>> ABSOLUTELY. CALL TO ORDER HISTORIC DISTRICT COUNCIL MEETING JULY 17, 2025. [00:00:10] LET'S SEE. COULD YOU CALL THE ROLL, PLEASE? >> MEMBER KOSACK? >> HERE. >> MEMBER PSULKOWSKI? >> HERE. >> MEMBER BYRNES? >> HERE. >> VICE CHAIR POZZETTA? >> HERE. >> CHAIR FILKOFF? >> HERE. WE'RE SHORT ONE MEMBER AND DOWN ONE MEMBER. WE HAVE HAD A MEMBER RESIGN, MEMBER GIBSON. LET'S MOVE ON. WE DO HAVE A QUORUM. COULD YOU PLEASE RISE AND SAY THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE? >> >> I DON'T NEED TO SEE ANY ALTERNATES. I THINK I'M GOING TO START DOWN HERE AND ASK IF ANYONE HAS HAD ANY EX PARTE COMMUNICATION. MEMBER BYRNES? >> NO EX PARTE COMMUNICATIONS FOR ME? >> MR. POZZETTA. >> I SPOKE WITH STAFF YESTERDAY ABOUT EACH OF THE ITEMS ON THE AGENDA. >> MS. KOSACK. >> I SPOKE WITH STAFF ON ALL THE ITEMS AS WELL. >> MR. PSULKOWSKI. >> I HAD A CONVERSATION ABOUT PERFORMING WORK AT THE FIRST PROJECT 009. SUBMITTED A BID, BUT WE DIDN'T END UP GOING FORWARD TOGETHER. I GUESS THE QUESTION IS IF I SHOULD RECUSE MYSELF. >> ATTORNEY DAY, COULD YOU HELP US WITH THAT QUESTION? >> NO. BUT NO CONTRACTUAL RELATIONSHIP RESULTED FROM YOUR PRIOR OFFER FOR DEALING. YOU WEREN'T INCORPORATED INTO THE BID? >> NO. >> DID I HEAR THAT CORRECTLY? >> YEAH. THERE WAS NO CONTRACTUAL OBLIGATION, NO CONTRACT SIGNED. >> IF YOU STAND TO FINANCIALLY GAIN FROM THE DECISION BE MADE, IF YOU WERE NOT AWARDED THE BID AND YOU DON'T GAIN ANY FINANCIALLY, SO YOU WOULDN'T HAVE TO RECUSE YOURSELF. BUT IF YOU DO, THEN YOU WOULD ANNOUNCE THAT AT THE TIME AND FILE THE FORM 8B WITH WHICH THE CLERK SHOULD HAVE FOR YOU TO FILE THIS EVENING AND YOU WOULD NOT VOTE ON THE ITEM. >> SOUNDS GOOD. >> HE HAS NO CONTRACTUAL OR FINANCIAL RISK INVOLVED, SO HE'S GOING TO STAY UP HERE, IS THAT GOOD? >> THAT'S GOOD. >> THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU. ALWAYS BETTER TO HAVE A QUESTION AND ADDRESS THEM. THANK YOU. >> ABSOLUTELY. >> NOW I'M GOING TO ASK YOU, ATTORNEY DAY TO PRESENT TO THE CHAMBERS THE QUASI JUDICIAL PROCEDURES, PLEASE. >> ABSOLUTELY. I KNOW YOU'VE ALL BEEN THROUGH THIS TIME OR TWO, SO I WILL SEE BRIEF AND COVER THE ITEMS THAT ARE IN YOUR ADMINISTRATIVE PROCEDURES THAT WILL BE PRESENTED AT THIS TIME. BUT THE PRIMARY DISTINCTION IN QUASI JUDICIAL ITEMS, AS YOU KNOW, IS THAT YOUR DECISION MUST BE BASED ON THE CONFIDENCE, SUBSTANTIAL EVIDENCE THAT PRESENTED TO YOU THIS EVENING IN THE CONTEXT OF THIS HEARING. TO DO THAT, WE MUST FOLLOW CERTAIN PROCEDURES, WHICH YOUR CHAIR IS AWARE OF AND IS GOING TO WALK US THROUGH EACH AGENDA ITEM. BUT I'M GOING TO NOW ANNOUNCE A FEW THINGS TO CHAMBERS. IF THE APPLICANT OR AGENT, OR ATTORNEY DOES NOT DESIRE TO PRESENT ANY EVIDENCE TONIGHT AND RELY SOLELY ON THE APPLICATION AND STAFF'S COMMENTS. THEY MAY DO SO AND RESERVE THE RIGHT TO ADDRESS ANY EVIDENCE AGAINST THE APPLICATION. THOSE WHO PRESENT EVIDENCE MUST BE SWORN IN BY THE CLERK. ALL THOSE WHO INTEND TO PRESENT INFORMATION TO THE BOARD THIS EVENING SHOULD BE PREPARED TO PRESENT EVIDENCE THAT SPECIFICALLY ADDRESS THE CRITERIA IN THE CASE. THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE, APPROPRIATE GUIDELINES ADOPTED BY THE CITY OR THE INTERIOR STANDARDS FOR REHABILITATION. THAT IS BECAUSE THE BOARD CAN CONSIDER THE FACTUAL TESTIMONY OF LAY WITNESSES AND THE OPINION TESTIMONY OF EXPERT WITNESSES. WE WANT TO MAKE SURE THOSE ARE BASED ON THE CORRECT STANDARDS FOR YOU ALL. THE APPLICANT WILL HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO PRESENT EVIDENCE FOR THE APPLICATION AND PRESENT ANY WITNESSES. THEY MAY ALSO CALL STAFF MEMBERS AND ASK THEM QUESTIONS AS WITNESSES. THE APPLICANT ALSO, THE MOST IMPORTANT THING HAS THE RIGHT TO CROSS EXAMINE WITNESSES, [00:05:01] WHICH YOU ALL ARE LIKELY FAMILIAR WITH. EACH PERSON PRESENTING EVIDENCE WILL ADDRESS THE ATP FROM THE PODIUM, AND IF THERE ARE DOCUMENTS OR PHOTOS, THEY MUST BE PRESENTED WHEN THE PARTICULAR INDIVIDUAL IS PRESENTING THE EVIDENCE. ALL DOCUMENTS WILL BECOME PART OF THE RECORD AND SHOULD BE GIVEN TO THE CLERK. AT THE QUALIFIED JUDICIAL HEARING, THE NUMBER OF INDIVIDUALS FOR OR AGAINST A PARTICULAR ITEM CANNOT BE A FACTOR IN THE DECISION MAKING PROCESS. AGAIN, YOUR DECISION MUST BE BASED ON THE CONFIDENT SUBSTANTIAL EVIDENCE THAT'S PRESENTED TO YOU. SINCE THE MEETING IS BEING TAPED, ALL PERSON SPEAKING SHOULD IDENTIFY THEM BY NAME AND ADDRESS OF THE PODIUM BEFORE SPEAKING. THERE SHOULDN'T BE ANY APPLAUSE, OR OUTBURST, OR TALKING EXCEPT BY THOSE APPEARING AT THE PODIUM, AS THAT WILL DISTORT OUR RECORDING TODAY. ALL PERSONS DESIRING TO SPEAK MUST ADDRESS THIS TO APC AND NOT THE APPLICANT OR OTHER SPEAKERS TONIGHT. I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS THAT YOU ALL MAY HAVE ON THE PROCEDURES TO BE FOLLOWED TONIGHT AS WE MOVE FORWARD. >> ANY QUESTIONS? >> YEAH. I AM STILL AN ALTERNATE MEMBER, DO I NEED TO BE SEATED? >> YOU'RE NOT. >> IT'S OFFICIAL AS OF THE MEETING ON TUESDAY. >> I'VE ANNOUNCED THAT FIRST. THE COMMISSION DID MAKE THE DECISION TO MAKE US A BOARD OF SEVEN. NO ALTERNATES. WE HAVE A QUORUM INCLUDING YOU. >> THANK YOU. >> YOU NOT AN ALTERNATE. >> ANY QUESTIONS. >> THANK YOU. YEAH, YOU MADE THAT ANNOUNCEMENT AT THE BEGINNING. THANK YOU FOR CLARIFYING. >> I JUST WANT TO CLARIFY. THAT WAS THE FIRST READING, THERE IS A SECOND READING FOR THAT. >> WE'RE STILL HAVE A QUORUM, SO WE NEED TO SEAT HER NOW. >> I JUST WANTED TO CLARIFY. >> DOES ANYBODY HAVE ANY ISSUE WITH SEATING, MISS BYRNE? >> NO. >> SO YOU'RE SEATED. >> THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU. NO QUESTIONS FROM THE AUDIENCE. THEN COULD ANYONE WHO PLANS TO SPEAK TODAY, PLEASE RISE AND TAKE THE OATH THAT THE SECRETARY WILL DELIVER? >> RAISE YOUR RIGHT HAND. DO YOU SWEAR OR AFFIRM THAT THE ORAL AND/OR WRITTEN TESTIMONY YOU'RE ABOUT TO GIVE WILL BE THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH, AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH? >> YES >> IF YOU DO PLAN TO SPEAK TODAY, COULD YOU MAKE SURE THERE ARE FORMS OVER THERE ON THAT LITTLE WHATEVER THAT IS, THAT JUTS OUT OVER THERE THAT SHELF, TO FILL OUT, TO MAKE SURE THAT WE HAVE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS ACCURATE FOR THE RECORD. [3. APPROVAL OF MEETING MINUTES] WE'RE INTO THE FIRST ITEM ON OUR REGULAR AGENDA? APPROVAL OF MINUTES. WE HAVE TWO SETS OF MINUTES TO APPROVE TODAY, ONE FROM THE WORKSHOP, WHICH IS ITEM 3.1. DID EVERYBODY HAVE A CHANCE TO READ THROUGH THAT? >> YES. >> ANY CHANGES? >> NO. >> ALL IN FAVOR OF ACCEPTING, PLEASE SAY, "AYE". >> AYE. >> NOW, WE'LL GO TO THE MINUTES FOR THE REGULAR MEETING 3.2. EVERYBODY READ THIS? >> YES. >> ANY NEED TO CHANGE? ALL IN FAVOR OF ACCEPTING, PLEASE SAY AYE. >> AYE. [4.1 HDC 2025-0009 - SARA FERRE, AGENT FOR BILLIE STILLWELL LIVING TRUST, 27 S. 5TH STREET FINAL Certificate of Approval (COA) to add an ADA ramp and relocate an existing door at the rear of the property. (Quasi-Judicial).] >> WE'RE NOW AT OLD BUSINESS, WHICH IS APPROPRIATE FOR ME TODAY. HDC CASE 2025-0009 AGENT FOR THE BILLY STILLWELL LIVING TRUST. STAFF REPORT, PLEASE. >> THIS CASE CONCERNS 27 SOUTH 5TH STREET. YOU GUYS SAW THIS CASE IN MAY AND COME BACK AGAIN IN JUNE. THIS IS THE THIRD APPEARANCE OF THE CASE AND THE APPLICANT, WHO ARE SEEKING FINAL APPROVAL TO CONSTRUCT A NEW ADA RAMP AND RELOCATE A DOOR IN THE REAR OF THE PROPERTY. BELOW IS A SITE PLAN THAT WAS REVISED FROM THE LAST MEETING REFLECTING THE DESIRED CHANGES. I ZOOMED IN ON THE BACK PATIO ON THE LEFT TO SHOW THE RELOCATION OF THE MECHANICAL EQUIPMENT THAT WILL BE SET BACK AT LEAST FIVE FEET INTO THE PROPERTY LINE TO COMPLY WITH LDC GUIDELINES. THEN ON THE RIGHT, YOU CAN SEE A SITE PLAN FOR THE NEW RAMP, WHICH INSTEAD OF THE SWITCH BACK, IS GOING TO GO STRAIGHT BACK FOR A SINGLE FILE 88 COMPLIANT RAMP. THEN I MOVED ZOOMED IN ON THE SIDE ON THE RAMP AS WELL. THESE ARE THE UPDATED MATERIALS FROM THE APPLICANT. STAFF IS RECOMMENDING FINAL APPROVAL WITH THE CONDITION THAT THE RAMP WOULD BE COMPLIANT WITH BUILDING CODE AND ADA GUIDELINES. >> ANY QUESTIONS FOR STAFF? WE HAVE THE APPLICANT WITH US. >> HI. SARAH FRA, [00:10:01] 27 SOUTH FIFTH STREET. >> VERY GOOD. THANK YOU. DID YOU MAKE THESE DRAWINGS YOURSELF? [LAUGHTER] >> NO, MA'AM. THIS IS FROM MY ARCHITECT WHO IS WORKING WITH MY BUILDER, AND THEY ARE GOING TO BE THE OFFICIAL PLANS, WE'LL SUBMIT WHEN WE START PERMITTING. I REALIZED YOU GUYS JUST WANTED A LITTLE MORE INFORMATION, MORE SPECIFIC MEASUREMENTS. I THOUGHT YOU MIGHT BENEFIT FROM SEEING EVERYTHING FLESHED OUT. OBVIOUSLY, THIS ISN'T THE ENGINEERED SIDE, BUT JUST A LOT MORE DETAIL THAN LAST TIME. >> ANY QUESTIONS FOR THE APPLICANT? >> NO QUESTIONS JUST TO COMMENT. I JUST WANT TO THANK YOU BECAUSE I REALLY APPRECIATE. I KNOW YOU'VE BEEN HERE THREE TIMES ALREADY. >> ABSOLUTELY. >> THIS IS RIGHT. [LAUGHTER] >> THANK YOU. >> YOU GOT THIS ONE RIGHT THIS TIME. >> YOU RAISED GREAT POINTS. THESE WOULD HAVE COME UP CODE PERMITTING. [OVERLAPPING] >> YOU HAVE HAD SOME ISSUES. THANK YOU FOR THAT. >> THANK YOU, MIA, AND EVERYONE FOR FITTING ME IN. I KNOW IT'S REALLY TIGHT, BUT IT MEANS SO MUCH, TRULY. THANK YOU. >> GREAT. IT'S GOOD TO SEE THAT PROPERTY. >> YES. WE'LL DO IT JUSTICE. >> YES. [LAUGHTER] ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS FROM THE BOARD? I'M GOING TO OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING. DOES ANYBODY IN THE CHAMBER HAVE ANY COMMENT TO MAKE ON THIS? SAYING, NONE. CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING. >> THANK YOU SO MUCH. >> DO WE NEED ANY BOARD DISCUSSION ON THIS OR DO WE HAVE A MOTION? I>> THINK WE NEED A MOTION. >> I THINK MR. POZZETTA IS GETTING READY TO MAKE A MOTION. [LAUGHTER] >> I MOVE TO APPROVE CASE NUMBER HDC 2025-0009 WITHOUT CONDITIONS, AND I MOVE THE HDC MAKE THE FOLLOWING FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW PART OF THE RECORD. AT HDC CASE HDC 2025-0009 AS PRESENTED, IS SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANT WITH THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE, SECRETARY OF INTERIOR STANDARDS, AND THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT GUIDELINES, WARRANT FINAL APPROVAL AT THIS TIME. >> DO I HAVE A SECOND? >> A SECOND. >> I HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND. ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION? COULD YOU CALL THE ROLL, PLEASE? >> MEMBER KOSACK? >> YES. >> MEMBER PSULKOWSKI. >> YES. >> MEMBER BYRNES? >> YES. >> VICE CHAIR POZZETTA? >> YES. >> CHAIR FILKOFF? >> YES. THANK YOU. CONGRATULATIONS. >> I APPRECIATE IT. THANK YOU. >> UNDER NEW BUSINESS, WE HAVE CASE HDC 2025-0012. [5.1 HDC2025-0012 - MIRANDA ARCHITECTS, AGENT FOR MIKE AND CHRISTIE MYERS, 20 S. 10TH STREET FINAL Certificate of Approval (COA) to construct a single-family residence and a detached accessory structure on a previously developed site. (Quasi-Judicial).] FINAL CERTIFICATE OF APPROVAL TO CONSTRUCT A SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENCE AND DETACHED ACCESSORY STRUCTURE ON A PREVIOUSLY DEVELOPED SITE. CAN WE HAVE STAFF REPORT. >> HDC 2025-0012. THE APPLICANT AT 20 SOUTH 10TH STREET IS SEEKING FINAL APPROVAL TO CONSTRUCT A SINGLE FAMILY HOME AND ACCESSORY STRUCTURE. THE EXISTING USE OF THE PROPERTY IS A GARDEN AND FLORIST BUSINESS, WITH THE EXISTING GARAGE IN THE BACK. THE GARAGE IS TO REMAIN, AND THEY ARE GOING TO ADD A SMALL ACCESSORY STRUCTURE IN THE NORTHERN PART OF THE PROPERTY, AND THE SINGLE FAMILY HOME TOWARDS THE FRONT. I PULLED SOME ELEVATIONS, THE WEST AND THE EAST ELEVATIONS. THE TOP IS WHAT'S FACING THE STREET, AND THERE'S AN OUTLINE OF THAT BIG OLD TREE IN THE FRONT, AND THEN THE BACK ELEVATIONS. [BACKGROUND] STAFF WAS RECOMMENDING FINAL APPROVAL AT THIS TIME. >> IT'S A BIG OLD TREE. >> IT IS. >> ANY QUESTIONS FOR STAFF? IS THE APPLICANT HERE, MR. MIRANDA? >> I SAY MIRANDA VERANDA ARCHITECTS 39.5 CENTER STREET. PRETTY STRAIGHTFORWARD, WE'RE MATCHING THE DETAILING AND ARCHITECTURAL STYLE OF THE PREVIOUSLY APPROVED GARAGE BUILDING THAT'S ALREADY ON THE SITE. THE NEW CONSTRUCTION WILL BE OFF GRADE FRAMED. WE'RE TRYING TO DO MINIMUM IMPACT TO THE 42 INCH OAK THAT'S ON THE FRONT. WE TRY TO KEEP IT AS SIMPLE AND SMALL AS POSSIBLE. WE DO HAVE AN EXTENSIVE FRONT PORCH OVERHANG, BUT WITH NO POSTS IN ORDER TO TRY TO CREATE COVER FOR SOMEONE COMING IN WITHOUT ADDING POSTS TO LIMIT THE USABLE SPACE AS YOU ENTER THAT. THE FOCUS IS REALLY GIVING THE BUSINESS END TOWARDS THE STREET, AND THEN A LITTLE MORE OPENNESS ON THE BACK WHERE THEY'RE GOING TO DO A SMALL PLUNGE POOL. >> PLUNGE? >> YES. >> WHAT IS A PLUNGE POOL? [LAUGHTER] >> IT'S BASICALLY THE NEW NAME FOR A SMALL POOL. [LAUGHTER] >> OKAY, THEN, I GOOD. >> IT'S LIKE A TOWNHOUSE IS A NEW NAME FOR A DUPLEX. [LAUGHTER] >> THERE YOU GO. IT'S STARTING TO MAKE PERFECT SENSE. [LAUGHTER] >> YES. >> ANY QUESTIONS FOR MR. MIRANDA? [00:15:03] >> I SAY, WILL THAT TREE NEED TO BE LIMBED UP FOR THE [OVERLAPPING]? >> NO. IT'S ALREADY LOST A COUPLE OF MAJOR LIMBS IN THE LAST TWO STORMS. IF THERE'S ANYTHING IT'S GOING TO BE PRETTY SMALL, AND THAT'S WHY WE KEPT THE HOUSE ONE STORY, EVEN THOUGH IT'S GOT A TALL VOLUME, IT'LL BE WELL TUCKED IN UNDERNEATH WHAT'S REMAINS OF THE TREE CANOPY. >> AS FAR AS THE HEIGHT OF THE HOUSE, WAS THAT A CONSCIOUS DECISION TO HAVE IT LOWER THAN GARAGE? >> YES. AGAIN, BECAUSE WE'RE TUCKED UNDERNEATH THE TREE, THEY DIDN'T NEED A SECOND STORY, BUT IT'S STILL GOING TO BE A VAULTED SPACE, AND WE'VE GOT A 12 FOOT PLATE HEIGHT WITH SCISSORS TRUSSES, SO IT'S GOING TO FEEL LIKE A NICE VOLUME IN THERE GIVEN THAT SMALL FOOTPRINT. >> ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? COMMENTS? >> IS IT A HOUSE OR IS IT GOING TO BE A BUSINESS FUNCTION? >> NO, IT IS HOUSE. IT'S TURNING BACK TO RESIDENTIAL. ESSENTIALLY, THEIR BUSINESS IS GOING TO BE CONTRACTUAL OR ON A AS NEEDED BASIS, IT WILL NO LONGER BE THE FULL HEIRLOOM YARD, AS YOU KNOW IT. >> IT'S REALLY SAD. >> IT IS REALLY SAD. >> I KNOW THIS WAS THE VERY RESPONDING[OVERLAPPING] FROM THE BEGINNING. >> THEY ALWAYS NEED A VACATION. [LAUGHTER] >> I GET IT. I'M SURE OF THAT. >> TAKE A BREAK. >> YES. >> I HAD TWO OTHER ONE QUESTION AND ONE COMMENT. FIRST, I WANTED TO COMMENT THAT I KNOW THIS IS C3, SO WE DON'T HAVE ANY SETBACKS, BUT I REALLY APPRECIATE HOW YOU LEFT A LITTLE BIT OF GRACE WITH THE ACCESSORY BUILDING ON THAT ONE SIDE AND EVEN WITH THE BOX SOFFIT. WE DON'T HAVE ANYTHING OVERHANG OR EVEN COMING UP TO THE PROPERTY LINE. UNTIL THERE WON'T BE ANY DISPUTES IN THE FUTURE AND THAT WAS REALLY NICE TO HAVE THAT LITTLE BIT OF SPACE THERE. >> THANK YOU. >> THEN, DO I SEE HVAC ON HERE SOMEPLACE,. >> IT'S IN THE STORAGE CLOSET. >> WELL, THE INTERNAL. >> THE EXTERIOR COMPRESSOR. DO WE HAVE A COMPRESSOR SOMEPLACE? >> IT IS NOT NOTED RIGHT NOW, BUT IT'LL BE PROBABLY ON THE DRIVEWAY SIDE OF THE BUILDING, BECAUSE WE DON'T WANT TO BACK AT THE POOL AREA. I KNOW WE HAVE TO BE THE MAGIC FIVE FEET AWAY FROM THE PROPERTY LINES, WHICH IS, AS YOU KNOW, ALMOST AN IMPOSSIBILITY IN THE C3 ZONING, WHEN YOU HAVE ZERO SETBACKS, AND WE DON'T LIKE UNITS ON THE ROOF WHEN IT'S A SLOPED ROOF. >> DID POOL EQUIPMENT GO OVER THERE WITH THE C3? >> YES. >> IT'LL BE ON THE NORTH SIDE. >> THE FLOATING FLAMINGO. [LAUGHTER] ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? >> JUST TO COMMENT. I THINK IT'S A REALLY NICE DESIGN. I THINK IT'S APPROPRIATELY SCALED FOR THE PROPERTY. IT DOESN'T BOTHER ME THAT THE GARAGE IS BIGGER BECAUSE I THINK IT IS GOING TO SIT REALLY NICELY UNDERNEATH THAT TREE. I THINK IT WORKS WELL. >> THANK YOU. I AM SAD ABOUT THE FLOWERS, BUT OTHER THAN THAT, I THINK IT WORKS WELL. [LAUGHTER] >> GET TO HEAR THAT A LOT. >> YEAH. [LAUGHTER] >> ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? THANK YOU, SIR. I'M GOING TO OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING. ANYONE WANT TO COMMENT ON THIS CASE OR ASK QUESTIONS? DO WE NEED ANY FURTHER BOARD DISCUSSION, OR DO WE HAVE A MOTION? >> I'LL MAKE A MOTION. I MOVE TO APPROVE CASE NUMBER HDC 2025-0012 WITHOUT CONDITIONS. I MOVE THAT THE HDC MAKE THE FOLLOWING FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW PART OF THE RECORD, THAT CASE HDC 2025-0012 AS PRESENTED IS SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANT WITH THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE, THE SECRETARY OF INTERIOR STANDARDS, AND THE OLD TOWN FERNANDINA PRESERVATION AND DEVELOPMENT GUIDELINES TO WARRANT FINAL APPROVAL AT THIS TIME. >> IT'S NOT OLD TOWN. >> WE'LL STRIKE OUT THE PART ABOUT OLD TOWN. >> I SECOND. >> WITH THAT AMENDMENT? >> YES, WITH THE AMENDMENT. NOT IN OLD TOWN. >> VERY GOOD. >> WOULD LOOK GREAT IN OLD TOWN ON THE SCALE. [LAUGHTER] >> IF THERE'S NO FURTHER DISCUSSION, COULD YOU CALL THE ROLL PLEASE? >> MEMBER KOSACK? >> YES. >> MEMBER PSULKOWSKI. >> YES. >> MEMBER BYRNES? >> YES. >> VICE CHAIR POZZETTA? >> YES. >> CHAIR FILKOFF? >> YES. >> WE ARE NOW AT HDC CASE 2025-0013. [5.2 HDC2025-0013 - MCG HOMES AGENT FOR CHARLES AND ELIZABETH RICE, 30 N. 6TH STREET FINAL Certificate of Approval (COA) to remove portion of existing rear wall and install 3 new French doors, to construct new brick steps to rear, to construct under roofed addition to kitchen area at the N.E. facade of residence. (Quasi-Judicial)] LET ME JUST SAY THANK YOU FOR MAKING SUCH FINE CONTRIBUTIONS TO OUR HISTORIC DISTRICT. MCG HOMES AGENT FOR CHARLES AND ELIZABETH RICE 30 NORTH SIXTH STREET. COULD WE READ YOUR REPORT PLEASE. >> THE APPLICANT AT 30 NORTH 6TH STREET IS REQUESTING FINAL APPROVAL TO RENOVATE THE KITCHEN TO FEATURE THREE FRENCH DOORS LEADING TO THE BACKYARD, CREATE A BRICK LANDING AND ENCLOSE A SMALL SIDE PORCH ON THE NORTHEAST SIDE OF THE PROPERTY. MEMBER POZZETTA AND I VISITED THE PROPERTY DURING THE PRE-APPLICATION MEETING [00:20:04] TO SEE IF THE KITCHEN WAS A MODERN ADDITION, AND WE WERE ABLE TO CONFIRM THAT IT WAS BASED ON A PIECE OF TRIM THAT DIFFERENTIATED THE ORIGINAL STRUCTURE FROM THE ADDITION, AS WELL AS THERE WAS A DIFFERENT REVEAL IN THE LAP SIDING FROM THE ORIGINAL STRUCTURE ONTO THE ADDITION. IT IS OUR BEST INFERENCE THAT IT IS AN ADDITION AND RENOVATION OF THIS AREA OF THE HOUSE IS PERMISSIBLE. ON THIS SLIDE, I HAVE THE EXISTING ELEVATION ON THE LEFT, AND ON THE RIGHT IS THE PROPOSED RENOVATION. THIS SLIDE I CLIPPED THE PROPOSED DOORS AND A SITE PLAN FOR THE EXIT AND THE BRICK LANDING. STAFF IS RECOMMENDING FINAL APPROVAL AT THIS TIME. >> IT'S VERY GOOD. THANK YOU. >> WELCOME. >> IS THE APPLICANT HERE? >> I'M STEPHANIE LAGOS, MCG HOMES, 1750 SOUTH 14TH STREET. >> THANK YOU. >> WE'RE PROPOSING TO HAVE THESE THREE FRENCH DOORS. WE WILL BE USING ANDERSEN 400 SERIES TO MEET THE COLONIAL STYLE. THEY ARE A 60-INCH WIDE DOORS BY 80. I ALSO HAVE SOME OF THE PICTURES FROM THE PORCH NOTICING THAT THE PART THAT WE WANT TO ENCLOSE IT WAS A ADDITION TO THE ORIGINAL HOUSE. IF IT'S OKAY CAN I PASS THESE PICTURES? >> SURE. THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU. >> THANKS. VERY COOL. >> WOW. >> WOW. THAT'S GOOD. >> THE PART THAT WE ARE PROPOSING IT'S, AS YOU CAN SEE, IN THE TWO FIRST PICTURES. THAT PART OF WHERE THE DOOR CURRENTLY IS, IT WAS CONNECTED TO THE OLD HOUSE WITH A TRIM MOLDING. THAT'S WHAT WE'RE PLANNING TO DO FOR THE NEW ADDITION ENCLOSING THAT PART. WE ARE ALSO PLANNING TO REUSE THE MATERIAL FOR THE DOOR OPENING, SO WE WILL USE THE SAME SIDING, SO IT WILL BE CONTINUOUS. WHERE THE OLD STRUCTURE MEETS THE NEW STRUCTURES, WE WILL DO THE SAME MOLDING AS THEY DID IN THIS ADDITION ON THIS SIDE. >> ANY QUESTIONS? >> I HAVE A QUESTION FOR YOU. I'M CURIOUS. THESE PICTURES ARE GREAT. I THINK YOUR PRESENTATION IS VERY THOROUGH. THANK YOU FOR ALL THE PHOTOS IF YOU WERE THE ONE THAT WAS INVOLVED WITH THAT. THANK YOU FOR THAT. THESE REALLY OLD PHOTOS ARE FASCINATING. THIS MIGHT BE FOR ELIZABETH AND DREW, BUT WHERE THIS OLD ROOF LINE CAME DOWN, AND THERE WAS A LITTLE WINDOW ABOVE WHAT USED TO BE THE PORCH. IS THAT SPACE ACCESSIBLE UP THERE? IS THAT WINDOW TUCKED BEHIND? >> [INAUDIBLE] CLOSET AND THERE'S NO WINDOW UP THERE NOW. >> THANK YOU. >> ANY OTHER QUESTIONS, COMMENTS? >> THAT WINDOW THAT'S GETTING DEMOED ON THE BACK OF THE HOUSE, IS THAT PART OF THIS ADDITION TO THE HOUSE? IS THAT A HISTORIC WINDOW OR IS THAT, BECAUSE IT LOOKS LIKE IT'S ON THE BUILDING ORIGINALLY, BUT THAT DOESN'T TELL ME IF THE WINDOW IS ORIGINAL. >> THE WHOLE KITCHEN [INAUDIBLE]. >> WITH THAT WINDOW? >> NONE OF THE WINDOWS IN THE KITCHEN ARE CURRENTLY HISTORIC. >> ANYTHING ELSE? >> COUPLE MORE THINGS. I DIDN'T SEE A DETAIL ABOUT WHAT KIND OF BRICK YOU GUYS WERE PLANNING ON USING. >> WE DID AN ADDITION AT THE FRONT OF THE HOUSE FOR THE SAME LANDING AND WE'RE REUSING THE SAME MATERIALS. I THINK THAT THEY WERE PART OF THE EXISTING GARAGE THAT PATIO THAT IT WAS THERE. IT IS EXISTING BRICK FROM THE HOUSE THAT WE'RE GOING TO REUSE. >> THAT'S AWESOME. >> ANYTHING ELSE? THANK YOU VERY MUCH. >> THANK YOU SO MUCH. >> IN THE PUBLIC HEARING, DOES ANYONE WANT TO SPEAK TO THIS CASE? OH, HALLELUJAH. WE'RE GETTING THERE. [LAUGHTER] I'M GOING TO CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING. ANY BOARD DISCUSSION? >> I'D LIKE TO THANK JIM FOR GOING OVER AND DO IT BECAUSE WHENEVER WE SEE A CHANGE IN FENESTRATION OR OPENINGS, WE ALWAYS GET A LITTLE BIT NERVOUS ABOUT WHAT'S HAPPENING AND THE AGE OF IT. [00:25:05] THAT WAS REALLY HELPFUL TO SEE THAT. MIA, THANK YOU FOR REACHING OUT AND TAKING THAT TIME TO EXPLORE WHAT THIS ADDITION IN THIS PART OF THE STRUCTURE IS VERY HELPFUL. >> LUCKILY, THERE WAS ENOUGH INFORMATION ON THE SIDE OF THE HOUSE AND THE FOUNDATION THAT YOU COULD SEE TO INDICATE THAT THIS IS SOMETHING THAT CAME AFTER THE FACT. >> EVEN THAT LITTLE LANDING STAIR THAT'S THERE NOW, IT'S OKAY. IT'S GOING TO REALLY FINISH OFF THE BACK OF THE HOUSE NICELY. THE NEW EAST ELEVATION, IT'S APPROPRIATE, SO IT'S GOOD. >> IT UNIFIES THAT ELEVATION BEFORE. >> GREAT. LOOKS VERY NICE. DO I HAVE A MOTION? >> SURE, I'LL MAKE A MOTION. I MOVE TO APPROVE HDC CASE NUMBER HDC 2025-0013 WITHOUT CONDITIONS. I MOVE THAT THE HDC MAKE THE FOLLOWING FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW PART OF THE RECORD, THAT CASE 2025-0013 AS PRESENTED IS SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANT WITH A COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE, AND THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT DESIGN GUIDELINES TO WARRANT FINAL APPROVAL AT THIS TIME. >> SECOND. >> I HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND. COULD YOU PLEASE CALL THE ROLL. >> MEMBER KOSACK? >> YES. >> MEMBER PSULKOWSKI? >> YES. >> MEMBER BYRNES? >> YES. >> VICE CHAIR POZZETTA? >> YES. >> CHAIR FILKOFF? >> YES. CONGRATULATIONS. NOW WE'RE GOING TO HDC 2025-00014. [5.3 *HDC2025-0014 - MK DESIGN GROUP, AGENT FOR SCOTT MICHAEL & LISA DONOVAN, 908 LADIES STREET FINAL Certificate of Approval (COA) to construct a single-family residence with a detached accessory structure. (Quasi-Judicial). VIRTUAL ATTENDANCE OF AGENT AT HEARING] COULD WE HAVE THE STAFF REPORT, PLEASE? >> OUR FINAL CASE FOR THE EVENING, HDC 2025-0014. THE APPLICANT IS AT 908 LADIES STREET IN OLD TOWN. SEEKING FINAL APPROVAL TO CONSTRUCT A SINGLE FAMILY HOME WITH AN ACCESSORY STRUCTURE. THIS SLIDE SHOWS THE PROPOSED ELEVATIONS AND SITE PLAN, WHICH ALL MEET THE SITE DESIGN REQUIREMENTS SET OUT BY THE OLD TOWN PRESERVATION GUIDELINES. THEN HERE ARE THE ELEVATIONS OF THE OUTBUILDING, OR IT IS SOMETIMES REFERRED TO THE POOL HOUSE IN PLANS. STAFF RECOMMENDS FINAL APPROVAL AT THIS TIME. >> IS IT A PLUNGE POOL? >> IT IS. >> IT SAYS IT'S A COCKTAIL POOL. >> COCKTAIL POOL. >> THIS ONE SAYS COCKTAIL POOL. [LAUGHTER]. >> IS THAT SHALLOWER THAN A PLUNGE? [LAUGHTER] >> I DON'T KNOW WHERE I'VE BEEN. I'VE LOST TOUCH WITH ALL THESE TYPES OF POOLS. >> THERE'S NEW TYPES OF POOLS. >> COULD WE HAVE THE APPLICANT COME FORWARD, PLEASE? >> MY NAME IS LISA DONOVAN. [OVERLAPPING] OUR ARCHITECT IS ONLINE. >> WE HAVE ALL THESE PEOPLE ONLINE. [LAUGHTER] >> THEY SHOULD LOAD UP. THERE SHE IS. >> HI. WELCOME TO THE PARTY. >> THE PARTY POOL. >> WE APPRECIATE YOU OFFERING ZOOM. IT'S JUST SO HELPFUL. >> GOOD. WHAT CAN YOU TELL US ABOUT THIS PROJECT? >> WELL, I BELIEVE THAT SCOTT AND LISA ARE THERE TOO, BUT WE SET OUT THIS IS ON A SINGLE PEONIA, AND WE SET OUT TO REALLY DESIGN A RELATIVELY SMALL FOOTPRINT COTTAGE WITH A WRAPPING PORCH, 1.5 STORIES THAT FELT LIKE IT HAS REALLY SETTLED INTO OLD TOWN. IT TAKES A LOT OF ARCHITECTURAL CUES FROM SURROUNDING OLD TOWN AND ALSO THE DOWNTOWN AREA. THEN THERE IS A POOL HOUSE IN THE BACK WITH AN ATTACHED WORKSHOP AND CARPORT THAT ENCLOSE A FAIRLY SMALL COURTYARD IN BETWEEN THE MAIN HOUSE AND THE OUT BUILDING, WHICH HAS THAT SMALL COCKTAIL POOL. REALLY THE IDEA AND NATHAN CAN SPEAK TO THIS TOO, IS THAT THEY WANTED TO LIVE ALL THE WAY AROUND THE HOUSE. YOU CAN SEE EGAN'S CREEK FROM THE FRONT PORCH, GET THOSE BREEZES, HAVE A GREAT PORCH ON THE SIDE, AND THEN A NICE GREEN PORCH IN THE BACK THAT REALLY DIRECTLY TIES INTO ALSO THE POOL HOUSE. YOU COULD OPEN UP THE POOL HOUSE DOOR AND HAVE THIS TEAM WITH OUTDOOR, INDOOR SPACE. THEY REALLY WERE FOCUSED ON MAINTAINING SOME OF THE HISTORIC DETAILS, PARTICULARLY WITH THE WINDOWS AND THE DOORS AND MAKING SURE THEY LOOKED VERY TRADITIONAL AND FIT INTO OLD TOWN. >> ANY QUESTIONS FOR THE APPLICANT? >> A QUESTION OR MAYBE PERHAPS IT'S A COMMENT. THE LADIES STREET ELEVATION, SO I GUESS THE FRONT ELEVATION, I KNOW WE CAN'T REALLY TECHNICALLY COMMENT ON SCALE AND MASSING. [00:30:01] I THINK THE DESIGN IS VERY GOOD, AND IT WORKS WELL. THE ONLY THING THAT BOTHERS ME IS THE SECOND FLOOR, THE DORMER, AND LOOKING AT THIS VIEW ON THE LEFT HAND SIDE, I DON'T KNOW WHAT STREET THAT IS ACTUALLY ON. IT LOOKS OVER SCALED OR TOO BIG FOR THAT FRONT ELEVATION. IF IT JUST DIDN'T PROJECT OUT FURTHER THAN THE REST OF THE BUILDING, IF THERE'S SOMETHING THAT COULD BE DONE TO MAKE IT SMALLER, I REALIZE IT'S A SMALL HOUSE AS IT IS. REDUCING THE SQUARE FOOTAGE MIGHT HURT, BUT IT DOESN'T FEEL SCALED APPROPRIATELY. >> ANY OTHER COMMENTS? >> IS IT POSSIBLE TO COMMENT ON THAT? >> ABSOLUTELY. >> A COUPLE OF REASONS. WE ACTUALLY STUDIED FROM PRECEDENCE IN THE DOWNTOWN OF FERNANDINA AND LOOKED AT THIS AND, I DON'T KNOW IF I COULD GET INTO THE CUFF, TO LOOK AT THE PROPORTIONS OF THAT. THAT'S SIMILAR TO OTHER HOUSES IN THAT AREA. BUT ALSO WE REALLY PAID A LOT OF ATTENTION. I CAN'T REALLY SEE WHAT YOU ARE SEEING, BUT IF YOU ZOOM INTO THAT FRONT ELEVATION, YOU'LL NOTICE THAT THE ROOF ON THE LEFT SIDE OF THE PORCH. I'M LOOKING AT IT ON MY COMPUTER SCREEN. THAT'S WHY I'M NOT LOOKING AT YOU, BUT THE ROOF ON THE LEFT SIDE OF THE PORCH COMES IN PRECISELY AT THE CORNER OF THAT DORMER. WE DID THAT SO THAT IT WOULD BE A VERY SIMPLE ROOF FORM THERE. IT DIDN'T FEEL OVERLY COMPLEX WITH THE DORMER. THOSE ARE THE TWO REASONS, WE PULLED FROM PRECEDENT AND WE WERE VERY CONSCIOUS OF THAT THAT DORMER IS THE SIZE AND PROPORTION THAT IT IS. >> ANY OTHER COMMENTS, RESPONSE? >> I HEAR WHAT YOU'RE SAYING. IT FEELS LIKE IT'S OVERSCALED. IT JUST FEELS LIKE IT'S TOO BIG THERE. I REALIZED THAT WE TECHNICALLY CAN'T COMMENT ON ANYTHING REALLY OTHER THAN THE SITE DESIGN, THE PEONY LINES. I WOULD JUST ASK YOU TO LOOK AT THAT AND SEE IF THERE'S ANY WAY YOU CAN PULL IT IN A LITTLE BIT. >> ARE THERE OTHER COMMENTS? DOES ANYONE HAVE OTHER COMMENTS TO MAKE ABOUT THIS? >> I HAVE A LITTLE ONE FOR BOARD DISCUSSION. IT DOESN'T REALLY INVOLVE THAT DESIGN. >> THIS MIGHT BE FOR LAUREN THOUGH. LET ME BACK UP. THIS MIGHT HELP VERONICA'S CONCERN. LAUREN, THANK YOU FOR YOUR DESIGN BY THE WAY. I ALWAYS ENJOY LOOKING AT YOUR DESIGNS BECAUSE THEY'RE SO DETAILED. IT'S SHOWING A 37-INCH OAK THAT IS REMAINING. IF I'M LOOKING AT THIS PROPERLY, FROM THE LADIES STREET ELEVATION, THAT OAK SHOULD BE ON THAT LEFT SIDE, AND WILL SOME OF THAT CANOPY HELP DISGUISE SOME OF THE OVERSIZED DORMER APPEARANCE THAT VERONICA HAD CONCERNS ABOUT? >> IT MAY. THAT'S SOMETHING THAT DEFINITELY WE LOOKED AT THAT. MAYBE DONOVAN THERE CAN SPEAK TO THAT A LITTLE BIT. BUT IT'S DEPENDING ON HOW MUCH OF THAT CANOPY COMES IN FRONT. THAT IS A GOOD POINT. >> I THINK THAT WOULD HELP IF THAT TREE STAYS IN PLACE. >> COULD YOU COME UP, PLEASE. [LAUGHTER] >> STATE YOUR NAME. >> LISA DONOVAN. WITH REGARD TO THE OAK TREE, THAT WAS AN IMPORTANT ELEMENT FOR US IS TO KEEP THAT OAK TREE. WE CAME FROM A HISTORIC DISTRICT IN CHARLOTTE AND WHERE THE TREE CANOPY IS VERY IMPORTANT. WE ACTUALLY THAT LOT SO THAT WE COULD MAINTAIN THAT TREE. WE WILL BE DEADWOODING AND MAYBE HAVE TO TAKE UP SOME OF THOSE BOTTOM BRANCHES. BUT THE DESIGN WAS INTENTIONAL SO THAT WE CAN KEEP THAT TREE. I DO THINK WITH THE POSITION OF THAT TREE, THAT IT SHOULD OVERHANG A LITTLE BIT OF THAT HOUSE OR AT LEAST OUR HOPE WOULD BE THAT IT IS AN INTEGRAL PART OF THE DESIGN OF THE HOUSE. I THINK IT'S GOING TO BE INCORPORATING THAT TREE IN THAT AREA. JUST TO BE CLEAR [OVERLAPPING]. [00:35:02] >> SORRY, GO AHEAD. >> I WAS JUST GOING TO SAY THE AREA WHERE THAT DORMER IS IS NOT LIVING SPACE, IT'S STAIRWAY SPACE. >> YEAH, I SAW THAT. >> I JUST WANT TO BE CLEAR ON THAT. >> VERY GOOD. THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU. >> ARE WE GOOD? >> WE'RE GOOD. >> WE'RE GOOD. NO FURTHER DISCUSSION? OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING. WOULD ANYBODY LIKE TO COMMENT ON THIS CASE OR ASK QUESTIONS ABOUT IT? >> NO? [NOISE] CLOSE PUBLIC HEARING. >> THE BOARD DISCUSSION BIT I WANT TO TALK ABOUT WAS THE THING I HAD MET WITH MIA ON THIS PARTICULAR PROJECT WAS THE LDC HAS SOME CREATIVE VERBIAGE ABOUT THE HEIGHT ALLOWED FOR ACCESSORY BUILDINGS. IT'S A LITTLE UNCLEAR ON HOW IT WOULD APPLY SPECIFICALLY TO THE LITTLE POOL HOUSE BUILDING. I THINK MIA ANSWERED ME TODAY THAT SHE BELIEVES THAT ONE THING SAYS YOU CAN HAVE WHAT? WAS IT 24, 25 FEET HIGH? ANOTHER ONE SAYS 16. ANYWAY, MY POINT IN BRINGING THIS UP IS THAT WE'VE TALKED ABOUT LOOKING AT OUR RULES AND STUFF AND TRYING TO COMB OUT SOME OF THIS WEIRD LANGUAGE THAT DOES IT WORK? I THINK THIS MIGHT BE A CANDIDATE FOR SOMETHING WE NEED TO GO IN AND WHAT IS IT TRYING TO TELL US? HOW CAN WE WORD IT TO ACTUALLY DRIVE HOME THE INTENT TO WHAT IT'S TRYING TO PUT THERE? RIGHT NOW, I DON'T KNOW THAT IT WORKS. >> WELL, IF YOU DON'T THINK IT WORKS, THEN I DON'T THINK IT'D WORK. >> BECAUSE LOOK HOW IT SAYS THE AREA OF OTHER OUT BUILDINGS IS LIMITED 350 SQUARE FEET AND MUST NOT EXCEED 16 FEET IN HEIGHT. THIS PARTICULAR POOL HOUSE STRUCTURE IS JUST OVER 19. BUT IF YOU READ THE FIRST PART, IT COULD FALL INTO EITHER ONE OF THOSE SECTIONS. MY POINT OF BRINGING THIS UP IS THAT ITEM H, WE NEED TO LOOK AT IT AND GET IT SO IT WORKS. >> THIS IS HOMEWORK FOR US, FYI? >> YEAH. >> ANY OTHER DISCUSSION? YOU HAD SOMETHING ELSE? >> WELL, I'M JUST CONCERNED ABOUT THAT, THOUGH. ARE WE NOT PRESCRIBED THAT IF THERE IS A CONFLICTING ORDINANCE, THAT WE'RE TO ABIDE BY THE MOST STRINGENT? >> APPARENTLY, AS I HEARD THE OTHER NIGHT, THERE'S BEEN A CASE RULING TO SAY THAT IF THERE'S A CONFLICT, YOU GO WITH THE PROPERTY OWNER. IN THAT CASE, IT HITS ALL THE OTHER POINTS. WE DON'T HAVE AN ISSUE WITH THAT. DID I GET THAT RIGHT, MIA? >> YEAH, BUT IN THIS CASE, THIS IS DESCRIBING PERMANENT TYPES OF OCCUPANCY. BASED ON THE DESIGN AND CONVERSATIONS WITH THE APPLICANT, I BELIEVE THIS IS A PERMANENT OCCUPANCY TYPE OF SPACE, EVEN IF THERE'S NOT A BEDROOM THERE. I THINK THAT WOULD FALL UNDER THAT 25 HEIGHT LIMIT. IT WAS TRICKY TO LOOK INTO THIS BECAUSE IN OUR OLD TOWN, PRESERVATION GUIDELINES, BOTH THE 2013 VERSION AND THE 2021 VERSION, DON'T MENTION THIS AT ALL. IT ONLY SAYS 25 FEET PERIOD. >> YOU'RE COMFORTABLE WITH IT BEING PART OF THIS AS AN APPROVED PROJECT? >> THE FACT THAT IT IS ALSO UNDERNEATH OR LESS THAN 350 SQUARE FEET? >> ANYTHING ELSE? DO WE HAVE A MOTION? >> I'LL MAKE A MOTION ONCE I GET THERE. MAKE SURE IT SAYS. [LAUGHTER] >> IT DOES. >> I MOVE TO APPROVE CASE NUMBER HDC 2025-0014 WITHOUT CONDITIONS, AND I MOVE THAT HDC MAKE THE FOLLOWING FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW PART OF THE RECORD, THAT HDC CASE HDC 2025-0014 AS PRESENTED IS SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANT WITH THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE, THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR STANDARDS AND THE OLD TOWN FERNANDINA PRESERVATION AND DEVELOPMENT GUIDELINES TO WARRANT FINAL APPROVAL AT THIS TIME. >> SECOND. >> MOTION AND A SECOND. >> CAN YOU CALL THE VOTE, PLEASE? >> MEMBER KOSACK? >> YES. >> MEMBER PSULKOWSKI? >> YES. >> MEMBER BYRNES? >> YES. >> VICE CHAIR POZZETTA? >> YES. >> CHAIR FILKOFF? >> YES. CONGRATULATIONS. LOOKS LIKE A REALLY COOL HOUSE. >> THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR YOUR WORK. >> YOU'RE WELCOME. THANK YOU. WE APPRECIATE IT. >> NOW WE'RE ON TO SCHEDULING TIME FOR DOWNTOWN DESIGN GUIDELINES. [6. BOARD BUSINESS] [00:40:07] [LAUGHTER] I'M GOING TO TELL YOU ALL WHAT I SUGGESTED TO MIA. BUT FIRST, I'M GOING TO SAY TO MIA, YOU HAD TIME TO THINK ABOUT MY SUGGESTION. >> I DID. I LIKE YOUR SUGGESTION. >> WELL, UNLIKE SOMEONE. [LAUGHTER] >> I THINK IT'S GOING TO BE MORE PRODUCTIVE. >> THANK YOU GOD. >> I'LL LET YOU SHARE YOUR IDEA. >> HERE'S WHAT I SUGGESTED TO MIA ON THIS BECAUSE WE'RE NEVER GOING TO GET EVERYBODY TOGETHER FOR A WHOLE DAY, WHICH IS WHAT IT WOULD TAKE IF WE GOT INTO DISCUSSION ABOUT THIS STUFF. WE TEND TO TALK ABOUT IT. WHAT I SUGGESTED TO MIA, WAS THAT SHE TAKE TIME TO INTERVIEW EACH OF US WITH THOSE THINGS THAT WE FIND MOST HIGHEST PRIORITY IN THESE GUIDELINES THAT EITHER NEED TO CHANGE, BE FIXED, OR BE CODIFIED. NOW, I'M GOING TO ASK MIA TO TELL US SOMETHING IN A MINUTE, BUT I'VE SUGGESTED THAT WE DO THAT AS AN INTERVIEW SITUATION, WHICH MEANS THAT EACH OF US HAS TO COME HIGHLY PREPARED TO THAT INTERVIEW. WE HAVE TO GO THROUGH THAT DOCUMENT AND KNOW WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT. THINGS LIKE WE JUST SAW, WE PROBABLY NEED TO FIND THOSE TYPES OF THINGS TOO. THOSE ARE IN LDC LANGUAGE. >> THAT'S LDC LANGUAGE. >> YES. >> IF WE ARE IN AGREEMENT WITH THAT APPROACH, I THINK WE CAN FINALLY MAYBE GET THIS THING DONE BECAUSE WHAT I ASKED HER TO THINK ABOUT WAS TAKING THAT APPROACH AND THEN COMING BACK AND LET US DISCUSS ANYTHING THAT WE THINK IS RIGHT, WRONG OR INDIFFERENT. WITH THAT SAID, IT SEEMS TO BE APPROVED BY THIS GROUP. I WOULD JUST ASK YOU TO SCHEDULE THOSE MEETINGS. I WOULD LIKE TO SEE POSSIBLY GETTING THIS DONE BY THE END OF SEPTEMBER. DOES THAT WORK FOR EVERYBODY? >> I HAVE A QUESTION. >> DOESN'T IT JUST FIGURE? [LAUGHTER] >> JIM GOES FIRST WITH MIA OR VERONICA. >> I WAS GOING TO BE LAST. >> NO. >> HEAR WHAT EVERYBODY ELSE SAID. [LAUGHTER] >> THEY'RE GOING TO PUT VERY DETAILED ARCHITECTURAL EYES ON A LOT OF THE SPECIFICITY OF THINGS. THEN WHEN THE NEXT GROUP GOES, SHE'S ALLOWED TO DISCUSS WITH US WHAT THEY HAVE ALREADY BROUGHT? THIS ISN'T A CASE PER SE? >> NO. WE STILL HAVE OUR ATTORNEY ONLINE? >> YES. >> I AM STILL HERE, AND THE BIGGEST THING FOR INDIVIDUAL MEETINGS WITH EVEN YOUR STAFF LIAISON IS THAT THEY CANNOT SERVE AS A GO BETWEEN OR CONDUIT FOR COMMUNICATIONS BETWEEN TWO BOARD MEMBERS ON A MATTER THAT IS LIKELY TO COME BEFORE YOU FOR A VOTE. IF YOU'RE GOING TO BE MAKING A RECOMMENDATION ON THE DOWNTOWN DESIGN GUIDELINES ETC, THEN THOSE INDIVIDUAL MEETINGS CAN HAPPEN WITH STAFF SO THAT THEY CAN ESSENTIALLY DEVELOP A PRODUCTIVE AGENDA FOR YOU ALL TO COME TOGETHER AND TALK ABOUT, BUT STAFF WILL NOT BE ABLE TO TELL YOU SO AND SO GAVE ME THESE PRIORITIES OR THIS AND THIS, AS A GO BETWEEN. REALLY HAVE TO BE ABOUT, AS THE CHAIR MENTIONED, YOUR THOUGHTS OR YOUR PRIORITIES AND OBSERVATIONS IN THAT CONTEXT. >> THAT'S ACTUALLY WHAT I INTENDED. YES, MA'AM. IT WAS MEMBER KOSACK THAT THREW A MONKEY WRENCH IN BECAUSE I WAS FINE. >> BASICALLY, THIS PUTS US BACK ON MIA. EACH OF US IS GOING THROUGH THE ENTIRE SET OF GUIDELINES AND WE MEET WITH MIA AND GIVE HER OUR TWO CENTS, THREE CENTS, FIVE CENTS, AND THEN MIA HAS TO PARSE ALL OF THOSE DIFFERENT THINGS TOGETHER AND RECREATE A SET OF GUIDELINES TO THEN PRESENT TO US AS A WHOLE. AM I UNDERSTAND THAT? >> NOT NECESSARILY THINKING THAT SHE HAS TO DO ANYTHING OTHER THAN COMPILE EVERYTHING AND ONLY POINT OUT TO US WHERE THERE'S A DIFFERENCE OF OPINION. DOES THAT WORK? >> I THINK MY GUT FEELING IS WE'RE GOING TO BE IN THE SAME POSITION WE ARE NOW AFTER MIA INTERVIEWS ALL OF US, AND WE'RE STILL GOING TO END UP WANTING TO HAVE A CONVERSATION. [00:45:02] >> WHICH WE VERY WELL MIGHT. IF THAT'S THE CASE, THEN I THINK WE HAVE A WORKSHOP TO DO THAT. BUT AT LEAST WE HAVE A LOT OF THE LEG WORK AND GROUNDWORK DONE TO COME TO THE TABLE WITH SOMETHING RATHER THAN JUST BLUE SKY. >> I CAN COMPILE AN OVERVIEW NOTES DOCUMENT. NIKKI, WOULD IT BE OKAY IF I COMPILED NOTES FROM EACH OF THE INTERVIEWS AND THEN SHARED THOSE AT THE WORKSHOP AS PART OF THE PUBLIC RECORD? >> THOSE DISCUSSIONS IN THE PUBLIC MEETING ARE IN THE PUBLIC MEETING. THAT'S PUBLIC. BUT YOU'RE JUST TRYING TO GET THE INFORMATION TO COMPILE FROM WHAT I UNDERSTAND, WHAT WOULD BE MOST PRODUCTIVE TO DISCUSS AT THAT WORKSHOP. >> YES. THAT'S WHAT I'M TRYING TO GET AT SO THAT THERE'S SOME FOUNDATION FOR US TO WORK FROM AND THEN HAVE THE DISCUSSION, HAVE THE DEBATE, IF NEED BE ABOUT THE WHOLE THING THAT WAY. THANK YOU, NIKKI. WHAT I'M ASKING MIA TO DO THEN IS THAT FEASIBLE FOR YOU? NOW, I SAID THE END OF SEPTEMBER BECAUSE I'M GONE THE WHOLE MONTH OF AUGUST. I DON'T KNOW WHAT EVERYBODY ELSE'S SCHEDULES ARE. >> I'M GOING TO MISS NEXT MONTH TOO. >> I AM TOO. >> WE MIGHT, IN FACT, HAVE TO NOT MEET IN AUGUST BECAUSE WE WON'T HAVE A QUORUM. >> THAT CHANGES THINGS A LITTLE BIT FOR ME BECAUSE I ALREADY HAVE THE AGENDA. >> HOW MANY CASES ARE ON THAT AGENDA? >> FOUR. >> ARE THEY ALL NEW? >> CAN BOARD MEMBERS ZOOM IN? IS THAT POSSIBLE? >> CAN WE DO WHAT? >> CAN WE DO A ZOOM? >> A ZOOM? I DON'T THINK WE'RE ALLOWED TO ZOOM IN. WE'RE NOT ALLOWED. [LAUGHTER]. >> CAN YOU ZOOM FROM VENICE? >> IN NORWAY. [LAUGHTER]. >> WHAT PART OF AUGUST ARE YOU NOT BACK UNTIL SEPTEMBER? >> TOWARDS THE END. >> IF WE'RE ALL BACK THAT LAST WEEK IN AUGUST, MAYBE WE CAN MOVE THE MEETING. STILL HAVE AN AUGUST MEETING, BUT IT HAS TO BE A WEEK LATER. >> I DON'T KNOW BECAUSE WE GAVE NOTICE. WE MAILED OUT ALL THE NOTICES AND STUFF WITH THE DATE THAT WAS ALREADY SET. I DON'T KNOW. >> THAT YOU JUST HAVE TO LET THEM KNOW THEN. >> WE'RE NOT GOING TO HAVE A QUORUM. WE DON'T HAVE A QUORUM. >> WE COULD CANCEL, BUT I DON'T KNOW IF WE COULD JUST MOVE IT UNTIL A WEEK LATER. >> NIKKI, CAN WE JUST MOVE A MEETING THAT WAS SCHEDULED AND NOTICED FOR ONE DAY BY A WEEK? >> GET STAFF ONTO THAT PARTICULAR AGENDA AND THE NOTICES THAT HAVE GONE OUT FOR THAT AGENDA TO GIVE YOU AN OPINION ON THAT. THERE ARE WAYS TO MOVE AND RE ADVERTISE MEETING TIMES, BUT GENERALLY, YOU DO IT IN THE SAME MANNER THAT IT WAS ORIGINALLY GIVEN. >> THAT'S WHAT I'M SUGGESTING WE DO. >> JUST REAL QUICK, I CAN'T SPEAK TO OTHER AVAILABILITY OF CITY FACILITIES, ETC FOR SCHEDULING PURPOSES. >> SURE. >> THERE ARE WAYS THOUGH TO LEGALLY CHANGE. IF YOU PREVIOUSLY ADVERTISE THE MEETING FOR AUGUST, AND THEN YOU'RE CHANGING THE MEETING, SO LONG AS IT'S RE NOTICED IN THE ORIGINAL MANNER. THAT INCLUDES MAIL NOTICE. FOR EXAMPLE, APPLICANTS OR NEIGHBORING PROPERTY OWNERS, THEN THAT WOULD INCLUDE THAT AS WELL. >> I DON'T KNOW WHAT SCHEDULE WE USED TO MAKE THOSE NOTICES GO OUT. NOT THROWING SHAME. I DIDN'T HAVE A NOTIFICATION THAT WE HAD ANYTHING FOR AUGUST THAT HAD TO BE DONE IN AUGUST. I DON'T KNOW IF ANYBODY ELSE DID, BUT A TRIP TO VENICE HAS BEEN SCHEDULED FOR A WHILE. A TRIP TO NOVA SCOTIA HAS BEEN SCHEDULED FOR A WHILE. YOU'VE GOT ISSUES IN AUGUST, TOO. I WILL COME OVER HERE TOMORROW AND TALK WITH YOU ALL ABOUT WHAT WE CAN DO ABOUT THIS, BUT IT NEEDS TO BE AT LEAST MOVED. >> FIRST, ARE CHAMBERS AVAILABLE ON THE 28TH? SHOULD WE WORK BACKWARDS? >> WELL, THAT'S WHAT WE NEED TO FIND OUT. IF YOU CAN FIND OUT THAT INFORMATION FOR US BY TOMORROW, THEN I'LL COME MEET WITH YOU MIA TOMORROW AND SEE WHAT WE CAN DO, WHAT OUR OPTIONS ARE. >> I WOULD HATE TO CANCEL THE AUGUST MEETING, [00:50:03] BUT I DO HAVE A WEDDING THAT I NEED TO BE IN ATLANTA FOR THAT WEEKEND OF AUGUST, SO I WAS GOING TO TRY TO SLIP OUT OF HERE. BUT THAT'S NOT THE MAIN ISSUE. >> ON THE 28TH? >> YEAH. >> IT'S OKAY. >> I CAN WORK AROUND THAT. WE'LL SEE. >> LET'S TALK ABOUT IT MORE IN THE MEETING. YOU'RE GOING TO SCHEDULE? >> NOW WE'RE ALL SCHEDULED IN SEPTEMBER TO MEET WITH HER. >> I KNOW. WE'RE ALL GOING TO HAVE TO MEET WITH YOU IN SEPTEMBER TO GET THIS DONE. I DON'T WANT TO PUSH THIS THAT FAST IF IT'S GOING TO CAUSE STRESS AND AGGRAVATION ON EVERYBODY. IF WE SAY THE END OF OCTOBER, IS THAT A BETTER PLAN? >> ARE YOU SAYING THAT A DEADLINE FOR INTERVIEWS TO BE COMPLETED? >> YES, AND COME BACK FOR A WORKSHOP. >> I THINK THE END OF SEPTEMBER IS FINE BECAUSE I CAN ALSO MEET WITH THOSE WHO ARE AVAILABLE IN AUGUST. >> JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE YOU DON'T GET STRESSED. GOT YOU. >> BUT I THINK THE EARLIER WE CAN BLACK OUT A DAY FOR A WORKSHOP, JUST USE IT TO PLAN IT. >> WE'RE GOOD THEN. IS THAT GOOD WITH YOU, MIA? MIA, COULD YOU TELL US WHAT YOU LEARNED THIS MORNING IN THAT DESIGN GUIDELINES CLASS THAT YOU ATTENDED? >> IT WAS DEVELOPING INTENTIONAL ARCHITECTURAL DESIGN GUIDELINES. FIRST OF ALL, WE GOT MANY COMPLIMENTS FROM EVERYONE AT THE CONFERENCE ABOUT OUR CITY, AND EVERYONE LOVES FERNANDINA, AND ALL THE PRESERVATIONISTS HAD ALL GOOD THINGS TO SAY. SOME OF WHAT I LEARNED IS FROM OTHER TOWNS IN FLORIDA, THERE'S A LOT OF DEVELOPMENT PRESSURE, OBVIOUSLY. WHEN THINGS ARE NOT BOUND BY DESIGN GUIDELINES, WE GET A LOT OF JUST ANY TOWN USA, SUBURBAN DEVELOPMENT. I KNOW THAT IN OUR COMMUNITY IS A BIG FEAR, AND OUR EARS ARE PERKED UP TO THAT. BUT I ASKED THE SPEAKER AT THE VERY END ABOUT WORDS LIKE SHOULD OR RECOMMENDED AND THESE WISHY WASHY WORDS. HE SAID TO STRIKE THOSE AND PUT SHALL AND MUST. THEN I ASKED HIM HIS PERSPECTIVE ON CODIFYING DESIGN GUIDELINES. I KNOW WE'VE TALKED ABOUT CHERRY PICKING, WHAT WE THINK SHOULD BE INCORPORATED INTO THE LDC FROM THE DESIGN GUIDELINES, AND I KNOW THERE'S A LOT OF PASSION IN THAT ROOM AND A LOT OF EXPERTISE. THEY SAID, CODIFY THE WHOLE THING. >> THEY DID SAY THAT? >> YES. BUT THEY ARE I DON'T WANT TO SAY RADICAL PRESERVATIONIST, BUT THEY'RE VERY GUNG HO ABOUT IT. THEY SAID THAT IT'S HARDER TO DO, BECAUSE YOUR COMMISSION HAS TO AGREE TO CODIFY IT. >> IT WOULD MAKE THINGS CLEARER FOR ME GOING FORWARD. I JUST DON'T KNOW HOW THE COMMISSION WOULD REACT, AS WELL AS WE HAVE ALL THESE QUESTIONS ABOUT OUR DESIGN GUIDELINES NOW. THERE'S DISCREPANCIES BETWEEN THE LDC AND OUR DESIGN GUIDELINES PRESENTLY THAT WE HAVEN'T WORKED THROUGH. I'D BE VERY WARY TO CODIFY THEM SOON. BUT IF WE GET ALL THOSE HAMMERED OUT, I'M SURE THAT'S THE WAY TO REALLY. >> DID THEY HAVE AN EXAMPLE OF OTHER CITIES THAT HAVE I THOUGHT I READ THAT THEY HAD TWO DIFFERENT CITIES THAT THEY WERE PRESENTING WITH MAYBE MARIANNA. WAS THAT THAT WORKSHOP? DID THEY HAVE AN EXAMPLE OF SOMEBODY THAT DID NEW GUIDELINES? >> MARIANNA CAME UP. I FORGOT WHAT SESSION THAT WAS IN. IT'S BEEN A LONG WEEK AT PALMS. >> WELL, MARIANNA IS ONE OF THOSE TOWNS THAT WAS REALLY DAMAGED GREATLY BY A HURRICANE A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO. I KNOW THAT WHEN I WAS INVOLVED IN THE MAIN STREET PROGRAM, THERE WAS DISCUSSION ABOUT ENSURING THAT YOU HAD A CURRENT INVENTORY OF YOUR HISTORIC RESOURCES, WHICH I WANT TO ASK ABOUT TOO BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T HAVE ONE SO I'M WONDERING IF THEY HAVE DEVELOPED GUIDELINES NOW. FROM HERE FORWARD, THIS IS THE WAY IT'S GOING TO BE BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T HAVE THE INVENTORY TO HELP PEOPLE FIGURE OUT HOW TO REPLACE HOW TO RESTORE. >> I ASKED A COUPLE OF PEOPLE ABOUT CODIFIED DESIGN GUIDELINES AND ADOPTING THINGS BY REFERENCE, AND PEOPLE HAVE SAID THAT THERE'S TOWNS THAT DO DO IT, AND NO ONE HAS GAVE ME AN EXACT EXAMPLE THAT I CAN GO LOOK UP AND CHECK OUT. >> DID YOU GET THE CONTACT INFORMATION FOR THE GENTLEMAN THAT RAN THE CLASS? I HOPE, HE COULD GIVE US THAT INFORMATION. >> I THINK ONE LET ME SAY LOCAL MISCONCEPTION IS, IN MY OPINION, WE DON'T HAVE DESIGN GUIDELINES. [00:55:04] WE HAVE SOME GUIDELINES THAT MAKE SUGGESTIONS, BUT WE DON'T HAVE ANYTHING THAT CALLS OUT, HEY, THIS IS THE STYLE THAT IS PERIOD APPROPRIATE FOR FERNANDINA BEACH. YOU'RE DRIVING FOR THAT IS THE EXPECTATION. A LOT OF PEOPLE HAVE THIS IDEA THAT YOU WOULDN'T BE ABLE TO COME IN IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT AND BUILD ON AN EMPTY LOT, A GLASS BOX. BUT THERE REALLY ISN'T ANYTHING IN OUR GUIDELINES THAT SAYS, NO, YOU CAN'T, AS LONG AS YOU MEET THE SETBACKS AND THE HEIGHT REQUIREMENTS AND THE BASIC NUTS AND BOLTS TYPES OF THINGS, THERE'S NOTHING IN OUR GUIDELINES AND IT'S TRUE. >> IT'S TRUE. >> WELL, WHAT ABOUT MATERIALS, THOUGH, AND APPROPRIATENESS? WE HAVE THOSE DISCUSSIONS ALL THE TIME. >> THEY'RE JUST GUIDELINES THOUGH. >> THE ARGUMENT COULD BE THAT, HEY, MY GLASS BOX REFLECTS ALL THE MATERIALS AND ALL THE SURROUNDING CONTEXTS PERFECTLY. >> WELL, THAT CERTAINLY SOUNDS LIKE A GAP THAT WE NEED TO ADDRESS. >> I DON'T KNOW THAT WE CAN. CERTAINLY ON ACTUAL CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE, WE'VE GOT LANGUAGE IN THERE THAT REALLY HELPS US DRIVE HOME AT THINGS ON. BUT FOR A BRAND NEW HOUSE. >> WELL, THEN WE NEED TO MAKE THAT PART OF WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT WHEN WE REVIEW THESE FOR OUR INTERVIEW. DID YOU LEARN ANYTHING ELSE BESIDES HOW HOT IT IS OUTSIDE WHILE YOU WERE AT FLORIDA? >> IT WAS REALLY HOT. I WENT TO SOME SESSIONS TODAY, I WENT TO THE DESIGNING INTENTIONAL ARCHITECTURAL DESIGN GUIDELINES AND ZONING AND LAND USE EFFECTS ON PRESERVATION, WHICH HAD SOME REALLY INTERESTING CASE STUDIES FROM CITY OF JACKSONVILLE THERE'S FIVE NEIGHBORHOODS THAT ENIS DISCUSSED IT WAS LIKE SPRINGFIELD AND EAST SIDE AND DURKEEVILLE, AND BROOKLYN HE JUST TALKED ABOUT HOW WORKING WITH THE COMMUNITY AND HAVING THOSE DESIGN GUIDELINES AND THAT SPECIFICALLY RELATIONSHIPS WITH DEVELOPERS HELPS PRESERVE NEIGHBORHOODS AND COMMUNITIES. HE ALSO DISCUSSED SOME MORE MODERN ARCHITECTURAL STYLES THAT EMULATE CERTAIN THINGS, WHETHER IT BE LIKE DENSITY OR SCALING AND MASSING OF BUILDINGS SO IT WAS REALLY INTERESTING. I'VE BEEN LEARNING A LOT, WALKING AROUND A LOT. >> VERY GOOD. >> THEN THIS AFTERNOON, I WENT TO THE MASONRY AND PAINT WORKSHOP WITH AUSTIN HISTORICAL AND DID SOME. >> SHE GETS EXCITED ABOUT THE STRANGEST THINGS. >> YES. NOW I GOT THE HISTORIC WINDOW WORKSHOP UNDER [INAUDIBLE] AND NOW MASONRY AND PAINTING SO IT'LL BE COOL TO APPLY THAT IN MY WORK, AND LIKE WHEN ME AND MEMBER KOSACK WENT TO CHECK OUT THE CHIMNEY, JUST UNDERSTANDING WHAT PORTLAND CEMENT IS AND WHAT LINE BASED CEMENT IS AND THE DIFFERENCE IN THAT CONSISTENCY. IT GIVES ME MORE CONFIDENCE TO CONVINCE PEOPLE TO RESTORE THEIR HOMES AND DO OTHER THINGS LIKE THAT. >> SHE MADE HER OWN PANEL THAT SHE GETS TO KEEP. >> WOW. >> I GOT TO DO A LITTLE MURDER ON BRICK VENEERS. I HAVE A LITTLE THING. >> TODAY, I HEARD YOU USE A WORD IN THE STAFF REPORT THAT I AM WILLING TO BET MONEY YOU HAD NEVER USED UNTIL YOU STARTED THIS JOB. >> WHICH ONE? >> YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT THE REVEAL. >> OH, YEAH. >> THE BIG REVEAL? >> YEAH, THE BIG ONE. I'M VERY PLEASED AND I'M SURE EVERYBODY HAS NOTICED THE PROGRESS THAT HAS BEEN MADE. >> ABSOLUTELY. >> THANK YOU FOR YOUR COMMITMENT AND YOUR ENERGY. >> MY PLEASURE. >> AND YOUR ATTITUDE. >> I DID WANT TO MENTION, I LIKE YOUR REPORTS DID A BETTER JOB OF DISPLAYING SOME OF THE PROJECTS THAN THE PROJECT PRESENTERS DID. BY PUTTING THE NEW RIGHT NEXT TO THE OLD, THEN THAT SHOULD BE JUST DONE PART FOR THE COURSE. >> I TRY TO JUST PICK OUT WHAT I THINK IS GOING TO BE BEST A EXPLAINING THE PROJECT FOR THE PRESENTATIONS. YOU GUYS HAVE ALL THE MATERIALS YOU NEED ANYWAYS. >> THANK YOU FOR THAT. YOU'RE PRETTY COOL. ANY COMMENTS ABOUT THE STAFF CERTIFICATES OF APPROVAL? [7. STAFF REPORT] >> JUST A QUESTION OR TWO ON THE, I THINK THERE'S TWO PERMITS FOR THE BLUE HERON. >> THAT WAS MY COMMENT. >> I'M JUST TRYING TO UNDERSTAND WHAT THAT SCOPE REALLY IS. I THINK THERE'S TWO OF THEM I GUESS IS ONE FOR EACH BUILDING IT'S THE TO REPLACE THE EXTERIOR FLOORBOARDS ON THE PORCH FLOORS. IF I UNDERSTAND CORRECTLY, REPLACING IT IN KIND WITH WOOD WITH WHAT IS THERE SO [01:00:04] IT'S NOT TONGUE AND GROOVE BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T HAVE TONGUE AND GROOVE BEFORE. >> IT'S NOT THE THIN PORCH BOARDS, EITHER. >> IT'S DECK BOARDS. >> NO. IT'S FIVE QUARTER BY. >> FIVE QUARTER, OKAY. >> IT'S JUST DECKING. >> THE RAILINGS ARE BEING. >> THE RAILINGS ARE GOING TO REMAIN. THEN THE CONTRACTOR WAS SPEAKING TO ME, THERE'S SOME THAT ARE DAMAGED, AND I SAID, MAKE IT LOOK THE SAME. >> THEY'RE DONE WITH THAT WHOLE PROJECT, AREN'T THEY? >> AND THE RAILINGS ARE STILL THERE. THEY'RE REPLACED OR PUT BACK BECAUSE OF THE EXISTING. >> ONE OF THE PERMITS SAYS, IT'S PERMIT NUMBER BLDC 2025-0143. DECK AND RAILING WILL BE REPLACED IN KIND, BUT I DON'T ACTUALLY THINK THEY REPLACED THE RAILING. I THINK IT ALL JUST WENT BACK. >> BUT THE DECKING WASN'T REPLACED IN KIND. IT WAS TOO DIFFERENT. IT WAS TONGUE AND GROOVE THREE AND A QUARTER DECKING, AND NOW IT'S FIVE AND A QUARTER PRESSURE TREATED DECKING. >> ON WHICH BUILDING? >> ON THE WRAP ROUND PORCH ON THE MAIN. >> THEY ACTUALLY WENT OVER THERE AND THEY MEASURED IT. IT WAS THE SAME THAT WAS. >> NOT A CHANCE, TWO DIFFERENT DECKING. >> I SAW THE PAINTED DECKING THAT WAS EXISTING WHEN I SAW IT MATCHED WHAT THEY PUT IN. THEY COULD HAVE REPLACED THAT DECK AT ANOTHER TIME FROM THEIR ORIGINAL SMALLER PIECES OF WOOD TO THE BIGGER PIECES OF WOOD. BUT THAT WAS ACTUALLY A DISASTER GOING OVER BECAUSE THEY WERE ALREADY DOING WORK, AND ME AND KELLY RAN OVER THERE. >> THE NEW INNKEEPER REACHED OUT TO ME, I GUESS, AS A FELLOW INNKEEPER, MAYBE SHE I WAS ON THE HDC, WHATEVER, AND I TOTALLY I'M LIKE, SHE CANNOT ASK ME THE QUESTIONS THAT SHE'S ASKING ME. SHE NEEDS TO ACTUALLY GO TO THE CITY BECAUSE SHE WAS ASKING HOW SHE CAN JUST QUESTIONS ABOUT THE VINYL SIDING AND THINGS LIKE THAT. I'M LIKE, YOU GOT TO FOLLOW THE GUIDELINES AND YOU NEED TO CONTACT THE CITY. IT WAS AN AWKWARD CONVERSATION AND I APPRECIATE AND UNDERSTAND THAT SHE'S TRYING TO GET SOMETHING DONE, AND SHE'S GETTING PRESSURE FROM THE OWNER. I DON'T KNOW IF SHE'S REACHED OUT TO YOU. >> BUT THERE'S MORE WORK COMING OUR WAY FOR THAT. >> THERE'S MORE COMING. >> I HAD A QUESTION THAT WHEN I WAS LOOKING AT THESE, WHAT INFORMATION DO YOU GET BEFORE YOU ISSUE THE PERMIT? DO YOU GET A LITTLE PLAN THAT SAYS WHEN IT SAYS REPLACE THE DECKING? DO YOU GET A PLAN THAT SAYS THIS DECKING, OR IS IT JUST DECKING AND IT COULD BE ANYWHERE. >> IT VARIES A LOT. FOR THAT SPECIFIC BLUE HERON PROJECT, I DID NOT GET VERY MUCH INFORMATION AT ALL BECAUSE I WAS TRYING TO WORK WITH THE CONTRACTOR AND THE OWNER, LITERALLY IN THE LOBBY OF THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT. THEY WERE LIKE, TRYING TO GET THEIR THING DONE. THEY'RE LIKE, WE'RE RIGHT HERE AND RIGHT NOW, TELL THEM WHAT I NEED TO DO, AND I'M LIKE, WELL, I TOLD THEM THEY CAN REPLACE THE DECK IN KIND, AND THAT'S ALL THEY CAN DO SO THEY SENT ME THEIR MATERIALS LIST. I UPLOADED OUR EMAIL THREAD THAT DISCUSSED THAT INTO THE APPLICATION TO DOCUMENT THAT. BUT USUALLY, IF I AM UNCLEAR ON WHAT THE PROJECT IS ABOUT, I ASKED THEM TO SEND ME A TYPED UP SCOPE OF WORK THAT DETAILS IT. I ALWAYS LIKE TO SEE A SITE PLAN. FOR ASSIGNED PERMITS, I GET DRAFTS OR MOCK UPS OF THE SIGN. USUALLY, THAT'S LIKE FROM FAST SIGNS AND THEY'LL SEND ME THE DRAFT SIGN WITH THE MATERIALS LIST. WITH PAINT COLORS, IT'S JUST THE SKEW NUMBER. IT'LL BE SHARON WILLIAMS NUMBER. >> I THINK THE QUESTION HAS COME UP BEFORE. IT'S THE IN KIND. MAYBE THAT'S SOMETHING WHEN WE DO OUR GUIDELINES, WE EITHER HAVE DEFINED, LITERALLY IN KIND EQUALS SAME PROFILE. I DON'T KNOW WHAT WE WANT IT TO BE WOOD, MATERIAL SIZE SHAPE, PROFILE, DIMENSION, CONSTITUTION WHATEVER OR, IS IT DEFINED IN THAT SECTION, IF IT'S FOR STAFF, IN KIND WOULD REQUIRE IF IT'S A RAILING IT HAS TO MATCH THE RAILING, WE NEED SOME MORE SPECIFICITY ON THAT. >> I THINK IT WOULD HELP TO REQUIRE THE APPLICANT TO DOCUMENT WHAT'S THERE WHATEVER. IF IT'S PHOTOS, WHATEVER IT IS DOCUMENTED, SO MIA THEN KNOWS IT'S ACTUALLY IN KIND BECAUSE IT LOOKS THE SAME, AT LEAST THAT'S A STRING POINT. >> THAT HAPPENS A LOT WITH SIDING BECAUSE PEOPLE COULD SAY, REPLACE THE SIDING TO MATCH EXISTING OR IN KIND. [01:05:04] WE HAVE LOTS OF DIFFERENT BEAD BOARD SIDING. WE HAVE THE LITTLE WATERFALL. WE HAVE THE THICKER, WE HAVE THE DOUBLE. THERE'S A LOT OF DUTCH LAP. THERE'S A LOT OF DIFFERENT TYPES OF SIDING, SO THEY WOULD NEED TO DEFINE WHAT THEY HAVE AND WHAT THEY'RE PUTTING BACK. >> COMPLETELY AGREED. >> JUST AS WE TALKED LAST MEETING ABOUT STANDARDIZING THE APPLICATION AND THE REPORT BEFORE IT COMES HERE. FOR THESE STAFF APPROVALS, YOU MIGHT WANT TO LOOK AT STANDARDIZING WHAT THEY GIVE YOU, INCLUDING THINGS LIKE PHOTOGRAPHS, ETC. >> PHOTOS WITH A WRITTEN DESCRIPTION, MAYBE CALL OUT SOME DIMENSIONS. >> EXPOSURES. >> YEAH, ON ALL THESE PRODUCTS, IT DOES AS DYLAN'S APPROPRIATELY POINTED OUT, THAT HISTORIC DECKING HAS A CHARACTER, A LOOK, AND A SIZE IN KIND TO ME MEANS YOU ARE MATCHING EXACTLY WHAT'S THERE NOW. TO OTHER PEOPLE IT JUST MEANS WELL, IT'S WOOD. >> WOOD WITH WOOD. >> I THINK THAT MAKES IT EASY FOR US TO CLARIFY TO THEM, AND US AS A BOARD TO DECIDE IF PEOPLE CAN GO AHEAD WITH PROJECTS, IF YOU'RE REPLACING IN KIND. IT'S RIGHT THERE. IT'S EXISTING YOU CAN MEASURE IT. IT'S TANGIBLE. >> WE NEED TO KEEP ALL THESE THINGS IN MIND WHEN WE REVIEW, AND WHEN WE TALK. >> BUT GOING FORWARD, I CAN CONFIRM IF THEY'RE DOING IN KIND REPLACEMENT FOR THEM TO DOCUMENT WHAT'S THERE AND WHAT EXACTLY THEY'RE GOING BACK WITH. >> DOCUMENTED IN TERMS OF A PHOTO, IF POSSIBLE. >> THAT'S THE ONLY WAY WE HAVE A CHANCE OF GETTING SOME IN KIND PLACEMENT. >> ANY OTHER COMMENTS ABOUT STAFF APPROVALS? PRESERVATION ON MAIN STREET. WE TALKED ABOUT THE CONFERENCE A BIT, BUT DID YOU WANT TO TALK SPECIFICALLY ABOUT PECK? >> WE HAD THE PECK GIVE BACK EVENT ON TUESDAY SO PALMS DOES A VOLUNTEER EVENT AT ALL THEIR CONFERENCES. I HEARD AT THE EVENT THAT THEY'RE USUALLY LIKE CLEANING HEADSTONES OR PAINTING SOMETHING, AND IT'S LIKE PHYSICAL HANDS ON RESTRICTION, BUT PECK CENTER ALREADY LOOKS BEAUTIFUL, AND THERE'S NOT MUCH WORK LEFT TO BE DONE ON THAT FRONT RIGHT NOW. I IN CONJUNCTION WITH THE FLORIDA TRUST FOR HISTORIC PRESERVATION CREATING AN EVENT, THAT WAS MORE LIKE A DIALOGUE BETWEEN ALUMNI MEMBERS AND CONFERENCE ATTENDEES AND I HAD ALL THE INFORMATION, ALL THE NATIONAL REGISTER NOMINATIONS, SO THE PAST FOUR ATTEMPTS TO GET THAT STRUCTURE LISTED OUT ON THE TABLE, ALL THE PRINTED PHOTOS, ALL THE MAPS, AND SITE PLANS FOR THE BUILDING, AND JUST HONESTLY, THE ALUMNI TOOK IT AWAY, AND THEY HAD A GREAT TIME DISCUSSING THEIR EXPERIENCES AT THE HIGH SCHOOL, AND IT REALLY INSPIRED ME TO INCORPORATE THE CULTURE AND THE COMMUNITY THAT WAS CREATED FROM THAT SCHOOL, AND THAT IT'S STILL THERE AND ALIVE, AND IT'S SO IMPORTANT TO THESE PEOPLE. I MADE A TEMPLATE FOR THEM TO WRITE LETTERS OF SUPPORT WE'RE GOING TO GET SOME FRESH LETTERS FROM 2025. I MET WITH DR. LUCAS WITH THE DIVISION OF HISTORIC RESOURCES OVER THE WEEK AND TALKED TO HER ABOUT THE NOMINATION AS WELL SHE, AT THE END OF THE DAY, SAID, SUBMIT EVERYTHING YOU HAVE, AND WE'LL HELP YOU PARE IT DOWN FROM THERE. THAT TAKES A LOT OF PRESSURE OFF ME FROM PARSING THROUGH ALL OF THIS STUFF. I'M JUST GOING TO SCAN IT ALL IN INTO ONE FILE AND THEN LET THEM PARE IT DOWN FROM THERE. ALL I HAVE TO DO NOW IS THE ACTUAL STATEMENT OF SIGNIFICANCE AND NARRATIVE AND COMBINE WHAT'S ALREADY BEEN WRITTEN AND INFUSE IT WITH WHAT I'VE LEARNED, AS TO NOT PLAGIARIZE AND ALSO BRING IT INTO THE MOST MODERN CONTEXT POSSIBLE. >> WAS THERE A GOOD SHOWING AT THE GIFT BAG? >> YEAH. WE HAVE PROBABLY MORE THAN 15 ALUMNI MEMBERS AND LIKE 10 OR SO CONFERENCE ATTENDEES, AND THEN SOME REPRESENTATIVES FROM THE TRUST SO DEFINITELY MORE ALUMNI THAN ANYTHING ELSE THEY HAD A REALLY GOOD TIME AND THEY SHARED A LOT OF INFORMATION WITH ME. >> I THINK THAT IF ANY OF YOU HAVE NOT BEEN FORTUNATE ENOUGH TO BE INVOLVED IN SOME WAY SHAPE OR FORM WITH THE PECK ALUMNI. IT'S IT'S DIFFERENT, ISN'T IT? YOU KNOW, I'VE HEARD DIFFERENT ASPECTS FROM PEOPLE WHO ATTENDED PECK HIGH SCHOOL, AND THERE IS A SOLID, VERY TANGIBLE ALMOST BOND AMONG THOSE PEOPLE. ONE OF MY GOOD FRIENDS ALSO TALKED NOT JUST ABOUT BEING AN ALUMNI BECAUSE SHE WAS NOT ABLE TO GRADUATE FROM THERE, BECAUSE THE WAY IF YOU'RE NOT AWARE I WAS IN ALABAMA TEACHING [01:10:04] WHEN FEDERAL GUIDELINES FOR INTEGRATION WENT INTO EFFECT IN THE 70S. THE SAME THING HAPPENED HERE THAT HAPPENED THERE, WHICH WAS THE FIRST YEAR, THEY TOOK THE 10TH GRADE FROM THE HIGH SCHOOL I WAS TEACHING IN, WHICH WAS ALL BLACK STUDENTS AND SENT THEM TO THE FORMERLY ALL WHITE HIGH SCHOOL WHERE I HAD DONE MY STUDENT TEACHING. >> I HAD A HOME ROOM OF JUNIORS WHO WERE NOT HAPPY PEOPLE BECAUSE THEY KNEW THAT THE FOLLOWING YEAR WHEN EVERYTHING WENT INTO EFFECT, THEY WERE GOING TO HAVE TO GO TO A SCHOOL OF PEOPLE WHO DIDN'T WANT THEM THERE, WHO WEREN'T GOING TO WELCOME THEM WITH OPEN ARMS. THEY ALREADY HAD THEIR HIGH SCHOOL RINGS. THEY WERE PROUD OF THE SCHOOL THEY HAD ALWAYS GONE TO, AND THEN THEY HAD TO DO THIS. THEY WERE NOT VERY HAPPY, AND THEN I HEARD WANDA BLUE DISCUSSING AT THE MUSEUM WHAT IT WAS LIKE FOR HER HERE BECAUSE SHE WAS IN THAT SAME BOAT. SHE WAS A JUNIOR, HAD TO GO THERE FOR HER SENIOR YEAR, SO SHE CAN'T CALL HERSELF TECHNICALLY A GRADUATE OF PECK. SHE SAID THAT WHAT HAPPENED WHEN THEY GOT TO SCHOOL OVER THERE AT FERNANDINA BEACH HIGH SCHOOL WAS, EVERYBODY WHO WAS ALREADY ON THE FOOTBALL TEAM AND EVERYBODY WHO WAS ALREADY IN THE BAND KEPT THEIR PLACES, BUT THE KIDS FROM PECK HAD TO TRY OUT, THEY HAD TO AUDITION, THEY HAD TO GO THROUGH A SEMESTER OF GETTING THEIR GRADES BEFORE THEY COULD BE IN THE BETA CLUB OR STUDENT GOVERNMENT OR ANYTHING. THEY FELT LIKE IT WAS A HUGE TAKEAWAY. THAT'S THE WAY IT GOT HANDLED ALMOST ACROSS THE COUNTRY. A LOT OF PEOPLE LOSE THEIR PATIENCE WHEN THEY HEAR THAT FOLKS DON'T WANT TO COMBINE, SAY, THE ATLANTIC REC CENTER AND AML CASE CENTER. IT'S JUST ONE MORE THING YOU'RE TAKING AWAY IF YOU DO THAT. THERE'S THAT HISTORY THAT HAS COME DOWN, THAT BOND WITH ALL THOSE FOLKS TOGETHER. IT'S AN AMAZING THING TO WITNESS. THEY'RE VERY COOL PEOPLE. >> WHAT YEAR WAS THAT? >> HERE, I THINK IT WAS EITHER '69 OR '70, BUT IT WAS GROSSLY MISHANDLED. BUT IT HAD BEEN POSTPONED BY THESE STATES THAT HAD INTEGRATION OR SEGREGATION FOR SO LONG THAT NOW THE PUSH COMES, AND LET'S HURRY UP AND FIGURE OUT HOW TO DO IT, AND THAT'S WHAT THEY SETTLED ON. [NOISE] INTERESTING CULTURE. I DON'T KNOW IF ANY OF YOU KNEW MS. ASHLEY, WHO THE AUDITORIUM AT PECK IS NAMED FOR, BUT WHEN I WAS MAYOR, I WAS ASKED TO READ A PROCLAMATION AT HER BIRTHDAY PARTY. SHE WAS TURNING 85, I THINK. I HAD NEVER MET HER. THE PARTY STARTED IN THE AUDITORIUM AT PECK AND I READ THE PROCLAMATION, GAVE IT TO HER. SHE HAD THE MOST BEAUTIFUL SMILE IN THE WORLD. THEN THE NEXT WEEK, I GET THIS PHONE CALL FROM A NUMBER I DIDN'T RECOGNIZE AND SHE SAID, "THIS IS WILLIE MAE ASHLEY, AND YOU WERE OVER HERE FOR MY BIRTHDAY PARTY, AND I GOT STUFF TO SAY. AND I GOT A ROCK AND CHAIR THAT NEEDS TO HAVE YOU SITTING IN IT." I WENT OVER THERE AND LISTENED A LOT, AND SEVERAL TIMES I SAID I HAD REALLY GREAT OPPORTUNITY TO LISTEN TO HER STORIES BECAUSE SHE WAS BORN ON 10TH STREET AND 11TH THAT SEPARATED. SHE WAS BORN SOMEWHERE ON 10TH STREET, WENT TO SCHOOL AT PECK, TAUGHT AT PECK, AND SPENT HER LAST DAYS ON 11TH STREET TO MAKE SURE SHE COULD WATCH THE BUILDING. SHE AND RON SAPP TOOK THE LEAD ON RESTORATION OF THAT BUILDING. I THINK BUDDY JACOBS WAS INVOLVED AS WELL, BUT IT HAD BEEN ALLOWED TO JUST REALLY GO DOWNHILL FOR A FEW YEARS. I'M GRATEFUL THAT WE STILL HAVE IT, AND THEY'RE VERY GRATEFUL THAT WE'RE DOING THIS WORK, AND THEY THINK SHE JUST HUNG THE MOON. >> IT'S AWESOME. >> YES. >> BUT THE ALUMNI OR THE ATTENDEES THAT WENT THERE, THAT POOL IS JUST GETTING SMALLER. [01:15:01] >> YES, IT IS. ABSOLUTELY. >> WE HAVE A DEADLINE. >> I HAD A LITTLE BREAKDOWN ABOUT THEM. I HAVE TO GET THIS LISTED BEFORE THEY'RE GONE. >> SOME PEOPLE IN THAT GROUP ARE OLDER THAN I AM, AND I DIDN'T THINK THAT WAS HUMANLY POSSIBLE, BUT THEY ARE. >> CAN I TALK A COUPLE OF THINGS ABOUT PALMS? ARE YOU DONE WITH THAT PART? >> YES. GO FORWARD. >> ANYBODY THAT DIDN'T GO, THIS WAS AN AMAZING CONFERENCE. THERE WERE SO MANY GOOD THINGS AND I MET SO MANY INCREDIBLE PEOPLE. THE NUMBER ONE THING, I'M ALWAYS ASKING PEOPLE WHERE THEY'RE FROM, HOW THEY LIKE IT HERE, FIRST TIME HERE, BLAH, BLAH, BLAH. THEY LOVED THIS TOWN, AND THE NUMBER 1 THING THAT I HEARD WAS, WE LOVE THE TREES. THIS IS JUST PEOPLE FROM FLORIDA THEY'RE LIKE, DON'T EVER LOSE THESE TREES. IT'S THE FEELING AS YOU'RE WALKING DOWN CENTER OR THESE SIDE STREETS. THEY LOVE THE SHADE THAT THEY PROVIDE. THEY SAID AND THE BIG TREES, NOT JUST PALM TREES. I THOUGHT THAT WAS INTERESTING. FLORIDA DOES THE 11 TO SAVE EVERY YEAR. IT'S THE 11 MOST ENDANGERED HISTORICAL WHATEVERS. THIS WAS REALLY INTERESTING BECAUSE WE'VE TALKED ABOUT THIS. ONE OF THEM ON THE LIST IS A HOUSE THAT WAS BUILT IN 1952. OUR PERIOD OF SIGNIFICANCE OF HISTORY, AS WE KNOW, WE'VE TALKED ABOUT, IT'S SHIFTING. >> I'M OLDER THAN THAT. >> EVERYTHING IS SHIFTING SO THAT'S JUST SOMETHING TO CONSIDER WHEN WE SAY, WELL, THAT WAS BUILT IN THE '50S. >> ABSOLUTELY. >> THEN THE OTHER LAST THING I JUST WANTED TO MENTION WAS MAYOR ANTUN JAMES HAD A REALLY GOOD OPENING SPEECH AND HE TALKED A LOT ABOUT OUR HISTORY IN OUR TOWNS AND WHY IT'S SO IMPORTANT FOR RESIDENT SATISFACTION AND FOR COMMUNITY APPRECIATION, SO IF WE EVER HAVE ANY ISSUES, WE JUST HAVE TO PULL UP THAT SPEECH AND WE CAN HOLD HIM TO IT. [LAUGHTER] >> THAT'S RIGHT. >> THAT'S ALL I HAVE. >> I ALSO THINK, YOU MENTIONED EARLIER THAT FOR THE GIVE BACK, A LOT OF TIMES THEY DO THINGS LIKE CLEANING HEADSTONES. WE HAVEN'T DONE THAT IN A LONG TIME. I THINK THERE'S AN OPPORTUNITY. I DON'T THINK IT CAN HAPPEN BEFORE THE OCTOBER CEMETERY EVENT THAT THE GENEALOGICAL SOCIETY IS DOING, BUT I THINK THERE'S AN OPPORTUNITY. WE'VE HAD IN THE PAST A NATURAL TRAINING SESSION ON HOW TO CLEAN A HEADSTONE PROPERLY, AND THEN FOLKS WHO WERE INTERESTED IN IT BECAUSE THEY HAD FAMILY OR FRIENDS IN BOSQUE BELLO, DID THEIR OWN CLEANING, BUT THERE WAS TRAINING PROVIDED. THAT'S SOMETHING WE MIGHT WANT TO CONSIDER AGAIN, ESPECIALLY WITH THE LIGHT BEING SHONE ON BOSQUE BELLO RIGHT NOW WITH THAT WORK. FYI. I CAN SEE THAT PROBABLY THERE'S NO PUBLIC COMMENT. >> NO? >> I HAVE ONE THING I WANTED TO SAY. I KNOW THE CITY COMMISSION READ A PROCLAMATION ABOUT SUE ANN TAM. I JUST WANTED TO SAY, WHEN I FIRST STARTED ON THIS BOARD, SHE WAS ALWAYS SITTING RIGHT THERE. SHE HAD HER NOTEPAD. >> ABSOLUTELY. >> I KNEW I BETTER BE CAREFUL ABOUT WHAT I SAY BECAUSE SHE'S GOING TO RECORD THAT AND PUT IT IN HER TAMAGRAM. [LAUGHTER] >> HER TAMAGRAMS WERE SO FUNNY. >> [LAUGHTER] YES THEY WERE. >> THE FIRST TIME I CAME TO AN HDC MEETING, SHE WAS CHAIR OF THE HDC, AND THEY WERE TALKING ABOUT A HOUSE IN OLD TOWN THAT THERE WERE QUITE A FEW PEOPLE HERE THAT HAD INTEREST IN THAT DISCUSSION. SHE HANDLED THAT BEAUTIFULLY LIKE SHE HANDLED EVERYTHING. SHE'S AN EXTREMELY TALENTED WRITER. I DON'T KNOW IF YOU'VE ALL HAD THE OPPORTUNITY TO SEE THE OBITUARY ON OXLEY HEARD. IT'S A COMBINED OBITUARY FOR HER AND GERHARDT BECAUSE THEY DIED WITHIN A COUPLE OF WEEKS OF EACH OTHER. IF YOU'RE NOT FAMILIAR WITH GERHARDT'S HISTORY, HE WAS FORCED TO BE A MEMBER OF THE NAZI YOUTH CORPS IN GERMANY. HE WAS FROM GERMANY AND WROTE BOOKS ABOUT THAT EXPERIENCE. BOY SOLDIER WAS THE NAME OF THAT BOOK. THEN WHEN HE CAME TO THE STATES AFTER THE WAR, THE ONLY THING HE SAID HE KNEW HOW TO DO WAS BE A SOLDIER. HE JOINED THE ARMY AND THEN MADE HIM A SPY BECAUSE HE SPOKE GERMAN. WHEN HE STARTED FIGURING OUT WHAT TO DO, [01:20:01] HE WORKED WITH THIS YOUNG WOMAN WHO WAS TRANSLATING RUSSIAN DOCUMENTS, AND THAT HAPPENED TO BE SUE ANN. ACCORDING TO THE OBITUARY, WHICH I DIDN'T KNOW ANY OF THAT PART, THEIR SON, ERIC, SAID, WHEN THEY MOVED HERE, THEIR LIFE COMPLETELY CHANGED. IT WAS NO LONGER STRESSFUL AS MUCH AS THEIR LIVES HAD BEEN. THEY DIDN'T SHARE ALL THIS BACKGROUND WITH PEOPLE THAT THEY KNEW, BUT HE WORKED ON A WATERFRONT COMMITTEE IN THE PAST, PROBABLY 35 YEARS AGO. EVERY TIME I SAW HIM, HE GOES, HE'S STILL WORKING ON THAT BLAH, BLAH, BLAH WATERFRONT. BUT SUE ANN ALWAYS HAS SOMETHING TO SAY ABOUT ALMOST ANYTHING, AND SHE ALWAYS SAID IT VERY WELL. DEFINITELY, THEY BOTH WILL BE MISSED. >> I HAVE ONE OTHER QUESTION. >> JUST TALK, DON'T STOP. >> THIS IS A SHORT ONE. IT JUST POPPED INTO MY HEAD WHEN WE TALKED ABOUT THE 11 TO SAVE. DO WE HAVE A STATUS ON THE HUOT BUILDING SAME WITH MARINE? BECAUSE ACTUALLY ON ONE OF OUR TALKS, WE DID A WALK THROUGH TOWN AND WE WERE LOOKING AT STORM WATER PREPAREDNESS AND MITIGATION THINGS, AND WE WERE LOOKING AT THE ALACHUA OPENING, AND AS WE WERE WALKING DOWN THAT WAY, SEVERAL OF THE PEOPLE POINTED OUT THE STANDARD MARINE. THERE ARE SOME NEW STEP CRACKS IN THE PARAPET THAT ARE PRETTY SIGNIFICANT, AND THEY'RE COMING UP. THEY'RE DIAGONAL, WHICH ARE NOT GOOD. DO WE HAVE ANY INKLING OF WHERE WE ARE WITH THAT BUILDING? >> I DO NOT KNOW, BUT I CAN LOOK INTO IT. >> I BELIEVE THAT JOSE IS STILL THE ARCHITECT FOR THAT CONCEPT? >> HE IS. >> HE COULD PROBABLY LET US KNOW. >> I THINK THERE ARE SOME CHALLENGES BECAUSE IT'S BEEN OPEN TO THE WEATHER FOR SO LONG. THERE'S MORE OF A CONCERN NOW THAN THERE WAS BEFORE. >> IT WILL BE A TERRIBLE SHAME TO LOSE THAT. >> I WANT TO TALK TO THE OWNER. >> TALK TO JENNY. >> I'LL SEE WHAT JENNY HAS TO SAY. IT'S A BEAUTIFUL PART OF OUR HISTORY. >> WELL, LIKE THE BOAT HOUSE UP IN OLD TOWN, IT IS TALKING ABOUT THE PECK AND ALL OF THIS, THAT'S A CULTURAL ICON. I KNOW THE OWNERS HAVE BEEN TAKING BETTER CARE OF IT, BUT I COULD SEE SOMEBODY MOVING IN AND WANTING TO TEAR THAT THING DOWN. >> SURE. >> I'M SURE A LOT OF PEOPLE, THAT'S A CHUNK OF PROPERTY. DO YOU KNOW THE BOAT HOUSE? >> ON THE STEAMBOAT HOUSE? >> NO. IT'S A HOUSE THAT LOOKS LIKE THE PROW SHIP. >> THE BRICK CHIMNEY? >> YEAH. THE SAME GUY BUILT ONE, IT'S WHERE JESUS LIVES. >> IN AMERICAN BEACH. >> IN AMERICAN BEACH. WHEN I BRING FRIENDS, I SAY, YOU WANT TO GO SEE JESUS? >> BUT IS IT THE SAME MAN? >> YEAH AND THOSE ARE SISTER BOAT HOUSES. >> MY GOD, YOU'RE RIGHT. >> THAT'S GREAT. >> I WONDER [INAUDIBLE] >> DO WE NEED TO MEMORIALIZE THAT BUILDING SOMEHOW TO HELP JUST KEEP IT SAVED CULTURALLY? >> SHOULD WE BE IDENTIFYING SOME BUILDINGS THAT ARE IN DANGER? >> WELL, THAT'S WHAT MADE ME THINK OF THAT. >> WE HAVE OUR OWN LOCAL SAVE. >> LORELEI ASKED ME THE OTHER DAY TO BE THINKING ABOUT A SMALL MATCHING GRANT OPPORTUNITIES TOO. I KNOW THAT WE CAN ONLY HAVE ONE ACTIVE APPLICATION, BUT I COULD CHOOSE ONE. >> DEE, ARE YOU AWARE OF WHAT GRANT WORK MR. SPINA WAS DOING BECAUSE WHAT IS THAT? IS THAT FOR THE RESTORATION FOUNDATION? >> KIND OF FOR THE RESTORATION FOUNDATION. IT'S THE BAPTIST CHURCH NEAR FIRST LOVE BREWING ACROSS THE STREET? >> YES. >> I GET MY CHURCH NAMES MIXED UP. >> [INAUDIBLE] NASH. >> HE APPLIED FOR A SMALL MATCHING GRANT FOR THEM. >> BECAUSE HE WAS ASKING ME TO THINK ABOUT WHAT WE MIGHT WANT A GRANT FOR. I DON'T KNOW IN WHAT CAPACITY. >> I THINK HE'S ALREADY SUBMITTED THAT APPLICATION. >> BUT IT MUST BE THROUGH THE RESTORATION FOUNDATION. >> I DON'T KNOW. I DIDN'T KNOW THAT HE WAS IN THAT [OVERLAPPING] >> HE HAD REACHED OUT TO ME AND I SAID, I DID NOT HAVE THE TIME TO DO IT. AND I'M LIKE, BUT YOU CAN DO IT AND THEN HE DID. >> I THINK HE DID BECAUSE HE ASKED ME TO WRITE A LETTER, WHICH I DID, AND JUST BEING A COMMUNITY MEMBER OWNING THE POVERTY CROSS STREET. MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT IT IS SUBMITTED, BUT I ALSO HEARD THAT THE STATE WAS NOT MOVING FORWARD WITH ANY GRANTS THIS YEAR, BUT I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S MORE ANECDOTAL. >> BUT YOU HEAR RUMORS ABOUT THE STATE AND GRANT MONEY A LOT. [01:25:03] >> THEY'RE DEFINITELY NOT FUNDING ANY SPECIAL CATEGORY GRANTS. >> WELL, I THINK WE SHOULD ALL GIVE SOME THOUGHT TO SOME BUILDINGS THAT WE WANT TO MAKE SURE STAY THE WAY THEY ARE. IT'S BOTHERSOME TO ME THAT THE BEECH STREET GRILL IS STANDING THERE UNUSED. >> VILLA LAS PALMAS. >> VILLA LAS PALMAS, AS WELL. >> GO BY THE BUILDINGS AND WALK BY. LET'S SEE WHAT ELSE IS FALLING OFF THIS ONE. >> WE PROBABLY COULD COME UP WITH OUR OWN LIST OF AT LEAST 10 CONCERNS, INCLUDING OLD TOWN. >> I DID SEE PEOPLE IN THAT BUILDING. >> VILLA? >> YEAH. >> SHE LIVES IN THERE. >> SHE LIVES THERE? >> YEAH. >> WHO LIVES WHERE? >> LAS PALMAS. >> IT'S CALLED VILLA LOST ALL THE MONEY, DIDN'T YOU KNOW THAT? [LAUGHTER] >> VILLA LOST ALL THE MONEY. >> I HAVE A LOT TO LEARN. [LAUGHTER] >> WE'RE ALL SET? >> I GOT NOTES. >> WHEN DO WE FIND OUT ABOUT THE AUGUST MEETING DATE? IS THAT JUST TO BE DETERMINED? >> I WILL SEND YOU GUYS AN EMAIL TOMORROW. IF YOU CAN DO THE 28TH, WE'LL PROBABLY DO THE 28TH. >> THANK YOU. THANK YOU ALL FOR BEING HERE. IF YOU KNOW OF ANYONE WHO MIGHT BE INTERESTED IN A POSITION ON THIS BOARD, PLEASE SHARE YOUR NAMES WITH MIA. I DID TALK TO MR. MIRANDA FOR HIM TO GIVE ME SOME IDEAS. >> ME TOO. >> YOU DID? [LAUGHTER] >> MEETING ADJOURNED. THANK YOU. * This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.