[1. CALL TO ORDER / ROLL CALL / DETERMINATION OF QUORUM]
[00:00:03]
THE REGULAR MEETING OF THE REGULAR MEETING OF THE AUGUST 17TH, 2023, HISTORIC DISTRICT COUNCIL WILL BE CALLED TO ORDER.
MS. SILVEY, PLEASE CALL THE ROLL.
AND WE WILL STAND FOR THE PLEDGE.
ONE NATION UNDER GOD, INDIVISIBLE, WITH LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL.
MR. POZZETTA IS GOING TO BE CONFLICTED OUT ON THE OLD TOWN CASE, SO WE WILL BY ACCLAMATION SEE WHO WE SEEING TO ARLENE I'M SORRY, ARLENE I FORGET WHO WAS AN ALTERNATE.
SO, ALL THOSE IN FAVOR OF CEDING MS. FILKOFF FOR THAT ONE CASE SAY AYE.
AYE. ANY OPPOSED? NONE. SO, MS. SILVEY, WE HAVE SEATED MS. FILKOFF, FOR WHAT CASES? GET THAT ON THE RECORD HERE.
WE WILL DISCLOSE EX PARTE COMMUNICATIONS.
AND I WILL START WITH MS. FILKOFF.
I HAVE SPOKEN WITH MR. HARVEY WARD ABOUT THE DAIRY PROJECT OFF AND ON IN RECENT WEEKS.
WE MOST RECENTLY SPOKE ABOUT THE EXTERIOR FABRIC AND THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN WHAT'S THERE ON THE SOUTH SIDE AND ON THE NORTH SIDE AND EAST SIDE NORTH SIDE.
AND HE ALSO TOLD ME TO PAY BETTER ATTENTION IN THESE MEETINGS.
HE'S SUCH A NICE GUY. I THINK THAT'S THE ONLY ONE I'VE GOT.
VERY GOOD. AND THEN WE WILL PROCEED TO CITY ATTORNEY.
THANK YOU, TAMMI. I KNOW YOU'RE HAVING A BUSY DAY, SO WE APPRECIATE YOU GETTING HERE.
IF YOU WOULD, TALK ABOUT THE QUASI JUDICIAL PROCEDURES.
OKAY. WE DO NOT HAVE ANY VARIANCES TONIGHT.
HOW MANY CASES? I SEE ONE DO WE HAVE? HOW MANY NEW BUSINESS CASES DO WE HAVE? SO WE HAVE FOUR FOR NEW BUSINESS.
SO WE HAVE FIVE HEARINGS TONIGHT.
EACH ONE OF THE HEARINGS FOR EACH OF THE CASES WILL BE CONDUCTED AS A QUASI JUDICIAL HEARING.
WHAT THAT MEANS IS, FIRST, MR. COMELLA WITH CITY STAFF IS GOING TO MAKE A PRESENTATION AND INTRODUCE EVIDENCE INTO THE RECORD.
AND HIS DOCUMENTS AND STAFF REPORT THAT'S BEEN UPLOADED TO THE AGENDA IS SUBMITTED.
AND ON THE RECORD, WE ARE KEEPING A RECORD TONIGHT, VIDEO AND AUDIO RECORDING.
PRETTY SOON THE CHAIR WILL ASK ANYBODY THAT, INCLUDING CITY STAFF THAT WISHES TO SPEAK, INTRODUCE EVIDENCE AND TESTIMONY INTO THE RECORD TO TAKE AN OATH AFTER SAL MR. SAL COMELLA MAKES HIS PRESENTATION INTRODUCES EVIDENCE THE APPLICANT AND OR THEIR AGENT COME TO THE PODIUM, STATE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS AND YOU WILL BE PRESENTING EVIDENCE AND TESTIMONY INTO THE RECORD AS WELL.
IF THERE ARE WITNESSES THAT THE CITY AND OR ANY APPLICANT WISHES TO CALL TONIGHT, YOU MAY CALL THOSE WITNESSES AND THE PARTIES WHICH INCLUDE THE CITY AND THE APPLICANT CAN CROSS-EXAMINE EACH OTHER AND EACH OTHER'S WITNESSES.
IF THERE ARE ANY AFFECTED PARTIES HERE TONIGHT, IT MEANS YOU LIVE IN THE CITY LIMITS.
THEN YOU ALSO CAN COME UP AND INTRODUCE EVIDENCE AND TESTIMONY INTO THE RECORD.
YOU WILL NOT BE LIMITED BY THE AMOUNT OF TIME THAT YOU GET TO SPEAK.
PLEASE NAME AND ADDRESS AND THAT YOU ARE AN AFFECTED PARTY.
IF THERE'S AN APPEAL OF ANY OF THE FIVE DECISIONS TONIGHT MADE BY THE HISTORIC DISTRICT COUNCIL, THAT APPEAL HAS TO BE FILED WITHIN 30 DAYS TO THE CIRCUIT COURT TO APPEAL THE BOARD'S DECISION.
AND 30 DAYS IS AFTER THE CHAIR SIGNS THE FINDINGS OF FACT.
SO IT'S ABOUT 35 CALENDAR DAYS BY THE TIME WE GET ALL THOSE PAPERS SIGNED.
ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS ABOUT THE PROCEDURES FROM BOARD MEMBERS? AUDIENCE MEMBERS? OKAY. ACTUALLY, I HAVE ONE QUICK QUESTION REGARDING CASE NUMBER 0094.
OKAY. WITHIN THE DESIGN IS WHAT'S BEING PRESENTED TONIGHT.
I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE SHOULD I WHEN YOU SAY THAT OR HELP ME UNDERSTAND FIELD WORK, LIKE SITE WORK OR DOCUMENTING THE EXISTING BUILDING OF WHAT'S THERE NOW AND YOUR CONTRACTS CLOSED OUT, ALL OF THAT, YOU HAVE NO OTHER.
OKAY THEN. IS THERE ANYONE WHO WISHES TO TESTIFY THAT.
[00:05:03]
WOULD YOU PLEASE NOW RISE, AND MS. SYLVIE WILL ADMINISTER THE OATH.DO YOU SWEAR OR AFFIRM THAT THE ORAL AND OR WRITTEN TESTIMONY YOU'RE ABOUT TO GIVE WILL BE THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH, AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH? I DO. THANK YOU.
[3. APPROVAL OF MEETING MINUTES]
MEMBERS, HAVE YOU HAD AN OPPORTUNITY TO REVIEW THE MINUTES OF THE PREVIOUS MEETING WHICH WERE MAILED TO YOU, EMAILED TO YOU, AND DO YOU HAVE ANY CHANGES OR CONCERNS? I HAVE NONE. NONE.THEN CAN I GET A MOTION TO APPROVE THOSE MINUTES? IN A SECOND. SO MOVED.
SECOND. ANY DISCUSSION? HEARING NONE. MS. SYLVIE, PLEASE CALL THE ROLL.
WHAT CAN WE DO THAT BY ACCLAMATION? OKAY. WE WILL BEGIN WITH OLD BUSINESS, AND THIS IS CASE 2023-0090.
[4.1 HDC 2023-0090 - COTNER & ASSOCIATES, AGENT FOR MATTHEW + KATHARINE MEADE, 14 S. 6TH STREET]
THIS IS COTNER FOR MATTHEW AND KATHRYN MEAD AT 14 SOUTH SIXTH STREET.WE APPROVE THIS CONCEPTUALLY SOUND IN JUNE, CORRECT? PLEASE GO AHEAD, MR. CUMELLA.
GOOD EVENING. I'M SAL CUMELLA, CITY'S HISTORIC PRESERVATION PLANNER.
THIS IS 2023-0090 ADDRESSED AT 14 SOUTH SIXTH STREET.
PROPERTY IS ZONED C-3 IN THE CENTRAL BUSINESS DISTRICT.
IT IS A CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE TO THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT, CONSTRUCTED APPROXIMATELY 1884.
HERE'S AN AERIAL TO LOCATE THAT PROPERTY.
AND WE DID SEE THIS BEFORE FOR CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL ON JUNE 15TH AT THE REGULAR MEETING.
STAFF FINDS THAT THE PROPOSED ARCHITECTURE OF THE ADDITIONS IS COMPATIBLE WITH THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT AND IS SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANT WITH THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE AND THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT GUIDELINES AND STAFF IS RECOMMENDING FINAL APPROVAL OF HGC 2023-0090.
THANK YOU. SO, ARE THERE ANY CONDITIONS FROM YOU? NO QUESTIONS FOR MR. CUMELLA. DID I RECALL A REQUEST AT ONE POINT, A DISCUSSION AT ONE POINT TO PRESERVE AND REUSE HISTORIC MATERIALS OFF OF THIS HOUSE? CORRECT. AND SO, IF YOU LOOK IN THEIR FINAL SUBMS.ION THERE, ACTUALLY, WHERE THE NEW CONSTRUCTION IS ATTACHING, THEY'RE ACTUALLY LEAVING THE SIDING IN PLACE THERE.
SO, THEY DID DO WHAT WE WERE ASKING FOR.
DID WE HAVE ANY OTHER DISCUSSION IN OUR JUNE MEETING ABOUT WHAT WE WOULD LIKE TO SEE HAPPEN ON THIS PROPERTY? I JUST I APOLOGIZE. I DON'T REMEMBER TWO MONTHS AGO.
I THINK EVERYONE REALLY APPRECIATED THE SETBACK AND THE WAY THEY DEFINED IT.
I THINK EVERYONE WAS REALLY PLEASED WITH WHAT THEY DID.
YEAH, BECAUSE IT'S A SENSITIVE ADDITION.
YOU CAN TELL IT'S A LATER ADDITION.
THE ONLY OTHER NOTE THAT WE HAD IN DISCUSSION WHICH THEY'VE ADDRESSED WAS THE FALSE WINDOWS ON THE NORTH ELEVATION AND HAVING THEM REFLECT KIND OF THE INTERIOR USES OF THOSE SPACES AND BE SPACED ACCORDINGLY.
AND SO, THEY'VE DONE THAT HERE.
I THINK THEY'RE SHOWING NOW A SHUTTER, IF I'M NOT MISTAKEN.
AND YOU WANT TO COME UP AND INTRODUCE YOURSELF FOR THE RECORD, PLEASE.
ANN PITTMAN FROM COTNER ARCHITECTS.
MY ADDRESS IS 15 NORTH 18TH STREET.
ANY QUESTIONS FOR? DO I HAVE A QUICK QUESTION? I KNOW THAT YOU ARE REMOVING EXISTING WINDOWS AND PARDON ME IF I COULDN'T FIND IT ON THE DRAWINGS.
WHERE ARE THOSE WINDOWS? THEY'RE BEING RELOCATED ONTO THE CELL SOUTH SIDE.
YEAH, THE ONES THAT ARE NOTED, THEY'RE THE ONES THAT HAVE THE.
YEAH. RIGHT. SO PRETTY MUCH ALL OF THE BACK SIDE EXISTING WINDOWS WILL BE REPLACED AND THEN THOSE WILL BE RELOCATED.
YEAH. THERE'S JUST THREE THAT ARE BEING RELOCATED BECAUSE THEY'RE ON THE NORTH SIDE WHERE, WHERE THE NEW ADDITION IS BUTTING UP AGAINST IT. REALLY BEAUTIFUL DRAWINGS.
YEAH. NOT MUCH HAS CHANGED SINCE.
WELL, NOTHING EXCEPT THE SHUTTERS, REALLY? SINCE THE NORTH SIDE LOOK SO MUCH BETTER.
YEAH. I HAVE ONE QUESTION FOR YOU.
AND I DIDN'T SEE ANY OF THE DRAWINGS ABOUT AROUND THAT.
HOW WHAT ARE YOU PUTTING OUT THERE? SO WHEN IT GETS CONSTRUCTED IT WILL BE WE HAVE WALL SECTIONS THROUGH THERE NOW THAT THAT WEREN'T DONE AT THIS TIME.
[00:10:07]
BUT IN SOME PLACES WE'RE ACTUALLY GOING TO JUST LEAVE IT EXPOSED, LIKE IN THE HALLWAY AND IN THE GARAGE AND PLACES LIKE THAT.THERE'S A FEW PLACES WHERE WE'RE GOING TO FUR IT OUT WITH JUST FURRING STRIPS AND THEN CHIPBOARD.
YEAH, THAT'S NICE AND CREATIVE.
SO WE HAD TO GET A LITTLE CREATIVE THERE.
YEAH. AND I APPRECIATE THE WORK YOU'VE DONE ON THAT NORTH SIDE WITH THE ARRANGING, THE.
YEAH. IT MAKES IT FEEL MORE, MORE LIKE A REAL.
THANK YOU. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? WE WILL OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING.
IF THERE'S ANYONE HERE WHO WISHES TO ADDRESS THIS BOARD ON CASE 2020 3-0090, NOW WILL BE THE TIME.
WE'RE GOING TO CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING AND MOVE INTO BOARD DISCUSSION.
I THINK ANY CONCERNS THAT WERE THERE HAVE BEEN ADDRESSED AND IN A IN A BETTER WAY.
IT'S NOT JUST LIKE AN AD HOC ADDRESSING.
AND IF THERE'S NO OTHER DISCUSSION, I'D MOVE TO APPROVE.
SECOND. WELL, I THINK WE NEED A FORMAL MOTION, BUT THANK YOU.
YES. I MEAN, WE MAKE A MOTION.
ARE YOU GOING TO READ IT OR READ IT OUT OR.
WE'RE JUST GOING TO PRETEND THAT WE HEARD IT.
LET'S DO IT. LET'S START HERE.
YOU START HERE. I MOVED. I MOVED TO APPROVE HPC CASE NUMBER 2023-0090 WITHOUT CONDITIONS AND I MOVE THAT THE HPC MAKE THE FOLLOWING FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW PART OF THE RECORD THAT HPC CASE 2023 0090 AS PRESENTED IS SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANT WITH THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN OF THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE AND THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT GUIDELINES DISTRICT DESIGN GUIDELINES TO WARRANT FINAL APPROVAL AT THIS TIME.
ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION? HEARING NONE. MS. SYLVIE, PLEASE CALL THE ROLL.
[5.1 HDC 2023-0092 - COTNER ARCHITECTS LLC, AGENT FOR SPENCER + KRISTIN HAMILTON, 505 CEDAR STREET]
MOVING ON TO NEW BUSINESS CASE 2023-0092.THIS IS COTNER FOR SPENCER AND KRISTEN HAMILTON, 505 CEDAR STREET.
MR. CUMELLA? THANK YOU. SO, THIS IS HDC 2023-0092 PROPERTY LOCATED AT 505 CEDAR STREET.
IT'S A SINGLE-FAMILY RESIDENCE CONSTRUCTED IN 1909.
IT IS A CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE TO THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT.
HERE'S THE AERIAL OF THAT PROPERTY.
HERE'S A LITTLE BIT OF HISTORY ON THAT PROPERTY.
SO IT IS A UNIQUE PROPERTY IN THAT IT IS NOT A FULL 50 FOOT LOT, AS YOU CAN SEE.
I THINK IT'S 30, 30 AND CHANGE.
IT'S A VERY TYPICAL VERNACULAR RESIDENCE.
IT'S A SHOTGUN HOUSE STYLE HOUSE.
THE APPLICANT IS SEEKING TO REHABILITATE THE STRUCTURE AND INCLUDE AN 11 AND A 11.5FT ADDITION TO THE REAR IN THE LOCATION WHERE RIGHT NOW THERE'S CURRENTLY A WOOD DECK, A TWO-STOREY ACCESSORY DWELLING IS TO BE CONSTRUCTED AT THE NORTHEAST CORNER OF THE PROPERTY.
THE PROPOSED SCOPE OF WORK AND DESIGN WAS PREVIOUSLY APPROVED.
THOSE OF YOU THAT HAVE BEEN ON THE BOARD A WHILE.
IT WAS PREVIOUSLY HEARD AS CASE HDC 2018-01 AND HDC 2020-039 AND WAS GRANTED A COA IN JANUARY AND OCTOBER RESPECTIVELY OF 2018 AND 2020.
AND FOR BACKUP I'VE GIVEN YOU KIND OF THE APPROVAL HISTORY GOING BACK TO 2016 ON THAT PROPERTY.
WHEN ANALYZING IT, IT DOES MEET ALL THE GUIDELINES OF THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT GUIDELINES.
STAFF IS RECOMMENDING APPROVAL OF HDC 2023-0092 WITH THE FOLLOWING CONDITIONS, WHICH WAS A CONDITION THAT WE HAD ORIGINALLY WHEN THIS WAS APPROVED AND THE OTHER TO GO AROUND THAT THE SALVAGED HISTORIC SIDING BE USED ON THE FRONT ELEVATION WHILE REPLACEMENT, IF NECESSARY, OCCUR AT THE SIDES
[00:15:04]
WITH THE SAME WITH SIDING OF THE SAME MATERIAL PROFILE AND EXPOSURE.AND THE REASON FOR THIS IS THERE IS A LOT OF DAMAGE TO THE SIDING ON THAT PROPERTY.
SO THERE'S NOT GOING TO BE, IT'S NOT GOING TO BE ONE BOARD OR TWO.
THERE WILL BE A SIGNIFICANT AMOUNT OF NEW SIDING ON THAT PROPERTY.
SO, STAFF IS RECOMMENDING APPROVAL OF HDC 2023-0092 WITH THAT CONDITION.
THANK YOU. QUESTIONS FOR MR. CUMELLA. SO JUST FOR MY GENERAL KNOWLEDGE, SO THE DESIGN THAT WAS APPROVED IN 16 AND 18, IT'S THE SAME, CORRECT? EVEN THE ACCESSORY.
CORRECT. BUT IT LOOKS LIKE THERE'S STILL ORIGINAL WINDOWS IN THERE.
AND WAS THERE A REASON THAT THERE WAS APPROVAL TO REPLACE ALL OF THEM? WERE THEY COMPLETELY GONE? THEY'RE THEY'RE NOT.
YEAH. OTHER QUESTIONS FOR MR. CUMELLA. ARE THEY GOING TO HAVE TO GET SPECIAL WOOD MADE TO KEEP THE SAME PROFILE? THEY MAY. THAT I DON'T KNOW.
THEY MAY. IT'S A PRETTY STANDARD.
TIM. I THINK I SHOULD DISCLOSE THAT.
I CAN SEE THIS PROPERTY FROM MY HOME, AND I LIVED ACROSS THE STREET FROM IT FOR MANY YEARS, AND IT NEEDS EVERY BIT OF LOVE IT CAN GET. FOR THE RECORD, I WOULD CORRECT IT.
THE APPROVALS WERE FOR THIS SET OF PLANS WAS IN 2020.
AND JUST JUST TO CLARIFY YOUR QUESTION, 2020 AND 2018, WE'VE BEEN AROUND THIS CARNIVAL TWICE BEFORE, GOING BACK AS FAR AS 2018, FIVE YEARS AGO, AND IT'S A LITTLE NOSTALGIA LOOKING AT JOHN'S AND BENJAMIN'S DRAWINGS FROM FROM BACK FIVE YEARS AGO. IT'S REALLY, IT'S PRETTY COOL.
BEAUTIFUL WORK THAT WILL FILL THE LOT.
AND I'VE ALREADY HEARD NEIGHBORS ASK QUESTIONS.
WHY IS IT SO CLOSE TO THE PROPERTY LINE? WELL, IT'S A 33-FOOT-WIDE LOT.
SO, YES, THE EXISTING HOUSE IS NON-CONFORMING AND THAT IT IS ON THE PROPERTY LINE.
YEAH, IT JUST CAN'T ENCROACH OVER THE PROPERTY LINE, WHICH IT WON'T, RIGHT? SO THE ADDITION AND THEN THE GUEST HOUSE GARAGE WOULD BE 33FT FROM THE PROPERTY LINE FROM THE SIDE AND REAR.
AND I'VE HAD I'VE HAD NEIGHBORS COME TO ME AND ASK ABOUT BRIAN OLYPHANT'S, WHICH IS VERY SIMILAR.
AND THE ANSWER IS IT'S NOT FIVE FEET, IT'S 10% OF THE AVAILABLE.
SO WHAT THEY DID WAS SOME POINT 100 PLUS YEARS AGO IS TAKE ONE 100 BY 100 FOOT LOT, DIVIDE IT INTO THREE AND BUILD THESE THREE VERNACULAR COTTAGES. THAT'S THE POLITE WAY OF TALKING ABOUT THEM.
BUT THE CARPORT SIDE, THE THE SIDE YARD FOR THE CARPORT IT MEETS.
IT MEETS. IT MEETS THE. CORRECT.
YEAH. IT'S FOR SOME REASON THIS HOUSE GOT SHOVED TO THE WEST WHEN IT WAS CONSTRUCTED AWAY FROM MR. OLYPHANT'S PROPERTY. YEAH.
THE HOUSE ACTUALLY SITS ON THE WEST PROPERTY LINE.
RIGHT. BERRY WOODS HOUSE, WHICH IS THE ADJACENT PROPERTY OF 501 IS PRETTY TIGHT AS WELL.
ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR MR. CUMELLA? IF NOT, I'LL ASK MS. ANNE TO COME UP, AND I APOLOGIZE, BUT YOU DO HAVE TO IDENTIFY YOURSELF FOR THE RECORD.
ANNE PITTMAN WITH COTNER ARCHITECTS.
MY ADDRESS IS 15 NORTH 18TH STREET.
QUESTIONS FOR MS. ANNE. AND I KNOW THAT WE'RE TRYING TO SALVAGE ANY EXISTING WOOD FOR THE FRONT.
AND I SEE THE BOARD AND BATTEN INSPECTORS AS HARDY AS THE REST OF IT.
IF IT'S NON SALVAGEABLE ON THE THREE SIDES IN THE BACK.
HARDY OR WILL YOU TRY TO MATCH THAT PROFILE AND GO BACK WITH WOOD FOR THE SIDING? IS IT FOR THE WALL, THE SIDING ON THE ORIGINAL HOUSE WE'RE GOING TO TRY TO REUSE.
AROUND THE WHOLE HOUSE OR JUST ON THE FRONT.
JUST THE ADDITION IS THE HARDY, BUT THE BOARD AND BATTEN.
BUT THE BUT THE ORIGINAL FOOTPRINT OF THE HOUSE, THE ORIGINAL RECTANGLE RECTANGLE.
IF YOU NEED NEW SIDING, YOU WILL REPLACE IT WITH WOOD SIDING, RIGHT? RIGHT. OKAY. CORRECT.
AND DO YOU ANTICIPATE ANY DIFFICULTY FINDING MATERIALS OF SIMILAR SCALE TO WHAT'S CURRENTLY ON THE HOUSE? I DON'T THINK SO.
I DON'T THINK SO EITHER. NICE TO GET IT ON THE RECORD.
[00:20:03]
THANK YOU. OKAY. WE WILL MOVE ON TO THE PUBLIC HEARING PUBLIC PORTION OF OUR HEARING.THIS IS FOR CASE 2023, DASH ZERO ZERO 92.
IS THERE ANYBODY HERE WHO WISHES TO SPEAK WITH REGARD TO THIS CASE? THIS WOULD BE THE TIME. THANK YOU.
FALSE ALARM. YES, THIS REGARD.
NO WORRIES. THEN WE'LL CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING AND MOVE INTO BOARD DISCUSSION.
I'VE SEEN THIS CASE HOW MANY TIMES NOW? IT'S THE THIRD TIME. IT'S A CHARM.
ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION? IF NOT, WOULD SOMEBODY LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION SEEING IT? SO IF YOU HAVEN'T HAD A CHANCE TO VOTE ON THIS ONE YET, GOD LOVE YOU, YOUR HONOR.
I MOVED TO APPROVE HCC CASE NUMBER 2020 300 93 WITHOUT WITH CONDITIONS.
RIGHT WITH THE CONDITION THAT.
GOT A BIG SCREEN IF YOU CAN READ SCREEN.
OCCUR AT SITES WITH SIDING OF SAME MATERIAL PROFILE AND EXPOSURE.
SO, AND I MOVE THAT THE AGENCY MAKE THE FOLLOWING FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW PART OF THE RECORD THAT THE AGENCY CASE 2023-0093 AS PRESENTED IS SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANT WITH THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE AND DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT DESIGN GUIDELINES TO WARRANT APPROVAL. AT THIS TIME, IT IS MOVED.
ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION? HEARING NONE, MS. SILVIE, PLEASE CALL ROLL.
BASICALLY, I MUST MAKE A CORRECTION.
I WAS READING THE 0093 PARAGRAPH THE CASE, BUT THIS IS 0092.
AND NOBODY CAUGHT IT. OH, MY GOODNESS.
I DON'T THINK WE'RE GONNA HAVE ANY APPEALS ON THIS CASE, SO I THINK WE'LL BE ALL RIGHT.
[5.2 HDC 2023-0093 - DESIGN, DRAFTING & PERMITS INC, AGENT FOR RACHRIDGE LLC, 115 CENTRE STREET]
MOVING ON.HDC 2022-00 93 DESIGN DRAFTING AND PERMITS FOR ROCK RIDGE, LLC. THIS IS THE PALACE STAGE RAMP FENCE.
PICKET FENCE, OVERHEAD, GARAGE DOOR.
AS YOU SAID, THIS IS THE PALACE SALOON AND THE DICTIONARY.
THE BUILDING WAS CONSTRUCTED IN 1884.
IT IS A CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE TO THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT.
THIS IS THE AERIAL OF THAT PROPERTY.
SO, IT'S THIS BACK AREA THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT.
IT'S ALL IN THIS REAR COURTYARD AREA.
JUST TO POINT OUT, THIS ISN'T AFTER THE FACT CASE.
SO, THE STRUCTURE IS CURRENTLY THERE.
THERE WAS AN ERROR IN THE CHARGE FOR THE AFTER THE FACT FEE, BUT THAT HAS NOW BEEN CLARIFIED.
SO, THEY HAVE PAID THE FULL AFTER THE FACT FEE TO BE HEARD.
TONIGHT, STAFF FINDS THAT THE PROPOSED ACT OF AFTER THE FACT MODIFICATIONS AND NEW ADDITIONS ARE SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANT WITH THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE AND THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT GUIDELINES.
IT'S ON A NON HISTORIC ADDITION ON THE BACK OF THE BUILDING.
THE APPLICANT HAS RESPONDED IN THEIR APPLICATION AND SHOWN THE SPEAKERS THAT ARE BEING USED THAT ARE DIRECTIONAL AND ADDITIONALLY THEY'RE INSTALLING VEGETATIVE PLANTERS ALONG THE EDGES OF THE PROPERTY, WHICH WILL HELP A LITTLE IN DAMPENING SOME OF THE SOUND.
SO, STAFF IS RECOMMENDING APPROVAL OF HDC 2023-0093 WITHOUT CONDITIONS BECAUSE THEY HAVE MET THAT CONDITION AS OF TODAY. THANK YOU.
QUESTIONS FOR MR. CUMELLA? HOW DID THIS BECOME AN AFTER THE FACT?
[00:25:02]
IT SOUNDED LIKE YOU MET WITH THE APPLICANT TO DISCUSS SOME CONCERNS.SO, WE'VE MET FOR THIS FOR THIS CASE, FOR THE AFTER THE FACT CASE JUST FOR THAT.
THAT'S WHEN YOU BROUGHT UP THE HOW DID THIS COME TO YOUR I BELIEVE IT'S CODE ENFORCEMENT CAME AND SAID THAT THIS HAD SHOWN UP AND DIDN'T HAVE.
AND IT HAS PUT IN FOR BUILDING PERMITS NOW, BUT IT HAS TO GET A COA FIRST.
OBVIOUSLY, I'M VERY CONFUSED ON THIS CASE BECAUSE WE KNOW THAT THAT FENCE AND THAT STAGE HAS BEEN THERE FOR MONTHS, RIGHT? CORRECT. SO, PART OF THIS CASE IS AN AFTER THE FACT, BUT THEY'RE ALSO COMING FOR NEW WORK THAT'S NOT DONE AND THEY'RE COMING.
THEY DID. ALL OF THE WORK IS DONE.
ALL OF THE WORK. ALL OF THE WORK IS AFTER THE FACT.
OKAY. SO, EVEN WORSE THAN I THOUGHT.
AND AS FAR AS I KNOW, THERE ARE NO LIGHTS BECAUSE I JUST LIKE THE SOUND.
WE LOOK FOR THE LIGHT TO NOT ENCROACH ON NEIGHBORS AND SUCH.
SO I THINK IT WOULD BE A QUESTION FOR THE APPLICANT.
YES. SO WE DON'T HAVE ANY DESIGN GUIDELINES.
THEY DIDN'T ASK FOR A BUILDING PERMIT.
POINTER. WELL, I MEAN, I'M JUST SAYING, WHY GO THROUGH ALL THE NONSENSE IF YOU CAN GO THROUGH.
JUST PAY THE FINE. WELL, I DO THINK THERE'S POINTS TO BE MADE.
I MEAN, DIDN'T DID YOU SAY THAT THE COMMISSION RECENTLY REDUCED THE AMOUNT OF THE FINE FOR.
NO, IT'S BEEN WHAT IT IS FOR A WHILE.
IT'S JUST LESS THAN IT USED TO BE.
FOUR TIMES THE WHATEVER THE APPLICATION FEE IS, I THINK IT'S SLIGHTLY LESS THAN THAT NOW.
WELL, I GUESS THE QUESTION THAT I HAVE IS, YOU KNOW, WE'VE TALKED IN THIS GROUP BEFORE ABOUT PROJECTS THAT DON'T THINK THEY NEED TO GO THROUGH THE PROCESS AND HOW DO WE ADDRESS THOSE.
IN THIS PARTICULAR CASE, IT SEEMS LIKE $1,500 FINE FOR THAT MUCH WORK.
BECAUSE THAT'S A SIGNIFICANT AMOUNT OF WORK THAT WAS DONE.
THAT'S ONE NIGHT OF A BAND RIGHT THERE.
IT JUST, IT FEELS, AND THIS IS NOT JUST YOUR CASE I'M TALKING ABOUT.
I'M TALKING ABOUT THE CONCEPT OF HAVING, YOU KNOW, ANYBODY CAN GO OUT AND DO WHATEVER AND THEN GO, OH, I'M SORRY, AND COME BACK IN AND PAY RELATIVELY SMALL FEE.
YEAH, EXCEPT COMPARED TO THE WORK THAT'S BEEN DONE.
WHAT I WOULD LIKE TO. HOLD ON, BUDDY.
WE'LL GET TO YOU IN A MOMENT. YES, SIR.
IF CODE OR THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT HAD SEEN IT IN PROCESS, THEY WOULD HAVE SHUT IT DOWN.
I SAW IT IN PROCESS, AND I DIDN'T SAY ANYTHING.
I DID SAY SOMETHING. SO, HOW DO WE KNOW THAT CODE ENFORCEMENT OR THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT WOULD HAVE DONE THAT? SO, THERE WAS A CODE CASE ON THIS.
SO, HOW LONG HAD THE PROJECT BEEN DONE BEFORE THE CODE? THAT I DON'T KNOW. OKAY.
IS THERE IS THERE A CONSEQUENCE FOR NOT GETTING A PERMIT? I BELIEVE THE AFTER THE FACT FEE FOR A PERMIT IS ALSO FOUR TIMES THEIR BUILDING PERMIT.
IT'S SUBSTANTIAL. IT'S NOT SMALL.
SO, TELL US HOW THIS HAPPENED, CHARLIE.
SO, I WAS HIRED AFTER THE FACT TO HELP AND RESOLVE THE VIOLATION.
SO IT WAS DONE WITHOUT A PERMIT BECAUSE HE DID NOT THINK THAT HE WOULD NEED ONE.
THE $1,500 FEE IS FOR THE COA PRIOR TO THE BUILDING PERMIT.
THE BUILDING PERMIT WILL HAVE A BUILDING PERMIT FEE ALSO.
SO, IT WON'T JUST BE THE 1500 THAT THE OWNER WILL BE PAYING.
ONCE WE GET THE KOA, WE WILL APPLY.
SO THEN THERE WILL OBVIOUSLY BE A BUILDING PERMIT FEE TO ADD TO THE 1500 FOR THE COA.
ARE YOU ABLE TO USE THE FACILITY RIGHT NOW WHILE IT'S BEING DISCUSSED?
[00:30:03]
YES, MA'AM. SO, WE HAD AN ARCHITECT AND A STRUCTURAL ENGINEER REVIEW THE SITE, AND THEY DEEMED IT TO BE SAFE, BOTH STRUCTURALLY AND REGARDING THE ELECTRICAL WORK DONE TO IT, WHICH WAS ONLY OUTLETS AND AN ELECTRICAL FEED FOR THE SPEAKERS. SO WE PRESENTED THAT WHEN WE WHEN I FIRST ADDRESSED THE VIOLATION IN SO THAT THEY WOULD ALLOW US TO REMAIN OPEN.AND THERE WAS A LETTER FROM AN ENGINEER THAT WAS PRESENTED TO THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT TO SHOW THAT THEY DEEMED IT SAFE. QUESTIONS FOR MR. BACHMANN WAS A CONTRACTOR USED FOR THE WORK THAT WAS DONE? YES, MA'AM. AND THE CONTRACTOR DIDN'T INDICATE ANY NEED FOR BUILDING PERMITS OR ANYTHING.
I BELIEVE THAT THE OWNER AND THE CONTRACTOR NO LONGER HAVE A RELATIONSHIP, SO I HAVEN'T BEEN ABLE TO REACH THE CONTRACTOR WHO DID THE WORK. WHO WAS THE CONTRACTOR? I DON'T REMEMBER WHAT THE.
DO YOU REMEMBER? I DON'T THINK I HAVE THAT INFORMATION.
WELL, I ACTUALLY, I WAS, I REACHED OUT TO THE ELECTRICAL CONTRACTOR WHO DID THE ELECTRICAL WORK, WHO IS STILL INVOLVED, BUT I WASN'T ABLE TO REACH OUT TO THE BUT WE DO HAVE.
IT'S VERY UNUSUAL FOR A CONTRACTOR IN OUR COMMUNITY TO DO WORK WITHOUT A PERMIT.
BUT I DO HAVE A NEW GC WHO'S SIGNED FOR THE NEW BUILDING PERMIT THAT WE WILL BE PULLING.
SO, ANYTHING THAT NEEDS TO BE ADDRESSED WILL BE TAKEN CARE OF BY A GENERAL CONTRACTOR.
WHO IS THAT? IT'S A CONSTRUCTION.
OTHER QUESTIONS FOR MR. PABLO HERNANDEZ.
DIDN'T YOU KNOW? I THINK IT'S A LITTLE DISINGENUOUS TO SAY THEY DIDN'T REALIZE THEY NEEDED TO GET A PERMIT OR GET ANYTHING APPROVED BECAUSE THEY WERE HERE TALKING ABOUT THE FENCE MONTHS AGO.
REMEMBER, WE APPROVED THE PARAPET.
RIGHT. AND THE FENCING THAT THERE WAS A COMPLAINT ON THE FENCING THAT THEY HAD TO REDO THE FENCING.
BUT I DIDN'T EVER SEE THAT COME BACK WITH PLANS.
I BELIEVE THERE WAS MISCOMMUNICATION.
AND AGAIN, I'M SPEAKING AFTER THE FACT BECAUSE I WASN'T AROUND WHEN IT HAPPENED.
AND NEXT THING YOU KNOW, THE STAGE IS BUILT.
THERE WASN'T A BUILDING PULLED, A BUILDING PERMIT PULLED, AND HERE WE ARE AFTER THE FACT.
I DON'T BELIEVE THERE WAS EVER ANY MALICIOUS INTENT FROM THE OWNER.
I THINK IT WAS JUST PROBABLY FROM FROM MY UNDERSTANDING, A MISCOMMUNICATION BETWEEN ALL THE PARTIES, BETWEEN THE THREE PARTIES, THE OWNER, THE GC AND THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT.
YOU'RE KIND OF BEING YOU'RE NOT THE PERSON WE ACTUALLY NEED TO TALK TO.
I THINK THE GENTLEMAN IN THE WHITE SHIRT WAS HERE.
I WOULD JUST ASK POLITELY THAT IF YOU INTEND TO INSTALL ANY EXTERIOR LIGHTING, ANY EXTERIOR LIGHTING THAT YOU GO TO THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT AND YOU GET A PERMIT AND YOU FOLLOW THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE.
AND SO, AM I HANDLING THAT CORRECTLY? WOULD BE THROUGH THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT AND WITH CONCURRENCE WITH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT? CORRECT. I DON'T BELIEVE THERE'S ANY MORE ELECTRICAL WORK THAT NEEDS TO BE DONE GOING FORWARD.
YES, SIR. AS LONG AS YOU'RE MAKING SURE THAT ALL THE LINES ARE CROSSED.
YES, SIR. I APPRECIATE THAT. MY PLEASURE.
OKAY. SO WE WOULD APPRECIATE THAT COMMITMENT.
THANK YOU. YES, SIR. QUESTIONS FOR MR. BACH. IF NOT, WE'RE GOING TO MOVE ON TO THE PUBLIC HEARING.
THANK YOU VERY MUCH, SIR. MY PLEASURE.
THANK YOU. AND SO, WE WILL OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING ON CASE 2023-0093.
WE WILL CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING AND MOVE INTO BOARD DISCUSSION.
THE FUNNY THING IS, WE PROBABLY WOULD HAVE APPROVED THIS HAD IT BEEN PRESENTED, RIGHT?
[00:35:04]
YEAH, MAYBE FOR ARLENE.TAMMI. YOU'RE THE CONTRACTORS.
ARCHITECTS. YEAH, WE PROBABLY WOULD HAVE.
AND IT'S THE SAME THING LIKE WITH SUSAN DORNER'S HOUSE.
IF YOU CAN IGNORE THE PROCESS.
RIGHT. THAT'S. THAT'S WHERE MY 1500 BUCKS IS.
SAY HALF OF THIS. WE WOULD HAVE APPROVED, BUT WE WOULDN'T APPROVE THAT OTHER THING THAT THEY PUT UP.
THEN WHAT? WE'RE GOING TO SAY, TEAR IT DOWN.
THIS WAS DONE IN STAGES BECAUSE THE STAGE WENT UP.
YEAH. AND THEN THEY CAME BACK A MONTH LATER AND PUT UP HUGE POSTS AND THEN HUNG SUNSHADES.
I MEAN, THIS WENT ON FOR FOR QUITE SOME TIME.
THIS WASN'T HAPPENED OVERNIGHT.
RIGHT. WE TALK ABOUT THE ASTROTURF.
NO. DO YOU THINK HE KNOWS THAT HE NEEDS A LIQUOR LICENSE? CLEARLY NOT IN MY PURVIEW.
NO, HE DOESN'T EITHER. IT'S PART OF THIS IS NOT HAPPENING, I THINK.
GO AHEAD. SO, WE'VE HAD QUITE A FEW AFTER THE FACTS LATELY, RIGHT? WE HAVE. AND IT'S AT LEAST FROM THIS SEAT HERE, IT SEEMS LIKE THE CURRENT PENALTY STRUCTURE IS INSUFFICIENT TO MAKE PEOPLE TAKE NOTE OF THE FACT THAT THERE'S ACTUALLY RULES IN PLACE, AND YOU ACTUALLY ARE SUPPOSED TO FOLLOW THEM IF YOU WANT TO BE A MEMBER OF THE COMMUNITY.
CORRECT. AND I THINK PERHAPS THAT'S SOMETHING THAT NEEDS SOME SCRUTINY THAT FOR EXAMPLE, ON THE WINDOW PROJECT, THE PENALTY WAS LESS THAN THE COST OF REPLACING JUST ONE WINDOW.
RIGHT. SO, YOU'RE SPENDING $40,000.
BUT I THINK THE THE PENALTY STRUCTURE MAYBE IS JUST IT'S RADICALLY INSUFFICIENT.
I THINK IT SHOULD BE MORE. YEAH.
I MEAN, IF YOU JUST FACTOR IT IN AS PART OF THE COST OF DOING BUSINESS AND YOU DON'T APPLY FOR ANYTHING; RIGHT? YOU JUST GO AHEAD AND TAKE THE HIT.
AND THIS IS CLEARLY SO I MEAN WHAT DO WE DO? WE YEAH.
YOU'RE PUTTING IN A HEALTH SAFETY WELFARE CONTEXT.
ABSOLUTELY. YEAH. I THINK THE OTHER THING IS BECAUSE WE'RE ON SUCH A RAMPANT BUILDING CURVE RIGHT NOW AND PEOPLE ARE TIED UP, THEY'RE BRINGING IN OUTSIDE CONTRACTORS AND YOU KNOW THAT IT'S A PRETTY LAME EXCUSE, BUT THEY NEED TO KNOW WHERE THE HISTORIC DISTRICT IS, WHERE IT ISN'T, WHAT'S REQUIRED, WHAT'S NOT REQUIRED.
AND YOU CAN'T JUST FALL ON THE FACT THAT THIS WAS AN OUTSIDE CONTRACTOR THAT DIDN'T KNOW.
BUT SO, I DON'T KNOW HOW WE MAKE THAT AN OUTSIDE CONTRACTOR HAS TO SIGN UP AND PAY A FEE TO BE LICENSED TO WORK IN THE CITY OF FERNANDINA.
SO, HE SHOULD KNOW THAT AUTOMATICALLY.
HE IS NOT A LICENSED CONTRACTOR IN THE CITY OF FERNANDINA AND THAT'S WHAT GETS YOU BACK TO THAT POINT WHERE IF THIS DOES HAPPEN, THERE NEEDS TO BE A FINE WHERE THEY CAN'T WORK IN THE CITY FOR SIX MONTHS. RIGHT.
OR THEY'RE MORE THAN JUST A SMALL FOR A COMMERCIAL STRUCTURE, $1,500 IS NOTHING.
ALL RIGHT, SO HAVING SAID ALL THAT, I DON'T SEE ANY RATIONALE FOR NOT APPROVING IT IS THAT UNLESS SOMEONE SEES SOME INCONSISTENCY WITH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE, THE DESIGN GUIDELINES NOT LIKING THE PROCESS IS NOT SUFFICIENT RATIONALE.
I AGREE. JUST DISAPPROVE OF IT UNFORTUNATELY.
BUT CAN I JUST ADD THERE THAT BECAUSE WE HAVE SEEN SO MANY AFTER THE FACT CASES, I THINK SINCE I'VE SEEN ONE, WE'VE SEEN ONE CASE FOR THE LAST FOUR MINUTES FOR FOUR MINUTES.
MY MEMORY DOESN'T SERVE THAT WELL.
I REMEMBER THE DORNER CASE, OBVIOUSLY, BUT I DON'T REMEMBER PRIOR TO THAT.
SO WE'VE SEEN THE DORNER CASE.
[00:40:03]
YEAH, YEAH, YEAH.SO, I GUESS MANY OF US FEEL LIKE WE'VE HAD A LOT OF THEM.
OKAY. RECENTLY WE'VE HAD DISCUSSIONS WITH THE CITY ABOUT WHETHER THEY'RE SUBJECT TO THE LDC AS WELL.
IT SEEMS TO ME THAT THERE'S A, I MEAN, THE REASON WE PUT THIS IN PLACE, IF YOU GO BACK TO THE 70S WHEN THE HDC WAS CREATED, WAS TO PROTECT THE WORK THAT HAD BEEN DONE DOWNTOWN AND TO PROTECT DOWNTOWN AS AN ENTITY BECAUSE DOWNTOWN IS SO MEANINGFUL TO THE REST OF THE COMMUNITY IN MANY WAYS, ECONOMIC ET CETERA, TO DO SOMETHING, TO CONTINUE TO SAY IT'S OKAY BECAUSE IT'S AFTER THE FACT AND WE DON'T WANT TO CHARGE YOU A LOT OF MONEY TO REDO IT.
MR. LUCIER CAME IN HERE ON SUSAN DORNER'S CASE AND DID THE RIGHT THING.
I BELIEVE THAT IT'S OUR RESPONSIBILITY IN SOME WAY TO COMMUNICATE OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN WHAT THE PROCESS IS AND TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO PREVENT THESE THINGS FROM HAPPENING.
GET IN FRONT OF THEM RATHER THAN HAVE TO REACT TO IT AFTER IT'S ALREADY DONE.
WE WILL ASK SAL IF HE HAS ANY RECOMMENDATIONS IN THAT REGARD.
I KNOW YOU'VE THOUGHT ABOUT THIS.
ANY ANYTHING YOU WOULD ADD TO ANYTHING WE SHOULD BE DOING DIFFERENTLY? ANYTHING? ANYBODY? WE SHOULD BE TALKING TO? I THINK WE CAN TALK ABOUT IT AS A IN ONE OF OUR BOARD DISCUSSIONS AND BRING IT BACK FOR SOME BRAINSTORMING AND TALK.
I THINK WE'VE TALKED IS GOING TO HAPPEN.
I'M SORRY ABOUT EDUCATION OPPORTUNITIES FOR THE FOR THE COMMUNITY.
NOT EVERYBODY UNDERSTANDS ALL THIS STUFF, EVEN THOUGH WE THINK THEY SHOULD AND NOT.
AND CERTAINLY THE CONTRACTORS ARE GOING TO DO WHAT THEY'RE GOING TO DO.
AND IF THEY DON'T GET CAUGHT AND FINED, THEN THEY JUST GO AND DO IT SOMEWHERE ELSE AGAIN.
I BELIEVE IT COULD WELL FALL INTO OUR PURVIEW TO CREATE SUCH.
A PRODUCT, AN EDUCATION PROGRAM OF SOME KIND.
SO, WHEN WE HAD A FEW YEARS AGO, SOME ISSUES WITH SIMILAR SITUATIONS, WITH PEOPLE JUST COMING IN AND CUTTING DOWN TREES AND THEN JUST PAYING THE FINE, THEY STRENGTHENED THE TREE ORDINANCE QUITE A BIT.
AND IF YOU CUT DOWN A HISTORIC WHATEVER, IT'S LIKE A $10,000 FINE.
IF YOU DON'T PUT WOOD AROUND THE TREE, IT'S $250 A DAY.
YOU DON'T GET IT. SO, YOU KNOW, WHAT IF YOU COME AFTER THE FACT AND YOU'VE DONE IT, WHO CARES IF WE WOULD HAVE APPROVED IT? IT'S A $10,000 FINE.
BIG NUMBERS, WHAT YOU'RE SAYING? YEAH.
YEAH. I MEAN, I THINK IT'S GOING TO KEEP HAPPENING UNTIL.
UNTIL SOME PROJECT COMES TO US, AND WE WOULDN'T APPROVE IT.
SO, WE HAVE GROUNDS TO NOT TO DISAPPROVE IT.
AND THEN, YOU KNOW, THAT'S GOING TO COST SOME DAMAGE.
SO, I THINK THIS HAS BECOME A SYSTEM OF SYSTEMIC AND I THINK WE SHOULD ADDRESS THAT MAYBE WITH THE COMMISSIONERS, WITH BUILDING DEPARTMENT, WHOEVER.
BUT I THINK MY CONCERN IS THAT IT'S GOING TO KEEP HAPPENING UNTIL THEN.
RIGHT. AND OR WORSE, IF IT'S SOMETHING THAT IS A CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE AND THEY JUST LOP OFF HALF OF IT, RIGHT? YEAH. YOU KNOW, THEN IT'S LOST.
IT'S GONE. I GUESS MAYBE THAT'S MY MY POINT THEN IS IF IN FACT WHAT I'M HEARING IS THAT WE REALLY DON'T HAVE THE ABILITY, AS LONG AS THE FINES ARE PAID AS CURRENTLY OUTLINED, WE DON'T REALLY HAVE THE ABILITY TO REJECT THIS ANYWAY.
WE JUST DIDN'T HAVE A REASON WHY WE HAVE TO HAVE A REASON TO REJECT IT IN THIS CASE.
WHAT I'M SAYING IN THIS CASE, WE DON'T BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T, THEY DIDN'T MESS UP ANYTHING HISTORIC.
RIGHT. DO WE HAVE CLEAR GUIDELINES AROUND WHAT IT WOULD HAVE TO BE FOR US TO REJECT IT? PROBABLY NOT, BECAUSE IT'S A QUASI-JUDICIAL PROCESS.
LET'S JUST BACK THIS UP A LITTLE BIT.
SO, DORNER COMES IN AND SHE SAYS, I'M NOT RESTORING THESE WINDOWS.
I'M JUST GOING TO LIVE WITH WHAT WE GOT.
AND WE TURN HER DOWN UNTIL SHE COMES BACK WITH A SOLUTION THAT WORKS.
AND JOHN KNEW THAT. THAT'S WHY HE CAME IN WITH A SOLUTION THAT WORKS.
SHE COULD HAVE RESTORED THE EXISTING WINDOWS FOR A FRACTION OF THAT PRICE.
[00:45:01]
RIGHT. BUT SHE PAID FOR THE WINDOWS THAT SHE HAD.SO, IF WE TAKE THE AMOUNT OF MONEY THAT'S BEING SPENT OR WHO HAS HOW MUCH OR ALL OF THAT OUT OF THE EQUATION AND JUST LOOK AT THE PROCESS AND CRITERIA AND RULES, THEN I THINK WE NEED TO CLARIFY SOME OF THE RULES, MAYBE EVEN FOR OURSELVES.
SO, IF I'M HEARING WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, YOU'RE SUGGESTING THAT BECAUSE ON A CASE BY CASE, WE WOULD IDENTIFY SPECIFIC ISSUES, SPECIFIC DETAILS OF THE PROJECT. BUT YOU'RE SAYING SOMETHING BROADER JUST AROUND AN AFTER THE FACT SITUATION.
YES, BECAUSE IT ALREADY FEELS TO ME IN MY SHORT TIME UP HERE THAT WE'VE HAD WAY TOO MANY AFTER THE FACT SITUATIONS.
THEN IT HAS TO GO TO THE COMMISSION, RIGHT? THE TREMENDOUS IRONY INSIDE OF THIS IS THAT FOLKS WILL SAY, WELL, THE CITY'S PROCESSES ARE TOO CUMBERSOME, AND THAT'S WHY WE JUST WENT AROUND IT.
I TELL PEOPLE YOUR YOUR PROBLEM ISN'T THAT YOU HAVE THE CITY IS GIVING YOU TROUBLE.
YOU JUST HAVEN'T HIRED THE RIGHT PROFESSIONALS TO MANAGE YOUR PROJECT.
ALL RIGHT. WELL, WE NEED WE SHOULD MOVE ON.
WE'RE GOING TO WORKSHOP THIS. IT SOUNDS LIKE AT SOME POINT I HEAR THAT VERY CLEARLY.
NOPE. TO APPROVE HDC CASE NUMBER 2023-0093 WITHOUT CONDITIONS AND I MOVE THAT THE HTC MAKE THE FOLLOWING FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW PART OF THE RECORD.
THE HDC CASE 2023-0093 AS PRESENTED IS SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANT WITH THE COMPREHENSIVE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE, THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT DESIGN GUIDELINES AND WARRANTS AFTER THE FACT.
MOVED, POYNTER. SOMEONE SECOND.
IS THERE A WAY TO SECOND, I DIDN'T WANT TO READ THAT BEGRUDGINGLY.
AND WE SEEM TO HAVE NO ABILITY WHATSOEVER.
WELL, THEY DIDN'T STOP ANYTHING.
YOU KNOW, THERE MIGHT BE SOMETHING THAT GOES IN THERE.
IF IT'S SOMETHING THAT'S BEING USED, THEY HAVE TO STOP USING IT.
ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION, MS. SILVIE, PLEASE CALL THE ROLL.
. MOVING ON TO CASE HCC 2020 3-0094 MIRANDA FOR THE DRYER BUILDING.
THIS IS A CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL TO CONSTRUCT A TWO-STOREY ADDITION.
I DIDN'T JUMP AHEAD. DID I GET.
THAT'S THE RIGHT ONE. THANK YOU.
SO, THIS IS HDC 2023-0094 101 CENTER STREET.
[5.3 HDC 2023-0094 - MIRANDA ARCHITECTS, AGENT FOR 101 CENTRE STREET LLC, 101 CENTRE STREET CONCEPTUAL]
THE DRYER BUILDING, IT'S ZONED C-3 IN THE CENTRAL BUSINESS DISTRICT.THE BUILDING. THANK YOU. YOU'RE WELCOME.
AT THE REQUESTED ACTION IS CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL TO CONSTRUCT A TWO-STOREY ADDITION TO THE BUILDING.
THIS NEW ADDITION WOULD BE TO THE TO THE NORTH, THE REAR SECTION OF THAT BUILDING.
IS THIS AFTER THE FACT? IT DOES NOT CURRENTLY EXIST AND 1880, 1882, AND IT IS JUST CONCEPTUAL, 1882.
JUST DO IT AFTER THE FACT. YEAH.
THE REHABILITATION WAS APPROVED BACK IN JUNE OF THIS YEAR.
[00:50:03]
AND THIS THIS THIS IS CONCEPTUAL.WE DID APPROVE THE REHABILITATION OF THE EXISTING BUILDING ALREADY.
WE DID THE SHELL. I THOUGHT THIS WAS CORRECT AND THEY HAD TO PUT DOORS AT IT.
IT WAS LIKE THE TEMPORARY DOORS AT THE BEGINNING.
THAT WAS IN THE PAST. WE'VE ACTUALLY APPROVED THE REHAB ALSO.
SO, WE'RE GOOD WITH THE HISTORIC SECTION.
NOW THEY'RE MOVING ON TO DESIGNING THE ADDITION.
AND SO, STAFF IS RECOMMENDING CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL OF HDC 2023-0094 WITHOUT CONDITIONS.
THIS IS THE THIRD TIME. IT IS THE THIRD TIME.
BUT THIS IS THE FIRST TIME WE'RE SEEING WE'VE SEEN THEM, CORRECT? THEY'VE BEEN DOING IT IN PHASES.
ALL RIGHT. THIS IS THE ONE I'VE BEEN ASKING QUESTIONS FOR, SAL.
OR SHOULD WE JUST MOVE RIGHT TO.
LET'S JUST GO RIGHT TO THIS GUY.
JOSE, IF YOU COULD JOIN US AND PLEASE IDENTIFY YOURSELF AND YOUR ADDRESS FOR THE RECORD.
I KNOW WE LOVE YOU, JOSE MIRANDA.
309 1/2 CENTER STREET, SUITE 26.
YEAH. THIS IS, LIKE YOU SAID, PHASE TWO OF OUR PROJECT TO DESIGNING THE ADDITION ON THE BACK.
THE ADDITION IS PRIMARILY GOING TO HOUSE KITCHEN, BOTH FIRST FLOOR AND SECOND FLOOR, PLUS A BAR FOR THE LACK OF A BETTER WORD THAT FACES THE RIVER.
SO JUST KIND OF WALKING YOU THROUGH THIS IS PRETTY SELF-EXPLANATORY.
THIS IS THE HISTORIC BUILDING THAT WE'RE GOING TO BE RESTORING FROM HERE OVER IS OUR ADDITION.
THIS FIRST FLOOR IS KIND OF OUR UTILITIES.
WE'RE TRYING TO ENCLOSE THEM BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE VERY MUCH SITE AREA.
SO WE'RE TRYING TO PUT OUR GREASE TRAP, ELECTRIC CONNECTIONS, ALL OF THAT IN THERE.
THIS IS OUR SECOND FLOOR, WHAT WE CALL OUR SUNSET BAR, WHICH WILL HAVE RETRACTABLE DOORS SO IT CAN BE AN INDOOR OUTDOOR SPACE.
SO YOU CAN KIND OF SEE WHAT IT IS NOW AND WHAT IT WILL BE.
FIRST FLOOR. WE'RE GOING TO GO WITH BRICK.
SECOND FLOOR. WE'RE GOING TO GO WITH STUCCO.
BUT THE OTHER TWO SIDES ARE GOING TO BE THE TABBY.
AND SO WE HAD TO KIND OF BRIDGE THAT GAP.
SO, IF YOU GO TO THE NEXT ELEVATION, WHICH IS THE BACKSIDE, HERE'S THE BACK SIDE.
YOU CAN SEE WHAT IT IS. NOW, NOT MUCH TO LOOK AT.
THIS IS THE NEW ADDITION COMING FORWARD.
SO, WE'VE TAKEN THE TURN THE CORNER AND THEN STOPPED AND THEN ALL THIS WILL BE STUCCO.
THIS IS EGRESS DOOR COMING OUT FROM THE STAIRWAY FROM THE SECOND FLOOR.
WE'VE GOT OBVIOUSLY THE REQUIRED MECHANICAL AND ROOF SCREENS.
AND THIS LITTLE POP UP IS OUR ROOF ACCESS FOR EQUIPMENT ON THE ROOF, WHICH IS A LOT OF OUR MECHANICAL EQUIPMENT WILL BE UP THERE. THE BIGGEST CHALLENGE OF THIS PROJECT IS BECAUSE WE HAVE SUCH LITTLE SIDE AREA.
SO, WHERE DO YOU TAKE THE STORM WATER? WE'RE COMING TO THE WEST WITH THE STORM WATER AND THEN HAVING TO TRY TO PIPE IT TOWARDS CENTER STREET.
SO, ALL OUR STORMWATER WE'RE GOING TO REDIRECT RIGHT NOW, THIS BUILDING HAS GOT A RIDGE RIGHT HERE AND IT HAS WATER GOING THIS WAY AND THAT WAY YOU CAN'T GO TO THE NEIGHBOR WITH IT. SO, WE'RE HAVING TO RESTRUCTURE THIS ENTIRE ROOF AND REDIRECT IT THAT WAY.
SAME WITH THIS ONE, BECAUSE WE CAN'T GO FROM FRONT TO BACK BECAUSE THAT'S TOO LONG AND THAT'S ALL HIDDEN BEHIND THE PARAPET, RIGHT? IT'S ALL HIDDEN BEHIND THE PARAPET ON THE WEST ELEVATION.
YOU'LL NOTICE THAT WE'VE GOT SOME RAIN COLLECTORS DOWNSPOUTS.
THERE WAS ONE THAT WAS ALREADY THERE THAT'S ALREADY ROTTED OFF AND GONE.
SO WE JUST BASICALLY GRABBED IT.
YOU CAN KIND OF SEE THEM HERE.
WE'RE GOING TO PUNCH THROUGH THERE AND THERE.
THIS ONE IS ACTUALLY THERE'S AN OPENING ALREADY EXISTING HERE.
AND THEN ON THE NEW BUILDING, WE'LL HAVE TWO AS WELL.
SO THAT'S WHY ON THE NORTH SIDE OF THE NEW BUILDING, WE LOSE THE GABLE BECAUSE YOU'RE KICKING IT.
THE ELEVATION OF THE NEW ADDITION AS IT HAS TO BE AT 11.5FT, THE FIRST FLOOR IS AT 6.5FT.
SO THE HISTORIC BUILDING IS EXEMPT.
SO WHAT WE'RE DOING IS WE'RE ENTERING INTO THAT LOWER LEVEL.
WE GO UP TO 9.5FT, WHICH IS THE FEMA MINIMUM FOR THE FLOOD.
[00:55:08]
BUT INTERNALLY, ALL THIS WILL BE ON ONE LEVEL.SO BASICALLY IT'S AN OPEN PLAN.
AND ACTUALLY SOME OF THIS HAS ALREADY BEEN REDESIGNED.
BUT THERE'S OUR UTILITY AREA, THE KITCHENS AND THE PROCESS OF BEING DESIGNED.
WE'VE ALREADY CHANGED THIS DESIGN.
FLIP THE STAIR A LITTLE BIT, ELEVATORS IN THE SAME LOCATION.
BUT WE PUT THIS BAR ACTUALLY IN THE MIDDLE HERE.
THIS WILL BE AN EVENT VENUE SPACE.
IT'S NOT INTENDED TO BE ADDITIONAL RESTAURANT SPACE, BUT ACTUALLY SPECIFICALLY EVENT VENUE.
HERE'S THAT SUNSET BAR THAT'S FACING THE WATER.
THIS IS ESSENTIALLY A WARMING OR SERVING KITCHEN FOR THIS LEVEL.
AND THEN WE'VE GOT ROOFTOP ACCESS AND THEN THE FIRE STAIR THAT COMES DOWN THE SIDE.
SO WE HAVE TWO, TWO WAYS OF GETTING OUT OF THE BUILDING.
BUT WE'RE HERE FOR, AS YOU KNOW, CONCEPTUAL.
WE'VE GOT A LONG JOURNEY AHEAD OF US.
OBVIOUSLY, HARVEY'S ABOUT TO PEEL OFF THE SKIN STARTING IN SEPTEMBER.
FIRST STEP IS GETTING SCAFFOLDING.
WELL, BEFORE WE CAN GET SCAFFOLDING, WE NEED PERMS.ION FROM THE OWNER ON THE ADJACENT PARCEL.
IF ANYBODY KNOWS ANYBODY AT THE B PLACE, THE B COMPANY, WE'RE TRYING TO GET SCAFFOLDING ON THAT SO WE CAN PEEL OFF THAT STUCCO AND RESTORE THE TABBY. SO THAT'S OUR FIRST CHALLENGE.
WERE AS PART OF THE EXTERIOR RENOVATION.
WE'RE GOING TO HOLD OFF ON PUTTING IN ANY NEW WINDOWS AND DOORS IN BECAUSE SINCE WE'RE RESTRUCTURING THE INSIDE, WE DON'T WANT TO HAVE TO INSTALL THEM AND THEN PROTECT THEM DURING CONSTRUCTION. SO WE'RE JUST GOING TO DO TEMPORARY CLOSING OFF OF ALL THE OPENINGS UNTIL WE'RE READY FOR FOR NEW WINDOWS.
BUT THIS IS KIND OF A WE'RE PULLING ON THE THREAD AND SEEING WHAT HAPPENS.
QUESTIONS FOR MR. MIRANDA? I HAVE THREE QUESTIONS. YES.
DO YOU HAVE A SENSE OF THE STRUCTURAL STABILITY OF THE EXISTING BUILDING FROM THE INTERIOR INSPECTIONS? YES, BECAUSE IT'S ALL VACANT NOW AND IT'S TOTALLY BEEN GUTTED.
WE'RE ABLE TO SEE WHAT'S EXISTING.
WE'RE DOING A SIMILAR CONCEPT AS WE'VE DONE ON STANDARD MARINE BUILDING.
WE'RE JUST KEEPING THE OUTSIDE SHELL.
WE'RE CREATING A NEW STRUCTURE INSIDE TO SUPPORT THE WALLS, CREATING A NEW FLOOR AND A NEW ROOF.
AND WILL THERE BE ANY POSSIBILITY? I MEAN, THERE'S ALWAYS A POSSIBILITY, BUT I'M SURE YOU'LL TAKE PROTECTIONS WHEN YOU START PEELING OFF THE EXTERIOR SKIN IN CASE THAT'S THE ONLY THING THAT'S HOLDING SOME OF THOSE BRICKS. NOW, YOU'RE RIGHT.
SO, ONCE WE KNOW MORE, WE MAY BE COMING BACK TO YOU SAYING, HEY, WE CAN'T RESTORE THIS BRICK IT'S DAMAGED BEYOND SO WE MAY BE COMING BACK TO YOU FOR DOING A STUCCO FINISH ON IT, JUST NOT THE FROSTING STUCCO THAT'S ON THERE NOW.
AND THEN MY NEXT QUESTION IS I SEE A LOT OF EXISTING WINDOWS AND THEN NEW MARVIN WINDOWS.
CAN YOU EXPLAIN THE CHANGES? WE ALL OF THE WINDOWS WILL BE NEW ON THIS ONE.
NONE OF THE ORIGINAL WINDOWS ARE IN THAT BUILDING AT ALL.
SO THOSE ARE NOT THE ORIGINAL WINDOWS? NO, THOSE AND SOME OF THOSE CASES, THEY'RE JUST A GLASS PANEL AND A FRAME AND SOMEBODY TAPED ON SOME MUNTINS.
IT'S LIKE, NO, IT WAS A REAL HODGEPODGE.
AND EVEN THE DOORS, WHAT WE'VE DONE IS DESIGNED A CUSTOM DOOR THAT MATCHES ONE OF THE ORIGINAL DOORS THAT'S ON THE BACK THAT WE KNOW WE'RE HAVING TO REMOVE AS PART OF THE ADDITION. BUT WE USE THAT AS OUR POINT OF DEPARTURE FOR THE DESIGN.
YOU GET THE RENDERING PIECE? YEAH. KIND OF GIVES YOU AN IDEA OF THE SCALE.
THE WHITE ONE? YEAH, THE WHITE ONE? YES. WELL, WHITE BUILDING.
WE. WE KEEP THEM AS A CLAY MODEL BECAUSE I DON'T LIKE TO PREMATURELY COMMIT TO A COLOR SCHEME.
AND EVERYBODY'S TOO LITERAL WITH THEIR APPOINTMENTS.
[01:00:01]
BUT YOU HAVE BECAUSE YOU HAVE BRICK ON THE EDITION, SO.YEAH, BUT DO WE KNOW THE COLOR OF THE BRICK? NO, BECAUSE IT'S CONCEPTUAL.
PUT THAT PICTURE UP. NO COWS? NO. NO.
NO. PALACE. PALACE? YES. YOU CAN SEE.
AND THEN HERE'S OUR ADDITION ON THE BACK.
BUT YOU CAN GET A SENSE OF THE SCALE IN TERMS OF THE MAIN BUILDING AND THE ADJOINING PROPERTIES.
IF OBVIOUSLY THAT'S A NEW BUILDING.
BUT IF YOU PEEL OFF THE SKIN ON THE WEST SIDE AND IT FAILS AND YOU DECIDE TO STUCCO IT, ARE WE STILL DOING BRICK ON THE ADDITION? NO, WE WOULD WE WOULD COME BACK WITH A REDESIGN BECAUSE I COULD HERE BECAUSE THEN IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE TO DO BRICK IF THE OLD BUILDINGS BRICK IS COVERED UP.
YOU CAN HEAR YOU CAN HEAR THE FOLKS NOW ON THEIR WAY TO THE SALTY.
I CAN'T BELIEVE THEY PUT RED BRICK UP HERE.
AND THAT'S WHY WE KEPT THIS BLANK.
WE'RE NOT GOING TO SHOW EVERY PIECE OF BRICK IN THE RENDERING.
THAT'S WHAT HARVEY TOLD ME TO DO.
OTHER QUESTIONS FOR MR. MIRANDA. I JUST HAVE ONE QUICK ONE.
I HOPE WITH THE ADDITION, HOW MUCH SPACE IS LEFT BETWEEN THIS BUILDING AND SALTY? ABOUT 4.5FT.
OKAY. SO, BECAUSE IN A PRIOR LIFE WHEN I WAS MEETING WITH A RAILROAD, THEY WERE TALKING ABOUT HAVING TO PUT A CUT IN THERE FROM FRONT STREET BECAUSE THERE USED TO BE SOME FOLKS WHO PARKED BEHIND THAT BUILDING.
BUT THAT WOULDN'T BE NECESSARY.
NOW AND YOU CAN SEE IT ON THE SURVEY.
THERE IS THERE WAS AN EASEMENT AT ONE TIME THAT'S BEEN ABANDONED AFTER THE LAST OWNER SOLD.
OKAY. THAT'S ALL BEEN VACATED.
WE'RE NOT DOING ANY PARKING OR ANYTHING.
SO, TECHNICALLY, YOU COULD BUILD RIGHT UP TO THE PROPERTY LINE.
WELL, THE PROPERTY LINES ARE HERE.
SO, OUR ADDITION AUTOMATICALLY CAN ONLY GO INTO HERE.
NO, ON THE SALTY SIDE, THE, ON THE SALTY NORTH SIDE.
WELL, WE HAD TO KEEP THIS CLEAR BECAUSE OUR FIRE STAIR COMES OUT HERE EXACTLY A WAY TO GET OUT.
YOU NEED SOME EGRESS. WE WANT TO GET SOME LIGHT INTO THE KITCHEN, ACCESS TO THE UTILITY CORRIDOR.
SO, IT MADE SENSE TO GIVE US SOME CUSHION BACK THERE.
OKAY. ONE MORE THING ON THAT SIDE WHERE YOU'RE BUILDING IN FRONT OF THAT, YOU KNOW, ALL THE MECHANICALS AND EVERYTHING THAT THEY HAD THERE, THOSE TWO DOORS, THE ARCHED TOP DOORS THAT ARE EXISTING, ARE THEY ORIGINAL HERE? THIS ONE? YES. IT APPEARS THAT THE ONES ON THE SECOND FLOOR THAT ARE STILL THERE MAY BE ORIGINAL, BUT THEY'RE IN SUCH POOR CONDITION, THEY'RE BARELY HANGING ON AND THEY WILL BE REMOVED BECAUSE THAT'S WHERE WE'RE PUTTING OUR OPENING BETWEEN ON THE SECOND FLOOR.
OTHER QUESTIONS FOR MR. ? THANK YOU, JOSE.
THANK YOU FOR FOLLOWING THE PROCESS.
YOU ARE AWARE YOU HAVE TO GET A PERMIT TO BUILD THIS STUFF.
LUCKILY, I'M NOT THE ONE THAT PULLS THE PERMIT.
AND YES, I'M LICENSED TO DO WORK IN THE CITY.
ARE YOU. DO YOU WISH TO COMMENT FOR THE PUBLIC HEARING? COME ON UP AND IDENTIFY YOURSELF.
HOW IS IT? [INAUDIBLE] LIVE AT 2929 RIVER BEND IN THE CITY.
AND ALSO, ONE OF THE OWNERS OF THE SALTY PELICAN.
SO, MY CONCERN HERE ISN'T WITH THE BUILDING SO MUCH.
IT'S WITH THE EAST AND WEST, THE ACCESS TO THE SALTY PELICAN.
NOW, AS YOU KNOW, YOU GOT THE RAILROAD FENCE.
BUT THAT WAS THE ONLY ACCESS ROAD TO 12 NORTH FRONT STREET, THE SALTY PELICAN.
OUR CONCERN IS ALL THE THE WORK, THE SCAFFOLDING.
RIGHT NOW, THERE'S ONLY ONE WAY IN OR OUT.
THE SALTY PELICAN THAT'S AT FOUR FOOT SIDEWALK FOR EMERGENCIES, DELIVERIES, HUNDREDS OF PEOPLE, STAFF, STROLLERS, WHEELCHAIRS, 901, EVERYTHING.
AND THAT'S THAT CONCERNS US THAT WE'RE ALL IT'S REALLY WE HEAR YOU.
IT'S REALLY BUTTONHOLED RIGHT NOW.
NOW IT'S GOING TO GET EVEN WORSE.
[01:05:02]
AND I WOULD EXPECT HE WOULD DO HIS NUMBER IS NINE ZERO.JOSE, WOULD YOU LIKE TO COMMENT? WE KNOW. WE KNOW. WE KNOW.
HARVEY AND THEN THE OTHER SIDE ON THE EASTERN SIDE, THERE WAS AN EASEMENT BETWEEN THE MARINA BUILDING AND WHAT? THE SHORE BUILDING THERE.
AND THAT IS OUR SEWER LINE GOING OUT TO CENTER STREET.
ONE WAY SEWER GOING OUT TO CENTER STREET.
JOSE, YOUR PROMISE TO WORK, ADDRESS YOUR CONCERNS.
YEAH. THE THE SEWER ISSUE WAS ADDRESSED AT DRC AND YES, THIS IS NOT OUR PROPERTY.
ANYTHING WE PUT IN HERE, I THINK WE WERE LOOKING AT A MINIMUM OF TWO FEET OF SCAFFOLDING JUST TO BE ABLE TO GET THE WINDOWS IN, GET THE WINDOWS IN AND GET THE THE SKIN RESTORED.
ON THE OTHER SIDE IS OBVIOUSLY ON CENTER STREET.
THE OTHER SIDE WILL BE FIVE FEET.
SO AS YOU CAN SEE, WE'RE WE'RE EASILY A GOOD TEN FEET TO THE SIDEWALK.
WE'RE NOT GOING TO IMPACT THE SIDEWALK AT ALL.
AND WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO HAVE CONSTRUCTION FENCING ANYWAY JUST OUTSIDE THAT SCAFFOLDING.
SAME WITH THIS SCAFFOLDING WON'T EVEN HAVE TO GO UP.
SO AGAIN, I THINK I DON'T THINK WE'RE GOING TO IMPACT THEM FROM AN ACCESS POINT OF VIEW, BUT WE WERE MADE AWARE OF THAT SEWER LINE AND THE FACT THAT THEY DO HAVE AN EASEMENT ON THAT FOR THE UTILITIES.
THANK YOU. OKAY. THANK YOU, AL.
WE UNDERSTAND YOUR CONCERNS ARE VERY REASONABLE.
ANY OTHER QUESTIONS WE COULD PERHAPS MOVE INTO BOARD DISCUSSION, PERHAPS A MOTION? IT'S GREAT. I DON'T WANT ANY COMMENTS.
YEAH, IT'S TYPICAL JOE'S PROJECT WELL PRESENTED.
I'LL MAKE A MOTION IF THERE'S NOT.
PLEASE. ANY MORE DISCUSSION? YEAH, WELL, WE COULD STILL HAVE DISCUSSION AFTER A MOTION.
OKAY. WE USUALLY DON'T. I MOVE TO APPROVE.
HDC CASE 2023-0094 WITHOUT CONDITIONS.
AND I MOVE THAT HDC MAKE THE FOLLOWING FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW PART OF THE RECORD.
THAT HTC CASE 2023-0094 AS PRESENTED IS SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANT WITH THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE AND THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT DESIGN GUIDELINES TO WARRANT CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL AT THIS TIME.
ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION? HEARING NONE. MS. SILVEY, PLEASE CALL THE ROLL.
ALL RIGHTY. MR. POZZETTA IS EXCUSING HIMSELF AS HE'S PRESENTING THIS NEXT CASE, WE'RE GOING TO HEAR 2023.
[5.4 HDC 2023-0096 - BRADLEY EVANS, 1015 SOMERUELUS STREET]
THANKS, AL. THANK YOU, JOSE.2023-0096 EVANS SAMMARILLA STREET.
AND FOR PURPOSES OF THIS MRS. ARLENE, WE'LL HAVE A VOTE.
SO THIS IS HDC 2023-0096 PROPERTY LOCATED AT 1015 SOMMARILLA STREET IN OLD TOWN.
IT IS ZONED T1 ONE HIGH DENSITY RESIDENTIAL.
AND STAFF IS RECOMMENDING APPROVAL OF HGC 2023-0096 WITHOUT CONDITIONS.
THANK YOU. HAVE WE SEEN THIS BEFORE? THIS HAS BEEN APPROVED IN THE PAST.
[01:10:05]
SO, IT IS BEING BROUGHT BACK.WHY WASN'T IT JUST AN EXTENSION? YOU HAVE TO YOU GET TWO SIX-MONTH EXTENSIONS.
SO, ESSENTIALLY YOU GET A FULL TWO YEARS IN MOST CASE, AND THIS HAS EXPIRED BEYOND THAT.
OKAY. ANY QUESTIONS FOR MR. POZZETTA? THIS IS THE FIRST TIME I'VE SEEN TREES IDENTIFIED AS BAD TREES.
YEAH, IT'S SAD WHEN IT HAPPENS BECAUSE THEY ALL START OUT SO GOOD.
AND THEN HANG AROUND WITH THE WRONG CROWD.
CAMPERS ARE NOT ROOTED PROPERLY.
THE DAD JOKES WILL CONTINUE UNTIL SOMEBODY STOPS US.
ALL RIGHT. SO, WELL, IF WE'RE TALKING IF YOU'RE ASKING HIM A QUESTION, ARE YOU GOING TO COME ON UP AND INTRODUCE YOURSELF FOR THE RECORD JUST IN CASE TAMMI HAS A QUESTION FOR YOU? YES.
JAMES POZZETTA, 103 SOUTH 18TH STREET.
THE BOARD HAS ACTUALLY SEEN THIS MULTIPLE TIMES AND APPROVED IT MULTIPLE TIMES EACH TIME.
THANK YOU. SO, YEAH, I HAVE A QUESTION.
OF COURSE. GO FOR IT. JUST FOR ARLENE BENEFIT, SINCE SHE HASN'T SEEN IT AS MANY TIMES, I JUST WANT TO COMMEND YOU AGAIN ON THE RAILING, THE GROUPING AND THE PLACEMENT OF THE RAILINGS.
AND I LOVE THE DIAMOND CUTOUTS ON THE DECO DIAMONDS ON THE FRONT STEPS.
I MEAN, THOSE ARE THE LITTLE FINE DETAILS THAT ARE SUBTLE, BUT THEY MAKE A HUGE DIFFERENCE.
AND I WANT TO COMMEND YOU AND I APPRECIATE THAT SO MUCH.
I'LL CONFESS I'M DRAWN THAT RAILING LIKE PROBABLY A DOZEN TIMES ON PROJECTS AND THEY NEVER DO IT.
AND I DID HAVE ONE QUESTION ABOUT A BAD TREE.
YEAH, IT'S CALLED OUT AS BAD ON TWO SPOTS AND THEN IT'S SHOWN ON TWO PLANS.
SO IS IT GOOD OR BAD? IS IT THEY'RE OUT THERE. IT'S THE 18 INCH OAK IN THE FRONT.
IT'S CROSSED THROUGH ON TWO PLANS AND THEN SHOWN ON THE DRAINAGE AND ONE OR THE OTHER SHEETS.
I DON'T KNOW IF THEY HAVE TAKEN IT OUT YET.
MY RECOMMENDATION WAS GO THROUGH THE PROCESS AND HAVE IT REMOVED.
IF IT'S A, I MEAN, YOU CAN SEE THE PICTURES THEY TOOK OF IT.
IT'S NOT VERY GOOD, BUT YOU HAVE IT SHOWN AS STAYING ON TWO OF THE PLANS.
WE JUST DON'T KNOW. IS THAT THE RIGHT.
RIGHT. OTHER QUESTIONS FOR MR. POZZETTA. JOSE, YOU'RE NOT HERE TO COMMENT ON THIS.
SO THE PUBLIC HEARING WILL BE OPENED AND CLOSED AND I'M HERE FOR THE SHOW.
THANK YOU, JIM. DO I HEAR ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION? YEAH, IT'S IT'S VERY NICE.
BUT IT IS A CADILLAC HOUSE VOLKSWAGEN LOT.
YEAH, OKAY. I KNOW WHAT YOU'RE SAYING BECAUSE IT WASN'T PART OF THE BECAUSE I THINK IT SAYS FOUR BAD AND THEY'RE COMING OUT AND THE REST ARE SAYING BUT THEN THERE'S LIKE ONE, TWO, THREE, FOUR, THERE'S LIKE EIGHT X'S.
SO THAT'S SUBJECT TO OUR APPROVAL.
SO, IT'S THE FINAL, IT'LL COME OUT IN THE BUILDING PERMIT.
IT'S WHERE THEY ACTUALLY TALLY UP THE MITIGATION FOR TREES.
[01:15:01]
IT'S SO WE PAY ATTENTION, BUT IT'S ACTUALLY NOT PART OF OUR PURVIEW.ALL RIGHT. HOW ABOUT A MOTION? THANK YOU. I MOVE TO APPROVE THIS ONE.
SO THEY DON'T AMENDMENT. NO, NO, NO.
SO, I MOVED TO APPROVE THIS CASE NUMBER HDC 2023-0096 WITHOUT CONDITIONS.
THE HDC CASE 2023-0096 AS PRESENTED IS SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANT WITH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE, SECRETARY OF INTERIOR STANDARDS AND THE AND THE OLD TOWN SHOULD HAVE SAID RIGHT OLD TOWN DESIGN GUIDELINES TO WARRANT FINAL APPROVAL AT THIS TIME.
SECOND, ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION? HEARING NONE. MS. SILVEY, PLEASE CALL THE ROLL.
THANK YOU. JIM, WHY DON'T YOU JOIN US? WE'RE MOVING INTO BOARD BUSINESS.
[6.1 HISTORIC STREETSCAPE ELEMENTS]
SAL HAS A RESOLUTION FOR OUR CONSIDERATION.SAL, YOU WANT TO TALK ABOUT THAT? SURE. SO, YOU'VE ALREADY SEEN THIS.
THE IDEA OF THIS IS TO RECOGNIZE THE IMPORTANCE OF THE HISTORIC STREETSCAPE TO THE CHARACTER OF FERNANDINA BEACH, AS WELL AS ESTABLISHING SOME REQUIREMENTS FOR THE CITY TO KEEP AN INVENTORY OF THOSE RESOURCES, CREATE ANNUAL INSPECTIONS AND MAINTENANCE PLANS, REQUIRE BUDGETING FOR MAINTENANCE DURING THE ANNUAL BUDGET, AND REQUIRING THE COORDINATION OF ALL RELEVANT CITY DEPARTMENTS AND OUTSIDE AGENCIES.
THIS ORDINANCE IS SUPPORTS A NUMBER OF OUR COMPREHENSIVE PLAN POLICIES RELATED TO GOAL 11 OF THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION ELEMENT OF OUR COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.
AND SO TONIGHT, YOU ARE TAKING A FINAL VOTE ON THAT ORDINANCE.
QUESTIONS FOR MR. CUMELLA. SO, YES.
HOW DOES THIS RESOLUTION IMPACT THE UPCOMING RENOVATIONS AND IMPROVEMENTS TO DOWNTOWN? SO, THIS AND IT IS IMPORTANT TO THAT UPCOMING WORK AND ALL UPCOMING WORK IN THAT IT IDENTIFIES THOSE HISTORIC ELEMENTS SUCH AS THE GRANITE CURBS, THE HEXAGONAL PAVERS, WHAT ELSE? OH, THE STREET SIGNS, THE CONCRETE STREET NAME OBELISKS, AND WOULD AT THAT POINT THEN INVENTORY THEM AND PROTECT THEM FROM BEING COMPLETELY REMOVED. SO, THAT WOULD ALSO INCLUDE, I THINK, THE FOUNTAIN IN FRONT OF THE COURTHOUSE THAT THIS IS JUST STREETSCAPE ELEMENTS.
IT DOES NOT INCLUDE THINGS LIKE THE FOUNTAINS AND THAT TYPE OF STUFF.
WOULD THE UPCOMING RENOVATIONS TO SIDEWALKS IN DOWNTOWN? WE WOULD PRESERVE THE EXISTING HEXAGONAL PAVERS.
WOULD IT REQUIRE ADDITIONAL HEXAGONAL PAVERS TO BE ADDED AS A SIDEWALK WAS TAKEN OUT? NO. THIS IS JUST TO PRESERVE THE THE EXISTING HISTORIC ELEMENTS THAT ARE OUT THERE.
THIS DOESN'T RECOMMEND OR CONTEMPLATE WHAT THE OTHER MATERIALS ON THE REST OF THE NEW SIDEWALKS IS.
THAT'S THAT'S A DIFFERENT ISSUE ALTOGETHER.
SO, THE GUIDELINE IS JUST SO THE REASON, IF I MIGHT, THE REASON I ASKED THAT VERY SPECIFIC QUESTION IS THAT OTHERS IN THE CITY HAVE READ THIS AND INTERPRET IT TO MEAN THAT IT WOULD REQUIRE HEXAGONAL PAVERS TO BE INSTALLED, WHERE WHENEVER WE TOOK UP A PLAIN SIDEWALK RIGHT NOW, THE LOVELY RIVER, THAT IS NOT WHAT THIS IS.
SO, CORRECT. AND WHAT WE'RE GOING TO DO HERE IS WHEN WE VOTE TO APPROVE THIS, WE'RE GOING TO VERY CLEARLY STATE THAT IT DOES NOT REQUIRE THE INSTALLATION OF NEW HEXAGONAL PAVERS IN PLACES WHERE THEY DO NOT CURRENTLY EXIST.
CORRECT. THAT THAT I THINK WILL CALM SOME CONCERNS.
WELL, IT SAYS THAT RIGHT UNDER THE SUMMARY.
I'M JUST SAYING JUST SAYING THAT IT WOULD REQUIRE YOU TO READ THEM.
I JUST HAVE I JUST HAVE A SUGGESTION TO THE BOARD AND TO SAL.
SAL, I HAVEN'T MENTIONED THIS BEFORE.
IT'S JUST A THOUGHT IS I THINK THE ORDINANCE SHOULD BE PART OF THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE.
AND THE REASON WHY IS BECAUSE WHENEVER WE DO A STANDALONE ORDINANCE, WE'VE DONE THIS IN THE PAST.
YEAH, IT KIND OF GETS LOST AND NOBODY REALLY HAS A GOOD PLACE TO LOOK AT IT.
[01:20:04]
IF IT'S PART OF THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE, THEN, WOULD YOU? WE LOOKED AT IT FOR, SO YOU'D BE INCLUDED INTO THE MUNICIPAL CODE UNDER THE STREETS SECTION BECAUSE THAT'S WHERE SOME OF OUR OTHER STREETS STUFF LIES.WOULD THAT MAKE SENSE? THAT COULD WORK.
JUST AS LONG I DO IT SOMEPLACE.
CAN WE APPROVE THIS AND ASK FOR THAT STEP TO BE TAKEN? YEAH. THAT IT BE CODIFIED.
THAT'S ALL YOU REALLY HAVE TO SAY TO THE COMMS.ION, RIGHT? RIGHT, RIGHT.
THANK YOU. THAT'S THE MOST HELPFUL, AS ALWAYS.
HOW CAN I JUST ASK, HOW DO WE ADDRESS I MEAN, WHEN I WAS WORKING MAIN STREET AND SOMEBODY DECIDED TO EMBELLISH DAVID ULIS STATUE, WHEN WE TALKED ABOUT FIXING THAT, THE ANSWER THAT WE GOT FROM THE CITY WAS IT'S NEVER BEEN OUR RESPONSIBILITY TO FIX STUFF THAT WAS DONATED TO US.
SO, THEY COUNTED THE FOUNTAIN THAT WAY AND THEY COUNTED.
DAVID WOOLLEY THAT WAY, THE FOUNTAIN AND THESE PIECES THAT WERE OVER HERE IN THE PARKING LOT, RIGHT? SO HOW DO CAN WE DO THAT WITH THIS OR IS THAT A SEPARATE ISSUE? I WOULDN'T DO THAT WITH THIS.
THE REASON WHY IS BECAUSE THE RESTORATION FOUNDATION HAS INDICATED AN INTEREST IN HAVING AN AGREEMENT WITH THE CITY TO BE ABLE TO TAKE CARE OF THOSE THINGS. I DO THINK IT WOULD BE GREAT IF YOU HAD JUST A SEPARATE RECOMMENDATION AND, OH, BY THE WAY, OUTSIDE OF THE STREETSCAPING IS WE REALLY WANT SOMETHING SOLIDIFIED.
I CAN'T THINK OF ANOTHER WORD, SOMETHING THAT SHOWS IF IT'S A RESOLUTION OR WHATEVER, THAT THE CITY AGREES THAT WE OWN THEM AND THAT WE WILL MAINTAIN THEM FOR FUTURE GENERATIONS.
OKAY, SO THAT'S BEING WORKED ON BY THE RESTORATION FOUNDATION, THOUGH THEY HAVE APPROACHED ME ABOUT DOING A RESOLUTION THAT GIVES THE RESTORATION FOUNDATION PERMISSION, BUT IT HASN'T STARTED THROUGH THE PROCESS.
SAL, THANK YOU. I KNOW YOU'VE DONE A LOT OF WORK HERE, JOSE.
THANK YOU. I KNOW YOU'VE DONE A LOT OF WORK HERE.
WOULD SOMEBODY LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE? MOVE TO APPROVE. SECOND.
FURTHER DISCUSSION. DID YOU CATCH THAT? DO WE ENTER THAT? DO WE ENTER THAT RECOMMENDATION TO BE CODIFIED OR IS THAT SEPARATE TO THE APPROVAL? THAT'S A GOOD QUESTION.
I DIDN'T. SHOULD THE MOTION ALSO SAY TO BE CODIFIED? YEAH, THAT'S FINE. YOU CAN ADD IT.
THE CODIFICATION IS PART OF OUR MOTION PLEASE.
AND WE'LL APPRECIATE THAT TEN YEARS FROM NOW WHEN WE'RE DEAD.
YOU MIGHT BE. I'LL BE DOING WORK WITH THE CITY LONG ENOUGH ENTIRELY.
ALL RIGHT, VASSILY, PLEASE CALL THE ROLL.
I HAVE OFFERED YOU A LETTER THAT I DRAFTED TO MR. GEORGE REGARDING THE PAVERS BETWEEN EIGHTH AND 11TH STREET.
THE FIRST POINT IS, IS THIS SOMETHING YOU WOULD SUPPORT ME SENDING, SIGNING AND SENDING ONCE THE CITY RESCINDED ITS RESPONSIBILITY FOR MAINTAINING THE STATE CAME AND BLOCKED IT OFF.
AND I HAVE REAL CONCERNS THAT SOMEDAY THE STATE IS JUST GOING TO SHOW UP AND TEAR IT OUT.
AND WHY WERE WE SUPPOSED TO STOP THAT AGREEMENT? I DON'T REMEMBER. THE RATIONALE FOR IT WAS A STATE THAT IT WOULD PROTECT IT.
SO, I WOULD ASK YOU PERMISSION.
I NEED TO YOU NEED TO CHANGE IT TO DEPUTY CITY MANAGER, INTERIM CITY MANAGER.
IS THAT ACCEPTABLE? ABSOLUTELY. ABSOLUTELY.
YES. OKAY. I WILL GO AHEAD AND DO THAT.
WHAT ELSE IS ON THE AGENDA HERE? CODE ENFORCEMENT UPDATE THAT MANY IN THE COMMUNITY HAVE VOICED CONCERN ABOUT THE LIGHTS AT PEPPERS.
[6.2 CODE ENFORCEMENT UPDATE]
[01:25:06]
I DON'T KNOW IF ANYBODY'S BEEN BY THERE LATELY.YOU CAN DO YOUR HOMEWORK BY THOSE LIGHTS.
YEAH, THEY'VE BEEN OVER THERE.
I HAVEN'T BEEN THERE LATELY. THIS SOUNDS TERRIBLE.
I'M NOT OUT THAT LATE. I'M UP EARLY WHEN THE LIGHTS GO ON.
WHEN ARE YOU NIGHT OWLS? CAN YOU REPORT BACK? I COULD HAVE BEEN AT ANY. I KNOW YOU DO.
YOU GOT 820 BUSINESSES TO RUN.
SO, LIKE SUNLIGHT? IT WAS. AND I DON'T BELIEVE THEY HAD A BUILDING PERMIT.
TAMMI. YOU KNOW ABOUT THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE AROUND THESE THINGS? TELL THEM. TELL US THEY SHOULD HAVE GOTTEN A BUILDING PERMIT TO INSTALL THE LIGHTING, RIGHT? YOU SHOULD HAVE DONE THE LIGHTS.
THEY SHOULD HAVE DONE A LIGHT STUDY PERMITS FOR THAT.
BUT ISN'T THAT PART OF THE WHOLE IMPROVEMENT THAT THE ELECTRICAL PLAN NEEDED TO BE ON THEIR ORIGINAL PLAN? REMEMBER, THEY CAME TO US FOR ALL THOSE ADDITIONS.
THESE THESE ARE LIGHTS IN ADDITION TO THE LIGHTS THAT WERE APPROVED ON THE ADDITION.
AND THEY WOULDN'T HAVE NEEDED A BUILDING PERMIT FOR THOSE LIGHTS.
SO THEY NEED CONCURRENCE WITH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE.
SO I WAS UNDER THE IMPRESSION THAT LIGHTS HAVE TO IN THE DOWNTOWN, THEY HAVE TO STAY, CORRECT? THEY DO. ON THE PROPERTY.
AND IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING THAT IT IS NOBODY FROM THE COMMUNITY.
THAT'S WHY THEY'RE IN VIOLATION.
SO WHERE DOES IT STAND OUT? WORKING WITH WITH STAFF.
THEY'RE GOING TO GET IT'S NOT GOING TO GO AWAY ANYTIME SOON.
I MEAN, THE KIND THING TO DO WOULD BE TO TURN THE DAMN LIGHTS OFF.
BUT THEY'RE NOT GOING TO THEY'RE GOING TO GO AND FIND DIFFERENT LIGHTS BY THE, I DON'T KNOW HOW LONG CODE ENFORCEMENT WILL GET THEM BEFORE THEY TAKE THE OLD ONES OUT AND PUT THE NEW ONES IN.
SO THE REASON WHY YOU CAN THANK YOU, THE REASON I ASK IS IT REALLY IS OFFENSIVE.
HONESTLY, IF I'D HAVE BEEN ON MY RADAR, I'D HAVE BEEN THERE TO MAKE THE POINT.
SO, THEY. BECAUSE. MAY I FINISH, PLEASE? MARLA MOVED. YEAH.
AND THERE'S NOBODY IN HER HOUSE.
APPRECIATE YOUR SUPPORT AROUND THIS.
THEY DID NOT HAVE TO GO THROUGH THE CITY FOR ANYTHING.
THAT'S RIGHT. SO THEN THEY MUST HAVE THEY HAD THE ELECTRICAL FIXTURES IF THEY JUST PUT THEM UP.
YEAH. I'M JUST AGAIN WITH THE AFTER THE FACT KIND OF STUFF.
IT'S LIKE HOW DID HOW DID THEY NOT KNOW? I APOLOGIZE.
RIGHT. WELL, TOO MUCH BIKE RIDING, JUST ENOUGH BIKE RIDING, NOT ENOUGH ELECTROLYTES.
THERE WE GO. OH, YEAH, THAT HAM WAS TALKING TO ME.
OKAY, SO IF YOU HAVE ANY ADDITIONAL THOUGHTS REGARDS TO PEPPERS AND ANYTHING ELSE YOU THINK WE MIGHT DO, LET'S JUST SAY THAT WE WOULD LIKE TO BE KEPT APPRIZED WHEN I GET AN UPDATE FROM CODE ENFORCEMENT, I'LL SHARE.
AND YOU KNOW, LET'S BE CLEAR ABOUT THIS.
SHE'S GOT A VERY DIFFICULT JOB AND I THINK SHE'S DOING GREAT.
BUT THIS IS A PLACE WHERE WE CAN SUPPORT HER IN THAT WORK.
MRS. TAMMI YOU HAD AN UPDATE FROM OPA HIGHWAY.
[6.3 OCEAN HIGWHAY PORT AUTHORITY UPDATE]
THEY HAVE VOTED TO SELL THE THREE PARCELS IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT, AND THEY ARE 15 LOTS TOTAL AND THEY'RE KIND OF CONFIGURED IN AN UNUSUAL WAY.THEY'RE COUNTER DIRECTIONAL TO THE EXISTING STRUCTURES UP THERE, COMMERCIAL BROKERS.
AND THEY DID SAY SPECIFICALLY IN THEIR RFP THAT THE BROKER MUST DEMONSTRATE FAMILIARITY WITH THE CITY OF FERNANDINA BEACH, LAND USE AND ZONING AND THE HISTORIC DISTRICT GUIDELINES.
[01:30:05]
AND NOT ONCE DID ANYBODY MENTION THE HISTORIC DISTRICT OR THE NEIGHBORHOOD OR THE FABRIC OR THE CONTEXT.WHAT I HEARD OVER AND OVER WAS REZONING, REZONING, SUNSET VIEWS, MULTI STORY MAXIMIZATION, DOLLARS. I MEAN, THAT'S WHAT THEY ALL GOT UP THERE AND SAID.
SO I'VE GOT THE MAP UP FOR YOU.
TAMMI. AT THE LAST OPA MEETING THERE WERE SEVERAL PEOPLE FROM THE COMMUNITY THAT THAT SPOKE AND VOICED CONCERNS ABOUT, YOU KNOW, MULTIFAMILY OR CHANGING WHAT GOES IN THERE.
AND THERE WAS THE TOP LOT DOESN'T LOOK LIKE YEAH, RIGHT UP THERE.
AND THERE WERE TWO HOMESTEADS ORIGINALLY FACING THIRD STREET RIGHT NOW YOU CAN SEE 18, 17, 16, 15.
SO, THAT DOESN'T FIT ANYTHING IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT OR ANYTHING UP THERE.
THERE WAS A GREAT PROPOSAL PUT FORTH IN A SHADE MEETING WHERE THAT PROPERTY COULD BE SWAPPED OPA TO THE CITY IN IN LIEU OF RETROACTIVE PILOT TAXES AND SOME FORWARD-THINKING PILOT TAXES TO KIND OF OFFSET WHAT THEY WOULD OWE US, AND THEN THAT WOULD REMAIN UNTOUCHED AND IT COULD BE PUT INTO RECREATION OR SOMETHING, YOU KNOW, AND IT JUST STAYS THE WAY IT IS.
WELL BUT THESE DOWN HERE YOU'VE GOT SIX LOTS AND FIVE LOTS AND REALLY THE CONFIGURATION IS ODD.
I MEAN IDEALLY, THEY SHOULD BE PUT BACK INTO 50-FOOT LOTS TO TO MATCH EVERYTHING ELSE IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD AND WHETHER OR NOT THEY GET SWITCHED WHICH WAY THEY FACE BECAUSE OF DRIVEWAYS GO ON TODAY THAT THERE WAS ONE PROPOSAL PUT FORTH BY JOHN HILLMAN AND HE MAINTAINED THE RESIDENTIAL CHARACTER. HE TALKED ABOUT SAVING THE CUSTOMS HOUSE AND ACTUALLY MOVING THAT AND USING IT AS PART OF ONE OF THE BUILDINGS ON THE NEW LOTS.
AND HE WAS ALL ABOUT RESIDENTIAL AND BUFFERS.
AND I'M NOT SURE IF HE'S STILL IN THE RUNNING OR WHERE THAT IS.
ANYWAY, AT THE END OF THE STORY IS I THINK OPA HEARD THE CONCERNS AND THEY SAID THAT IF WE NOTICE A MEETING AND WE WE HAVE A GATHERING, THEY WOULD CONSIDER PUTTING DEED RESTRICTIONS ON THE LOTS AND THEY WOULD PUT ON, YOU KNOW, WE COULD SAY WE DON'T WANT MULTIFAMILY OR WE COULD SAY THESE CAN NEVER BE REZONE.
SO THAT COULD TECHNICALLY BE, YOU KNOW, ALL SORTS OF THINGS UP THERE.
YEAH. SO COULD THAT BE TOWNHOMES THEN, THE MU ONE.
WELL, ACTUALLY THESE COULD TOO, BECAUSE THAT'S A SINGLE FAMILY HOME.
SO THAT COULD, THAT'S CONSIDERED ALL BE TOWNHOUSES.
YEAH. BUT IT'S NOT IN KEEPING WITH THE NEIGHBORHOOD DIFFERENCE BETWEEN TOWNHOMES AND ROW HOUSES.
AND I'M UP HERE, WHAT, FIVE TIMES A WEEK ON MY BICYCLE, RIGHT? THE TRUCK TRAFFIC WHEN SHIPS ARE COMING AND GOING OR WHEN THE WHEN THERE'S A LOT OF PAPER BEING MOVED IS ASTOUNDING.
SO IT'S UNFORTUNATE THEY AREN'T ORIENTED TOWARDS DADE, TOWARDS THE THIRD STREET SIDE BECAUSE BE MUCH MORE ATTRACTIVE PROPERTY ESPECIALLY IF SOMEBODY PUTS SOME BUFFER IN THESE LOTS ON THE ON THE ON THE TRUCK ROUTE.
THERE'S THERE'S SOME OPTIONS WITH SOME MINOR SUBDIVISIONS THAT CAN HELP THAT AND WORK WITH THAT.
AND THAT'S THE END OF THE STORY IS WE'RE HAVING A NOTICE COMMUNITY MEETING ON MONDAY, AUGUST 28TH BETWEEN 5:00 AND 7:00 ON THE WOODED LOT, AND THAT'S WITH OPA COMMS.IONERS.
ANYBODY THAT WANTS TO ATTEND, IT'LL BE PROPERLY NOTICED.
SO IT'S A MORE THAN ONE PERSON COMMS.IONER CAN ATTEND AND WE WILL TABULATE COMMUNITY CONCERNS, THOUGHTS, IDEAS, SUGGESTIONS AND THEN GIVE THEM SOMETHING, YOU KNOW, A HARD COPY OF SOMETHING THAT WE WANT TO PUT IN THERE AND JUST SAY, YEAH, IF YOU WANT TO WORK WITH THE COMMUNITY, HERE'S WHAT THE COMMUNITY WANTS FOR THESE LOTS.
AND, AND I THINK IT WOULD BE VERY IMPORTANT FOR PEOPLE OF THE HISTORIC DISTRICT, THE COMMITTEE, TO VOICE WHAT YOU WANT TO SEE ON THOSE LOTS BECAUSE EVERYBODY ON YOUR EMAIL LIST SERVE AROUND.
WHAT IS EVERYBODY HERE ON YOUR LIST SERVE FOR FOR OPA ISSUES.
[01:35:05]
COULD YOU REMIND US OF THIS IS TERESA IS THAT'S RIGHT BECAUSE WE DIDN'T WANT TO WE WEREN'T SURE.YEAH WE DIDN'T. WOULD WE SELL THESE PROPERTIES IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT.
AND SO WE NEED TO BE CAREFUL HOW WE TALK ABOUT THIS STUFF RIGHT SIDE OF THIS ROOM.
THANK YOU. SO I ENCOURAGE YOU TO GO.
MONDAY THE 28TH, 5 TO 7 THIS MONTH.
YEAH. AND THE REASON IS THAT THE 31ST OPA IS VOTING ON WHO THEIR BROKER IS.
SO THAT'S ONE OF OUR IMPORTANT THINGS.
YOU KNOW, YOU CAN'T TAKE ON ANY MORE WORK.
NO, I KNOW THAT. BUT YOU KNOW WHAT I'M SAYING? I THINK YOU JUST GOT A NEW JOB DEVELOPER.
HILLMAN WOULD BE GREAT. YEAH, IT'S A HILLMAN.
HE'S BEEN HERE. HE'S DONE STUFF.
CRANE ISLAND, HIS HOUSE IN OLD TOWN.
HILLMAN, HE. HE WAS THE OPERATIONS GUY FOR CRANE ISLAND.
HE MAY STILL BE. AND HE RENOVATED HIS COTTAGE IN OLD TOWN, AND IT CAME OUT.
HE'S A GOOD, GOOD ONE ON BROOMS ON CALHOUN STREET NEXT TO THE LIFT STATION.
HE HAS HIS OWN BUSINESS NOW, SO HE IS A PSEUDO DEVELOPER.
BUT HE'LL BRING ANOTHER PEOPLE AND HE WILL PARCEL THEM OFF AND BE VALUE ADDED.
AND HE'S LOCAL. HE'LL WORK WITH THE COMMUNITY.
SAL, WAS THERE ANYTHING IN THE STAFF REPORT THAT MEMBERS WANTED TO DISCUSS WITH SAL AT THIS TIME?
[7. STAFF REPORT]
I WAS CURIOUS WHAT THE PHD STUDENT NUMBER WAS.IT DOESN'T. IT'S JUST A DISCUSSION ITEM FOR YOU GUYS.
SO, I WANTED TO BRING THAT TO YOU GUYS AND ASK, IS THAT SOMETHING YOU WOULD BE OKAY WITH HAVING A NON-VOTING STUDENT MEMBER? YES, THEY WOULD HAVE A DIFFERENT TERM THAN YOU GUYS DO.
IT WOULD BE JUST A SCHOOL YEAR.
WE WOULD LIKE A HIGH SCHOOL STUDENT.
LIKE A HIGH SCHOOL STUDENT? YEAH, A JUNIOR.
A JUNIOR. THEY'D HAVE TO BE A JUNIOR OR A SENIOR.
OKAY. BUT AND WE WOULD OFFER IT FOR OUR, THE BOARDS WE HAVE THROUGH THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT.
AND IF IT IS, THEN WE WOULD CONSIDER IT.
YES. WORK ON STANDARDS? YES. I THINK I CAN TELL YOU THAT THEY WOULD BE INTERESTED BECAUSE I'VE WORKED WITH MARY HAMBURG TO HELP THEM PUT TOGETHER THEIR STRATEGIES AND THEIR GOALS AND OBJECTIVES.
AND THEY KEPT TALKING ABOUT ISLAND VIBE IS WHAT THEY LOVE.
SO, I MADE THEM PEEL THAT APART TO SAY, WHAT DOES THAT LOOK LIKE? WHAT IS AN ISLAND VIBE THAT MIGHT MAKE YOU WANT TO COME BACK? SO, THEY'RE ACTUALLY WORKING ON A PRESENTATION RIGHT NOW TO GIVE TO THE COMMISSION TO TALK ABOUT JUST THAT.
AND THEY EQUALLY ADDRESSED THE ENVIRONMENT BEING GREEN AND THE HISTORY.
I THINK THEY WILL BE INTERESTED.
THAT'S GREAT. CAN I JUMP IN ONE THING WHILE I'M THINKING ABOUT IT, THAT THE THE BROWN BAG, THE THIRD ON THIRD THAT THE MUSEUM HAD ON THE ON THE PAVEMENT DID YOU WERE THERE. I SAW I HAD MY AIR CONDITIONER WENT OUT SO I HAD TO WATCH THE RERUN OF IT.
IF YOU GUYS HAVEN'T SEEN IT, IT'S REALLY GOOD.
WATCH IT. I MEAN, WHAT HE TALKED ABOUT IS SO FASCINATING.
AND LIKE ONE OF THE THINGS HE SAID THAT THOSE PAVERS WHERE THEY HAVE THEM SHUT DOWN WHERE LIKE THE THERE'S ONLY THREE CITIES OR SOMETHING IN THE UNITED STATES THAT HAVE THAT THAT ONE WEIRD CONFIGURATION OF THOSE PAPERS.
SO, THE SQUARE, HE COULDN'T BELIEVE IT.
YEAH. HE WAS LIKE, WOW, YOU'VE GOT TO SAVE THESE.
WHY IS THERE STUFF UP THERE? BUT I MEAN, THAT WAS REALLY INFORMATIVE.
I THINK THAT SHOULD BE, YOU KNOW, STANDARD OPERATING PROCEDURE FOR PEOPLE TO WHICH IS TO, I THINK.
CHAIR SPINO, YOU HAVE MENTIONED A COUPLE OF TIMES THAT DOWNTOWN REVITALIZATION PLAN, RIGHT? HAVE WE ALL SEEN THAT? OH, I'M SORRY. I HAVE DETAIL.
AND HE ASSURED ME THAT HE WILL HAVE A ROBUST STAKEHOLDER ENGAGEMENT PROCESS AND INCLUDING RESTORATION FOUNDATION BUSINESS LEADERS.
BUSINESS OWNERS, PROPERTY OWNERS, HDC CRA ADVISORY BOARD.
MAIN STREET. MAIN STREET RESTORATION FOUNDATION.
[01:40:03]
AND I WAS PLEASED THAT WHEN I WENT IN TO SAY, HEY, YOU NEED TO DO THIS BEFORE I COULD GET THE WORDS OUT, HE WAS TELLING ME HOW HE WAS GOING TO DO IT.THAT'S I'M OPTIMISTIC ABOUT THAT, THOUGH, BECAUSE I THINK THAT WHAT'S HAPPENING WHILE THE BUDGET IS BEING PREPARED, THERE ARE, YOU KNOW, RFPS GOING OUT FOR THIS PIECE OF THE ACTION AND THAT PIECE, AND NOBODY HAS SEEN WHAT'S THE WHOLE PLAN? WHAT IS EVERYTHING THAT'S GOING TO BE WORKED ON EVEN IN THIS BUDGET YEAR? SO WHAT I'M CONCERNED ABOUT, YOU KNOW, PAVERS BEING AT THE TOP OF MY LIST RIGHT NOW OF THROWING AWAY OUR HISTORY ONE BUDGET ITEM AT A TIME, ONE BUDGET VOTE AT A TIME WILL DECIDE TO GET RID OF THINGS BASED PURELY ON THE COST AS OPPOSED TO WHAT'S VALUABLE TO THE COMMUNITY.
WHAT DO WE VALUE HERE? AND I REALLY THINK THAT HAS TO BE LOOKED AT MORE IN THAT WAY.
WELL, LET ME LET ME CLARIFY WHAT I WAS TALKING ABOUT HERE.
THE DESIGN RFP, WHICH IS WHAT'S GOING TO DRIVE THE WORK, HAS NOT BEEN ISSUED.
AND IT INCLUDES A ROBUST STAKEHOLDER ENGAGEMENT PROCESS ON THE FRONT END.
IN OTHER WORDS, WHEN WE SIT DOWN WITH THE DESIGN CONSULTANT AND WE SAY HEX PAPER, HEX, PAPER, HEX PAPER, WE CAN IMPACT HOW THAT PROCESS GOES FORWARD. OKAY.
I BELIEVE. WHAT? I'M NOT AWARE OF AN RFP I'M AWARE OF.
SO THERE SO I'M SURE THEY'RE GOING OUT TO HAVE PEOPLE GIVE A PRICE ON WHAT IT'S GOING TO COST.
I MEAN, YEAH, I MEAN, WE MAY BE THE COMMS.IONER ROSS IS GOING TO CLARIFY FOR US BECAUSE WHAT I'M CONCERNED ABOUT IS FOREGONE CONCLUSIONS FEEDING INTO THE DESIGN PROCESS BECAUSE IT'S A BUDGET ISSUE.
IT'S TOO EXPENSIVE. COMMS.IONER, DID THIS HELP US HELP US THROUGH THIS? CHIP ROSS, 210 NORTH THIRD STREET, FERNANDINA BEACH, FLORIDA.
ACTUALLY, HE GOT HIS HEAD RIGHT.
ACTUALLY, I PUT BABY OIL ON MYSELF WHEN I WAS A TEENAGER, AND I'M CURSED EVER SINCE.
THE FIRST ONE I'D LIKE TO GO BACK A LITTLE BIT, PLEASE.
IF A COUPLE BUILDING OFFICIALS AGO, WE HAD SOMEBODY WHO WAS REALLY ROBUST AT SHUTTING DOWN WORK PROJECTS AND SO ON, THIS ROOM WAS PACKED WITH BUILDERS WHO CAME IN AND MADE A BIG STINK ABOUT YOU'RE GETTING IN OUR WAY.
BASICALLY. SOME OF THEM WERE CORRECT AND SOME THINGS WERE A BIT OF AN EXAGGERATION.
SO, I THINK THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT IS REAL SHY ABOUT STOPPING WORK PROJECTS AND SO ON AND SO FORTH.
NUMBER TWO, YOU HAVE A COMMISSION NOW THAT LIKES TO CUT FEES, NOT INCREASE FEES.
IT WAS DIFFICULT ENOUGH WHEN WE WENT THROUGH THE TREE ORDINANCE THING AND.
ALL THAT GOT WATERED DOWN TREMENDOUSLY.
I'M NOT SAYING IT'S GOOD, I'M NOT SAYING IT'S BAD.
DO I THINK THERE SHOULD BE SEVERE PENALTIES? ABSOLUTELY. WOULD I VOTE FOR THAT? ABSOLUTELY. BUT YOU'VE GOT TO GET TWO, THREE GOING TO THE SCHOOLHOUSE.
THE CITY DIDN'T WANT TO SPEND THE MONEY.
AND SO WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN THERE IS WHO KNOWS THE STATE.
BUT THE STATE IS GOING TO DO WHAT THEY'RE GOING TO DO.
IT'S THEIR RIGHT OF WAY, WHETHER THEY AND THEY ARE NOT GOING TO MAINTAIN PAVERS LIKE THAT.
I CAN GUARANTEE I CAN ALMOST GUARANTEE THAT THEY WERE CLEAR ABOUT IT.
THEY'RE NOT I CAN ALMOST GUARANTEE THAT.
[01:45:01]
SO WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN THERE? I'M NOT SURE IF THE CITY HAS A MAINTENANCE AGREEMENT.THEY DO NOT HAVE A MAINTENANCE AGREEMENT ANYMORE.
IF THE CITY CREATES A MAINTENANCE AGREEMENT, THEN IT'S ON THE CITY AND THEY'LL LEAVE IT ALONE.
SO, BUT, COMMISSIONER, YOU'RE TALKING TO THE WRONG PERSON.
I MEAN, I AGREE WITH ALL THESE THINGS.
I MEAN, THE POINT IS, THOUGH, THERE'S NO MONEY TO DO THIS.
AND EVERYBODY WE JUST WENT THROUGH THIS BUDGET PROCESS.
I WORKED IT WAS ALL OF A SUDDEN $1 MILLION WENT INTO DOING THIS DOWNTOWN, DOWNTOWN.
THAT WAS SOME CREATIVE FINANCING THERE.
BUT AT LEAST WE PRESERVED THAT.
I THINK THERE'S $1.3 MILLION AND I KNOW A FEW OTHER PLACES.
DO THEY KNOW WHAT THEY'RE GOING TO DO WITH IT? WELL, TWO THINGS.
AND IT'S AT $75 A SQUARE FOOT, WHICH IS ASK YOU A QUESTION.
SURE. DID IT GO OUT WITH THE REQUIREMENT THAT THE CITY BELIEVES IS THE ONLY WAY TO LAY THOSE DOWN? YES. DID IT GO OUT THAT WAY? I DIDN'T.
OKAY. I'VE READ ZILLIONS OF THINGS.
I DON'T REMEMBER READING THE BID AGREEMENT, I WOULD.
I WOULD SPECULATE THAT AT 75 BUCKS A SQUARE FOOT, YOU'RE LAYING A SIDEWALK AND YOU'RE PUTTING PAVER.
YEAH. SO, BUT TO GO TO AN EXPERT COMPANY LIKE TAMPA USES OR SAINT PETE OR.
THIS MORNING I MADE A PHONE CALL TO YBOR, TO THE MAYOR, AND I'M GOING TO GET IN TOUCH AND FIND OUT WHO THE COMPANY WAS THAT PUT DOWN THEIR PAVERS DOWN THERE COME MONDAY AT THE.
I'LL SEND YOU THE LINK IF SOMEBODY WOULD SEND ME THE LINK.
I WILL CALL THEM PERSONALLY AND FIND OUT WHAT THE STORY IS.
BUT THE DIFFERENCE IS $75 VERSUS $8 A SQUARE FOOT.
YOU'RE PREACHING TO THE CHOIR.
YOU'RE PREACHING TO THE CHOIR.
BUT I HAVE TO LIVE IN THE WORLD.
YOU GOT TO PAY FOR ALL THIS STUFF.
AND I AGREE WITH YOU, BUT YOU HAVE TO PAY FOR IT.
SO THE IDEA NOW AND NONE OF THIS IS CAST IN STONE IS THAT THEY COME UP WITH AN RFP REQUEST FOR PROPOSALS TO COME UP WITH THE LET ME GO BACK. THE LIGHT PORTION OF DOWNTOWN IS ALREADY BEING DONE AND THAT SHOULD BE OUT IN A COUPLE OF WEEKS.
AM I CORRECT, SAL? I BELIEVE SO, YEAH.
SO THAT'S BEING DONE, CORRECT.
OKAY. SO, WE HAVE THE LIGHTS, WHICH YOU NOW NEED IS THE CURBS.
YOU NEED THE SIDEWALKS, YOU NEED THE MEDIUM STRIP IN BETWEEN THE CURBS AND THE SIDEWALKS, AND YOU NEED LIGHT LANDSCAPING TREE PLAN. ALL RIGHT.
THE IDEA WAS, I THINK THE CURRENT IDEA OF THE INTERIM CITY MANAGER I'M SPEAKING FROM WHAT I'VE HEARD IS TO PUT OUT A REQUEST FOR PROPOSAL AND GET ONE DESIGNER WHO WOULD PUT ALL THAT TOGETHER.
AND AS PART OF THAT, ALL THESE OTHER GROUPS GET TOGETHER AND COME UP WITH A PLAN FOR DOWNTOWN.
MY CONCERN IS ALL THAT SHOULD PROBABLY BE DONE AHEAD OF TIME.
ALL GET TOGETHER AND FIGURE IT OUT BECAUSE THE METER IS GOING TO SPIN.
WE GOT 12 ONE, A LITTLE OVER $1.2 MILLION.
WHAT I'D LIKE TO SEE IS MOST OF THAT GO INTO CONSTRUCTION.
SO, YOU CAN DO THE FIRST BLOCK TWO BLOCKS FROM LAKE TO FRONT STREET TO THE RAILROAD, ESSENTIALLY TO LIKE SECOND OR THIRD STREET.
$1.2 MILLION IS NOT GOING TO GO FAR IN CONSTRUCTION.
IF THEY GO TO THAT ROLLBACK RATE AGAIN, THERE'S GOING TO BE ABSOLUTELY NO MONEY FOR ANYTHING.
AND ALL THE MONEY, THE FOUND MONEY IS GOING TO BE SPENT.
THERE'S GOING TO BE NOTHING THERE.
WHEN DOES THE FISCAL YEAR START? OCTOBER 1ST. SO YOU BASICALLY WE NEED TO GET THAT MONEY SPENT.
WE NEED A PLAN IN PLACE AND CONSTRUCTION UNDERGOING TO GET THAT MONEY SPENT.
SO THERE'S NOTHING GOING TO REALLY HAPPEN DOWN HERE.
YOU GET PUSHED TO OTHER PLACES.
DOES ANYBODY HAVE ANY QUESTIONS? ANYTHING ELSE? FOR THE GOOD OF THE ORDER.
[01:50:01]
THANK YOU. SO, LAST THING, THIS IS A POSITIVE THING DOWN ON FRONT STREET.IF YOU LOOK UP FRONT STREET TO THE NORTH, YOU'LL NOTICE A WHOLE BUNCH OF TELEPHONE POLES.
IF YOU GO DOWN THERE TODAY, THEY'RE DOING BORINGS AND THEY'RE PUTTING IN UNDERGROUND LINES FOR BOTH COMCAST AND FPU. AND HOPEFULLY THOSE POLES WILL BE DOWN IN TWO MONTHS.
WOW. WE DON'T HAVE TO WAIT FOR A HURRICANE.
I STARTED ON THAT JOURNEY FIVE YEARS LINE AS THEY GO.
WELL, YEAH. SO ANYHOW, THANK YOU.
THANK YOU. THAT'S WHEN THEY THREW US ALL OUT.
I APPRECIATE THE TIME FOR ALL YOUR HISTORIC DISTRICT COUNCIL NEEDS.
WE'RE ADJOURNED. WE ARE ADJOURNED.
* This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.