[1. CALL TO ORDER / ROLL CALL / DETERMINATION OF QUORUM] [00:00:06] WELCOME TO THE MARCH 2021 HISTORIC DISTRICT COUNCIL MEETING. THE TEMPORAL CALL. >> MEMBER KOSACK. >> HERE BACK VICE-CHAIR POZZETTA. >> CARE. >> MEMBERS FEMALE FEEDBACK HERE. >> AT THAT POINT LET ME WELCOME OUR NEW ALTERNATE IT'S GOOD TO HAVE YOU WITH US AND THE PROTOCOL HERE IS THAT AS WE ARE A FULL BOARD YOU MAY NOT VOTE ON ANY OF THE ISSUES THAT THAT IS THE ONLY THING YOU CANNOT DO. WE WELCOME YOU AND YOUR CONTRIBUTIONS, YOUR QUESTIONS AND DISCUSSIONS AS WE MOVE THROUGH THE AGENDA. SO WELCOME. PLEASE STAND AND JOIN ME IN THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE. >> I PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA AND TO THE REPUBLIC FOR WHICH IT STANDS, ONE NATION, UNDER GOD, INDIVISIBLE WITH LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL. >> THANK YOU. [3. APPROVAL OF MEETING MINUTES] >> WE HAVE THE MINUTES OF THE FEBRUARY 18 MEETING TO CONSIDER. ARE THERE ANY CHANGES OR AMENDMENTS? >> I HAVE NONE. >> I DID SEND AN E-MAIL TO MS. HARTMAN THIS MORNING WITH A COUPLE OF CHANGES THAT I THINK NEED TO BE MADE IN SECTION 51 THERE IS AN ERROR, DID YOU GET A CHANCE TO RESEARCH THAT? >> IF YES I, IT WAS MEMBER KOSACK SECONDED THAT MOTION THEMATIC THANK YOU FOR THAT. 'S METHOD OR BOARD BUSINESS I MADEA STATEMENT UNDER LAST MONTHS MEETING WHICH IS NOT FULLY REFLECTED IN THE MINUTES. WHAT I MEANT TO SAY AND I WILL SAY THIS AS DISTINCTLY AS I CAN AND THEN SEND IT TO YOU. IS THAT AS OLDTOWN BECOMES MORE DEVELOPED, PRESSURE IS GROWING ON BUILDERS TO FIND SUITABLE PLACES FOR THEIR MATERIALS. IT IS A PROVEN VERY DIFFICULT FOR THEM TO CONTAIN THE MATERIALS WITHIN THE LAW THAT THEY ARE. SO THEY ARE TENDING TO SPREAD OVER INTO JOINING THE HOT SAND INTO THE STREETS. AND I THINK, SAL, YOU MADE COMMENTS AND THE BUILDING A STRUCTURE WHICH HAS MY RESPECT, HAS ISSUED AN EDICT THAT BUILDING PERMITS MUST SHOW WHERE THE MATERIAL IS TO BE MORE DURING CONSTRUCTION. >> CORRECT. >> WITH THOSE CHANGES I NEED A MOTION IN A SECOND TO APPROVE THE MINUTES. >> I MOVED TO APPROVE THE MINUTES WITH THE STATED CHANGES. >> THANK YOU, TAMMI. IS THERE A SECOND? >> SECOND. >> SECOND MEMBER POZZETTA. ALL IN FAVOR. AYE ALL. >> NOSE AGAINST SAINT NAY, I SAY AYE. >> ALL BUSINESS, HVC -- SORRY WE HAVE SOME QUASI- JUDICIAL CASES. MATT ON CITY ATTORNEY, PLEASE TELL US WHAT WE HAVE TO DO. >> YES, WE HAVE TWO CASES TONIGHT. THEY WILL BE CONDUCTED AS QUASIJUDICIAL HEARINGS. FIRST, SAL COMELLA WAS CITY STAFF WILL MAKE A PRESENTATION AND'S INTRODUCED EVIDENCE INTO THE RECORD AT THEN THE APPLICANT, AND/OR THEIR AGENTS WILL COME TO THE PODIUM, STATE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS. YOU WILL BE PRESENTING THE EVIDENCE AND TESTIMONY. IF THERE ARE ANY AFFECTED PARTIES HERE TONIGHT WHICH MEANS YOU ARE A RESIDENT OF THE CITY, YOU MAY ALSO COME TO THE PODIUM, STATE NAME AND ADDRESS AND YOU ARE ALLOWED TO PRESENT EVIDENCE AND TESTIMONY AS WELL. ALL OF THE PARTIES ARE PERMITTED TO CROSS-EXAMINE EACH OTHER AND TO CROSS-EXAMINE EACH OTHER'S WITNESSES. ANYBODY WHO WISHES TO SPEAK TONIGHT WILL TAKE AN OATH WHEN I AM FINISHED THE CHAIR WILL ASK THE RECORDING SECRETARY, MS. HARTMAN, TO ADMINISTER THE OATH. YOU WILL BE TESTIFYING UNDER OATH. THE RECORD WE ARE KEEPING US IN AUDIO AND VIDEO RECORDING OF THE PROCEEDINGS. WE DO NOT DO A TRANSCRIPTION OR TRANSCRIBED THOSE ARE REPORTING'S, THAT IS SUCH INDIVIDUALS TO DO ON THEIR OWN. IF THERE IS AN APPEAL TO BE TAKEN OF EITHER OF THE DECISIONS [00:05:01] MADE BY THE HISTORIC DISTRICT COUNCIL TONIGHT, THAT APPEAL IS FILED WITH THE CITY COMMISSION WITHIN 30 DAYS BY THE APPLICANT. AFFECTED PARTIES HAVE BEEN APPEALED TO THE CIRCUIT COURT PRAY ABOUT BOTH WITHIN 30 DAYS OF THE BOARDS WRITTEN FINDINGS OF FACT WHICH THE CHAIR SIDES WITHIN THREE-FIVE BUSINESS DAYS OF THIS MEETING. ABOUT 35 DAYS. ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS #THAT'S IT. YOU HAVE ALREADY DONE X PARTAKE,. >> WE HAVE NOT ALREADY DONE X PER SE. YOU HAVE A RECOMMENDATION FOR WHEN WE HAVE CUSTOMER. >> NO. JUST GO AHEAD AND DISCLOSE AWAY. >> THANK YOU VERY MUCH. DO ANY MEMBERS OF THE HISTORIC DISTRICT COUNCIL HAVE ANY EXPORTS HEY COMMUNICATIONS TO DISCLOSE. HAND GIVE A NEW MEMBER A CHANCE TO FIGURE OUT WHAT IS GOING ON LET'S START WITH YOU JIM. >> I HAVE NONE. >> VERY HELPFUL. >> I HAVE NONE. >> TO WANT ME TO MAKE SOMETHING UP? >> I HAVE NONE. >> MEMBERS FEMALE SELECT MR. SHAMAN AND I HAVE BEEN DISCUSSING 101 NORTH SECOND STREET. I MADE A SITE VISIT YESTERDAY TO TOUR THAT. >> OKAY, THANK YOU VERY MUCH. MS. DUNCAN. >> NO. >> I HAVE TO DISCLOSE TO THAT I HAVE HAD DISCUSSIONS WITH SAL AND MS. HARTMAN CONCERNING TONIGHT'S AGENDA, SIMPLY TO REVIEW IT. THANK YOU. NOW, LET'S MOVE TO ALL BUSINESS. HDC CASE 2020-0046, MARK AND JENNIFER BAILEY, 809 SAN FERNANDO STREET. >> TO A NEED TO SWEAR PEOPLE IN? >> OF COURSE WE DO. >> WE DID NOT YET SWEAR THAT MAN. FORGIVE ME. I AM GETTING VERY MUCH OUT OF ORDINARY. MS. HARTMAN, WOULD YOU PLEASE SWEAR THOSE PEOPLE IN THE AUDIENCE WHO WISH TO GIVE EVIDENCE TONIGHT. >> 20 PARTIES WISHING TO ENTER EVIDENCE INTO THE RECORD, PLEASE STAND AND RAISE YOUR RIGHT HAND. >> DO YOU SWEAR OR AFFIRM THAT THE ORAL, AND/OR WRITTEN TESTIMONY YOU ARE ABOUT TO GET WILL BE THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH, NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH? >> I DO. >> I DO. >> IT MR. CHAIRMAN, WE ALSO HAVE SOME PARTICIPANTS AND APPLICANTS ONLINE TONIGHT. WE WILL SWEAR THEM AND AS WE GO INTO EACH CASE. >> PLEASE REMIND ME. SO, LET'S START WITH 2020-0046, MARK AND JENNIFER BAILEY. [4.1 HDC 2020-0046 - MARK L. + JENNIFER D. BAILEY, 809 SAN FERNANDO STREET] VAL, PLEASE TELL US WHY WE ARE HEARING THIS CASE AGAIN. >> GOOD EVENING. I AM SAL THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION BANNER FOR THE CITY. THIS IS CASE HDC 2020 —-DASH 0046 ADDRESS AT 809 SAN FERNANDO STREET. IT IS AN OT ONE ZONE LOTS IN OLDTOWN. THIS IS A CERTIFICATE OF APPROVAL TO CONSTRUCTION 2596 SQUARE FOOT TWO-STORY RESIDENCE. THIS IS THE AERIAL OF THE PROPERTY HERE. THE PROPERTY HAS CONSISTS OF A FULL PAEONIA AND TO MEDIA PAEONIA. THIS CASE HAS COME BEFORE THE HDC BEFORE CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL WAS GIVEN IN NOVEMBER 2020. FINAL APPROVAL WAS CONTINUED IN DECEMBER AND AGAIN IN MARCH. -- TO MARCH. THE UPDATE TO THIS MONTH IS THAT THE APPLICANT HAS MADE MODIFICATIONS TO THAT GARAGE STRUCTURE IN RESPONSE TO BGC COMMENTS FROM LAST TIME. STAFF DOES FIND THAT THOSE PROPOSED DESIGN ELEMENTS ARE CREDIBLE WITH THE OLDTOWN FERNANDINA HISTORIC DISTRICT IN TERMS OF REFORMS, ORIENTATIONS AND SETBACK AND STAFF IS RECOMMENDING APPROVAL OF HDC 2020-46. GIVE ME A MINUTE TO SWITCH SCREENS, I WILL SHOW YOU THE CHANGE FOR THIS MONTH WHICH APPEARS ON THE GARAGE STRUCTURE. IT'S LIKE THIS IS WE THOUGHT (THERE WAS CONCERN ABOUT THE LEVEL OF DETAIL AND MANAGING THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE. THIS IS THE PROPOSED NEW CONCEPT FOR THAT GARAGE. [00:10:07] THEY HAVE CHANGED THE POWER PITS ON THE ROOF LINE IN FRONT OF THE GARAGE. I HAVE CHANGED THE SLIDE DOOR BUMP OUT TO REFLECT ELEMENTS ON THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE. INKY. >> IT DO WE QUESTIONS OF STAFF? ANYBODY? NO. AND IS THE APPLICANT PRESENT? >> THEY ARE ON ZOOM. >> OKAY. IS THE APPLICANT ABLE TO TALK TO US? THEY SHOULD BE IN A MINUTE. >> THIS IS NOT THE OWNER BUT THIS IS THE ARCHITECT. CAN YOU HEAR ME? >> WE CAN. GOOD EVENING. HOW ARE YOU? >> I AM GREAT. >> JUST TALK US BRIEFLY THROUGH WHAT YOU HAVE DONE. >> THE BAILEY'S ARE ALSO ON THE LINE. >> HELLO BAILEY'S, GOOD EVENING. >> HELLO. >> OKAY WOULD ONE OF YOU LIKE TO SPEAK TO WHAT YOU ARE SUBMITTING TO US TONIGHT? >> PLEASE APPROVE US. >> I AM THE ARCHITECT. I WILL START OFF AND THEN IF I MISS ANYTHING THAN THE BAILEY'S CAN HELP ME OUT. SO THE FIRST RESPONSE WE GOT WITH THE GARAGE WE HAD ADDED THE ROOF OVER THE DOORS IN THE SECOND REITERATION WAS THAT WE JUST NEEDED A LITTLE MORE. SO ALTHOUGH THERE WAS SOME HANDWRINGING ON OUR PART, WE HAVE ADDED THE PARAFFIN AND ON THE STREET AND ALSO ON THE BUMP OUT THERE IN THE BACK WITH THE HOUSE WITH THE SECONDARY STRUCTURE WE DON'T WANT TO BE WITH THE HOUSE AND ALSO ISSUING THE SITE PLAN FROM SAN FERNANDO STREET THEY'VE GONE THROUGH A LOT OF CHANGEOVER BEFORE YOU CAN EVEN BEGIN TO SEE THE GARAGE. BUT THAT IS KINDA WHERE WE HAVE BEEN AND WHY WE MADE THE CHANGE THAT WE MADE THAT YOU ASKED FOR. >> THANK YOU. IT HAS BEEN POINTED OUT TO ME THAT YET AGAIN I HAVE OFFENDED THE PROTOCOL AND THAT YOU GUYS AS THE APPLICANT'S NEED TO BE SWORN IN. SO, WOULD YOU PLEASE RAISE YOUR RIGHT HANDS AND FOLLOW MS. HARTMAN'S GUIDANCE. >> TO YOU SWEAR OUR FIRM THAT THE ORAL AND/OR WRITTEN TESTIMONY YOU ARE ABOUT TO GET WILL BE THE TRUTH, THE FULL TRUTH AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH? >> YES, WE DO. >> THAT'S GOOD, THANK YOU. YOU MAY NOW SIT. >> OKAY, DO WE HAVE ANY QUESTIONS ON THE APPLICANT? >> STATE YOUR NAMES AND ADDRESS FOR THE RECORDS PLEASE. >> NAMES AND ADDRESS FOR THE RECORD. >> JENNIFER AND MARK BAILEY, 306 CAMILO AVENUE 33134. MR. HARRIS. >> BILL HARRIS, THE ARCHITECT DID 1003 CHARLES STREET SOUTH CAROLINA, 29902. >> THANK YOU. ANY FURTHER QUESTIONS OF THE APPLICANT'S MARK. >> AND I WOULD JUST LIKE TO COMMENT THAT I FEEL LIKE THE CHANGES MADE ARE VERY GOOD INTERPRETATION OF THE COMMENTS MADE BY THE BOARD AT LEAST FROM MY STANDPOINT. I FEEL LIKE THEY KNOCKED IT OUT OF THE PARK SO TO SPEAK. I REALLY LIKE THE RESOLUTION OF THESE DETAILS. >> THANK YOU. >> I AGREE. >> MR. MORRISON AGREES. ARE YOU STILL ABLE TO ACCOMMODATE -- PANELS, I THINK YOU WANTED SO SAD. >> WE HAVE NOT REEVALUATED THAT OUR PRIMARY INTEREST IN THIS POINT IN TIME IS SATISFYING THE BOARD SO THAT WE CAN GET TO CONTRACTORS AND START MAKING THOSE SEGMENTS. >> I UNDERSTAND. THANK YOU. OKAY, LET'S MOVE ON QUICKLY. LET ME OPEN THE HEARING TO A PUBLIC HEARING. IS THERE ANYONE IN THE AUDIENCE WHO WISHES TO SPEAK FOR OR AGAINST THIS CASE? ANYBODY ONLINE? >> NO SIR. >> IN THAT CASE WE WILL CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING AND MOVED TO [00:15:04] BOARD DISCUSSION. >> I WOULD LIKE TO SAY EXACTLY WHAT THE TWO GENTLEMEN JUST SPOKE ABOUT. THIS IS EXACTLY IN MY MIND WHAT WE WERE SEEKING THE VERY FIRST MEETING WHEN WE WANT TO MORE DIALOGUE BETWEEN THE TWO STRUCTURES. I THINK I HAVE EXCEEDED WHAT WE WERE LOOKING FOR AT THE VERY FIRST MEETING. I THINK IT IS EXCELLENT. >> SOUNDS LIKE A MOTION. >> I WILL MAKE A MOTION. I MOVED TO APPROVE HDC CASE HDC 2020-46 WITHOUT CONDITIONS AND SAID THAT THEY MAKE IT A FINAL EFFECTIVE CONCLUSIONS PART OF THE RECORD. THAT HDC 2020-46 ASSET PRESENTED IS WITH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE IN THE OLDTOWN GUIDELINES TOWARD FINAL APPROVAL AT THIS TIME. >> SECOND TWO THANK YOU FOR THE SECOND. MS. HARTMAN, PLEASE CALL. >> MEMBER KOSACK. >> YES. >> MEMBER POZZETTA. >> YES. >> VICE CHAIR. >> ASKED. >> CHERRY. >> YES. [4.2 HDC 2020-0051 - NORTH FLORIDA WASTE PRO MANAGEMENT, AGENT FOR RICHARD GOODSELL, 101 N. 2ND STREET] >> HDC CASE 2020-ZERO ZERO FIVE NORTH FLORIDA WASTE PRO MANAGEMENT AND AGENT FOR RICHARD GOOD CELL ON NORTH SECOND STREET. >> THIS IS HDC 2020-51. A PROPERTY LOCATED AT 101 NORTH SECOND STREET KNOWN AS THE CH HOYT TO BUILDING. IT IS ON THE C-3 CENTRAL BUSINESS DISTRICT CURRENTLY VACANT COMMERCIAL STRUCTURE BUILT IN 1882. WE HAVE PREVIOUSLY SEEN THIS CASE FOR THE DEMOLITION FOR THE WAREHOUSE STRUCTURE THAT WAS ADJACENT BUILDING. THIS APPLICANT IS NOW SEEKING AN AMENDMENT TO THAT COA TO DEMOLISH THE CONCRETE BLOCK WAREHOUSE ADDITION TO THE NORTH OF THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE. THAT WAREHOUSE ADDITION WAS CONSTRUCTED IN 19 STAFF FIND THAT THE REMOVAL OF THIS EDITION MEETS THE CRITERIA FOR DEMOLITION OF THE REMOVAL OF THE DETERIORATED WAREHOUSE WILL ENHANCE THE SOCIETY ALLOWING FOR THE REHABILITATION OF THE STRUCTURE. THE REMOVAL WILL NOT NEGATIVELY IMPACT INSIDER SURROUNDING NEIGHBORHOOD. THE PROPERTY CURRENTLY HAS OR DOES NOT HAVE A CODE ENFORCEMENT CASE AGAINST IT. IT HAS IN THE PAST. STAFF IS RECOMMENDING APPROVAL OF THIS BY HDC 2020-51. I DO HAVE SOME PHOTOS AND THERE WERE SOME QUESTIONS ABOUT ATTACHMENTS AND SO LET ME BRING UP SOME PHOTOS FOR YOU TO SEE HOW THAT ATTACHMENT IS MADE TO THE HISTORIC BUILDING. THESE ARE SOME OF THE BEINGS IN THE BRICK WALL THAT YOU ARE SEEING TO THE RIGHT IS THE HISTORIC BUILDING. THIS ADDITION WAS ADDED ON. THESE WOULD BEINGS WHERE AND SO THIS TO THE RIGHTS OF THE TWO-STORY BUILDING IS THAT HISTORIC BUILDING. TO THE LEFT IS A ONE-STORY ADDITION IN THE 1950S AND THEN THERE IS A LATER WAREHOUSE ADDITION ADDED ONTO THAT. THE REQUEST IS TO REMOVE ALL OF THE WAREHOUSE ADDITION AND THAT IS NOT PART OF THE ORIGINAL STRUCTURE. HERE YOU HAVE A GOOD ILLUSTRATION OF HOW THE BUILDINGS. YOU HAVE THE CMU BLOCK WALLS UP AGAINST THE BRICK WALLS NOT REALLY TYING INTO THE BRICK WALLS. THE ONLY REAL CONNECTION WOULD BE ON THE X CARRIER AND WHAT WE DISCOVERED WAS THAT OBVIOUSLY THESE INTERIOR WALLS ARE ON STUCCO WHERE THE REST OF THE BUILDING WITH STUCCO. THE BUILDING WAS STUCCOED SOMETIME AFTER 1950 WHEN THIS WAS CORRECTED. AGAIN, THIS IS THE OPENING THAT PENETRATION INTO THE HISTORIC BUILDING LOOKING INTO THE HISTORIC BUILDING. AS YOU CAN SEE THIS IS THE BRICK X YOUR YOUR WALL. THAT'S WHERE ALL OF THE SOUTHSIDE IS BEING ASKED TO BE DEMOLISHED. HERE ARE SOME MORE SHOTS OF THAT WAREHOUSE SECTION AND IF THE BOARD HAS ANY QUESTIONS I WOULD BE HAPPY TO ANSWER. THANK YOU. [00:20:03] >> QUESTIONS OF STAFF? >> I HAVE A QUESTION. AND THE STAFF REPORT SAID IT'S ELIGIBLE FOR INCLUSION INTO THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT AS A CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE. DID YOU MEAN THE TOTALITY OF THE WAREHOUSE AND THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE OR DO YOU MEAN THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT THAT. >> WE DON'T HAVE A DIFFERENTIATION BETWEEN THE TWO. >> IF THEY WERE STILL CONNECTED THERE WOULD NOT BE A DIFFERENTIATION THEY WOULD BOTH BE CONSIDERED. IT WOULD BE HAD NONCONTRIBUTING ADDITION TO A CONTRIBUTING PRIMARY STRUCTURE. SINCE THE ADDITIONS WERE BUILT AFTER THE PERIOD SIGNIFICANCE FOR DOWNTOWN. >> THANK YOU. >> THE CODE ENFORCEMENT CASE, WAS THAT RELATED TO WAREHOUSE? SIGNIFICANT CORRECT. THERE WAS SOME DAMAGE AT ONE OF THE LAST STORM SAID THAT WAS THE PRIMARY CONCERN IS THAT THAT WAS A DANGER AND I BELIEVE THAT CASE HAS BEEN RESOLVED. THERE IS THIS SECTION IS STILL OPEN.. INTO THE SKY. THERE IS STILL CONCERNED AS FAR AS THE SAFETY OF THIS PART OF THE BUILDING. >> SALE, YOU HAVE A PICTURE OF THE MASONARY TRANSITION ON THE INSIDE. ARE ALL OF THE ATTACHMENT POINTS COLD JOINTS LIKE THAT SO THERE'S NO INTEGRAL CONSTRUCTION METHOD? FROM THE EXTERIOR THEY MUST PART THE STUCCO OVER THE JOINT. IT LOOKS LIKE IT IS ONE CONTINUOUS. SO YOU DON'T HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT IT : YOU'LL BUILDING APART. >> I BELIEVE SO. I DON'T BELIEVE THE CMU MASONARY IS TIED INTO THE BRICK MASONARY OF THE BUILDING AT ALL. >> IT WOULD PROBABLY BE A GOOD IDEA IDEA TO TAKE SOME CARE AS YOU MOVE THAT CMU JUST ON THE CHANCE THAT IT HAS BEEN TIGHT AND YOU DO NOT WANT TO DAMAGE THE BRICK BUILDING TAKING IT OFF CEMENT IT COULD SUE MCCOY AND IN SUPPORT DISCUSSION, I WOULD LIKE THE APPLICANT TO PLEASE BE SWORN FIRST OF ALL. ARE YOU ONLINE APPLICANT? >> YES. NAME AND ADDRESS PLEASE. >> TONY -- WITH THE WASTE MANAGEMENT 525 WEATHERBY LANE. CAN YOU HEAR ME? >> WE CAN. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. >> THANK YOU. CEMENT YOU NOW DEAN TO BE'S. MS. HARTMAN, PLEASE ADMINISTER THE OATH THAT. >> PLEASE YOUR RIGHT HAND. DO YOU SWEAR OR AFFIRM THAT THE ORAL AND/OR WRITTEN TESTIMONY YOU ARE ABOUT TO GIVE ART WILL BE THE TRUTH, THOUGHTFUL TRUTH AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH? >> I SWEAR. >> THANK YOU. >> I HOPE YOU HEARD SAL'S INTRODUCTION OF THE CASE, DO YOU HAVE ANY COMMENTS TO MAKE ON THAT? WERE ANYTHING YOU WOULD LIKE TO SAY ABOUT YOUR APPLICATION? >> WE ARE STILL VERY CONFIDENT WITH THIS PROJECT BUT WE HAVE DONE IT BEFORE ON THE OTHER SIDE AND HAD NO PROBLEM. DAN I BELIEVE IT'S GOING TO GOES. NO WE ARE NOT CONCERNED AT ALL. >> GOOD. THANK YOU. >> WE ARE GOING TO MAKE SURE THAT THE GATE I'M SORRY THE DOOR IS CLOSED WITH PLYWOOD SO IT DOESN'T LOOK ALL RAGGEDY. WHEN WE ARE ALL SAID AND DONE. >> OKAY. THANK YOU. I THINK. >> TO YOU WISH TO SAY SOMETHING? >> YES SUE MY PLEASE GIVE US YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS. >> IT IS TIM WALKER, 17TH AND REGATTA DRIVE. I WANT TO ADDRESS TAMMI'S QUESTION. THE ONLY CONNECTION IS THAT THAT BEING THAT THEY SHOWED IN THAT FIRST PICTURE. THAT COMES IN TO THE OTHER BUILDING AND TO THE STANDARD MARINE BUILDING. AND WE HAVE A PLAN TO GET IT OUT. IT IS NOT HOOKED UP IN ANY WAY. IT OR CONNECTED IN ANY WAY OTHER THAN. >> IT'S POCKETED AGAIN. SO YOU JUST MOVE THAT BEAM AND THAT'S REALLY THE ONLY THING THAT IS REALLY PULLING THOSE TWO BUILDINGS TOGETHER. >> WHAT ARE YOU IN CONNECTION WITH THIS PROJECT? >> I HAVE BEEN TRYING TO MANAGE THIS PROJECT FOR A WHILE. I AM REPRESENTING MR. -- TODAY. >> THANK YOU VERY MUCH. >> SO WE HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR THE APPLICANTS? >> CAN YOU TELL US MORE ABOUT THE PROCESS YOU ARE GOING TO? >> WELL FIRST OF ALL, THE BEAM IS NOT CONNECTED ITSELF TO ANYTHING. IT IS JUST LAYING IN THE GROOVE THERE. THAT OPEN SPOT. AND WANT WE ARE GOING TO TEAR [00:25:02] THE BUILDING DOWN WE ARE GOING TO START ON DO IT TAKING THAT BEAM OUT. IT WILL EITHER BE SOUGHT OFF AT THE CONNECTION POINTS THEN THE ROOF WILL BEGIN TO BE TAKEN OFF. AND TRANSITION BETWEEN THE ROOF OF THE OLD BUILDING IS JUST WOODEN TARPAPER FOR TAR AND THAT SORT OF THING. AND JUST DISCONNECT THE ROOF AND WE WILL INSPECTED AT THE TIME WE OBVIOUSLY ALREADY LOOKED AT IT BUT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE ARE NOT PULLING ANYTHING THAT WILL COME OFF THE OTHER BUILDING SHOULD BE ABLE TO SEPARATE EASY. WE WILL DO THAT BY HAND. AND THEN ONCE THE BEING AND THE ROOF IS DOWN AND WE WILL COME BACK AND TAKE THE CONCRETE BLOCKS DOWN FROM THE NORTH END OF THE BUILDING. AS WE GET CLOSE TO THAT TRANSITION POINT WE WILL DOUBLE CHECK IN CASE THERE IS WE MISSED IN THE INITIAL INSPECTION AS FAR AS ANYTHING WITH THE CINDERBLOCKS CONNECTING TO THE BUILDING. WE DON'T BELIEVE THEY ARE. AND WHEN AND IF NECESSARY WE WILL GO WITH SAUCE OR WHATEVER AND MAKE ANY DISCONNECTION IN A WAY THAT IT WILL NOT IMPACT A STANDARD MARINE BUILDING. THE STANDARD MARINE BUILDING, IT IS OBVIOUSLY IT'S IN THE BEST INTEREST TO NOT DESTROY THAT BUILDING HEARD THAT BUILDING BECAUSE IT IS IN THE PROCESS OF A CONTRACT BEING DONE. I DON'T KNOW IF YOU KNOW THIS BUT MR. -- HAS HAD A LOT OF OFFERS ON THE BUILDING BUT HE WILL NOT SELL THE BUILDING OR ENTERTAIN ANY OFFERS TO ANYONE WHO IS NOT GOING TO REFURBISH OR REDO THE STANDARD MARINE BUILDING. THAT REALLY NARROW DOWN THE PEOPLE QUITE A BIT. THERE'S ONLY TWO APPLICANTS THAT AGREED TO KEEP THE BUILDING AND REFURBISH IT. A HAND THEY GAVE A GREAT PRESENTATION AT WHAT THEY PLANS WERE FOR. AND BUT I THINK MR. GOOD SALE, HE HAS BEEN A GREAT CARETAKER OF THAT BUILDING. AND HE HAS HAD THE CITY AND MINDS AND THE CITY'S INTEREST IN MIND AS WELL. AND SHE HAS ASKED ME TO MAKE SURE THAT THIS THING HAS BEEN DONE WITHOUT ANY DAMAGE TO THAT BUILDING OR WITHOUT ANY PROBLEMS. >> WE APPRECIATE THAT. THANK YOU FOR YOUR DILIGENCE. >> I THINK WE CAN OPEN INTO THE PUBLIC HEARING. IS THERE ANYONE IN THE ROOM ARE ONLINE WHO WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK ABOUT THIS CASE? >> ARE YOU ASKING ME? I'M SORRY. >> IF YOU ARE THE APPLICANT'S WE ARE ASKING IF THERE IS ANYBODY WATCHING ONLINE WHO NEEDS TO MAKE A CONTRIBUTION AT THIS POINT. >> I'M GOOD. I THINK I THINK LIKE THEY SAY, WE ARE SLOWLY GOING TO TAKE THIS BEEN DOWN SO IT DOESN'T DAMAGE THE BUILDING, BUT BESIDES THAT EVERYTHING IS SEPARATED WITH THE OTHER BUILDING SO WE ARE NOT CONCERNED, BUT WE CAN HANDLE THIS BEING HERE WITHOUT DAMAGING THE BUILDING. >> GOOD. THANK YOU. SO WE WILL CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING AND WE WILL MOVE IN SUPPORT DISCUSSION. >> IT SEEMS TO ME THAT THE PRIMARY CONCERN IS THE PROTECTION OF THE MARINE TO BE VERY LITTLE CONCERN OF ACTUALLY REMOVING THE EXISTING CONCRETE STRUCTURES. >> AND MY VISIT WITH SAL YESTERDAY I THINK THAT WAS OUR CONCERN, TO MAKE SURE THE PROCESS THEY WERE GOING TO USE WAS GOING TO BE CAREFUL, APPROPRIATE. I THINK MY CONCERNS BUT WHAT I SAW THIS REINFORCE THERE IS ONE THING WITH BEING CONNECTED WITH THE TWO BUILDINGS. IT LAID OUT THE INTERESTING THING ABOUT THE WAREHOUSES ACTUALLY BIGGER THAN THE STATE OF THE MARINE BUILDING ITSELF. WE GUESSED IT WAS PROBABLY 30 BY 100 OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. THE TWO WAREHOUSES AND SO MY SENSE IS THAT WITH MR. WALKER'S ASSURANCES AND OVERSIGHT I THINK WE ARE GOING TO BE WHERE WE NEED TO BE. WHAT WE DID NOT WANT TO HAVE HAPPENED IS AN ACCIDENTAL DEMOLITION WHICH WOULD CERTAINLY BE UNFORTUNATE. AND I KNOW THEY WOULD NOT WANT THAT EITHER. >> INDEED. [00:30:04] >> I DO HAVE A PLAN. >> THANK YOU. MR. CHAIRMAN, THE OTHER THING THAT CAME TO US YESTERDAY WAS THAT THERE ARE SUBSTANTIAL STRUCTURAL AND ARCHITECTURAL NUMBERS IN THIS WAREHOUSE. THIS IS -- TO THE BEAMS IN THERE THAT ARE EXTRAORDINARY. 20 FEET LONG, 14 OR MORE INCHES IN HEIGHT, 8 INCHES IN DEPTH. THERE'S A BUNCH OF STRUCTURAL MATERIAL IN THE ROOM WITH THE JOINTS THAT BASED ON THE PREVIOUS COMMENTS ANOTHER HEARINGS THIS IS STUFF THAT REALLY OUGHT TO BE REVIEWED, NOT JUST SENT TO THE LANDFILL. SO, I WOULD LIKE YOUR OPINIONS OF COURSE BUT MY OPINION WOULD BE THAT WE WOULD ASK FOR SOMETHING MORE SUBSTANTIAL THAN WHAT WE HAVE SEEN IN TERMS OF THE DECONSTRUCTION OF THE BUILDING AS OPPOSED TO JUST A DEMOLITION. >> YOU MEAN THE PROCESS OF DECONSTRUCTION OR WHAT HAPPENS TO WHAT IS VALUABLE? >> I WOULD PUSH ROOF DECONSTRUCTION RATHER THAN DEMOLITION AT LEAST TO THE EXTENT WHICH WE HAVE GOT MAYBE. THAT REALLY DOESN'T DO IT JUSTICE. >> THESE ARE AMAZING. AND SO ARE THE ROOF JOINTS. IT WOULD BE SIMPLE TO HAVE GOTTEN THE LANDFILL. >> MY ONLY COMMENT ON MY UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE SAYING. MY ONLY COMMENT ON THAT IS THAT IT MIGHT BE VERY SUBSTANTIAL PIECES OF WOOD THAT IT WOULD BE A SHAME TO THROW AWAY BUT THEY ARE NOT HISTORIC. THEY ONLY SAY BACK TO THE 1950S YET SO, WE GENERALLY MAKE RECOMMENDATIONS THAT HISTORIC MATERIALS BE SAVED AND RARELY DO WE HAVE ENFORCEMENT OF THAT RATHER THAN MAKING A RECOMMENDATION BUT IN THIS CASE THEY'RE NOT REALLY HISTORIC MATERIALS. SO I MEAN I WOULD HOPE THAT THE OWNER WANTED WANT TO REUSE THAT OR COME UP WITH A CREATIVE SOLUTION BUT I'M NOT REALLY SURE THAT I FEEL LIKE THAT IS OUR JURISDICTION TO MAKE THAT PART OF THE MOTION OR ANY PART THAT WE ARE PRIVY OF TONIGHT. >> SO WE KNOW IT'S FROM THE 50S? >> YES. I SPENT A GOOD TIME TODAY RESEARCH UNITS MAKE SURE BECAUSE OF THE FACT THAT THE BRICK IS NOT STUCCO IT THROUGH US ALL THINKING THAT THIS WAS OLDER THAN IT IS WHAT EFFECT IT DOESN'T SHOW UP ON THE 1949 SANBORN MAPS AND A PROPERTY WHICH MAKES SENSE AND I AGREE. THE MATERIALS THAT HISTORIC VALUE IS NOT THERE IN THE BEANS ABOUT FROM A SUSTAINABILITY STANDPOINT I THINK WE SHOULD CONSIDER THAT. >> THAT MEAN BEING LOOKS LIKE A CLEAR SPANS 20 FEET OR MORE. >> THERE'S TWO OR THREE. >> YES, I HEAR THAT, TAMMI. AND IT'S UNSOUND AND FLEE THE MATERIAL SHOULD BE SALVAGED IF AT ALL POSSIBLE BUT REMEMBER WE ARE THE HISTORIC DISTRICT COUNCIL. I ECHO MR. MORRISON'S WORDS HERE AND LIMIT ON HOW FAR DOWN THE RABBIT HOLE WE NEED TO FOLLOW THE RABBIT. >> COULD WE ASKED MR. WALKER TO COME BACK AND COMMENTS. >> BY ALL MEANS JUST A COUPLE OF THINGS, THE BUILDING IN THE CITY MAY BE INTERESTED IN THAT'S ME BEING THE IT'S NOT SCOPE. BUT, WE OBVIOUSLY IDENTIFY THOSE BEINGS AS SOME PRETTY SPECTACULAR THINGS YOU DON'T SEE VERY OFTEN AND THEY HAVE A LOT OF VALUE. AND SO WE DON'T HAVE A FINALIZED DISPOSITION FOR THEM YET, BUT SOMEBODY'S GOING TO DO SOMETHING WITH THOSE BEINGS OTHER THAN JUST CHECK ON IN A LANDFILL. THOSE ARE BEAUTIFUL BEINGS. AND THEY ARE HARD TO COME BY AND VERY VALUABLE. SO WE ARE GOING TO MAKE SURE THEY ARE PUT TO GOOD USE SOMEWHERE AT SOME POINT SINCE I FORGET THE OTHER ISSUE IS AS FAR AS THE DEMOLITION GOES IN THE CITY, I KNOW AND IT'S NOT UNDER YOUR SCOPE WITH THE CITY HAS A LOT RIGHT NEXT TO MY OFFICE ON 105 FRONT STREET THAT SURROGATES SELL ONSETS WHILE THE CITY BROUGHT THE PROPERTY TO THE SOUTH OF IT. WE ARE GOING TO HAVE ABOUT 15 OR SO, 20 TRUCKLOADS OF CRUSHED CINDERBLOCKS IN CONCRETE COMING OUT OF THAT JOB. AND THERE IS VERY LITTLE REBAR, ONLY AROUND THE FOOTERS. BUT I HAVE CALLED CHIP ROSS AND ALSO TALK TO I THINK MR. GEORGE, [00:35:09] CHARLES FROM RICH ABOUT SEEING IF THE CITY WANTED TO USE THAT RIFFRAFF TO FILL IN THE LOT BETWEEN THE MARINA AND 105 FRONT STREET BECAUSE IF YOU EVER WALKED OVER THERE THERE'S NOT A LOT OF LOT THERE. AND OF COURSE WHEN FRONT STREET WAS AND IS COVERED WITH WATER A LOT HE COULD DO SOME THINGS WITH THAT RIFFRAFF POSSIBLY TO STOP THAT WATER FROM JUST COMING OVER. >> THAT'S AN EXCELLENT SUGGESTION. >> YOU COULD ALSO BUILD THAT OUT ABOUT ANOTHER 15 FEET WHERE COMES IN ON THAT BIG DEPTH THERE. SO JUST I HAVEN'T HEARD BACK, BUT THIS MAY REMIND SOMEBODY THAT THAT COULD BE A GREAT OPPORTUNITY TO MAKE THANK YOU VERY MUCH. ONCE YOU'RE ON YOUR FEET I HAVE A QUESTION OF SOME HISTORY HERE. SAL, YOU REFER TO THIS AS THE BOYS BUILDING TO MAKE WHICH SOUNDS RATHER TO THE WHITES RESIDENCE WHICH IS AT THE TOP OF CENTER STREET, HOY TC BACK DIFFERENT FAMILY. >> MY QUESTION IS, IS THE PRONUNCIATION THE SAME? >> IT IS. >> THANK YOU. OKAY, FOR DISCUSSION. >> I WILL MAKE A MOTION THAT WOULD BE GOOD. >> I MOVED TO APPROVE THIS AMENDMENT HDC CASE NUMBERS 20 2020-51 WITHOUT CONDITIONS AND I MOVE THAT HDC MAKES THE FOLLOWING FINDINGS OF FACTS AT CONCLUSION OF LAW PART OF THE RECORD. THAT THIS AMENDMENT HDC CASE 20-51 IS COMPLIANT WITH THE LIMITED AND THE WATERFRONT COMMUNITY REDEVELOPMENT GUIDELINES TO A WARRANT CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL THIS TIME, IS THAT RIGHT? FINAL. >> TO MY THINKING MR. MORRISON. MR. MORRISON PROPOSES COMMISSARY SECOND? >> I WILL SECOND. >> SECONDED, MEMBER POZZETTA. PLEASE CALL. >> UNDER PROCEDURE WE NEED TO GO TO DISCUSSION NOW ON THE MOTION. >> OKAY, IS THERE ANY DISCUSSION OF THE MOTION? >> MR. CHAIRMAN, I WOULD LIKE TO ADD AND AMEND THIS MOTION TO ADD LANGUAGE PRESENTED AS PRESENTED IN THE PAST ABOUT THE RECYCLING AND REUSE OF THE MATERIALS AS POSSIBLE AND TO REINFORCE THAT THE -- BE SECURED AT ALL TIMES BECAUSE THE BUILDING IS OPEN THEN THE STRUCTURE IF THE WAREHOUSE CAME DOWN SEVERAL OF US HAD TO. [INAUDIBLE] WE HEARD THAT IT WILL BE SECURE, BUT I WOULD LIKE TO SEE IT IN THE MOTION THAT IT IS A REQUIREMENT THAT THE OPENINGS TO THE STANDARD LEVEL HE CLOSED AS SOON AS REASONABLY POSSIBLE. I ASKED MR. MORRISON IF HE WOULD SUGGEST THEN ADJUST THE LANGUAGE. >> AND I ASKED THE OTHER MEMBERS OF THE COUNCIL WHETHER THEY BELIEVE THAT MODIFICATION IS NECESSARY? DO WE WANT TO MAKE THIS VERY SENSIBLE SUGGESTION WHICH I'M SURE WILL BE FOLLOWED, DO WE WANT TO MAKE IT A CONDITION OF THE APPROVAL? >> I WOULD SUPPORT THAT. WE HAVE DONE THAT IN THE PAST. IT'S GOOD TO HAVE IT IN THERE AND BE CONSISTENT. >> OKAY. >> I THINK HER. >> ARM AND I HAVE SOME LANGUAGE IF IT IS APPROPRIATE I CAN READ IT NOW IF YOU AGREE TO IT. >> THAT THE APPLICANT MAKE AN EFFORT TO RECYCLE AND REUSE STRUCTURAL MATERIALS AND TO SECURE OPENING TO THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE THANK YOU. >> I WOULD LIKE TO AMEND MY MOTION TO ADD THE FOLLOWING CONDITIONS, THAT EVERY EFFORT POSSIBLE BE MADE TO REUSE OR RECYCLE ALL EXISTING MATERIALS FROM THE BUILDING AND THAT ALL OPENINGS TO THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE BE SECURED AS SOON AS REASONABLY POSSIBLE. >> THANK YOU. ARE YOU PREPARED TO SECOND THAT? >> I WILL SECOND THAT. >> THANK YOU. >> AND PLEASE CALL. >> MOTHER BECAUSE XP MAC. >> MEMBER POZZETTA? >> YES. >> PFISTER MORRISON. >> ESTIMATES YOUR GARRISON. >> YES. >> THANK YOU VERY MUCH INDEED. [00:40:04] WE LOOK FORWARD TO THE PROGRESS. >> NOW TO ITEM NUMBER FIVE ON THE AGENDA WITH NEW BUSINESS WHICH RANGE WE APPEAR TO HAVE NONE TONIGHT. SO LET'S MOVE INTO BOARD [6. BOARD BUSINESS] BUSINESS. ARE THERE ANY ISSUES THAT MEMBERS OF THE COUNCIL WOULD LIKE TO DISCUSS FURTHER BENEFITS. >> VISIT 4028 STREET IS THAT THE ADDRESS FOR THE HOUSE AT THE CORNER #. >> 402. >> THAT ACTUALLY IS RELOCATED? IN -- AND WE ARE DOING A LOT OF WORK WOULD YOU CONCUR? AND IF YOU HAVEN'T HAD THE OPPORTUNITY TO SEE THE CHURCH WAS A HAS DONE A REALLY NICE JOB. IT LOOKS LIKE THAT BUILDING IS SUPPOSED TO BE THERE. >> AND THE APPROVED PARKING LOT. >> THAT'S ALL I HAVE I THINK YOU. >> I JUST WANT TO MAKE A COMMENT SANDS EXPRESS MY LAB FOR THE ARTICLE THAT SHE WROTE ON THE BUILDING ON FRONT STREET. I REALLY DO THINK THAT IT WAS SUCCESSFUL IN ENGAGING THE COMMUNITY AND EDUCATING SOME PEOPLE ABOUT THAT SITUATION THAT MIGHT NOT HAVE OTHERWISE HEARD ABOUT IT. I APPRECIATE THE TIME AND EFFORT YOU PUT INTO THAT. VERY WELL DONE. >> THANK YOU. I HAVE TO HAVE A SHOUT OUT TO THE TWO PAPERS. THEY WERE RECEPTIVE AND RESPONSIVE BUT I THINK THEY DID A GOOD JOB COVERING IT. >> I GUESS THAT IS STILL IN PROCESS. >> I HAVE A QUESTION ABOUT THE CUSTOMS HOUSE AND SO HPA WHICH WAS RECENTLY IN THE PAPER. IS THAT WITHIN OUR JURISDICTION? >> YES WE HAD ARE WE DOING ANYTHING TO INVOLVE OURSELVES IN THE DISCUSSIONS? >> WHAT ARE THE DISCUSSIONS? >> WELL THE LEAD ARTICLE WAS THAT OH HPA NEEDED TO DO QUITE A BIT OF WORK TO MAINTAIN THE BUILDING. I AM WONDERING WHETHER THEY ARE GETTING THE ASSISTANCE OR ENCOURAGEMENT FROM US #. >> I HAVE NOT SPOKEN TO THEM. >> I HAVE NOT SEEN ANY WORK GOING ON. ARE THEY ACTIVELY DOING SOMETHING? THAT WE KNOW OF? I NEED TO KEEP AN EYE OUT? I HAVEN'T SEEN SOMATIC CELL IS VERY QUIET RIGHT NOW. >> OKAY, THE QUESTION HAS BEEN RAISED BUT NOT YET ANSWERED. LET'S HOPE THAT SOMETHING COMES THROUGH THE EITHER IN THE COMING WEEKS ON THIS. >> OKAY, STAFF REPORT. [7.1 Staff Certificate of Approval - February 2021] SAL, THE LIST OF CERTIFICATES OF APPROVAL THAT WE PROCESSED IN FEBRUARY IS AMAZING AND I THINK BACK TO THE DAYS OF THIS COUNSEL FOR EVERY APPLICATION BEFORE SOMEBODY HAD THE RIGHT IDEA OF ESTABLISHING STAFF APPROVALS. SO THANK YOU FOR THAT WORK THAT YOU DO. THANK YOU FOR ALLOWING US TO DEAL WITH THE IMPORTANT MATTERS. BUT AS THE GUY SAID, I DON'T REMEMBER THE END OF THE STORY. DOWNTOWN DESIGN GUIDELINE EXAMPLE. [7.2 Downtown Design Guidelines Examples] >> BACK WITH THOSE IN THEIR REGULAR REVIEW, LAST TIME WE TALKED ABOUT WHAT WE WANTED TO TALK ABOUT AT THIS MEETING SINCE WE HAVE A LITTLE EXTRA TIME. AND THE WALL WHAT WE TALKED ABOUT WAS RIGHT NOW WE ARE IN THE MIDDLE OF THE OLD-TIME UNTRAMMELED TOWN DESIGN GUIDELINES IN THE ANALYSIS OF THE OLD-TIME DESIGN GUIDELINES WHICH ARE STILL UNDERWAY. THERE WILL BE AN UPDATE SURVEY JUST FOR THE RESIDENTS OF ALL TIME COMING UP IN APRIL. THERE WILL ALSO BE AT THE END OF APRIL ANOTHER PUBLIC WORKSHOP TO DISCUSS SOME OF THOSE RESULTS [00:45:05] AND THEY ARE CONTINUING TO SCAN PORTIONS OF MOTOWN. SO, ONCE WE ARE DONE WITH THAT NEXT YEAR WE WANT TO FOCUS IT IS TIME TO LOOK AT AN OBJECT OF THE JOHNSON 59 AND SO THE DISCUSSION FOR THE BOARD IS, WHAT DOES THE BOARD WANTS TO DO WITH THOSE GUIDELINES? IS IN AN UPDATE, OR REWRITE? AND THEN SOME OTHER CONSIDERATIONS ARE HOW TO GO ABOUT IT WE WANT TO FIGHT FOR HIS GRANT AND HAVE CONSULTANTS TOO? DO WE WANT TO DO IT IN-HOUSE AND UTILIZED LOCAL ARCHITECTS TO HELP US WITH THE DRAWINGS THE THREE EXAMPLES I HAVE GIVEN YOU THAT ONE OF THEM I AM A LITTLE BIASED BECAUSE I WROTE. THE CITY OF ST. PETERSBURG DESIGN GUIDELINES FOLLOW THE OTHER TWO WHICH IS THE TREND IN DESIGN GUIDELINES RIGHT NOW WHICH ARE REALLY MORE PATTERN BOOKS. SO REALLY TAKING THE EMPHASIS AWAY FROM DO THIS NOT BAD TO UNDERSTANDING WHAT YOU ARE YIELDING ENVIRONMENTS IS, UNDERSTANDING WAS THE PROPERTY IS THAT WHAT IT SHOULD HAVE AND I SAID WHAT MAKES A DIFFERENT NEIGHBORHOOD SPECIAL. I CAN SHOW YOU SOME EXAMPLES OF WHAT THAT LOOKS LIKE. IT IS VERY VISUAL AND TEMPLATES UPFRONTS THE HOUSE STYLES TO UNDERSTAND WHAT THOSE STYLES ARE. YOU WILL SEE EXAMPLES OF IF YOU HAVE A CERTAIN TYPE OF HOUSE WHAT THOSE WINDOW SHOULD LOOK LIKE, SO IT GOES INTO THE HISTORY, ALL OF THAT STUFF, COMMUNITY HISTORY, BUT VERY VISUAL. AGAIN SO PEOPLE KNOW WHAT IT IS WE ARE LOOKING AT. HERE IS SOME OF THE VOCABULARY OF WHAT WE ARE DEALING WITH. THEN ECHO ASSENTED DIFFERENT HOUSE TYPES, IT TALKS ABOUT IT AND GIVES EXAMPLES AROUND TOWN OF WHAT IT IS, TALKS ABOUT WHAT THE BASIC STYLISTIC FEATURES ARE. THERE IS A LOT OF DIAGRAMS AND A LOT OF VISUALS IN THIS. YOU CAN SEE DIFFERENT WINDOW STYLES IT GOES INTO DIFFERENT DOOR STYLES. WHAT WE FIND IS THAT A LOT OF TIMES PEOPLE LOVE HISTORIC HOUSES BUT DON'T REALLY KNOW WHAT THEY ARE OR WHAT'S IMPORTANT ABOUT THEM. AND SO THIS STARTS OUT WITHOUT UPFRONTS. SIMONY GOES INTO A LOT OF THE OTHER ISSUES. IT STILL DESIGN GUIDELINES BUT FOCUSED ON THE ACTUAL STYLES. LET ME FOLLOW-UP ONE FROM THE CITY OF ROANOKE ONE IS REALLY VISUALLY LIKE I SAID, THIS IS SOMETHING WE CAN DO WITH CONSULTANTS FOR YOU DID SOMETHING THAT WE CAN DO IN-HOUSE, THERE'S A LOT OF DIFFERENT WAYS TO GO ABOUT THIS AND REALLY I THINK THE BOARD NEEDS TO DISCUSS WHAT IS IMPORTANT TO US AS A BOARD. WHAT ARE WE LOOKING TO ACHIEVE AND HOW DO WE WANT TO GO ABOUT IT? WE HAVE PLENTY OF TIME NOW TO PLAN WHAT THAT WOULD LOOK LIKE AGAIN, VERY VISUAL GIVING THE STREETS MADE SENSE THAT FACTS AND ALL THAT STUFF. THIS IS VERY MUCH LIKE WHEN YOU HEAR THE PHRASE FOREIGN-BASED POEM TO THIS IS VERY MUCH WHAT THAT LOOKS LIKE. IT IS VERY VISUAL TO HELP EVERYBODY UNDERSTANDS WHAT IT IS THAT IS BEING SOUGHT AFTER AND WHAT THE CHARACTER OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD IS YOU AND SO I PUT THOSE THREE EXAMPLES IN THERE FOR YOU TO REVIEW. IF YOU HAVE COMMENTS OR ANYTHING WE CAN TALK ABOUT IT. >> THE ST. PETERSBURG ONE COMMENTED THAT USE EXAMPLES FROM ST. PETERSBURG ITSELF? >> CORRECT. >> THEY ARE SPECIFIC EXAMPLES FROM ST. PETERSBURG. ONE OF THE THINGS I DID AND THAT WAS ACTUALLY WHAT THROUGHOUT THE CITY AND PHOTOGRAPHED THE ARCHITECTURE OF THE CITY SO THE ENDS WE WHAT WE DIDN'T WANT TO DO WAS SHOW DON'T DO THIS EXAMPLE. WE WANTED TO SHOW THE GOOD EXAMPLES OF WHERE IT REALLY SHINES. THAT IS WHAT YOU WILL SEE THROUGHOUT THAT SACRAMENTS. >> I CERTAINLY LIKE THE IDEA OF A DESCRIPTION OF TERMS AND CATALOG OF THE BUILDINGS IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT. THAT ACTUALLY COMPLIED WITH SOME OF THESE FEATURES. >> WHICH ARE GUIDELINES DO HAVE TO SOME EXTENT ALREADY. >> THE ST. PETERSBURG ONE WHEN IT'S IN MUCH MORE DETAIL. IT WAS NICE HAVING IT THE WAY IT WAS ORGANIZED. I THINK IT WAS RIGHT IF YOU DID NOT HAVE TO GO THROUGH THE ENTIRE THING. PICK THE RIGHT TO YOUR ARROW OR SILENCED THAT SECTIONS RATHER [00:50:03] THAN OUR SYSTEM BECOMES ITEM FOCUSED RATHER THAN PERIOD FOCUS. I THINK I LIKE 30000-FOOT THAT SANK COPPER AND THEN YOU ALSO GOT A LITTLE BIT MORE GRANULAR AND HIGHLIGHTS THE SECTION, BOXES, RECOMMENDED AND THEN EVEN THOUGH YOU SAY DON'T DO THIS, NOT RECOMMENDED. THAT MADE IT A LITTLE BIT MORE SOMEBODY WAS CONSIDERING SOMETHING ON THEIR STRUCTURE WHAT TO DO AND WHAT NOT TO DO. AND THEN WHILE I HAVE GOT THE FLOOR, THE OTHER THING I THOUGHT MIGHT BE HELPFUL FOR US AS IT WE COULD EITHER GET FROM STAFF OR FROM OUR PREVIOUS EXPERIENCE, ANY CONFLICTS OR INCONSISTENCIES THAT WE HAVE BETWEEN OUR GUIDELINES AND OUR ORDINANCES. WE HAVE BUMPED UP AGAINST THAT A COUPLE OF TIMES. LET'S TRY TO CLARIFY THAT ONE WAY OR THE OTHER IF IT'S AN ADJUSTMENT ON ONE SIDE OR THE OTHER SO WE HAVE A GOOD. >> I THINK THAT IS A VERY IMPORTANT PART OF IT, REALLY ASSEMBLING THAT LIST. >> I THINK THE BIGGER QUESTION IS, WHY DO WE WANT TO CHANGE THE GUIDELINES #I THINK THAT DATA IS A SUBSET OF WHY WE WOULD WANT TO CHANGE. IN THE INTRODUCTION I HEARD SAL THAT WE COULD COME UP WITH A SET OF GUIDELINES THAT WERE MORE HELPFUL TO APPLICANTS AND LESS DESCRIPTIVE. I CERTAINLY DO NOT WANT TO HAVE GUIDELINES WHICH ARE SO INFLEXIBLE THAT ALL OF THE DESIGNS TURNED OUT AND LOOK IDENTICAL WITHIN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT. THERE STILL THINGS TO BE FLEXIBILITY. >> I THINK WHEN WE ARE TALKING ABOUT IT LAST MONTH WE SAID THAT WE COULD EACH COME TO THE MEETING TONIGHT MAYBE IF WE HAVE CERTAIN THINGS IN THE GUIDELINES THAT WE ALREADY KNOW THAT WE THINK MIGHT NEED TO GET A CHANCE THAT WE COULD START COMPILING SOME OF THAT STUFF. SO I MEAN I HAVE ONE THING I WANTED TO TALK ABOUT IT IF NOW IS AN APPROPRIATE TIMER-WAIT, THAT'S UP TO YOU TO MAKE I THINK NOW IS GOOD TO MAKE I THINK AS WE CONTINUE TO HAVE THESE MEETINGS EVERYBODY BRING TO THE TABLE THOSE ISSUES. >> 12 THE ISSUES THAT I WANTED TO BRING UP IS ON PAGE 57 OF THE GUIDELINES THAT REFERENCES INFILL BUILDINGS AND MY CONCERN IS TO SOME EXTENT WITH THE WORDING OF HOW THIS SECTION IS LAID OUT. I THINK THAT WE HAVE A SITUATION AND THIS GOES BACK TO SOME OF THE INCONSISTENCIES YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT WHERE WE HAVE A 4D THEN THE CENTRAL BUSINESS DISTRICT BUT THAT WE HAVE GUIDELINES IN THE LANGUAGE OF THE GUIDELINES THAT PREVENT ANYBODY FROM ACTUALLY BEING ABLE TO BUILD ANYTHING CLOSE TO THAT. MY SUGGESTION IN LOOKING AT MAY BE SOME ALTERNATIVE TO THE WAY THAT IT IS WORDED NOW IS THE RIGHT NOW IT REFERENCES THAT NEW BUILDINGS IT SHOULD THE SAME NUMBER OF STORIES AND BE WITHIN 10% OF THE AVERAGE HEIGHT OF EXISTING BUILDINGS THAT SAME FROM THE STREET IN PUBLICLY ACCESSIBLE AREAS. ONE CONCERN IS THAT EXCESS WITHIN 10% OF THE AVERAGE HEIGHT OF EXISTING BUILDINGS BUT IT DOESN'T TELL YOU AT ALL DOESN'T SOUND THE SAME BLOCK FOR THE SAME STREET, OR EITHER SIDE. THERE'S NOT ANY SORT OF DEFINITION THERE OF HOW YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO INTERPRET THAT. AND MY GREATER CONCERN IS WHAT IT SAYS THAT THE BUILDINGS HAVE TO HAVE THE SAME NUMBER OF STORIES AS THE ADJACENT BUILDINGS BECAUSE HE'S SICKLY RIGHT NOW AS FAR AS I KNOW THERE IS PROBABLY LIKE THREE-STORY BUILDINGS IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT AND THAT LANGUAGE RIGHT THERE PRETTY MUCH EXPLAINS SALUTES ANYBODY FROM BEING ABLE TO BUILD A THREE-STORY BUILDING IN THE FUTURE BECAUSE HE WOULD NOT BE ABLE TO JUSTIFY THE NUMBER OF STORIES BECAUSE OF THE LANGUAGE BUT IN MY CONCERN IS THAT WE WOULD BE PREVENTING THE POSSIBILITY OF FUTURE PROJECTS THAT ARE WELL EXECUTED AND PROPORTIONAL BY THE SPECIFICITY OF THAT LANGUAGE. I THINK THAT WE COULD SPECIFY THE GUIDELINES AND ENCOURAGE AND SHOW EXAMPLES OF HOW BUILDINGS CAN BE PROPORTIONAL TO THEIR SURROUNDINGS AND BE RESPECTFUL OF WHAT ELSE IS HAPPENING IN CONTEXT WITHOUT SPECIFYING THAT IT HAS TO BE THE SAME NUMBER OF FLOORS. THAT IT HAS TO BE WITHIN 10% OF THE HEIGHT OF THE OTHER BUILDINGS. IT IS 12% NOT OKAY BUT 10% IS OKAY? AND I REALIZE THAT THESE ARE GUIDELINES AND NOT ORDINANCES. SO TO SOME EXTENT SINCE LEFT UP TO THE BOARD'S INTERPRETATION OF THAT. I THINK THERE IS A TENDENCY OF THE BOARD IS TO TAKE THESE AS BEING FAIRLY LITERAL RECOMMENDATIONS AND I THINK WE WOULD BE CREATING A SITUATION [00:55:05] WHERE WE WOULD BE LIMITING OURSELVES AND APPLICANTS IN THE FUTURE FROM BEING ABLE TO COME UP WITH PROJECTS THAT MIGHT BE WORTHWHILE THEM VIABLE JUST BECAUSE OF HOW THE GUIDELINES ARE WORDED. >> THANK YOU. WE HAVE TWO ARCHITECTS IN OUR MIDST HERE, TO PRACTICING ARCHITECTS, I WOULD LIKE TO ASK WHETHER THE ARCHITECT IMMUNITY IS IN A POSITION TO CONTRIBUTE TO THESE GUIDELINES. OTHER POINTS WITHIN THE GUIDELINES WHICH ARE SEEN AS BEING UNNECESSARY OR RESTRICTED CUSTOMER IS THAT A BODY OF WISDOM THAT THIS SUPPORT MEANS FOR CONSULT REVIEWING THESE GUIDELINES? >> I THINK IT WAS HIGHLIGHTED ONE OF THE POTENTIAL ISSUES ABOUT THE FUTURE TRAJECTORY AND LOOK OF THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC AREA AND HOW THE WORDING OF OUR CURRENT GUIDELINES MIGHT AFFECT THAT IN ONE WAY OR ANOTHER. AS I WAS LOOKING THROUGH THE EXAMPLES THAT SALLY GIVEN US, I HARKENS BACK TO SOME OF TAMMI'S COMMENTS FROM THE PREVIOUS MONTH ABOUT WINDOW TRIM AND I FOUND LIKE YOUR ST. PETERSBURG ONE IS A REALLY GOOD EXAMPLE OF HELPING GOING FORWARD WOULD BE GOOD FOR THE BOARD TO HAVE SOMETHING SIMILAR AS A RESOURCE TO BE ABLE TO LOOK TO BECAUSE NOT EVERY WINDOW OR STYLE CALLS FOR SPECIFIC TRENDS. I'M JUST EVEN FROM LOOKING THROUGH THAT YOU CAN QUICKLY SEE THAT CERTAIN TILES HAVE CERTAIN TRIM PACKAGES THAT SHOULD BE ASSOCIATED WITH THEM. I THINK SOMETHING LIKE THAT WOULD BE A VALUABLE RESOURCE. >> ARE YOU SUGGESTING THAT WINDOW TRIM SHOULD BE A CHECKBOX ON THE EVALUATION? YES, ONE OF MANY CHECKBOXES. IT IS SOMETHING THAT THEY NEED BIASES AFFORD AND HAVING A RESOURCE LIKE THAT AS WE ARE LOOKING AT THESE PROJECTS AND REVIEWING THAT WE CAN SAY THAT'S APPROPRIATE OR WHAT IF THEY JUST FINDING THIS A LITTLE BIT IT WOULD REALLY SET THAT STYLE PERFECTLY ARE THE KIND OF THINGS THAT WOULD BE NICE TO HAVE AS A REFERENCE. >> ANYTHING IF LARGELY THE CRITIQUE IF ANY THAT WE GET FROM MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC AS A BOARD IS THAT WE ARE CRITICIZED SOMETIMES AS BEING SUBJECTIVE. I THINK WITH AS MUCH THAT WE CAN'T APPOINT APPLICANTS EVEN AT THE STAFF LEVEL TO POINT THEM TO THE GUIDELINES THAT GIVE SPECIFIC EXAMPLES THAT PUMPS PRESENT PREVENT SITUATIONS WHERE WE LOOK LIKE WE ARE ACTING OBJECTIVELY SOMETHING. >> SOMETHING THAT I THINK THIS COUNSEL SHOULD TAKE A LEADERSHIP VISION AND TRYING TO SHAPE THE DESIGNS THAT ARE SUBMITTED FOR INCLUSION IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT. TRADITIONALLY THE COUNCIL IS SIMPLY JUST EACH CASE, CASE BY CASE AND HAS SAID YES OR NO TO IT UNFORTUNATELY WE HAVE HAD MANY GOOD DESIGNS FOR WHICH WE REALLY HAVEN'T CONTRIBUTED AS A COUNSEL BUT WE AGREED I WOULD SUPPORT THE MOVEMENT IN THIS DIRECTION. >> I THINK FROM LOOKING AT OTHER CITIES WITH HISTORIC DISTRICT GUIDELINES, WE HAVE TO DECIDE HOW MUCH WE WANT TO BE THE GUIDELINES ARE ADVISORY VERSUS STANDARDS AND REQUIREMENTS THAT HAVE SOMETHING OF A ORDINANCE THAT BACK IT UP AND MAYBE WE WORK, IF THERE'S SOMETHING THAT'S VERY IMPORTANT THAT WE FEEL LIKE IT IS THE IMPORTANT TO THE HISTORY OF OUR TOWN THEN WENT BACK IT UP WITH AN ORDINANCE THAT SUBMITTED SOMETHING IT BECOMES LESS SUBJECTIVE THE HANDS OF THIS PARTICULAR ITEM IS SOMETHING THAT HAS TO BE. >> AND I THINK THAT COULD BE SOMETHING LIKE THE MECHANICAL SCREENING SITUATION THAT BECAME A HOP ON A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO WHERE WE STARTE WITH IT STARTED AT HDC BUT THEN RECOMMENDATIONS ARE MADE TO THE COMMISSION NEW ORDINANCES WERE PASSED. EXACTLY DID YOU HAVE. >> AND IF THERE WERE OTHER THAN THE REGULAR POINTS THAT WERE BEING MADE WITH THE WINDOW TRIM OR THE BUILDING HEIGHT, ARE THERE ELEMENTS ON THE HDC GUIDELINES THAT YOU THOUGHT THIS REALLY NEEDS WORK, WERE THERE ANY DEFICIENCIES THAT YOU SAW? [01:00:11] PROBABLY PUBLIC I THINK A LOT OF TIMES THE PUBLIC I GET IS THAT WE READ THROUGH IT BUT WE REALLY DON'T UNDERSTAND. IT JUST SAYS THE SAME THING OVER AND OVER AGAIN WHICH IS IF YOU HAVE ALL MATERIALS, SAVE THEM. BUT IT DOESN'T EXPLAIN MORE ABOUT THAT OR WHY YOU SHOULD BE SAVING THEM OR HOW YOU SHOULD BE SAVING THEM, THAT KIND OF THING. >> AND IF IT RESONATES WITH YOU TO MAKE SO, WE DID A LOT OF PUBLIC WORKSHOPS WITH THAT PARTICULAR PROJECT AND WHAT WE HEARD FROM PEOPLE TIME AND AGAIN WAS THAT THEY WANTED TO KNOW MORE ABOUT THEIR HOUSES. THEY WANTED THAT INTIMATE KNOWLEDGE OF WHAT MAKES THEIR HOUSE THEIR HOUSE AND WHY WHEN THEY WENT TO THE BOARDS AT THE BOARD TELL THEM THAT THEY NEEDED A SPECIFIC TYPE OF WINDOW ALSO, FROM THE PLANNERS THEY ARE BECAUSE I WAS INVOLVED NOT FROM A PLANNING PERSPECTIVE THAT I WORK FOR THE ARCHITECTURAL FIRM THAT DID THAT PROJECT, THE PLANNERS FOR THE CITY FELT THAT THEY HAD GUIDELINES SIMILAR TO OURS WHICH ARE COMMON IN THE TIME THEY WERE WRITTEN. THAT THEY WERE NOT AS USABLE AND DEFENSIBLE AND A GOOD WAY TO ASK LANE TO CITIZENS WHY IT IS WE ARE ASKING YOU SO THAT IS WHERE THAT PATTERN OF INFLUENCE IS THE FOREFRONT AND THEN IT THE BACKUP MATERIAL AND EVERYTHING ELSE AFTER THAT. >> THANK YOU. I THINK WHAT WE ARE HEARING THAT THERE IS A STYLISTIC CONTENTS AND VERY SPECIFIC CHANGES THAT WE NEED TO MAKE NUMBNESS. >> DO YOU HAVE ANY COMMENTS #. >> I AGREE THAT FROM SOMEBODY WITH AN ARCHITECTURAL BACKGROUND THE GUIDANCE AS IT STANDS IS DIFFICULT TO INTERPRET FOR SOMEBODY AND THAT I THINK HAVING AN UNDERSTANDING OF WHY THE BOARD IS ASKING AND CAN SIDESTEP SOME OF THE CONFLICT TO PEOPLE HAVE AN UNDERSTANDING OF WHY IT'S BEING ASKED. I AGREE IT'S PROBABLY TIME TO REVISIT THAT SOMATIC. [INAUDIBLE] >> IT'S HARD TO EXACTLY WHAT THE RESULTS. >> SO, CLARITY OF THE DESIGNER REQUIREMENTS PERHAPS WITH THE DESIGN GOALS. WHAT DO WE NEED TO DO AT THIS POINT, SAL? IS IT TO DECIDE IF WE WANT TO LOOK FOR A CONSULTANT TO DO THAT OR WHETHER WE CAN DO THAT IN HOUSE? >> SO YOU DON'T NEED TO MAKE A DECISION TONIGHT BUT THOSE ARE DEFINITELY DECISIONS THE BOARD NEEDS TO DISCUSS AND THINK ABOUT. >> SAL, WHEN YOU DID IT FOR THE SAINT PETE'S COMMENTED TO WORK WITH THEIR HISTORIC DISTRICT? DID YOU HIRE OUTSIDE? WERE YOU PART OF THE HISTORIC DISTRICTS OR WHAT WAS THE PROCESS? TO MAKE THE CITY CAME TO MY ARCHITECTURAL FIRM TO DO THE GUIDELINES AND WITH THE CITY WE HELD A PUBLIC WORKSHOPS AND WORKSHOPS IT WITH THE CITIZENS WHY THAT'S IT AND HOW THEY FELT ABOUT THE EXISTING GUIDELINES AND WHERE THEY FELT IT WOULD BE A BENEFIT TO CHANGE THEM. AND SO THAT IS WHERE WE DID RESEARCH AND SAW A TREND IN THIS PATTERN BOOK IDEA AND SAW THAT IT WAS WORKING IN OTHER PLACES. OTHER PLACES WERE GOING TO THAT WHEN WE WORKSHOPS THAT PEOPLE REALLY LIKED IT. THERE IS A LOT OF GOOD INPUT ABOUT UNDERSTANDING MORE ABOUT THEIR BUILDINGS VERSUS JUST DON'T DO THIS, DO THAT. >> AND REMIND ME AGAIN, IS THERE A PRESCRIBED TIMEFRAME SET THE GUIDELINES ARE SUPPOSED TO BE REDONE? OR IS IT JUST AN ARBITRARY ARBITRARY WHENEVER IT FALLS INTO STATE? >> THE STATE RECOMMENDS EVERY FIVE-TEN YEARS. >> WHEN WAS THE LAST TIME IT WAS DONE? >> 13. >> OKAY. >> I THINK IT'S AN OPPORTUNITY TO REALLY LOOK AT FROM A PERSPECTIVE OF SAME WHAT TEN YEARS FROM NOW WHAT'S IT WE THINK OUR CITY, WHAT WOULD WE LIKE OUR CITY TO LOOK LIKE AND WHAT DO WE NOT WANT OUR CITY TO LOOK LIKE AND ALSO TRY TO TAKE ADVANTAGE OF SOME OF THE TRENDS THAT WE ARE SEEING WITH MATERIALS THAT ARE NEW SENSE OF THE LAST GUIDELINES WERE WRITTEN 13 YEARS AGO AND THINGS LIKE THAT THAT ARE REFLECTIVE OF THE TRAJECTORY OF WHERE THE CITY IS HEADED RIGHT NOW. >> QUITE HONESTLY, THE RACES THAT POINT RIGHT THERE THAT WE NEED TO HAVE SOME CONVERSATION [01:05:03] AROUND COLOR PANELS IN ALTERNATIVE ENERGY AND HOW THAT FITS IN AND HOW PEOPLE CAN COMPLY. >> I DID SEE SOME OF THE GUIDELINES THAT SAL HAD SECTIONS OF SUSTAINABILITY. >> SO HOW DO WE WANT TO MOVE FORWARD TO GET TO THE POINT THAT WE CAN TAKE SOME ACTION, SO WE NEED TO TALK MORE ABOUT WHAT NEEDS TO BE INCLUDED? >> I THINK IT WOULD BE HELPFUL, SAL, YOU WALKED US THROUGH SOME OF THE EXAMPLES OF THE SCENARIOS OF HOW THIS COULD BE DONE WHETHER CONSULTANTS ARE IN-HOUSE, BUT I THINK IF THERE IS A REALITY OF AFFABLY WHAT IS FEASIBLE AND WHAT ISN'T AND WHAT IS SELLABLE AND FUNDABLE AND ALL OF THAT. SO I THINK IF YOU COULD COME BACK TO US WITH MORE OF A HEARING OF OPTIONS THAT ARE ACTUALLY PROBABLY REASONABLE TO TRY TO GET ACCOMPLISHED AND THAT WOULD PROBABLY BE HELPFUL. I HOPE IT'S NOT IN-HOUSE TO SOME EXTENT BECAUSE I DON'T KNOW HOW WE WOULD DO IT BE HONEST WITH YOU. >> IT MIGHT BE A HYBRID APPROACH. MAYBE THERE IS A CONSULTANT THAT CAN DO THE BIG CALL GLASS LET I THINK THE DANGER SOME TIME WITH OUTSOURCING COMPLETELY IS THAT THEY DON'T HAVE A PULSE ON EXACTLY KINETIC YOU COULD DO SO BUDGET WORKSHOPS. >> MAYBE A LITTLE BIT OF BOTH WE COULD REDLINE BASED ON OUR HISTORY AND WHAT WE HEAR PERSONALLY AND WHATNOT AND THEN WE GET THE LIST OF INCONSISTENCIES WITH THE LDC OUR PREVIOUS CASES AND THEN BACK IT UP TO OUR PRODUCT OPEN SAMPLING. >> AND ASSET HAPPENED IN THE PAST, I DON'T KNOW ABOUT THE HISTORIC GUIDELINES BUT CERTAINLY WITH THE LDC I KNOW THAT MY FIRM HAS CONTRIBUTED DRAWINGS AND ILLUSTRATIONS TO HELP FOR THE WRITTEN CODES I THINK WE COULD TAKE ADVANTAGE OF SOME OF THAT STUFF TO. >> AND THAT WAS ONE OF THE THINGS THAT RINGS REALLY I WAS CITIZENS. THE VISUALS AND BEING ABLE TO VISUALLY SEE WHAT THAT MEANS WHEN YOU ARE ASKING FOR CERTAIN THINGS. SO THIS IS VERY COLORFUL AND ARTISTIC BUT THERE'S A LOT OF DIFFERENT WAYS TO DO IT BECAUSE THE VISUAL WAS VERY IMPORTANT WEEK OF THE PUBLIC WORKSHOPS. A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE VISUAL LEARNERS AND REALLY WANTED TO SEE THOSE EXAMPLES AND WHAT THAT LOOKS LIKE. >> ANY IDEAS IF THIS WAS FUNDING FOR AN OUTSIDE CONSULTANT, BALLPARK OR A RANGE OF COST OR WHERE THAT MONEY COME FROM? >> SO, THERE ARE OPPORTUNITIES, MOST CITIES GET THOSE TYPES OF THINGS FUNDED THE DIVISION OF HISTORICAL RESOURCES ANNUAL GRANT CYCLE TO MAKE IS THAT WHAT WE DID WITH OLDTOWN? MAKE AS TO MAKE TO A TO CLOSE THAT OUT AND FINISH THAT? >> CORRECT. WE WOULD NOT BE ABLE TO DO THIS THROUGH THAT GRANT THIS YEAR OR FOR THE FOLLOWING YEAR. BECAUSE WE CURRENTLY HAVE THE TEXT CENTER GRANTS OUTSTANDING. >> WE HAVE NOT RECEIVED THE FUNDING FOR THAT YET. THE FUNDING WILL COME FROM THAT OVER THE SUMMER AS LONG AS THE GOVERNOR KEEPS IT IN THE BUDGET AND THEN WE WILL HAVE THE NEXT YEAR TO COMPLETE THE WORK TO MAKE SO WITH THE PROCESS UNDERWAY WE MAY OR MAY NOT BE FUNDS THERE'S CORRECT. THAT PROJECT RANKED VERY HIGH. AS LONG AS THAT PART OF THE BUDGET GETS FUNDED IT WILL GO THROUGH. THERE'S ALWAYS A POSSIBILITY TO MAKE GUESTS. >> OKAY CANCEL I THINK WE HAVE AIRED THIS SUFFICIENTLY, LET'S THINK ABOUT IT AND COME BACK TO ITS AT A FUTURE MEETING. >> I THINK WHEN WE HAVE SHORT AGENDAS LIKE THIS IT'S A GREAT OPPORTUNITY TO START TOGETHER THE DISCUSSION. >> ONE ELEMENTS OF THIS THAT REALLY STRIKES HOME TO ME IS THE OWNERSHIP THAT HOMEOWNERS GET WHEN THEY UNDERSTAND HOW THEIR HOME IS CONSTRUCTED AND WHY AND WHAT IS SIGNIFICANT ABOUT IT. IT'S ALMOST LIKE KNOWING SOMETHING ABOUT THE HISTORY RE- OF THE BREED OF DOG THAT YOU HAVE, WHY THEY ARE LIKE THAT. >> I THINK IT MIGHT BE GOOD TO WE HAD AN ECONOMIC ANALYSIS IN THERE THAT SUPPORTS INCREASE [01:10:01] PROPERTY VALUES THAT HISTORIC DISTRICTS. >> THROUGH STUDIES. IT SHOWS, SO MANY PEOPLE FEEL LIKE THIS IS RESTRICTIVE LIKE THE GUIDELINES BUT IT'S RAISING YOUR PROPERTY VALUES. >> THERE IS A REALLY GOOD STUDY THEY JUST HAVE NOT UPDATED SINCE 2015 I THINK. IT'S A LITTLE OUTDATED NOW BUT IT DOES EXACTLY THAT. THAT'S USUALLY STILL WITH PEOPLE REFERRED TO FOR THAT. >> BUT I CONSCIOUS THAT WHAT WAGE HAVE MAINTAINED THROUGH THE ACTION OF THE HOMEOWNERS. >> JUST TAKE CARE OF IT. >> I HAD A QUESTION FOR SALKIND UPON THE RELATED FOR HAVING A DISCUSSION RIGHT NOW. I'M JUST WORKING ON SEVERAL PROJECTS IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT RIGHT NOW WHERE WE ARE DEVELOPING PRETTY DETAILED DRAWINGS OF THEM. IT STRUCK ME AS I WAS THINKING ABOUT IT AND I WAS WONDERING, DOES THE CITY KEEP AN ARCHIVE OF AS BUILT DRAWINGS FOR HISTORIC PROPERTIES HERE IN THE CITY HAS THEY ARE SUBMITTED FOR PERMIT INANE AND THINGS LIKE THAT? IF WE DON'T MAYBE THAT'S A PROGRAM WENT QUIET. JUST IF THE CITY WORKED OUT TO THE ARCHITECTURE FIRMS HERE AND WE LOOK BACK AT OUR ARCHIVES, WE PROBABLY HAVE HALF THE BUILDINGS IN DOWNTOWN ALREADY AS BUILT DRAWINGS. I THOUGHT MAYBE IT WAS A MISSED OPPORTUNITY IF WE DON'T DO THAT IT LETS YOU GET A SNAPSHOT OF WHERE THINGS ARE RIGHT NOW AND IN AN ARCHIVES THAT WE COULD USE INSURED. >> THAT IS A VERY GOOD QUESTION. WE HAVE BEEN ARCHIVING ALL OF THE HCC CASES. WHAT WE RECENTLY LEARNED IS THAT THE SYSTEM OF HOW THEY ARE BEING ARCHIVED IS NOT WHAT WE THOUGHT IT WAS. THEY ARE BEING ARCHIVED BY ADDRESSING THE INPUT AND WITH BUILDING PERMITS WHICH HAVE A LIFESPAN OF TEN YEARS AND THEN DESTROYED. AND SO WE ARE IN THE PROCESS OF RETRIEVING WHATEVER HCC CASES WE HAVE AND HAVING THEM BROUGHT BACK TO THE CITY TO BE SCANNED ACCURATELY SO THAT WE CAN THEN MAKE THAT ARCHIVE. I LIKE YOUR IDEA OF ANYTHING WE DON'T HAVE WE COULD DEFINITELY. >> MAYBE IS THAT OF THE NECK TO BE A PROGRAM WITH THE MUSEUM OR SOMETHING WHERE THEY HAPPEN AND KEEP TRACK OF EVERYTHING AND WE SEE THAT INFORMATION TO THEM. I JUST THOUGHT IT WAS INTERESTING TO THINK ABOUT AND WILL NOT TAKE VERY MUCH WORK BUT WOULD HAVE A VERY LASTING POSITIVE BENEFIT TO THE COMMUNITY BACK I USE THAT A LOT, I REFER BACK. WE HAVE DIGITAL FILES BACK AS FAR AS 2009 FOR OUR HCC CASES. I USE A LOT OF THAT WITH THE RESEARCH FOR CASES WHEN A PROPERTY COMES UP. [7.3 Old Town Fernandina Analysis and Guidelines Update - 2021] >> OKAY. LET'S TALK ABOUT THE OLDTOWN FOR FERNANDINA GUIDELINES. >> THERE'S NOT MUCH OF AN UPDATE FOR THAT, EXCEPT IT IS STILL ONGOING. THE SURVEY COMPANY SURVEY WILL BE GOING OUT CHESTER OLDTOWN RESIDENCE AND THEN WE WILL BE HAVING ANOTHER PUBLIC WORKSHOP ON THEN AND SO THAT IS. THE NEW DOCUMENTS SHOULD COME OUT IN JULY. ONCE THAT SETTLES THERE WILL BE A PRODUCT THAT COMES OUT OF IT THROUGH THE MUSEUM AND THE CITY. AND THEN I HAD ONE LAST THING I WANTED TO BRING TO THE BOARD'S ATTENTION. WE HAVE LAUNCHED STARTING THIS WEEK THE PRESERVATION REHAB ASSISTANCE GRANT. FOR BOTH COMMERCIAL AND RESIDENTIAL PROPERTIES. AND THAT, THAT THAT'S ABOUT THE WEBSITE WE HAVE A APPLICATION ONLINE. IT IS UP TO $5000 GRANTS FOR APPROPRIATE REHAB TO STABILIZE OR REHAB HISTORIC PROPERTIES. THEY HAVE TO BE CONTRIBUTING PROPERTIES IN THE DISTRICT. THERE ARE SOME PREFERENCES, THINGS LIKE THE RESTORATION OF HISTORIC WINDOWS, AND A LOWER INCOME REQUIREMENT GETS A PREFERENCE. BUT WE ARE GOING TO DO IS COLLECT THOSE APPLICATIONS AND THEN WE WILL BRING THEM TO THE HCC TO RANK. WE ONLY HAVE $30000 IN THE BUDGET. SO DEPENDING ON HOW MANY CASES ARE APPLICATIONS WE GET. >> THEY MUST BE IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT OR CRA. >> JUST IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT. >> OKAY. >> THEY HAVE TO BE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES TO THE DISTRICT AND IT HAS TO BE ASKED. >> SO I GUESS IT SAYS THAT THE [01:15:01] APPLICATION PERIOD OPENS MARCH 16. WHAT DOES IT CLOSE? >> WHEN THE MONEY IS GONE. SO MAKE YOUR JUST GOING TO WAIT TILL YOU GET A CERTAIN NUMBER OF APPLICATIONS AND THEN BRING THEM TO ASSEMBLE GO THROUGH THEM IT'S NOT LIKE YOU HAVE 30 DAYS AND THAT IT MAKES NO. MIKE IS A FIRST COME FIRST SERVE. >> IT WILL BE A ROLLING APPLICATION UNTIL THE MONEY IS GONE. THE MAX'S $5000 FOR THE BOARD THAT THE PROJECT DOESN'T FEEL LIKE WE NEED 5000 WE CAN LOWER THE AMOUNT. >> AND WHEN IS THAT -- >> IT IS ACTUALLY A ZERO IT'S A 0% INTEREST LOAN. IT'S A LIEN ON YOUR PROPERTY FOR FIVE YEARS THE GOAL IS THAT THE PROPERTY HAS TO BE IT CANNOT BE VACANT. AND IT CANNOT AND NEEDS TO BE MAINTAINED BECAUSE HE WILL SIGN A COVENANT THAT YOU WILL CONTINUE MAINTAIN THE PROPERTY. IF THE PROPERTY IS SOLD OR BECOMES VACANT YOU HAVE TO PAY BACK THE PRO RATA PORTION OF THAT MONEY BASED ON HOW MANY YEARS IT IS. IF YOU REACH THE END OF THE FIVE YEARS THE LEAVE IS RELEASED AND THERE IS NO PAYBACK. WHILE WE ARE HOPING, ONE OF THE OTHER IMPORTANT PROVISIONS OF THIS IS PRIORITY TWO CASES THAT HAVE CODE ENFORCEMENT CASES THAT ARE IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT SO THAT WE CAN GET THOSE RESOLVED. >> AS LONG AS THE INFRINGEMENT IS RELATED TO MY CORRECT. AND SO, IF THEY HAVE A CASE OF HERCULEAN PAINTS OR EXAMINES WINDOWS AND THEY COME IN AND SAY WE WANT TO REPAIR THEM AND WOULD LIKE $5000 TOWARDS IT, THE HOPE IS THAT WE CAN ALSO I WORKED ON OTHER PROJECTS BEFORE WHERE EVEN A SMALL AMOUNT OF MONEY LIKE THIS CAN REALLY GET THE COMMUNITY TOGETHER TO HELP DO BIGGER PROJECTS WHERE BENEFITING COMPANY DONATES THE PAIN SWORD LOCALS WILL HELP THAT PERSON TO THE LABOR OR WHATEVER. BUT IT IS REALLY THE SEED THAT STARTS THE PROJECT. THAT IS REALLY THE HOPE OF THIS TRANSIT. >> HOUSES BEING ADVERTISED TO CITIZENS? >> ONE POSTCARD GOES TO EVERY HISTORIC PROPERTY AND THEN THERE IS A WEBSITE AND IT'S EASY. THE F EFL .US WHICH THE CITY'S WEBSITE. BACKSLASH TRH THAT IS ALSO WHERE YOU FIND THE APPLICATIONS MAC I KNOW MAINSTREET SHARED IT WITH THE BUSINESSES IN THE MAINSTREET DISTRICT. >> THIS IS A PILOT PROGRAM. IF WE FIND THAT IT IS SUCCESSFUL THERE MAY BE WAYS TO GET FUNDED IN FUTURE YEARS FOR OTHER THINGS OR WHAT OTHER TO CONTINUE THE PROGRAM IN SOME WAY, SHAPE OR FORM IF WE FEEL IT IS SUCCESSFUL EVENT IF FUNDS ARE PAID BACK FROM HIS LOAN WILL THAT GO BACK INTO THE FUND FOR? THAT IS A GOOD QUESTION BECAUSE OF THE CITY'S MONITORING STRUCTURE WE WILL ALL HAVE TO FIND OUT ABOUT THAT. >> , BIKE RIDE TO BUT I DON'T THINK TECHNICALLY IT CAN BE. >> FOR CITY DOESN'T HAVE GENERALLY FUNDING FRACTURES, THAT'S A SEPARATE FUNDING STRUCTURE GENERALLY SPEAKING. >> THAT THE HCC HAS ITS OWN LITTLE OPTO SONIC? >> THERE IS THE HISTORIC DISTRICT TRUST FUND WHICH THIS MONEY IS A SUBSET OF THE HISTORIC DISTRICT TRUST FUND MEDIC. >> COULD BE RECLAIMED TO THE TRUST FUND? >> WE CAN WORK OUT THE HISTORIC DISTRICT TRUST FUND WAS CREATED IN 2015 BUT NEVER RECEIVED ANY FUNDING ACCEPTANCE INITIAL FUNDING. TWO YEARS AGO I BELIEVE IT WAS THE COMMISSION VOTED TO RECAPTURE ALL OF THE FEES THAT WE CHARGE OR COA, THEY ALL KNOW NOW GO INTO THE HISTORIC DISTRICT TRUST FRONT RATHER THAN GOING INTO THE GENERAL FUND. SO THAT A CITY ORDINANCE WRITTEN IN 2015 AND ALLOWS FOR US TO DO THINGS LIKE IF WE HAVE TO DO SURVEYS ARE ARCHITECTURAL EVALUATIONS OF HISTORIC BUILDINGS, WE CAN DO A GRANT PROGRAM AND THOSE TYPE OF THINGS ARE PART OF IT. WORKSHOPS, THAT'S HOW WE CAN FUND THOSE TYPE OF THINGS. >> IS THERE A LIMIT OR A CAP ON WHAT THAT FUNDS CAN HOLD? NO. EXCEPT FOR WHAT IT TAKES IN WHICH IS JUST THE FEES. >> WE WOULD NEVER BE IN A POSITION WHERE WE HAVE OUR BACKS AND WE HAVE TO DO SOMETHING WITH THAT. >> , TRUST THE BALANCE OF THE FUND SMIRK. >> AT THE CURRENT TIME I THINK WE ARE AT $2000 TO MAKE THAT GROWN QUITE A BIT. [01:20:09] WASN'T IT LIKE 27 A YEAR AND HALF AGO? STOMACH WE BEEN BUSY. >> THAT WAS BEFORE OWNING A SMALL PORTION WAS BEING PUT IN. NOW 100% OF ALL FEES. >> AND THOSE SHEDS THOSE HISTORIC SHEDS IN THE PERMIT. >> IS THERE ANYTHING ELSE TO COME BEFORE THIS GREAT COUNSEL? >> I'M JUST GOING TO BRING UP THE WEBSITE REAL QUICK. TONIGHT THIS IS REALLY WONDERFUL BY THE WAY. >> SPREAD THE WORD. WE DEFINITELY -- IT'S A SMALL AMOUNT OF MONEY BUT WE WANT TO SEE THE BIGGEST IMPACT WE CAN KEEPING IN MIND THAT AS A CITY WE ARE HERE NOT JUST TO BE THE BODY THAT SAYS NO TO THINGS IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT. WE WANT TO PARTNER WITH SINS AND PRESERVING HISTORY AND CULTURE OF THE CITY. THIS IS THE WEBPAGE WHICH IS FEF .US BACKS —-DASH DR AG. IT IS ALSO THE APPLICATION WHICH IS AN ONLINE APPLICATION. YOU MAY THINK YOU. >> I THINK MR. MAY HAVE SOMETHING HE'S TRYING TO SAY OVER HERE TO MAKE TO HAVE PUBLIC [8. PUBLIC COMMENT] COMMENT? STAY IN THE KNOW, ON THE GO, WITH THE NEWS 2 APP YES. >> YOU ASKED ABOUT THE PORT CUSTOMER. >> YES. >> SO, I CAN GIVE YOU A LITTLE INFORMATION, WHICH YOU LIKE THAT? >> YES THESE YOU COULD HELP ME UNDERSTAND HOW FOR HBA AS A VOLUNTEER. >> THE PORT AUTHORITY. SURE. THAT BUILDING IS CURRENTLY OCCUPIED BY THE CUSTOMS. AND PRIOR TO ABOUT SIX MONTHS AGO THEY WERE PAYING RENTS AND THEN THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT SAID YOU JUST HAVE TO GIVE US A PLACE FOR FREE AND THEY ARE NO LONGER PAYING RENT. >> THEY SAID THAT TO WHOM? OCEANPORT AUTHORITY. SO THE CUSTOMS OCCUPIES THAT BUILDING RENT-FREE. AND THEY HAVE A LEASE. >> OH PA OWNS THE BUILDING. >> THEY DO. AND SO, THE CUSTOMS HAS ALSO SAID THAT, IN THE NOT-TOO-DISTANT FUTURE LIKE SIX MONTHS, YOU HAVE TO PROVIDE US A NEW BUILDING THAT HAS TO MEET X, Y, AND Z CRITERIA. ALDWYCH THE OCEAN IN THE HIGH PORT AUTHORITY HAVE A SLOW MONEY, THEY ARE DOING DEFICIT SPENDING RIGHT NOW. SO HOW THAT IS GOING TO WORK OUT IS UNCLEAR. WHERE THEY WILL PUT THAT BUILDING IS UNCLEAR AND IN THE PAST THEY HAVE WANTED TO PUT IT ON THE RESIDENTIALLY ZONED LAND ACROSS THE STREET. THERE IS TO LAST WHERE THE OCEAN PORT AUTHORITY IS. THE CITY HAS GONE THROUGH NOW TWICE DENIED THAT ZONING THE BUILDING ITSELF THE REASON I CAME TO ATTENTION ON THE FRONT PAGE OF THE PAPER ALL OF THOSE PICTURES, THEY CAME FROM THE LETTER THAT WAS HAND-DELIVERED TO THE OCEAN HIGHWAY PORT AUTHORITY SAYING THAT YOUR BUILDING IS FALLING APART WE WANT YOU TO FIX ALL OF THESE THINGS. SOMEBODY SAW THAT LETTER AND BROUGHT IT TO THE ATTENTION OF THE CITY AND THE CITY CODE ENFORCEMENT WENT DOWN THERE AND ALSO FILED THE COMPLAINT AGAINST THEM. NOW, WHETHER THEY ARE DOING DEMOLITION BY NEGLECT OR NOT, THAT IS ANOTHER STORY FOR ANOTHER GROUP TO LOOK AT. THE OCEAN HIGHWAY PORT AUTHORITY HAS SAID THE CITY HAS NO JURISDICTION OVER THAT BUILDING AND WHAT THEY ARE CONTEMPLATING SUING IS TEARING THE BUILDING DOWN AND PUTTING A NEW CUSTOMS HOUSE THERE. >> FOR WHICH THEY HAVE NO MONEY TO MAXWELL. >> I'M SORRY. >> LACK OF FUNDS DOES NOT SEEM TO SLOW THEM. >> IT HAS ON THIS THING. THIS IS BEEN GOING ON FOR YEARS. I'VE BEEN GOING TO EVERY MEETING FOR THE LAST FOUR YEARS AND THIS COMES OUT A LOT. >> AND DOES THAT MEAN THE CITY HAS NO JURISDICTION TO THE POINT WHERE THEY DO NOT NEED TO APPLY FOR DEMOLITION FUNDS? >> THAT DEPENDS ON WHO YOU TALK TO. [01:25:04] IF YOU TALK TO THE CITY ATTORNEY YOU GET ONE ANSWER WHICH IS DIFFERENT THAN IF YOU TALK TO THE OCEAN REPORT AUTHORITY. SO THAT IS WHERE THAT BUILDING IS. >> ARE THERE ANY SUGGESTIONS THAT WHY IS -- AWAY FORWARD? MAKE THE BALL IS IN THEIR COURT. IT'S ON PRIVATE PROPERTY. HIS PUBLIC PROPERTY THE OCEAN PORT AUTHORITY PROPERTY. >> IF THEY DEMO IT ON THE BUILDING GOES AWAY DOESN'T BECOME A LAWSUIT? WHAT HAPPENS? >> THAT I'M NOT GOING TO SPECULATE ON THAT BANK IS A BEAUTIFUL BUILDING. >> THEY HAVEN'T, THEY HAVE SAID THAT THEY WOULD BE WILLING TO HAVE THE CITY TAKE IT OFF THEIR HANDS IF WE WANTED TO MOVE IT. THAT WAS ANYHOW SO, THIS ISN'T, IT'S GOING TO COME TO SOME KIND OF A RESOLUTION IN THE NOT-TOO-DISTANT FUTURE BECAUS THE CUSTOMS IS GOING TO UNLESS I GET A NEW BUILDING IS GOING TO LEAVE AND SO. >> WHAT IS THE BASIS IN WHICH CUSTOMS PLAYING THAT OH PA, NEW BUILDING? I THINK I'LL PAY RENT FOR? >> THAT IS A FEDERAL STATUTE. I NEVER BOTHERED TO GO READ ALL OF THAT. >> TO YOU KNOW IF THERE IS AN OBLIGATION? PROVIDER COMPILATIONS? >> IF YOU WANT TO HAVE CUSTOMS AT YOUR PORT YOU PROVIDE THEM WITH CERTAIN SERVICES OR THEY WILL BE ON CALL AND COME UP FROM WHEREVER ELSE THEY ARE. >> SHIPS, FROM OTHER PLACES. A LOT OF SHIPS I CAN'T I JUST HAVE A VAGUE IDEA WHAT THE AGREEMENT IS ABOUT HIS IT HAS GOT TO DO IF YOU WANT CUSTOMER SERVICE THERE YOU HAVE TO PROVIDE CERTAIN THINGS. >> THANK YOU. >> WHAT IS THE DEMOLITION BY NEGLECT ORDINANCE. >> YOU STILL HAVE TO APPLY FOR. >> NO. >> IF THIS BOARD. >> THAT'S A SENTENCE. >> IF THIS FORWARD FINDS IN ANY CASE OR INITIATES A CASE BY NEGOTIATION BY NEGLECT FINES THEN WE FORWARDED ON TO THE CODE ENFORCEMENT BOARD. SO THE COURT ENFORCEMENT BOARD CAN HAVE THAT NORMAL PROCESS. >> THANK YOU FOR THAT. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS ON? PLAY THAT CLEARED UP. >> IT RAISES. >> BUT I BELIEVE THE OHP CHARGER IS SOMETHING TO BE ONE TO THAT. >> IS THERE SOMETHING THAT WE AS A CITY NEED TO BE PROACTIVE ABOUT? I KNOW EVEN TAMMI MULLEN GET INTUITIVE WHO IS RESPONSIBLE FOR WHAT. >> EITHER WAY, THE CITY OR THE BUILDING IS IN OUR HISTORIC DISTRICT SINCE SO I WILL GET WITH CODE ENFORCEMENT AND SEE WHAT ACTIONS THEY ARE TAKING AND WHEN THAT IS GOING TO APPEAR, I WILL GET BACK TO YOU AND LET YOU KNOW. >> THIS IS ALMOST A CASE WHERE WE DON'T WANT TO PUSH THEM TOO HARD WITH CALLED THINGS BECAUSE THEY WILL COME WITH THE DEMO. >> BUT THAT DOESN'T MEAN THEY CAN TAKE THE BUILDING DOWN. DEMO BY NEGLECT MEANS THEY ARE GUILTY OF NOT TAKING CARE OF THE PROPERTY AND THEY WILL BE SUBJECT CORRECT. ALSO IN THE NEXT MEETING THE TRUST FUND ORDINANCE, THAT ORDINANCE WAS CREATED BECAUSE OF THE PORT AND SOME DEMOLITION THEY DID WITHOUT PERMANENT AND THE AGREEMENT THEY MADE WITH THE CITY WAS TO GIVE MONEY TO THE CITY TO CREATE A TRUST FUND FOR UPPER TRAP IS PRESERVATION. >> SHOULD THEY APPLY FOR A GRANT? >> IT SOUNDS LIKE 5000 MIGHT NOT DO IT THEY NEED THOUGH. >> IS THERE A SEPARATE ENTITY OF SUPPORT IS SUPPOSED OH PA? [01:30:05] NO. >> THANK YOU IF WE ARE ALL DONE, I CLOSE THE MEETING. THANK * This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.