[* A portion of this meeting is without audio. *] [3. APPROVAL OF MEETING MINUTES] [00:01:51] WHAT THE ISSUE IS WITH THE COMMERCIAL PROPERTY, NOT THE FENCE ITSELF. SO I JUST, THAT WAS KIND OF WRITTEN ODDLY IN THOSE MINUTES, SO I'M HOPING TO CORRECT THAT. AND I COULD TALK ABOUT THAT IF WE NEED TO. ANY OTHER COMMENTS? ALL RIGHT. DO WE HAVE A MOTION TO APPROVE WITH AN AMENDMENT? I'LL MAKE A MOTION. GO AHEAD, TOM. I MOTION. THANK YOU. SECOND. ANYONE SECOND? I'LL SECOND IT. ALL RIGHT. COULD YOU CALL THE ROLL, PLEASE? MEMBER KOSAK? YES. MEMBER SKALSKY? YES. MEMBER BURNS? YES. MEMBER SALA? YES. VICE CHAIR PEZZETTA? YES. CHAIR POLKOFF? YES. AND YOU WILL TALK WITH MS. BURNS ABOUT THAT CHANGE? YES, MA'AM. ALL RIGHT. VERY GOOD. [Additional Items] FIRST ON OUR... AGENDA TONIGHT WE WANT TO TALK ABOUT A QUASI JUDICIAL THANK YOU I HAVE ALL THESE PEOPLE HELPING ME BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T PUT MY CHEAT SHEET IN OKAY SO WE HAVE A QUASI JUDICIAL MEETING AND ATTORNEY PRINCE WILL EXPLAIN THAT TO ALL OF YOU I CERTAINLY WILL THANK YOU MADAM CHAIR AND THEN AFTER I EXPLAIN WE'LL BE GOING TO THE CITY PROJECT UPDATE I BELIEVE YES OKAY SO TONIGHT'S HEARINGS UNDER OLD BUSINESS 5.1, 5.2, AND NEW BUSINESS 6.1, 6.2, 6.3, 6.4, 6.5, ONE OF WHICH IS BEING REMOVED. WHAT NUMBER WAS THAT, MIA? 6.3. OH, YEAH, 6.3. SO 6.1, 6.2, 6.4, AND 6.5. THEY ARE QUASI-JUDICIAL HEARINGS. A QUASI-JUDICIAL HEARING BY STATE STATUTE IN CASE LAW IS DIFFERENT. FROM A REGULAR HEARING CONDUCTED BY THIS BOARD. A QUASI-JUDICIAL HEARING IS LESS FORMAL THAN A COURT HEARING, BUT SIMILAR IN PROCEDURES AND EVIDENCE MATTERS. APPLICANTS HERE TONIGHT HAVE THE BURDEN OF DEMONSTRATING THROUGH COMPETENT, SUBSTANTIAL EVIDENCE THAT HIS OR HER APPLICATION IS CONSISTENT WITH THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE, THE SECRETARY OF INTERIOR STANDARDS, AND THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT DESIGN GUIDELINES. THE OPPOSED THOSE OPPOSED WHO TESTIFY MUST ALSO DEMONSTRATE THROUGH COMPETENT SUBSTANTIAL EVIDENCE THAT THE APPLICATION DOES NOT MEET THOSE REQUIREMENTS. WHILE THE BOARD WELCOMES COMMENTS FROM ALL WHO HAVE AN INTEREST IN THESE PROCEEDINGS, FLORIDA LAW REQUIRES THAT THE BOARD'S DECISION IN A QUASI-JUDICIAL ACTION BE SUPPORTED BY COMPETENT SUBSTANTIAL EVIDENCE PRESENTED TO THE BOARD DURING THE HEARING ON THE APPLICATION. COMPETENT SUBSTANTIAL EVIDENCE IS SUCH AS EVIDENCE THAT A REASONABLE PERSON WITH A REASONABLE MIND WOULD ACCEPT. AS ADEQUATE TO SUPPORT A CONCLUSION. THERE MUST BE A FACTUAL BASIS IN THE RECORD TO SUPPORT OPINION TESTIMONY FROM BOTH EXPERT AND NON-EXPERT WITNESSES. GENERAL OBJECTIONS WITHOUT SPECIFIC EVIDENCE TO A PROJECT DOES NOT CONSTITUTE SUBSTANTIAL COMPETENT EVIDENCE. THE ONLY MATERIAL OR RELEVANT EVIDENCE IS THAT WHICH ADDRESSES THE STATUTORY CODE [00:05:01] REQUIREMENTS, THE SECRETARY OF INTERIOR STANDARDS, AND THE DOWNTOWN DISTRICT HISTORIC GUIDELINES, DESIGN GUIDELINES. IN THE HEARING TONIGHT, IT'LL BE LED BY THE CHAIR. THE APPLICANT IS ENTITLED TO BE REPRESENTED BY COUNCIL. WE HAVE SEVERAL APPLICATIONS TONIGHT. IF ANY APPLICANT DESIRES A CONTINUANCE TO OBTAIN COUNCIL, PLEASE COME FORWARD AND MAKE THE REQUEST AT THIS TIME. OKAY, SEEING NONE, MADAM CHAIR, I WILL... THE PROCEEDING WILL BE CONDUCTED BY THE CHAIR. STAFF WILL BE SWORN AND MAKE A PRESENTATION THE APPLICANT MAY WAIVE THEIR PRESENTATION AND RELY ON STAFF OR THEY MAY PRESENT EVERYONE WHO PRESENTS WILL BE SWORN THE APPLICANT OR REPRESENTATIVE WILL HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO PRESENT EVIDENCE FOR THE APPLICATION PUBLIC PARTICIPANTS FOR OR AGAINST AN APPLICATION ALSO HAVE TO BE SWORN AND WILL HAVE THREE MINUTES EACH TO PROVIDE TESTIMONY AND PRESENT EVIDENCE TO THE BOARD EXTENSIONS OF TIME MAY BE GRANTED THROUGH THE CHAIR. SHARING OR TRANSFERRING TIME IS NOT ALLOWED. THE APPLICANT OR REPRESENTATIVE WILL HAVE A MAXIMUM OF 10 MINUTES FOR A CROSS-EXAMINATION, REBUTTAL, ANSWERING QUESTIONS. STAFF MAY PROVIDE FINAL COMMENTS TO THE BOARD, AND THEN THE BOARD WILL CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING AND DISCUSS THE APPLICATION AMONGST THEMSELVES. THEY CAN ASK QUESTIONS OF STAFF OR WITNESSES FOR OR AGAINST THE APPLICATION. AND ANY MOTION OF THE BOARD WILL INCLUDE WHETHER THE BOARD FINDS THE COMPETENT SUBSTANTIAL EVIDENCE THE MEETING IS RECORDED THEREFORE THERE CAN BE NO APPLAUSE OUTBURSTS TALKING OR COMMENTS FROM THE AUDIENCE AS IT WOULD DISTORT THE RECORDING THE OFFICE OF THE CITY ATTORNEY REPRESENTS THE BOARD AND PROVIDES COUNSEL TO THE BOARD INCLUDING ADVICE AS TO THE HEARING PROCEDURES AND THE RELEVANCY OF EVIDENCE PRESENTED WHILE THE STRICT RULES OF EVIDENCE APPLICABLE TO A COURT PROCEEDING WILL NOT BE UTILIZED THE BOARD WITH ASSISTANCE OF THE CITY ATTORNEY MAKES EVIDENCE THAT IS NOT RELEVANT TO THE CODE CRITERIA IS SET FORTH IN THE APPLICATION OR IS REPETITIVE IN NATURE IF ANYBODY HAS ANY QUESTIONS PLEASE LET US KNOW AT THIS TIME ANY QUESTION HERE WE WILL DO OUR BEST WE WILL DO RIGHT IS THAT BETTER OKAY OH NO YOU PROBABLY STILL WILL GOT NOTHING RACY GOING ON UP HERE. OKAY, IF ANYBODY EXPECTS TO TESTIFY OR SPEAK TONIGHT, PLEASE RISE SO THAT THE CLERK CAN GIVE YOU THE OATH. RAISE YOUR RIGHT HAND. DO YOU SWEAR OR AFFIRM THAT THE ORAL AND OR WRITTEN TESTIMONY YOU ARE ABOUT TO GIVE WILL BE THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH, AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH? VERY WELL. NOW I WILL GO TO WHERE I SHOULD HAVE GONE BEFORE. ARE THERE ANY EX PARTE COMMUNICATIONS HERE? MR. SIKOWSKI, WE'LL START WITH YOU. YES, I'LL BE RECUSING MYSELF FOR THE SECOND CASE, 2026-0006. I'LL BE REPRESENTING THE HOMEOWNERS AS THEIR AGENT. DID YOU STAND AND SWEAR? TAKE THE OATH? OKAY, I WASN'T LOOKING. THANK YOU. MS. KOSAK? I SPOKE WITH STAFF ON ALL OF THE CASES TONIGHT. MR. PEZZETTA. I ALSO SPOKE WITH STAFF ON ALL OF THE AGENDA ITEMS. MS. BURNS. I HAD A GENERAL CONVERSATION WITH STAFF ON THE AGENDA. OKAY. MR. SALA. I JUST HAD A CONVERSATION WITH PEOPLE IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD ABOUT THE NEW BUSINESS IN OLD TOWN. OKAY, AND I SPOKE TO STAFF ALSO ABOUT THE AGENDA. YOU WOULD THINK I'D KNOW IT BETTER THAN I DO BECAUSE I DID TALK TO THEM. BUT ANYWAY, OKAY, LET US START WITH THE FIRST ITEM ON THE AGENDA, CITY PROJECT [4.1. Bosque Bello Columbarium Update- Parks & Recreation] UPDATE, VOS BELLO, COLUMBARIUM. GOOD EVENING. THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME. I WANTED TO GIVE A QUICK UPDATE ON WITERI AND IF YOU HAVE ANY. WITH THAT, THAT'S WHY I CALL THEM BURIED. WITERI IS CURRENTLY RUNNING [00:10:01] OUT. WE HAVE ABOUT AN ESTIMATED ABOUT 600 GRAVES REMAINING, VACANT GRAVES WITHIN BOSCOVILLA. WITH THAT BEING SAID, THAT'S GOING TO BE ABOUT A FIVE-YEAR PROCESS. AND THEN TO GO ALONG WITH THAT, IT'S MORE COST-EFFECTIVE THAN TRADITIONAL BURIALS. IT MEETS A GROWING DEMAND. RIGHT NOW THE PERCENTAGES OF CREMATIONS ARE MUCH HIGHER THAN THE TRADITIONAL BURIAL. ENVIRONMENTALLY FRIENDLY, IT CREATES A LASTING MEMORIAL. OBVIOUSLY, POPULATION GROWTH. CURRENTLY, WE'RE BURYING REMAINS IN TRADITIONAL GRAVES. THE WAY THE CENTER IS NOW, YOU CAN BUY A TRADITIONAL GRAVE, FOUR FEET BY TEN FEET, AND PUT REMAINS WITHIN BURIAL. AND ADD TWO SETS. THIS WILL PROVIDE A NEW REVENUE AND IT ALSO EXTENDS THE TIME BEFORE THE CARE FUND. SO WITHIN THE CEMETERY WHEN SOMEONE PURCHASES A GRAVE A CERTAIN PERCENTAGE OF THAT MONEY GOES INTO THE OPERATIONS OF RUNNING THE CEMETERY. THE OTHER PERCENTAGE GOES INTO THE PERPETUAL CARE ACCOUNT. ONCE WE SELL OUT ALL OF THE GRAVES THE PERPETUAL CARE ACCOUNT KICKS IN AND WE USE THAT MONEY TO RUN THE CEMETERY. ...THE CEMETERY CUPS, WE NEED EDGE, PLEASE. AND HOW WE GOT HERE. YOU MAY REMEMBER IN FISCAL YEAR 20, WE HAD GONE THROUGH ABOUT $16,000. WE HAD MANY STAKEHOLDERS INVOLVED, THE AMELIA FOUNDATION, FRIENDS OF US. WE WORKED THROUGH THE CONCEPTUAL DESIGN. WE DID GET IT TO A POINT WHERE WE WERE ASKING TO MOVE FORWARD TO DRAWINGS. WE DID NOT GET IT. SO THE PROJECT KIND OF STALLED. IT WAS AND IT DID GET BROUGHT BACK UP WITH THE NEW COMMISSION AND WE RE-BOUGHT IT. IN MAY 2025, A YEAR, I PRESENTED THE HISTORY OF THE COLUMBARIAN PROJECT. AND LOOK FOR DIRECTION. SO BASICALLY WHAT STAFF HAS BEEN WORKING ON AFTER THAT MAY 2025 MEETING, WE RE-ENGAGED MARQUISE LATTIMORE WHICH WAS THE DIRECTOR THAT WE ACTUALLY, WE DEVELOPED AN INITIAL CONCEPT, WE DEVELOPED A FINAL MASTER PLAN TO INCLUDE SCHEMATIC DESIGN, ILLUSTRATIVE MASTER PLAN, PHOTOREALISTIC PERSPECTIVES, AN OPINION OF PROBABLE COSTS, AND PHASING. SO WE ARE CURRENTLY PREPARED TO BUDGET FOR THIS PROJECT IN FISCAL YEAR 27, START OF OCTOBER. WE HAVE REVIEWED PRICING FOR THE NICHES AND RELATED TO THE COSTS THAT PER NICHE WOULD COST. I ALWAYS SAY NICHE OR NICHE OR I GET IT MIXED UP. I CALL THEM BOTH. AND THEN WE'VE BEEN DISCUSSING SALE PERCENTAGES GOING INTO THE SALE OF THE NICHE AND PREVENTIVE CARE. LIKE I SAID BEFORE, WE HAVE OUR CERTAIN PERCENTAGE NOW AND INTO THE FUTURE. SO THERE WERE SOME CONCERNS WITH THE PREVIOUS DESIGN. THE COST, HOW WE WERE GOING TO FUND IT, THE COLUMN BARRIER. AND MAINTENANCE REQUIREMENTS, AND MAINTENANCE REQUIREMENTS MAINLY RELATED TO THE FIRST. AND THEN THE EXPANSIVE FOOTPRINT. NOW THERE IS A PICTURE ON THIS SLIDE THAT IS, THAT'S OBVIOUSLY AN EXPANSIVE FOOTPRINT. THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN WHEN IT WAS ENTIRELY BUILT INTO THE FUTURE. SO IT WOULD HAVE PROVIDED US A PLAN TO BUILD INTO THE FUTURE. AND IT WAS SIGNIFICANT SPACE, BUT THAT PICTURE SHOWS. ALL RIGHT, NEXT SLIDE. LOCATION, LOCATION, LOCATION. SO YOU MIGHT LOOK AT THIS AND BE LIKE, OKAY, HOW MANY TREES ARE YOU CUTTING DOWN? THERE'S NO WAY YOU CAN FIT THAT IN THERE. BUT IF YOU GO TO THIS LOCATION, IT FITS PERFECTLY. THERE ARE NO TREES THAT WILL BE REMOVED. THERE ARE NO ROOT SYSTEMS THAT WILL BE IMPACTED. THE CANOPY IS SO BEAUTIFUL THERE, IT'S ALMOST LIKE IT WAS MADE. SO THAT IS THE LOCATION. [00:15:01] IT'S JUST TO THE EAST OF THE ANCIENT SECTION. MAGNOLIA ROAD RUNS RIGHT PERPENDICULAR TO THERE. AND IT'S RIGHT OFF OF NASSAU STREET. SO IT'S A BEAUTIFUL LOCATION, SHADE AND GREAT CANOPY. SO ONCE BUILT OUT, IT WILL ALL SIT WITHIN JUST THAT FOOTPRINT OF THE CENTER. NEXT SLIDE PLEASE. SO THIS IS THIS IS PHASE ONE RIGHT NOW WE WERE LOOKING AT A FIVE NICHE HIGH THIS IS KIND OF THE PERFECT POINT BASED ON FINANCIALS AND VIEWING RESTRICT, YOU KNOW SITE SITES ACROSS THE CEMETERY AND OBVIOUSLY WHEN YOU BUILD THESE YOU LOOK AT THE PRICE AND IT KIND OF IS THE PERFECT MATCH. SO AS OF RIGHT NOW, WE ARE LOOKING AT GOING FIVE-NICHE HIGH. SO IT'S GOING TO BE RIGHT AT ABOUT A FIVE-FOOT MARK. SO YOU'LL STILL BE ABLE TO SEE IT'S NOT LIKE YOU'RE GOING TO BE CONFINED WITHIN ALMOST LIKE A SQUARE. SO THIS IS PHASE ONE. WITHIN THAT, IT WOULD BE 400 NICHES. AND YOU CAN SEE IT'S THE TOP. ON THE TOP OF THE SCREEN, THE TOP TWO, WHICH WE WOULD ALMOST CALL THEM GARDENS, AND WITHIN THERE, THERE'S LIKE A SITTING AREA THAT WOULD BE RIGHT IN THE MIDDLE. AND I THINK YOU'LL BE ABLE TO SEE THAT IN THE NEXT SLIDE. SO WHEN WE HAD THE CONVERSATION WITH THE COMMISSION, ONE OF THE, WHAT WE DECIDED IS THERE IS SOME... BRICK YOU CAN SEE ON THE BASE OF THAT SO WE WOULD WE WOULD COME DOWN WITH YOUR YOU CAN SEE THERE WOULD BE ADDITIONAL TREES PLANTED WITHIN EACH LITTLE GARDEN AND THEN YOU CAN SEE THE PICTURES RELATED NICHES AND THEN THERE'S A WALKWAY AND THEN JUST IN THE MIDDLE OF IT BETWEEN EACH ROW THERE WOULD BE A GRASS AREA. WE COULD ADD IN-GROUND NICHES AND THEN ALSO THE SEEDED AREA. THOSE ARE BENCHES. SO WITH THAT BEING SAID, NEXT SLIDE PLEASE, WE DID A RUN OPINION OF COST AND WHERE WE ARE RIGHT NOW. PHASE ONE. PROBABLE COST IS $288,000. WITH THAT BEING SAID, TOTAL REVENUE COMING IN FROM THIS THING, I USE THE NUMBER OF $2,000. CURRENTLY, THE PRICE OF A TRADITIONAL GRAVE IS $2,000. I USE REVENUE FROM PHASE ONE. YES, IT WOULD BE 400 NICHES THAT WOULD BE WITHIN PHASE ONE. THAT WOULD BE A REVENUE, TOTAL REVENUE OF EIGHT, AND INCLUDING ALL THE PRICES, ALL THE COSTS TO DEVELOP. PHASE ONE THE NET REVENUE. SO ACTIONS ITEMS MOVING FORWARD WE ARE BASICALLY RIGHT NOW AT THE POINT WHERE WE HAVE WE'RE DEVELOPING A PURCHASE POSITION TO DO CONSTRUCTION DRAWINGS. OUR GOAL IS TO HAVE THIS READY TO BE GOING OUT TO BID AND BEING BUILT AT THE BEGINNING OF FISCAL YEAR. WITH THAT BEING SAID, THIS DOES SIT RIGHT OUTSIDE THE ANCIENT SECTION OF THE CEMETERY. BUT WITH THAT BEING SAID, I DO THINK IT WAS APPROPRIATE TO PRESENT TO YOU AND SEE IF YOU HAD ANY QUESTIONS OR CONCERNS THAT WE COULD TAKE INTO CONSIDERATION. [00:20:02] ANY COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS? I DO HAVE A QUESTION. WHEN YOU SHOW THE NET REVENUE, DOES A PROPORTION OF THAT HAVE TO GO, WHAT GOES TO PERPETUAL CARE INTO LIKE THAT SAVINGS ACCOUNT AND WHAT'S ACTUALLY AVAILABLE TO THE CITY OR THE GENERAL FUND? YEAH, SO RIGHT NOW, THE WAY THAT WE, AND THE CITY MANAGERS, IS ALL WE GIVE THEM. BUT RIGHT NOW, I THINK WE CAN ADJUST THAT PERCENTAGE. PROFITABLE MEANING BASICALLY WE CAN ADJUST IT SO NOT A HUNDRED PERCENT SURE OF THE 40 OR EVEN 55 OKAY MISS KOSA SCOTT UM WE'VE SEEN THIS A COUPLE OF DIFFERENT PLANS AT HGC ARE WE AT THE POINT NOW WHERE THIS MIGHT BE A QUESTION FOR THE ATTORNEY. WE'RE NOT BEING PRESENTED THE FINAL PLANS FOR REVIEW. ARE WE NOT PART OF THAT? WE'RE JUST KIND OF TOLD WHAT'S HAPPENING? BECAUSE WE HAD, I MEAN, SOME OF THE OTHER PLANS, WE ACTUALLY WENT THROUGH DESIGN GUIDELINES, AND THAT'S WHEN WE TALKED ABOUT MATERIAL. SO I'M JUST WANTING TO KNOW WHAT THE PROCESS WILL BE, IF WE'LL BE LOOKING AT IT OR NOT. SO WE, ONCE WE DEVELOP THE, OR ONCE WE, I BELIEVE, HAVE IT, WE COULD COME BACK TO HBC FOR FORMAL REVIEW. OKAY, AND THAT KIND OF PIGGYBACKS ON, DIDN'T WE JUST RECENTLY GET THE NATIONAL REGISTER DESIGNATION FOR THE, AND IF WE'RE CLOSE TO THE ANCIENT SECTION, WE JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE WE'RE NOT COMPROMISING ANYTHING THAT'S INVOLVED IN THAT DESIGNATION OR, YOU KNOW, COMPROMISING THAT, WHICH I'M SURE WE WON'T. SO WE DO NOT HAVE THE NATIONAL, WE DO NOT HAVE THAT DESIGNATION YET. YEAH, OKAY. ALL RIGHT, AND THEN JUST TWO OTHER THINGS FROM YOUR ASSUMPTIONS. WHEN YOU'RE WHEN YOU DO THE NET REVENUE AND THEN THE TOTAL REVENUE, I MEAN, OBVIOUSLY, YOU'RE EXTRAPOLATING BASED ON 100% BUYOUT. YOU'RE SAYING THAT THE $800,000 WOULD BE IF EVERY SINGLE NICHE IS PURCHASED. SO I WOULD, YES, THAT IS CORRECT. THAT IS FROM PHASE ONE. SO THAT WOULD BE WITH THE 400 NICHES BEING SOLD. SO IF WE BACK UP, AND YOU SAID WE HAVE 600 SPOTS AVAILABLE NOW, AND THAT SHOULD LAST US ABOUT FIVE YEARS. WE HAVE 120 PEOPLE BEING BURIED THERE A YEAR? SO IT'S NOT NECESSARILY BEING BURIED, BUT WE ARE. OKAY, AND IS THAT RIGHT? 120 A YEAR? IT'S PRETTY CLOSE. OKAY, ALRIGHT, PEOPLE ARE DYING TO GET IN. OH MY GOD. THEY ARE, THAT'S WHAT THEY SAID. OKAY, WELL WE GOT THAT FENCE AROUND. THERE'S GOTTA BE SOMEONE THAT SAID THAT. SECOND. SO, I MEAN... AND MEMBERS OF THEIR, I BELIEVE THAT THERE WERE. SAW THE GRANITE VERSUS BRICK DECISION. I THINK JUST SPEAKING TOWARDS MATERIALS, OBVIOUSLY BRICK IS A REGIONAL LOCAL MATERIAL CHOICE THAT FITS OUR COMMUNITY AND WHERE OUR MATERIALS COME FROM. THE GRANITE, WHICH IS VERY BEAUTIFUL AND NICE AND I'M SURE MAINTENANCE WISE, REQUIRES LESS MAINTENANCE THAN BRICK. WE DON'T HAVE GRANITE IN FLORIDA. OR EVEN SOUTH GEORGIA. THE GRANITE IS MUCH FURTHER AWAY. SO I WOULD JUST MENTION THAT MAYBE BRICK. GIVE IT ANOTHER THOUGHT JUST BECAUSE IT'S A CONTEXTUAL MATERIAL THAT YOU WOULD FIND IN THE HISTORIC AREAS AROUND. I THINK THE LAST TIME WE TALKED [00:25:01] ABOUT BUSK, HELLO. I KNOW I HEARD SAFETY ISSUES BEING EXPRESSED BY A LOT OF THE LOCALS WHO LIVE NEARBY. AND I'M SURE GOING UP HIGHER GIVES YOU MORE OPPORTUNITY TO SELL MORE SIGNS, BUT THOSE LITTLE ALCOVES THERE, YOU CAN'T TELL WHAT'S GOING ON IN THOSE ALCOVES WHEN IT'S THAT HOT. SO I WOULD... I DON'T KNOW IF YOU GUYS HAVE CONSIDERED THE SAFETY ISSUE, SECURITY ISSUE, BUT I'D ALSO ASK YOU GUYS TO KIND OF THINK ABOUT THAT TOO AS YOU COME TO DECISIONS ON THE HEIGHT OF THOSE. YES, SIR. ONE THING WE HAVE DONE RECENTLY, WE DID ADD RING FENCING, SO WE ARE LOCKING EITHER CURRENTLY. WE STILL DO HAVE... FEW ISSUES WITHIN THE CEMETERY. ANY OTHER COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS? I WOULD JUST CONCUR WITH JIM THAT I THINK THAT THE BRICK WOULD BE APPROPRIATE AND PERHAPS A COMBINATION OF THE BRICK AND THE GRANITE BUT SOMEHOW INCORPORATE MORE BRICK INTO IT. SCOTT WHAT WERE THE ISSUES WITH BRICK THE FIRST GO-ROUND? MAINLY MAINTENANCE AND THEN ONE OF THE, WITHIN THE ORDINANCE, IT TALKS, AND MAYBE THIS IS SOMETHING I NEED TO SPEAK WITH OUR ATTORNEY, IS WITHIN THE ORDINANCE IT TALKS ABOUT WHAT MONUMENTS CAN BE USED, WHAT MATERIAL A MONUMENT CAN BE. AND WHEN THEY TALK ABOUT THE MONUMENT, THOUGH, I BELIEVE WHAT WE'RE REFERRING TO IS A HEADSTONE. AND IT HAS TO BE DONE ON WHAT MATERIAL IS GRANITE, MARBLE, AND IT DOESN'T MENTION BRICK THAT IS ALLOWED. SO THAT WAS A DISTINCTIVE PROBLEM. NOW YOU MENTIONED THAT YOU HAD BEEN TO THE COMMISSION WITH THIS AND THEY SAW THIS PLAN. THEY SAW THIS PRESENTATION, YES MA'AM. AND DID THEY WEIGH IN AT ALL ON THE MATERIALS? SO ONE OF THEIR CONCERNS... ONE OF THEIR MAIN CONCERNS WAS MAINTENANCE AND WHAT THE LEAST AMOUNT OF MAINTENANCE AND WITH THAT BEING SAID IT WOULD BE GRANTED. WELL THAT'S WHY I THINK IT'S KIND OF IMPORTANT THAT IT DOES COME THROUGH THE HISTORIC DISTRICT BECAUSE I MEAN THE LEAST MAINTENANCE WOULD BE FINAL. YOU KNOW, AND WE DID TALK ABOUT THIS LAST TIME, AND I LIKE THE MIXTURE, IF YOU NEED TO MIX THE TWO OF THEM. AND YOU DID MENTION SOMETHING, YOU SAID WHERE YOU SEE THE BRICK, WE'RE GOING TO COME BACK WITH FULL GRANITE. I WASN'T SURE WHAT YOU WERE REFERRING TO WHEN YOU SAID THAT. YEAH, SO IF YOU GO TO THE NEXT SLIDE. YEAH, RIGHT THERE. SO IF YOU NOTICE ON THE VERY BOTTOM OF THE COLUMBARY. OH, IT HAD, BEFORE IT HAD LIKE A BRICK. THAT SHOWS GRANITE, AND THEN IF YOU GO BACK TO THE NEXT, TO THE ONE UP ABOVE, YOU CAN SEE THE BRICK RIGHT HERE. SO YOU'RE NO LONGER PUTTING THAT BRICK THERE. AS OF RIGHT NOW, WE'RE PROCEEDING WITH, IS THAT PRICE, THE PRICE OF GRANITE ORE? LANDSCAPE ARCHITECT SAID THERE'S REALLY NOT. IF WE WERE TO MAKE ADJUSTMENTS TO THAT, I DON'T, IT'S A FACADE ALMOST ON THE OUTSIDE. THAT WOULD BE A SHAME. OKAY, I'M GOING TO, MS. PRINCE, IN THE PAST, THINGS THAT GO ON IN THE CEMETERY HAVE NOT NECESSARILY BEEN BROUGHT TO THIS BOARD. MY QUESTION IS, SHOULD THEY BE IN THE FUTURE? FROM WHAT I UNDERSTAND, IT IS SUPPOSED TO COME TO THIS BOARD. I WASN'T ASKED TO LOOK AT IT BEFORE THIS MEETING, SO I CAN LET YOU KNOW AT THE NEXT MEETING. BUT I WASN'T ASKED TO LOOK AT THAT, BUT... OKAY. YES, SIR, PLEASE. WE HAVE THE DEPUTY CITY MANAGER HERE. GLENN CROMWELL, DEPUTY CITY MANAGER AND PROJECT MANAGERS. SO, YES, THE DESIGN WILL COME BACK TO YOU. WE DID GET SPECIFIC DIRECTION FROM THE COMMISSION TO STAY AWAY FROM BRICK. AND WE WENT THROUGH THAT WHOLE. [00:30:01] THAT DOESN'T MEAN THAT THE FINAL. I WON'T HAVE TO SEE IN BOTH DESIGNS THERE IS A BRICK ON THE GROUND. THERE ARE OTHER REASONS WE'RE HERE. THERE'S ALWAYS A MIXED PIECE ABOUT WHERE IT'S REQUIRED TO AIR ONTO. SO I WOULD SAY IN THIS CASE THOUGH, BECAUSE- OKAY, SO WHAT I'LL JUST SAY TO THAT IS I APPRECIATE WHAT YOU'RE SAYING. I KNOW THAT IN THE PAST, LIKE WITH THE SIGNAGE DOWNTOWN, AS FAR AS PARKING GOES, THAT WAS AN ENFORCEMENT ISSUE AND IT WAS NOT SOMETHING THAT WE- HAD FINAL APPROVAL ON. I DO THINK, WHAT IS IT CALLED, THE MISSION STATEMENT, ETC., THAT FORMED THE HDC SHOULD PROBABLY SPECIFY, ESPECIALLY IF THIS CEMETERY IS GRANTED NATIONAL REGISTER APPROVAL, IT SHOULD PROBABLY SPECIFY THAT HDC HAS SOME APPROVAL PART IN IT. AND THEN THAT WOULD. DETERMINE IF IT DOES THAT WOULD DETERMINE THE PROCESS SEQUENCE BECAUSE HEARING THAT THE COMMISSION HAS WEIGHED IN IS A LITTLE BIT OFF-PUTTING UNDERSTOOD OKAY HOWEVER WE COULDN'T MOVE FORWARD I UNDERSTAND THAT THEY JUST THEY JUST STEP WHEN THEY DECIDED TO TALK ABOUT MATERIAL WELL I THINK THEY GAVE US THEY'RE THERE THEY'RE WHAT THEY WANT TO SEE IN MATERIALS. AS I HAVE MENTIONED IN OTHER PROJECTS THAT I'VE BROUGHT FORWARD IN THE PROJECT PROCESS, THAT ULTIMATELY WHEN IT COMES DOWN TO MANAGING THESE PROJECTS AND GETTING THEM BUILT IN THE BEST WAY POSSIBLE, STAFF, WE'RE HIRED TO MAKE THOSE PROFESSIONALS. AND WE HAVE TO WEIGH IN ALL OF THEM, INCLUDING YOUR INPUT THERE. RIGHT. AND WE HAVE A LOT OF COMMUNITY INPUT. I'M CERTAIN YOU DO. BUT TO MAKE THIS BOARD'S CONTRIBUTION MORE MEANINGFUL AND NOT MAKE THE PEOPLE UP HERE FEEL LIKE, WELL, THIS IS JUST INFORMATION AND WE DON'T CARE, RIGHT? I THINK YOU HAVE TO HAVE SOMETHING THAT SAYS WHAT, FOR EVERYBODY'S SAKE. WHAT COMES HERE FOR FINAL APPROVAL? STAFF'S SAKE AS WELL. I AGREE WITH YOU. SO I DO THINK THAT IT'S WORTH LOOKING AT THAT LANGUAGE AND SEEING WHETHER IT SHOULD BE UPDATED. BECAUSE WHEN THIS BOARD WAS FORMED, IT WAS IN THE 70S. YOU KNOW, WE ONLY HAD ONE HISTORIC DISTRICT. NOW WE HAVE A FEW, LIKE THE CEMETERY, WHICH IS NOT OFFICIALLY PART OF THE HISTORIC DISTRICT. BUT IN THE EVENT THAT IT IS ON THE NATIONAL REGISTER, THAT'S PRETTY CRITICAL THAT WE WATCH WHAT'S GOING ON. AND FROM OUR PERSPECTIVE, IT'S BECAUSE IF IT BECOMES BETWEEN PHASE 1 AND PHASE 2, WE BRING PHASE 2 TO YOU. YES. BECAUSE WE'D BE... YES. TO US, IT MAKES SENSE TO BRING PHASE 1 TO YOU. IT MAKES SENSE TO US TOO, BUT THERE'S JUST A LITTLE WIGGLE ROOM ON WHAT ROLE WE'RE AFTER PLAYING, I GUESS. WE NEED TO GET YOUR APPROVAL. NONE OF US HAS ANY HOLY WATER TO SCATTER ON THE PLAN OR ANYTHING, BUT WE DO HAVE SOME THOUGHTS ABOUT THE ENVIRONMENT, WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE HERE. I MEAN, VOSKVILLE IS PRETTY COOL, AND WE WANT TO MAKE SURE IT STAYS THAT WAY. AND I THINK THIS... PLAN LOOKS NICE. NOW ARE YOU GOING TO PRE-SELL THESE THINGS BEFORE YOU START CONSTRUCTION? THANK YOU. YES, MAYBE. SO YES, THAT IS SOMETHING THAT WE DEFINITELY WANT TO DO. AND YES, IF THAT PRE-SALES COULD BE USED TO FUND IT, I NEED TO WORK WITH THE CITY ATTORNEY AND CITY MANAGER'S OFFICE. WE DO THAT, BUT YES, I DO WANT TO LOOK INTO THAT ONCE WE GET THE FINAL OF THIS IS WHAT'S HAPPENING AND I THINK THE COMMUNITY THEN CAN SEE EXACTLY WHAT IT IS I THINK AT THAT POINT WE CAN START THE PRE-SALE OF THESE ITEMS. I THINK THAT'S FAIRLY COMMON PRACTICE YES MA'AM. [00:35:01] WITH COLANDARIANS. OKAY. ANY OTHER COMMENTS? WE DON'T NEED A PUBLIC HEARING FOR THIS, OR DO WE? THEY HAVEN'T BROUGHT IT TO YOU FOR YOUR CERTIFICATE OF APPROVAL AT THIS POINT. IT'S AN INFORMATIONAL FROM WHAT I SEE ON THE AGENDA. OKAY. LET ME JUST ASK, IS THERE ANYBODY WITH A BURNING NEED TO SAY SOMETHING? I HAVE A QUESTION. CAN YOU COME UP, PLEASE? IT'S DIRECTED TO THE MATERIAL GUY. THAT'S OKAY. YOU HAVE TO IDENTIFY YOURSELF, PLEASE, AND GIVE YOUR ADDRESS. MY NAME IS DIANE PULLEN. I LIVE AT 1020 WHITE STREET IN OLD TOWN. MY QUESTION IS, WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT NICHES, ARE YOU DIVIDING THEM INTO FOUR, OR HOW BIG ARE YOUR NICHES? BECAUSE EACH SPACE IS A DIFFERENT COST IN EACH, CORRECT? YES. SO THE GREAT QUESTION IS, THESE WALLS WILL BE TWO-SIDED. AND THEY WILL THEN ALSO, IN ADDITION, THERE WILL BE ROOM FOR TWO SETS OF... OKAY. ALL RIGHT. YES, MA'AM. YES, SO THAT'S HOW WE WILL PROCEED. WE WON'T HAVE SPECIFIC ONES WHERE THERE WILL BE A ROW OF ONE, EACH ONE BACK-TO-BACK, AND THEN TWO SETS OF REMAINS COULD GO IN EACH ONE. OKAY. ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU, SCOTT. YES, MA'AM. ALL RIGHTY. ARE YOU NEXT, MR. HAWKINS? OKAY. OH, I'M SORRY. I'M SORRY. DIDN'T SEE YOUR HAND GO UP. SORRY. ERIC MARTEL, 3820. REGARDING THE CORRECT FIRST GRANT THAT CAME UP MANY YEARS AGO, IT HAD TO DO WITH... THERE'S A GIVEN WITH THE COLUMN AND IF YOU IF YOU LOOK AT BRICK THAT'S BEEN USED IN MUSKELLO IN THE PAST IT DOESN'T HOLD UP ANYWHERE NEAR AS WELL AND THERE'S SOME SPECULATION THAT THAT MAY HAVE SOMETHING TO DO WITH THE AIR QUALITY BECAUSE A CHEMICAL REACTION MORE RAPIDLY THAN AND THIS HAS BEEN DISCUSSED. I THINK THAT'S PART OF IT. OKAY. AND IF YOU GO OUT AND LOOK AT IT AND TAKE A TOUR OF THE HISTORIC SECTION AND LOOK AT PLACES WHERE THEY'VE USED BRICK, IT'S ALL CRUMBLY AND... THANK YOU. [4.2. Waterfront Park Expansion- Project Management] ALL RIGHT, MR. KARMOFF. SO THIS HIGHLIGHTS... THE PROCESS THAT KIND OF SKIPPED OVER A LITTLE BIT WITH US, ONCE WE GO THROUGH THE PRELIMINARY DESIGN PROCESS AND KIND OF GET CONCEPTUAL FOR A PART, THEN IT MOVES TO PROJECT MANAGEMENT. SO SCOTT, IN THESE TWO CASES, SCOTT HANDS IT OFF TO OUR TEAM, AND THEN WE TAKE IT THROUGH CONSTRUCTION DRAWINGS AND BRING IT TO THE PROPER BOARDS AND ALL OF THAT PROCESS. SO THAT'S KIND OF WHERE WE ARE WITH PHASE TWO OF THE WATERFRONT. AND AGAIN, WE'RE HERE TO UPDATE YOU. WHEN WE HAVE A FINAL DESIGN, WE'LL BRING IT BACK THROUGH JUST LIKE WE DID PHASE ONE TO GET YOUR APPROVAL. AND SO I'M GOING TO KIND OF GO OVER WHERE WE ARE TODAY WITH IT. SO IN CONCEPTS, WE'VE LOOKED AT A NUMBER OF THINGS. YOU CAN SEE UP AT THE TOP THERE ARE SWINGING BENCHES THAT HAVE BEEN BROUGHT UP. GRANITE PLANTERS, GRANITE CURVES, INSCRIBED PAVERS, SOME OTHER COVERED INFRASTRUCTURE. THIS IS PHASE TWO OF AN EXISTING PARK. SO AS THE FOLKS WHO PUT TOGETHER THE CONCEPT SAID, WE'RE BASICALLY CREATING ANOTHER ROOM IN THE PARK. AND THAT'S KIND OF WHAT PHASE TWO IS. WE HAVE MULTIPLE ROOMS IN PHASE ONE. MAYBE TWO OF THE TWO SERVES. THIS IS JUST A CONCEPT, IT'S NOT A FINAL DESIGN BY ANY STRETCH. ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE ARE LOOKING AT, AND WE'VE BEEN TALKING WITH THE AMERICAN LEGION ABOUT MOVING THE... [00:40:03] THE MEMORIAL THAT'S OVER THERE INTO THIS SITE THAT WE ARE CONSIDERING IS BECAUSE THIS WILL BE A MUCH BETTER GATHERING AREA. YOU'RE NOT GATHERING IN A PARKING LOT, YOU'RE GATHERING IN A SPACE THAT IS TRULY HONORING A TRUE MEMORIAL. SO THAT'S GOING TO BE PART OF THIS DESIGN. WE'LL BE DESIGNING THAT INTO THE PROCESS. AND SO FAR WE'VE HAD POSITIVE FEEDBACK ABOUT DOING THAT. AGAIN, THIS BECOMES ANOTHER GATHERING SPACE. THERE'S A COUPLE OF OTHER THINGS THAT ARE HIGHLIGHTED. IT WILL BE ADJACENT TO THE, AT THE NORTH END, IT WILL BE ADJACENT TO THE BOAT RAMP, SO WE'VE GOT TO WORK OUT A NUMBER OF POSSIBLE CONFLICTS THERE AND BE ABLE TO BRING THAT INTO THE PROCESS. ONE OF THE OTHER PROBLEMS THAT WE'LL TRY TO ADDRESS IN THIS IS THAT ANYONE WHO'S BEEN DOWN HERE, YOU WALK ACROSS THE TRACKS, EVEN THOUGH THERE'S TWO CROSSWALKS, THEY'RE KIND OF FUNKY, AND YOU REALLY DON'T KNOW WHERE YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO GO, AND ESPECIALLY FOLKS WHO COME FROM OUTSIDE THE CITY. AND THE DRIVING PUBLIC REALLY DOESN'T KNOW HOW TO HANDLE THAT INTERSECTION. SO ONE OF THE CONCEPTS THAT WE'RE EXPLORING IS BASICALLY A TABLE, A RAISED PEDESTRIAN TABLE, WHERE YOU CAN WALK ANY WHICH WAY YOU NEED TO. IT'S HASHED OUT SO THE DRIVING PUBLIC CAN SEE WHERE PEDESTRIANS ARE AND WHERE THEY SHOULD LOOK AT. IT ALSO WILL HELP WITH THE, AS THEY'RE USING THE BOAT LAUNCH TO PROTECT PEDESTRIANS AND THEM FROM HAVING PEOPLE WALK BEHIND THEM. THAT DOES HAPPEN CURRENTLY. SO THOSE ARE SOME OF THE THINGS WE'RE TRYING, DESIGN ELEMENTS THAT WILL COME INTO DESIGN THAT ARE NOT REALLY CAPTURED IN THE CAR. AS YOU CAN SEE, WE'RE TRYING TO BE CONSISTENT WITH WHAT'S GOING ON. YOU WILL SEE ON THE NORTH END, RIGHT AT THE NORTH END WHERE THE CONCEPT GOES INTO THE REAL DESIGN, THOSE FOUR TREES HAVE ALREADY BEEN PUT IN. IT LOOKED A LITTLE WONKY WITH THE SIDEWALK THERE, TREES ON ONE SIDE, NOT ON THE OTHER. ANOTHER PIECE TO THIS IS THAT THERE'S ABOUT WHERE ATLANTIC SEAFOOD WAS, THERE'S 40 TO 60 FEET OF SEAWALL THAT NEEDS TO GO IN THERE. SO WE ARE ATTEMPTING, PENDING PERMITTING AND ALL OF THAT STUFF, IS TO MAKE THAT CONNECTION AS PART OF EITHER ONE OF OUR SEAWALL PHASES. ONE, WE'RE HIRING A CONTRACTOR TO DO SEAWALL FOR BRETT STEVAN AND THE MARINA REHAB, AND THEN WE'RE ALSO GOING TO DO SEGMENT ONE. ONE OF THOSE TWO CONTRACTS WE'RE HOPING WE CAN GET TO DO THAT 60 FEET, SO THEN WE CAN TOTALLY FINISH THE PARK. AND REALLY, IF WE CAN'T DO THAT, THEN YOU CAN SEE THAT AREA RIGHT THERE HAS A COUPLE OF TREES AND SHRUBS IN IT. IT'S ONLY MEANT TO BE A SPACE THAT WE CAN GET INTO BECAUSE THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE TO TEAR IT UP. AND SO WE'RE GOING TO, YOU KNOW, THIS IS DESIGNED TO BE ABLE TO WORK AROUND. AND THEN YOU CAN SEE THE KIND OF HASHED OUT AREA. THERE'S A NUMBER OF DIFFERENT IDEAS THAT WE'VE HAD AND WE'VE WORKED WITH SOME FOLKS OUTSIDE THE DESIGNERS AS FAR AS THAT'LL BECOME A VIEWING AREA. WE CAN PUT THE SWINGS THERE. THERE'LL BE SOME PAVERS THAT GO IN THERE. IT'LL BE MUCH LIKE THIS SECTION JUST BY THE PAVILION. SO IT'LL BE VERY SIMILAR TO THAT, THE SAME PAVERS WE GO IN AS. AND THEN WE COULD PUT SOME FURNITURE AND TAKE THAT AND USE THAT SPOT. WE'RE LOOKING AT IT AND PLANNING, PUTTING ONE BREAK IN IT. YOU KNOW, WE'RE TRYING TO KEEP THE LEAST BREAKS IN THE SEAWALLS POSSIBLE BECAUSE... THE ONES WE HAVE IN THERE THE BETTER. WE DO TEST THE ONES IN THE CURRENT PARK TWICE A YEAR, BUT THAT'S ANOTHER PIECE FOR US. I THINK WITH THAT, AGAIN, WE WANT TO MAKE IT ANOTHER GATHERING SPACE, ESPECIALLY WITH THE MEMORIAL. IF THAT DOES END UP BEING THERE, WE WANT PEOPLE TO BE ABLE TO... [00:45:02] STAND IN THE GRASS. WHERE THEY CAN GATHER AND CELEBRATE IN ANY FORM OR BETTER. SO LOOK AT IT FROM A PARKS OPERATION PERSPECTIVE. MAINTENANCE IS ALWAYS A PIECE OF THAT, BUT ALSO HOW WE MIGHT RENT OUT A SPACE OR SPACES IN THIS. KIND OF WHERE WE ARE NOW. I'D LOVE TO HEAR YOUR FEEDBACK. AND THEN, AGAIN, WE'LL BE BACK TO GIVE YOU THE PLAN. ANY QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS? YES, SIR. GLENN, THANKS. YOU HAD MENTIONED RIGHT NOW I SEE TWO BREAKS. SO WHICH ONE'S COMING OUT, THE ONE IN NUMBER TWO? I THINK IT WOULD BE THE ONE IN THREE WHEN YOU'RE LOOKING AT IT. BECAUSE WHEN YOU HAVE A... THE WALL, HOW ARE WE GOING TO BALANCE THAT? BECAUSE THREE, I'M ASSUMING, IS GOING TO BE HIGHER THAN TWO. YES. AND WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE FLOW OF HOW THE SIDEWALK IS THERE, TWO COULD REALLY COME OUT BECAUSE ALL THE SIDEWALK FLOWS TO THEM. AND IN THE OTHER PLACE, IT'S A VIEWING AREA. MUCH LIKE, AGAIN, MUCH LIKE THE PAPER AREA NOW, THERE IS VIEW OF THE SUNSET. I JUST... I SEE THERE'S A, IF YOU KEEP GOING SOUTH AFTER TWO, THERE'S A BREAK KIND OF LIKE, WHAT IS THAT, 20, 30 FEET RIGHT DOWN WHERE THE LITTLE BUILDING IS. YEAH, THERE'S ANOTHER ONE. THERE IS ANOTHER ONE RIGHT AT WHERE. RIGHT IN THE FADED AREA. YEAH, YEAH. OKAY. THERE'S ONE THERE NOW. WHAT HAPPENS AT THE BOAT RAMP END? DOES IT CURVE UP OR, I MEAN. WELL. WE CAN'T CLOSE THE BOAT RAMP UP WHEN A HURRICANE COMES, LIKE A WALL, RIGHT? SO IT CONTINUES AND THEN DOES THE BOAT RAMP GO AWAY OR IS THERE A WALL THAT GOES IN IF BAD WEATHER COMES? YEAH, THAT'S A FUTURE DESIGN ELEMENT. THAT IS A DECISION POINT FOR THE FUTURE. BUT IF WE KEEP THE BOAT RAMP, WE WOULD HAVE TO HAVE THAT SAME... THAT SAME FEATURE IN THE BOAT RAMP. THE CHALLENGE WITH THAT, YOU DO NOT WANT TO STRUCTURE A PILLAR IN THE MIDDLE OF THE BOAT RAMP EVERY DAY. AND THAT'S WHAT WOULD NEED TO HAPPEN BECAUSE IT'S NOT THAT BIG. IT'S AN ENGINEER. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS? GLENN, THE FIRST PHASE IS AWESOME. IT'S AMAZING, AND I LOVE SEEING PEOPLE USE THAT SPACE IN SO MANY DIFFERENT WAYS. I THINK I COPIED YOU ON AN EMAIL THAT I SENT. ONE THING THAT I NOTICED, JUST PART OF MY BUSINESS OVER THE YEARS, IS LANDSCAPE DESIGN AND INSTALLATION. AND IF WE CAN ADDRESS IT IN THIS ONE, IT WOULD BE GOOD. WHEREVER THERE'S AND THE TRANSITION OF SOD TO EITHER MULCH OR A HARD SURFACE, IT IS JUST SO MUCH MORE EFFICIENT IF THERE'S LIKE A SMOOTH RADIUS FOR A MOWER RATHER THAN A SHARP POINT BECAUSE THEN THE MOWER DOES THIS AND THEN THEY HAVE TO COME BACK AND, YOU KNOW, STRING TRIM IT TO STRING TRIM ANY OF THE SOD. SO, YOU KNOW, I'M JUST THINKING FROM LONG-TERM MAINTENANCE TO MAKE IT EASIER, LESS LABOR. AND THEN THERE'S A COUPLE OF AREAS WHERE WE HAVE A TREE. SKIRT OF MULCH AND THEN RIGHT OUTSIDE OF IT ARE THE TWO LIGHTS IN THE SIDE. SO THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE TO COME TRIM THEM AROUND THEN THEY'RE GOING TO GET DAMAGED SO YOU KNOW WE EITHER EXPAND THE MULCH SKIRT OR BRING THE LIGHTS IN AND I THINK JUST FOR LONG-TERM MAINTENANCE THOSE ARE JUST SMALL ISSUES THAT MAKE EVERYBODY'S JOB EASIER. AGREED. HAVING STARTED MY CAREER IN MAINTENANCE I'M DEFINITELY AWARE AND I THINK THAT'S THE THINGS THAT CREATIVITY INCLUDES OUR... AND THE OTHER THING IS, YOU'RE PROBABLY AWARE OF A DESIRE PATH, OR A PATH OF DESIRE. SO YOU MIGHT HAVE A WALKWAY HERE, BUT IF IT'S EASIER TO GO THIS WAY, PEOPLE ARE GOING TO GO THAT WAY EVERY SINGLE TIME, AND IT BECOMES A PATH. AND THERE'S A FEW SPOTS DOWN THERE WHERE WE HAVE A BENCH, LIKE RIGHT IN THE MIDDLE OF SAAD, AND THEN YOU WANT TO WALK AROUND THIS WAY, BUT EVERYBODY'S ALREADY CUTTING THROUGH IT. SO, YOU KNOW, GIVE THEM THE PATH. YOU KNOW, PUT THE MULCH DOWN. AND I THINK THAT'S ONE [00:50:01] OF THE THINGS THAT I SAID IN UPDATING. PEOPLE ON THIS PARK, IT'S A BUILDING, A PARK, ANYTHING YOU BUILD TAKES ABOUT SIX MONTHS TO SETTLE. YEAH, YEAH. AND THEN WE REALIZE THOSE PATHS SHOW UP, OR SOMETHING THAT WAS DESIGNED, AND FOR ALL OF THOSE WHO ARE BUILDING AND ALL OF YOU WHO DO THAT, YOU REALIZE YOU DESIGNED IT IN ONE WAY, YOU BUILD IT, AND YOU GO, EH, IT'S NOT QUITE THE WAY IT IS. BUT YOU CAN DO A LITTLE TWEAKING, RIGHT? AND TO YOUR POINT, THERE'S NOTHING THAT, IF YOU LOOK AT THE TOP LOOKS AND THEY HAVE THE BORDER ON THEM, WE HAVE SOME WORK TO DO TO MAKE SURE THAT STAYS THERE. BUT THAT'S SOMETHING THAT WE CAN DO TO MAKE CURVED BORDERS THAT MATCH THAT IN THE FUTURE. SO WE'VE ALREADY PUT IN THE BUDGET A SIGNIFICANT AMOUNT TO RETROFIT THINGS LIKE THAT. WHILE WE'LL LEARN FROM PHASE ONE TO GO TO PHASE TWO, THERE'LL BE A FEW OF THOSE IN PHASE TWO AS WELL. WHEN DO YOU SEE THIS STARTING? IT'S HARD TO SAY BECAUSE I CURRENTLY HAVE SIX PROJECTS WE'RE ALL STARTING. BUT WE'RE GOING TO GET THE DESIGN FINISHED HERE PRETTY SOON. SO I WOULD ANTICIPATE WE WILL TRY TO BRING IT IN FRONT OF YOU. AUGUST OR SEPTEMBER. AND ONCE WE BRING IT HERE, WE WILL BE LOOKING TO GO TO BID AFTER THAT. SO MY TARGET, OUR TARGET WAS MAYBE CONSTRUCTION DECEMBER, JANUARY. THIS IS A SHORT PROJECT. THIS IS 10 WEEKS, LIKELY, MAYBE LESS, AS LONG AS WE GET GOOD WEATHER. WHICH I'M COMMITTED TO, BY THE WAY. IT MAKES MY JOB MUCH EASIER. SO WE'RE LOOKING AT A QUICK TURNAROUND, BUT THAT'S KIND OF THE TENTATIVE SCHEDULE RIGHT NOW. OKAY. AND SINCE I'M HERE, THERE'S A NUMBER OF PROJECTS THAT ARE GOING ON. I KNOW WE'VE TALKED ABOUT BRESS ALREADY AND THE REHAB, BUT THAT GOES TO ADD TOMORROW. A BID OPENING IS JULY 2ND. SO WE HAVE A... WE ARE STARTING A AGGRESSIVE TIME IN THE CAPITAL. ANYTHING ELSE? THANK YOU, SIR. WOULD ANYBODY LIKE TO COMMENT ON THIS PROJECT? YES, MA'AM. DON'T LEAVE. PAT GANTZ, 801. I JUST WANT TO KNOW IF WE HAVE AN ANTICIPATION. MAINTENANCE FOR LANDSCAPING, PAINT, RUST, WE KNOW THESE PROJECTS ARE GREAT. MAINTENANCE ULTIMATELY IS THE WHAT IS THIS GOING TO CONTAIN ON A YEARLY BASIS. SO YES, WE HAVE A WE HAVE A MAINTENANCE PLAN FOR EVERYTHING IN THE BUILDING. WE ALSO KNOW, SO THERE'S SOME GENERAL WAYS TO FIGURE OUT. SO IF YOU LOOK AT THE INITIAL PROJECT, IT WAS BUDGETED FOR 2.3. THE TOTAL IS ABOUT 2.5. WE SPENT $2.6 MILLION ON THE PROJECT. WHAT YOU NORMALLY DO IS FIGURE ABOUT 1% PER YEAR OF YOUR BUILDING COSTS. SO WE KNOW THAT'S OUR ANNUAL MAINTENANCE COST. THE CHALLENGE, THIS PROJECT IS HIGHER THAN THAT BECAUSE IT'S SUCH A HIGH-PROFILE PROJECT. AND WE DESIGNED AS MUCH AS WE COULD TO KEEP IT LOW MAINTENANCE, BUT JUST BY ITS LOCATION, JUST BY THE NATURE OF HOW IT'S GOING TO BE USED. AND BY THE WAY, WE'RE INCREDIBLY HAPPY THAT IT'S USED. WE LIKE TO BUILD THINGS THAT ARE USED. SO WE DO PLAN THAT IN OUR BUDGET. ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WILL BE A DISCUSSION AS WE ROLL THE OTHERS OUT, PHASE TWO, THE COLUMBARIUM, THE MLK, ALL THE OTHER THINGS THAT WE'RE ROLLING OUT, IS THAT THERE IS MORE DOLLARS THAT HAVE TO BE PUT IN THE BUDGET. IT CANNOT CONTINUALLY ABSORB WITHIN THE CURRENT BUDGET TO MAINTAIN THINGS, AND I THINK THAT'S THE POINT OF THE QUESTION. BUT WE DO PLAN. WE KNEW WE HAD STARTED A PLAN TO DO THIS. WE ALSO HAVE MONEY FOR CONTRACTORS TO HELP US WITH IT. SO JANITORIAL. WE KNEW THIS WAS A HIGH JANITORIAL AREA. [00:55:02] THIS IS NOT A ONCE-A-WEEK THING. AND IT IS BEING MAINTAINED. SO WE KNOW THAT THOSE THINGS ARE COMING. WE BUDGETED FOR THEM LAST YEAR TO BE ABLE TO ROLL IT OUT THIS YEAR. AND WE WILL CONTINUE TO DO THAT PROCESS, AND WE WILL BE COMING IN FRONT OF THE COMMISSION SAYING, ALL RIGHT, THERE IS AN INDUSTRY STANDARD ABOUT STAFFING, CONTRACTING, AND... MATERIALS THAT YOU NEED TO MAINTAIN THINGS AND A REPLACEMENT SCHEDULE. SO EVERYTHING IN THAT PARK HAS A REPLACEMENT SCHEDULE. WE'VE ALREADY DETERMINED IT AND WE KNOW THAT WE'LL HAVE TO PLAN FOR THAT, BUDGET FOR THAT, AND THAT'S PART OF THAT 1%. SO WE'RE DOING A, CERTAINLY WHEN WE DO A STREET, LIKE FOR THIS, THAT WHEN THEY REDO THE STREET, IT'LL BE ABOUT 1%. AND IF WE DO 1% PER YEAR, WHEN THE TIME COMES TO REPAY THIS AFTER IT'S DONE, WE'LL HAVE ENOUGH MONEY FOR THE HOSPITAL. THE PARK IS IN THE CRA, SO DOES THE DELTA TAX, THE INCREMENTAL TAX MONEY, CAN THAT BE USED FOR OPERATIONS? IT CAN. OKAY. SO THOSE ARE, AND AS WE CONTINUE TO IMPROVE THE CRA, THAT REVENUE IS UP AND UP AND UP. AND IF YOU LOOK AT THE OPPORTUNITY AT THE BLANK SLATE WE HAVE OUT THERE, WE'RE GOING TO BE CHALLENGED AT THE END OF THE CRA FINDING WAYS TO... BECAUSE IT CAN ONLY BE USED IN THE CRA. YEAH. BUT WE DON'T HAVE THAT CHALLENGE NOW. WE HAVE PLENTY OF PLACES TO SPEND IT. OKAY. THANK YOU. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS? [5.1 HDC 2026-0009 - DONALD SKIPPER, AGENT FOR FOR JUDITH TORTORA, 811 WHITE STREET] ALL RIGHT. WE WILL NOW GO ON TO THE NEXT ITEM, WHICH IS HTC 2026-0009. MS. SEBB, GOOD EVENING. THANK YOU GUYS ALL FOR COMING. I KNOW WE ARE A LOT OF FRIENDS. MOVE AS QUICKLY AS POSSIBLE THROUGH THESE STAFF REPORTS. SO OUR FIRST ITEM UNDER OLD BUSINESS TONIGHT IS HTC 2026-0009. THIS CASE WAS HEARD LAST MONTH. IT'S FOR A NEW CONSTRUCTION PROJECT ON THE CORNER OF WHITE STREET AND AMELIA STREET IN OLD TOWN. IT LIES ON TWO MEDIA PEONIES. NO SUBSTANTIAL CHANGES HAVE BEEN... MADE TO THE PLAN BESIDES THE FURTHER DEFINITION OF THE MEDIA PIONIA LINE AND SCREENING OF THE MECHANICAL EQUIPMENT, WHICH WERE THE CONDITIONS THAT I PLACED ON THE CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL FROM LAST MEETING. ON THIS SLIDE, I PULLED THE LEFT ELEVATION AS AN EXAMPLE. IT'S MIRRORED ON THE RIGHT ELEVATION THROUGH THAT MID-LOT VISIBILITY CORRIDOR. SO ON THE LEFT-HAND SIDE, YOU HAVE WHAT WAS PRESENTED. AT THE APRIL MEETING AND THEN ON THE RIGHT IS THE REVISED DESIGN WITH THE ADDING OF THE BALCONETTE AND AN EXTENSION OF THE GABLE EAVES TO SPAN 10 FEET THROUGH THAT MID-LOT VISIBILITY CORRIDOR OR MEDIA PIONIA LINE ON THE DESIGN. THIS IS THE LEFT ELEVATION AND THE RIGHT ELEVATION IT'S MIRRORED IT GOES RIGHT THROUGH THERE AND THEN I CALLED OUT THE ADDITION OF THE MECHANICAL EQUIPMENT SCREENING ON THE FRONT RIGHT CORNER OF THE PROPERTY. THESE ARE THE FRONT AND REAR ELEVATIONS THAT WERE UNCHANGED. AND I LOOKED AT THESE PLANS AND I'M STILL HAVING A HARD TIME WITH THIS ELEMENT OF THE OLD TOWN DESIGN GUIDELINES THAT STATE PRINCIPAL AND OUTBUILDINGS MAY NOT CROSS LOT LINES WITHOUT THE USE OF AN OPEN SPACE OR CONNECTING ELEMENT THAT MAINTAINS THE DIMENSIONS OF THE MID-LOT CORRIDOR. THIS IS A SIMILAR SLIDE TO WHAT I SHOWED AT THE LAST MEETING THAT SHOWS WHERE THAT MID-LOT VISIBILITY CORRIDOR LIES ON THE PROPERTY. AND AN EXAMPLE OF A TYPICAL BLOCK OF OLD TOWN IN THE BOTTOM RIGHT CORNER. I DID PULL SOME ELEMENTS IN THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE AND I KNOW THAT'S REALLY SMALL YOU COULD TURN AROUND IN YOUR SEAT TO SEE. IT'S STAFF INTERPRETATION THAT THIS ELEMENT OF THE GUIDELINES HAS STILL NOT BEEN ADDRESSED. I DID PULL OUT NUMBER FIVE AS WELL THAT SAYS INSTANCES WHERE MEDIA PEONIES ARE OWNED IN AGGREGATE OR ASSEMBLED TO MEET MINIMUM DENSITY OR AREA REQUIREMENTS THE VISIBILITY CORRIDOR MAY BE CROSSED BY AN ENCLOSED PRIMARY STRUCTURE OR CONNECTING ELEMENT WHICH CLEARLY INDICATES THE EXISTENCE OF A VISIBILITY CORRIDOR SUBSTANTIAL CHANGES IN ROOF ELEVATIONS SUBSTANTIAL INDENTATIONS OR BREAK IN EXTERIOR WALL ELEMENTS AND SIMILAR ARCHITECTURAL FEATURES AS MAY BE APPROVED BY THE HISTORIC DISTRICT COUNCIL SO I'M LEAVING THAT UP TO THE BOARD TONIGHT IF THIS SATISFIES THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE OLD TOWN PRESERVATION DESIGN GUIDELINES IN THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE I DID PULL AN EXAMPLE THAT THE BOARD HAD APPROVED IN 2024 ON A SIMILAR CASE. THIS WAS REQUESTED BY ONE OF THE BOARD MEMBERS THAT I SHOW AN EXAMPLE TONIGHT OF WHAT THE INTENT OF THAT CODE IS. AND THIS WAS STATED BY THE [01:00:02] BOARD AS A GOOD EXAMPLE. EXAMPLE. SO I WANTED TO POINT THAT OUT TONIGHT. I KNOW THAT THE WORDS CAN GET KIND OF CONFUSING BUT IT'S ALWAYS EASIER WHEN YOU SHOW A VISUAL EXAMPLE. STAFF IS RECOMMENDING DENIAL BASED ON THE HCC DESIGN GUIDELINES AND THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE BUT RELIES ON THE HCC'S INTERPRETATION OF THE GUIDELINES FOR THIS CASE TONIGHT. THANK YOU. ANY QUESTIONS FOR MS. SADLER? ALL RIGHT. IS THE APPLICANT HERE? YES, SIR. GOOD EVENING, DONALD SKIPPER, SKIPPER CONSTRUCTIONS. CAN YOU TELL US YOUR THOUGHTS ON THIS? UM, AS FAR AS THE CONNECTING ELEMENT, WE COULD ADD THAT TO THE SHOW FROM THE BOARD. I THINK YOU'RE MISTAKEN. THAT'S IF THERE'S A DIFFERENT SITUATION WHERE A PEONIAT IS CROSSED. YOU WOULD NEED THAT. SHE'S NOT SAYING THAT THAT HAS TO BE ATTACHED. IS THAT RIGHT, MIA? I THINK THE ASSUMPTION THERE IS THAT THE GARAGE IS ON THE, IF YOU TAKE THE RED LINE, IF YOU TAKE THE RED LINE, THERE'S A GARAGE ON ONE SIDE OF THE RED LINE AND THE MAIN HOUSE ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE RED LINE, AND THEN YOU CROSS IT WITH. A BREEZEWAY, FOR LACK OF A BETTER TERM. THE EXAMPLE YOU SHOWED WAS LITERALLY WHAT THEY DID. THERE WAS A BREEZEWAY THAT, ASSUMING YOU CAME IN ON BOTH SIDES TO SOMETHING THAT'S NOTICEABLE, AND IT ALMOST LOOKS LIKE A BREEZEWAY THROUGH THERE. YEAH, AND THIS DESIGN EXTENDS WAY BEYOND THE MEDIA PEONY. YEAH, THE PEONIES DON'T DO THAT. I THINK I KNOW THE HOUSE THAT WAS APPROVED A FEW YEARS AGO. THAT ONE, I MEAN, YOU'VE GOT TWO PIECES OF THE HOUSE, AND THEN THERE'S ALMOST LIKE A CORRIDOR BETWEEN THEM, WHICH, I MEAN, CALL IT A GARAGE IF YOU WANTED TO CALL THAT ONE. IT WAS ON THE LEFT, BUT YOU DEFINITELY SEE THAT AIRSPACE. WELL, THAT'S NOT A BEDROOM IN THAT PARTICULAR DESIGN. RIGHT. NO, NO, WHAT I'M SAYING IS THAT... THAT IS VERY DEFINABLE AS OPEN SPACE FROM THE GROUND UP. THE ROOF LINE, EVERYTHING. ANY OTHER COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS? PLEASE. FIRST OFF, I DID WATCH PODCAST LEON. HAVE YOU GUYS READ STAFF'S ANALYSIS PROJECT? I THINK, I THINK... MIA'S DONE A VERY GOOD JOB OF ARTICULATING EXACTLY WHAT WE'RE FOCUSED ON IS THAT RED AREA THERE BETWEEN THE HOUSES. I THINK AN IMPORTANT THING TO KIND OF LOOK AT IN THE EXAMPLE HOUSE SITUATION, IT'S ALL ONE HOUSE. LIKE YOU SAID, IT'S A BEDROOM BACK. IT'S NOT A GARAGE. BUT THE HOUSE HAS BEEN ARTICULATED SO IT LOOKS LIKE THERE'S ONE MASS ON ONE PEONY AND THEN THERE'S ANOTHER ONE ON THE NEXT ONE AND THEN IT'S INFILLED. IT HAS LIVING SPACE AND SUCH IN BETWEEN IN THAT INFILL BUT IT'S A INDENTATION WITH A DIFFERENT ROOF STRUCTURE SO YOU CLEARLY CAN READ ONE ROOF STRUCTURE OVER ONE MASS, ONE ROOF OVER ANOTHER ONE AND THEN THERE'S A PIECE THAT INFILLS BETWEEN THEM. THE ISSUE I THINK WE'RE SEEING IN THIS DESIGN THAT YOU [01:05:01] PRESENTED, WHICH, I MEAN, IT'S A GREAT LOOKING HOUSE. BUT IT DOESN'T ADDRESS THAT MIDLOCK CORRIDOR BECAUSE THAT ROOF SPANS ALL THE WAY ACROSS THE WHOLE THING, FRONT TO BACK. REALLY, THAT ROOF, IN ORDER TO ADDRESS THAT MIDLOCK CORRIDOR, THAT ROOF WOULD HAVE TO CHANGE SOMEHOW TO BREAK UP THOSE MASSES IN THERE. I THINK THAT ITEM FIVE THAT MIA HAD POINTED OUT REALLY KIND OF STRIKES HOME AT WHAT... WHAT WE'RE LOOKING FOR AS A BOARD, I THINK, UNFORTUNATELY, REALLY, THE ONLY WAY TO ADDRESS THAT IS BY DESIGN OF THE AGGREGATE MASS OF THE HOUSE. YES, SIR, IT WOULD BE GOING BACK AND READ THE EXAM. YEAH, THE GABLE ROOF IS A... YOU KNOW, IT'S AN ADDITIVE FEATURE ATTACHED TO THE SIDE OF THE HOUSE TRYING TO ADDRESS THAT CHORD. AND I JUST DON'T THINK IT GOES FAR ENOUGH BECAUSE ESPECIALLY WHEN YOU READ THAT ITEM FIVE, IT'S TALKING ABOUT THE MASS AND ORGANIZATION OF THE WHOLE HOUSE. THAT'S JUST AN ADDITIVE PIECE ON THE EXTERIOR THAT IT'S A NOD TOWARDS IT, BUT IT'S NOT REALLY ADDRESSING THE... FULL EFFECT I THINK THE STAFF REPORT REALLY GIVES VERY DETAILED ITEMIZATION OF WHAT WE'RE LOOKING FOR THERE AND THEN HONESTLY THIS IS THE HARDEST CONCEPT THAT WE HAVE TO DEAL WITH ON THIS BOARD IT IS NOT EASY AT ALL MIA DID KIND OF PRESS TO US THAT THERE, YOU KNOW. I GET IT. I APPRECIATE THAT YOU TRIED TO GET US THERE. IN MY, THIS ISN'T REALLY GOING TO GET US TO WHERE THE WAY THAT PIECE OF THE GUIDELINE IS WRITTEN AND SPECIFICALLY HOW THAT MIDLOCK CORRIDOR NEEDS TO BE ADDRESSED. I WANT TO COMPLIMENT YOU GUYS BECAUSE IT IS AN ATTRACTIVE HOUSE AND I THINK IT WOULD ENHANCE THE COMMUNITY AND IF YOU BRING THAT SAME ATTITUDE TOWARDS DETAIL TO AN ALTERNATE DESIGN THAT REALLY NAILED THAT MIDLOCK QUARTER, IT'S GOING TO BE AN AWESOME HOUSE. BASED ON WHAT I'M SEEING HERE, I THINK YOU GUYS HAVE THE RIGHT IDEA AS FAR AS QUALITY. THE DESIGN AESTHETIC, I LOVE THE FACT THAT YOU'VE GOT PIERS ON YOUR PORCHES, WITH A HOG BOARD IN BETWEEN. THAT'S REALLY WHAT WE'RE LOOKING FOR IN OLD TOWN. THAT REALLY DRIVES THAT OLD TOWN LOOK. THIS WOULD BE GREAT IN A MID-LOT BIONIA. AND THAT'S THE HARDEST, I THINK, CONDITION THAT STAFF AND WE ALL DEAL WITH TO TRY TO CONVEY AND EXPLAIN. AND I THINK THAT'S WHY THE MAJORITY OF THE VACANT LOT LEFT IN OLD TOWN OR CORNER LOTS. YEAH. BECAUSE YOU'VE GOT TO WORK AROUND THOSE PEONIES. NOW, MAYBE THIS IS MORE BOARD COMMENT, BUT WE HAVE AN UPDATED SET OF OLD TOWN DESIGN GUIDELINES THAT HAVE GRAPHICS AND IMAGES IN THERE, BUT IT JUST HASN'T BEEN ADOPTED BY THE CITY COMMISSION YET THAT I THINK WOULD BE REALLY HELPFUL FOR PEOPLE LIKE YOU GUYS WHEN YOU COME IN AND ARE FIRST STARTING OFF. HAVE THOSE AT YOUR FINGERTIPS TO LOOK AT AND REALLY UNDERSTAND WHAT WE'RE LOOKING FOR. I DID WRITE DOWN A COUPLE OTHER THINGS THAT I THINK MAYBE WOULD BE IMPORTANT TO KEEP IN MIND AS YOU PROGRESS. THERE'S ANOTHER KIND OF ODD BIT THAT'S CALLED A CORNER VISIBILITY ANGLE, AND THIS IS A FDOT REQUIREMENT, AND I'M NOT ENTIRELY SURE OF THE EXACT MEASUREMENTS. BUT IT IS AT THE CORNER. IT'S AN ANGLED CHUNK CUTOUT THAT HAS TO BE LEFT OPEN SO YOU CAN SAFELY NAVIGATE TRAFFIC-WISE THROUGH. I THINK IT WOULD BE A GOOD IDEA TO GET THAT ON YOUR SITE PLAN AND SHOW THAT YOU'VE ADDRESSED THAT. YES, SIR. WITH THE FRONT FOUR STAIRS, THEY'RE REALLY NOT A CITY ON A TOUR TOUR. THAT'S THE... THAT'S RIGHT THERE. THAT'S RIGHT THERE, AND THAT'S [01:10:01] WHAT HINDERS YOUR VIEW FROM... AND THERE'S NO TREES? YEAH. AS FAR AS THE SETTING RIGHT WHERE THE SHEETS GOT IT ON THE SITE PLAN, WITH THAT FRONT PORCH, YOU'RE ABLE TO SEE LEFT AND RIGHT IF THE TREES WEREN'T THERE. YEAH. THANK YOU. SOME OTHER THINGS. I DIDN'T SEE ELEVATIONS FOR THE ACCESSORY BUILDING IN THE PACKET FOR THIS MONTH'S REVIEW. I... I HAD THE ACCESSORY BUILDING WASN'T CHANGED SINCE LAST MONTH. I JUST INCLUDED THE UPDATED PACKET MATERIALS, SO IT WOULDN'T BE CONFUSING FOR THE BOARD TO HAVE TWO SETS OF EVERYTHING. OKAY, SO WE'LL NEED TO SEE THOSE. I DID NOTE WHEN I WAS LOOKING AT YOUR SITE PLAN THAT THE STAIRWELL FOR THE ACCESSORY BUILDING IS 2'7 OFF THE PROPERTY LINE. I THINK BUILDING DEPARTMENT IS GOING TO TELL YOU IT HAS TO BE 3. YOU MAY NOT BE ABLE TO ENCROACH THAT CLOSE TO THE PROPERTY LINE. AND CERTAINLY IF YOU DID GO TO, IF THEY LET YOU GO TO 27, IT'S GOING TO HAVE TO BE FIRE RATED, WHICH IS GOING TO CHANGE THE WHOLE WAY THAT THING LOOKS BECAUSE YOU CAN'T JUST PUT A WOOD. SO KEEP THAT IN MIND AS YOU KIND OF ADDRESS THESE THINGS. I THINK IT'D BE VALUABLE ALSO FOR THIS BOARD TO TALK ABOUT LOT COVERAGE. WHEN I CRUNCHED THE NUMBERS THAT YOU GOT PRESENTED THERE, YOU'RE 45.1%. YOU'RE LIKE 0.1% OVER THE LOT COVERAGE, WHICH IS A COUPLE SQUARE FEET. IT'S NOT A HUGE DEAL. BUT I THINK... WE AS A BOARD HAVE SOMETHING BROKEN IN OUR GUIDELINES THAT IT ALLOWS THAT THE FRONT PORCH AND THE REAR PORCH DON'T COUNT AT ALL TOWARDS LOT COVERAGE. WHICH, YEAH, IF IT'S AN OPEN DECK, SURE, PROBABLY SHOULDN'T. BUT ONCE YOU PUT A ROOF ON IT, THAT READS VISUALLY AS MASS. IT DOESN'T ALLOW WATER TO FALL TO THE GROUND. I THINK WE NEED TO FIX OUR CODE TO ADDRESS THAT. I THINK THEY SHOULD. LIKE IF YOU BUILT THAT SAME HOUSE IN THE CITY, IT WOULD COUNT TOWARDS THAT CAP. BUT YOU'RE IN OLD TOWN, AND BECAUSE OF THE WAY THE GUIDELINE IS WRITTEN, IT DOESN'T. WELL, I BUILT IT. YEAH, I'M SORRY TO HEAR THAT. MY POINT IS THAT... THE WAY THAT'S WRITTEN RIGHT NOW, SOMEONE COULD COVER THEIR ENTIRE LOT WITH A ROOFED DECK AND SAY, HEY, THIS IS A CONNECTIVE ELEMENT. AND YOU WOULD HAVE A LOT THAT'S FILLED SETBACK TO SETBACK, LOT LINE TO LOT LINE WITH A ROOFED ELEMENT. AND THAT'S JUST NOT RIGHT. THAT'S NOT, YEAH. SO I THINK THAT'S SOMETHING FOR US TO WORK ON. WE NEED TO FIX THAT. RIGHT. TODAY WE'RE FOCUSED MOSTLY ON THE COST. YEAH. AND AT THE FINAL, FINAL, WE DO NEED TO SEE ALL THE EXTERIOR ELEMENTS CLEARLY DEFINED. LAP SIDING, FINISH, AND SPACING. AND I THINK I SAW, WELL, DOOR AND WINDOW TRIM, CALL IT THE MATERIAL, THE FINISH, THE SIZES, WATER TABLE TRIM, FASCIA, SOFFIT, CORNICE, THE DECK. CALL SO THAT WE KNOW WHAT WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO PUT IN HERE TO BUILD THIS THING? YEAH, I CAN SEE BY THAT PHOTO OF THE EXISTING HOUSE. THIS IS GONNA THE STUFF YOU'RE GONNA USE IS GONNA LOOK GREAT BUT FOR US WE NEED TO KNOW WHAT WE'RE SAYING. YES TO I THINK SORRY FOR TALKING SO ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR... ALL RIGHT, SO IF YOU COULD JUST STAY CLOSE. I'M GOING TO OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING. OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING. I HAVE ONE REQUEST TO SPEAK, MS. BASS. OH, CAN YOU PLEASE... WILL YOU RAISE YOUR RIGHT HAND? DO YOU SWEAR OR AFFIRM THAT THE [01:15:01] ORAL AND WRITTEN TESTIMONY YOU ARE ABOUT TO GIVE WILL BE THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH? NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH. BASICALLY, I HAVE A QUESTION. YOU SAY HE'S THE VERY FIRST THING OUT OF HIS MOUTH WHEN YOU GAVE ME CHILLS, AND THAT IS GARAGE. ONE THING WE'RE NOT SUPPOSED TO HAVE IN ALL TIMES, YOU CAN HAVE ROOMS, GUEST HOUSES, BUT NOT APARTMENTS LIKE YOU CAN RIGHT NOW. NOT SEPARATE HOMES WHERE YOU CAN LIVE IN. AND IT'S GETTING TO THE POINT WHERE WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO HAVE A WHOLE NEIGHBORHOOD FULL OF CARETAKERS TO GET STOPPED BECAUSE IT'S HAPPENING IN ABOUT TEN DIFFERENT PLACES IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD. AND IT DOESN'T MAKE FOR A VERY HAPPY NEIGHBORHOOD IF WE START TURNING IN OUR NEIGHBORS FOR HAVING RENTAL PROPERTY THAT THEY'RE NOT SUPPOSED TO HAVE. SO IF WE COULD STOP IT HERE... WE COULD PUT THEM INTO IT. MY OTHER CONCERN IS THE LOT COVERAGE. AND WHAT'S ALWAYS MY PITY IS THAT IT DOESN'T GO UP TO THAT. THE THIRD ONE IS TO, AND I DON'T EVEN KNOW IF THIS IS UNDER YOUR RESPONSIBILITY, BUT IT'S KEEPING PEOPLE FROM PUTTING THEIR LANDSCAPING IN THE RIGHT OF WAY. NOW THAT OLD TOWN'S BEGINNING TO BUILD OUT, AND TRUST ME, IT CAME RIGHT ON UP WHITE STREET. IT CAME TO MY HOUSE. THERE'S NO PLACE FOR ANYBODY TO PARK. WE PUT A HOUSE ON EVERY LOT, JUST SO NOBODY CAN HAVE ANY COMPANY. BECAUSE THERE'S NO PLACE FOR THE COMPANY TO PARK. AND SO THEY'RE IN THE STREET, THEY DON'T KNOW WHERE THE RIGHT-OF-WAY IS. THEY PUT FLOWERS IN THE RIGHT-OF-WAY, THEY PUT TREES IN THE RIGHT-OF-WAY. THEY PUT EVERYTHING YOU CAN THINK OF IN THE RIGHT-OF-WAY. BUT NOT THE CARS THAT BELONG THERE. AND IT JUST IS GETTING OUT OF HAND. AND IT'S GOING TO GET WORSE, I'M AFRAID, BEFORE IT GETS BETTER. SO IF YOU COULD ENCOURAGE PEOPLE TO NOT FILL IN THERE RIGHT AWAY, I'M NOT EVEN SURE MOST OF THEM KNOW WHAT THAT IS, BUT IF WE COULD START HAVING THAT DELINEATED. THE OTHER THING I WANT TO SUGGEST IS WHEN YOU'RE STANDING ON THIS PROPERTY, IF YOU LOOK DIRECTLY TO THE EAST, THE HOUSE TO THE EAST, THERE IS A COLUMN STANDING THERE THAT LOOKS A LITTLE OUT OF PLACE AND YOU WONDER WHAT IT IS. IT'S THE THING THEY USE TO DELINEATE THE TWO LOTS. NOTHING IS INDENTED, NOTHING IS CHANGED, IT WAS JUST A COLUMN. YOU KNOW, I WANT TO THINK ABOUT A COLUMN. WHICH WE'VE DONE LESS THAN WE'VE DONE BEFORE NOW, I'M SURE. BUT I DON'T THINK... WHAT HE'S BUILDING IT OUT OF HAS ANYTHING TO DO WITH WHAT WAS WITH THE HGC. THERE ARE ONLY FOUR THINGS YOU CAN, IN OLD TOWN, BUILD IT OUT OF GLASS IF YOU WANT TO. AND THAT'S THE SETBACKS, THE COVERAGE. WHAT ARE THE OTHER TWO? THE CORRIDORS. CORRIDORS. THERE'S ONE MORE. THE GRID. THE GRID. THE GRID. THERE'S A LOT MORE THAN FOUR. OTHER THAN THAT, THEY CAN BUILD A GLASS HOUSE. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. THANK YOU. THE DIFFERENCE THERE IS THAT WHEN WE APPROVE A HOUSE, WE NEED TO KNOW WHAT WE'RE APPROVING. OKAY. AND THAT'S WHY I MAKE THE KIND OF COMMENTS THAT LET'S DEFINE WHAT MATERIALS WE'RE USING. WELL, IN THE ORIGINAL PACKET, ALL OF THAT WAS IN IT. SO, ONE TO SIX, ONE TO TWO, PARTY, ALL OF THAT WAS IN IT. PERFECT. THANK YOU. IS THERE ANYONE ELSE WHO WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK ON THIS CASE? AND MS. GASS, THANK YOU FOR FILLING OUT THE FORM AND REMINDING ME TO TELL PEOPLE, IF YOU DO CHOOSE TO SPEAK BEFORE YOU LEAVE TODAY, COULD YOU FILL OUT ONE OF THESE FORMS AT THE BACK SO THAT WE HAVE A PAPER RECORD OF HER BEING HERE? ALL RIGHT, I AM GOING TO CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING AND GO TO BOARD DISCUSSION. DON'T ALL JUMP AT ONCE. I THINK MR. PIZZETTA HAS STATED A FEW THINGS. IS THERE AGREEMENT WITH JIM AND GEMMA? I DO. I DO. AFTER LOOKING AT WHAT WAS ABLE TO BE DONE, THANK YOU, I DON'T THINK THAT MEETS THE EXPECTATION OF DELINEATING IT BECAUSE YOU HAVE THE PRINCESS PORCH, [01:20:03] BUT THEN THERE'S A WINDOW IN THERE AND THEN ANOTHER WINDOW AND THEN ON OUR HIGHER WINDOW UP IT JUST IT ALMOST THE TERM THAT COMES TO MIND IS RANSOM NOTE I I DON'T I DON'T SEE THE CLEAN MIDLOCK PIANO AND AND AND I KNOW IT'S TOUGH BECAUSE WE'VE SEEN THIS BOARD KIND OF WALK AROUND IT AND NOT DO IT BUT AT SOME POINT WE HAVE TO DO THE RIGHT JOB AND UM AND AND WHILE THESE ARE WONDERFUL PEOPLE AND IT'S A BEAUTIFUL HOUSE I'M GOING TO HAVE TO VOTE NO BECAUSE IT DOESN'T MEET THAT MINIMUM CRITERIA. ANYTHING ELSE? I JUST WANTED TO SAY THAT I APPRECIATED JIM'S INPUT SO MUCH. HE'S GOT THE MOST EXPERIENCE WITH THIS UP THERE. PROBABLY YOU HAVE ALMOST AS MUCH JUST WITH ALL THE THINGS THAT YOU'VE DEALT WITH UP THERE AND BUILDING AND YOUR HOUSES AND WHATNOT. BUT I WENT UP THIS WEEKEND, AND I JUST LITERALLY WALKED THE WHOLE. EVERY BLOCK AND I LOOKED AT EVERY MEDIA PEONIA. THERE ARE A FEW THAT HAVE BEEN BUILT OVER THE YEARS THAT AT SOME POINT THEY THERE WAS NO REGARD FOR IT AND WHERE THAT COLUMN IS YEAH THAT COLUMN SHOWS EXACTLY WHERE THE MEDIA PEONIA IS BUT ALSO THEIR STRUCTURES DON'T CROSS THE LINE. THAT STOPS AND THEN THE GARAGE STARTS. THAT'S NOT JUST A COLUMN THAT WAS RANDOMLY OR STUCK THERE TO DENOTE IT SO I LIKE JIM'S IDEA THAT WE NEED TO JUST BE SUPER CLEAR AND IF WE NEED TO STUDY THIS OR CHANGE ANY WORDING, THAT'S FINE. BUT I THINK THERE'S GOOD GUIDELINES THAT HAVE BEEN GIVEN FOR THIS AND SOME ADJUSTMENTS CAN BE MADE TO MAKE IT HIT WHAT IT'S SUPPOSED TO HIT. AND I THINK DONALD HAS IDENTIFIED THAT TO MAKE THAT ELEVATION MATCH. WHAT THE REQUIREMENT OUTLINED IN STAFF REPORT IS REALLY JUST NOT POSSIBLE WITH A SIMPLE LITTLE TWEAK HERE OR THERE, UNFORTUNATELY. I'M IN AGREEMENT WITH WHAT'S BEEN SAID SO FAR THAT IT DOESN'T, ALTHOUGH IT IS A BEAUTIFUL DESIGN, IT REALLY IS LOVELY, BUT IT DOESN'T MEET THE REQUIREMENTS. AND I DO THINK IT'S A REDESIGN OF THE FLOOR PLAN AND THEN HOW THAT TRANSLATES TO THE ELEVATIONS AND THE ROOF. ANY OTHER COMMENTS? DO WE FEEL READY TO TAKE A VOTE? JUST TO KIND OF SUMMARIZE, THERE'S TWO SEPARATE ISSUES AT LEAST HERE. THERE'S ONE THAT SAYS THE CORRIDORS HAVE TO BE MARKED. WE HAVE TO KNOW THAT. THAT'S THE ONLY WAY. WE CAN PROTECT THE GRID AND THAT'S OUR MAJOR CHARGE IS TO PROTECT THE GRID. KNOWING FULL WELL THAT PROBABLY IN THE EARLY DAYS OF FERNANDINA, THAT GRID, FROM WHAT I UNDERSTAND, WENT RIGHT THROUGH SOME PEOPLE'S HOUSES AND THEY ACTUALLY HAD TO MOVE THEIR HOUSE. SO WE'RE NOT MOVING ANYTHING. BUT I DO THINK THAT... THE SEPARATE ISSUE IS THE GUIDELINES. WE NEED TO DO SOME WORK ON THE GUIDELINES TO ENSURE THAT THEY'RE REALLY CLEAR AND UNDERSTOOD BY EVERYBODY COMING IN. MY SUGGESTION, WELL, I'LL WAIT UNTIL AFTER THE VOTE BECAUSE MAYBE I DON'T HAVE ONE. OKAY, ARE WE READY FOR A VOTE, FOLKS? LET ME ASK THE OTHER BOARD MEMBERS. MY THOUGHT IS TO MOVE TO DENY BASED ON THE STAFF REPORT, BECAUSE I THINK IT VERY ARTICULATELY LAYS OUT THE RATIONALE FOR WHY. AND IF YOU GUYS ARE IN AGREEMENT WITH THAT, I'D GO WITH THAT. ALL RIGHT. SO, READY TO MAKE A MOTION? YES. I MOVE TO DENY CASE NUMBER HDC 2026-00. WITH THE CONDITION THAT IT BE REVISED TO ADDRESS STAFF COMMENTARY IN THE REPORT. AND I MOVE THAT THE HDC MAKE THE FOLLOWING FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW PART OF THE RECORD, THAT HDC CASE HDC 2026-0009, AS PRESENTED, IS NOT SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANT WITH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE. SECRETARY OF INTERIOR STANDARDS AND THE OLD TOWN DEVELOPMENT AND PRESERVATION GUIDELINES TO WARRANT FINAL APPROVAL. [01:25:04] DO WE HAVE A MOTION? DO WE HAVE A SECOND? SECOND. PLEASE CALL THE ROLL. MEMBERS FOR SAT SALAH. MY BRAIN RIGHT NOW. SO HE SAID YES. MOVE TO DENY. YES TO DENY. SORRY MIDDLE SCHOOL BRAIN TEACHER. SORRY. ALMOST ON MY BREAK. MEMBER KOSAK. YES. MEMBER STOKOWSKI. YES. MEMBER BURNS. YES. MEMBER SALA. YES. VICE REPOSITO. I'M GOING TO VOTE YES. REGRETFULLY SO BECAUSE I THINK IT IS A GOOD DESIGN FOR SOME OTHER LOT AND CHEERFUL YEAH SO MY SUGGESTION WOULD BE THAT AS YOU SIT DOWN TO LOOK AT THE PLAN AND TRY TO DETERMINE WHERE TO GO NEXT I WOULD TAP INTO ME EARLY ON IN THAT PROCESS NOT AFTER YOU'VE DONE IT BUT HAVE HER ASSIST YOU WITH THAT BECAUSE THAT SHOULD MAKE IT GO EASIER. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. [5.2 HDC 2026-0006 - SHANE DONOVAN FATLAND, 322 S. 6TH STREET] THANK YOU. ALL RIGHT WE ARE NOW AT CASE HGC 2026-0006. THANK YOU. THIS IS THE SECOND APPEARANCE OF THIS CASE HGC 2026-0006. FOR A PROPERTY LOCATED AT 322 SOUTH 6TH STREET. THE APPLICANTS WERE HERE LAST MONTH IN APRIL FOR FINAL APPROVAL FOR A COMPREHENSIVE RESTORATION OF THE STRUCTURE, INCLUDING A COUPLE OF ELEMENTS. SINCE THEN, THE APPLICATION HAS BEEN REVISED TO MEET HGC BOARD COMMENTS THAT WERE GIVEN AT THAT MEETING. THERE WERE SOME ADDITIONAL APPLICATION MATERIALS FOR THIS CASE. THAT'S INCORRECT. THING WHERE IT SAYS HEIGHT OF ACCESSORY STRUCTURE. THERE'S JUST SOME ADDITIONAL MATERIALS THAT WERE PLACED AT YOUR DESKS BEFORE YOU ARRIVED INCLUDING CAD DRAWINGS OF THE SITE PLAN AND ALL EXISTING AND PROPOSED ELEVATIONS. THE APPLICANT, AFTER THE MEETING, I WATCHED IT BACK AND MADE A LIST OF EVERYTHING THAT THE BOARD REQUESTED AND SENT THAT TO THE APPLICANT AND THEN WHEN THEY SUBMITTED NEW APPLICATION MATERIALS THEY HAD A SIMILAR KIND OF Q&A. A DOCUMENT THAT THEY INCLUDED IN THEIR APPLICATION PACKET SPECIFICALLY ADDRESSING EACH OF THE BOARD'S REQUESTS WITH EITHER AN EXPLANATION OR A DESCRIPTION OF WHERE THAT WAS INCLUDED IN THEIR ADDITIONAL APPLICATION MATERIALS. I JUST INCLUDED THAT CHART THAT WAS IN MY STAFF REPORT HERE ON THIS SLIDE. THERE WAS A SPECIFIC CALL-OUT FOR HEIGHT DIMENSIONS AND THE GARAGE WAS MEASURED AND THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE WAS MEASURED FROM GRADE TO THE PEAK OF THE ROOF. INFORMATION ABOUT INTENTIONS FOR THE POSTS ON THE PORCH WERE INCLUDED. SETBACKS WERE ADDED TO THE DRAWING TO MATCH REQUIREMENTS OF THE R2 ZONING DISTRICT. THERE WERE SPECIFIC CALL-OUTS FOR TYPE OF WOOD FOR ALL CONSTRUCTION, INCLUDING SIDING, RAILINGS. THERE WAS MORE DETAILS ABOUT THE SIDE PORCH RESTORATION ON THE SOUTHEAST CORNER, INCLUDING THE EXISTING AND PROPOSED ELEVATION, AND THE REQUEST TO REMOVE THE ADDITION OF THE BAY WINDOW ON THE FRONT WAS PROPOSED IN THE REVISED PLANS. THERE WAS ALSO A WINDOW SURVEY THAT WAS INCLUDED. AS PART OF THIS REAPPEARANCE OF THE CASE AND AS WELL AS THE CAD DRAWINGS AND I'LL JUST KIND OF FLIP THROUGH THOSE RIGHT NOW FOR THE AUDIENCE BUT THOSE ARE ON YOUR DESKS RIGHT NOW AND THESE ARE A MORE PROFESSIONAL QUALITY THAN THAT WHAT WAS PRESENTED AT THE FIRST MEETING I DID NOT HAVE ANY RESERVATIONS ABOUT THIS CASE AT THE LAST MEETING AND I STILL RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF HTC 2026-0006 OKAY ARE YOU GOING TO SPEAK OR IS MR. ZUCCA? OKAY. YOU DON'T WANT TO? I'LL BRING IT IN IF I HAVE TO. SHANE AND BRIAN, WE'RE HERE LAST WEEK ENGAGED, BUT AFTER... QUESTIONS FOR MR. SAKOWSKI. ONE QUICK QUESTION. THESE DRAWINGS ARE, THANK YOU FOR THAT. AND ACTUALLY THANK YOU FOR THE HAND DRAWINGS THAT PRIOR TO THE THING TO CLYDE DO, THE BAY WINDOW. BUT THERE IS A HAND DRAWN. SEAT FRONT ELEVATION. SO I JUST WANT... YEAH, THAT WAS OLD APPLICATION MATERIAL. [01:30:02] ANYTHING ELSE? YES, SIR. MR. PIZZATA. SO I'M LOOKING AT THE ACCESSORY STRUCTURE OF THE GARAGE. I THINK YOU GUYS MAY WANT TO CHECK SOME COAT THINGS. FOR EXAMPLE, YOU GOT A DOOR GOING INTO THE SIDE YARD BECAUSE IT'S RIGHT ON THE THREE-FOOT SETBACK. YOU MAY NOT BE ALLOWED TO HAVE A DOOR THERE. NORMALLY WHAT I WOULD DO IS JUST SCOOCH IT IN FOUR INCHES AND THEN YOU CAN PUT DOORS AND WINDOWS ON THERE. IT'S A FIRE COAT THING IS WHY. I THINK THAT MAY NOT BE ALLOWED. I'M JUST SAYING THAT SO THEY CHECK IT AND VERIFY. THERE'S AN ODD LITTLE PIECE IN THE OLD TOWN GUIDELINES ABOUT ACCESSORY STRUCTURES THAT THE OVERHANG CAN ONLY BE 12 INCHES. THIS LOOKS LIKE IT'S 16 OR SOMETHING. SO SORRY SORRY YOU MAY WANT TO CHECK THAT. OKAY, NO PROBLEM. THE ACCESSORY BUILDING, YOU MIGHT WANT TO CHECK IF THERE'S A REQUIREMENT FOR THE OFFSET FROM THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE TOO. IN THE LDC, THERE'S LIKE ONE LITTLE TERM ABOUT THAT, AND MAYBE FIVE FEET THAT THAT COULD AFFECT THIS. IF NOT, NO ISSUE. THEN... I JUST HAVE IT ON IS THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT EVEN GOING TO LOOK AT THIS PROJECT IF YOU DON'T HAVE ARCHITECTURAL DRAWINGS FOR THE GARAGE SO WE'LL HAVE ENGINEERING DRAWINGS FOR THE GARAGE STRUCTURE WILL BE ALL RIGHT CORRECT SETBACKS THANK YOU, AND I JUST WANT TO SAY THANKS YOUR WHOLE TEAM FOR GETTING ALL THAT EXTRA DETAIL AND ALL THE EXTRA CALL-OUTS ON THERE IS SUPER HELPFUL TO READ IT AND SEE IT. AND I HAD, MY GUT TOLD ME, YOU GUYS ARE GOING TO DO A GREAT JOB. AND THIS, JUST GETTING THIS EXTRA INFORMATION ON THERE MEANS THAT WHEN WE SAY YES TO YOUR PROJECT, WE KNOW WE'RE GOING TO GET IT. THANKS, GUYS. ANYTHING ELSE? THANK YOU FOR JUMPING TO GET THIS DONE. THANK YOU FOR ALSO JUMPING TO GET THIS DONE. HUGE, HUGE. I MEAN, IT JUST MAKES OUR LIFE EASY BECAUSE WE CAN UNDERSTAND IT AND WE CAN SEE IT AND WE KNOW WHAT WE'RE APPRECIATING. IT'S GOING TO BE GORGEOUS. I THINK THE OTHER BENEFIT IS FOR MEMBERS OF THIS BOARD WHO HAVE THE KIND OF EXPERTISE AND EXPERIENCES THAT MR. POSADA AND MS. BURNS. ALL OF THEM HAVE AND WHERE THEY'VE GOTTEN BURNED IN THE PAST TO BENEFIT FROM THAT FOR YOU SO THANK YOU SIR ALL RIGHT I'M GOING TO OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING IS THERE ANYONE WHO WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK ON THIS CASE FOR DISCUSSION I THINK WE HAVE EVERYTHING WE NEED. YEAH. WE'RE GOOD? I'D LIKE TO MAKE A POSITIVE MOTION. WELL, THEN YOU GO FOR IT. I MOVE TO APPROVE CASE NUMBER HDC-2026-0006 WITHOUT CONDITIONS, AND I MOVE THAT HDC MAKE THE FOLLOWING FINDINGS A FACT IN CONCLUSIONS OF LAW OF HEART OF THE RECORD, THAT HDC CASE HDC-2026-0006 AS PRESENTED. IT IS SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANT WITH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE, SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR STANDARDS, AND THE HISTORIC DOWNTOWN FERNANDINA BEACH DESIGN GUIDELINES TO WARRANT FINAL APPROVAL AT THIS POINT. SECOND. WE HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND. PLEASE CALL THE VOTE. MEMBER SHORSAD SCHALLER? YES. MEMBER KOSAK? YES. MEMBER SIKOWSKI? WE'RE CLOSED. MEMBER BURNS? YES. MEMBER SALA? YES. VICE CHAIR PEZZETTA? YES. AND CHAIR POLKOFF? YES. CONGRATULATIONS. GOOD LUCK. IT'S GOING TO BE BEAUTIFUL. IT'S GOING TO BE BEAUTIFUL. I KNOW. I WON'T BE HERE TO SEE IT. SEND ME A PICTURE. [6.1 HDC2026-0010 - 1ST IMPRESSIONS CONTRACTORS INC, AGENT FOR BLUE HERON BNB LLC., 102 S. 7TH STREET] OKAY, WE ARE NOW ON TO HDC 2026-0010. YES. SO WE HAVE FOUR ITEMS ON OUR NEW BUSINESS TONIGHT. WE USED TO HAVE FIVE AND THEN WE REALIZED IT WAS NOT IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT. SO THAT HAS BEEN REMOVED [01:35:01] FROM THE AGENDA. MOVING ON TO HGC 2020. 2026-00010, THIS IS AN APPLICATION FOR CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL TO REPLACE EXTERIOR VINYL SIDING WITH PARTY BOARD. THIS IS FOR THE PROPERTY LOCATED AT 102 AND 106 SOUTH 7TH STREET, KNOWN AS THE BLUE HERON INN. THESE ARE THE PROVIDED PICTURES FROM THE APPLICANT. WE'VE GOT ONE OF THE FACADE AT 102 SOUTH 7TH STREET AND ONE OF A CLOSE-UP OF THE VINYL SIDING. THESE ARE SOME PICTURES OF WHAT IS PROVIDED BY THE APPLICANT OF WHAT IS EXISTING UNDERNEATH THE VINYL SIDING. THERE WAS A SIMILAR APPLICATION TO THIS MADE IN 2024 AND I DID SOME RESEARCH AND INFORMED THE APPLICANT OF THIS CASE THAT WAS PRESENTED IN 2024 AND THE QUESTIONS THAT CAME UP FROM THE BOARD. I DID ADVISE THE APPLICANT THAT WE WOULD NEED A MORE THOROUGH AUDIT AND INVESTIGATION INTO WHAT IS EXISTING. AND WHAT IS UNDERNEATH THE VINYL SIDING FOR THE BOARD TO BE ABLE TO APPROVE THE REPLACEMENT OF HARDY BOARD OVER HISTORIC WOOD AND THEN I DID DO SOME RESEARCH THESE ARE THIS IS A LOT OF WORDS BUT I'LL KIND OF WALK EVERYONE THROUGH REGARDING THE SUBSTITUTE AND OF AND REPLACEMENT MATERIALS ORIGINAL SIDING IS HIGHLY DEMONSTRATIVE OF ARCHITECTURAL INTEGRITY MEANING THAT IS VERY IMPORTANT TO OUR HISTORIC DISTRICT AND OUR CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES THESE STRUCTURES ARE LISTED AS CONTRIBUTING ON THE SURVEY THAT WAS DONE IN 2020. SO MODERN SIDING TREATMENTS SUCH AS VINYL AND ALUMINUM CANNOT REPLICATE THE NATURAL APPEARANCE OF REAL WOOD AND ARE THEREFORE DISCOURAGED. THE GUIDELINES STATE TO RETAIN AND MAINTAIN ORIGINAL WOOD SIDING, AND THERE'S A COUPLE GUIDELINE BULLET POINTS THERE. I'LL JUMP TO NUMBER FIVE, REPLACE HISTORIC SIDING AND SHINGLES ONLY AS REQUIRED AND WITH MATERIALS THAT MATCH ORIGINAL AS CLOSELY AS POSSIBLE. AND IF HISTORIC SIDING WAS REMOVED AND COVERED PRIOR TO THE ADOPTION OR DESIGN GUIDELINES OR BECOMES DAMAGED BEYOND REASONABLE REPAIR, THE USE OF SYNTHETIC REPLACEMENT SIDING MAY BE PERMITTED. AND THAT IS THE REASON WHY THE BOARD IS SEEING THIS TONIGHT. IT'S NOT SOMETHING THAT I FELT COMFORTABLE APPROVING ON A STAFF LEVEL, SO I ADVISED THE APPLICANT WHEN THEY REACHED OUT THAT THEY WOULD HAVE TO MAKE AN APPLICATION TO THE HISTORIC DISTRICT COUNCIL FOR THE BOARD TO REVIEW THE CASE. OUR ADMIN COORDINATOR HELPED ME TO KIND OF DO SOME INVESTIGATING INTO WHEN THE VINYL SIDING WAS PLACED. BUT PLACED ON THE BUILDING IN 1990 WHICH WAS AFTER THE DESIGNATION OF THE HISTORIC DISTRICT IN 1972 SO THEREFORE THE GUIDELINES STATE THAT THE WOOD SIDING SHOULD BE RESTORED AND PRESERVED ON THESE BUILDINGS IT WAS STAFF'S OPINION THAT THE APPLICATION MATERIAL WAS NOT SUFFICIENT TO WARRANT THE USE OF CEMENTITIOUS SIDING SO STAFF HAD TO RECOMMEND DENIAL OF HGC 2026-0010 ANY QUESTIONS I JUST WANTED THE FACT THAT IT'S A CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE REALLY IS DRIVING HOME THE DETERMINATION FROM STAFF CORRECT YES AND THE PART THAT CONCERNS ME IS IF WE WERE TO APPROVE REMOVING THAT HISTORIC WOOD SIDING POTENTIALLY WE'RE JEOPARDIZING ITS STATUS AS A CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE FORWARD AND IF WE DO THAT ENOUGH TIMES WE POTENTIALLY ARE JEOPARDIZING OUR ENTIRE HISTORIC DISTRICT OF HAVING THAT DESIGNATION. SO I THINK, FOR ME ANYWAY, THIS IS A VERY EASY DESIGNATION. BASED ON THOSE PHOTOS OF THE EXISTING CONDITION, IT LOOKS FINE. I DON'T SEE ANY COMPELLING REASON TO REMOVE THE EXISTING WOOD. THE VINYL, I GOT NO PROBLEM WITH. IF THEY WANT TO TAKE THAT VINYL OFF, I THINK THAT'S EASY. I DON'T THINK MIA WOULD BE HERE TODAY WITH THIS IN FRONT OF US IF IT WAS ONLY TO REMOVE THIS VINYL. THAT'S REALLY ALL I HAVE. THE APPLICANT IS HERE. THEY MIGHT HAVE ADDITIONAL EXPLANATION AS WELL. OKAY. SO IT SAYS IT'S CONCEPTUAL TO REPLACE THE HARDY. SO DO YOU MEAN LEAVE THE WOOD THERE AND JUST PUT HARDY IN FRONT OF IT? I DON'T THINK YOU CAN PUT HARDY OVER WOOD. YEAH. AND THIS IS THE EXACT DISCUSSION WE HAD THE FIRST TIME IT WAS BROUGHT TO US BECAUSE OF LOSING CONTRIBUTING STATUS AND THE MODIFICATIONS THAT HAD ALREADY BEEN MADE ON THE SECOND BUILDING HERE THAT WE DIDN'T WANT TO. I THINK IT'S PRETTY CUT AND DRY. OKAY, WELL, LET'S GET THE APPLICANT. IS THE APPLICANT HERE? YES, MA'AM. TOOTH EXTRACTION. AND I'M JUST GOING TO SWEAR YOU IN IF YOU DON'T MIND. [01:40:06] DO YOU RAISE YOUR RIGHT HAND? WE SWEAR OUR FIRM THAT THE ORAL AND OUR WRITTEN TESTIMONY YOU'RE ABOUT TO GIVE WILL BE THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH OF NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH. AND JUST PLEASE STATE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS FOR THE RECORD. YES, MY NAME IS... NO PROBLEM. IT'S A PROPERTY... I DO HAVE... EXISTING AND THAT'S THE REASON WHY THE STRUCTURE IS BEING VERY BAD. AND AS FAR AS THE PRESERVING, YOU KNOW, THE HISTORIC, YOU KNOW, WE UNDERSTAND THE IMPORTANCE OF PRESERVING THE NINA BEACH HISTORIC CHARACTER OUR GOAL HERE IS EXISTING FINAL CITING THE MATERIAL THAT IS VISIBLY SUPERIOR SYSTEM AND THE TRADITION HISTORIC WIDTH AFFORD WHILE ENSURING KEEP HAVING MATERIAL THAT LOOKS JUST LIKE THEIR WORK. IT LOOKS IDENTICAL. SAME SPAN. ARE YOU PROPOSING TO USE THE ARTISAN SERIES AS OPPOSED TO REGULAR ARTIE? YES, SIR. OH, ALL RIGHT. A LITTLE BETTER. I'M TORN ADU. TORN ADU. WELL, PENDING WHAT THE EXISTING WALL SURFACE IS. WELL, LIKE I ALREADY SAID, I HAVE NO ISSUE WITH REMOVING THE VINYL, BUT IN ORDER FOR US TO APPROVE REPLACING THE EXISTING WOOD, WE'D HAVE TO SEE EVIDENCE THAT THAT EXISTING WOOD IS BEYOND HELP. I DO HAVE, THROUGH OUR COMPANY, AND YOU DON'T HAVE THOSE PHOTOS WITH YOU? I THINK MAYBE FOR CLARITY, IT'S NOT JUST IF THE ORIGINAL... WOOD IS DETERIORATED, YOU KNOW, IT KIND OF NEEDS TO BE A PERCENTAGE. SURELY THERE'S SOME AREAS WHERE YOU PULL IT OFF AND IT'S GOING TO BE COMPLETELY ROTTED, BUT, YOU KNOW, SOMETIMES THE VINYL PROTECTS WHAT'S UNDERNEATH IT. SO IT MIGHT JUST BE A CORNER BOARD OR A FEW SQUARE FEET THAT MIGHT BE INFILLED AND LACED IN TO REPAIR, AND THAT'S REALLY WHAT WE'RE LOOKING FOR. YOU KNOW, WE'VE HAD A LOT OF STRUCTURES IN A SIMILAR SITUATION. THEY'VE TAKEN OFF AND THEY WERE ABLE TO MATCH THE EXISTING WOOD SIDING. AND REPAIR RATHER THAN JUST WHOLESALE REPLACE WITH A MODERN MATERIAL. SO, YOU KNOW, IT'S JUST HARD FOR US TO KNOW, EVEN BY LOOKING AT A COUPLE OF PHOTOS THAT SHOW SOME DETERIORATION, WHAT THE PERCENTAGE OF THAT DETERIORATION MIGHT BE ACROSS THE WHOLE BUILDING. CAN I ASK YOU SOMETHING? YES. WHEN I SEE THIS PICTURE HERE, I SEE WHAT WAS REMOVED VINYL SIDING, FOAM INSULATION. AND THEN THE OLDER WOOD SIDING. SO I KNOW I'M ASKING THE SAME QUESTION AGAIN. SO THE INTENT HERE IS TO TAKE OFF THE VINYL SIDING, ALL THE FOAM INSULATION, ALL THE WOODEN SIDING, AND THEN PUT HARDY BORON? I JUST WANT TO CLARIFY, BECAUSE AGAIN, REPLACEMENT IS ONLY VINYL. DIDN'T SAY THE REST OF IT. SO IF YOU LOOK AT TWO OF THE... AND HAVE A GREAT DAY. CAN YOU CLAP? SHEATHING, THERE'S NO WOOD [01:45:02] FOR THIS. IT'S, IT'S, IT'S, IT'S VINYL ON STUDS. YES. BUT WE NEED MORE. DO YOU KNOW WHICH TWO SIDES OF WHICH BUILDINGS THAT MIGHT BE? I WILL SAY, WE'RE KIND OF LIKE, WE'RE DOING A LITTLE... SO WHAT IS SO VERY IMPORTANT FOR THE HISTORIC DISTRICT IS WHAT PRESENTS TO THE STREET. AND LIKE EVEN COMPOSITE AND FRESHER, MORE MODERN MATERIALS MIGHT BE ALLOWED ON A DECK, FOR INSTANCE, IN THE REAR OF THE PROPERTY, BUT NOT ON THE FRONT. THAT COULD BE DONE IN WOOD. SO I THINK IT'S CRITICAL FOR ALL OF US TO HAVE... MANY MORE DETAILED PHOTOS THAT REALLY, MAYBE EVEN A SITE PLAN THAT SHOWS, YOU KNOW, THIS PICTURE IS ON THE BACK REAR CORNER. THERE'S NOTHING THERE. SO IF YOU'RE GOING TO PROPOSE GOING BACK WITH HARDY THERE, I THINK WE'D HAVE A LOT LESS PROBLEMS WITH THAT. WHEREAS ON THE FRONT, IF IT'S MORE PRESERVED AND YOU ARE RESTORING, YOU KNOW, YOU MIGHT GO TWO SIDES WOOD, TWO SIDES HARDY. YEAH, AND WE HAVE IN THE PAST WHERE THERE'S SIGNIFICANT AREAS OF DEGRADED. EXISTING HISTORIC SIDING, WE HAVE ALLOWED THEM TO SALVAGE THE GOOD STUFF FROM THE NON-VIEW SIDES, USE THEM TO FIX THE VIEW SIDES, AND THEN RE-SKIN THE NON-VIEW SIDES WITH NEW STUFF SO THAT WE STILL MAINTAIN THAT HISTORIC MATERIAL AND THE QUALITY OF IT. AND THE INTEGRITY OF THE BUILDING. YEAH, AND THAT'S CERTAINLY... SOMETHING THAT COULD BE DONE, BUT I THINK WE NEED TO BE PROVIDED WITH A VERY DETAILED SURVEY OF WHAT'S THE CONDITION IT SOUNDS LIKE A MOTION. ALL AROUND THESE HOUSES. VISIBLY, BECAUSE I HAVE PICTURES, SO I DON'T WANT TO COME FROM EXISTING. THAT'S RIGHT. SO HOW CAN WE FARE IN REGARDS? BUT AGAIN... THE DEVIL IS IN THE DETAILS. SO IT WAS APPROVED APPARENTLY FOR SOME OF THE SURFACES BUT NOT THE STREET FACING. SO THAT WOULD BE THE RESEARCH THAT YOU WOULD NEED TO DO IS TO DETERMINE WHAT OF THE WOOD THAT'S LEFT IS GOOD ENOUGH TO MAYBE MOVE TO THE FRONT. I'M SORRY, EARLIER ON DIDN'T YOU SAY THOUGH THAT IT WAS REALLY DETERIORATING AND EVERYTHING? IN THE BACK. OH, IN THE BACK. OKAY. ONE WAY THAT WE'VE HAD APPLICANTS DEAL WITH THIS IN THE PAST IS THEY'VE COME TO US WITH THE REQUEST AND INTENT TO REMOVE THE VINYL OR WHATEVER THE SIDING MIGHT BE. ASBESTOS SIDING SOMETIMES WAS PUT UP OVER THE OLD AND THEN REPLACE AND REPAIR THE EXISTING WOOD, WHICH GOES RIGHT THROUGH, FULL APPROVAL, BECAUSE YOU'RE DOING THE SAME PROFILE, DOING EVERYTHING. IF THEY THEN COME BACK TO US AND SAY, HERE'S THE PICTURE WHEN WE WENT IN TO DO THIS, THIS ENTIRE THING, THERE'S INFILL, THERE'S WINDOWS THAT WERE CUT IN, THERE'S NO SIDING BACK HERE. THEN WE HAVE SOMETHING ELSE TO LOOK AT, AND WE'RE ALL LOOKING AT A FULL PICTURE. SOMETHING TO CONSIDER. ONE THING I'D LIKE TO POINT OUT IS IN YOUR SITING REPAIR NARRATIVE, ITEM 6 IS CALLING [01:50:03] OUT INSTALL NEW JAMES HARDY FIBER CEMENT LAP SIDING. THAT IS NOT THE SAME AS THE ARTISAN, WHICH HAS THAT THICKER BUTT AND MUCH MORE APPROXIMATES REAL WOOD SIDING. THAT, I THINK, IS THE PROPER MATERIAL TO BE REPLACING WITH. YEAH, ESSENTIALLY IT'S CALLED A CEDAR MILL FINISH. WHICH CORRESPONDS WITH WHAT THOSE PHOTOS SHOW, IS THE ROUGH STONE TEXTURE. AND THEN THE OTHER CONSIDERATION IS, I CAN'T REMEMBER IF THIS PROPERTY HAS REPLACEMENT WINDOWS OR ORIGINAL WINDOWS. WE'VE GOT TRIM AND SILLS. HAVE THEY BEEN BASTARDIZED WITH THE VINYL? WHAT ARE WE GETTING INTO THERE? AND THE WOOD HAS NOT BEEN ENCASED WITH THE VINYL? SOMETIMES I CUT OFF AN EAR JUST TO PUT... AGAIN, I DON'T KNOW BECAUSE WE'RE NOT TOUCHING... I MEAN YOU MIGHT END UP COST FOR COST, YOU MIGHT BE FINE WITH WHAT WE'RE REQUESTING BECAUSE IT'S ACTUALLY LESS LABOR INTENSIVE TO HAVE TO GO BACK AND... REDO EVERYTHING IF YOU CAN FIND SOME GOOD WOOD UNDER THERE. I MEAN, YEAH. I MEAN, WE'VE SEEN, I MEAN, YOU KNOW. YEAH. DIFFERENT FITS. AGAIN, I DO NOT, THIS IS NOT MY PROPERTY. READY FOR US TO GO IN THERE AND START. I'D LIKE TO ASK MIA. PROCEDURAL QUESTION, IF THEY WERE TO COME BACK AND SAY HEY WE WANT TO REMOVE THE VINYL AND REPAIR THE WOOD, IS THAT A STAFF LEVEL APPROVAL? I'M JUST THINKING THAT THEY WOULDN'T HAVE TO WAIT FOR THE NEXT BOARD MEETING IF THEY CAME BACK. THAT'S THE ADVICE THAT I GAVE THE APPLICANT WHEN THEY FIRST CALLED. I SAID IF YOU WANT TO TAKE OFF THE VINYL AND REPAIR THE HISTORIC WOOD WITH WOOD IN KIND, THAT WOULD BE A STAFF APPROVAL. RIGHT, AND THEN IF WHEN YOU TAKE THE VINYL OFF YOU DISCOVER THERE'S SIGNIFICANT ISSUES, THEN YOU COULD COME BACK AND SAY, HEY, THIS WALL NEEDS TO BE, THERE'S NO SIDING AT ALL ON THIS ENTIRE FACADE. THEN YOU COULD COME BACK, BUT THAT WOULD LET YOU GUYS GET STARTED AND START MOVING ALONG WITHOUT US HOLDING YOU UP FOR A WHOLE MONTH. AND I CAN REACH OUT TO YOU AFTER THIS MEETING AND EXPLAIN THE STAFF APPROVAL PROCESS. IT'S SIMILAR APPLICATION MATERIALS. IT WILL DESCRIBE YOUR SCOPE OF WORK AND I USUALLY TURN THOSE AROUND. VERY QUICKLY UNLESS THERE'S A BUILDING PERMIT ASSOCIATED WITH IT. AND I'LL HAVE TO CHECK WITH THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT TO SEE IF YOU WOULD NEED A BUILDING PERMIT TO REPAIR WOOD SIDING. I'M NOT 100% SURE. YOU DO. SO YOU'RE GOING TO NEED TO GET A BUILDING PERMIT, AND THEN THE HISTORICAL REVIEW WILL AUTOMATICALLY BE TACKED ONTO THAT. AS LONG AS THE SCOPE OF WORK IS SAYING RESTORE AND REPAIR WOOD SIDING IN KIND AND YOU DESCRIBE TO ME THE TYPE OF WOOD THAT YOU'LL BE USING, IT COULD BE A STAFF APPROVAL. SO I HAVE ONE MORE MONKEY WRENCH. LOOKING AT THE PHOTOS MORE CLOSELY, THE BULK OF THIS HOUSE HAS BEEN CLAD IN VINYL. WE HAVE PERFORATED VINYL SOFFITS. WE HAVE VINYL SHUTTERS. SO WE'RE GOING TO HAVE A LOT MORE THAN JUST SIDING BEING REPLACED. ARE THERE EXPOSED RAFTER TAILS UNDER THERE? I THINK WE'RE REALLY CHANGING A LOT MORE THAN I THINK WE SHOULD PUT ON MIA. JUST MY THOUGHT. YEAH, I MEAN, I KIND OF AGREE [01:55:01] WITH TAMMY. KNOW THIS IS A BIG PROJECT. THIS IS A BIG UNDERTAKING. I DO NOT PITY YOU WHATSOEVER. YOU KNOW, RIPPING OFF SIDING AND FINDING OUT WHAT'S UNDERNEATH IS A FUN CONTRACTOR'S JOB. SO, YEAH, THIS COULD TURN INTO QUITE A RAT'S NEST AS FAR AS WHAT'S UNDERNEATH IT. AND IT MAY BE PRESERVED. OH, I'M SORRY. NO, GO AHEAD. BUT IT MAY ALSO BE VERY WELL PRESERVED. YEAH, YEAH, YEAH. I'M SUSPECTING SO. YEAH. SO WHAT WE'RE DEALING WITH TODAY IS AN APPLICATION THAT, AS WRITTEN, WE WOULD NOT NECESSARILY APPROVE. BUT WHAT WE'RE ALSO SAYING IS THAT FOR NEXT STEPS FOR YOU TO GET WITH MIA AND THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT AND DETERMINE THAT REMOVAL OF THE VINYL SO THAT YOU CAN SEE WHAT YOU'RE DEALING WITH, RIGHT? YEAH. SO I DON'T WANT YOU TO LEAVE HERE SAYING THAT EVERYTHING WAS DENIED, BECAUSE WHAT WE'RE GONNA BE SAYING, I BELIEVE. AS SOON AS SOMEBODY MAKES A MOTION, IS THAT AS IT'S WRITTEN TODAY? OKAY. OKAY. SO, IS EVERYBODY OKAY WITH THAT? I AM. I'M JUST TRYING TO GET THIS PLACE FIRST. YES, SIR. SO, CONCEPTUAL, BUT NOW WE'VE GIVEN BETTER GUIDANCE. WITH THE BETTER GUIDANCE, IT JUST GOES TO STAFF. WELL, IT COULD BE. IT DEPENDS ON WHAT THEY FIND. THE DEGREE OF DAMAGE OR NON-DAMAGE. OKAY. ALL RIGHT. SO JUST HANG OUT A LITTLE BIT AND I HAVE TO OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING. OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING. ANY COMMENTS ON THIS PROJECT? YES, SIR. COME AHEAD. ROB SULKOWSKI, BUILT THE LAST CONSTRUCTION 710 BEACH STREET. WE BOUGHT, WE MOVED OUR FAMILY INTO... THE HOUSE THAT WE OWN AT 710 BEAT STREET IN 2013, IT WAS ALUMINUM SIDING. AND WITH THE HELP OF, AND REALLY IT ENDED UP BEING HANDLED BY MY THREE SONS, SPEARHEADED BY THAT GUY, WE REMOVED THE ALUMINUM SIDING, WE REMOVED THE FOAM INSULATION, AND THEN DYLAN ESPECIALLY, DYLAN AND SEAN HAD THE JOBS OF PULLING UP ALL THE STAPLES. OUT OF THE SIDING. IT WAS A BEAUTIFUL HEART PINE DUTCH LAP. WE HAD EXPOSED RAFTER TAILS AND AS VERONICA SAID ABOUT IT BEING PRESERVED, IT WAS GORGEOUS. HOUSE GOT PRESSURE WASHED, SCRAPED, PAINTED UP. WE REPLACED WOOD, YES, WITH LIKE KIND OF DUTCH LAP SIDING AND YOU KNOW IT'S SOMETHING THAT WE DIDN'T KNOW WHEN WE GOT INTO IT. BUT IT WAS A WONDERFULLY PRESERVED HOME. THE LOWER ENDS WERE SHOPPED, YOU KNOW, BY THE VERY NATURE. MY OTHER CONCERN IS THAT I'VE SEEN, SINCE LIVING HERE FOR A WHILE, THAT WHILE HOUSES ARE UP FOR SALE FOR A WHILE, I KNOW WE'VE COME TO THIS BOARD, OR I'VE COME TO THESE MEETINGS, AND WATCHED PEOPLE DISCUSS THE CARVING UP THE ESTATE LOTS ON NORTH 6TH STREET BECAUSE THE HOUSES WERE HARD TO SELL. I THINK WE JUST HAVE TO WATCH OUT THAT, YOU KNOW, THESE FIXES ARE NOT MADE JUST FOR THE IMMEDIACY OF A SALE. AND, YOU KNOW, WE BOUGHT A HOUSE IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT BECAUSE WE LOVE OLD HOUSES. AND, YOU KNOW, YOU PUT YOUR BIG BOY PANTS ON EVERY DAY WHEN YOU'RE DEALING WITH THESE HOUSES. AND, YOU KNOW. THERE'S PLENTY OF PLACES ON THE ISLAND THAT HAVE BEAUTIFUL HARDY SIDED HOUSES AND ARE TOUTED AS MAINTENANCE FREE. THAT AIN'T US. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. ANY OTHER COMMENTS? CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING. DO WE HAVE CLARITY ON WHERE WE'RE GOING WITH THIS? OKAY. SPEAK. I'M WAITING FOR A MOMENT. THE MOTION I'M GOING TO MAKE IS TO DENY, BUT I THINK THEY'VE GOT INFORMATION THEY CAN GO TO MENA AND POTENTIALLY HAVE A WAY FORWARD THAT WON'T CAUSE A DELAY. RIGHT. ALL RIGHT. I MOVE TO DENY CASE NUMBER HDC-2026-0010 WITHOUT CONDITIONS, AND I MOVE THAT THE HDC MAKE THE FOLLOWING FINDINGS A FACT AND CONCLUSIONS A LAW PART OF THE RECORD, THAT HDC CASE HDC-2026. 0010 AS PRESENTED IS NOT [02:00:01] SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANT WITH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE SECRETARY OF INTERIOR STANDARDS AND THE HISTORIC DISTRICT DESIGN GUIDELINES TO WARRANT APPROVAL AT THIS TIME SECOND THE MOTION AND A SECOND PLEASE CALL THE VOTE MEMBERS FIRST THAT SCHALLER YES REMEMBER KOSTAK YES MEMBERS KOSKI YES MEMBER BURNS YES REMEMBER SALA YES VICE CHAIR PEZZETTA YES AND CHAIR PHILKOFF YES GOOD LUCK WITH YOUR TOOTH. THANK YOU. I HOPE YOU FIND GOOD STUFF. AND I DO TOO. I HOPE YOU FIND GORGEOUS WORK. IT'LL BE A GREAT IMPROVEMENT. YEAH. [6..2 HDC2026-0011 - 3 S DESIGN STUDIO, AGENT FOR MARIE & CHISTOPHER J. PULLAN, 803 WHITE STREET] WE'LL FIND OUT. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. IT'S A SHOW TO RESOLVE. OKAY, AND WE MOVE ON TO HDC 2026-0011. MS. SADLER. THANK YOU. THIS IS HDC 2026-0011 FOR NEW CONSTRUCTION. IT'S 0011. NEW CONSTRUCTION AT THE PROPERTY IN OLD TOWN AT 803 WHITE STREET. THIS IS A FINAL CERTIFICATE OF APPROVAL APPLICATION TO CONSTRUCT A THREE-STORY SINGLE-FAMILY HOME. AND AN ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT ON A SINGLE PEONIA LOT. SO THIS IS ONE OF THOSE MID-LOT LOCATIONS IN OLD TOWN. IT DOESN'T HAVE THAT MEDIA PEONIA LOT KIND OF CAVEAT TO IT. THERE WERE ADDITIONAL APPLICATION MATERIALS FOR THIS CASE WITH A REVISED HEIGHT OF THE ACCESSORY STRUCTURE. UPON MY REVIEW OF THE PLANS AFTER I WAS GETTING INTO THEM, I NOTICED THAT THE ACCESSORY STRUCTURE WAS AT 27 FEET AND 2 INCHES. SO I HAD ASKED TO THE APPLICANT IF HE COULD REVISE THE HEIGHT AND BRING IT DOWN TO 25, WHICH IS THE ACCEPTABLE HEIGHT FOR ACCESSORY SHOES. IT WAS AN OLD TOWN. HE WAS ABLE TO PROVIDE ME THOSE, BUT NOT AHEAD OF WHEN THE AGENDA PACKET WAS DUE, SO THAT'S WHY YOU HAVE THOSE ADDITIONAL APPLICATION MATERIALS IN FRONT OF YOU TODAY. MY STAFF REPORT RECOMMENDS APPROVAL WITH THAT CONDITION THAT WE WOULD SEE PLANS THAT SHOW THE ACCESSORY STRUCTURE AT 25 FEET IN HEIGHT, AS WELL AS THE CONDITION THAT ANY MECHANICAL EQUIPMENT ON THE PROJECT WILL BE MORE THAN 5 FEET AWAY FROM ANY PROPERTY LINE AND ALSO SCREENED FROM THE RIGHT-OF-WAY. SO I HAVE HERE THE FRONT AND REAR ELEVATIONS ON THE LEFT AND THEN THE SITE PLAN ON THE RIGHT. THE SITE PLAN IS COMPLIANT WITH THE FIVE FOOT VISIBILITY CORRIDORS OR SETBACKS IN OLD TOWN AND THE LOT COVERAGE BASED ON AN OLD TOWN CALCULATION IS COMPLIANT WITH THE 45% MAXIMUM. HERE IS THE LEFT AND RIGHT ELEVATIONS. THE TOP ONE WOULD BE FACING TOWARDS THE RIVER AND THE LEFT TOWARDS EGAN'S CREEK, SO YOU CAN KIND OF IMAGINE IT THAT WAY. AND THEN HERE ARE SOME RENDERINGS THAT WERE PROVIDED BY THE APPLICANT. AND THAT CONDITION AT THE BOTTOM JUST STATES THAT I'M LOOKING FOR THAT APPLICATION MATERIAL TO BE REVISED TO SHOW THE 25-FOOT MAXIMUM HEIGHT FOR THE ACCESSORY STRUCTURE. OTHER THAN THAT, STAFF FOUND IT COMPLIANT WITH THE OLD TOWN PRESERVATION GUIDELINES AND LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE. ANY QUESTIONS FOR MS. ZAVALA? ARE YOU AWARE OF ANY OTHER POLLS? THREE-STORY HOUSES IN OLD TOWN. I ONLY KNOW OF THE ONE. I DID NOT LOOK INTO THAT. I KNOW THAT EARLIER THIS YEAR WE DID APPROVE A CASE WITH A CROW'S NEST, WHICH IS LIKE A HALF. NO, WE HAVE COPULAS AND WE HAVE CROW'S NESTS. THIS IS CHANGING THE CHARACTER. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR MS. SADLER? IS THE APPLICANT AVAILABLE? HELLO, SIR. COULD YOU COME UP, PLEASE? GOOD EVENING. HELLO. DENNIS GREAVES, US DESIGN STUDIO. 432 RINGFIELD. SO, THE PRELIMINARY SCHEMATIC DESIGN... 50 SECONDS. BY WHO? DR. HOOVER. WAS IT CONSENSUAL? I DID NOT LOOK INTO THAT. WE HAVE NEVER SEEN THIS. [02:05:06] DO YOU KNOW WHAT YEAR IT WAS APPROVED? WE DID SEE IT PREVIOUSLY. IF YOU'RE GOING TO SPEAK, YOU'VE GOT TO COME TO THE MICROPHONE. AND THAT INFORMATION IS NOT EVIDENCE IN THE PACKET AND I DON'T KNOW THAT A PRIOR APPROVAL OF ANOTHER PLAN WOULD BE ANYTHING THAT YOU NEED TO CONSIDER AT THIS TIME. IN 854, WE'RE RENTING, IT'S BEING BUILT. SO WHEN WE BOUGHT THIS LOT, THE ORIGINAL DRAWINGS WERE BY HAND, RIGHT? CUTLER? CUTLER, YES. AND WE WERE TOLD... I WAS GOING TO SAY, SHE CAME HERE TO... NO, NO, AND... WE WERE TOLD, IS THAT THE ORIGINAL? YES, THIS IS THE HOUSE THAT WAS APPROVED IN 2023. IT WAS DESCRIBED AS A TWO AND A HALF STORY. OKAY. THAT'S THE ONLY INFORMATION I HAVE. ALL RIGHT. I HAVE THE TWO. THAT'S BY THE HDC. THEY DID ACQUIRE A COA, A CERTIFICATE OF APPROVAL IN 2023 FOR THIS DESIGN. OH, IS THAT CONCEPTUAL? IT WAS FINAL APPROVAL. FINAL APPROVAL. OKAY. THANK YOU. SO I THINK... IT HAS EXPIRED. THERE'S NO RULES IN THE GUIDELINES THAT SAY SOMEBODY CAN'T HAVE A THREE-STORY HOUSE, AS LONG AS THEY MEET THE HEIGHT REQUIREMENTS. SO I DON'T, THERE'S NOTHING IN THE, THERE'S NO QUALIFICATION THAT SAYS YOU CAN ONLY HAVE A THREE-STORY IF THERE'S FIVE OTHERS IN OLD TOWN. I DON'T THINK WE CAN REALLY HANG OUR HAT ON ANY OF THAT. I DON'T SEE THAT AS AN ISSUE. IT'S 35 AND 25. JIM, THE ONLY REASON I BROUGHT THAT UP IS BECAUSE THE OLD GUIDELINES TALK ABOUT THE CHARACTER OF OLD TOWN AND MAINTAINING HIGH CEILINGS BASED ON THE EARLY 1900S, THE HEAT. SO, PERSONALLY, I THINK IT'S A BEAUTIFUL HOUSE. I DON'T KNOW WHAT WE MEAN BY TO MAINTAIN THE CHARACTER OF OLD TOWN IN THE TWO-STORY HOMES. SO IF THAT'S NOT CHARACTER, THEN... SO LET ME ADDRESS THAT. BECAUSE I THINK SOME OF THE CHARACTER ELEMENTS THAT THEY HAVE IN THIS DESIGN, YOU HAVE HORIZONTAL BANDING THAT HELPS DEFINE THE DIFFERENT FLOORS. IT ALSO HELPS BREAK DOWN THE SCALE OF THE HOUSE. IT'S A BIG HOUSE, NO DOUBT ABOUT IT. THE SMALLER ROOF FORMS THAT KEPT THE HOUSE ALSO HELPED BRING DOWN THE SCALE, THE OVERALL PERCEPTION OF IT. AND THERE'S BALCONIES, THERE'S DECKS, THERE'S LOTS OF ELEMENTS HERE THAT BRING IN DEFINING, DETAILING, HELP BREAK DOWN THAT SCALE AND MASSING OF THIS HOUSE TO AT LEAST APPROACH THE KIND OF CHARACTER OF OLD TOWN. NO, NO, I... THE ONLY OTHER HOUSE WITH THREE FLOORS HAS DONE EXACTLY THAT. THEY CHOPPED UP A LOT OF PORCHES AND ROOF LINES. YEAH, IF IT WAS A THREE-STORY STUCCO HOUSE WITH A FLAT ROOF, I DON'T THINK WE'D BE EVEN CONTEMPLATING APPROVAL. BUT THIS HAS QUITE A FEW OF THOSE DETAILS THAT EXACTLY WHAT YOU TALKED ABOUT, I THINK THEY EXIST IN THERE. ARE THERE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR THE APPLICANT? THAT'S SOME GENERAL COMMENTS. THERE'S SOME VERBIAGE ON, AND YOU MAY HAVE ANSWERED THIS ON SOME OF THE, DID THEY TURN IN SUPPLEMENTAL? YEAH, THIS IS ONE OF THE CASES WITH ADDITIONAL MATERIAL IN YOUR FOLDER. SO I'M GOING TO APOLOGIZE IF YOU ADDRESS THAT IN THE STUFF THAT WE JUST GOT TODAY. BUT I NOTICED THERE WERE A COUPLE THINGS THAT WERE CALLED OUT AS TO BE DETERMINED. ALL RIGHT, WE'RE NOT GOING TO GO FOR TO BE DETERMINED. WE WANT TO KNOW, WHAT DO YOU WANT TO DO? ALL RIGHT, I THINK THAT REALLY PROBABLY FITS. AND I THINK I DETECTED MOST OF THE THINGS I HAD COMMENTS ON IN THOSE COUPLE FEW MINUTES. OH, I DID HAVE ONE LITTLE QUESTION. WHY ARE THERE MUNTINS [02:10:01] ON THE WINDOWS TO THE GARAGE DOOR? IT'S GONE. OH. THERE'S NO MUNTINS ANYWHERE ELSE ON THIS HOUSE AND THEN THEY JUST APPEAR. OKAY, WE'RE GONE. SEE, YOUR WISH IS HIS COMMAND. YAY. I WAS... ANY OTHER COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS? MADAM CHAIR, I HAD A QUESTION FOR STAFF. OKAY. SO YOU HAD TIME TO LOOK AT THESE. YOUR RECOMMENDATION OF APPROVAL IS BASED ON THE INFORMATION THAT WE'VE BEEN GIVEN OF THE ONLY KIND OF ISSUE THAT I SAW BASED ON THE ORIGINAL APPLICATION MATERIALS THAT WERE TURNED IN IN TIME FOR THE AGENDA PACKET WAS THE HEIGHT OF THE ACCESSORY STRUCTURE OKAY SO MY MY APPROVAL WAS RECOMMENDED AS THE FACT THAT HE WOULD HAVE THE PLANS THAT SHOW THE PROPER HEIGHT AT THE TIME OF THE MEETING SO I DON'T HAVE ANY PROBLEM WITH IT BUT WHEN IT DOES COME FOR PERMITTING I WILL BE CHECKING THE MECHANICAL EQUIPMENT TO MAKE SURE THAT IT'S FIVE FEET MORE THAN FIVE FEET AWAY AND SCREENS THAT'S WHAT MY APPROVAL SPACE AND THEN THE OTHER THING FOR THE EVIDENCE AND PREVIOUS APPROVALS DO NOT BIND YOU SO YOU SHOULD LOOK AT THIS AS A NEW APPLICATION YOU KNOW THAT THE FACT THAT IT WAS DONE IN THE PAST DOESN'T BIND YOU TO DO IT AGAIN IT IS A NEW APPLICATION I JUST HAVE A QUESTION IF WE ARE APPROVING IT, ARE WE DOING IT WITH CONDITIONS BECAUSE WE HAVE NEW DOCUMENTS HERE, OR IS IT STANDARD, LIKE, BECAUSE WE HAVE DRAWINGS THAT WE JUST RECEIVED BEFORE TIME? THAT'S AT THE PLEASURE OF THE BOARD. THAT'S WHAT I'M ASKING. I THINK PART OF THAT IS BASED ON THE NEW EVIDENCE. YEAH, YEAH. IT WOULD HAVE TO, AT THE MEETING, YEAH. OKAY. AND I'D ADD IN THE THINGS THAT STAFF ASKED FOR, TOO. ALL RIGHT. SO, THE MECHANICALS. ANYTHING MORE FOR THIS GENTLEMAN? ALL RIGHT, THANK YOU, SIR. I'M GOING TO OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING. IS THERE ANYONE WHO WISHES TO SPEAK TO THIS PROJECT? MS. GAFF. PAT GASS, HERE AT ONE WAY STREET, AND NOW THAT YOU'RE HERE. SO OUR FIRST QUESTION IS FROM RAMIA. DOES IT MEET THE 45? BASED ON THE DEFINITION OF OLD TOWN, THAT THE CONNECTING ELEMENTS ARE NOT INCLUDED IN THE LOT COVERAGE, INCLUDING PORCHES, LOGGIAS, FLORIDA ROOMS, AND BREEZEWAYS. WHAT DO YOU MEAN THAT? AND TO REMIND YOU, THESE FOLKS HAVE A TELEPHONE POLE IN THEIR FRONT YARD, SO THEY'LL KNOW EXACTLY WHERE THE SETBACK IS. YOU HAD NO IDEA YOU WERE THAT FORTUNATE, DID YOU? PEOPLE ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE STREET DON'T ALWAYS HAVE THAT. BUT WE ARE LOOKING FORWARD TO MAKING NEW NEIGHBORS. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. YOU'RE GOING TO BE NOISY. CONSTRUCTION. NOISELESS CONSTRUCTION. I THOUGHT MAYBE SHE WAS TALKING ABOUT YOU. I WISH. VERY GOOD. OKAY, ANY OTHER COMMENTS ON THIS PROJECT? OKAY, PUBLIC HEARING. I WILL JUST MAKE A GENERAL STATEMENT. SUPPORT OF WHAT MISS GASS HAS STATED SHORT-TERM RENTALS IN FERNANDINA BEACH ARE LIMITED TO A SPECIFIC SET OF AREAS COMMERCIAL ZONED AND IF YOU WERE GRANDFATHERED IN BACK IN 2001 FOR WHAT YOU HAD AT THE BEACH BEFORE BUT NOT IN OLD TOWN AND IN R3 COMMERCIAL OKAY LONG TERM ON IT? I'M SORRY? LONG TERM RENTAL? NO, I SAID SHORT TERM. I DON'T THINK THERE'S ANY RESTRICTION ON LONG TERM. YES, SIR? SHORT TERM? YES, MA'AM. ARE YOU AWARE OF THE SWITCH AND BAKE PROGRAM IN FRONT OF ENUM? THERE'S AN OFFICIAL ONE? OH, I AM, YES. IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD, ANYWAY. YOU ADVERTISE IT TO BE RENTED FOR A MONTH. SO YOU RENT IT FOR A MONTH. YOU STAY FOR A WEEK. THEN YOU GET YOUR OTHER THREE WEEKS' MONEY BACK. WE HAVE AT LEAST TWO HOUSES THAT PLAY THAT GAME. I'D LIKE TO FIND THE REALTORS THAT ARE PLAYING, FEEDING IT ALONG, BECAUSE IT'S REALLY, IT DOES JUST AS MUCH DAMAGE TO [02:15:01] THE NEIGHBORHOOD AS JUST PLAIN OLD SHORT-TERM. WELL, IT IS A SHORT-TERM RENTAL. IT IS. AND IT'S HAPPENING AND IT'S EVERYWHERE PAT, IT'S EVERYWHERE. YEAH, IT'S AT THE BEACH, IT'S AROUND HERE, IT'S EVERYWHERE. YEAH. WE'VE GOT PEOPLE IN THE ORIGINAL HISTORIC DISTRICT TRYING TO DO IT NOW. SO- WHAT WE GOTTA DO. OKAY. SURE, YEAH, BECAUSE WE WANNA REMEMBER IT. GREAT. 85456. WE HAVE NO INTENTION. WE ACTUALLY OWN THE BEACHFRONT IN THAT BUSINESS, BUT WE HAVE NO INTENTION OF RENTING OUT OUR CAMPING. MUSIC TO PASS THE EARTH. ALL RIGHT. ANY FURTHER COMMENTS? CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING FOR DISCUSSION I WANT TO SAY THAT WHEN THIS DID COME BACK I REMEMBER IT WAS OVER ON GARDEN STREET WHEN I AND BROUGHT IT TO US AND I THINK WE HAD THE SAME AT FIRST REP WHOA THAT'S A BIG HOUSE BUT IT HIT YOU KNOW THEY ARE THEY HIT EVERY NECESSARY GUIDELINES SETBACK ETC ETC SO THIS STILL HITS ALL THOSE PROPER THINGS NOW THAT THE LOT COVERAGE LIKE JIM SAID WE'VE TALKED ABOUT THIS AND TALKED ABOUT THIS I'D LIKE TO PROPOSE THAT WE GET IT ON EITHER A WORKSHOP OR AN AGENDA THAT WE ADDRESS IT AND THEN GET IT TO PAB BECAUSE WE CAN'T JUST KEEP TALKING ABOUT IT WE'RE GOING TO BE BUILT OUT COMPLETELY YEAH YEAH SOMEBODY CAN COME IN VERY EGREGIOUSLY RIGHT YEP AND I I'M GONNA I'M BRINGING THE OLD TOWN DRAFT OF GUIDELINES TO YOUR NEXT MEETING AND THAT IS THE DRAFT WHERE I'VE COMBINED THE 2021 VERSION AND THE 2013 VERSION WITH THE NECESSARY HISTORICAL BACKGROUND AND TEXT WITH THE 2021 GRAPHICS AND IMAGES. MCKENNA AND I HAVE BEEN WORKING THAT ON THE SIDE SO THAT'LL BE AT YOUR NEXT MEETING. IT'S A LONG MEETING NEXT MONTH BUT IF YOU GET TO IT IT'LL BE THERE FOR YOU ALL TO LOOK AT. ALL RIGHT. ALL SET? DO WE HAVE A MOTION? OKAY, I CAN MAKE A MOTION, AND I'LL BASE IT ON THE SUPPLEMENTAL MATERIALS THAT WERE PRESENTED TO US AND INCLUDE THE STAFF-SUGGESTED ADDITIONAL CONDITIONS. I MOVE TO APPROVE CASE NUMBER HDC-2026-0011. WITH THE CONDITION THAT THIS APPROVAL IS BASED ON THE SUPPLEMENTAL MATERIALS PROVIDED PRIOR TO THE MEETING, AND THAT THEY PROVIDE STAFF WITH THE REQUESTED ITEMS THAT STAFF ASKED FOR. AND I MOVE THAT THE HDC MAKE THE FOLLOWING FINDINGS A FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW PART OF THE RECORD AT HDC CASE HDC-2026-0011. AS PRESENTED, IT IS SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANT WITH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE, SECRETARY OF INTERIOR STANDARDS, AND THE OLD TOWN DEVELOPMENT AND PRESERVATION GUIDELINES TO WARRANT FINAL APPROVAL. SECOND. PLEASE CALL THE VOTE. MEMBER SHERSAD SCHALLER? YES. MEMBER KOSAK? YES. MEMBER SKOWSKI? YES. MEMBER BURNS? YES. MEMBER SALA? YES. VICE CHAIR PEZZETTA? YES. AND CHAIR VOLKOFF? YES. CONGRATULATIONS. [6.3 HDC2026-0012 - BAGLEY CONSTRUCTION, AGENT FOR CITIZENS STATE BANK, 715 CENTRE STREET] THANK YOU. ALL RIGHTY SO WE'RE SKIPPING THE NEXT ONE BECAUSE IT SHOULDN'T HAVE BEEN I WAS JUST GOING TO MENTION MIA DID US A GREAT FAVOR IN HER REVIEW SHE ACTUALLY CALCULATED ALL THE ROOF YEAH AND IT WAS STILL AT 44% THANK YOU MIA MIA'S NOT YOU'RE NOT APPRECIATED ENOUGH YEAH RIGHT WE HAVE WE'RE SKIPPING THE PINE LAND BANK ITEM, BECAUSE IT'S NOT IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT, HOWEVER, COMMA, HAD IT NOT, HAD KEYSTONE HOTEL BEEN IN SOMEBODY'S HISTORIC DISTRICT, WE'D STILL HAVE IT. I JUST WANTED [02:20:03] TO SAY WHEN I SAW PINELAND BIKES WAS ON THE AGENDA, I WAS LIKE, YES, TEAR IT DOWN. AND THEN I SAW IT WAS ONLY ABOUT THE PARKING LOT AND STUFF. A CURVE. [6.4 HDC2026-0013 - 3S DESIGN STUDIO, AGENT FOR STEVE & ANNE WALL, 306 S. 7TH STREET] OKAY. THAT CURVE SHOULD BE LIGHT GRAY. ALL RIGHT. NEXT CASE, HBC 2025-0013. OH. 2026. OH. WHO PUT THAT IN THERE? IT SAYS 2025. ON THE STAFF REPORT, BUT THAT'S OKAY. IT'S 2026-0013. OKAY. MS. SADLER, GO FOR IT. THANK YOU. THIS IS HGC 2026-0013 FOR THE PROPERTY LOCATED AT 306 SOUTH 7TH STREET. MCKENNA IS NOW PASSING OUT SOME APPLICATION MATERIALS. IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING FROM THE APPLICANT THAT NOT MUCH HAS CHANGED. I WILL ASK HIM TO KIND OF EXPLAIN, POINT OUT WHAT HAS. I'VE GOTTEN A LOT OF DIFFERENT APPLICATION MATERIALS. I JUST WANTED TO GIVE THE BOARD EVERYTHING THAT I HAD RECEIVED. BY THE TIME I RECEIVED THESE, I WAS DONE PRINTING OUT EXTRA STUFF, SO I ASKED THEM TO BRING SOME COPIES. THIS IS AN APPLICATION FOR A FINAL CERTIFICATE OF APPROVAL TO CONSTRUCT A GARAGE AND WORKSHOP ACCESSORY STRUCTURE CONNECTED BY A BREEZEWAY. AND THERE WILL ALSO BE SOME ADDITIONAL DECKING IN THE BACK. THIS IS FOR A NON-CONTRIBUTING MASONRY STRUCTURE. ON 7TH STREET, IT'S CONSTRUCTED OF BRICK, BUT IT'S PAINTED WHITE. THIS IS A RENDERING OF THE GARAGE AND ACCESSORY STRUCTURE. IT'S COMPLIANT WITH CRITERIA FOR ACCESSORY STRUCTURES. THEY ARE PERMITTED TO BE CONNECTED TO THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE THROUGH A CONNECTING ELEMENT SUCH AS A BREEZEWAY. IT IS COMPLIANT WITH THE SETBACKS AND THE HEIGHT FOR ACCESSORY STRUCTURES. STAFF'S OPINION THAT THE ARCHITECTURAL DESIGN RELATES. TO THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE BUT DOESN'T EXACTLY MIMIC IT. IT USES SOME OF THE MATERIALS THAT ARE USED ON THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE, BUT ALSO THE INTRODUCTION OF THE BOARD AND BATTEN. THE COLORS WILL BE SIMILAR. STAFF DOES RECOMMEND THIS FOR APPROVAL WITH A COUPLE OF CONDITIONS. WELL, I THINK IT'S JUST TWO. AGAIN, THE CONDITION THAT THE MECHANICAL EQUIPMENT IS SCREENED AND FIVE FEET AWAY FROM THE PROPERTY LINE. THAT WASN'T SHOWN ON THE SITE PLAN. IF THERE IS GOING TO BE AN ADDITIONAL MECHANICAL EQUIPMENT, I'M GOING TO BE LOOKING FOR THAT AT TIME OF PERMITTING. AND THE OTHER CONDITION WOULD BE THE SHUTTERS TO BE INSTALLED ON THE LEG TRIM OF THE WINDOWS RATHER THAN THE SIGNING ITSELF, JUST FOR A MORE AUTHENTIC LOOK. I BASED MY RECOMMENDATION OF APPROVAL OF THE APPLICATION MATERIALS THAT ARE CONTAINED IN THE PACKET. I DIDN'T HAVE ADEQUATE TIME TO REVIEW WHAT IS SITTING IN FRONT OF YOU NOW. IS THAT BECOMING A BIGGER PROBLEM? THIS MEETING, IT HAS BEEN HAPPENING. FOR THIS MEETING? YES. WHO STARTED THE TREND? IT WAS ME. OKAY, SO WE NEED TO MAKE SURE IN THE FUTURE THAT WE DO WHATEVER WE CAN TO GET THESE THINGS IN IN TIME. I KNOW THERE'S A LONG LEAD TIME FOR THE MEETING, BUT GIVING THESE FOLKS JUST A SHORT TIME RIGHT HERE TO READ THROUGH THE... MATERIALS IS NOT FAIR TO THEM. AND IT IS WITHIN THE BOARD'S DISCRETION TO CONTINUE IT BECAUSE OF LIGHTS AND METAL. I THINK THE BOARD HAS BEEN VERY LENIENT TONIGHT IN REVIEWING A LOT OF MATERIALS. THE GOOD THING IS IT WAS IT WAS SMALL REVISIONS FOR THE MOST PART AND IT WAS I THINK IT WAS ALL OLD BUSINESS TOO. DO YOU GET ANYTHING ELSE BESIDES THIS, LIKE ARCHITECTURAL PLANS OR JUST THE RENDERINGS? THEY'RE IN THE PACKET, THE DIGITAL PACKET. THERE IS INFORMATION IN THE AGENDA PACKET THAT I BASE MY STAFF REPORT OFF OF. I WILL BE HONEST, I DID NOT HAVE TIME TO ADEQUATELY LOOK AT THE NEW APPLICATION MATERIAL TODAY. OKAY. MAYBE WE HAVE SOMETHING THAT CAN DESCRIBE IT. WELL, ALL RIGHT. COULD YOU COME FORWARD? DENNIS KRIEGS, 3S DESIGN STUDIO. OKAY, QUESTION. SO THE SMALL CHANGES THAT PREVIOUS, THEY WANTED TO BRING OVER... FACING ON THEM AND THEN THE DOOR. [02:25:28] THE BREEZEWAY ENTRANCE SEEMS TO BE MADE OF BRICK BUT ON HERE IT'S NOT. YEAH. SO HERE, THAT'S KIND OF AN OLD 3D RENDERING. I THINK WE'RE JUST GOING TO CONTINUE THE BRICK. BECAUSE THIS ONE IS THE... IT WAS MORE OF THAT. THAT WAS THE FIRST INITIAL KIND OF THOUGHT. BUT I THINK IT LOOKS BETTER WITH JUST... YEAH, I THINK I'M WITH HEATHER THAT MY COMMENTS WERE JUST GOING TO BE THE RENDERING SEEMED VERY DISCONNECTED FROM THE DRAWINGS AS FAR AS WHAT IS AND WHAT IS THERE AND THEN WE GET THIS AS WELL. I JUST, I'M NOT SURE WHAT IS FINE. WHAT IS THAT? WHAT ARE YOU PROPOSING? BECAUSE THERE ARE JUST SO MANY DRAWINGS. IT'S JUST THAT DETACHED RIGHT SIDE. I JUST MEAN AS FAR AS MATERIALS. ARE WE GOING WITH BRICK ON? WHERE ARE WE GOING WITH THE BRICK AND WHERE ARE WE GOING WITH THE SIDING? THE ONLY BOARDING BATTEN IS GOING TO BE ABOVE THE GARAGE, RIGHT THERE, AND THEN THE REST OF IT WILL BE THE WALL. THE RENDERINGS THOUGH, THE NEW ONES ARE SHOWING LIKE BRICK ON THE FRONT ELEVATION OF THE GARAGE, BOARDING BATTEN ON THE TOP, SOMETHING ELSE ON THE SIDE, DIFFERENT ARCH ON THE... AND THAT EYEBROW ARCH THING ABOVE THE DOOR, SO THERE'S SOME DIFFERENCES HERE. IT IS HARD TO... THERE'S THE FLAT, THE FLAT PART, AND THEN THE BORDER. IS THAT, I GUESS, ARCH OR EYEBROW STILL, IS THAT PROPOSED? IT'S JUST BUILT OUT OF THE EYES. BUT THAT ARCH IS SOMEHOW PROPOSED ON THE FRONT ELEVATION OF THE GARAGE? AND IT WAS THE OWNER'S KIND OF SPOT. WHAT'S THE MATERIAL ON THE SIDE? THE NORTH SIDE. YEAH, THIS THING RIGHT THERE. I'M PROPOSING BRICK. JUST THAT THIS RENDERING DOESN'T SHOW IT, AND THAT'S THE ONLY REASON WHY. YEAH, NO PROBLEM. I THINK BY SAVING MONEY THEY WERE THINKING OF THE BOARD OF THAT. SO THIS IS... KIND OF THAT IDEA TO BEGIN WITH. BUT, AESTHETICALLY I THINK THE BRIDGE JUST LOOKS A LOT BETTER. IT'S VERY OPEN VIEW. YEAH, I REALLY LIKE THIS DRAWING THAT YOU HAD. SO THERE'S THAT. THIS WAS IN THE AGENDA PACKET. THIS IS WHAT I EVALUATED ON MY STAFF REPORT. BUT THEN WE KIND OF LOST THAT AS WE WENT AROUND THE SIDE AND TOWARDS THE BACK. THAT LEVEL OF DETAIL. YEAH. THAT WAS NICE. THAT WAS THE FIRST THOUGHT, AND THEN IT CHANGED THE OWNER. YEAH, WE JUST DON'T HAVE ANY OF THAT DETAIL IN HERE. BECAUSE THAT'S NOT EVEN PART OF THE WORKSHOP. IF YOU GUYS SUGGEST THAT WE CORRECT IT. I THINK JUST ME PERSONALLY, I'D JUST LIKE TO KNOW WHAT IS FINAL AND WHERE IS IT GOING ON THE BUILDING. AND, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE THOSE SPECIFIC CALL OUTS ON. YOU KNOW THE PAPER THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT. RIGHT NOW THE FINAL IS WHITE BRICK, BOARD AND BAT ABOVE WITH THE ARCH. AND THE BOARD AND BAT IS JUST ABOVE THE TOP BAND OF THE GARAGE. IT'S NOT THREE SIDES. IT'S JUST THE FRONT. OTHERWISE IT'S THREE SIDES BRICK. IT MIGHT, I DON'T KNOW IF THIS IS BOARD DISCUSSION. DO YOU HAVE MORE QUESTIONS? NO, IT'S MORE COMMENTARY ON THE DESIGN. ALRIGHT, QUESTIONS FOR... SO I THINK THE AESTHETIC CHOICE OF... I'D MUCH PREFER TO SEE YOU BE CONSISTENT WITH YOUR USE OF MATERIAL. THE FRONT FACADE, SIDE, BACK, OTHER SIDE. SO FOR EXAMPLE, THE ELEMENT THAT WE JUST RECEIVED NOW THAT KIND OF HAS THE BRICK GOING UP ABOVE THE GARAGE DOOR. THE BRICK AT THAT HEIGHT LOOKS FINE TO ME, BUT I WOULD SAY CARRY IT ALL AROUND ALL FOUR SIDES AND HEADBOARD AND BATTEN ABOVE IT. SO IT'S A CONSISTENT TALENT. YOU KNOW, YOUR NEW BUILDING KIND OF HAS ITS OWN LANGUAGE. RIGHT. AND LET'S SPEAK THE SAME LANGUAGE ON ALL FOUR SIDES. KIND OF EMULATE THE SAME ELEVATION. YEAH, YEAH. I DON'T UNDERSTAND THE EYEBROW. KIND OF CONFUSING ME. [02:30:03] I DON'T KNOW. SO I THINK, I MEAN, IT'S POSSIBLE TO GET IT THERE, BUT I THINK YOU NEED TO REFERENCE THE EXISTING HOUSE TO FIND THAT COMPATIBLE LANGUAGE. I DON'T NECESSARILY SEE IT THERE. SO IT MAY BE A HARD SELL ON AN EYEBROW. I MEAN, IF YOU ASK ME RIGHT NOW TODAY, WE'RE VOTING YAY OR NO ON IT, I'D SAY NO EYEBROW. WELL, I MEAN, I COULD SEE IF THE GARAGE DOOR HAD AN ARCH TOP. IF THERE WAS ANOTHER ARCH TOP IN THE BUILDING SOMEPLACE. I DID. I SAID, WOULD YOU LIKE TO DO IT? YEAH. THEN THAT WOULD FINISH IT OFF IN THE END. GET RID OF THAT? GO AHEAD. YEAH, SO I GUESS I DO HAVE A... ALTHOUGH I UNDERSTAND THAT THIS IS NOT A CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE, I DO THINK IT'S... THE GARAGE IS... IT'S DEFINED AS SOMETHING DIFFERENT, AND I THINK HAVING WHITE PAINTED BRICK FOR UP TO THAT ELEVATION, THAT'S A... HARD SELL FOR ME. I MUCH PREFER THAT ELEMENT WE'RE SEEING IN THE RENDERING AND I THINK THE BOARD AND BATTEN IS REALLY LOVELY AND WRAPPING THAT AROUND ALL FOUR SIDES, KEEPING THE BRICK DOWN AT A LOWER, I GUESS WATER TABLE, WHATEVER YOU WANT TO CALL IT, WOULD BE MORE APPROPRIATE AND THE EYEBROW ARCH. I WOULD AGREE, I WOULD NOT BE VOTING ON THAT. I WOULD LIKE TO TALK HER INTO AN ACTUAL... I THINK... I WOULD FOLLOW WITH THESE GUYS. YEAH. YEAH. FINDING A RATIONALE FOR ITS EXISTENCE. AND IF YOU COULD POINT TO THE EXISTING HOUSE TO FIND IT, I THINK THAT THAT'S VERY HELPFUL. JUST READING MY OWN... THE SAME THING'S HAPPENING HERE. IT'S JUST A THING THAT HASN'T... WHAT IS IT? I DIDN'T UNDERSTAND THAT THAT WAS A CHANGE. I DIDN'T EITHER. SO FOR US TO UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE PROPOSING TO DO OR NOT DO, YOU NEED TO BE VERY CLEAR ON THE DRAWINGS WITH CALLING IT OUT AND SPECIFICALLY SAYING, OR A LOT OF TIMES WE'LL SEE EXISTING AND THEN NEW SO THAT WE CAN COMPARE AND SEE THAT SOMETHING'S CHANGING. THEY'RE NOT FINAL YET, BUT IN THE FINAL DRAWING. SO THIS IS THE CONCEPTUAL WE'RE GOING FOR? NO, THIS IS FINAL. OH, THAT'S FINE. ARE THOSE LITTLE CANOPIES OVER THOSE THREE WINDOWS ON THE EXISTING HOUSE, ARE THEY NEW? BECAUSE I REMEMBER NOTING THAT THEY LOOKED A LITTLE DIFFERENT IN A COUPLE DIFFERENT DRAWINGS, AND I WAS QUESTIONING, ARE THEY CHANGING THESE? ARE THESE NEW? THEY'RE LIKE THOSE 1940S METAL CANOPIES. YEAH, I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THEM. I JUST WANTED THEM AS SOMETHING NEW. AND I THINK WE ALREADY HEARD THE SHUTTER PLACEMENT COMMENT GOING OVER THE LAKE. THAT'S AN EASY MOD. I THINK I UNDERSTAND THE NEW GARAGE DOOR BEING PROPOSED IS THIS ONE, NOT THE ONE THAT HAS THE MUNTINS AND THE... AND THE GLASS, WHICH DON'T OCCUR. THEY'RE GONE. YEAH. BUT WE ALSO WERE DEPICTING A DIFFERENT SCALE OF THE LEGS OF THE GARAGE, ON EITHER SIDE OF THE GARAGE DOOR. IN THE RENDERING WE GOT TODAY, IT LOOKS A GOOD FOUR FEET ON EITHER SIDE. AND IN THE DRAWING, IT LOOKS MAYBE ABOUT TWO AND A HALF. SOMETIMES THE 3D RENDERINGS WILL... YEAH, DIMENSIONS WOULD HELP THAT. YEAH, DIMENSIONS. YEAH, I DON'T SEE ANY SETBACKS ON THE SITE PLAN. IT'S JUST THE BUILDING. AND I DON'T ACTUALLY KNOW WHERE THAT IS [02:35:01] ON THE PROPERTY ITSELF. AT THE MEASUREMENTS OF THE BUILDING, I DON'T HAVE ANY SETBACKS. I CAN NOTE THE SETBACKS FOR SURE. JUST SO WE KNOW WHERE THAT BUILDING IS GOING. AND YOU'LL NEED THAT FOR PERMITTING. YEAH, ABSOLUTELY. LIKE I SAID, THIS IS JUST TRYING TO GET INTO YOUR BUILDING. I DID LIKE THAT YOU ADDED THE WINDOW ON THE NORTH SIDE BECAUSE IT WAS A BIG BLANK BRICK WALL AND I WAS LIKE BEGGING FOR SOMETHING TO HAPPEN THERE. I DID HAVE TWO. YES, AND THEN I SAW THE SECOND ONE ON THIS, SO THAT WAS GOOD. ALL RIGHT, ARE WE DONE QUESTIONING THE FORMAT? JUST MAKE SURE ON THE FINAL YOU CALL OUT ALL YOUR TRIM AND ALL THAT BUSINESS. ABSOLUTELY. I ALSO DETECTED YOUR WALL SECTION DOESN'T AGREE WITH WHAT YOUR ELEVATIONS ARE SHOWING. THE WALL SECTION IS CALLING FOR SPUCCO AND SHAKE SIGHTING. GET IN THERE AND TWEAK THAT. THAT'S WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT TOO. YEAH. YEP. ALL RIGHT, SO I'M GOING TO OPEN A PUBLIC HEARING. OPEN A PUBLIC HEARING. DOES ANYONE WANT TO TALK ABOUT THIS PROJECT? COMMENT ON IT? SEEING NONE. CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING. WHAT IS THE WILL OF THE BOARD? IT MAKES SENSE TO CONTINUE IT WITH OUR COMMENTS AND GIVE IT A SHOT. YEAH. I HAD ONE QUESTION FOR THE BOARD TO THINK ABOUT. WHEN WE WERE LOOKING AT THE FIRST SET OF PRESENTED DRAWINGS, WHERE THEY HAD THE ARCH TOPPED. THE BREEZEWAY, THE CONNECTING ELEMENT TO THE GARAGE. YES. AND THEN THAT SEEMS TO BE WHAT EVERYBODY IS LEANING TOWARDS. DOES THAT KIND OF GO AGAINST WHERE WE'RE SUPPOSED TO SHOW SOME SORT OF CLEAR DEFINITION BETWEEN OLD AND NEW? WOULD THE BOARD AND BATTEN STARTING THERE MAKE MORE SENSE? THAT SHOWS THAT WHERE THE BOARD AND BATTEN ATTACHES TO THE EXISTING BRICK, THIS BECOMES NEW CONSTRUCTION. YEAH, I THINK THAT CHANGE IN MATERIAL SHOULD HAPPEN AT THE ADDITION, NOT AT THE FACE OF THE GARAGE. AND IF THEY'RE DOING SOME EXTENSIVE, IT'S MORE THAN JUST TWEAKS THAT WE HAVE TO DO. WE'VE GIVEN SOME REALLY DETAILED, WE'VE GOT SO MANY DIFFERENT BRACKETS WE'RE LOOKING AT AND DIFFERENT CHANGES. WE DON'T REALLY KNOW WHAT'S HAPPENING, SO I THINK A CONTINUANCE WOULD BE GOOD TO GET THE FINAL. A CONTINUANCE IS DOABLE AS POSSIBLE. RIGHT. YES, IT IS. AND IF YOU CONTINUE IT TO A DATE CERTAIN, THEN WE DON'T HAVE TO RE-ADVERTISE IT. SO, WHAT DO YOU NEED TO GET MATERIALS AND EVERYTHING? WOULD IT BE THE JULY MEETING? TYPICALLY, THE CASE IS... I'VE BEEN OPERATING IF THERE'S CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL, THEY CAN GIVE ME APPLICATION MATERIALS TWO WEEKS AHEAD OF THE MEETING, BECAUSE THAT GIVES ME ONE WEEK TO LOOK AT IT AND THEN ONE WEEK TO POST MY AGENDA. BUT IF IT'S CONTINUED TO DATE TURN, I'D PREFER THAT IT MEETS THE ACTUAL DEADLINE OF THE JULY MEETING. OKAY. AND WE, YES, SO IT WOULD BE THE JULY MEETING. DID EVERYONE GET DISTRACTED? I CAN SAY THAT AGAIN. IT'S PRETTY IMPRESSIVE. THAT'S SCARY. SORRY. YEAH, I LIVE HERE, SO. WHERE'S IT GOING? IT'S GOING TO THE BATHROOM. WOW. THIS IS NOT WHAT IT SHOULD HAVE. I KNOW, I THOUGHT IT WAS SOMETHING ELSE. I WAS TRYING TO HEAR. WHOA, WHOA, WHOA. IS THERE ACTUALLY SOMEBODY DRIVING? GLENN, IS SOMEONE STEALING THE POINT OF YOUR RATE FOR YOUR MEETING? OKAY, THAT'S ENOUGH. SORRY, I... I'LL JUST REPEAT THAT. IF CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL IS GRANTED, I'VE BEEN OPERATING AS THEY CAN GIVE ME THEIR APPLICATION MATERIALS TWO WEEKS AHEAD OF THE MEETING. BECAUSE THAT GIVES ME A WEEK TO REVIEW IT AND THEN I HAVE TO POST MY AGENDA TWO WEEKS OUT OF NEXT MEETING. IF THERE IS NON-CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL AND THE CASE IS CONTINUED, I WOULD PREFER THEY MEET THE DEADLINE OF THE JULY MEETING. SO WE WOULD CONTINUE IT TO THE JULY MEETING, THE DATE CERTAIN AND TIME. OKAY. IF WE DO THAT, DO WE KNOW WHAT WE'RE ASKING THE APPLICANT TO DO? CAN WE ITEMIZE THOSE THINGS FOR THE APPLICANT? [02:40:06] NOW, I KNOW THAT MCKENNA'S TAKING NOTES, BUT DO YOU THINK YOU GOT EVERYTHING? NO. CAN YOU GUYS STATE ALL THOSE THINGS VERY SLOWLY? ARE YOU BEING WISE? NO, I'M JUST SAYING THAT I'M CONFUSED LISTENING, AND I WOULD LIKE AN ITEMIZED LIST THAT I CAN GO BACK AND LISTEN TO TOMORROW. ALRIGHT. CAN I JUST SAY SOMETHING THOUGH? WE'RE NOT DESIGNING THESE PROJECTS. NO. AND WE SHOULDN'T BE DESIGNING. WE CAN GIVE RECOMMENDATIONS, THOUGHTS, AND, LIKE, YOU KNOW, THIS REALLY DOESN'T HIT THE GUIDELINES AND GIVE A SUGGESTION. SO I FEEL LIKE IF WE GET INTO THE TRAP OF SAYING, CHANGE THE BRACKET, PUT THE BRICK HERE, DO THIS, THEN WE'RE REALLY LEADING WAY TOO MUCH THAN WE NEED TO BE. AND I'LL SHOW YOU WHAT I SHOWED THE OTHER CASE THAT CAME BACK, THE CASE ON 322 SOUTH 6TH STREET. THIS IS THE TYPE OF INFORMATION I'D LIKE TO SHARE WITH THE APPLICANT. CALL OUT THE HEIGHT AND DIMENSIONS SPECIFICALLY. INFORMATION FOR INTENTIONS ON THE PORCH POSTS INCLUDE SETBACKS. CALL OUT THE TYPE OF WOOD, MORE DETAILS ON THE SIDE PORCH, AND YOU GUYS REQUESTED THE REMOVAL OF THE BAY WINDOW. I'D LIKE TO SEND A SIMILAR NOTE TO THIS APPLICANT. THAT WAS A REALLY DIFFERENT TYPE OF PROJECT. THERE WASN'T REALLY, I THINK, CONCEPTUAL... DESIGN THINGS WITH ITEMS WITH THIS PROJECT ON SOUTH 6TH WHERE THERE'S SOME TRULY CONCEPTUAL DESIGN ITEMS THAT ARE THAT NEED WE I BELIEVE NEED TO BE REVISED SO AND I AND I'M IN AGREEMENT WITH TAMMY THAT WE WOULD BE GIVING TOO MUCH LIKE WE'D BE DESIGNING IT FOR THEM AND WE WE SHOULD NOT BE SO I DON'T I THINK I THINK THE DESIGNER UNDERSTANDS THE INTENT AND I THINK HE'S GONNA HAVE TO GO BACK TO THE CLIENT AND HAVE A CONVERSATION WITH THEM ABOUT WHAT THE, BECAUSE THERE'S GOING TO BE SOME REVISIONS, BECAUSE IT'S NOT GOING TO BE EXACTLY WHAT WE JUST DISCUSSED. BECAUSE HE'S GOING TO HAVE TO WORK THROUGH ANOTHER PROCESS WITH HIMSELF. YEAH. I THINK THE DISTINCTION HERE IS ON 322, IT WAS AN ITEMIZED REQUEST OF, THIS IS THE ADDITIONAL INFORMATION YOU NEED TO SEE. IN THIS CASE, WE'RE SAYING WE NEED YOU TO GO BACK AND DO SOME NEW DESIGN. YEAH. AND I AGREE WITH TAMMY. WE DON'T REALLY WANT TO BE IN A POSITION WHERE WE'RE TELLING THEM WHAT KIND OF DESIGN TO DO. REALLY, MY COMMENTS ARE, LET'S BE CONSISTENT WITH THE USE AND DETAILING OF THE MATERIALS ON ALL FOUR SIDES OF THIS NEW STRUCTURE. THAT'S PRETTY GENERAL. HE'S GOING TO MEET WITH HIS CLIENT. HE'S GOING TO DECIDE HOW HIGH IS THAT BRICK. WHERE DOES THE BOARD AND BED START AND STOP? THOSE KIND OF THINGS, THAT'S GOING TO BE UP TO THEM TO COME BACK. THAT'S WHY I THINK CONTINUING TONIGHT AND JUST LEAVING IT AS A CONTINUING IS THE WAY TO GO. OKAY. WE'LL GET NEW INFORMATION NEXT TIME AND THEN WE CAN DECIDE. ALL RIGHT. DO YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS? NONE. YOU'RE GOOD. YOU'RE GOLDEN. I WON'T BE HERE FOR YOU NEXT TIME. OKAY. DO WE NEED TO VOTE ON A CONTINUANCE? SO I WOULD SUGGEST THAT SOMEONE MOVE TO CONTINUE THIS CASE TO JULY 16TH, 5 P.M. HISTORIC DISTRICT COUNCIL MEETING. THANK YOU. AND THEN THAT WAY IT'S ANNOUNCED AND... I THINK I CAN DO THAT. CONTINUE CASE NUMBER HTC 2026-0013 TO THE JULY 16TH JULY 16TH HISTORIC DISTRICT COUNCIL MEETING AT 5 P.M. OKAY. DO WE HAVE A SECOND? SECOND. PLEASE CALL THE VOTE. MEMBER SHORSTAD-SCHALLER? YES. MEMBER KOSAK? YES. MEMBER SIKOWSKI? YES. MEMBER BURNS? YES. MEMBER SALA? YES. VICE CHAIR PEZZETTA? [6.5 HDC2026-0014 - BLANCHFORD REAL ESTATE, LLC (COASTAL TEA CAFE), 27 S. 5TH STREE] YES. AND CHAIR PHILCOX? YES. THANK YOU, SIR, FOR YOUR TIME. ALL RIGHT, WE ARE NOW ON TO HDC 2026-0014, CORRECT? YES. THAT'S CORRECT. MS. SADLER. THIS IS OUR LAST CASE OF THE EVENING, AND WITH THIS TERM. THIS IS AN APPLICATION FIRST. FINAL CERTIFICATE OF APPROVAL TO ADD AN ADA RAMP, CHANGE TWO OPENINGS ON THE SIDE AND THE REAR OF THE STRUCTURE, PAINT, ADD SIGNAGE, ADD SOME PATIO SPACE WITH THE INTENTION OF CHANGING A RESIDENTIAL STRUCTURE TO A COMMERCIAL STRUCTURE. IT'S A COFFEE AND TEA BUSINESS AS I UNDERSTAND IT. THEY ATTENDED THE TECHNICAL REVIEW COMMITTEE ABOUT MAYBE A MONTH OR TWO MONTHS AGO TO GET THEIR CHANGE [02:45:01] OF USE APPROVED. SO THIS HAS BEEN LOOKED AT BY THE UTILITIES DEPARTMENT, STREETS, THE ARBORIST, FIRE, CODE ENFORCEMENT BUILDING, AND PLANNING TO MAKE SURE THAT THIS CHANGE OF USE IS COMPATIBLE WITH THIS PROPERTY, AND THEY GAINED APPROVAL FOR THE CHANGE OF USE. PART OF THEIR TR TECHNICAL REVIEW COMMITTEE FOLLOW-UP NOTES WAS TO GAIN APPROVAL FROM THE HDC TO MEET ADA REQUIREMENTS AND ANY OTHER CHANGES THAT THEY'D BE MAKING ON THE EXTERIOR OF THE BUILDING TO ACCOMMODATE THE BUSINESS. I REVIEWED AN ADA RAMP PROPOSAL ON THE SOUTH SIDE OF THE STRUCTURE. I DID A BRIEF KIND OF LEARNING SESSION ABOUT ADA STANDARDS FOR ACCESSIBLE DESIGN AND IT MEETS THE REQUIREMENTS FOR KIND OF THE RISE OVERRUN, THE SLOPE OF THE RAMP, AND THE WIDTH OF THE RAMP. IT'S RUNNING UP THE SOUTH SIDE OF THE BUILDING TO A A DOOR THAT WILL BE ADDED. SO ON THIS SLIDE I KIND OF HIGHLIGHT ON THE LEFT IS EXISTING AND THE RIGHT IS PROPOSED. THERE IS CURRENTLY TWO WINDOWS THERE AS I UNDERSTAND IT AND THEY WILL BE SHIFTED AWAY FROM THE CENTER AND A DOOR WILL BE ADDED TO ACCOMMODATE THE ADA RAMP ON THE LEFT SIDE OF THE BUILDING. THIS IS NOT READILY SEEN FROM THE ROAD SO I DIDN'T SCRUTINIZE IT AS MUCH AS I WOULD A PRIMARY OPENING ON THE FRONT FACADE OF A STRUCTURE. THERE IS SOME CORRESPONDENCE IN YOUR APPLICATION AND YOUR AGENDA PACKET ABOUT CHANGING THE BACK DOOR AND THIS WAS A BACK DOOR THAT WAS FOUND IN THE SHED THAT IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING THAT THE APPLICANT IS PROPOSING THIS BACK DOOR REPLACE THE CURRENT BACK DOOR FOR EASE OF ACCESS TO SERVICE TO THE BACK PATIO AND THEN I PULLED A PAINT SWATCH THAT IS PROPOSED FOR IT. THERE'S PAINTED LIKE CONCRETE AND SOME BRICK IN THE BACK THAT WILL BE PAINTED. THERE'S GREEN COLOR. I ADDED THE DETAIL ABOUT THE BRICK PAVER. EXPANSION THAT WILL NOT REQUIRE ANY FURTHER STORMWATER REVIEW SINCE IT'S LESS THAN 620 FEET SQUARE FEET OF ADDITIONAL IMPERVIOUS SURFACE AND THEN I ADDED THEIR SIGN MOCK-UP WHICH IS NOT SUBJECT TO AGENCY APPROVAL BUT I THOUGHT I WOULD SHOW YOU GUYS WHAT THAT IS PLANNED TO LOOK LIKE. I DO RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF THIS CASE WITH THE CONDITION AGAIN THAT I DID NOT SEE THE MECHANICAL EQUIPMENT ON THE SITE PLAN SO THAT NEEDS TO BE AT LEAST FIVE FEET FROM ANY PROPERTY LINE AND SCREEN FROM THE RIGHT OF WAY. AND THAT ALL VISIBLE WOOD ELEMENTS ARE STAINED OR PAINTED. BUT I DO RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF THIS CASE TONIGHT. ANY QUESTIONS FOR MS. SADLER? ALL RIGHT. WHAT DO YOU DO? I'VE COMMENTED ON THE... OH, OKAY. IS THE APPLICANT HERE? IS THAT YOU? COME FORWARD. COME FORWARD. ANY QUESTIONS FOR THE APPLICANT? I DO. I HAVE A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS AND MAYBE SOME COMMENTS AS WELL. SO, FIRST OF ALL, THANK YOU BECAUSE I KNOW THAT WE SAW THIS BUILDING WITH, I BELIEVE, A DIFFERENT OWNER. YES, A DIFFERENT OWNER AND A DIFFERENT BUSINESS OWNER. YEAH, YEAH, UNDERSTOOD. YEAH, YEAH. I KNOW, WHATEVER. IT WAS A FEW MONTHS OR SO. AND I THINK THAT YOU'VE DONE A REALLY GOOD JOB AT ADDRESSING SOME OF THE CONCERNS THAT WE HAD AT THAT POINT IN TERMS OF ...HANDICAP ACCESSIBILITY. I DO LIKE VERY MUCH THAT YOU'VE FLIPPED THE RAMP AROUND WHERE ORIGINALLY IT WAS COMING INTO LIKE THE FRONT PORCH. THAT BEING SAID, YOU KNOW, WHAT THE ADA SAYS IS THAT YOU'RE REALLY NOT SUPPOSED TO HAVE AN ISOLATED OR A SEPARATE ENTRANCE FOR DISABLED PEOPLE. AND SO IDEALLY, YOU'D WANT TO BRING THEM IN SOMEHOW THROUGH THE FRONT ENTRANCE. HOWEVER... THAT'S NOT JUST FOR THIS. YOU SEE THIS BACK... YEAH, YEAH, YEAH, NO, YEAH, NO. YEAH, YEAH. TOTALLY UNDERSTAND. I DON'T TAKE EXCEPTION TO THIS AT ALL, AS I THINK YOU'VE SOLVED THE PROBLEM, AND I THINK IT'S TOTALLY REASONABLE, AND IT KEEPS THE FRONT OF THE BUILDING INTACT. SO I JUST, ALTHOUGH IT'S WHAT THE ADA SAYS, I THINK YOU'VE ADDRESSED IT HERE. IT WORKS WELL. I THINK THERE'S A COUPLE OF THINGS THAT YOU JUST NEED TO LOOK AT. THE... DIMENSION AT THE TOP OF YOUR LANDING FOR THE RAMP, IT SHOWS AN OVERALL DIMENSION OF FIVE FEET, WHICH INCLUDES THE RAILING THICKNESS, BUT YOU'VE GOT TO HAVE FIVE FEET CLEAR. SO IT'S JUST GOING TO HAVE TO BE A LITTLE BIT BIGGER. SO THAT'S ONE THING. [02:50:03] AND THEN WHEN YOU HAVE YOUR HANDRAILS COME DOWN THAT RAMP, THEY NEED TO EXTEND 12 INCHES BEYOND THE FACE OF THE RAMP. RAMP AND THEY ARE GOING TO BE IN CONFLICT WITH THAT STAIR THAT'S AT THE FRONT PORCH. THE STAIR IS NOT GOING TO BE ACTIVE, THAT DOOR. I AGREE THEY DON'T MEET CODE. YEAH, YEAH, ABSOLUTELY. OKAY, ALL RIGHT, WELL THEN THAT'S GOOD BECAUSE MY OTHER ISSUE WAS THAT AND POTENTIALLY A HANDRAIL COMING OFF THE STAIRS. SO THEN THAT SOLVES THAT PROBLEM. IT DOESN'T APPEAR FROM WHAT I CAN SEE THAT... THERE'S ADA COMPLIANCE FOR FOLKS TO GET INTO THE BOOK NOOK. LIKE THE DOOR WIDTH MAY NOT BE WIDE ENOUGH. AND ONE OF THE DOOR OPENINGS FROM LIKE THE BATHROOM, THE HALLWAY INTO THE BOOK NOOK, THAT MAY BE TOO NARROW JUST BASED ON WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE IT'S DRAWN HERE. I JUST THINK YOU NEED TO LOOK AT THAT AND WIDEN IT SO THAT THERE'S ACCESS INTO THAT SPACE. IT'S THE OPENING BETWEEN THE BATHROOM HALLWAY AND THE BOOK NOOK. YEAH, YOU MAY JUST NEED TO WIDEN THAT A LITTLE BIT SO YOU HAVE THE ACCESS IN. SO THAT'S ALL. BUT I THINK THE DESIGN OVERALL WORKS WELL. I THINK THERE'S A COUPLE OF TWEAKS THAT YOU NEED TO MAKE, AND I'M SURE THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT WOULD PICK UP ON THIS AS WELL IN TERMS OF THE ADA COMPLIANCE. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS? YES. YES. I THINK VERONICA TOUCHED ON SOME KEY BITS HERE THAT THESE RAMPS ARE FINICKY, AND THERE'S A LOT OF LITTLE SUBTLE DETAILS. FOR EXAMPLE, I THINK YOU MAY NEED GRASPABLE HANDRAILS ON BOTH SIDES OF THE RAMP. YEAH, I SHOULD HAVE IT. OKAY. BECAUSE IT IS REQUIRED. THAT'S WHY I'M ASKING. THEN I THINK THERE'S A, I'D SUGGEST YOU LOOK INTO THE APPROACH. WHEN YOU OPERATE THE DOOR, I THINK THERE MAY BE A 16 OR 18 INCH APPROACH TO THE STRIKE SIDE OF THE DOOR. THAT MIGHT NECESSITATE THAT YOUR LANDING GET WIDER. AND IT'S 12 ON THE OUTSIDE, IT'S GOING TO BE 18 ON THE INSIDE. YEAH, AND I'M ONLY SAYING THIS BECAUSE IT MAY CHANGE THE DESIGN OF IT. WHICH IS WHAT I'M INTERESTED IN AND WHAT IT'S GOING TO LOOK LIKE. AND I THINK THE LAST THING IS I WANTED TO APPLAUD YOU GUYS FOR KEEPING THOSE HISTORIC WINDOWS, REUSING THEM. PROXIMITY TO THE RAMP AND THE STAIRS IS PROBABLY GOING TO REQUIRE THEM TO BE TEMPERED. RIGHT. YOU MAY BE ABLE TO GET, SINCE I ASSUME THIS IS A CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE, YOU MAY BE ABLE TO GET AROUND THAT WITH LIKE A... LETTER FROM THE BUILDING OFFICIAL AND ONCE AGAIN I'M ONLY SAYING THAT BECAUSE IT COULD AFFECT THE LOOK OF THE WINDOWS IT COULD BE A HISTORIC EXEMPTION RIGHT WITH THE WINDOWS I DON'T KNOW IT IN COMMERCIAL IF THAT WOULD WORK BUT SO I THINK THAT REALLY IS ANYTHING ELSE FOR THE APPLICATION OH AND I LIKE THAT HISTORIC DOOR YOU WANT TO USE ON THAT? THAT WAS GOING TO BE MY COMMENT. THAT WAS ACTUALLY DOROTHEA'S ORIGINAL FRONT DOOR. OH WAS THAT THE ONE? YEAH. HER SON PUT THAT ONE ON. YEAH. NICE. I HAVE A, IT'S TOTALLY UNRELATED. OKAY, THAT'S THE QUESTION. ARE YOU THE BLANCHARDS THAT THE FAMILY THAT IN 1947, 1950? WAS THERE BLANCHARDS? THERE ARE ONLY 17 OF US IN THE UNITED STATES RIGHT NOW. OH. OH, WE CAN SEND, YEAH, LET'S TALK. THAT WOULD BE REALLY INTERESTING. YEAH, THAT NAME COMES UP. NOW, YOU COULD BE A MILLIONAIRE AND NOT. NO, NO, NO, NO, NO, I OWN IT NOW. FORGET IT. BUT THAT NAME COMES FROM A PREVIOUS HOME. IT'S AN ASIAN NAME. ALL RIGHT. SEE? YEAH. THANK YOU. YOU'RE WELCOME. NOW I KNOW THE T CONNECTION. AND YOU CAN DO SOME SORT OF CONNECTION IN THE WILLIAMS [02:55:01] HOUSE AND HAVE IT COMBINED. YEAH. PROMOTION. PROMOTION. OK. ANYTHING ELSE FOR THE APP? I JUST HAVE ONE QUESTION. WHEN THOSE WINDOWS ARE COMING IN, THEY'RE MOVING IN, CORRECT? THEY'RE MOVING OUT. THEY'RE MOVING OUT. OK. SO, AND I TAKE IT YOU'RE MATCHING. WHAT SIDING IS GOING BACK BECAUSE YOU'LL HAVE THAT GAP BETWEEN THE WINDOW AND TAKING OUT? OH, THEY'RE COMING OUT. YEAH, THEY'RE COMING OUT. OKAY. OKAY. GOT IT. GOT IT. OKAY. ALL RIGHT. LOOKS GOOD. OKAY, WE'RE READY. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. IS THERE ANY BOARD DISCUSSION? I THINK THERE IS. FOR EXAMPLE, THE LITTLE THINGS I SAID, I THINK MAYBE THAT COULD BE SOMETHING THAT MIA COULD LOOK AT. THEY'RE NOT ANY, I DON'T THINK THEY'RE THINGS WE NEED TO LOOK AT. OKAY. ALL RIGHT, SO MIA, YOU KNOW WHAT THOSE ARE? GOOD. ALL RIGHT. DO I HAVE A MOTION? I MOVE TO APPROVE CASE NUMBER. PUBLIC. OH, PUBLIC. OH, I'M SORRY. MR. PUBLIC HERE. ANYBODY WANT TO SAY ANYTHING? STEVIE, YOU GOOD? I'M GOOD. GLENN? YOU'RE GOOD. MARGARET? YOU'RE GOOD. HI. LET US IN PUBLIC HERE. SHALL I MAKE A MOVE? I HAD TO LEAVE. PLEASE. THAT WAS YOUR LAST ONE, MADAM CHAIR. THE LAST BANGING OF A PUBLIC HEARING COUNCIL. I MOVE TO APPROVE CASE NUMBER ACC-2026-0016. IT'S THE 8 O'CLOCK HOUR. WITHOUT CONDITIONS. AND I MOVE THAT THE HCC MAKE THE FOLLOWING FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW PART OF THE RECORD THAT HCC CASE 2026-0016... PRESENTED IS SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANT WITH THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE WITH SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR STANDARDS AND THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT GUIDELINES TO OUR FINAL APPROVAL AT THIS TIME REMEMBER COSSACK IT'S HGC 2026 0 0 1 4 OH THAT ONE YEAH OKAY SO ONCE MORE CLARIFY CHANGE TO 0 0 1 4 MAYBE JUST TO AMEND TO ADD IN THE STAFF RECOMMENDATIONS IT WAS JUST A COMMENT ABOUT THE PLACEMENT OF MECHANICAL I'M LOOKING AT THE STAFF REPORT, IT SAYS 0016. DON'T LOOK AT THAT. OKAY. LOOK AT THE STAFF RECOMMENDATIONS. STAFF RECOMMENDATIONS. OKAY, SO PLEASE AMEND MY MOTION TO 0014 AND ADD THE CONDITION THAT THE MECHANICAL EQUIPMENT IS AT LEAST FIVE FEET FROM THE PROPERTY LINE AND SCREENED AND THAT VISIBLE WOOD ELEMENTS ARE STAINED OR PAINTED. I SECOND. WE HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND. COULD YOU CALL THE VOTE, PLEASE? MEMBER SHORSETH SCHALLER? YES. MEMBER KOSAK? YES. MEMBER SKOWSKI? YES. MEMBER BURNS? YES. MEMBER SALA? YES. VICE CHAIR PEZZETTA? YES. AND CHAIR KULKOFF? YES. VERY GOOD. CONGRATULATIONS. THANK YOU SO MUCH. GOOD LUCK. YES. THAT HOUSE IS ADORABLE. YEAH. SO IT'S IMPORTANT THAT IT STAY ADORABLE. OKAY, ON TO STAFF CERTIFICATES. [7. BOARD BUSINESS] ANYBODY? NO, YOU MISSED ONE. WHAT DID I MISS? SEVEN BOARD BUSINESS. SHE WANTS TO SKIP IT. WE COULD SWITCH IT. I DON'T, I'M LOOKING OVER HERE, I DON'T SEE ANYTHING. I HAVE TWO ITEMS ON BOARD BUSINESS. WANT ME TO JUST JUMP IN? OH SURE. I GOT TWO QUICK ONES. OKAY, GOOD. SO, SUPER FAST, I ALREADY DISCUSSED THIS WITH MIA, BUT MAYBE WE CAN HAVE SOME I FORGOT IT'S FROM THE BOARD. THERE'S A BELL, YOU KNOW THE BELL, CAPTAIN BELL, NEXT TO YOUR HOUSE THAT BUILT UP. THEY BUILT ANOTHER ONE ON THE BELL O'HAGAN HOUSE ON NORTH 3RD. IT'S THE WHITE ONE NEXT TO JOHN BONVOLOR'S. AND WE APPROVED THE VACANT LOT AND A BEAUTIFUL ADDITION TO IT. AND THEY WERE DOING GREAT CHANGES. THEY TOOK OUT ALL THE WINDOWS TO HAVE THEM REBUILT AND HAD THEM SENT OUT. THE PROPERTY IS NOW ON THE MARKET FOR SALE BY OWNER AND ALL THE WINDOWS ARE GONE. SO I DON'T KNOW WHY. IF WE HAVE... I ACTUALLY HAVE SOME INFO ON THAT. OKAY. I DON'T KNOW WHAT WE DO. DO YOU HAVE THE WINDOWS? NO. AUSTIN HISTORICAL HAS THE WINDOWS. THEY DO HAVE THEM? YEAH, THEY STILL HAVE THEM. OKAY. OH, YEAH. I WALKED THROUGH IT YESTERDAY. BECAUSE THOSE WINDOWS BELONG IN THAT HOUSE. YEAH, THEY STILL HAVE THEM. OKAY. AND THEY'RE GOING TO PUT THEM BACK IN THIS HOUSE? SOMEONE, HOPEFULLY, WILL PUT THEM BACK. OKAY. AUSTIN HISTORICAL HAS THEM. THEY'RE PRESERVED AND, YEAH. ALL RIGHT. MY ONLY OTHER THING WAS THAT [03:00:04] THE CUTE LITTLE PIRATE SHAFT THAT WE APPROVED... FOR TEMPORARY DOWN THERE. YEAH. AND NOW IT'S A NEON SIGN. SO EVERY MORNING ON THE WALK, IT'S LIKE, YEAH, I'M A PIRATE. WELL, YOU'RE GOING TO TAKE CARE OF THAT. I'M SORRY? WE'LL TAKE CARE OF IT. THANK YOU SO MUCH. THAT'S IT. ANYBODY ELSE HAVE ANY MORE BUSINESS? I JUST WANTED TO SEE IF WE COULD LOOK INTO PUTTING TOGETHER A WORKSHOP TO TALK ABOUT. OLD TOWN LOCK COVERAGE TO REVISE THE LANGUAGE AND TO REVIEW AND EXPAND THE MIDLOCK CORRIDOR DEFINITIONS AND GRAPHICS OR AT LEAST REVIEW WHAT'S IN THE SOON-TO-BE UPDATED DESIGN GUIDELINES AND SEE IS THERE MORE GUIDANCE THAT WE CAN OFFER. I ACTUALLY WOULD LIKE TO ADD TO JIM. SO WAS IT LAST MEETING OR THE MEETING BEFORE NOT? QUASI-JUJA CITY PRESENTED BILL KAVANAUGH'S WHERE THEY WERE GOING TO PUT THE BOLLARDS AND BLOCK THE RIGHT-OF-WAY. SO, AND PAT GASS BROUGHT IT UP EARLIER TONIGHT, THE RIGHT-OF-WAYS IN OLD TOWN ARE USED FOR PARKING, AND I WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT IF PEOPLE DECIDE TO PARK ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THOSE BOLLARDS, IT'S A RIGHT-OF-WAY THAT'S TO BE USED IN OLD TOWN. SO I DON'T KNOW IF WE NEED TO ADDRESS THEM IN THE GUIDELINES. RIGHT NOW, A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE LIKE, WELL, NOW, CAN I PUT THINGS UP IN MY RIGHT-OF-WAY SO NO ONE PARKS IN MY RIGHT-OF-WAY? AND I DON'T KNOW IF WE NEED TO ADDRESS THAT, WHERE IF THE CITY CLOSES IT FOR DANGER IS DIFFERENT. YES. A LOT OF PEOPLE HAVE BROUGHT THAT UP TO ME SAYING, WELL, DOES THIS MEAN NOW I CAN PUT... THINGS UP IN FRONT OF MY RIGHT-OF-WAY BECAUSE I DON'T WANT PEOPLE TO PARK IN FRONT OF MY HOUSE. YEAH, PEOPLE LIKE PUTTING... WE'VE POTTED PLANTS THERE. OH, I HAVE SEEN, NO, NO, I'VE SEEN, UM... PAPERS? SOUL HORSES. I SAW TWO SOUL HORSES YESTERDAY. AND THAT'S A CHARM. IT'S LIKE A CHARM. IT'S A CHARM. YEAH. OH, YOU SEE THE LITTLE FLAGS? THERE'S CHAIRS OUT THERE. THEY JUST DON'T WANT PEOPLE TALKING. OKAY. MEDICARE, UM... MR. OBAMA. THAT WOULD BE A GOOD GUIDELINE. THIS MAN IS GOING TO TELL US HOW IT WORKS. I AM VLADE GROMOV, DEPUTY CITY MANAGER. THE CITY RUNS AND OWNS AND MANAGES. SO WHEN THERE'S SOMETHING ILLEGALLY PUT IN THERE, WE KNOW ABOUT IT. THERE'S A PERFECT EXAMPLE RIGHT HERE. THEY PUT UP ROCKS RIGHT IN THE RIGHT-OF-WAY SO THAT PEOPLE WOULDN'T CUT A CORNER HERE. SECOND AND BROOM. THEY'RE NO LONGER THERE BECAUSE THOSE ARE CODE COMPLIANT THINGS AND I'M AWARE OF THE SITUATION YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT. IT'S ON US. NO, AND WHAT I MEANT IS WE NEED, IN THE SAME GUIDELINE MEETING, WE NEED TO CLARIFY THAT BECAUSE THE GUIDELINES ACTUALLY SAY, I'VE READ IT THREE DIFFERENT PLACES, RIGHT-OF-WAYS ARE TO BE USED FOR PARKING. YES. SO IN THAT CASE... THERE'S A RIGHT-OF-WAY THERE WE STILL CALL IT RIGHT AWAY BUT WE'VE BLOCKED AND UNLESS IT'S BLOCKED BY THE CITY OR SOMETHING SO SO ANYWAY WE WILL BE GLAD TO DO SOME MORE OF THE WAYS OKAY COOL THING ANYTHING ELSE MY ONE PIECE OF BOARD BUSINESS FOR THE BOARD IS THAT I DO UNDERSTAND IT'S YOUR LAST MEETING CORRECT YES SO JUST FOR THE BOARDS FOR OUR PROCEDURES WE DO HAVE A VICE CHAIR SO AT THE NEXT MEETING THE VICE CHAIR WOULD RUN THE MEETING AND THEN IN YOUR BOARD BUSINESS AT THE NEXT MEETING YOU CAN SELECT WHO WILL BE YOUR CHAIR AND VICE CHAIR AND HOW YOU WILL HANDLE THAT JUST SO WE KNOW WHO WILL BE THE NEXT MEETING THE VICE CHAIR WILL BE TAKING OVER. AND THEN IN THIS PORTION OF THE NEXT MEETING YOU CAN SELECT THE REST OF YOU WHO'S GOING TO DO WHAT? YOUR CHAIR AND YOUR VICE CHAIR. THAT ALSO MEANS WE'LL HAVE ONE. THERE'S A YOUNG LADY, A YOUNG FAMILY IN OLD TOWN THAT'S INTERESTED. WELL, WE DON'T TAKE FAMILIES. SHE WANTS TO. WE'LL TELL HER THE PROCESS OF SUBMITTING AN APPLICATION. I DIDN'T KNOW THEY ALREADY HAD PEOPLE SUBMITTED HER. [03:05:01] CORP SONG YEAH THE CLERK SHE WOULD JUST MAKE THIS YES AND THEN ALL RIGHT WE'RE GOOD WELL I HAD YOUR ANNOUNCEMENT ON THE AGENDA ON THE YEAH YOU'RE 7.1 OKAY WELL I'M LEAVING WE WILL BE MOVING I JUST GOT HERE WE WILL BE MOVING FROM HERE ON JUNE FOUR. TO GO TO SANTA FE, NEW MEXICO ON A NEW ADVENTURE. SO IT'S SOMETHING THAT WE'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT, WELL I'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT IT FOR LONGER THAN MY HUSBAND. BUT WE'VE MADE THE DECISION THAT THIS IS WHAT'S BEST FOR US IN OUR LIFE. SO WE'VE SOLD OUR HOUSE, WE BOUGHT A HOUSE YESTERDAY IN SANTA FE. THAT'S EXCITING. WE'LL BE ON THE ROAD PROBABLY 10 DAYS OR SO AND THEN WE CLOSE OUT THERE ON SO WE'RE VERY EXCITED. I WILL I HATE TO TELL YOU THIS BUT I WILL MISS YOU GUYS. I WILL. I THINK THIS IS A GREAT BOARD. I THINK THAT YOU BRING YOUR EXPERTISE TO THE TABLE EVERY TIME AND THAT IS SO COOL. AND, YOU KNOW, ONE OF THE COOLEST THINGS THAT I THINK HAS HAPPENED IN THE PAST COUPLE OF YEARS IS WE HAVEN'T HAD ANYBODY YELLING AT US. RIGHT? I MEAN, IT HASN'T HAPPENED IN THE PAST COUPLE OF YEARS. NOBODY HAS GOTTEN ANGRY WITH US, AND IT'S BECAUSE OF ALL OF YOU AND YOUR WILLINGNESS TO EXPLAIN YOURSELVES, TO HAVE THEM UNDERSTAND AND DO IT IN A CIVILIZED WAY THAT IT JUST MAKES A HUGE DIFFERENCE. AND WITHOUT YOU GUYS, I'M NOT SURE THE HISTORIC DISTRICT WOULD BE MANAGING AS WELL. AND OF COURSE THERE'S MIA AND MARGARET AND GLENN AND MCKENNA. YOU GUYS ARE GREAT. THANK YOU FOR ALL YOU'VE DONE FOR THIS CITY. IT'S MAKING A DIFFERENCE AND IT'S BEING FELT. SO I APPRECIATE IT. IT'S BEEN, HOW LONG WE'VE BEEN HERE? 22 YEARS? IT HASN'T ALL BEEN FUN. IT HASN'T ALL BEEN EASY. WE'VE BOTH HAD SOME STUFF GO ON PERSONALLY AND AS MEMBERS OF THE COMMUNITY, IT'S A DIFFERENT COMMUNITY ALTOGETHER FROM ANY I'VE CERTAINLY EVER LIVED IN. AND IT HAS SO MUCH POTENTIAL. IT HAS SO MUCH GOODNESS. AND I WOULD LOVE THAT SOMEDAY THOSE THINGS GOT PRAISED PUBLICLY RATHER THAN ALL THE NEGATIVITY WE SEE. SOMEBODY WOULD JUST SAY, GOD, WHAT A BEAUTIFUL PARK. YOU KNOW, OR, GEEZ, I DIDN'T HAVE ANY TROUBLE FINDING A PARKING PLACE TODAY. YOU KNOW, WE DON'T HEAR THOSE THINGS. WE NEVER DO. AND I'M SURE THAT YOU ALL WOULD BENEFIT FROM HEARING MORE. AND YOU ARE AN AMAZING GROUP, SO THANK YOU FOR ALL YOU'VE DONE FOR THIS COMMUNITY. I'D LIKE TO THANK YOU FOR LEADING US. I THOUGHT SHE SAID LEAVING. LEAVING US. I THINK YOU'VE DONE A TREMENDOUS JOB AS A ROLE MODEL, AS AN INPUTTER, AND LIKE I SAY, YOU'RE GOING FROM ONE VORTEX TO ANOTHER VORTEX. I AM. I AM. I CAN'T WAIT TO FEEL THE PULL OF THAT VORTEX. SO THANK YOU ALL, AND GOOD EVENING. GOOD EVENING. OH WAIT WE HAVE STAFF SORRY WHAT ITEM EIGHT AND WE HAVE YEAH WE HAVE A COUPLE MORE MADAM CHAIR OKAY HOW DO YOU REVERSE THIS THE MEETING IS NOT [8. STAFF REPORT] ADJOURNED WHAT ARE WE DOING ITEM EIGHT STAFF REPORTS OKAY I HAVE TWO THINGS FOR STAFF REPORTS ONE IS THE COAS AND THE OTHER IS I WANT TO TAKE A GROUP PICTURE AFTER THE MEETING IS ADJOURNED. SO I JUST WANTED TO SAY THAT BEFORE EVERYONE JUST RUNS AWAY. THESE ARE THE SOCCER RULES FOR APRIL. I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS. I HAD ONE COMMENT. I JUST WANTED TO SAY I'M SUPER HAPPY TO SEE THAT THEY'RE GOING TO GO WITH REPAIR WORK ON 303 SOUTH 8TH BECAUSE I WAS TERRIFIED THAT THEY WOULD TEAR DOWN. YEAH, YEAH. SO I WAS SUPER HAPPY TO SEE THAT. IT'S JUST A ROOF AT THIS POINT THOUGH, RIGHT? YES. THAT'S A SPARK. IT IS. AND I TOOK ALL THE MERCHANDISE [03:10:01] OUT. YEAH. THEY STARTED PATCHING. THEY DID SOME, I GUESS, TEMPORARY. WELL, THE OTHER THING THAT I HEARD YESTERDAY THAT WAS HOPEFUL WAS THAT FOLKS WHO ARE INTERESTED IN THE PROPERTY ON ASH STREET DOWN HERE IN BURLINGTON PROBABLY WON'T WANT TO DEMOLISH. THERE, THE INDIVIDUAL WHO IS INTENDING TO BUY THAT PROPERTY OR HAS PURCHASED THAT PROPERTY, I'M NOT SURE, HAS FILED TO COME TO A FORMAL TECHNICAL REVIEW COMMITTEE. AND THE PROPOSAL RIGHT NOW IS TO JUST ADD A COVERED PAVILION TO THE BACK AND LEAVE THE STRUCTURE THERE. 310, IT'S THE WOODEN HOUSE RIGHT HERE. OH, WOW. ONE THAT'S NEVER SEEN PAINT. YEAH, I WAS ABOUT TO SAY THAT. AND THERE'S... THERE'S DEBATE IT'S NOT IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT RIGHT LOCATION I MEAN IT'S THE OLDEST THING AROUND BUT IT'S NOT LIKE THE PINELAND BANK YEAH BUT THAT THAT BUILDING THERE'S DEBATE OVER THE ACTUAL HISTORY OF IT OR NOT WHETHER THAT WAS THE BUILDING WHERE DR. WAS SHOT MR. FRIEND OR WHETHER THAT HAPPENED NEXT DOOR BUT AS LONG AS THERE'S EVEN THE POSSIBILITY THAT THAT THAT HISTORY IS THERE I THINK IT'S JUST A I MEAN WHY HOW MUCH OLDER A NAME CAN YOU [9. PUBLIC COMMENT] GET IN THIS COMMUNITY OKAY ARE WE DONE NO AND JUST SO YOU KNOW WHILE THIS TRACK COMING UP THIS GENTLEMAN IN THE BACK IS YES AND BLAYLOCK HE IS THESE CITIES SUMMER LEGAL INTERN. SO I KNOW WHEN WE HAVE NEW PEOPLE IN THE AUDIENCE I SHOULD HAVE INTRODUCED HIM EARLIER. WE WERE WORKING ON BETTER BEHAVIOR. BASICALLY FROM J.U. LAW SCHOOL. SO JUST WHILE YOU WERE GETTING TO THE PODIUM I THOUGHT I'D LET HIM KNOW WHO WAS LEFT IN THE ROOM. NOT THAT BLALOCK. YOU MEAN THE BLALOCK? NO, NOT THAT BLALOCK. SO WE HAVE THE SAME NAMES AND NOBODY'S RELATED TO ANYBODY. OKAY. I'M OFF DEPUTY CITY MANAGER. TWO THINGS. I FORGOT TO MENTION EARLIER ON JUNE 3RD THERE WILL BE A TOWN HALL TO DISCUSS THE AND GET PUBLIC INPUT ON THE MOVIE. SO I WANT TO DO THAT, AND THEN I'M NOT GOING TO LET YOU LEAVE OUR LANE WITHOUT US MAKING A STATEMENT. I'LL SPEAK FOR STAFF THAT YOU WILL BE MISSED. WE HAVE ENJOYED WORKING WITH YOU, AND I'M NOT SPEAKING FOR JUST THE CURRENT STAFF. THERE'S A LOT OF WORK WITH YOU OVER THERE. YOU SAID 22. YOU'VE DONE A LOT OF WORK FOR THIS COMMUNITY AND AT TIMES YOU'VE TAKEN GRIEF BECAUSE OF YOUR LOVE. AND THAT'S WHAT IT TAKES TO MAKE A DIFFERENCE. SO WHILE NOT EVERYTHING LOOKS AS YOU WOULD WANT IT WHEN YOU LEAVE, IT WILL EVENTUALLY WHEN WE'RE MOVING IN THAT DIRECTION. AND AGAIN, WE DEFINITELY APPRECIATE ALL OF OUR COMMUNITY. AND YOUR SUPPORT. THANK YOU. MAYBE WE SHOULD CALL PHASE 2 THE ARLENE PHILCON TALK. YES, I ABSOLUTELY THINK YOU SHOULD. I HAVE SOMETHING ELSE IN MIND. WAIT, WHY NOT? THANK YOU VERY MUCH. THANK YOU. HAD YOU NAMED THE ALACHUA OPENING AFTER ME, IT WOULD HAVE BEEN FAR MORE APPROPRIATE. OKAY, THANK YOU ALL SO MUCH. MEETING ADJOURNED. * This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.