[00:00:02]
>> ORDER. HISTORIC DISTRICT COMMISSION MEETING FOR FERNANDINA BEACH.
[1. CALL TO ORDER / ROLL CALL / DETERMINATION OF QUORUM]
COULD YOU PLEASE CALL THE ROLL?>> HERE. PLEASE RISE FOR THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE.
>> THANK YOU. WE HAVE NO ALTERNATES TO SEAT, CORRECT?
[Additional item]
WE'RE COPACETIC.>> ON THE 401 CASE, YOU WILL SEE AN ALTERNATE THIS EVENING.
>> WHO WOULD THAT ALTERNATE BE, IS THAT MS. BRYNES?
>> OKAY. WE'RE GOING TO NEED TO SIT HER, AND THEN HOPEFULLY, WE CAN CHANGE THAT WHOLE PROCESS.
>> WE ARE GOING TO TALK ON THAT.
>> IS THERE ANY OBJECTION TO SEATING MS. BRYNES?
EX PARTE COMMUNICATIONS. BOARD MEMBERS, MS. GASS, DID YOU HAVE ANY [OVERLAPPING]?
>> I SPOKE WITH LISA FINKELSTEIN ON 4.2, AND PROBABLY STAFF ON A FEW OTHER MINOR ISSUES.
>> I SPOKE TO STAFF ABOUT THE PRESBYTERIAN CHURCH WINDOW JOB.
>> I EMAILED STAFF ABOUT 232 SOUTH SEVENTH STREET.
>> I HAD CONVERSATIONS WITH BOTH KELLY AND MIA.
FOR THOSE OF YOU WHO HAVE NOT YET MET MIA, MIA IS OUR NEW STAFF PERSON.
JUST COME IN AND WATCH THE FUN AND GAMES.
MR. PAUL, COULD YOU EXPLAIN QUASI-JUDICIAL PROCEDURES TO OUR [OVERLAPPING]?
FOR THE CASES, WE'LL HAVE QUASI-JUDICIAL PROCEEDINGS IN EFFECT FOR TONIGHT.
IN THOSE CASES, THE DECISION OF THE BOARD WILL NEED TO BE SUPPORTED BY COMPETENT, SUBSTANTIAL EVIDENCE, AND THAT EVIDENCE CAN BE PRESENTED IN THE FORM OF TESTIMONY OR DOCUMENTS, OR PHOTOGRAPHS.
ANYONE INTENDING TO INTRODUCE ANY EVIDENCE OR TESTIMONY TO THE BOARD WILL NEED TO BE SWORN.
STAFF WILL MAKE THEIR PRESENTATION, THE APPLICANT WILL ALSO HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO PRESENT TO THE BOARD AND BE SUBJECT TO ANY CROSS-EXAMINATION OR QUESTIONS FROM THE BOARD.
ANYONE WHO DISAGREES WITH THE DECISION OF THE BOARD WILL HAVE THE RIGHT TO APPEAL THAT DECISION WITHIN 30 DAYS TO THE NASSAU COUNTY CIRCUIT COURT BY PETITION OF [INAUDIBLE] AND THAT 30 DAYS BEGINS TO RUN FROM THE DATE THAT THE FINAL DECISION IS SIGNED BY THE CHAIR.
DOES ANYONE HAVE ANY QUESTIONS ABOUT THE QUASI-JUDICIAL PROCEEDINGS? THANK YOU.
>> THANK YOU VERY MUCH. IF ANY OF YOU EXPECT TO TESTIFY TODAY, WOULD YOU PLEASE RISE SO THAT WE CAN ADMINISTER THE OATH TO YOU?
>> RAISE YOUR RIGHT HAND. DO YOU SWEAR OR AFFIRM THAT THE ORAL AND/OR WRITTEN TESTIMONY YOU'RE ABOUT TO GIVE WILL BE THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH, AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH?
DID EVERYBODY GET A CHANCE TO REVIEW THE MINUTES FROM THE LAST MEETING?
[3. APPROVAL OF MEETING MINUTES]
>> ARE THERE ANY COMMENTS? DO WE HAVE A MOTION TO APPROVE?
>> WE HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND.
CAN YOU CALL THE ROLL, PLEASE?
[4.1 HDC 2024-0028 - RICE ARCHITECT, AGENT FOR ROBERT AND STACY MCKENZIE, 232 S. 7TH STREET]
WE START WITH OLD BUSINESS.THIS IS FOR A FINAL APPROVAL, IF I UNDERSTAND.
YES. WE'VE HEARD ABOUT THIS CASE BEFORE.
MS. GIBSON, COULD YOU GIVE US YOUR REPORT?
>> LET ME MAKE SURE I CAN GET BACK TO THE SLIDE SHOW HERE FOR YOU.
THIS CASE IS 232 SOUTH SEVENTH STREET, AND YES, THE BOARD HAS SEEN THIS MOST RECENTLY ON, I BELIEVE THIS IS THE THIRD TIME WITHIN THE PAST CALENDAR YEAR.
THE BOARD REVIEWED DIFFERENT APPLICATIONS FOR THE SAME PROPERTY IN SEPTEMBER,
[00:05:07]
NOVEMBER, AND NOW FEBRUARY.THIS EVENING, AND CONSISTENTLY, THERE'S BEEN SOME OF THE SAME THEMES WITH EACH APPLICATION.
I THINK TWO YEARS AGO, THE BOARD HAD REVIEWED AND CONSIDERED DEMOLITION OF THE GARAGE STRUCTURE.
AT THAT TIME, THE BOARD FELT THAT THE STRUCTURE SHOULD STAY.
IN SEPTEMBER OF LAST YEAR, THE APPLICANTS CAME BEFORE THE BOARD WITH A DESIGN THAT REUSED THAT EXISTING STRUCTURE TO THE EXTENT THAT IT WAS FEASIBLE, BUT MAKING REASONABLE USE OF IT TO HAVE AN OUTDOOR PATIO SPACE, AN OUTDOOR LIVING AREA UNDER THE ROOF LINE OF THAT ORIGINAL STRUCTURE.
AT THAT TIME, THE BOARD DIRECTED RECONSIDERATION OF THE DEMOLITION OF THE STRUCTURE IN LIEU OF HAVING A NEW STRUCTURE THERE.
THEN IN NOVEMBER, THE BOARD WAS PRESENTED WITH A TWO-STORY ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT FOR REPLACEMENT OF THE GARAGE STRUCTURE THAT IS CURRENTLY THERE, AND RECEIVED CONCEPTUAL LEVEL APPROVAL WITH SOME FEEDBACK PROVIDED.
THIS EVENING, THE BOARD IS PRESENTED WITH A DIFFERENT CONCEPT ENTIRELY, BUT REQUESTING FINAL APPROVAL TO CONSTRUCT A ONE-STORY DETACHED GARAGE WITH A COVERED PORCH ON THE REAR SIDE OF IT, AND CONSTRUCTING A NEW ONE-STORY ADDITION ON THE NORTHERN SIDE OF THE EXISTING PRINCIPAL STRUCTURE.
REMOVING THREE WINDOWS TO REUSE ON THAT ADDITION, INSTALLING NEW ANDERSON SERIES WINDOWS, AND THEN INSTALLING PAVERS TO THE REAR OF THE GARAGE AND WITHIN THE NEWLY CREATED WEST COURTYARD AREA.
I'VE GOT SOME EXISTING PHOTOS HERE OF THE STRUCTURE, THE GARAGE STRUCTURE, AS WELL AS THE SUBJECT PROPERTY IN THE FRONT.
LET ME SEE. THE PROPOSED RENDERINGS OF THE NORTHERN ELEVATION AND THE CEDAR STREET ELEVATION THAT SHOWS THE CONTEXT OF THAT NEW GARAGE STRUCTURE SO THAT YOU CAN GET A SENSE OF IT IN CONTEXT WITH THE EXISTING PROPERTY THAT IS THERE.
THEN, OF COURSE, WHAT IT WOULD LOOK LIKE ON THE OPPOSING SIDE.
ADDITIONAL RENDERINGS THAT DEPICT THE HEIGHT OF THE STRUCTURE AND THE MATERIALS THAT WOULD BE USED.
THEN IN ELEVATION, A PHOTO THAT SHOWS THE LOCATION OF WHERE THE NEW ADDITION WOULD BE.
THE ADDITION IS REQUESTED TO BE AT 330 SQUARE FEET ON THAT NORTHERN SIDE.
ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I'VE RECENTLY DISCUSSED WITH THE APPLICANT IS THE SETBACK ASSOCIATED WITH IT.
IT IS SET BACK FROM THAT PRINCIPAL FACADE SO THAT IT DOES CREATE A DISTINCTION IN THE PRINCIPAL ORIGINAL HISTORIC STRUCTURE IN THE ADDITION ITSELF.
BUT WE WOULD NEED TO HAVE THEM APPLY FOR CONTEXT-SENSITIVE SETBACK DETERMINATION TO APPLY A DIFFERENT FRONT YARD SETBACK TO THE ADDITION THAT'S PROPOSED.
IN EVALUATING THE PROPOSED ADDITION AGAINST THE STRUCTURES THAT ALIGN THAT BLOCK FACE, IT DOES APPEAR THAT THEY WOULD BE ELIGIBLE FOR THAT DETERMINATION AND TO HAVE A SETBACK ESTABLISHED WITHIN THE AREA THAT THEY ARE PROPOSING.
WITH THAT, STAFF DOES RECOMMEND FINAL APPROVAL WITH THE CONDITION OF THE APPLICATION FOR A CONTEXT-SENSITIVE SETBACK DETERMINATION ON THAT FRONT YARD.
THAT WOULD BE APPLIED FOR SEPARATELY.
>> ANY QUESTIONS FROM MS. GIBSON?
>> I HAVE A QUESTION ABOUT THE SETBACK, THE CONTEXT-SENSITIVE.
WHY WOULD THAT BE REQUIRED IF THE PRINCIPAL FACADE IS REMAINING WHERE IT IS AND THIS IS SETBACK WHATEVER, A GOOD FIVE OR 10 FEET, IS IT ANY WALL ON THE FRONT THAT HAS TO BE, I GUESS?
>> ALTHOUGH OUR CODE IS VERY GRACIOUS IN ALLOWING THE MAINTENANCE OF NON-CONFORMITIES, ANY NEW CONSTRUCTION MUST COMPLY WITH CURRENT STANDARDS.
BUT WE DO HAVE A PROVISION OF CODE IN PLACE THAT ALLOWS FOR CONTEXT-SENSITIVE SETBACK REVIEW.
IT CAN ONLY BE APPLIED ON A FRONT YARD, THOUGH.
>> FOR THIS ADDITION, THEY WOULD BE MEASURING ALL THE OTHER FRONTS OF THE BUILDINGS ON THAT BLOCK,
[00:10:06]
AND THEN THIS ADDITION WOULD HAVE TO BE WITHIN THAT AN AVERAGE?>> AN AVERAGE OF WHAT IS ON THAT SAME BLOCK FACE WOULD BE THE MAXIMUM EXTENT TO WHICH THEY COULD MOVE IT FORWARD.
>> EVEN THOUGH THE ADDITION IS ACTUALLY BEHIND THE EXISTING FRONT YARD SETBACK?
>> YEAH. THAT'S A LITTLE CONFUSING.
>> ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FROM MS. GIBSON?
>> I HAVE JUST ONE QUESTION AND IT WAS IN REGARDS TO THE EMAIL THAT I HAD SENT.
DID WE DETERMINE, BECAUSE I KNOW IT'S MISSING FROM THE SURVEY, WHERE THE TREE IS IN RELATIONSHIP TO THE ADDITION? IT JUST IT SEEMS LIKE IT WOULD BE VERY CLOSE, SO JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE WE'RE NOT TOUCHING THAT.
>> I KNOW THAT OUR ARBORIST HAS CONSULTED WITH THE PROPERTY OWNERS ON THE TREE ITSELF, AND THAT THEY CAN SPEAK TO THAT CONVERSATION BECAUSE I WAS NOT THAT'S PART OF IT.
BUT THAT ANY MITIGATION OF THAT TREE COULD BE ACHIEVED THROUGH EITHER WHAT IS RETAINED ON THE PROPERTY OR THROUGH NEW PLANTINGS.
>> THAT VERY LARGE TREE IN THAT IMAGE, POSSIBLY THAT TREE IS GOING TO COME DOWN FOR THIS ADDITION?
>> THE ONE ON FURTHER BACK IS ACTUALLY NOT ON THEIR PROPERTY.
BUT YES, THE ONE FURTHER FORWARD.
>> I THINK THE APPLICANT CAN PROBABLY SPEAK TO THAT BETTER.
>> WOULD YOU LIKE TO COME FORWARD?
WE CONTACTED THE CITY ARBORIST.
>> PLEASE STATE YOUR NAME AND YOUR ADDRESS FOR THE RECORD.
>> OH, SORRY. STACY MCKENZIE, 232 SOUTH SEVENTH STREET.
WE CONSULTED WITH THE CITY ARBORIST.
HE CAME OUT AND LOOKED AT THIS TREE.
HE SAID IT IS A LAUREL OAK, AND THAT IT IS BEYOND ITS EXPECTED LIFESPAN, AND THAT HALF OF IT HAS ALREADY BEEN CUT OUT DUE TO ROT, NOT BEING A HEALTHY TREE.
HE SAID HE WOULD RECOMMEND AND SUPPORT IT COMING DOWN.
HE SAID THAT WOULD BE PART OF THE HOUSE PERMITTING PROCESS IS AT THE SAME TIME, YOU'D APPLY A PERMIT TO REMOVE THE TREE.
FOR THE MITIGATION, HE WAS TALKING ABOUT THE NUMBER OF TREES AND THE SIZE THAT WOULD HAVE TO BE PLANTED TO MITIGATE WHAT WAS TAKEN DOWN.
HE SAID THE TREES COULD NOT BE BETWEEN THE SIDEWALK AND THE ROAD, THEY HAD TO BE BETWEEN THE SIDEWALK AND THE HOUSE.
THEY COULD NOT BE UNDER THE BIG TREE IN THE BACK, EVEN THOUGH IT'S NOT ON OUR PROPERTY.
THE CANOPY OF IT COVERS OUR BACKYARD.
THAT'S ONE REASON WE'RE DOING THE PATIO CAUSE YOU CAN'T GROW GRASS.
BUT IT IS A HERITAGE TREE, THE BIG ONE IN THE BACK.
HE SAID THAT WE ALONG, I GUESS, THE SOUTH SIDE OF THE HOUSE, THE CEDAR SIDE, THERE'S PLENTY OF OPPORTUNITY TO PLANT REPLACEMENT TREES BETWEEN THE HOUSE AND THE SIDEWALK.
EVEN IN THE PLAN FOR THE GARAGE, THE LITTLE PICKET FENCE IS GOING TO STAY, AND WE WERE PLANNING TO PLANT BUSHES AND TREES ALONG THAT FOR PRIVACY, ANYWAY.
>> ANY FURTHER QUESTIONS TO THE APPLICANT?
>> WELL, I ACTUALLY HAD ONE FOR DIRECTOR GIBSON.
I'M SURE WE GO TO THE APPLICANT.
>> DO YOU MIND SEATING NEARBY? [LAUGHTER]
>> THIS IS THIS WAS A SETBACK QUESTION, BUT IT'S IN REGARDING TO THE GARAGE ELEMENT.
I THINK I'LL STATE UP FRONT THAT I DON'T HAVE ANY PARTICULAR ISSUE WITH THE LOCATION OF THE GARAGE BECAUSE IT'S ESSENTIALLY WHERE THE PREVIOUS ONE WAS.
BUT MY UNDERSTANDING OF THE THREE-FOOT SETBACK FOR AN ACCESSORY BUILDING WAS FOR SIDE SETBACK AND REAR SETBACK, BUT WE ACTUALLY, I BELIEVE, HAVE A CORNER SETBACK ON THAT SIDE, WHICH I'VE BEEN TOLD IN THE PAST IS DIFFERENT THAN A SIDE SETBACK.
I LIKE IT WHERE IT'S AT BECAUSE IT'S IN KEEPING WITH THE ORIGINAL CONTEXT.
WOULD WE NEED TO STATE SOMETHING TOWARDS THAT AS WE MOVE FORWARD THAT WE ARE SPECIFICALLY ALLOWING IT TO BE IN THAT POSITION?
[00:15:02]
>> IT IS WITHIN THE THREE FEET, WHICH IS ALLOWED FOR THE ACCESSORY STRUCTURE.
HOWEVER, A PRINCIPAL STRUCTURE HAS TO COMPLY WITH THAT 15-FOOT CORNER LOT SETBACK.
WHEN WE HAD DISCUSSED CHANGES TO ACCESSORY STRUCTURES, THIS WAS SOMETHING THAT WE BROUGHT UP AND IT WAS DETERMINED AT THAT TIME NOT TO APPLY THE CORNER LOT SETBACK TO A ACCESSORY STRUCTURE, SO IT'S ONLY HELD TO WHAT IS THE TYPICAL SIDE YARD SETBACK FOR THAT PARTICULAR IMPROVEMENT.
>> OKAY. THEN IT'S A NON-ISSUE BASICALLY.
BECAUSE THEY'RE A FOUR-FOOT ONE.
>> YEAH. ORIGINALLY, FOR CONTEXT, WHEN WE VERY FIRST SAW THIS CASE, IT WAS BACK IN 2022, AND IT WAS RECOMMENDED TO DENY BECAUSE THEY WANTED TO DEMO THE ADDITION THAT WAS ON THERE.
THERE'S LIKE THAT LITTLE WARTY ADDITION ON THE BACK THAT TONY PUT IN TO BUMP OUT FOR HIS CAR.
THEY TOOK THAT DOWN AND THEN THEY COULDN'T REBUILD BECAUSE THEY WERE ENCROACHING IN THAT SETBACK.
I THINK THAT WAS ADDRESSED SEVERAL TIMES PAST.
I LIKE WHAT YOU'RE SAYING THIS LOCATION IS GOOD AND BASICALLY LOOKS LIKE THEY'RE JUST SHIFTING THE RIDGE LINE OVER, SO IT'S A LITTLE BIT MORE SYMMETRICAL.
>> ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR EITHER MS. GIBSON OR FOR THE APPLICANT?
>> WELL, I THINK I WOULD LIKE TO ASK A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS OF THE APPLICANT.
>> FIRST, I WANT TO SAY THAT I COMMEND YOU ON REUSING EXISTING WINDOWS AND OTHER PLACES. I THINK THAT'S IDEAL.
I KNOW WE AS A BOARD HAVE ASKED PEOPLE WHEN YOU HAVE AN ADDITION GOING ON TO AN EXISTING HISTORIC HOME, AND BOARD MEMBERS, PLEASE CHIME IN IF I'M SPEAKING OUT OF LINE HERE, BUT RATHER THAN SEE YOU TAKE THE EXISTING SIDING OFF OF THE AREA COVERED AND REUSING IT ELSEWHERE.
MAYBE ENTOMB THAT SIDING BECAUSE OF THE PART OF THE CODE THAT WE'RE SUPPOSED TO ADHERE TO SAYS THAT YOU SHOULD BE ABLE TO REMOVE THE ADDITION AND HAVE THE ORIGINAL EXISTING HOME BE AS IT WAS.
SO IF YOU WERE TO ENTOMB THAT SIDING BEHIND, SAY, ANOTHER WALL JUST IN FRONT OF IT, IT WOULD ALLOW THAT TO HAPPEN.
>> NOW, I THINK I COULD BE SWAYED IF YOU'RE TELLING ME THAT THERE'S SOME ROTTEN SIDING THAT MATCHES THAT, THAT YOU'RE GOING TO USE THAT SIDING TO REPAIR IT.
THAT MIGHT BE A MITIGATING FACTOR OR SOMETHING, BUT IF YOU'RE GOING TO USE THE EXISTING SIDING ON THE NEW PIECE, IT MIGHT MAKE MORE SENSE TO USE NEW SIDING ON A NEW PIECE, AND TUNE THE EXISTING.
I DON'T KNOW IF ANY OTHER BOARD MEMBERS HAVE.
>> WE'VE SAID THAT TIME AND AGAIN, AND THAT'S PART OF THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION GUIDELINES.
IT SAYS THAT YOU SHOULD TOUCH IT AS LIGHTLY AS POSSIBLE AND LEAVE AS MUCH. LET'S FACE IT.
THE HOUSE THAT'S BUILT THIS YEAR IS PROBABLY NOT AS GOOD AS THE ONE THAT WAS BUILT 80 YEARS AGO.
SOMEBODY'S GOING TO COME IN IN 20 YEARS AND RIP OFF THIS NEW ADDITION.
[LAUGHTER] THEN THEY'RE GOING TO SAY, THIS IS WHERE THE HOUSE ENDED ORIGINALLY.
WE WANT TO GIVE THEM SOME CUES AS TO WHERE THE ORIGINAL STRUCTURE IS.
>> MARK AIKENS, 1414 HIGHLAND DRIVE FERNANDINA BEACH.
WE'VE PREPARED THE DESIGN AND DRAWINGS FOR THIS PROJECT AND OUR CLIENT.
WE CAN CERTAINLY PROVIDE GUIDANCE IN OUR CONSTRUCTION DOCUMENTS FOR THE BUILDER TO ASSESS THAT SITUATION AND BE CONSIDERATE OF THAT SIDING.
IF IT'S AT ALL CONSERVABLE, WE WILL DO SO.
JUST TO ADD, WE HAVE RENOVATED THIS HOUSE PREVIOUSLY, CORRECT.
WE TOOK GREAT PAINTS EVEN ON THE INSIDE TO DO JUST THAT.
REUSING MATERIALS THAT WE HAD FOUND INSIDE, THE FRAMING THAT WE HAD INSIDE.
WE DIDN'T WANT TO LOSE THAT LUMBER.
WE REUSED LUMBER INSIDE THAT WE HAD, EXPOSED SOME OF THE CEILING JOINTS THAT WERE IN THERE THAT WERE COVERED UP.
NOW THEY'RE GLORIOUSLY EXPOSED THROUGH THE HOUSE.
WE'RE SENSITIVE TO THAT, AND WE CAN PROVIDE GUIDANCE IN OUR DRAWINGS IF YOU'LL STIPULATE TO THAT, WE CAN DO THAT.
>> I THINK ALONG THOSE LINES TOO, THE CONVERSE OF THAT IS, AND YOU KNOW THIS MARK, WHENEVER THERE'S AN ADDITION ADDED ON, WE ALSO WANT TO HAVE IT BE CONTEXTUALLY SENSITIVE OR COMPATIBLE WITH THE EXISTING STRUCTURE,
[00:20:03]
BUT HAVE SOME DISCERNIBILITY THAT IT IS AN ADDITION AND THERE IS.SOMETIMES IT'S JUST THE EXPOSURE OF THE SIDING IS A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT OR MAYBE THE TRIM IS A LITTLE BIT BIGGER OR SOMETHING THAT WILL.
WE'RE NOT JUST MAKING A LOOKY-LOO AND TRYING TO MATCH EVERYTHING, WHICH GOES AGAINST SOME PEOPLE.
THEY DON'T UNDERSTAND THAT, BUT THAT'S PART OF THE GUIDELINE.
THAT THIS SHOULD BE DESIGNED DIFFERENT.
>> PERHAPS, I THINK EXPOSURE WILL REVEAL THAT.
>> I MEAN, MATERIAL WILL DO THAT.
MY OTHER QUESTION, I'M DONE, JIM, I DON'T MEAN TO STEP [LAUGHTER] ON YOU.
THESE PLANS ARE DATED JANUARY 9TH OF 2024, IS THAT JUST A TYPO?
>> THAT'S A TYPO. [OVERLAPPING]
>> BECAUSE I THOUGHT, I'M HERE, ARE WE LOOKING AT ANOTHER SETTLEMENT? [LAUGHTER]
>> NO. WE STILL HAVEN'T FIGURED OUT ITS 2025 YET.
>> I JUST WANTED TO ADD IN A FEW COMPLIMENTS.
>> I HOPE SO, BECAUSE I LOVE THE WAY THE HOUSE IS LOOKING [OVERLAPPING].
>> I THINK THE GARAGE ADDITION IS JUST SO PERFECT.
IT COMPLIMENTS WHAT WAS THERE BEFORE.
IT ADDRESSES ONE OF MY CONCERNS IS, WE DON'T HAVE MANY EXAMPLES LEFT IN THE CITY OF THE CARRIAGE HOUSE ACCESSORY BUILDING AND THE SIZE AND SCALE OF WHAT YOU'RE PROPOSING THERE FITS THAT, WHEREAS THE PREVIOUS THING WE LOOKED AT BEING AT TWO STORIES, IT WASN'T THAT ANYMORE.
YOU GUYS HAVE TAKEN WHAT WE TALKED ABOUT LAST TIME AND COME UP WITH THIS, I THINK IS A FAR SUPERIOR PLAN.
IN YOUR DRAWINGS, YOU'VE DONE A REALLY COMPREHENSIVE JOB OF GIVING US EVERYTHING WE NEEDED TO LOOK AT TO BE ABLE TO SAY, "HEY, A GREAT JOB." THANK YOU FOR THAT.
>> THAT'S GREAT TO HEAR. THANK YOU.
>> IT IS. THIRD TIME'S A CHARM.
I REALLY DO, AND I THINK THE FERRERA FAMILY WOULD BE REALLY PLEASED TO SEE WHAT YOU'RE DOING WITH IT. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS?
>> JUST ONE QUESTION. I AGREE WITH MR. JIM.
I THINK BY FAR, THIS IS THE BEST DESIGN.
I THINK, IT'S REALLY APPROPRIATE AND REALLY WELL DONE, AND WOULD BE FULLY SUPPORTIVE OF IT.
MY ONLY QUESTION IS JUST HOW MUCH OF THAT EXISTING WALL IS GOING TO REMAIN IN PLACE THAT POTENTIALLY IS ENTOMBED OR IS IT COMING OUT.
[OVERLAPPING] BECAUSE I K, OW THE FLOOR PLAN IS NOT THAT DETAILED.
>> CORRECT. NO, GREAT QUESTION.
WE HAVE ONLY TWO PENETRATIONS IN THAT WALL THAT ARE GOING TO OCCUR FOR A DOOR.
THE ADDITION ITSELF IS A MASTER SUITE ADDITION, WHICH THE HOUSE DOESN'T REALLY HAVE ONE.
MANY OF THESE DON'T. ONE PENETRATION FOR THE ENTRY INTO THE BEDROOM AND ONE PENETRATION FOR THE ENTRY BACK INTO THE BATHROOM, SO TWO DOORS.
>> ARE THEY POTENTIALLY GOING WHERE THOSE WINDOWS ARE BEING REMOVED?
>> YES. [OVERLAPPING] I WAS GOING TO READ THAT, CORRECT.
AT LEAST ONE OF THEM IS. BOTH OF THEM ARE?
>> ONE TO THE MASTER, ANOTHER DOWN THE HALLWAY.
IT'LL BE A LITTLE OFF, BECAUSE THERE'S A CLOSET THERE, BUT IT'S IN GENERAL AREA.
>> WE TRY TO THINK OF THESE THINGS.
>> THANK YOU VERY MUCH. ANY DISCUSSION FROM THE BOARD?
>> THIS MIGHT BE A LITTLE BIT LATE. THIS MIGHT BE FOR KELLY.
IF THAT CHAMBER WAS RECOMMENDED TO COME DOWN AND MITIGATE, DO WE NOT HAVE TO HAVE THOSE ON OUR PLANS OR THAT JUST GOES THROUGH BUILDING?
>> WE'RE NOT ON THE HOOK FOR ANYTHING?
>> I GUESS, IT'S TIME TO OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING.
IF ANYONE HAS ANYTHING YOU'D LIKE TO SAY ABOUT THIS CASE, THIS IS THE TIME TO DO IT.
BREATH AND SIGH. THE PUBLIC HERE AND CLOSED.
>> I MOVE TO APPROVE HDC CASE NUMBER 2024-0028 WITHOUT CONDITIONS.
I MOVE THAT THE HDC MAKE THE FOLLOWING FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW PART OF THE RECORD.
THAT CASE 2024-0028 AS PRESENTED IS SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANT WITH THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE, AND THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT DESIGN GUIDELINES TO WARRANT FINAL APPROVAL AT THIS TIME.
>> I'D LIKE TO SECOND THAT ONE.
>> WE HAVE MOTION BY MEMBER KOSACK AND A SECOND BY MEMBER POZZETTA.
[00:25:03]
COULD YOU CALL THE ROLL PLEASE?DO YOU FEEL LIKE WE ENDED UP WITH THE BEST PLAN DUE TO YOUR FEEDBACK?
>> CHAIR FILKOFF, I KNOW HE SPOKE BEFORE THE MEETING, BUT IF I'M NOT NEEDED, I WILL ADJOURN.
>> THAT'S NOTHING. YOU 'RE NOT NEEDED.
>> CERTAINLY NOT WANT IT. ONE THING WITH THAT LAST APPLICATION, I WAS GOING TO NOTE THAT BACK ROOM ON THE HOUSE, I BELIEVE, IT WAS AN EDITION, AND THAT USED TO BE WHERE GRANNY'S ALTERATIONS WAS.
SHE HAD A LITTLE AD IN THE NEWS LEADER, AND SO SHE WAS A LOCAL SEAMSTRESS, AND SHE RENTED THAT BACK ROOM, AND I CAN REMEMBER GROWING UP AND HAVING TO GO THERE TO GET SOMETHING ALTERED.
>> WAS THAT MRS. FERRERA THAT ACTUALLY RAN THAT?
>> I DON'T THINK SHE WAS GRANNY.
NO, BUT RENTED THAT BACK SPACE THERE.
>> I HAVE FUTURE CONTACT INFORMATION I WORKED IN AT MUSEUM TO FINISH OUT THE HISTORY AT THE HOME.
>> I'D LOVE TO HAVE IN THE NEXT MEETING [OVERLAPPING].
>> I'M GOING TO HAVE SOME QUESTIONS.
DOES THAT CHANGE QUORUM NUMBERS, DOES THAT CHANGE VOTING NUMBERS ON VARIANCES, THINGS LIKE THAT [OVERLAPPING].
>> MR. PAUL, YOU MIGHT NEED TO HANG ON FOR A LITTLE MINUTE HERE.
IF YOU ALL DON'T MIND, I'M GOING TO MOVE SOMETHING ON THE AGENDA UP SO THAT WE CAN HAVE MR. PAUL STAY HERE FOR.
THIS IS THE DISCUSSION, WHERE IS IT ON THE AGENDA?
WHAT WE HAVE TALKED ABOUT DOING AND HAD CONSENSUS ABOUT IT, RIGHT NOW, THE FOUNDING DOCUMENT FOR THE DISTRICT BOARD SAYS THAT THERE ARE FIVE REGULAR MEMBERS AND TWO ALTERNATE MEMBERS.
ALTERNATE MEMBERS, JUST FOR EVERYBODY'S INFORMATION, ARE REQUESTED TO ATTEND ALL MEETINGS AND BE PREPARED TO VOTE ON ANYTHING THEY MIGHT BE SEATED TO VOTE ON.
A FRIEND OF MINE CALLED IT KISSING MY SISTER.
IT'S LIKE, YOU HAVE TO GO THROUGH ALL THE STUFF TO BE A FULL-TIME MEMBER, BUT YOU DON'T GET TO VOTE, AND YOU NEVER KNOW WHETHER YOU'RE GOING TO OR NOT.
I'M AWARE THAT THE PLANNING ADVISORY BOARD CHANGED THIS STRUCTURE A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO, I THINK, TO HAVE NO ALTERNATES ANY LONGER.
>> CORRECT. SO WHAT WE WOULD LIKE TO DO IS MAKE THAT CHANGE ON THIS BOARD, BUT THERE ARE SOME MEMBERS WHO HAVE SOME QUESTIONS THAT MIGHT BE, YOU THAT NEEDS TO ANSWER.
IF WE MOVE TO SEVEN VOTING MEMBERS, DOES THAT CHANGE HOW MANY PEOPLE HAVE TO BE PRESENT FOR A QUORUM? DOES THAT CHANGE HOW MANY YES VOTES TO GET A PASS, AND SPECIFICALLY FOR VARIANCES, DOES THAT CHANGE HOW MANY YES VOTES YOU NEED FOR A VARIANCE?
>> THAT WOULD NEED TO BE CONTEMPLATED AND ADDRESSED BECAUSE RIGHT NOW, YOU NEED THAT SUPER-MAJORITY, THOSE FOUR VOTES OUT OF FIVE FOR A VARIANCE.
IF YOU EXPANDED TO SEVEN VOTING MEMBERS FOR CONSISTENCY, THEN YOU MIGHT CONSIDER FIVE OR EVEN SIX VOTES FOR A VARIANCE.
THAT WOULD JUST BE, ULTIMATELY, UP TO THE CITY COMMISSION WHAT THEY WANT TO ADOPT IN THE AMENDMENT TO THE LDC.
A QUORUM, AS IT'S DEFINED RIGHT NOW, IS JUST A MAJORITY.
WHEREAS YOU WOULD NEED AT LEAST THREE TO BE A QUORUM, NOW YOU'RE INCREASING THAT TO IF YOU HAVE SEVEN VOTING MEMBERS TO FOUR.
>> ANYTHING ELSE TO ASK HARRISON?
>> I GUESS MAYBE THIS IS A QUESTION FOR YOU, ARLENE, THAT'S JUST I'M CURIOUS WHY WE'RE LOOKING INTO THIS?
[00:30:04]
>> FIRST OF ALL, I WAS AWARE OF THE PLANNING ADVISORY BOARD HAD MADE THE CHANGE AND THAT THERE WAS NO NEGATIVE IMPACT IN DOING THAT.
THEN WE HAD A SITUATION WHERE WE HAD AN ABUNDANCE OF OPENINGS ALL AT ONE? WE ALSO HAD A SITUATION WHERE A SEATED MEMBER HAD FORGOTTEN TO TURN IN HER PAPERWORK FOR REAPPOINTMENT UNTIL IT WAS A LITTLE BIT LATE.
I THINK A COUPLE OF WEEKS, THREE WEEKS, SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
THEN SO WE JUST HAD ALL THIS ABUNDANCE OF PEOPLE, AND THAT PERSON WHO HAD BEEN AN ALTERNATE, MS. BRYNES IS NOW MADE AN ALTERNATE AGAIN.
>> BECAUSE OF THE PAPERWORK AND BECAUSE WE HAD SO MANY OPENINGS AT THE SAME TIME, AND IT MADE ME QUESTION, WHY DO WE HAVE ALTERNATES? BECAUSE I SPENT MY TWO YEARS OVER THERE AS AN ALTERNATE, AND IT PRETTY MUCH SUCKS.
I MEAN, TO BE HONEST, YOU REALLY DO JUST HAVE TO SIT THERE.
IT'S BEEN SO LONG SINCE YOU'VE BEEN AN ALTERNATE, YOU DON'T REMEMBER.
>> WE'RE HERE TO SEE, YOU JUST CAN'T VOTE.
>> YOU CAN DISCUSS AND PARTICIPATE IN THE DISCUSSION, IT'S JUST YOU DON'T GET THAT FINAL SAY.
>> YOU DON'T GET THE FINAL SAY, AND YOU DON'T GET TO BE A MEMBER OF EVERYTHING THE BOARD IS INVOLVED.
>> I HAVE A QUESTION. THIS IS NOT CHARTERED.
WHAT DETERMINES THE NUMBER OF ANY BOARD, AND WHAT MADE THAT INITIAL DETERMINATION, WHY WOULD A BOARD BE FOUR OR FIVE OR SEVEN OR NINE OR?
>> I'M GOING TO ANSWER AND THEN KELLY, IF I SAY SOMETHING WRONG, YOU'RE GOING TO CORRECT.
YOU MAY ALSO, EVEN THOUGH WE'RE PAYING YOU TO DISAGREE WITH ME.
IT'S OKAY. THE RESEARCH THAT I DID FOR THIS WOULD TAKE THE FOUNDING DOCUMENT.
THERE'S A NAME FOR IT, ESTABLISHING CHARTER OR WHATEVER, PER EACH BOARD.
THE ADVISORY BOARDS, WHEN I WAS ON THAT A BOARD, WE NEVER HAD ALTERNATES THERE AT ALL.
I THINK IT'S PRETTY MUCH QUASI JUDICIALS THAT WERE SET UP THAT WAY.
THEY WERE SET UP THAT WAY WHEN GOD WAS A CHILD. LONG LONG AGO.
>> WHEN WE HAD POSSIBLY MORE OF AN ABUNDANCE OF VOLUNTEERS.
I NEVER TRULY UNDERSTOOD, JUST UNLESS SOMEBODY WAS ABSENT, WAS THE ONLY REASON.
>> QUASI, WE HAVE THREE QUASI BOARDS, AND THEY'RE THE ONLY ONES THAT HAVE ALTERNATES?
>> MAYBE IT WAS BECAUSE IN CASE SOMEBODY WAS ABSENT, IT WAS LIKE A BACKUP.
THERE WAS A CASE AND WE HAD A LOT MORE CASES, I MEAN, EVEN IN THE PAST FOUR YEARS, WE'VE HAD MANY FEWER CASES THAT WE'VE HAD ANY THROUGH THAT, AND VERY FEW VARIANCES.
>> WE'VE HAD BOARD MEMBERS ON SOME OF THEM THAT BECAUSE OF THE NATURE OF THEIR BUSINESS, THEY'RE CONFLICTED FROM CERTAIN MATTERS.
IT'S BEEN PRETTY COMMON IN ONE MEETING THAT BENJAMIN, WHEN HE WAS ON THE BOARD, HE WOULD HAVE TO STEP DOWN FROM THE DAYS.
>> WELL, THESE GUYS HAVE ALSO HAD TWO ON OCCASIONS?
>> RIGHT. I THINK THAT'S ALSO HELPFUL TO HAVE THOSE ALTERNATES TO FILL IN FOR THOSE CIRCUMSTANCES.
UNDERSTANDING THAT, PARTICULARLY WITH THE HDC, WHEN YOU HAVE A LEVEL OF EXPERTISE WITH YOUR MEMBERS, THAT THEY'RE GOING TO BE INVOLVED IN SOME OF THESE BUSINESS THAT COMES BEFORE YOU.
I THINK THAT'S REALLY A LOT OF THE WISDOM OF HAVING THOSE ALTERNATES.
NOW, THE PAB IS A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT BECAUSE IT IS PURELY ADVISORY.
THERE YOU'RE NOT DECIDING ANY PARTICULAR ISSUE.
YOU'RE JUST GIVING THAT ADVICE TO THE COMMISSION.
>> THE OTHER BOARD NOW THAT WOULD HAVE ALTERNATES WOULD BE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENTS?
>> CORRECT, AND CODE ENFORCEMENT.
>> IS THERE STILL A CODE ENFORCEMENT BOARD?
>> THEY STILL DO. I WAS THERE LAST WEEK.
>> WHAT ARE WE SAYING? ARE WE CHANGING OUR OPINION ABOUT IT? THE PROCESS, JUST LET ME TELL YOU WHAT THE PROCESS IS THAT I FOUND OUT.
WE HAD TO DISCUSS IT, SO I ASKED KELLY TO PUT IT ON OUR AGENDA SO THAT WE COULD HAVE AN OFFICIAL DISCUSSION, AN OFFICIAL VOTE ON WHETHER WE WANT TO DO THIS.
THEN IT HAS TO GO TO THE PAB, WHICH DOES NOT HAVE ALTERNATES.
THEN IT HAS TO GO TO THE COMMISSION.
[00:35:01]
>> TWICE TO THE COMMISSION BECAUSE IT'S AN LDC CHAIN.
>> I GUESS, I WOULD JUST PLAY DEVIL'S ADVOCATE.
I DON'T HAVE A DOG IN THIS RAISED ONE WAY OR THE OTHER.
IF I WAS A COMMISSIONER, I WOULD SAY, WHY DO YOU WANT TO HAVE SEVEN? GIVE ME THE REASON. WHY SHOULD WE VOTE ON THIS?
>> WELL, A COUPLE OF THEM HAVE ALREADY TOLD ME IT'S ALLOWED.
THEY DON'T AGREE WITH THE ALTERNATE STRUCTURE.
THERE'S A COUPLE OF THEM AT LEAST, WHO I DON'T THINK ARE GOING TO ASK ME THAT QUESTION.
IF THEY ASK, I'LL GIVE THEM THE SAME EXPLANATION WE JUST HAD.
NOW, WE HAD A SITUATION WHERE ALL THESE OPENINGS HAPPEN CONCURRENTLY, AND BECAUSE OF A PAPERWORK ISSUE, WE WERE LOSING A VOTE FROM SOMEBODY WHO HAD BEEN ON THE BOARD FOR A YEAR ALREADY AND WHO BRINGS TO THE TABLE QUITE A BIT OF EXPERTISE.
IF THAT CAN HAPPEN, WHICH I DON'T SEE WHY IT WOULDN'T HAPPEN AGAIN IF IT HAPPENED ONCE, IF THAT CAN HAPPEN, I DON'T BELIEVE THAT IT'S THE BEST WAY TO GO FOR OUR COMMUNITY.
IF THEY DISAGREE, OF COURSE, THEY'RE NOT GOING TO VOTE FOR IT.
>> OF COURSE, SOME OF THE INITIAL CONCERNS, AND MAYBE THIS IS JUST IF IT IS THE DECISION OF THIS BOARD TO SEEK THIS AND STAFFS WRITING IT.
YOU HAVE SOME DIFFICULTIES, PARTICULARLY WITH THE VARIANTS AND THE NUMBER OF VOTES REQUIRED AND THE NUMBER OF MEMBERS THAT ARE SEATED THAT EITHER AREN'T CONFLICTED OUT OR ABSENT.
YOU HAVE SORT OF A MOVING TARGET THERE ON WHAT IS REQUIRED FOR A VARIANCE, FOR EXAMPLE.
ONE OF THE WAYS YOU COULD ADDRESS THAT IS IT REQUIRES NO LESS THAN 80% OF THE VOTING MEMBERS AT A QUORUM MEETING.
I TAKE 80% BECAUSE THAT'S FOUR OUT OF FIVE.
THERE'S WHAT WE HAVE NOW FOR A VARIANCE FOR YOUR BOARD OR FOR THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT.
FOR CONSISTENCY, BUT I THINK THERE WOULD HAVE TO GIVE SOME THOUGHT IN THE MECHANISMS AND SOME OF THE UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES, AND THE POSSIBILITY THAT YOU COULD HAVE SOME MATTERS THAT FAIL BECAUSE THERE'S A DEADLOCK, YOU KNOW, A 3-3 VOTE BECAUSE ONE OF THE VOTING MEMBERS IS ABSENT.
>> I UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE SAYING.
IT'S JUST THAT IN THE TIME OF BOUNDS FOR NEVER RUN INTO EITHER OF THOSE SITUATIONS. BUT OKAY.
>> I DON'T THINK THE SYSTEM IS BROKEN.
SO FAR, I DON'T THINK WE NEED TO FIX IT.
I THINK IT'S UNFORTUNATE THAT THAT IT WENT THROUGH AT THE TIME WHEN THERE WERE SO MANY VACANCIES THAT NEEDED TO BE FILLED, BUT I THINK THAT HAPPENS IN ALL BOARDS AT SOME TIME OR ANOTHER.
IT'S JUST THE LUCK OF THE DRAW AND THE WAY THINGS HAPPEN.
I THINK IT'S UNFORTUNATE THAT TIME SLIPPED BY AND SOMEONE FORGOT TO FILL IN THE PAPERWORK, AND WHICH REMINDS ME I NEED TO SEE THAT WHEN I GET TO GET MY FINANCIAL STUFF DONE BECAUSE I MIGHT BE OFF THIS BOARD SHORTLY [LAUGHTER] FOR THE VERY REASON.
BUT I JUST THINK WHEN YOU SHOULD PROBABLY JUST LEAVE IT LIKE IT IS BECAUSE IT'S REALLY NOT BROKEN, AND IT'S WORKED VERY WELL FOR A VERY LONG TIME AND WE SHOULD CARRY ON.
>> THE ONLY THING THAT BOTHERED ME ARE THE UNFORESEEN CONSEQUENCES AND SPECIFICALLY VARIANCE ISSUES, WHICH THANKFULLY, WE DON'T HAVE TO CONSIDER VERY OFTEN BECAUSE THEY'RE TYPICALLY FRAUGHT.
I'M A LITTLE NERVOUS ABOUT WHAT THOSE UNFORESEEN CONSEQUENCES COULD BE FOR CHANGING IT.
BECAUSE I CAN'T FULLY SEE WHAT THAT PICTURE LOOKS LIKE WHEN THE NEXT VARIANCE COMES UP AND WE'VE GOT SEVEN VOTING MEMBERS.
IF IT'S 80%, DOES THAT MEAN WE NEED SIX AT OF SEVEN?
>> THAT WAS ONLY A SUGGESTION ON ONE OF THE WAYS TO ADDRESS IT.
I THINK THE DEVILS IN THE DETAILS IF IT IS CHANGING.
YOU NEED TO THINK ABOUT HOW IT'S GOING TO IMPACT THOSE OTHER PROVISIONS IS WHAT IT MEANS.
>> A VARIANCE IS ALREADY DIFFICULT.
DOES THAT MAKE IT EVEN MORE DIFFICULT?
>> ANY OTHER COMMENTS? IT SOUNDS AS THOUGH THE BOARD IS NOT IN FAVOR OF MOVING AHEAD WITH THAT.
>> I THINK I'M A LITTLE TOO UNEASY TO VOTE YAY ON IT.
>> WE WILL GO FORWARD WITH ALTERNATES.
[00:40:03]
>> WE HAVE PUT OUT SOCIAL MEDIA REQUEST FOR PEOPLE WITH INTERESTS TO APPLY TO BE ON THIS BOARD TO DO SO.
HOPEFULLY, WE'LL GET SOMEBODY SOON AND TELL THEM THAT THEY GET TO BE AN ALTER.
THE NEXT ITEM ON THE AGENDA IS 4.2 HDC 2024-26 CITY FERNANDINA BEACH,
[4.2 HDC 2024-0026 CITY OF FERNANDINA BEACH, CENTRE STREET "DOWNTOWN STREETSCAPE"]
CENTER STREET, DOWNTOWN STREET SCAPE.I THINK IS THAT YOU, MRS. FINKELSTEIN?
>> THANK YOU FOR LETTING ME ASK QUESTIONS.
>> GOOD EVENING, MATT JOURNEY WITH KIMLEY-HORN, 380 BANYAN FOREST DRIVE.
THANK YOU FOR ALLOWING ME TO BE HERE TONIGHT.
I'M EXCITED TO PRESENT AN EXCITING PROJECT FOR THE DOWNTOWN CITY OF FERNANDINA BEACH.
I WANT TO START BY GOING OVER OUR OBJECTIVES WITH THIS DESIGN, WHAT WERE THE MAIN GOALS WE HAD IN MIND WHEN WE FIRST STARTED.
NUMBER 1, WE WANTED TO REPLACE ALL OF THE SIDEWALKS, THE CROSSWALKS, AND CURBS WITH CONSISTENT PAVING THROUGHOUT THE DOWNTOWN.
IF YOU LOOK NOW THERE'S A LOT OF DIFFERENT MATERIALS.
IT GOES A LOT OF DIFFERENT DESIGN DIRECTION, BUT WE WANT TO CREATE A CONSISTENT OVERALL THEME THROUGHOUT THE DOWNTOWN CORRIDOR.
NUMBER 2, WE WANTED TO PROTECT AND ENHANCE THE EXISTING TREES, THE EXISTING LIVE OAKS, ESPECIALLY WITHIN THE CORRIDOR, AND THOSE ROOT ZONES THAT GO WITH THOSE TREES.
NOT ONLY WE BY DOING THAT, WE'LL CREATE SHADE MORE SHADE FOR PEDESTRIANS, AND THEN WE'LL ALSO REPLACE THE EXISTING LANDSCAPING THROUGHOUT THE CORRIDOR AS WELL.
NUMBER 3, WE WANTED TO CREATE A SAFER PEDESTRIAN EXPERIENCE AND INCREASE ADA COMPLIANCE THROUGHOUT THE PEDESTRIAN CORRIDOR.
NUMBER 4, WE WANTED TO MAINTAIN THE HISTORIC THEME AND REUSE HISTORIC MATERIALS THROUGHOUT THE CORRIDOR WHEN FEASIBLE.
WE'RE ALSO GOING TO INCORPORATE A NEW LIGHTING SYSTEM DOWNTOWN WITH NEW LIGHT FIXTURES.
IT'S A COMPLETE REFURBISHMENT, REFRESH OF THE DOWNTOWN.
WHAT WE'VE DONE NOW IS WE'VE CREATED A GRAPHIC FOR YOU BECAUSE I KNOW LOOKING AT 100 PAGE DOCUMENT PLAN SET CAN BE DIFFICULT.
WE'VE CREATED THIS DOCUMENT TO LAY SIDE TO SIDE EACH BLOCK SECTION, IF I CAN PULL IT OUT A LITTLE BIT.
I'LL TRY TO WALK YOU GUYS THROUGH WHAT WE'VE DONE IN EACH BLOCK.
>> CAN YOU HOLD ON JUST A SECOND.
KELLY, DO WE HAVE THIS PRESENTATION IN OUR PACKET?
>> WE'RE GOING TO LOOK UP HERE.
>> I CAN TRY TO WALK YOU GUYS THROUGH.
THE FIRST BLOCK HERE IS FROM FRONT STREET TO SECOND STREET, ESSENTIALLY THE RAILROAD TRACKS TO TO SECOND STREET.
WHAT WE'RE DOING HERE IS IS A CONSISTENT THEME THROUGHOUT.
WE'RE GOING TO REPLACE ALL OF THE CONCRETE CURVES THROUGHOUT, AND WE'RE GOING TO REPLACE THEM WITH NEW CONCRETE.
NOW, THE AREAS WE HAVE GRANITE CURVES, WE'RE GOING TO KEEP THOSE GRANITE CURVES IN PLACE, AND ESPECIALLY RIGHT IN FRONT OF THE PARKING SPACES.
THE EXCESS GRANITE CURVES THAT WE HAVE LIKE HERE, WE'LL TAKE THAT UP AND REUSE IN OTHER AREAS THROUGHOUT THE DOWNTOWN.
AS YOU CAN SEE, THE YELLOW AREAS ARE AREAS THAT WE'RE REMOVING ASPHALT.
TO DO THAT, WHAT WE'RE DOING THAT FOR IS TO CREATE A LARGER GROWING AREA FOR THE EXISTING TREES.
THERE'S A MONSTER LIVE OAK THAT JUST NEEDS MORE SPACE.
WE'RE TRYING TO CREATE MORE SPACE FOR TREES TO GROW WITHOUT BECOMING A PROBLEM IN THE FUTURE.
BECAUSE IF YOU DON'T GIVE THEM ENOUGH SPACE, THEY'RE GOING TO START KICKING UP SIDEWALKS CURVES AND YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE ISSUES DOWN THE ROAD THAT WE DON'T WANT TO HAVE.
IF YOU LOOK AT THAT DEMO SHEET, THIS IS THE PROPOSED SECTION.
LET ME GO BACK TO THE WALLS HERE. THE SEAT WALLS.
[00:45:02]
THIS SEAT WALL IS ENCROACHING REALLY CLOSE TO THIS LIVE OAK.WE'RE PROPOSING TO REMOVE THAT SEAT WALL, AND THEN AND THEN REPLACE IT WITH A SIMILAR SEAT WALL, THE SAME SEAT WALL JUST IN A DIFFERENT AREA.
WE'VE GIVEN THAT LIVE OAK MORE ROOM TO GROW NOW.
IT'S ESSENTIALLY GOES FROM THAT TO TO THIS.
THEN ALSO, WE'VE NOW CREATED AN HANDICAP SPACE HERE WITH AN ADA HANDICAP RAMP.
THEN ONE OF THE SPECIAL FEATURES WE'VE DONE THROUGHOUT THE CORRIDOR IS AT EACH INTERSECTION, WE'VE CREATED BUMP OUTS, WHICH WILL PROTECT PEDESTRIAN SAFETY.
I THINK A LOT OF YOUR INTERSECTIONS CURRENTLY THEY THEY'RE ALMOST THERE, BUT THEY'RE NOT QUITE THERE THERE FOR PEDESTRIAN SAFETY.
WHAT WE'VE DONE IS WE'VE CREATED A BIGGER AREA FOR PEDESTRIANS WITH ADA RAMPS, TACTILE WARNING SYSTEMS FOR ADA.
ALSO, WE'RE WANTED TO TOUCH ON THE CROSSWALKS.
THE CROSSWALKS ARE EXISTING HISTORIC BRICKS.
THOSE BRICKS WE WILL MAINTAIN, WE'RE GOING TO WE PROPOSE TO PULL THEM UP AND RELAY THEM ON A CONCRETE BASE.
WE WE WON'T HAVE A ANY OF THE PROBLEMS YOU MIGHT BE EXPERIENCING NOW WITH THEM.
WHEN WE RE INSTALL THEM, THEY'RE GOING TO BE THEY'RE GOING TO BE LAID ON CONCRETE BASE WITH MORTAR SET, SO THEY'RE GOING TO BE THERE FOR THE LONG HAUL.
>> MATT, HOW DO YOU WANT US TO ASK YOU QUESTIONS?
>> DOES ANYBODY HAVE ANY QUESTIONS YET? I KNOW I DO.
>> GO AHEAD. THIS TREE HAS PEAR TREES DOWN THERE.
WHAT HAPPENS TO THOSE TREES? BECAUSE I WAS TOLD THEY HAD OUTLIVED THEIR LIFE EXPECTANCY 20 YEARS.
>> YOU WE'RE TOLD CORRECT. WE ARE PROPOSING TO REMOVE THE PEARS AND REPLACE THOSE WITH A DIFFERENT TREE.
RIGHT NOW WE'VE GOT DRAKE ELMS COMING IN IN PLACE OF THEM, BUT WE ALSO HAVE NEW PALM TREES ALONG THE SIDEWALK AS WELL AS THE ELMS WOULD BE HERE.
ALL OF THESE WILL HAVE NEW SHRUBS IN GROUND COVER PLANTED UNDERNEATH AS WELL.
>> WHEN YOU SAID THAT YOU WOULD PULL UP SOME OF THE CROSSWALK BRICKS HAVE TO BE PULLED UP TO MAKE ROOM FOR THESE AREAS YOU JUST DESCRIBED, RIGHT THERE, FOR EXAMPLE, WHAT HAPPENS TO THOSE BRICKS?
>> WE'RE GOING TO REUSE THOSE BRICKS.
WE'RE GOING TO NEED EVERY BIT OF BRICK THAT WE PULL UP BECAUSE WE DO EXPECT TO LOSE SOME OF THE BRICKS AS THE CONTRACTORS WILL PULL THEM UP.
THERE'S A CERTAIN PERCENTAGE, SOME MAY BREAK AS WE PULL THEM UP.
BUT WE DO HAVE A STOCK PILE, I'M TOLD.
WE'RE GOING TO REUSE THE BRICKS THAT WE PULL UP ALONG WITH THE STOCKPILE TO RESET.
>> DO YOU EXPECT IN PULLING OF ANY OF THE GRANITE CURVE THAT'S THERE THAT YOU'LL BE ABLE TO REUSE THAT ANYWHERE?
>> YES, MA'AM. I'LL SHOW YOU SOME AREAS THAT WE'RE GOING TO REUSE THE GRANITE CURB ON UP THE STREET.
>> THE BRICKS THAT THEY'RE PULLING UP, HAVE YOU DONE ANY INVESTIGATIVE EXPLORATION TO SEE HOW THEY ARE SET RIGHT NOW?
LOOKED LIKE IT POSSIBLY HAD GROUT JOINTS THROUGHOUT, AND OVER TIME, THE GROUT HAS JUST WORN AWAY.
BUT I'M NOT SURE WHAT'S UNDERNEATH THAT, WHETHER IT'S CONCRETE OR JUST A COMPACTED BASE, BUT TO DO IT THE PROPER WAY, WE'D WANT TO HAVE A CONCRETE BASE AND THEN SET THEM IN MORTAR.
>> BUT YOU DON'T ANTICIPATE TRYING TO REMOVE THEM AND THEN DESTROYING THEM BECAUSE THE REMOVAL IS TOO IMPOSSIBLE?
>> I DON'T THINK IT WOULD BE TOO IMPOSSIBLE.
I THINK WE SHOULD BE ABLE TO DO IT.
I CAN'T GUARANTEE THAT WE WON'T LOSE SOME OF THEM, AND I FULLY EXPECT WE'LL LOSE SOME OF THEM, BUT NOT TO THE EXTENT WHERE WE CAN'T REUSE.
>> LET ME HELP IT ON THAT QUESTION.
>> JEREMIAH, CITY MANAGER'S OFFICE.
WHILE I JUST WANT TO JUMP IN ON THAT, KIMLEY-HORN HAS NOT COME UP HERE TO PULL UP ANY BRICKS IN THAT AREA, BUT CITY STAFF HAS FOR VARIOUS REASONS.
WE HAD SOME WATER LINES BREAK IN VARIOUS PLACES.
WE HAVE PULLED THEM UP, AND WE'VE NEVER HAD AN ISSUE WITH THEM BEING DESTROYED.
THE BRICKS BACK THEN ARE EXTREMELY RESILIENT.
THAT'S WHY THEY'RE STILL THERE WITH ALL THE VEHICLE TRAFFIC THAT WE'VE
[00:50:02]
HAD FOR DECADES AND FOR THAT PURPOSE.THE BRICKS HAVE NOT BROKE WHEN WE REMOVED THEM, THE MORTAR BRAKES BEFORE THE BRICKS DO.
WE'VE BEEN FORTUNATE IN OUR EXPERIENCE THAT WE'VE NOT HAD ANY BRICK DAMAGE WHEN WE PULLED.
>> JEREMIAH, ONE MORE THING ON THAT.
WHEN WE REDO OLD HOUSES, THEY WERE TYPICALLY DONE WITH A SOFT LINE MORTAR FOR THE VERY REASON THAT THEY DIDN'T WANT TO CRAFT THE BRICKS.
WHEN WE GO BACK AND WE USE A LOT OF THE ANTIQUE BRICKS, WE HAVE TO GO WITH A SOFT WE CAN'T GO WITH AN N OR AN S TYPE MORTAR.
WE HAVE TO GO WITH A SOFTER MORTAR.
ARE WE POTENTIALLY PUTTING THEM IN A BAD SITUATION WHERE WE'RE PUTTING THEM ON CONCRETE AND THEN SETTING THEM IN A VERY HARD-BASED MORTAR WHERE THAT COULD CAUSE YOU ANY DAMAGE TO THE BRICKS LONG-TERM.
>> IT WOULD DEPEND ON THE SPECK OF THE CONCRETE MIX, BUT YEAH, THAT WOULD DEFINITELY NEED TO BE TAKEN INTO CONSIDERATION.
>> JEREMIAH, WHILE YOU'RE STILL UP THERE, PLEASE.
WHEN YOU HAVE TO TAKE THEM UP, WHAT WERE THEY ON? WERE THEY ON DIRT?
>> NO, THEY'RE IN A CONCRETE BASE.
>> THEY ARE. IS THAT DONE IN THE '70S? BECAUSE I CAN'T BELIEVE IN 1905, THEY PUT IT ON CONCRETE.
WE HAVE FOUND SOME AREAS WHERE THERE'S NOT CONCRETE UNDERNEATH, BUT THERE'S NUMEROUS AREAS WHERE THERE IS.
BUT THESE BRICK CROSSWALKS REALLY NEED TO BE ADDRESSED.
NOW THAT WE'VE TALKED ABOUT, AND YOU'LL NOTICE SOME, THERE'S A LOT OF UNDULATIONS AND DIPS AND ROOTS ARE BUCKLING UP THE BRICKS IN SOME AREAS, SO THEY DEFINITELY NEED TO BE ADDRESSED.
>> THAT WAS ANOTHER ASPECT WITH THE CROSSWALKS WAS THE ADA COMPLIANCE.
THE GAPS IN SOME OF THE BRICKS ARE GREATER THAN A HALF AN INCH WHICH CREATES A PROBLEM FOR ADA.
THAT WAS ONE OF THE MAJOR THINGS WE LOOKED AT WHEN WE FIRST CAME SO THOSE NEEDED TO BE ADDRESSED PRETTY QUICKLY.
>> BUT BECAUSE WE WILL KEEP THEM.
>> THANK YOU. I JUST WANTED THOSE WORDS SAID.
>> THE TOUGH THING ABOUT THAT, THOUGH, IS WITH ADA, YOU CAN ONLY HAVE A VERY SMALL TOLERANCE OF LIPPAGE, AND THESE BRICKS AREN'T UNIFORM.
THAT'S TO ME, AS A LANDSCAPER THE DRAWBACK OF GOING ON A CONCRETE BASE, BECAUSE YOU HAVE THIS DEAD LEVEL FLAT OR CROWNED MAYBE BASE.
THEN YOU'RE TRYING TO PUT MATERIALS OF VARYING SIZES TO EVEN OUT OF THE TOP.
YOU EITHER HAVE TO BACK BUTTER DIFFERENTLY, BUT IT'S A LONG AND SLOW PROCESS TO GET IT DONE.
>> YES, IT'S NOT GOING TO BE EASY FOR SURE.
REUSING HISTORIC MATERIAL IS DEFINITELY A CHALLENGE.
>> MY UNDERSTANDING REGARDING THE BRICK THAT POTENTIALLY, YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE ENOUGH EXTRA BRICKS BECAUSE YOU'RE INCREASING SIZES OF THE PEDESTRIAN AREAS, ETC THAT YOU'RE GOING TO BE ABLE TO CREATE ANOTHER BRICK CROSSWALK, I THINK ON 7TH.
>> WE'RE ACTUALLY GOING TO GAIN A BRICK AREA BY STRATEGICALLY REUSING SOME OF THESE BRICKS.
I'M REALLY HOPEFUL THAT THEY COME UP NICELY AND DON'T GET DAMAGED.
I DID HAVE A QUESTION BECAUSE I WAS UNFAMILIAR WITH THESE DRAKE ELMS, SO I DUG INTO IT ON GOOGLE.
THEY LOOK VERY ATTRACTIVE, BUT I DID NOTE THAT IT TALKS ABOUT THEY NEED FREQUENT PRUNING FOR LOW BRANCHING CANOPY, AND THEY'RE PRONE TO STORM DAMAGE.
I JUST WANTED TO ASK IS THAT THE RIGHT TREE FOR HERE? I DON'T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT TREES, REALLY, SO I'M POSING IT TO YOU TO JUST MAKE SURE THAT WE'VE CONSIDERED THOSE.
WE DID CONSIDER A LOT OF TREES, AND ULTIMATELY, THE DRAKE ELM IS A GREAT DOWNTOWN STREET TREE.
ONE OF THE MAIN REASONS WE LIKE IT IS IT'S SEMI DECIDUOUS.
DURING THE SUMMERTIME IT'S GOING TO PROVIDE GREAT SHADE.
THEN WE ALL KNOW WE NEED SHADE IN THE SUMMER.
THEN IN THE WINTER, IT WILL DROP SOME OF ITS LEAVES AND SO THAT'LL ALLOW THE SUN TO COME IN AND WARM THINGS UP.
THAT'S THE DIRECTION WHERE WE'RE HEADED, AND WE KNOW IT'S WORKED WELL IN OTHER CITIES IN THE DOWNTOWN SECTIONS.
>> IT'S THE CLASSIC BUILDERS SIDEWALK OR PARKING LOT TREE.
THEY GO AND THEY TAKE A LOT OF POLLUTION AND STREET POLLUTION, IT'S PROBABLY NOT THE BEST.
IT'S NOT A NATIVE, IT'S NOT A HARDWOOD.
I WOULD ECHO MAYBE LOOKING INTO SOMETHING A LITTLE BIT MORE INDIGENOUS TO THIS AREA.
>> WE COULD DEFINITELY LOOK AT GOING WITH SOMETHING NATIVE.
[00:55:01]
>> SOMETHING THAT WON'T BLOW AWAY IN THE FIRST HURRICANE.
>> WILL YOU HAVE IRRIGATION SET UP, TOO?
>> WELL, AT THE RISK OF BEING TIRED OF HEAVEN, SHOULD WE EVEN TALK ABOUT PUTTING HISTORIC BRICKS IN THE STREET TO BE CONTINUED TO BE DRIVEN ON? SHOULD WE SAVE THOSE AND PUT THEM IN A LESS TRAVELED AREA AND PUT SOMETHING ELSE IN THE ROAD THAT CAN BE CONCRETED AND LEVELED FOR ADA AND ALL OF THIS? THERE MUST BE SOME OTHER PLACE THOSE OLD HISTORIC BRICKS COULD BE USED WHERE THEY WON'T BE DAMAGED OR CAN BE MORE PROPERLY USED FOR SOMETHING.
IN THIS DAY AND AGE, YOU CAN DO ALL KINDS OF THINGS TO MAKE STUFF LOOK OLD AND GET THE SAME LOOK THAT EVERYBODY WANTS WITHOUT DAMAGING THE ORIGINAL HISTORIC ITEM.
THAT'S JUST A THOUGHT. DON'T RUN ME OUT OF TOWN.
>> THE OTHER THING I WOULD SAY, AND I APPRECIATE YOUR SENSE OF PRESERVATION THERE, BUT THEN I THINK WE RUN A REALLY FINE LINE OF CUTTING OFF OUR NOSES SPITE OUR FACE.
WE WANTED TO SAVE THESE BRICKS, SO WE PUT THEM SOMEPLACE, AND THEN WE HOMOGENIZE THE CHARM OF WHAT WE HAVE.
THERE'S SO MANY CITIES THAT HAVE THESE ISSUES, SAVANNAH, CHARLESTON, DIFFERENT PARTS OF ATLANTA.
IT'S NOT 100% ADA BECAUSE THEY'RE OLD AND IT'S UNEVEN, BUT THAT COBBLED LOOK, I THINK IS SO IMPORTANT TO OUR DOWNTOWN.
>> I THOUGHT LIKE YOU. I PUT THAT IN THE PRO AND CON SCALES AND OVER IN THE PRO SCALES, LOOKING AT THE BRICK CROSSWALKS, YOU GET THE VISUAL, YOU CAN SEE THAT THERE'S A DIFFERENCE HERE.
HEY, THAT'S WHERE PEOPLE CROSS.
YOU GET THE AUDITORY, WHEN YOU HEAR THOSE CARS GO [NOISE] AND THEY DRIVE OVER IT.
I LOVE THAT SOUND WHEN THEY GO THROUGH HERE.
THEN YOU ALSO GET THE TACTILE, WHEN YOU'RE WALKING, YOU CAN FEEL IT.
IN MY MIND, WHEN I WEIGHED THOSE SCALES, EVEN CONSIDERING PRESERVING THE BRICK, I THINK IT'S STILL BEST USE.
>> WELL, I WAS THINKING MORE OF A NEWER BRICK BECAUSE I'M ALSO THINKING, BUT I JUST DON'T WANT MORE TORN UP.
>> I BELIEVE THAT I'VE HEARD IN THE PAST THAT THOSE BRICKS THEY HAVE KEPT UP WELL CONSIDERING.
>> YES. THAT'S WHAT JEREMIAH'S [INAUDIBLE]
>> IF I HAD MY WAY, THE WHOLE STREET WOULD BE THE WAY IT IS.
>> YOU MIGHT FIND SOME UNDERNEATH THERE.
>> A LOT BETTER THAN WHAT WE COULD GET [OVERLAPPING]
>> THOSE BRICKS, I THINK IS PART OF THE CHARACTER.
THE FACT THAT WE CAN TELL PEOPLE THAT THEY'VE BEEN THERE SINCE 1905 IS PRETTY COOL.
>> I DON'T WANT TO HOLD UP THE SHOW. IT'S RIGHT BACK AFTER.
>> I APPRECIATE IT. THANK YOU.
>> WE'LL GO ON TO THE NEXT BLOCK, 2ND TO 3RD STREET.
AS YOU SEE ON THIS FIRST DEMO PLAN, I DON'T KNOW WHAT'S GOING ON HERE.
WE'VE GOT SOME WALLS THAT ARE GOING TO BE REPLACED HERE BECAUSE OF THE PROXIMITY TO THE EXISTING LIVE OAKS.
WE'VE GOT SOME DAMAGE TO THE SEAT WALLS ALREADY.
WE'RE GOING TO TRY TO GIVE THEM THE TREES A LITTLE BIT MORE SPACE FOR ROOM TO GROW IN THE FUTURE.
THE PURPLE THAT YOU SEE HERE ARE THE WALLS THAT WE'LL REMOVE AND THEN ON THE NEXT SHEET IS HOW WE WOULD REPLACE THEM.
SIMILAR AREAS, BUT JUST GIVING THE TREES MORE SPACE.
>> MAYOR, DO WE HAVE A KEY FOR THIS LIKE THE ORANGE PURPLE, YELLOW, WHAT ALL THE COLORS ARE?
>> I DIDN'T ADD A KEY, BUT THE ORANGE IS THE PROPOSED CURB, AS WELL AS ON THE DEMO SHEETS, IT'S THE CURB THAT'S GOING TO COME OUT.
THE PURPLE IS THE SEAT WALLS AND THEN THE BLUE, THE CYAN IS THE GRANITE CURB THAT WE PROPOSE TO REMAIN.
>> WHAT I'M MISSING, AND IT'S PROBABLY JUST BECAUSE I CAN'T.
[01:00:05]
ANYWAY, WE'RE REMOVING SOME OF THE SEAT WALLS BUT WE'RE REPLACING SOME OF THE SEAT WALLS, SO WE WILL STILL HAVE THOSE LITTLE WALLS DOWN THERE AND SEATING AROUND THEM.THEY JUST MIGHT NOT BE IN THE SAME PLACE OR MIGHT NOT BE IN THE SAME SHAPE FOOTPRINT.
>> ONE MORE QUESTION ON THESE BRICK CROSSWALKS.
RIGHT WHERE WE'RE LOOKING ON, WHAT IS THAT? SECOND TO THIRD.
RIGHT THERE IN THE CENTER, YOU'VE GOT A CALL UP THAT SAYS EXISTING BRICK CROSSWALK TO BE REMOVED AND SALVAGED FOR REUSE.
WHY ARE WE REMOVING THAT ONE? ARE WE REMOVING ALL OF THEM AND REPAVING?
>> WE'RE REMOVING ALL OF THEM AND THEN WE'RE RESETTING THEM IN THE SAME SPOT.
>> IN THE SAME [OVERLAPPING] SPOT.
I GOT YOU TO GET THEM SET AND THE NEW INSTALLATION PROCESS.
>> YEAH. HERE'S THE LANDSCAPE PLAN IN THE SAME AREA.
THE YELLOW THAT I'VE HIGHLIGHTED OR THE LANDSCAPE AREAS THAT HAVE ENLARGED THROUGHOUT THE PROCESS.
WE REALLY WANTED TO GIVE THE EXISTING TREES AS MUCH SPACE AS POSSIBLE FOR ITS CONTINUED GROWTH WITHOUT CONTINUAL DEGRADING OF THE CONCRETE AND THE SIDEWALKS AROUND THEM.
>> MAYOR, AT THE TOP OF THAT 2ND TO 3RD STREET, THE YELLOW, THAT ONE.
I BELIEVE THAT'S WHERE THAT BOTTLE TREE IS, LIKE BALLS AROUND IT?
>> IT'S A BOTTLE TREE IN FRONT OF [OVERLAPPING]
>> THERE WAS A BOTTLEBRUSH ON THE FIRST BLOCK. THIS ONE.
>> THAT WAS FROM THE [INAUDIBLE] COPY.
>> SORRY. LIKE MY QUESTION THEN, ON THAT BOTTLE TREE, IS THAT STAYING?
>> IS THAT WALL AROUND IT STAYING?
THEN WHEN WE GO TO 3RD TO 4TH STREET.
AGAIN, HERE YOU SEE WE'VE GOT MORE WALLS THAT ARE GOING TO COME OUT, AND WE'RE GOING TO REPLACE THOSE.
I'LL SHOW YOU THOSE ON THE NEXT SLIDE, AS WELL AS THE ENLARGEMENTS OF THE LANDSCAPE AREA, SO THESE AREAS ARE CURRENTLY ASPHALT.
WE'RE GOING TO REMOVE THAT ASPHALT AND MAKE IT A LANDSCAPE AREA.
ALL THE CURB IS GOING TO COME OUT HERE AND BE REPLACED AS WELL.
HERE YOU SEE THE NEW LAYOUT OF THE SEAT WALLS.
VERY SIMILAR SIZE AND SPACE, BUT JUST DIFFERENT ORIENTATION TO ALLOW EXTRA SPACE.
AGAIN, WE TRY TO KEEP GRANITE CURB IN FRONT OF ALL THE PARKING SPACES.
THEN CONCRETE CURB ANYWHERE WHERE WE'RE DOING CURBS OR THINGS LIKE THAT.
>> BETWEEN 3RD AND 4TH, ARE THERE SEATS WITH THOSE WALLS OR JUST WALLS TO SIT ON?
>> IT'S A SEAT WALL. THERE'S NOT GOING TO BE A BENCH IN FRONT OF IT. IT'S JUST GOING TO BE THE SEAT WALL.
>> LIKE SF 105, IS THAT A CALL OUT FOR A LIGHT?
>> THIS IS NOT THE LIGHTING PLAN, BUT IF YOU LOOK AT MY LITTLE ARROW HERE, SO THAT IS A LIGHT FIXTURE HERE.
>> THOSE WILL BE ALL NEW LIGHT FIXTURES.
>> WILL THERE BE GENERALLY THE SAME NUMBER OF LIGHT FIXTURES THAT WE HAVE NOW?
>> THAT'S A GOOD QUESTION. I'M NOT ENTIRELY SURE, BUT I THINK WE DEFINITELY HAVE PROVIDED THE ADEQUATE FOOT CANDLES THAT IS REQUIRED.
>> THE LAMPING AND THE CRI AND THE COLOR INDEXING, IS THAT ALL YOUR PURVIEW OR IS THAT CITY HAD ITS OWN?
>> THE FIXTURES WERE ALREADY CHOSEN AND THOSE ARE THE FIXTURES THAT WE USED.
[01:05:07]
>> THE CALLING IN THE PAST, I BELIEVE, HAS BEEN AMBER FOR DOWNTOWN.
>> IT'S A WARMER LIGHT. I KNOW I'D HAVE TO GO BACK AND LOOK AT THE SPECS ON IT, BUT IT WASN'T A WHITE LIGHT.
>> I WANT TO SAY IT WAS A 3,000K.
>> THESE ARE THE SPECS THAT WE PROVIDED, PRETTY RIGHT.
THESE ARE LIGHTS THAT YOU ALL ALREADY APPROVED MONTHS AGO. YES.
>> BUT WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT IS THE COLOR OF THE LIGHT THAT'S SOFT.
>> IT WAS A 2,700, I THINK, AS I RECALL, SOFT WHITE.
>> AGAIN, THE LARGE LIVE OAKS, WE REALLY WANT TO GIVE THEM THE SPACE THAT THEY NEED.
>> YOU'RE NOT TAKING ANY OF THEM OUT?
IN THIS AREA, YOU SEE IN THE PURPLE, THOSE ARE THE CURRENT HEX PAVERS THAT WE ARE GOING TO PULL UP AND THEN REINSTALL ON THE NEXT SHEET.
WE'RE GOING TO MAKE THE ENTIRE BLOCK ON BOTH SIDES OF CENTER STREET HEX PAVERS.
IN ORDER TO DO THAT, WE'RE GOING TO REUSE THE HEX PAVERS THAT WE HAVE, THE ONES THAT ARE IN GOOD SHAPE AND THEN JEREMIAH SAID WE HAVE A STOCKPILE ALREADY IN THE CITY.
THEN ANY SHORTAGE, WE'RE GOING TO ADD TO THAT WITH NEW PAVERS.
IT'LL BE A RANDOM MIXTURE INTO THE HISTORIC PAVERS.
BUT IN ORDER TO GET THE WHOLE BLOCK ON BOTH SIDES, WE JUST NEEDED THAT FOR THE QUANTITIES.
>> I THINK THAT'S A REALLY SMART WAY TO APPROACH IT, AND I REALLY LIKE THAT BOTH SIDES, THE ENTIRE BLOCK WILL BE HEX PAVER.
BECAUSE RIGHT NOW IT JUST FEELS LIKE LITTLE TINY AREAS HERE AND THERE AND THIS IS GOING TO MAKE IT DEMARCATE THAT ZONE SPECIAL.
>> AGAIN, IN EVERY BLOCK YOU SEE, WE HAVE THESE BUMP OUTS AS WELL.
LIKE IF WE GO BACK AND LOOK YOU CAN SEE HOW THIS END OF THE BLOCK BUMPS OUT TO CREATE A MORE PEDESTRIAN FRIENDLY SPACE HERE.
AGAIN, ENLARGEMENTS OF LANDSCAPE AREAS FOR TREES.
HERE'S THE WALLS THAT WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO REMOVE HERE AND REPLACE.
AS I GO DOWN TO THE NEXT SHEET, WE'VE REPLACED IT HERE, BUT HERE WE DIDN'T HAVE THE SPACE NEEDED BECAUSE THIS INTRUDES INTO THIS SPACE HERE.
WE REALLY NEEDED TO GIVE THIS TREE AS MUCH SPACE AS POSSIBLE.
INSTEAD OF REDOING THE WALL HERE, WE'VE JUST ADDED THE BENCHES HERE.
>> AS YOU CAN SEE THAT'S A REALLY BIG TREE AND WE JUST COULDN'T PUT THAT WALL BACK IN THERE.
>> OKAY. WOULD YOU HAPPEN TO KNOW THE OVERALL IN THIS PROJECT NOT JUST ALONG CENTER STREET BUT WITH THE SIDE STREETS MARKING SOUTH AS WELL.
I BELIEVE THERE'S A NET GAIN OF PARKING SPACES?
>> S ON CENTER STREET ITSELF THERE IS A NET LOSS BUT WE INTEND TO TRY TO MAKE THOSE UP ON THE SIDE STREETS.
>> SO OVERALL THE PROJECT ANY PARKING.
>> CORRECT. THAT'S THE GOAL, YEAH.
>> DO YOU HAVE ANY SORT OF MEASUREMENT.
LINEAR FOOT OR OTHERWISE OR THE SEAT WALLS THAT WERE ADDING OR SUBTRACTING FROM THE TOTAL STREETSCAPE?
>> WE DO, I DON'T HAVE IT OFF ON THE TOP OF MY HEAD BUT I CAN CERTAINLY GET THAT INFORMATION.
>> I WAS CURIOUS ABOUT THAT TOO, IT SEEMS LIKE WE'RE LOSING THE TREES.
>> MAYBE THIS HAS BEEN DISCUSSED RIGHT BUT THE BENCHES THAT ARE DOWNTOWN ARE THOSE?
[01:10:05]
>> THE EXISTING BENCHES WE'RE GOING TO REUSE.
YEAH. SO WE DON'T WE DON'T INTEND TO BRING IN ANY DIFFERENT STYLE BENCHES.
>> AND THEN 6TH-7TH STREET, THIS STREET IS ONE THAT I BELIEVE HAS A DRIVEWAY THAT COMES IN HERE, AND WE'RE GOING TO CLOSE THAT DRIVEWAY OF.
AND THEN AS YOU SEE THE NEXT SLIDE.
>> THEY HAVE A TRUCK PARKED THERE.
>> AND THEN AT SEVENTH STREET, YOU SEE HERE, THE NEW BRICK CROSSWALKS THAT WE ARE PROPOSING TO PUT IN HERE.
IT'S GOING TO CROSS ON ALL FOUR CORNERS.
>> YOU'RE USING THE EXTRA BRICKS?
>> WE'RE USING THE EXTRA BRICKS
>> RIGHT NOW, THERE'S NO CROSSWALK CROSSING CENTER STREET AND THERE'S STAMPED ASPHALT CROSSING SEVENTH STREET ON BOTH SIDES.
THE MAJOR CHANGE HERE IS, AGAIN, WE'RE CREATING THIS BUMP OUT HERE TERMINAL ISLAND, WE'D LIKE TO CALL THEM, IN FRONT OF THE PARKING SPACE TO CREATE A SEPARATION BETWEEN THE TURN LANE AND THE PARKING SPACES.
WE'RE ALSO CLOSING OFF THE DRIVEWAY HERE TO THE RESTAURANT THERE'S A ONE HANDICAP SPACE SPOT THERE.
>> AND [INAUDIBLE] KNOWS THAT?
>> I BELIEVE THAT THAT'S BEEN COMMUNICATED YES.
>> OKAY. BECAUSE IT USED TO BE A GAS STATIONS.
>> WELL, ACTUALLY IT USED TO BE DOREE'S HOME.
>> USED TO BE WHAT? GAS STATION.
>> DOREE'S HOME IS WHERE THE GAS STATION IS AND IT WAS A BEAUTIFUL HOME.
>> ON THE CORNER OF EIGHTH LAND?
>> WELL, THAT WAS ALWAYS A GOLF GAS STATION WHEN I WAS GROWING UP.
>> CAN YOU SCROLL DOWN TO THE HARD SKATE PLAN, SEVENTH? YOU'RE IN CONTROL OF IT.
WHAT ARE THOSE ALL THE SQUARE BOXES ON THE BOTTOM?
>> THOSE ARE TREE BITS, THAT'S WHERE THE TREES WILL BE.
>> THOSE ARE PALMS, YES, MA'AM.
>> AND HOW MUCH ROOM IS IN BETWEEN THE BUILDING AND THE CORNER OF THAT? I WAS LOOKING AT THAT, I COULDN'T FIND A MEASUREMENT.
>> BETWEEN THE BUILDING AND THE CIRCLE?
>> THE EDGE OF WHERE THE BOX OF THE PALM WOULD BE?
>> I BELIEVE THAT'S ABOUT FIVE FEET.
>> SO I SAW A LOT OF GREAT STUFF IN YOUR SET OF DRAWINGS.
I REALLY LIKE THE LITTLE DETAILS, LIKE GETTING THE RECEPTACLES AND CONDUIT OFF OF THE TREE AND PUTTING THEM ELSEWHERE.
I THINK THAT MAKES A TON OF SENSE AND IT'S GOING TO LOOK A LOT MORE ATTRACTIVE BUT PROBABLY THE TREE WILL LIKE IT ABSOLUTELY MUCH BETTER.
I LIKE SEEING IN YOUR NOTES THAT YOU'RE DEMARCATING THE AREAS NEAR THOSE SPECIMEN TREES WILL BE HAND WORKED ONLY.
I THINK THAT'S GOING TO BE VERY IMPORTANT, ONLY WE AVOID HEAVY MACHINERY DAMAGING THEM.
I THINK I SAW THAT THERE'S SPACE FOR 20 BIKE RACKS UP AND DOWN THE CENTER.
ARE THEY ARE THEY GOING TO BE EVENLY SPACED FROM BLOCK TO BLOCK?
>> YES, WE TRIED TO DO AT LEAST TWO ON EACH SIDE OF THE BLOCK.
>> OKAY. AND I I LIKE THAT THEY'RE KIND OF LOW PROFILE BIKE RACKS.
THEY'RE NOT VISUALLY, THEY'RE NOT IN YOUR FACE THEY'RE KIND OF SUBTLE.
>> IT'S THE SAME BIKE RACKS THAT YOU CURRENTLY HAVE.
>> YEAH. I LIKE THAT YOU MIXED IN A BUNCH OF DIFFERENT SPECIES OF PLANTS IN THERE.
SO I THINK WE'LL GET SOME DIVERSITY OF FOLIAGE AND COLOR AND AS YOU WERE SAYING, THEY'LL ALSO GIVE US DIFFERENT TIMES A YEAR, DIFFERENT? YEAH.
[01:15:01]
>> DIFFERENT THINGS. AND I THINK THE OTHER THING I HAD A QUESTION ON WAS THE INTEGRAL CONCRETE COLOR? ARE WE GOING TO GET A CHANCE WHO KNOWS? MAYBE RIGHT OUT IN FRONT OF CITY HALL HERE PUT THE DIFFERENT COLORS SO WE CAN TAKE A LOOK AT THEM AND SEE WHICH ONES.
>> YEAH. THAT WAS PART OF OUR PLANS THAT THE CONTRACTOR WILL PROVIDE MOCK UPS FOR EACH COLOR AND THEN THEN WE CAN YOU GUYS CAN CHOOSE COLOR THAT YOU LIKE AT THAT POINT.
>> WHAT KIND OF CONTROLS DO THEY HAVE TO MAINTAIN CONSISTENCY BETWEEN PORES OF THAT COLOR?
>> THAT'S A GOOD QUESTION. IT'S ABOUT CHOOSING THE GOOD CONTRACTOR.
NUMBER 1, MAKING SURE THAT THEY ARE CONSISTENT WITH THAT PORE.
BUT I THINK IT'S AN IT'S AN EXACT MIXTURE OF COLOR.
SO THERE'S A RECIPE, ESSENTIALLY, JUST LIKE ANYTHING ELSE BUT AS LONG AS THEY FOLLOW THAT RECIPE, IT SHOULD BE THE SAME EVERY TIME.
>> WE'LL PROBABLY HAVE A LITTLE BIT OF VARIATION AND DEPENDING ON THE SIZE OF ANY AGGREGATE THEY HAVE IN THERE, BUT TYPICALLY IT'S AT A CONTROL JOINT.
YOU'RE GOING TO STOP A PORE HERE AND YOU TRY TO MAKE IT AS INTENTIONAL WHEN WE DO DRIVEWAYS AS INTENTIONAL AS POSSIBLE.
IF WE KNOW WE'RE GOING TO BE WAITING THREE HOURS FOR ANOTHER.
>> YOU MAKE SURE IT'S AROUND THE CORNER FOR THAT POUR AND IT'S NOT IN THE MIDDLE OF AN EXPANSIVE AREA.
>> ANYTHING WITH CONCRETE IS DIFFICULT BECAUSE IT'S SO DEPENDENT ON HUMIDITY, DEPEND THE TEMPERATURE, LIKE YOU SAY, AND ALL THAT STUFF CAN AFFECT HOW THAT COLOR BONDS OR EXPRESSES ITSELF.
YOU'RE RIGHT WE NEED A REALLY GOOD CONCRETE CONTRACTOR TO DO THAT.
>> ANY OTHER COMMENTS, QUESTIONS, CONCERNS?
>> JUST A QUESTION ABOUT TASTES LOSING THAT DRIVEWAY.
THAT PARKING SEAT, THAT ADA COMPLIANT PARKING SPACE IS, I BELIEVE, RIGHT WHERE THEY RAMP IS THE ADA RAMP.
SO WILL THE CITY BE THEN PROVIDING A NEW ADA COMPLIANT PARKING SPACE FOR THEM AND THEN THEY'LL GET THE PATHWAY INTO THE BUILDING.
LIKE IT'S GOT TO BE A DIRECTION THERE CAN'T BE WAY IN THE BACK OF THE PARKING LOT?
>> SURE, YEAH. SO WE DID MOVE THE ADA SPACE FROM THEIR LOT 2 TO THIS LAST SPACE HERE.
>> ALL RIGHT. SO DOWN STREET NOW?
>> THE ADA SPACE IS NOW ON THE STREET.
>> OH, THAT WORKS. YEAH. THANK YOU.
>> DO YOU HAVE A PRICE FOR ALL OF IT?
>> PLEASE NOT YET IN THE MOMENT.
>> ANY OTHER COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS?
>> HAS THERE BEEN AN ESTIMATE MADE FOR THIS YET?
>> THE COST THAT WE'VE DETERMINED INTERNALLY IS 10-15 MILLION.
>> FOR THE WHOLE ENTIRE DOWNTOWN REVITALIZATION.
>> CAN YOU SPEAK TO THE COLOR OF THIS PROJECT?
>> THE COLOR CODING OF THIS PROJECT UP HERE, IT'S FALLING IN THE PIPELINE.
>> OKAY. BECAUSE A PROJECT UPDATE FROM LAST NIGHT.
YEAH, WE MARKED THIS PROJECT AS RED WHICH MEANS IT'S STOPPED.
DOES IT MEAN THERE'S STILL WORK THAT WE CAN DO? WE'RE DOING THAT NOW TO MOVE IT FURTHER.
BUT WE DON'T WANT TO START CONSTRUCTION.
WE HAVE 1.1 MILLION IN THE BUDGET RIGHT NOW TO START BUT WE DON'T WANT TO START WE WANT TO START AND COMPLETE.
IF YOU COULD LEARN ANYTHING ABOUT THE LAST REVITALIZATION EFFORT THAT WAS DONE, IT STARTED AND STOPPED BETWEEN SECOND AND FOURTH STREET.
WE DID NOT CONTINUE THE UNDERGROUNDING OF UTILITIES THAT'S WHY YOU HAVE THE MISMATCH OF MATERIALS DOWN THERE AND WE DON'T WANT TO MAKE THAT SAME MISTAKE AGAIN.
WE LOST POLITICAL WILL, WE LOST FUNDING.
SO I KNOW WE GOT THE VISIONING SESSION NEXT WEEK WITH THE COMMISSION.
HERE IN A FEW WEEKS, WE WILL BE GOING TO TALLAHASSEE TO KISS THE RING AND DO WHAT WE SEE WHAT WE CAN DO TO GET FUNDING FOR THIS UPCOMING SESSION.
THIS COMING YEAR IS THE DOWNTOWN REVITALIZATION THAT WE'RE ASKING OF THE STATE.
ALSO, THE COMMISSION HAS EXPRESSED INTEREST IN ALTERNATIVE REVENUES STREAMS TO FUND THIS.
SO I KNOW THERE'S STILL WORK BEING DONE.
BUT THE POINT IS WE DON'T WANT TO START UNTIL WE HAVE THE FUNDING IN PLACE TO DO SO.
$1,000,000 WILL GET YOU SO FAR.
I'M SHOOTING HIGH BECAUSE EVERYTHING ENDS UP COSTING MORE.
WE KNOW WE HAVE PROBABLE COSTS OF JUST CENTER STREET WE HAD KNOW THE PROBABLE COST OF LIGHTING AND THEN YOU CAN EXTRAPOLATE THAT AND GET AN IDEA OF WHAT THE OVERALL PROJECT WILL BE.
WE HAVE THE UNDERGROUND UTILITIES, WE'RE WORKING WITH THE BUNS ON THAT.
[01:20:01]
SOME OF THAT WILL BE THEIR BURDEN TO ABSORB, SOME OF IT WILL BE OURS.SO THAT'S WHERE IT GETS COSTLY WHEN YOU START UNDERGROUNDING UTILITIES LIKE FROM FOURTH STREET ON TO EIGHTH. DOES THAT HELP YOU ANY?
>> SO THE BOND ISSUE I'VE HEARD WHISPERING ABOUT IS FOR THE WATERFRONT, THAT'S TIED IN WITH THIS?
>> IT COULD BE, OUR RECOMMENDATION IS NOT TO.
>> THERE ARE TWO DIFFERENT ISSUES.
>> TWO DIFFERENT YEAH, THE COMMISSION WILL BE TALKING ABOUT A NUMBER OF OPTIONS OF WHAT WOULD GO INTO A BOND.
OF COURSE, YOU NEED TO SELL THAT TO THE COMMUNITY AND IT NEEDS TO BE SOMETHING THAT RESONATES WITH EVERYONE IN THE COMMUNITY.
IF YOU RESTRICT THE BOND TO JUST THE DOWNTOWN YOU MAY NOT BE ABLE TO PUSH THAT THROUGH.
SO I THINK THERE'S OTHER WAYS TO FUND THIS PROJECT OUTSIDE OF A REFERENDUM.
>> THE OTHER MOVING PART IS, THIS IS JUST CENTER.
AND REALISTICALLY, THE WAY OUR UTILITIES ARE SET UP AND WHATNOT.
SOME OF THESE THINGS ARE GOING TO AFFECT SOME OF THOSE SIDE ROADS, EVEN THOUGH EVENTUALLY, YOU WANT TO GO DOWN, SECOND, THIRD, FOURTH, GO DOWN FURTHER.
AND FOR REASONS OUTSIDE OF MY CONTROL, THE WHOLE DESIGN OF CENTER STREET WAS DONE, LET'S DO CENTER.
BUT YOU CAN'T START CONSTRUCTION THAT WAY.
>> SO WHAT DRIVES THIS IS THE ELECTRIC, THE ELECTRIC IS WHAT'S UNDER THE SIDEWALKS.
THE ELECTRIC TRANSFORMERS ARE ON THE SIDE STREETS.
SO YOU GOING TO PULL THE SIDEWALKS AND THEN PULL THE ELECTRICAL UNDERNEATH THEM AND THEN TURN, WHOOPS, WE'RE NOT SUPPOSED TO BE ON THIS SIDE YET.
SO WHAT'S GOING TO COMMISSION NEXT MEETING IS FOR AMENDMENT TO OUR CONTRACT WITH KIMLEY-HORN TO BEGIN THE DESIGN OF SECOND STREET.
SO THAT YOU HAVE TO START THE PROJECT AND PHASE IT ACCORDING TO YOUR ELECTRICAL NEEDS, BECAUSE THAT'S GOING TO BE WHAT DRIVES IT, NOT YOUR CONCRETE, NOT YOUR TREES.
SO THAT YOU'RE EXACTLY RIGHT, TAMMY, THAT IS WHERE WE HAVE TO GO DOWN THE SIDE STREET THAT DESIGN.
THIS IS THE TEMPLATE AND THIS IS THE HEAVY LIFTING.
THE SIDE STREETS WILL BE MUCH MUCH EASIER BECAUSE IT HAS SEEN SOME ALREADY SOME UPDATES.
BUT THAT'S GOING BEFORE THE COMMISSION HERE AT THE MARCH 4 MEETING.
>> THE ONLY OTHER THING I'LL JUST THROW OUT THERE, JEREMIAH FOR YOUR THOUGHT PROCESS IS, WHEN WE DID THIS, HOWEVER MANY YEARS AGO AND WE STARTED UP FRONT AND WE MOVED UP SLOWLY THEN WE RAN OUT OF MONEY THEN WE DID IT AGAIN.
DO WE START IT THE OPPOSITE WAY? SO THE PLACES UP HERE THAT WERE NEVER DONE AND WE START TRYING TO AT LEAST MOVE BACK, SO WE DON'T KEEP REDOING THESE AREAS AND WE STILL HAVE THIS EYE SORE UP HERE MAYBE WE WORK IT EAST TO WEST.
>> THAT'S WHAT I SAY LAST TIME.
>> SO THINK ABOUT ALL OF THAT, I'M SURE YOU WILL.
I HAVE ONE MORE QUESTION BEFORE CLOSE THIS ONE.
DO WE GET A GAIN OF ADA PARKING OUT OF THIS?
>> YES. DEFINITELY ON CENTER STREET, YOU HAVE MUCH MORE ADA.
>> OKAY. ONE COMMENT THAT I WOULD MAKE IS THE CITY HAS HISTORICALLY HAD DIFFICULTY WITH CONTRACTS.
NOT CONTRACTORS BUT CONTRACTS IN TERMS OF WHAT OUR EXPECTATIONS ARE.
AND I THINK YOU HEARD SOME THINGS UP HERE TONIGHT LIKE THE COLOR OF THE SIDEWALK, ET CETERA, THAT MIGHT END UP IN A CONTRACT WHEN WE'RE READY TO DO THAT.
SO I WOULD ADVISE US TO TAKE A REALLY GOOD LOOK AT THAT BECAUSE AS I HAVE SAID MANY TIMES BEFORE, THIS DOWNTOWN IS SO VISIBLE TO ALL OF US THAT, YOU KNOW, EVERYBODY'S GOING TO HAVE AN OPINION LATER ANYWAY BUT LET'S TRY TO MANAGE THAT GOING FORWARD.
ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS? NO. OKAY. THIS IS VERY GOOD.
THANK YOU FOR DOING THIS. ALL RIGHT.
NOW WE HAVE WE HAVE TO VOTE ON ANYTHING ON THAT?
>> YES. OKAY. IF THERE'S NO MORE DISCUSSION DO WE HAVE A MOTION?
>> DO YOU WANT TO OPEN A PUBLIC HEARING?
DOES ANYONE HAVE ANY COMMENTS TONIGHT.
THE ONLY PEOPLE THAT HAVEN'T BEEN HERE FOREVER JUST LEFT. OKAY.
>> TODAY IS THE PUBLIC HEARING.
>> IF WE MAKE A MOTION, SHOULD IT JUST MAYBE MAKE A GENERAL COMMENT TO INCORPORATE THE BOARD COMMENTS EXPRESSED DURING IT?
>> THAT WOULD, I THINK, BE HELPFUL FOR WHAT I WAS JUST TALKING ABOUT,
[01:25:04]
FOR THE CONTRACT MOVING FORWARD.>> WHEN WE REVIEW A CASE, WHOEVER THE CASE IS FOR, THE CITY OR AN APPLICANT, AND WE ARE VOTING ON IT, WE HAVE TO LOOK AT ALL THE MATERIALS PROVIDED AND ALL THE ELEVATIONS, ET CETERA.
WE HAVEN'T SEEN AN ELEVATION FOR THIS, UNLESS MAYBE I'M WRONG.
DID WE HAVE TO DIG THROUGH THE 180 PAGES THAT WERE THIS BIG AND THEY HAD ELEVATION? I'M JUST SAYING THIS BECAUSE I GET A LITTLE BIT HESITANT IF I PUT MY NAME ON SOMETHING, AS A PROOF, AND THEN WE DON'T KNOW WHAT'S OUT THERE.
IT'S PROBABLY GOING TO BE FINE, BUT I DON'T KNOW THAT.
THAT JUST MAKES ME A LITTLE BIT NERVOUS.
>> IN GOING THROUGH IT TO SEE ELEVATIONS, THERE'S DETAILS THAT ARE KEYED IN THAT YOU GOT TO PIECE IT ALL TOGETHER.
SO I DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER TO THE QUESTION.
THERE'S WALL DETAILS AND THINGS LIKE THAT THAT GIVE YOU A SENSE OF THAT.
>> COULD YOU COME BACK, PLEASE? COULD YOU TAKE A SHOT AT ANSWERING THAT?
>> WE DO HAVE SOME RENDERINGS IN THE CONCEPT PACKAGE THAT WE DID ORIGINALLY.
THAT MIGHT GIVE YOU AN IDEA OF WHAT IT COULD LOOK LIKE. IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE LOOKING FOR?
>> WHEN YOU SAY ELEVATIONS, ELEVATION OF WHAT?
>> WELL, WE'RE LOOKING AT A PLAN VIEW, AND HE'S SAYING THAT WE'RE GOING TO REBUILD THESE SEAT WALLS, BUT WE REALLY DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT'S GOING TO LOOK LIKE.
I'M JUST ANTICIPATING, DOWN THE ROAD, IF THERE'S ANY COMMUNITY INPUT AND HOOPLA ABOUT WHAT'S HAPPENING, AND WHO APPROVED THIS AND WHY, AND HOW COULD YOU HAVE APPROVED THIS.
>> THE SEAT WALLS ARE DESIGNED TO MATCH EXACTLY WHAT'S THERE.
>> I THINK WHAT [OVERLAPPING] IS SAYING IS THAT WHEN WE LOOK AT A HOUSE DESIGN, WE GET A SIDE VIEW.
I'M GOING TO SAY THIS IN LAYMAN'S TERMS. WE GET A SIDE VIEW OF IT THAT SAYS THESE ARE THE MEASUREMENTS OF THOSE WALLS, ET CETERA.
IT COULD BE IN THAT RENDERING THING YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT, THAT ORIGINAL RENDERING THAT IS THERE.
>> THE CHALLENGE IS YOU'RE LOOKING AT STREETSCAPE.
YOU'RE NOT LOOKING AT A HOUSE, SO YOU DON'T GET THOSE ELEMENTS.
THE NUMBER 1 OBJECTIVE OF THIS ENTIRE PROJECT IS TO KEEP THE SENSE OF PLACE, LOOK AND FEEL WHAT WE HAVE AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE.
SO EVERYTHING IS GOING TO BE LIKE FOR LIKE.
YOUR WALLS ARE GOING TO GO BACK.
THEY'RE GOING TO MOVE, BUT THEY'RE GOING BACK TO THE SAME HEIGHT.
THE ELEMENTS ARE STAYING THE SAME.
THE BIKE RACKS ARE GARBAGE CONTAINERS.
PROBABLY THE BIGGEST CHANGE IS GOING TO BE THE DIFFERENT STREET LIGHT.
OF COURSE YOUR CONCRETE IS GOING TO CHANGE TOO, IN PLACES.
WE HAVE SEVEN DIFFERENT MATERIALS DOWN THERE NOW.
THIS ELEMENTS THAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT ARE GOING UP.
NOTHING'S CHANGING ELEVATION WISE.
IF ANYTHING, WHAT MAY HAVE A CHANGE IN ELEVATION IS WE'RE NOT ADA COMPLIANT ON A NUMBER OF OUR SIDEWALKS.
THERE'S A SLOPE TO CENTER STREET.
WE CAN'T JUST COMPLETELY RAISE UP THE ROAD, SO WE GOT SOME CHALLENGES THERE, BUT YOU MIGHT SEE THE SIDEWALK LEVEL IN PLACES.
BUT NO OTHER ELEVATION CHANGES THAN THAT.
THAT HELPS. KELLY HAS A [INAUDIBLE] RIGHT THERE.
SO IT HAS A LOT OF THE LITTLE ELEVATIONAL ITEMS THAT YOU CAN USE YOUR OWN LITTLE TOOL.
>> GOT THAT ON THE RECORD. [OVERLAPPING] TREPIDATION.
>> IS THERE ANY FURTHER BOARD DISCUSSION?
>> I'D STILL LIKE TO KNOW FOR ADDING OR LOSING A FOOT OF SEAT BALLS.
IT SEEMS LIKE THEY'RE JUST ALL ENCROACHING ON SIDE SIDEWALKS AND WALKWAYS.
BUT I UNDERSTAND BECAUSE YOU'RE TRYING TO MAKE ROOM FOR THE TREES, PEOPLE THAT OPERATE THE STREETS, TIMES THE NUMBER OF THE TREES DO.
I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU CAN DO ABOUT THAT. THAT'S A DESIGN THING.
[01:30:04]
>> DO WE HAVE A MOTION EITHER TO APPROVE OR TO DENY?
>> REALLY, YOU'RE ASKING FOR A NET GAIN OR LOSS.
>> SEAT WALL. I DON'T KNOW IF ANY BENCHES OR ANY NEW BENCHES COMING INTO THE EQUATION OR IS IT ONLY EXISTING THERE.
>> JUST SEEMS LIKE WE HAVE A LOT OF RECESSED AND [INAUDIBLE] LIKE SITTING AREAS.
IT'S JUST GOT A LOT CLOSER TO THE SIDEWALKS NOW.
YOU HAVE NINE-AND-A-HALF FOOT SIDEWALKS.
I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S GOING TO MAKE ANYBODY LESS COMFORTABLE AS THEY'RE WALKING.
>> YOUR MAIN CONCERN WOULD BE A LOSS OF SEATS?
>> I THINK THAT ADDS TO THE CHARM AS IT IS NOW.
>> BUT MS. FINKELSTEIN, MAIN STREET IS STILL SELLING THE BENCHES?
>> THEY'RE STILL SELLING BENCHES.
>> THERE WILL STILL BE SPACE ON THE SIDEWALKS TO PUT NEW BENCHES.
>> EVEN IF THERE WAS A LOSS IN THE WALLS, THERE ARE OTHER OPTIONS.
>> I MOVE TO APPROVE HDC CASE NUMBER 2024-0026 WITHOUT CONDITIONS.
I MOVE THAT HDC MAKE THE FOLLOWING FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW PART OF THE RECORD THAT HDC CASE 2024-0026, AS PRESENTED, IS SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANT WITH THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE AND THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT DESIGN GUIDELINES TO WARRANT FINAL APPROVAL AT THIS TIME.
>> CONGRATULATIONS [INAUDIBLE].
>> DID YOU SAY SECOND? MOVE TO APPROVE [INAUDIBLE] AND SECONDED BY KOSACK.
COULD YOU CALL THE ROLL PLEASE?
>> YES. THANK YOU FOR YOUR WORK AND THANKS FOR COMING BACK TO WALK THROUGH THAT WITH US.
MS. FINKELSTEIN, WE'RE AT BOARD BUSINESS NOW,
[5. BOARD BUSINESS]
AND LISA HAS SOMETHING TO SHOW US.>> I DO. I AM VERY EXCITED ABOUT THIS, AND WE'VE TALKED ABOUT IT BEFORE.
WE WERE BACK AND FORTH WITH THE SIDEWALK MATERIALS AND THE HEX PAVERS AND ALL OF THAT.
WHILE WE'VE CREATED A WHOLE BLOCK THAT WILL HAVE HEX PAVERS, AS YOU KNOW, THE REST OF THE SIDEWALK WILL BE A FAIRLY BASIC MATERIAL.
IN AN ATTEMPT TO BRING SOME OF THE HISTORY AND SOME OF OUR COMMUNITY INTO THE STREETSCAPE, I LOOKED INTO THE IDEA OF A MEDALLION THAT WOULD BE SET WITHIN THE SIDEWALKS, SCATTERED THROUGHOUT THE EIGHT BLOCKS ALONG CENTER STREET.
I WOULD LIKE TO JUST HEAR YOUR THOUGHTS ON DOING SOMETHING LIKE THAT, IF THIS IS THE RIGHT THING TO DO.
WE WENT WITH SHRIMPING DESIGN.
THIS IS A SAMPLE OF ONE, AND I'LL PASS IT, BUT IT'S HEAVY.
BUT THIS IS A SAMPLE OF ONE THAT WE HAD DONE.
THEY CREATED A COUPLE OF DESIGNS, AND THERE WAS ONE CLEAR WINNER THAT WE LIKED.
IT SAYS, BIRTHPLACE OF THE MODERN SHRIMPING INDUSTRY, FERNANDINA BEACH.
WE'RE ALSO LOOKING AT SOME OTHER DESIGNS.
WE WOULD POTENTIALLY NOT HAVE JUST ONE TYPE THAT WOULD BE IN THE SIDEWALK, BUT POSSIBLY OTHERS THAT WOULD BE OTHER PARTS OF OUR HISTORY.
I'VE ASKED HER FOR SKETCHES ON DESIGNS FOR KATE'S TREE, A SHRIMP BOAT, POSSIBLY INSTEAD OF A SHRIMP.
A LOCOMOTIVE ENGINE AS A NOD TO THE CROSS PENINSULA RAILROAD, A LIGHTHOUSE, AND THEN ONE WITH THE NATIVE AMERICAN TIMUCUANS.
THEY'RE WORKING ON SKETCHES FOR THAT.
I'VE ALSO INQUIRED, BECAUSE I DID SPEAK TO TAMMY ABOUT OTHER FINISHES, AND THEY CAN DO AN AGED BRONZE, WHICH IS JUST A LITTLE SOFTER THAN THIS.
IT'S AN UP CHARGE THOUGH, OF AT LEAST 10% OR A MINIMUM OF $33 A PIECE.
WE WOULD HAVE TO THINK ABOUT WHETHER WE WANTED TO SPEND THE MONEY OR GO WITH THIS STYLE.
THE PRICE ON THESE IN A QUANTITY IS $110, SO IT'S AN EXTREMELY REASONABLE COST,
[01:35:02]
I THINK, TO ADD SOME ELEMENT OF THE HISTORY TO OUR DOWNTOWN.>> ARE THERE [INAUDIBLE] POINTS TO THAT OR ECONOMIES OF SCALE IF YOU GET A CERTAIN NUMBER, OR IS THAT JUST [OVERLAPPING].
>> YES. LIKE, FOR INSTANCE, THIS ONE I PAID LIKE $230 FOR.
THEY COME DOWN FROM THAT NUMBER DOWN TO 110 IS THE LOWEST.
>> THAT WAS MY ONLY THOUGHT WHEN YOU WERE SAYING HAVING MAYBE SEVERAL DIFFERENT TYPES SCATTERED ABOUT.
>> WE WOULD PAY A LITTLE MORE.
BUT THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN 100 PIECES UP TO 24 IS ONLY $7.
THEY COME DOWN ONCE YOU GET OVER 10.
I THINK IT WOULD STILL WORK IF WE CHOSE FOUR DESIGNS OR FIVE DESIGNS THAT WE HAD SCATTERED THROUGHOUT THE DOWNTOWN, WE WOULD STILL PROBABLY BE DOING ENOUGH PIECES THAT WE WOULD BE OKAY.
I THINK WHAT I'M LOOKING FOR IS, DO YOU THINK THIS IS A GOOD IDEA? DO YOU THINK THIS ADDS SOMETHING TO OUR DOWNTOWN? DO YOU THINK DOING MULTIPLE THEMES VERSUS ONE THEME IS THE WAY TO GO? JUST GENERALLY YOUR IDEA ON THIS.
>> IS THAT BRONZE? DID YOU A [OVERLAPPING].
>> THIS IS BRONZE. IT'S GOING TO WEAR NATURALLY.
>> I WOULD JUST THINK, WHAT IF THEY DON'T EVEN PAINT IT? LET THE WHOLE THING BE A LIVING FINISH, LIKE THE OLD MANHOLE COVERS.
>> THEY GET BEAUTIFUL OVER TIME.
>> YEAH. THEN IT DOESN'T LOOK PLASTICIZED.
BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT LOOKS PLASTIC, IS THE FINISH.
WHEN LISA SHOWED ME THIS, I THOUGHT WAS COOL THAT COULD HAPPEN IS, IF THIS WAS SOMEHOW TIED IN WITH A GPS TOUR OR SOMETHING.
PEOPLE ARE LIKE, LOOK, THERE'S ONE OF THOSE FERNANDINA THINGS, AND THEN YOU DO THIS, AND IT TELLS YOU ABOUT THE [INAUDIBLE] HOUSE OR THE COURTHOUSE OR WHEREVER YOU'RE STANDING IN FRONT OF, OR JUST SOME TIDBIT.
IT COULD BE LIKE A WHOLE LEARNING WALKING TOUR. YEAH.
>> WELL, AND WE TALKED ABOUT THAT.
THERE'S AN APP THAT MAIN STREET USES CALLED DISTRICTS, AND THERE'S MANY OTHER APPS.
I THINK THE CVB HAS ONE THAT HAS A TOUR THAT YOU CAN DO ON YOUR PHONE.
BUT I KNOW WITH THE APP THAT WE USE, THERE ARE BEACONS THAT YOU CAN GET.
FOR INSTANCE, WHEN WE DID THE TOUR OF THE BUILDINGS AND THE HISTORY OF THE BUSINESSES THAT HAVE OCCUPIED THOSE HISTORIC BUILDINGS, THEN YOU CAN GET A BEACON SO THAT AS YOU PASS BY, IF I HAVE THE DISTRICT APP ON MY PHONE, THEN MY PHONE WOULD ALERT ME THAT I'VE JUST PASSED THAT SPOT AND THERE'S INFORMATION ABOUT THIS BUILDING.
WE COULD LOOK INTO EITHER USING THAT PARTICULAR APP, WHICH IS FREE TO MAIN STREET COMMUNITIES OR FOR SOME OTHER ONE, PARTNERING WITH THE CVB TO DO SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
BECAUSE WE TALKED ABOUT PUTTING SOMETHING IN THIS, AND I DON'T THINK THAT'S POSSIBLE, BUT YOU COULD DEFINITELY HAVE SOMETHING THAT WOULD INDICATE YOU'RE AT ONE.
>> YEAH. THERE WOULD BE A WAY TO DO THAT.
>> I DON'T KNOW. I WOULD BE INTERESTED TO SEE WHAT YOU THINK BECAUSE THIS IS, I BELIEVE, AN EIGHT INCH, WHICH THEY RECOMMENDED AS A REASONABLE SIZE FOR WHAT I WAS TRYING TO ACCOMPLISH.
>> IS IT POSSIBLE TO DO ONE LIKE THIS?
>> WELL, WITH THE EIGHT FLAGS, THE CITY OF FERNANDINA BEACH?
>> THE CITY SEAL. YEAH. IN LIEU OF THE LIGHTHOUSE, WE COULD DO THAT INSTEAD.
>> OR THE AISLE OF EIGHT FLAGS.
>> YEAH. LIKE I SAID, YOU KNOW, CAME UP WITH DIFFERENT ELEMENTS FROM THE HISTORY, BUT [INAUDIBLE] THE LIGHTHOUSE [OVERLAPPING].
RIGHT, IT WOULDN'T BE IN COLOR.
YEAH. BUT THAT IS CERTAINLY POSSIBLE.
>> ANY OTHER COMMENTS OR SUGGESTIONS?
>> I LIKE THE IDEA A BIT CONCEPTUALLY, BUT I THINK IT MIGHT BE NICE FOR THERE TO BE MORE VARIATION IN THE DESIGNS.
MAYBE THAT'S THE WAY THE APP WORKS AS OPPOSED TO JUST SEEING THE SAME THING REPEATED OVER AND OVER AGAIN.
>> START WITH FOUR OR FIVE DESIGNS IF POSSIBLE.
>> THESE WOULD BE ONLY ON CENTER STREET?
IF SOMEBODY WANTS ONE THEY CAN BUY IT AND PUT IN FRONT OF THEIR HOUSE.
WELL, WE HAVE TO CHARGE THEM $200.
>> WE GET A LITTLE COVERAGE THERE.
>> SOME OF THE SIDE STREETS DO STILL HAVE HISTORIC BUILDINGS ON THEM THAT MIGHT BE INTERESTED IN SPONSORING SUCH A THING.
>> WELL, I WOULD SAY, IF WE THOUGHT THIS WAS SOMETHING THAT WE WOULD WANT TO DO,
[01:40:02]
I WOULD WANT TO MAYBE TALK TO MATT ABOUT IT AND SEE WHERE WOULD THEY RECOMMEND THAT IT BE INCORPORATED IN.>> IT HAS TO BE SOMEWHAT INTENTIONAL TOO [OVERLAPPING].
>> WE'RE HERE, AND THEN NOTHING, WILLY NILLY ON THE SIDE STREETS.
>> BUT FOR EXAMPLE, IN FRONT OF FLORIDA HOUSE, TO HAVE THE TRAIN THERE OR TO HAVE THE EIGHT FLAGS THERE, I THINK EITHER OF THOSE WOULD BE SOMETHING THEY MIGHT BE INTERESTED IN SPONSORING.
>> WELL, WE DECIDED THAT WE'RE GOING TO START CALLING THIS THE ISLAND OF NINE FLAGS BECAUSE WE HAVE THE EIGHT FLAGS, AND THEN [INAUDIBLE] SOMEBODY HAS TO WAVE A WHITE FLAG.
>> WELL THAT'S TRUE [LAUGHTER]. THAT'S VERY TRUE
>> CAN THEY MAKE THEM ANY LARGER?
>> THEY CAN MAKE THEM ANY SIZE.
>> JUST TRYING TO CENTER IT IN A PIECE OF SIDE LAWN FLAM, SIX FOOT BY WHATEVER, FOUR FOOT.
MIGHT NEED TO BE A LITTLE BIT BIGGER JUST TO MAKE IT STAND OUT A LITTLE BIT MORE.
>> YOU NEED TO KNOW THE SIZE, SHAPE OF THE ISLAND.
>> JUST AS HISTORY, WHERE THIS CAME FROM, BECAUSE I HAVE NO ORIGINAL IDEAS, WHERE THIS CAME FROM IS I WAS VISITING OKALA WITH A MAIN STREET CONFERENCE.
I'M NOT ORIGINALLY FROM FLORIDA, SO I DON'T REALLY KNOW WHAT EVERY PART OF THE STATE IS KNOWN FOR NECESSARILY.
I WAS WALKING AROUND THEIR CENTER OF TOWN, WHICH IS A SQUARE AND I NOTICED IN THE SIDEWALKS THEY HAD EMBEDDED HORSESHOES.
THEY WEREN'T A REAL HORSESHOE.
I THOUGHT, THAT'S GENIUS, BECAUSE NOW I KNOW WHAT THIS TOWN IS.
THAT I'M IN HORSE COUNTRY AND THAT'S WHAT THEY'RE KNOWN FOR.
>> TO BE SO MUCH CHEAPER. IT'S A WOOD.
>> WELL, DEFINITELY. [LAUGHTER]
>> ANYWAY, THAT WAS THE THOUGHT PROCESS.
>> I'VE SEEN THEM IN TALLAHASSEE TOO.
THEY HAVE 18 INCH, 24 INCH, SAME SIZE PEN.
>> WE COULD DO SOMETHING THAT WOULD BE LARGER.
>> YOU HAVE GOTTEN THIS GROUP OUT OF CONTROL.
>> THANK YOU, I APPRECIATE YOU.
>> HISTORY OF THE APPROVAL PROCESS FOR REQUIRED RAILROAD FENCE, AND I ASKED THAT THIS BE PUT HERE BECAUSE WE TOLD MR. PLATT THAT WE DID NOT LIKE THE IDEA OF EXTENDING THE FENCE THAT'S DOWN THERE NOW BECAUSE WE DIDN'T LIKE THE LOOK OF IT.
THEN I WAS TOLD, GOT MY HANDS LEFT AND TOLD THAT [LAUGHTER] IT HAD ALREADY BEEN APPROVED BY THIS BOARD.
>> CAN I SAY SOMETHING? [LAUGHTER]
>> YOU CAN SAY SOMETHING BUT IT DOESN'T MATTER.
>> JAKE, IS THAT WHY YOU'RE HERE? DO YOU HAVE TO WAIT FOR THIS? [LAUGHTER] THIS IS WHEN I WENT DOWN THE RABBIT HOLE OF HDC MEETINGS.
IT WAS LIKE WATCHING THE DEAD POET SOCIETY BECAUSE WHEN THIS WAS ORIGINALLY APPROVED BACK IN 2019, WE HAD SAL, WE HAD SAMANTHA ROGIC, WE HAD TAMMY BACH, WE HAD HARRISON, MARRISON, ANGIE CONWAY, ME, AND POZZETTA.
IT'S LIKE EVERYBODY ELSE IS GONE.
>> [OVERLAPPING] OR SOMETHING.
>> ROUND AND ROUND. THE ONLY THING THAT I THINK IS WHY THIS CAME UP WAS, IT WAS MADE ABUNDANTLY CLEAR AT THIS MEETING SEVERAL TIMES THAT WE ARE APPROVING FROM ASH TO CENTER.
THERE WAS CONCERN EVEN WITH SPINO AND WITH ME THAT, WHAT DOES THIS MATCH? WHERE IS IT GOING? HOW BIG ARE THE COLUMNS, AND THE RUSTICATED BLOCK VERSUS BRICK, AND WE DID APPROVE THE RUSTICATED BLOCK AT A MUCH LARGER SIZE AND SCALE AND A TALLER SIZE.
I HAVE THE DRAWING THAT I PRINTED OUT, IT'S ON MY PRINTER AT HOME.
THAT'S WHERE ALL THE HOOTS BLOCK CAME UP.
THE CONCERN WAS THAT IT WAS ONLY FOR ONE SECTION AND IT WOULDN'T CONTINUE ON NORTH. THAT'S THE [OVERLAPPING]
>> THAT'S A LITTLE BIT OF DIFFERENCE THERE.
NOW THERE IS A REQUEST TO EXPAND IT.
>> WELL, IT'S ALREADY BEEN EXPANDED BECAUSE WE EVEN DISCUSSED THE TUBULAR FENCE THING IN FRONT OF THE SALTY PELICAN AND THE MARINA BECAUSE IT WASN'T ALIGNING, AND THEN THAT WAS REMOVED AND THE POOL FENCE WAS PUT FURTHER NORTH UP TO GOOD SALES PROPERTY.
>> WHERE DO WE WANT TO TAKE IT NOW? JAKE, PLEASE.
>> I WAS NOT HERE, JACOB PLATT PROJECT COORDINATOR.
I DON'T KNOW HOW I GOT ROPED INTO FENCE GATE,
[01:45:01]
I HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH IT.>> THE PLAN THAT WE TALKED ABOUT IN JANUARY WAS JUST TO EXTEND THE SAME FENCE ON THE NORTH SIDE OF ALACHUA.
WE'RE ABOUT TO GET A 20-YEAR PROJECT COMPLETED HERE IN THE NEAR FUTURE WITH THE LONGER IN THE NEAR FUTURE AT ALACHUA STREET.
THE INTENT IS TO EXTEND TO THE NEXT BLOCK AT BROOM STREET SO THAT YOU HAVE A NICE CONTINUATION OF THAT FENCE TO THE NORTH OF THE ALACHUA STREET CROSSING.
>> IF I CAN SUMMARIZE WHAT I'VE JUST HEARD, ABSENT ME, THIS BOARD APPROVED THE FENCE THE WAY IT LOOKS NOW.
ONLY TO GO TO CENTER, IS THAT CORRECT?
>> NO. IT IS BIGGER AND TALLER.
>> YOU'RE TELLING ME THAT AFTER THE DECISION WAS MADE HERE, IT GOT CHANGED AND DIDN'T COME BACK HERE?
>> MONEY. THAT'S USUALLY THE REASON.
>> FROM THE PROCESS PERSPECTIVE, IT SHOULD HAVE COME BACK HERE BECAUSE THE HDC IS NOW WALKING AROUND SAYING, WE APPROVED THE FENCE AND THEN SEE SOMETHING THAT'S NOT BEEN APPROVED AND PEOPLE.
>> WAS THE COMMUNITY IN AN UPROAR?
>> I DIDN'T HEAR ANYBODY TALK ABOUT IT.
REALLY WHEN IT BOILED DOWN TO IT, MY RECOLLECTION, WE TRIED REALLY HARD TO GET SOMETHING THAT WOULD BE USEFUL AND ATTRACTIVE.
ULTIMATELY, IT REALLY CAME DOWN TO, WELL, WE CAN AFFORD TO PUT SOMETHING IN THAT WOULD ADDRESS THE SAFETY ISSUE OF PEOPLE WANDERING ACROSS THE TRACKS.
YOU COULD EITHER HAVE THE UNSAFE UNFENCED TRACK SITUATION OR YOU COULD GET A FENCE.
THOSE WERE OUR CHOICES WITH THE PRETTY, THE CONTEXTURAL, THAT WASN'T ANYTHING THAT WAS ON THE TABLE TO CHOOSE FROM, REALLY, IS MY RECOLLECTION.
WE TRIED AND IT KEPT GETTING STRICTLY AWAY.
>> BUT DO YOU REMEMBER WHAT WAS APPROVED, LATIMER? THE REVISED DRAWINGS.
THE APPROVAL PROCESS RAN OUT SO THEY HAD TO COME BACK AND APPROVE IT.
>> [OVERLAPPING] GOING ON CENTER SET.
>> [OVERLAPPING] THE STREETS. THEY SAID THAT WOULD BE THE GATEWAY INTO THE AREA.
I DON'T KNOW, ARE PEOPLE IN THE UPPER? PROBABLY NOT, BECAUSE THEY DON'T KNOW UNTIL YOU SAY IT.
I MENTIONED IT TO SOMEBODY AND SAID, MAN, I NEVER REALIZED THAT.
THAT IS THE UGLIEST FENCE I'VE EVER SEEN. [LAUGHTER]
>> YOUR RECOLLECTION IS CORRECT ABOUT THE WING WALLS AT CENTER STREET, THE TALLER COLUMNS THAT HAD THE NAME OF THE STREET ON.
I DON'T KNOW THE GAP WHERE IT OBVIOUSLY DIDN'T GET CONSTRUCTED THAT WAY.
I DON'T RECALL IF IT CAME BACK TO AMEND IT.
IT SOUNDS LIKE IT DIDN'T, AND IT SHOULD HAVE.
BUT THERE WAS A VERY MUCH MORE DETAILED CENTER STREET TMU BLOCK AT THAT PARTICULAR AND ADDITIONAL CMU OR THE RUSTICATED BLOCK COLUMNS INSTEAD OF JUST YOUR STANDARD [OVERLAPPING]
>> BECAUSE I GET 24 FEET, GIVE OR TAKE, EVERY THREE PANELS OR SO.
I BRING THIS UP BECAUSE WE ERASE OR WE ADD TO, AND WE CHANGE SLOWLY THINGS OF OUR CITY.
I'M NOT SAYING, RIP IT OUT AND REDO IT, BUT DO WE HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY? ALL OF THIS IS MONEY, AND WE HAVE SO MUCH THAT NEEDS TO BE DONE RIGHT NOW. SO MUCH.
BUT IS THIS SOMETHING THAT JUST NEEDS TO BE ADDED TO THE BIG BALL OF WAX AND SAY, YOU KNOW WHAT? WE REALLY NEED TO ADDRESS THAT.
WE'RE PUTTING IN THIS WHOLE NEW THING AT A ALACHUA, OPENING IT UP, AND THAT WAS SUPPOSED TO BE THE OTHER PART OF THE GATEWAY RIGHT THERE.
INSTEAD OF THROWING GOOD MONEY AFTER BAD, FOR A FEW SHEKELS MORE, DO WE DO IT RIGHT ON THOSE TWO THINGS? I'M JUST SAYING, PUT THE POSSIBILITY OUT THERE AND LET THE NEW COMMISSION JUST KNOW WHAT'S HAPPENING.
I'M NOT LAYING BLAME ON ANYBODY.
>> WHAT I WANT TO THROW INTO THIS MIX IS ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I WAS GOING TO BRING UP LATER,
[01:50:01]
BUT I'M GOING TO DO IT NOW.[LAUGHTER] IS THERE'S ALSO A LOOK BEING TAKEN AT THE WHOLE AREA WHERE BRETT IS NOW.
WHAT'S HAPPENED WITH THAT IS THAT THE COMMISSION HAS ASKED THAT, IS IT THREE COUNCILS? MARINA ADVISORY, CRA, AND HDC.
BECAUSE THE PHYSICAL AREA THAT WE TALK ABOUT OVERLAPS.
THAT THOSE THREE GROUPS FORM AN AD HOC COMMITTEE WITH REPRESENTATION FROM EACH INTO THIS COMMITTEE TO LOOK AT THREATS, LOOK AT THAT WHOLE AREA AND EVENTUALLY END UP WORKING WITH PASARO WHO WERE THE ENGINEERS WORKING ON IT, TO HELP DETERMINE WHAT SHOULD GO DOWN THERE.
BECAUSE THERE HASN'T NECESSARILY BEEN A DECISION MADE ON ANY OF THAT YET.
THERE'S KNOWLEDGE ABOUT THE FACT THAT BRETT'S HAS SOME ISSUES UNDERNEATH IT, THERE'S SOME PEOPLE IN THE COMMUNITY, JUST LIKE WITH ANY OTHER THING YOU PUT OUT THERE.
SOME PEOPLE IN THE COMMUNITY WANT BRETT'S TO STAY, SOME PEOPLE IN THE COMMUNITY THINK THAT SHOULD ALL BE OPEN DOWN THERE, SOME PEOPLE IN THE COMMUNITY WANT A DIFFERENT RESTAURANT DOWN THERE.
THEN YOU HAVE THE MOST RECENT NEWS WITH ATLANTIC SEAFOOD AND WHAT IS SALT MARSH DOING AND DO NOT DO THAT.
WE HAVE ALL OF THESE THINGS GOING ON AT THE SAME TIME.
BY THE WAY, THE PARK DESIGN HAS A FENCE IN IT.
THAT'S A DIFFERENT FENCE FROM THIS FENCE.
>> IT'S A ALUMINUM FOUR-FOOT FENCE.
IT DOESN'T HAVE THE SPINDLES ON TOP OF THE TOP BAR, IT'S GOT A FLAT BAR ACROSS THE TOP.
THAT'S REALLY THE MAIN DIFFERENCE.
>> IS THERE CONCERN FROM ANYBODY HERE THAT THAT'S TRUE, THAT THAT FENCE DOESN'T MATCH THE ONE THAT'S ON THE RAILROAD? CONSIDERING THAT WE'RE RIGHT THERE?
>> TWO THINGS. AT THAT MEETING, THAT GEMINIS, BACK IN THE DAY, THAT WAS ONE OF THE VERY SPECIFIC THINGS THAT ANOTHER BOARD MEMBER BROUGHT UP.
THEY SAID, WELL, ARE WE APPROVING THE FENCING DETAIL FOR ALL OF THESE AREAS? BECAUSE THERE WAS CONCERN ON THE BOARD.
IT'S LIKE, WE DON'T REALLY WANT TO APPROVE THIS TO BE THE STANDARD THAT GOES EVERYWHERE BECAUSE IT NEEDS TO BE A LITTLE BIT MORE SUBSTANTIAL AND REFLECTIVE OF THE AREA.
FOR THIS FENCE, I DON'T HAVE AS MUCH CONCERN ABOUT THE ONE IN THE WATERFRONT AREA BECAUSE IT'S HEAVILY LANDSCAPED ON EACH SIDE, I BELIEVE, NOT ONE SIDE.
>> I THINK THAT FENCE IS BASICALLY GOING TO GO AWAY, AND THEN IT HAS A LOT OF UNDER STORY.
THIS OTHER ONE IS JUST RIGHT OUT THERE IN THE MIDDLE OF EVERYTHING.
IT'S LIKE, WELCOME TO THE WATERFRONT.
>> WELL, IF WE CAN'T AFFORD A PRETTY FENCE OR AN EXPENSIVE FENCE OR WHATEVER FENCE, MAYBE WE CAN AFFORD HEDGES, AND WE CAN HIDE OUR FENCE ALSO AND BE DONE.
THEN WE DON'T HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT GETTING EXPENSIVE FENCES.
WE CAN JUST GET SOME PRETTY HEDGES.
>> THE FENCE IS A SAFETY ISSUE.
>> WELL, WE HAVE TO HAVE A FENCE.
BUT WE CAN GET A LESS EXPENSIVE FENCE AND SOME NICE HEDGE TO PUT IN FRONT OF IT, THEN IT DOESN'T MATTER WHAT OUR FENCE LOOKS LIKE BECAUSE IT'S BEING HIDDEN.
WE NEED TO PUT HEDGES ON BOTH SIDES OF THE FENCE.
>> COME BACK. YOU HAVE A REACTION.
>> THERE'S JUST A POSSIBLE SOLUTION TO IT, PROBLEM.
>> THE FENCE WAS A STIPULATION FOR THE OPENING OF ALACHUA STREET AND THE OTHER SAFETY IMPROVEMENTS THAT WERE MADE WITH THE SIGNALIZATION AND THE HIGH BACK CURB.
THERE'S NO ROOM REALLY FOR LANDSCAPING OUTSIDE ON EITHER SIDE OF THE FENCE ON THE EAST SIDE OF THE RAILROAD TRACKS, UNFORTUNATELY.
>> THE FENCES THERE NOW WAS APPROVED BY THE RAILROAD.
>> IS THERE A COMPROMISE TO BE MADE TO SAY THAT AT ASH CENTER AND ALACHUA,
[01:55:01]
WE CAN HAVE SOMETHING A LITTLE MORE IMPOSING?>> WELL, INSTEAD OF THOSE FAKE BRICKS.
>> I GUESS THAT GETS INTO A LARGER DISCUSSION.
OBVIOUSLY, WE'VE GOT THE EXISTING FENCE THERE NOW.
THERE'S FOUR CMU RUSTICATED COLUMNS.
THAT'S CERTAINLY NOT SOMETHING I CAN SPEAK TO TONIGHT ABOUT CHANGING THE COMPLETE DESIGN, TEARING THAT COMPLETELY OUT AND GOING BACK SOMETHING DIFFERENT.
>> I'M NOT TALKING ABOUT CHANGING THE FENCE ITSELF, I'M TALKING ABOUT A COMPROMISE BY PUTTING JUST AT THE ENDS OF IT AT THOSE THREE MAJOR STREETS, LIKE WHAT WAS APPROVED, LIKE BUILDING THE TALLER.
>> THE TALLER COLUMN WITH THE STREET NAME ON IT.
I THINK IT REALLY ADDS A NICE DETAIL TO IT.
>> THAT'S WHAT WASN'T APPROVED.
>> SEE, I THOUGHT THAT CAME BACK.
>> THAT WAS THE AFTER THE FACT.
THAT'S WHEN CHIP ROSS AND I GOT INTO IT.
THAT WAS AFTER THE FACT BECAUSE THEY PUT THEM UP.
>> BUT I KNOW THAT IT CAME BACK AS A REVISION.
BECAUSE THAT THIS REVISION APPLICATION, LOOKS LIKE IT HAD SEVERAL [OVERLAPPING]
>> I THINK WE GOT THE ONE ON THE OTHER END.
THE OTHER END OF THE FENCE IS MUCH SHORTER ONE.
WE GOT THE ONE ON THE RIGHT-HAND SIDE.
>> JAKE, WHEN DO YOU NEED AN ANSWER ON THIS?
>> THIS SAYS CENTER TO ALACHUA.
>> IT WAS ALWAYS ASH TO ALACHUA FROM MY UNDERSTANDING.
>> JAKE, WHEN DO YOU NEED AN ANSWER?
>> THE INTENT IS, WE'RE ON TRACK TO COMPLETE THE ALACHUA STREET OPENING BEFORE TRIM FESTIVAL.
WE'VE BEEN TALKING WITH THE PROPERTY OWNER, MR. GOODSALL, WHO'S GOT VERY KEEN SENSE OF DESIGN AND WHAT HE LIKES AND WHAT HE WANTS.
I JUST NEED TO HAVE AN UNDERSTANDING IF Y'ALL ARE OKAY WITH EXTENDING WHAT'S THERE SO THAT I CAN HAVE A CONFIDENT CONVERSATION WITH MR. GOODSALL ABOUT WHAT WE'RE ACTUALLY PROPOSING.
IF WE'RE GOING TO CHANGE IT ALL UP, I DON'T WANT TO SAY, WELL, HERE'S WHAT WE WANT TO GO WITH, WE'RE GOING TO PAY TO INSTALL THIS, WE JUST WANT TO MAKE YOU AWARE.
BUT IF WE DON'T KNOW THAT ANSWER TONIGHT, I'M NOT GOING TO HAVE THAT CONVERSATION.
>> WE NEED AN ANSWER TONIGHT. WHAT ARE WE GOING TO DO?
>> IS ANYBODY PASSIONATE ABOUT THIS BESIDES HIM? JIM IS HALF THERE.
>> IS IT FEASIBLE TO MAKE IT LOOK BETTER?
>> WHAT I'M HEARING. I'M SORRY, A TALLER COLUMN HEAR WITH THE NAME.
>> THEN IT'S PRETTY DIFFERENT.
>> WHAT'S THERE RIGHT NOW'S THE RIGHT SIDE?
>> IT DOESN'T HAVE THE ASSIGNMENT.
>> KELLY, DO YOU HAVE ACCESS TO THESE PICTURES THAT CHAMMIES LOOKING AT RIGHT NOW?
>> IF YOU COULD BRING THAT UP SO THAT EVERYBODY COULD SEE THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN WHAT IS OUT THERE AND WHAT WAS APPROVED.
>> THEN THERE WAS A FURTHER AMENDMENT TO THIS WHERE THEY HAD THE TALLER ONES WITH THE NAMES ON IT?
THEY THEY HAD TO VALUE ENGINEER IT.
IT NEVER CAME BACK TO US FOR APPROVAL.
I DON'T KNOW WHAT WE DO AT THIS POINT.
DO WE DO YOU HOLD UP EVERYTHING THAT THEY NEED? I DON'T THINK THAT'S GOING TO FLY.
DO WE BRING IT TO THE COMMISSION'S ATTENTION? I DON'T KNOW.
>> JAKE, IS IT POSSIBLE TO PUT IN THE METAL PART OF THIS FENCE AND LEAVE THE COLUMNS OUT AT ALL UNTIL WE HAVE AN ANSWER BECAUSE I HAVE A FEELING THAT.
>> JUST JUST DO IT LIKE SMALL POSTS UNTIL WE CAN GET AND THEN PUT IN SOMETHING DIFFERENT LATER.
>> YOU COULD CERTAINLY INSTALL THE FOUR FOOT AND LEAVE OUT
[02:00:01]
THE RUSTICATED COLUMNS AND JUST DO THE TWO BY TWO, ALUMINUM COLUMNS.>> MAIN THE RIGHT AREA. IS EVERYBODY OKAY WITH THAT APPROACH? UNTIL WE HAVE A CHANCE.
SEE, THIS IS WHAT WAS ORIGINALLY APPROVED.
AND FROM WHAT I'M HEARING, NOT EVERYBODY ON THIS BOARD GOT TO SEE THE CHANGES THAT WERE MADE TO IT BEFORE IT WAS IMPLEMENTED.
>> THAT'S WHAT I'M LOOKING FOR. THAT'S THE SKETCH.
>> I THINK THE WING WALL CAME LATER.
>> I THINK THAT WAS AT THE 11-21-19.
>> WE LOOKED AT THIS MULTI YOU GO DOWN.
>> THIS IS WHY WE CAN'T GET VOLUNTEERS FOR YOU SIT DOWN ON.
THIS IS WHY WE CAN'T GET BECAUSE THEY IF THEY'RE ASKED TO APPROVE SOMETHING, AND THEN THEY DO IT.
THEN WHAT GOES IN IS NOT WHAT THEY APPROVED.
SEE, IT'S A HALF WALL RIGHT THERE, A KNEE WALL AT THE BOTTOM, AND THEN THEY WENT HIGHER ON THE 24 INCH RUSTICATED COLUMN, AND THEY HAD THE INSET NAMES OF THE STREETS. THE CAT.
>> IT WAS THE GATEWAY TO THE WORKING WATERFRONT.
>> YES. THEN THAT'S WHAT IT WAS JUST DO JUST THE RIGHT SIDE US RIGHT THERE.
>> THERE I DON'T REMEMBER THE WING WALL.
I DON'T KNOW. IS THAT SOMEWHERE THAT YOU'RE LOOKING FOR ALSO? THE WING WALL.
>> I'M GOING TO ASK THAT WE DETERMINE WHETHER WE CAN GIVE JAKE TO GO AHEAD TO GO AHEAD AND DO THE BLACK METAL AND DO THE COLUMNS AFTER WE'VE HAD A CHANCE TO LOOK AT SOME OTHER DESIGNS.
IF THAT'S AN OKAY APPROACH, IS IT?
ONE THING, AS LONG AS JEREMIAH IS OKAY WITH IT.
I THINK IT'D BE INTERESTING TO TAKE THIS AND GET A PROPOSAL ON WHAT IT WOULD TAKE TO DO THESE WING WALLS AT CENTER STREET JUST SO WE HAVE A COST.
>> THERE'S BRICK MASONS THAT WOULD DO IT.
>> BRICK MASONS ARE NOT CHEAP.
>> THAT'S WHY YOU DON'T HAVE THAT.
>> BUT WHY DIDN'T THEY KNOW ABOUT IT?
>> THAT'S THE PROBLEM. IT'S A PROCEDURAL ISSUE.
IF IN FACT, WE DO CODIFY ANY OF THESE GUIDELINES.
THAT WHOLE PROCEDURAL THING IS GOING TO GET WORSE.
ESPECIALLY THE PEOPLE WHO DON'T FOLLOW IT ARE PRIOR TO YOU CITY P.
>> WE'RE SAYING THE RAIN IS GOING TO BE BRICK?
>> BUT LOGISTICALLY, JUST IN TERMS OF CONSTRUCTION, I THINK, WOULDN'T IT BE THE REVERSE THAT THOSE PIERS NEED TO GO IN FIRST, AND THEN YOU FILL A FENCING IN BETWEEN.
YOU CAN'T REALLY JUST PUT THE FENCING IN AND THEN HOPE IT WORKS OUT WITH THE BRICK.
>> I GOT TO BE TO MAKE A FENCING.
>> YOU GOT TO START WITH THE PIERS.
>> TO DO THIS DESIGN, YOU WOULD BASICALLY BE DEMOLISHING EVERYTHING THAT'S THERE AND GOING BACK AND REBUILDING YOUR COLUMNS, WHATEVER DISTANCE.
IT'S NOT AS SIMPLE AS JUST THROWING THAT IN THERE INTO THE MIX THAT YOU HAVE.
>> I THINK, LET ME PUT WORDS IN YOUR MOUTH, BUT I THOUGHT YOU WERE JUST SAYING WE'LL LOSE THE ONES ON THE INTERIOR ONES AND JUST THE TERMINUS WHERE WE HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO DO SOMETHING.
THE VERY LAST ONES THAT ARE FLANKING THE TWO STREETS. IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE SAYING?
>> YES. I'M NOT REDOING THE WHOLE THING BECAUSE THAT IS COST PROHIBITIVE.
>> WE CAN TALK WITH THE MASON THAT WAS GOING TO DO THE ADDITIONAL COLUMNS ON BROOM STREET, WHETHER THEY CAN TAKE THAT TOP CAP OFF AND EXTEND IT AND THEN SEE HOW WE CAN DO THE NAMING.
>> IF YOU CAN DO THAT, PLEASE.
>> WHERE ARLA IS THIS YOU THINKING ASH AND CENTER AND ALACHUA, IN ROOM, SO AT EACH INTERSECTION? YES. I WOULD SUPPORT THAT.
[02:05:01]
>> WHAT HAPPENS IF THEY DON'T HAVE MONEY FOR THEM?
THANK YOU. PREFERENCE SURVEY. [INAUDIBLE]
>> FOLKS DO DOWNLOAD THE UPDATE IS PART OF THE AGENDA PACKET, BUT A UPDATED CLIER HAS BEEN MAILED TO ALL ADDRESSES AVAILABLE IN OLDTOWN, AS WELL AS THE SURVEY LIST THAT HAD BEEN PROVIDED TO US, ANYONE WHO RESPONDED TO THE SURVEY AND GAVE US THEIR E MAIL ADDRESS.
THEY RECEIVED THIS BY E MAIL AS WELL.
JUST TO REALLY QUICKLY SUMMARIZE, WE DID A ROADWAY PREFERENCE SURVEY.
YOU ALL SAW THAT DRAFT DOCUMENT PREVIOUSLY.
WE HAD A RESPONSE OF 61 TOTAL SURVEYS, WHICH IS A 56% RESPONSE RATE, AND THIS IS STATISTICALLY VALID GIVEN THE TOTAL NUMBER OF POTENTIAL SURVEY RESPONSES THAT WE COULD HAVE HAD.
I THINK THE CONCERN THAT PEOPLE ARE PEOPLE ARE CONCERNED WITH THE ROADWAY CONDITIONS AT THE PRESENT TIME. WE LEARNED THAT.
THEIR TOP CONCERNS WERE EROSION ISSUES AND DUST.
I THINK WE WERE WELL AWARE OF THAT PREVIOUSLY.
THEN IN TERMS OF PREFERENCE, THEY WOULD LIKE TO SEE THE EXISTING MATERIAL MAINTAINED WITH THE COCAINA SHELL.
WITH NEXT STEPS, WE'VE COMMITTED TO LOOKING AT INCREASED GRADING FREQUENCY TO SUPPORT THE EROSION CONCERNS THAT WERE IDENTIFIED, ADDING NEW COCAINA MIX, AND INVESTIGATING ENVIRONMENTALLY RESPONSIBLE DUST CONTROL METHODS, SOMETHING THAT MIGHT BE ABLE TO GO INTO THAT MIX AND HELP TO SUPPRESS THE DUST THAT'S OUT THERE. IT'S VERY DRY.
>> YOU NOTIFIED THE RESIDENTS OF THIS.
>> ARE YOU SURE YOU WANT TO HEAR IT? GO FOR IT.
>> NOW, I WAS LIKE ANSWERING A SURVEY.
WOULD YOU RATHER BE SLAPPED HIT OR KICKED? WELL, I DON'T KNOW. YOU GOT ANOTHER OPTION.
PICK ONE. WHICH ONE DO YOU WANT?
>> DO YOU THINK THE RESULTS DIFFER FROM WHAT YOU HEAR OUT THERE?
>> NO, I'M SURE THE RESULTS ARE JUST FINE.
BUT, WERE THERE ANY OTHER OPTIONS? I DON'T KNOW.
THAT WAS THE ONES YOU GOT, SO YOU PICKED ONE.
SOME WOULD RATHER BE KICKED. JEREMIAH.
>> BASED ON YOUR EXPERTISE, DO YOU FEEL LIKE THIS THE PLAN HERE IS GOING TO HELP WITH SOME OF THE ISSUES THAT WERE BROUGHT UP?
>> YEAH. WE'VE KNOWN BEING VERY FRANK, WE'VE KNOWN THAT THE ROADS WILL ALWAYS BE A CONCERN AND THE LOOK AND FEEL WHAT'S STAIRS DESIRED AND THE WITH THAT COMES THEY'RE UNIMPROVED ROADS.
THAT'S HOW THEY'RE CATEGORIZED. THEY'RE UNIMPROVED ROADS, THEY'RE NOT PAVED, AND WITH THAT, YOU GET DUST AND EROSION.
AS FAR AS, RATHER BE KICK, PUNCHED, SLAP, THE OPTIONS, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT ROAD MATERIALS HERE.
THERE'S NOT A LOT OF OPTIONS OUT THERE.
WE BASICALLY PRESENTED TO LEAVE IT AS IS, USE A COUPLE OF DIFFERENT MATERIALS THAT ARE UNIMPROVED TYPE MATERIALS OR PAVE.
THERE'S NOT REALLY A LOT OF OTHER OPTIONS, OTHER YOU CAN REALLY GET INTO DIFFERENT GRADES OF ASPHALT AND THINGS LIKE THAT.
BUT AS FAR AS DIFFERENT MATERIAL, WE DIDN'T EVEN BRING IN ANYTHING THAT WOULD BE CONSIDERED KIND OF RIDICULOUS LIKE CLAY OR THINGS THAT WOULDN'T EVEN FIT HERE.
THERE ARE SOME OTHER MATERIALS, BUT REALLY HERE IN NORTHEAST FLORIDA, THAT'S ALL YOU'RE GOING TO FIND ANYWHERE.
YOU TALK ABOUT BRINGING IN THE COQUINA SHELLS AND PUTTING THEM OUT AND THEN HAVING TO MAINTAIN.
TODAY, MY HUSBAND AND I HAD DRIVE THROUGH THE NEIGHBORHOOD TO GO TO JACKSONVILLE, AND JUST SO HAPPENED TO BE LAWN MAINTENANCE DAY IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD.
LAWN MAINTENANCE BAY MEANS GREAT LAWN MAINTENANCE PEOPLE BLOW ALL THE GRASS CLIPPINGS INTO THE STREET BECAUSE NOBODY WANTS ANY CUT GRASS IN THERE FOR YOUR YARD.
[02:10:02]
THEY WANT IT ALL ON THE STREET.ARE YOU ALL FAMILIAR WITH THIS PRACTICE? HAPPENS EVERYWHERE.
WELL, THAT LOOKS REAL CUTE IN A COCINA SHELL STREET.
THERE IT STAYS BECAUSE YOU KNOW THE LAWN MAINTENANCE PEOPLE, THEY LEAVE THEY DON'T HERE, THEY'VE DONE THEIR JOB.
WELL, THERE'S NO WAY TO GET THAT PRETTY STUFF OFF THAT PRETTY WINE STUFF.
>> MAYBE WE OUGHT TO OUTLAW LINES UP.
>> BUT THOSE ARE JUST SOME OF THE ISSUES.
>> WE SEE THAT EVERYWHERE. I'S AGAINST THE LAW TO DO THAT.
IT'S VERY DIFFICULT TO ENFORCE.
>> I KNOW, BUT SO THE NEXT THING THAT HAPPENS IS THEN THE GRASS STARTS GROWING IN THE ROAD, ESPECIALLY DOWN THE SIDE.
THERE'S JUST ALL ADDITIONAL ISSUES THAT COME THAT DON'T SEEM TO GET ADDRESSED.
BUT THEN I SIT UP HERE AND LISTEN TO US TO DISCUSS PUTTING BRASS DISC IN SIDEWALKS DOWNTOWN, AND 1510 -$15,000,000 FOR DOWNTOWN CENTER STREET.
YOU KNOW, AND ALL OF THIS, BUT THIS IS WHAT WE'RE GOING TO DO TO THE ORIGINAL FUNDING OF BECAUSE THAT'S ALL WE CAN DO BECAUSE YOU KNOW THEY ARE UNIMPROVED ROOMS. BECAUSE THAT'S JUST THE WAY IT IS BECAUSE THAT'S THE WAY IT IS. OLD TOWN SPOKE.
>> THEY DON'T WANT TO SEE THE ROADS CHANGE.
>>WELL, THEY DON'T WANT ANY STORM WATER RUNOFF, EITHER. WE DON'T WANT THAT TAKING.
>> KELLY, HOW MANY TIMES HAVE YOU BEEN THROUGH THIS WITH OLD TOWN ROADS.
>> MANY TIMES IN 50 YEARS I'VE BEEN THROUGH THIS.
I KNOW EXACTLY WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT.
BUT THERE ARE THINGS THAT HAVE TO BE ADDRESSED AND HAVE TO BE TAKEN CARE OF.
STORMWATER BEING ONE OF THEM, PARK AND BEING ONE OF THEM.
THIS IS WHAT THE PEOPLE HAVE SAID, AND THIS IS WHAT THE PEOPLE WILL GET.
WE WILL MOVE ON, AND WE WILL DEAL WITH IT AGAIN ANOTHER TIME IN ANOTHER WAY.
>> I HAVE THE SAME PROBLEM ON MY ROAD.
>> NO. I DON'T WANT TO PAVE BECAUSE RIGHT NOW IT MAKES A GREAT STORM WATER SOLUTION FOR ME.
I THINK THAT THERE MAY BE A POSSIBLE PROJECT IN THE CITY'S FUTURE TO TAKE A LOOK AT EVERYTHING IN OLD TOWN.
THIS WE GOT ANSWERS FOR AND SO THAT AND WE GO ON.
BUT I THINK DOWN THE ROAD, IF THESE EROSION PROBLEMS CONTINUE AND SOME OF THE THINGS THAT PEOPLE CAME AND COMPLAINED ABOUT, WHICH ARE ONLY QUASI RELATED TO THE ROAD.
THERE MIGHT BE AN OVERALL ANALYSIS THAT NEEDS TO HAPPEN.
WHAT'S TOUCH AND WHAT IN OLD TOWN? SO MAYBE THEY SHOULD FORM AN HOA.
JEREMIAH, KEEP THAT IN MIND FOR YOUR BUDGET DISCUSSION.
>> NOW WE GO ON BECAUSE WE DON'T NEED TO DO 5.4, WE DID THAT.
WE'RE GOING TO TALK ABOUT DISCUSSION AND UPDATE STAFF REVIEW AND ISSUANCE OF CERTIFICATE APPROVAL REGARDING FENCES.
I THINK THAT SHOULD PROBABLY MOVE TO OUR WORKSHOP DISCUSSION, AND SEE WHAT ALL OF THE STAFF APPROVAL SHOULD BE.
DOES THAT WORK FOR EVERYBODY? I WILL DO AN UPDATE FOR YOU NOW ON THE PECK CENTER APPLICATION, AND THEN KELLY HAS MORE INFORMATION.
IN DOING THE RESEARCH THAT I'VE DONE, THERE'S BEEN WORK DONE PIECEMEAL BY TWO OR THREE DIFFERENT PEOPLE, I THINK, ON THE PECK CENTER APPLICATION FOR THE NATIONAL REGISTER IN THE PAST.
I THINK THERE'S SOME HERE IN THE CITY, AND THEN ADRIAN MIGHT HAVE SOME ADDITIONAL.
WE'VE TALKED ABOUT GETTING THAT TOGETHER AND COMPLETING THAT PROJECT.
WHAT KELLY HAS SAID, THAT'S GOING TO BE MIA THAT GETS THAT ASSIGNMENT.
>> SHE ACTUALLY HAS AN UPDATE FOR YOU ABOUT THAT SPECIFICALLY.
>> HI. I'M MIA SADLER, I'M PLANNER 1.
[02:15:02]
I JUST STARTED HERE THIS MONTH, I'VE MET A COUPLE OF YOU GUYS.THE PAST FEW WEEKS SINCE I'VE TALKED TO CHAIR FILKOFF, I'VE BEEN LOOKING THROUGH ALL THOSE FILES, THE PIECEMEAL STUFF, AND ADRIAN BURKE DID A LOT OF THAT WORK, AND ALSO SAL, WHO WAS HERE BEFORE, A MIGHTY BIG SHOES TO FILL IT WITH THAT ONE.
BUT I'VE LOOKED THROUGH ALL THAT.
THERE'S A LOT OF MATERIAL LIKE DRAWINGS, LETTERS OF SUPPORT, PHOTOGRAPHS, NARRATIVE, STATEMENT OF SIGNIFICANCE.
ALL OF THAT IS PUT TOGETHER, BUT THE ENVELOPE HASN'T BEEN PUT THROUGH THE MAIL SLOT.
I TALKED TO THE DHR THIS WEEK AND THEY SAID THERE HASN'T BEEN A NATIONAL REGISTER NOMINATION.
THAT'S JUST SITTING THERE FOR US TO COMPLETE.
I WAS CURIOUS IF SAL HAD GONE AHEAD AND DONE THAT PERSONALLY BECAUSE JUST PEOPLE CAN SUBMIT THOSE NATIONAL REGISTER NOMINATIONS, AND HE WAS WORKING ON HIS THESIS HERE ABOUT THE PECK CENTER.
IT'S JUST A MATTER OF WALKING IT BACK THROUGH THE PROCESS WITH THE PSIQ AT THE STATE AND THEN HAVING THEM NOMINATED FOR THE NATIONAL REGISTER OF HISTORIC PLACES.
THE PSIQ FORM IS REALLY STRAIGHTFORWARD AND SIMPLE.
I'M GOING TO GO OVER THAT WITH KELLY TOMORROW AND HOPEFULLY SEND IT OUT TO THE STATE.
THEN THE REPRESENTATIVE, I TALKED TO THE DHR ANDREW WARBUR, SAID, BY THE END OF THE YEAR, IT'S A SHOE IN FOR NATIONAL REGISTER FOR HISTORIC PLACES, AND HE DOESN'T SEE ANY CONFLICTS WITH THAT.
WE ALREADY HAVE ALL THE INFORMATION, SO IT SHOULD BE A PRETTY STRAIGHTFORWARD PROCESS.
>> THE PECK ALUMNI WILL BE THRILLED.
>> I WILL JUST SAY, THE RESEARCH THAT HAS GONE INTO THAT AND THE ARCHITECTURAL ANALYSIS AND JUST GOING THROUGH THE ARCHIVES AND PHOTOS, I COULD NOT HAVE DONE THAT BY MYSELF.
THERE'S GOING TO BE LOTS OF ACCREDITATION TO THE PEOPLE WHO TRIED BEFORE ME TO GET THIS ON THE NATIONAL REGISTER.
>> I WILL JUST BE WRAPPING IT UP AND SENDING IT OFF.
>> IT'S ALWAYS THE LAST ONE TO TOUCH.
>> I THINK WE'RE GOOD ON THAT.
>> BUT DON'T LEAVE YET BECAUSE THE NEXT THING IS SEMI-RELATED.
IN DOING THE RESEARCH THAT I WAS DOING AROUND PECK, I FOUND THAT HIS HOME IS STILL HERE.
USED TO BE SITTING IN THE PARKING LOT OF WHAT IS NOW LAS ARENA, FACING HORIZON, OR FACING DAVIS.
FROM WHAT I'M TOLD, IT'S CHANGED DRAMATICALLY FROM WHAT IT WAS WHEN IT WAS ORIGINALLY THERE.
IT'S NOW ON THE CORNER OF THE SOUTH EAST CORNER OF CEDAR AND NINTH, AND I HAPPEN TO KNOW WHO LIVES THERE.
I WOULD LOVE FOR IT TO HAVE SOME PLAQUE OR SOME RECOGNITION THAT THAT'S WHO LIVED THERE.
NOW, SOMEBODY SUGGESTED A START MARKER.
CAN I ASK MIA TO LOOK INTO A COUPLE OPTIONS? IS THAT OKAY WITH YOU?
>> WOULD YOU PLEASE LOOK INTO WHAT THE OPTIONS MIGHT BE FOR JUST RECOGNIZING THAT HOME.
IT'S CURRENTLY OWNED BY JOHN MANDRIK'S SON.
JOHN USED TO WORK FOR THE CITY OF FERNANDINA.
WHEN I TALKED TO HIM, BECAUSE I THOUGHT IT WAS HIM THAT OWNED IT, HE SAID IT'S HIS SON WHO'S A MINISTER AND WHO HAD NO IDEA, NEITHER OF THEM, THAT IT HAD BEEN DR. PECK'S HOME.
IF YOU COULD LOOK INTO ANY OPTION, AND KELLY'S GETTING THAT.
>> NO, IT'S THE OTHER SIDE OF THE STREET.
>> THEY'VE DONE A TON OF WORK ON THAT HOUSE.
>> THEY HAVE. BECAUSE JOHN TOLD ME THAT THERE'S MORE INTERIOR DOORS IN THAT HOUSE THAN HE'S EVER SEEN IN HIS LIFE. [LAUGHTER]
I ALMOST BOUGHT THAT BEFORE MY HOUSE.
>> ONE OF THE THINGS THAT HAPPENED, I GUESS, AFTER DR. PECK DIED WAS THAT HIS WIFE RENTED OUT ROOMS FOR TEACHERS.
THE CHANGES THAT HAPPENED ARE [INAUDIBLE] JOHN ALSO SAID, AND THIS IS KILLING ME TO KNOW THIS, HE ALSO SAID THAT THE CHIMNEY IN THERE IS SPIRAL BROOKS BUT IT'S ALL ENCASED.
[02:20:06]
WE COULD ALL VOLUNTEER AS A BOARD TO GO [LAUGHTER] HELP HIM OPEN IT UP.BUT I DO WANT TO SEE [OVERLAPPING] IT MIGHT BE THERE.
>> I CAN DEFINITELY LOOK INTO THAT.
BUT AS FROM WHAT I'VE DONE FOR RESEARCH WITH THE PECK CENTER IS THAT THOSE HISTORICAL MARKERS AND DESIGNATIONS HAVE BEEN MORE OR LESS ABOUT THE ARCHITECTURE AND THE BUILT SPACE AND LEANING MORE INTO THE HERITAGE BECAUSE WE'VE LOST A LOT OF THAT ARCHITECTURAL INTEGRITY BUT WE STILL HAVE THE STORIES THAT ARE TIED TO THAT PLACE.
I THINK IF WE DO HIGHLIGHT THE STORY, AND THIS IS WITH DR. PECK'S HOME AND THEN HIS WIFE HOUSE TEACHERS.
THAT'S A VERY IMPORTANT HISTORICAL STORY THAT WE NEED TO TELL.
>> GREAT. THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
>> HOW LONG DID YOU SAY IT WOULD TAKE TO GET ON THE NATIONAL REGISTER?
>> HE SAID BY THE END OF THE YEAR THEY COULD SUBMIT IT TO THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT AND THEN IT WOULD TAKE 45-90 DAYS FOR THEM TO APPROVE IT.
>> THERE'S A GATEKEEPER FUNCTION HERE IN THE STATE THAT'S, FROM WHAT I'VE BEEN TOLD IN THE PAST, IS MUCH MORE RIGOROUS THAN [INAUDIBLE]
>> WHO I SPOKE WITH THIS WEEK, HE SAID THAT HE'S ACTUALLY VISITED THE PECK CENTER, AND HE SAID IT WAS A SHOE IN.
HE'S LIKE, THIS TOTALLY DESERVES TO BE ON THE NATIONAL REGISTER, AND HE'S LIKE, HE KNEW SAL AS WELL.
HE'S LIKE, JUST GET YOUR DOCS IN A ROW AND SUBMIT IT TO ME.
>> I WAS JUST THINKING MAYBE JUNE 10, 2026 WOULD BE A GOOD TIME TO DO THE RIBBON CUTTING.
THE CELEBRATION FOR ALL OF IT.
>> THERE'S BEEN A LOT OF WORK ALREADY PUT INTO IT.
>> WELL, LET KEEP THIS INFORMED.
>> UPDATE ON PORT ACTIVITIES, MEMBER COSA.
>> TWO ITEMS ABOUT THE PORT THAT AFFECT THE HISTORIC DISTRICT.
THE PORT ERECTED HOW MANY? TWENTY TWO THOUSAND SQUARE FEET TENTS OR SOMETHING.
ONE OF THEM IS FINE, IT'S ON THEIR PROPERTY.
ONE, THEY GOT APPROVAL FOR ON THE NORTHERNMOST PART OF THEIR CAMPUS AND OPA.
THEY HAVE TO GO TO OPA FOR APPROVAL, THEY APPROVED IT.
THEY NEVER SOUGHT A BUILDING PERMIT, SO IT NEVER GOT APPROVAL THROUGH THE CITY, AND THEN WHEN THEY CAME OUT TO ERECT IT, THE OPERATOR PUT IT IN A DIFFERENT LOCATION AND THEY ENCROACHED WITHIN THE 30-FOOT BUFFER INTO THE HISTORIC DISTRICT BECAUSE OUR COMP PLAN AND THE PORT ELEMENT STATES VERY CLEARLY THAT THE PORT SPECIFICALLY MUST MAINTAIN A 30-FOOT BUFFER IN BETWEEN THEM AND THE RESIDENTIAL HISTORIC DISTRICT, RATHER.
IT DOESN'T MATTER ABOUT WHAT THE ZONING IS.
THERE'S BEEN A LOT OF WHOOP BLAH BACK AND FORTH WITH THE NEIGHBORS AND THE PORT, AND THEN THE OPERATOR FILED FOR A NOTICE OF RELIEF AGAINST THE CITY.
THAT WAS SET TO BE HEARD ON SOMEWHERE END OF JANUARY OR MIDDLE OF JANUARY, I THINK.
THEN TAMMY BACH WAS LET GO SO WE DID NOT HAVE REPRESENTATION AND HARRISON WAS TO BE THE MAGISTRATE WHO WOULD HEAR THAT BECAUSE HE WAS NOW PART OF THE CITY.
AT THE LAST OPEN MEETING, THE OPERATOR CAME FORTH.
THE OPERATOR WAS NOT VERY EXCITED ABOUT THE WHOLE ADMINISTRATIVE HEARING.
THEY DID NOT KNOW THAT THE OPERATOR HIRED AN OUTSIDE LEGAL COUNSEL, THEY DIDN'T KNOW THAT THEY WERE GOING AGAINST THE CITY.
THEY KNEW NOTHING ABOUT IT UNTIL THE DAY OF THE MEETING WHEN SOMEBODY ASKED THEM WHAT THEIR OPINION WAS OF [OVERLAPPING]
>> [OVERLAPPING] IDEA? [LAUGHTER]
>> OPA IS NOT TOO HAPPY WITH THE OPERATOR.
AT THE LAST MEETING, THE OPERATOR ASKED OPA TO JOIN THEM AGAINST THE CITY AND TO HAVE THE CONTRACTOR WHO PUT THE FENCE IN JOIN THEM AGAINST THE CITY.
OPA WAS NOT TOO HAPPY ABOUT THAT, AND THEY'VE ASKED FOR A POSTPONEMENT SO THEIR LEGAL CAN LOOK INTO A COUPLE OF DIFFERENT THINGS ABOUT THAT.
THE NEXT OPA MEETING IS ON THE 26TH, AND WE'LL BE DISCUSSING THAT TO SEE WHERE EVERYTHING LANDS, BUT THERE'S AFFECTED PARTIES THAT HAVE BEEN NOTICED IN THAT AREA.
WE CAN SPEAK ON THE MATTER, WE CAN BRING UP CONCERNS AND THE HISTORY, ETC.
THEN IT'S BASICALLY BEING, IT'S NOT ADJUDICATED, BUT THE MAGISTRATE WILL HEAR IT AND SEE WHICH WAY THEY THINK THINGS SHOULD GO.
[02:25:03]
THE NEIGHBORS REALLY WANT THE TENT TO BE MOVED BACK TO WHERE IT WAS APPROVED BECAUSE IT'S RIGHT UP AGAINST.THE BUILDING AND WHAT OPA IS SAYING IS, WELL, WE OWN THAT BUILDING.
IT'S THE OLD CAPTAIN'S HOUSE, SO WHAT? THAT'S THE HISTORIC DISTRICT RIGHT THERE.
THERE'S A FEW LITTLE ISSUES ABOUT THAT.
JUST BRINGING THAT UP TO YOUR ATTENTION BECAUSE IT DOES AFFECT THE HTC.
THE SECOND THING IS THE PORT LOTS THAT ARE FOR SALE, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU SAW THEM ON ANY ARTICLES, BUT THEY ARE SELLING.
THERE'S SIX UNDERLYING LOTS OF RECORD.
WE'VE BEEN WORKING WITH THE PORT SINCE END OF 2021, AND THEY VERBALLY AND IN WRITING COMMITTED TO PUT DEED RESTRICTIONS ON THIS TO KEEP WITH THE HISTORIC DISTRICT FLAVOR, THREE LOTS MAXIMUM, 50-FOOT WIDE MINIMUM, SO CAN'T PUT SIX TINY HOUSES IN THERE.
WELL, THEY HAVE THAT IN THEIR LISTING AGREEMENT, BUT THEY HAVEN'T RECORDED.
TECHNICALLY, ANYBODY CAN BUY IT AND COME TO KELLY OR PLANNING AND FIGURE OUT WHAT WOULD WORK IN OUR ZONING.
IT IS OUR TWO WHICH WORKS IN OUR FAVOR.
THE ONE UP HERE IS MU, BUT THAT'S NOT ON THE CLOCK YET.
I'LL BE SPEAKING TO THEM ABOUT THIS TOO TO TRY TO GET THAT ON RECORD TO MAINTAIN THE FABRIC OF THIS AREA, SO TOWN HOUSES, HOUSES DON'T GO IN THERE, AND IT'S MORE IN KEEPING WITH THE OTHER BECAUSE THAT'S THE END OF OUR HISTORIC DISTRICT AND TO JUST FLIP ALL OF A SUDDEN, ESPECIALLY IF THIS IS ANOTHER POTENTIAL ACROSS THE STREET.
WE'LL SEE HOW THAT MEETING GOES IF WE NEED TO TAKE IT FURTHER AND HAVE MORE FORMAL REPRESENTATION FROM THE HDC.
>> WEREN'T THERE TWO HOMES THAT WERE ON THE SOUTHERN SET OF LOTS THAT WERE DEMOED BY NEGLECT BECAUSE THEY WERE JUST FALLING APART?
>> THERE WAS ONE RIGHT HERE AND ONE IN THE CORNER RIGHT THERE.
>> THEY JUST ROTTED [OVERLAPPING] TORN DOWN.
IT WAS DEMOLISHED BECAUSE THEY HAD 00.
>> YES. [LAUGHTER] THEN ONE BURNED.
>> ONE MORE AND THEN THEY WILL BURN.
>> DO YOU WANT TO KNOW WHAT SOMETHING THAT'S SO SAD? THESE WERE THE SISTER HOUSES TO MY HOUSE.
THEY WERE ALL THE EXACT EVERYTHING.
THEY COULD HAVE BEEN LIKE A CUTE LITTLE [INAUDIBLE] ANDY, KELLY, I REALIZED THAT THE PORT MEETING IS THE SAME AS OUR SO CAN I START HERE AND THEN MAYBE LEAVE? LIKE GET SIX AND GO FOR PUBLIC COMMENT AND THEN JUST COME BACK IN. IS THAT OKAY?
>> YOU CAN DO WHATEVER YOU WANT. [LAUGHTER]
>> YOU HAVE TO KEEP SPEAKING TO THEM BECAUSE YOU ESTABLISHED A RELATIONSHIP.
>> WE'RE ON TO NOW ANNUAL ELECTION OF CHAIR AND VICE CHAIR.
>> WE DID THOUGH. WE DID A STOP GAP.
IF ANYBODY NEED TO BE SPECIAL AND BEING CHAIR OR VICE CHAIR. PLEASE.
>> I CAN NOMINATE IRENE AGAIN.
>> I THINK SO TOO. YOU RUN A DARN GOOD MEETING.
WE HAVE JIM PASSETA AS VICE AND ME, I GUESS, AS CHAIR.
IS EVERYBODY OKAY WITH THAT? EVERYBODY SAY AYE.
STAFF CERTIFICATES OF APPROVAL.
[6. STAFF REPORT]
ANY QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS ABOUT THOSE IN OUR PACKET?>> [INAUDIBLE] FERNANDINA BEACH SHRIMPING INDUSTRY, WE'VE ALL RECEIVED AN INVITATION TO ATTEND THAT LISTENING SESSION.
>> YES. NEXT MONDAY AT 10:00 AM.
>> THAT'S BRUTAL. NEXT STEPS, KELLY ON THE BOSQUE BELLO CEMETERY.
>> YES. JUST AS AN UPDATE, THE FERNANDINA ISLAND RESTORATION FOUNDATION GRANT IN ORDER TO MOVE FORWARD WITH THE NATIONAL REGISTER NOMINATION FOR BOSQUE BELLO IN ITS ENTIRETY.
[02:30:06]
A VENDOR HAS BEEN SELECTED TO PUT TOGETHER THE DOCUMENTATION ASSOCIATED WITH THAT GRANT.THEY ARE HITTING THE GROUND RUNNING WITH IT.
THEY HAVE A VERY SHORT PERIOD OF TIME TO PUT THIS TOGETHER AND GET IT SUBMITTED.
THE NOMINATION IS DUE IN JUNE, SO I DO EXPECT THAT WE'LL SEE SOME MATERIALS AND AS SOON AS I HAVE MATERIALS, I'M HAPPY TO FORWARD THEM ALONG.
BUT THIS WILL RUN THROUGH THAT STATE REVIEW PROCESS.
THE PSIQ HAS BEEN COMPLETED FOR IT, SO WE KNOW THAT IT IS POTENTIALLY ELIGIBLE.
NOW, IT GETS INTO THE DOCUMENTATION COMPONENT OF IT AND COMPILING ALL OF THE NECESSARY MATERIALS TO REALLY FILE WHY THIS IS WORTHY OF BEING ON THE NATIONAL REGISTER.
THE FIRM THAT WAS SELECTED IS OUT OF JACKSONVILLE.
IT IS TERRACON, AND THEY HAVE WORKED ON NATIONAL REGISTER NOMINATIONS IN THE PAST, AND THEY'VE ALREADY MET WITH THE RESTORATION FOUNDATION AND ARE BEGINNING THAT WORK.
>> VERY GOOD. THANK YOU FOR THAT.
HANDS-ON WINDOW PRESERVATION WORKSHOP.
>> YES. THIS IS AN UPCOMING WORKSHOP THAT WE EXPECT TO DO AS PART OF OUR PRESERVATION MONTH ACTIVITIES IN MAY.
RIGHT NOW, THE TENTATIVE DATE IS MAY 16TH, A FRIDAY, AND IT'S EXPECTED TO BE EIGHT HOURS LONG WITH THE BEGINNING PORTION OF IT BEING MORE CLASSROOM AND THEN THE LATER PART OF THE DAY BEING HANDS-ON RESTORATION ACTIVITIES.
>> IS THIS THE SAME GUY THAT WE TALKED WITH BEFORE HERE?
>> HE'S DONE SEVERAL WORKSHOPS WITH THE CITY IN THE PAST.
>> IS THIS THE GROUP THAT WORKED WITH CHURCH TOO?
>> WHAT'S THE STATUS WITH THAT, THE FIRST PRESBYTERIAN WINDOW?
>> PERMITS HAVE BEEN ISSUED FOR THIS AND A CERTIFICATE OF APPROVAL WAS GRANTED AS PART OF THE PERMIT ISSUANCE.
>> WHAT ARE THEY DOING WITH THE WINDOWS THAT THEY CHOSE NOT TO REPLACE?
>> THAT THEY CHOSE NOT TO REPLACE? THEY WILL RESTORE THEM.
>> IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING THAT THERE WERE FIVE WINDOWS THAT WERE TAKEN OUT AND THAT COULD HAVE BEEN KEPT?
>> THERE'S THE POTENTIAL THAT THEY COULD HAVE BEEN RESTORED.
>> WHAT WILL THE CHURCH DO WITH THOSE?
>> I'M NOT SURE. THE EMAIL EXCHANGE THAT YOU SAW IS ALL I'VE HAD TO DATE FROM ANY FEEDBACK FROM THE CHURCH ABOUT IT.
>> WHEN I LOOKED AT THE STAFF REPORT, I JUST SAW ONE WAS BEING RESTORED, THE TRANSOM.
>> EVERYTHING ELSE WAS BEING [OVERLAPPING].
>> THAT REPORT TO ME, IT WAS VERY DETAILED, SOMEONE SPENT A LOT OF TIME ON THAT.
BUT I THINK WITHOUT ACTUALLY PHYSICALLY BEING THERE, I DON'T KNOW HOW YOU CAN TELL WHICH WINDOWS ARE [OVERLAPPING].
>> I WONDER IF THIS MIGHT BE SOMETHING BENEFICIAL FOR US TO DISCUSS AT OUR WORKSHOP OF WHEN THERE'S A LEVEL OR A PERCENTAGE OF WINDOWS.
THIS IS BASICALLY A WHOLESALE REPLACEMENT OF WINDOWS.
>> I THINK IT'S TOO MUCH INFORMATION.
>> IT'S TOO MUCH FOR STAFF, I THINK TO GO THROUGH.
WE CAN OFFER, LET US TAKE THE HEAT IF WE NEED TO BECAUSE I TELL YOU THAT TWO THINGS, TOO, THAT BOTHERED ME IN THE STAFF REPORT, IT SAYS, REPLACE 62 SASHES.
SIXTY-TWO SASHES TECHNICALLY IS 31 WINDOWS BECAUSE IF THEY'RE DOUBLE-HOME WINDOWS, THEY EACH HAVE TWO SASHES.
THEN I'M THINKING, OH, ARE THEY JUST DOING MAYBE A BOTTOM SASH HERE? THEN NO, THEY'RE REPLACING 62 WINDOWS, AND SOME OF THE RATIONALE, AS YOU GUYS KNOW, WAS IN THE ONE BUILDING, OH, THIS WAS AN ADDITION, AND IT WAS PUT IN THE 1960.
WELL, TO ME, HISTORIC IS A MOVING TARGET.
IT DOESN'T HAVE TO BE A PERIOD OF SIGNIFICANCE FOR ALL THINGS.
MY HOME IN ATLANTA, FOR INSTANCE, BUILT IN 1959 HAS 6/9'S, THIN MULLIONS.
YOU WALK BY AND YOU GET A BIG OLD DRAFT, BUT THEY'RE GORGEOUS.
I'M NOT GOING TO RIP THOSE OUT, PUT VINYL IN THEM.
I THINK JIM MADE THIS POINT AT A MEETING MANY YEARS AGO, AND IT'S SO GOOD, IT'S STUCK WITH ME.
WHEN YOU WALK BY SOME OF THESE HOUSES THAT ARE INDIVIDUALLY PANED, IT'S NOT JUST A SHEET TRUE DIVIDED OR TRUE PANES, YOU GET SLIGHT DIFFERENT REFLECTIONS AND REFRACTIONS OF LIGHT.
[02:35:01]
IT DOESN'T LOOK LIKE THIS FAKE PLATE GLASS LIKE THAT WITH MULLIONS ON IT.IT'S GOING TO CHANGE THE CHARACTER AND THE LOOK AT THAT HOUSE.
LAST THING, AND THEN I'LL GET OFF MY SOAP BOX HERE.
ANY OF US THAT HAVE DONE HISTORIC HOMES, IF YOU'RE JUST REPLACING THE WINDOWS, YOU'RE GOING TO GET A BUMP OF ENERGY EFFICIENCY, NOT A WHOLE LOT, BECAUSE THE PROBLEM WITH HISTORIC BUILDINGS, THERE'S NO INSULATION.
UNLESS YOU'RE RIPPING OUT THE SHEETROCK OR WHATEVER'S ON THE WALLS AND REDOING AND SEALING EVERYTHING, THERE'S SO MUCH DRAFT INFILTRATION, NOT JUST FROM THE WINDOWS.
BUT WHAT REALLY BURNED ME IS THAT SO MUCH OF THIS, IT WAS LIKE DEMO BY NEGLECT.
IT WAS NEGLIGENT MAINTENANCE, DEFERRED MAINTENANCE, PUSHED ASIDE, AND THEN, OH, WE ARE GOING TO HAVE TO CHANGE IT.
I AGREE WITH LOOKING AT SOME OF THOSE PICTURES, THERE WAS A LOT MORE THAT COULD HAVE BEEN REPAIRED AND SAVED THAN JUST PULLED OUT.
>> THIS WOULD APPEAR TO BE ANOTHER THING THAT WE CAN'T DO ANYTHING ABOUT.
IT SEEMS TO ME THAT WE OFTEN HAVE THOSE.
THAT'S PART OF WHAT I WANT US TO DISCUSS IN THIS WORKSHOP WITH CODIFICATION AND WHERE IS THE APPROVAL AND WHAT PERCENTAGE MAYBE OF THE WORK NEEDS TO BE APPROVED HERE VERSUS BY STAFF, OR IN THOSE TYPES OF CONVERSATIONS.
IF EVERYBODY HAS YOUR COPY OF THE GUIDELINE BOOK, DO YOU HAVE ONE?
>> I WOULD ASK YOU TO LOOK THROUGH THAT AGAIN BECAUSE I KNOW THAT WE ALL HAD COMMENTS ABOUT SOME OF THE FORMATTING THINGS OR TYPOS, OR THAT THING.
BUT LOOK THROUGH THOSE AGAIN AND PLEASE COME TO THE WORKSHOP WITH THOSE THINGS THAT YOU THINK ARE CANDIDATES FOR BEING CODIFIED AS OPPOSED TO JUST A SUGGESTION.
BECAUSE WE'VE SENT PEOPLE OUT HERE BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T DO SOME OF THESE THINGS, EVEN THOUGH THEY'RE JUST CALLED GUIDELINES.
IT MUST BE MORE THAN A GUIDELINE, I MEAN THAT LOGICALLY, I HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THAT.
IF THAT'S IT, WOULD YOU LIKE TO SAY ANYTHING? [LAUGHTER]
>> I ACTUALLY HAVE ONE QUESTION.
WASN'T LEFT OFF THAT HE WAS GOING TO GO BACK BECAUSE YOU GUYS SAID THAT, AND THIS IS FOR THE WINDOWS, YOU GUYS SAID THERE WASN'T ENOUGH INFORMATION TO DRAW ABOUT REPLACING ALL 62 WINDOWS.
WASN'T HE GOING TO GET BACK TO YOU GUYS WITH MORE INFORMATION?
>> WHAT HAPPENED BETWEEN THE APPROVAL AND MORE INFORMATION?
>> I THINK THE MORE INFORMATION WAS THAT SURVEY THAT HAD WNO ON EVERY WINDOW.
EVERYBODY'S WINDOW THAT'S BEEN PAINTED WILL NOT OPEN ANYMORE BECAUSE IT'S BEEN [LAUGHTER] [INAUDIBLE].
>> THAT WAS A PROJECT OF WINDOWS, AND IT ALL GOT DUMPED ON KELLY.
THAT'S ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT.
MAYBE IF IT'S THAT BIG A PROJECT, MAYBE IT SHOULD COME HERE BECAUSE SHE CAN'T, SHE IS ONE PERSON.
THOSE ARE THE KINDS OF THINGS, AND I APPRECIATE YOU REMEMBERING THAT.
>> I THINK SOME OF THE CRITERIA ON THE WINDOW SURVEY ITSELF IS EXTREMELY VAGUE, LOOSELY INTERPRETED.
IT IS A DISASTER THAT LED TO THIS. I THINK THAT'S [OVERLAPPING].
>> CONSIDERING IT'S OUR OLDEST CHURCH, THAT'S THE [OVERLAPPING].
>> IT'S LIKE THE SURGEON SAYING, OH, YEAH, WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO TAKE THAT GALLBLADDER OUT.
>> WELL, [INAUDIBLE] HAS A GOODS BECAUSE [BACKGROUND] [LAUGHTER] YOUR APPOINTMENT WILL NOT OPEN.
THERE'S LOTS OF DIFFERENT REASONS.
ONE COULD BE IT'S JUST BEEN PAINTED SHUT.
WELL, THAT'S NOT A REASON TO GET RID OF THE WINDOW.
ANOTHER ONE COULD BE THAT THE WEIGHTS INSIDE THE WALL, THE ROPES HAVE JUST DISINTEGRATED.
THEY JUST NEED TO BE REPLACED.
THEN A THIRD REASON COULD BE THAT THE WOOD'S JUST GONE AND SHOT, THAT THAT IT'S NO GOOD.
BUT IF THE FRAME IS OKAY, WELL, YOU JUST BUILD A NEW SASH AND FIX IT.
>> IS THAT SOMETHING THAT GETS COVERED IN THIS WINDOWS WORKSHOP? DO THEY TALK ABOUT THINGS LIKE THAT?
>> IN MY OPINION, IT'S THE WINDOWS THAT ALL THE WOOD OF THE WINDOWS, THE SASHES IS ROTTEN, THE FRAME IS ROTTEN, THE BALANCES OF THE WEIGHTS ARE SHOT, IT HAS TO BE A LOT OF THE WINDOWS COMPLETELY GONE OR THE GLASS IS BROKEN.
>> LET'S TALK ABOUT THOSE WINDOW WORKSHOPS.
THE PEOPLE THAT COME, YOU'RE PREACHING TO THE CHOIR.
BECAUSE THEY ARE THE PEOPLE THAT WANT TO DO IT.
IT'S ALMOST LIKE WE SHOULD MAKE IT MANDATORY FOR THE CONTRACTORS.
>> THAT'S SUCH A GREAT POINT BECAUSE HOW DO WE GET
[02:40:03]
TO THE PEOPLE WHO NEED TO HEAR THIS MESSAGE? HOW DO WE INVITE THEM, MAKE IT SO THIS IS A FORMAL INVITATION? PLEASE COME TO THIS SO THAT [OVERLAPPING] PEOPLE THAT NEED TO HEAR THIS MESSAGE ARE PRESENT BECAUSE IT'S GOING TO BE THE PEOPLE LIKE ALL OF US WHO ARE [INAUDIBLE].>> THE COUPLE THAT WAS HERE TONIGHT, THIS IS ALL BRAND NEW TO THEM.
THEY MIGHT NOT HAVE AN INTEREST IN GOING TO A WINDOW WORKSHOP, BUT MAYBE THE INFORMATIONAL PIECE, MAYBE IT CAN BE BROKEN UP INTO JUST INFORMATIONAL OR I DON'T KNOW.
>> [OVERLAPPING] I'M SORRY, GO AHEAD. BUT IF IT'S IN THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE, AND IF IT'S IN THE CODE, THEN I DON'T KNOW THAT THE HOMEOWNER REALLY NEEDS TO UNDERSTAND IT BECAUSE IT'S IN THE CODE, AND THEN THE DOCUMENTATION THAT IS SUBMITTED NEEDS TO BE CONSISTENT.
I'M HOPING THAT THERE WAS MORE TO THE SUBMISSION THAN WHAT WE SAW, WHICH WAS A POWERPOINT PRESENTATION.
WERE THERE ACTUAL DRAWINGS THAT WERE SUBMITTED, LIKE PLANS AND ELEVATIONS?
>> I ACTUALLY DON'T UNDERSTAND WHY THAT GOT TO THE POINT OF EVEN BEING REVIEWED, IT SEEMS LIKE IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN SENT BACK AND SAID YOU WOULD NEED TO SUBMIT COMPLETE DOCUMENTS IN ORDER TO GET A BUILDING PERMIT.
>> PERHAPS WHEN WE'RE GOING THROUGH THE GUIDELINES, WE CAN ADDRESS THOSE KINDS OF THINGS IN THAT SECTION.
WHEN INFORMATION IS PROVIDED TO, I WAS GOING TO ASK US ABOUT THE TAX INFORMATION THAT YOU SENT TO ALL OF US, THE TAX INCENTIVES.
WHEN FOLKS COME IN WITH A REQUEST TO DO ANYTHING WITH THE HISTORIC PROPERTY, DOES THAT INFORMATION GET SHARED WITH THEM RIGHT OUT OF THE CHUTE?
>> OH, TAXES? WE HAVE FLYERS AND INFORMATION AVAILABLE.
>> [OVERLAPPING] I'M SAYING [INAUDIBLE].
>> YOU KNOW HOW I FOUND OUT ABOUT IT.
I WAS WAITING IN THAT LITTLE ROOM WHERE BUILDING USED TO BE, AND I SAW THAT PLOT.
BECAUSE I'M LIKE, OH, WHAT'S THIS ABOUT THIS TOWN? I'M LIKE, WOW, TAX INCENTIVE [INAUDIBLE] [OVERLAPPING] BECAUSE SAL NEVER TOLD ME THAT.
>> WHEN I WAS DOING MAIN STREET, WE SURVEYED OUR PROPERTY OWNERS, AND A LOT OF THEM DIDN'T KNOW, TOO.
I THINK WHAT WE WANT TO TALK ABOUT IS FROM A PROCEDURAL PERSPECTIVE.
WHAT INFORMATION SHOULD WE FORCE-FEED PEOPLE THE FIRST TIME THEY COME IN THE DOOR?
>> LIKE A PACKET OF INFORMATION.
>> WELCOME TO THE HISTORIC DISTRICT.
THE VALUE THAT YOU JUST [OVERLAPPING].
>> MAYBE A PACKET YOU MAKE AND GIVE IT TO THEM WHEN THEY BUY IT.
>> YEAH. BECAUSE IT'S ALSO RELATED TO [OVERLAPPING] THE BUSINESS WHERE THE GUIDELINES BY THEMSELVES DON'T TELL THEM EVERYTHING.
>> LDC DOES TOO AND SO FORTH AND SO ON.
A LOT OF MY COMMENTS WERE SHOULDN'T WE HAVE A DIRECT REFERENCE TO THE LDC.
>> YES AND NO. YOU'D BE REALLY CAREFUL WITH PUTTING THAT IN YOUR GUIDELINES.
A REFERENCE TO THE GUIDELINE OR TO THE CODE, YES.
JUST GO SEE THE CODE FOR THAT.
YOU DON'T HAVE CODE SECTION [INAUDIBLE] [OVERLAPPING].
>> SEE THE CODE OR CHECK WITH PLANNING.
IT NEEDS TO BE GENERAL BECAUSE THE GUIDELINES ARE NOT THE END ALL BE, IT'S NOT INTENDED TO BE THAT WAY.
>> BUT I THINK THERE ARE A LOT OF PEOPLE THAT THINK THEY ARE.
DID YOU WANT TO TALK, [INAUDIBLE]?
I JUST WANT TO WHILE I HAVE YOU GUYS ALL HERE.
DOWN ON THIRD STREET, THERE'S A SMALL BRICK HOUSE AND THEN A CARPENTER SHED THAT'S GOING TO BE DEMOLISHED HERE SOON, AND THERE'S GOING TO BE TOWNHOMES THAT GO THERE.
IT'S OUTSIDE OF THE HISTORIC DISTRICT.
BUT THEY HAVE THESE JEALOUSY WINDOWS IN THE CARPENTRY SHED.
SOME PEOPLE DON'T THINK THEY'RE THAT SPECIAL, BUT I'M OBSESSED WITH THEM.
EARLIER THIS WEEK, I WENT WITH MY ELECTRIC SCREWDRIVER AND A PAINT CHISEL AND TOOK TWO OF THE SQUARE WINDOWS.
I'M LIKE, HEY, CAN I SALVAGE THESE WINDOWS? THEY WERE LIKE YEAH, AS LONG AS WE'RE NOT THERE TEARING IT DOWN. HAVE AT IT.
I DON'T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT REMOVING WINDOWS, SO I JUST WENT AND I WAS MESSING AROUND, GOT THEM.
I'M CLEANING THEM AT MY HOUSE.
>> GOOD FOR YOU. WAS THERE ANYTHING ELSE IN THE HOUSE?
ANYWAY, THAT'S JUST THE STORY.
>> BUT I THINK THERE IS A VOID IN THE COMMUNITY FOR ARCHITECTURAL SALVAGE.
WE HAVE ALL THESE BUILDINGS THAT AREN'T MAYBE PROTECTED BY THE HISTORIC DISTRICT OR DON'T HAVE ANY OTHER PROTECTIONS THAT ARE BEING TORN DOWN AND NEW BUILDINGS ARE COMING.
MAYBE IF THERE WAS LIKE A COALITION OR CO-OP OF BUILDERS, ARCHITECTS, PLANNERS, DEMOLISHERS, WHERE WE COULD HAVE A DIALOGUE ABOUT WHAT BUILDINGS ARE GOING TO BE TORN DOWN, WHAT MAYBE IMPORTANT ARCHITECTURAL FEATURES ARE PART OF THEM,
[02:45:01]
WHO HAS THE EXPERTISE TO REMOVE THESE AND RESTORE THEM, AND CAN WE SELL THEM OR REPURPOSE THEM IN NEW BUILDINGS?>> I THINK THAT'S A WONDERFUL IDEA [OVERLAPPING].
>> WE DON'T HAVE TO TALK ABOUT IT ALL TONIGHT, BUT I WANTED TO FLOAT IT, AND I'M SUPER INTERESTED IN MAYBE TALKING TO THE RIGHT PEOPLE AND GETTING THAT STARTED.
>> I THINK THERE'S A WAREHOUSE ON FRONT STREET.
WE SHOULD PUT ALL [INAUDIBLE] THERE.
>> I HAVE GLOVES AND I HAVE PROTECTION, BUT I DON'T KNOW WHAT I'M DOING.
>> IF YOU NEED ANY TOOLS, 322 [INAUDIBLE], COME KNOCK ON MY DOOR.
>> [OVERLAPPING] ANYTHING ELSE?
>> YES, SIR. YOU WERE GOING TO SOMETHING, JUST SAY IT.
>> WELL, I WAS CHANNELING MY INNER TUMMY ON THE PROJECT THAT I HAD ON 10TH STREET.
THE CONTRACTOR WORKED VERY CLOSELY.
WE SALVAGED EVERY HISTORIC PIECE OF MATERIAL.
THE OWNERS REPURPOSED A LOT OF IT IN THEIR HOUSE, BUT THEY STILL HAD A LOT LEFT OVER, AND THEY HAVE NOW SOLD OFF THOSE REMAINING BITS OF HISTORIC MATERIAL TO TWO OTHER HOUSES IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT.
ALL THAT STUFF IS GOING TO GET REUSED IN OTHER HOUSES.
>> WHEREAS USUALLY, IT WOULD BE IN LANDFILLS.
>> THAT'S RIGHT. THROWN RIGHT IN A DUMPSTER.
>> THE OLD SHELVES FROM THE DRUG STORE ON CENTRAL STREET, I JUST FINALLY CLEANED AND CUT DOWN AND REINSTALLED IN MY LIBRARY.
>> HER WHOLE HOUSE COST HER LIKE $50.
>> THANK YOU ALL. MEETING ADJOURNED.
* This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.