Dec 17, 2020 Historic District Council

[1. CALL TO ORDER / ROLL CALL / DETERMINATION OF QUORUM]

[00:00:03]

>> WE WILL CALL TO ORDER THE HISTORIC DISTRICT COUNCIL MEETING OF DECEMBER 720 AT 5:00.

I'M GOING TO GO AHEAD AND INTRODUCE DUNCAN AS OUR NEWEST MEMBER AND ASKED -- AND THANK YOU FOR YOUR WILLINGNESS TO SERVE AND ASKED MS. TAYLOR HARTMAN TO CALL THE

ROLL. >> MEMBER HARRISON. >> MEMBER MORRISON.

>> MEMBER TAMMY KOSACK MEMBER DUNCAN. >> SPICE CHAIR.

>> CHAIR. >> YOUR SEMINOLE EYES FOR THE PLEDGE.

>> I PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA INTO THE REPUBLIC FOR WHICH IT STANDS ONE NATION UNDER GOD INDIVISIBLE WITH LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL.

>> WE ARE GOING TO BE SEA MS. DUNCAN TODAY FOR TWO CASES LIKE THAT OUT ON THAT IS NUMBER

0034 AND 0037. AM I CORRECT? >> YES.

>> SO, MEMBERS JOINING A MOTION? WHERE IS COUNSEL? DO I NEED A MOTION TO SEEK THE ALTERNATE? BY CONSENSUS WE'LL SEE DUNCAN FOR THOSE TWO CASES.

THANK YOU. THAT IS DONE. THE NEXT COMMUNICATIONS.

I'M JUST GOING TO SAY THAT ASSAULT WE ALL GOT AN E-MAIL FROM -- WHICH WAS ALSO COPIED BY MR. SCOTT AND MS.. AND I BELIEVE SOME OTHERS. SO, WE WILL JUST GET THAT OUT THERE RIGHT AWAY. AND THEN, MR. JAMES POZZETTA ANY OTHER COMMUNICATIONS?

>> YOU JUST WANTED SPEAK ABOUT PROCEDURAL ACKNOWLEDGING THANK YOU AND OTHER THAN THAT, NO.

>> I HAVE -- FOR SOME REASON. 2020-37 I HAD A PHONE CALL FROM THE OWNER OR THE APPLICANT AND AFTER THE LAST MEETING AND THEN SUBSEQUENTLY I HAVE STAFF DISCUSSION ON THE CASE.

2020-48 I HAD A DISCUSSION WITH THE OWNERS AND THE NEIGHBORS WHEN THEY TALK TO ME ABOUT IT IN THE STREET. AND 2020-51, LOTS OF STAFF DISCUSSION ABOUT THAT AND I ALSO CALLED FROM SOMEBODY ACTING AS THE AGENT FOR THE OWNER ON THAT CASE.

>> MR. HARRISON? >> I BELIEVE. [INAUDIBLE] ON PAGE 47 I HAVE GIVEN A WINDOW I BELIEVE WE DISCUSSED HIS WINDOWS IN THE DETAIL OF THE

CASE. >> I HAD A -- WHEN WE SPOKE. >> AND THAT LEADS ME TO COUNSEL

DO YOU HAVE SOMETHING? >> I DO REGARDING CLOSURE. >> WE ARE DONE WITH DISCLOSURES.

>> THE E-MAIL THAT YOU REFERENCED FROM -- IF THAT IS INTENDED TO BE A NEXT PARTAKE COMMUNICATION MEETING THAT SHE WANTED TO COMMUNICATE SOMETHING TO YOU OR ALL OF YOU, THE FACT THAT SHE IS NOT HERE TO BE CROSS-EXAMINED AND PROVIDE TESTIMONY, THAT E-MAIL IS NOT GOING TO BE MADE PART OF THE RECORD BECAUSE SHE IS NOT HERE AVAILABLE FOR CROSS-EXAMINATION.

YOU ARE TO LISTEN OR HAVE READ THOSE WORDS. BUT PLEASE CONSIDER THAT WHEN YOU ARE WEIGHING THE EVIDENCE THAT SHE IS NOT HERE AND AVAILABLE FOR CROSS-EXAMINATION

WHICH MEANS THAT E-MAIL CANNOT BE AFFORDED MUCH LEEWAY AT ALL. >> THANK YOU, COUNSEL.

I THINK WE UNDERSTAND THE COUNCIL WELL. I ALWAYS AIR ON THE SIDE OF THOSE IN ANY COMMUNICATION AND INTEREST OF FULL TRANSPARENCY IN OUR PROCESS.

AND I THINK THAT SERVE ME WELL IN 30 YEARS OF GOVERNMENT WE WILL CONTINUE.

THANK YOU. THE CONVERSATION THAT WE HAD TODAY WAS TO SAY THAT HE AND I WANT TO EXTEND OUR THANKS TO COUNSEL TO DIRECTOR GIPSON TO THE HARTMAN AND MCCANN IN TROY,

[00:05:04]

>> WE ARE MOST GRATEFUL. WE THINK YOU DONE SOME PRETTY GOOD STUFF AND WE DO APPRECIATE THE SUPPORT. I HAVE TO TELL YOU THAT HAVING AN ARC IS AT YOUR ELBOW IS A WONDERFUL THING IN THIS OPPORTUNITY BECAUSE WHEN SOMEONE SAYS SOMETHING YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND YOU CAN GO HEY, WHAT WAS THAT? AND HE WILL TELL YOU.

THANK YOU QUALITY SUPPORT. MOVING ON. COUNSEL, WOULD YOU LIKE TO PRESENT A QUASIJUDICIAL PROCEDURE SO WE DON'T HAVE ANY VARIANCES TONIGHT.

MIKE TONIGHT, ALL OF THE CASES WILL HAVE HEARING LB CONDUCTED AS QUASIJUDICIAL HEARINGS.

FOR CITY STAFF, MR. CAMILLA WILL MAKE A PRESENTATION AND INTRODUCE EVIDENCE INTO THE RECORD THAT THE APPLICANT AND/OR THE AGENT WILL COME TO THE PODIUM AND IDENTIFY YOURSELF BY NAME AND ADDRESS AND YOU WILL BE PRESENTING EVIDENCE AND TESTIMONY TO THE RECORD.

IF THERE ARE ANY AFFECTED PARTY TO THE YOU ARE A PROPERTY OWNER OR RESIDENT OF THE CITY, YOU GET TO COME TO THE PODIUM, IDENTIFY YOURSELF BY THEN NAME AND ADDRESS AND YOU ARE NOT LIMITED ON TIME TO SPEAK. YOU WILL ALSO PRESENT EVIDENCE AND TESTIMONY.

ANYONE COMING HERE TO THE PODIUM TO PRESENT EVIDENCE AND TESTIMONY, SAL WILL BE TAKEN AN OATH THAT MS. HARTMAN WILL ADMINISTER WITH ME YOU WILL BE TESTIFYING UNDER OATH.

WE'LL BE CREATING A RECORD HERE AND KEEP A VERBATIM RECORD OF THE PROCEEDING THAT ARE RECORDED. WE ARE NOT MAKING THE TRANSCRIPTS.

THAT IS SENT TO INDIVIDUALS TO CALL IN COURT REPORTERS FOR THAT.

CROSS-EXAMINATION IS PERMITTED BOTH BY AFFECTED PARTIES AND STAFF AND APPLICANTS WITH THE AGENT. WHAT THAT MEANS IS YOU CAN ASK THE OTHER PARTY OR AFFECTED PARTIES QUESTIONS BACK AND FORTH. AND THAT IS MANAGED BY YOU ALL.

YOU CAN ASK QUESTIONS AND ANSWER QUESTIONS. THOSE WILL BE CONSIDERED BY THE BOARD MEMBERS. IF THERE IS AN APPEAL TO BE TAKEN BY ANY OF THE DECISIONS TONIGHT MADE BY THE HISTORIC DISTRICT COUNCIL, THAT APPEAL MUST BE FILED BY THE APPLICANT TO THE CITY COMMISSION WITHIN 30 DAYS OF THIS BOARDS OF WRITTEN FINDINGS.

THAT IS USUALLY THREE TO MY PIPE IS A SAFE AFTER THIS MEETING. ABOUT 35 CALENDAR DAYS WOULD BE YOUR APPEAL PERIOD TO GO TO THE CITY COMMISSION FOR APPLICANTS ONLY.

ANY AFFECTED PARTIES THAT FEEL THAT THEY HAVE STANDING ALSO HAVE AN APPEAL METHOD TO GO STRAIGHT TO THE CIRCUIT COURT. THAT ALSO MUST BE FILED WITHIN 30 DAYS OF THE PORTS WRITTEN FINDINGS. THAT IS FOR ANYBODY THAT CAN PROVE STANDING IN THE CIRCUIT

COURT. ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS? >> THANK YOU, COUNSEL.

MS. HARTMAN, WOULD YOU PLEASE ADMINISTER THE OATH TO ANYONE WHO WISHES TO TESTIFY LIKE A

MONTHLY STAND AND BE IN A STUDIO. >> YOUR RIGHT HAND.

YOU SWEAR OR AFFIRM THAT THE ORAL AND/OR WRITTEN TESTIMONY YOU ARE ABOUT TO GIVE WILL BE THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH, AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH? I DO.

>> THANK YOU, MS. HARTMAN. BOARD MEMBERS, HAVE YOU HAD AN OPPORTUNITY TO REVIEW THE BOARD

[2. APPROVAL OF MEETING MINUTES ]

>> ANY DISCUSSION? ANY CHANGES PLEASE HELP THE ROLE MEMBER HARRISON.

>> YES MEMBER MORRISON. >> YES MAC MEMBER BASIC. >> ICE CHAIR POZZETTA.

[3.1 HDC 2020-0030 - WAYNE CHISM, CHISM DEVELOPMENT CO., AGENT FOR CHRISTINE STEWART, LOTS 3 + 4 BLOCK 11, NEW STREET ]

>> YES. >> VICE CHAIR SPINO. >> YES.

>> WE WILL BEGIN WITH HDC 2020 —-DASH 047. >> A GOOD EVENING EVENING SOUTH MILLER. THIS IS HD SEE 2020-30 WITH LOTS THREE AND FOUR ON THE STREET AND NEWTOWN. IT IS A VACANT PARCEL THAT IS CURRENTLY ZONED OP1.

THE APPLICANT IS SEEKING APPROVAL TO CONSTRUCT A TWO-STORY PRIMARY STRUCTURE IN A TWO-STORY SENSORY STRUCTURE. CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL WAS GRANTED ON THE OCTOBER MEETING.

STAFF BUYS THAT THE PROPOSED DESIGN IS COMPATIBLE WITH THE OLD TOWN FERNANDINA DISTRICT INCLUDES THE SERIAL, SCALE, PROPORTIONS, ORIENTATION OF FACTS.

AS WELL AS IT IS CONSISTENT WITH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE, THE SECRETARY OF INTERIOR STANDARDS ON THE ALL-TIME PRESERVATION AND DEVELOPMENT THAT IS STAFF IS RECOMMENDING APPROVAL OF HDC

[00:10:01]

2020-30. THANK YOU. >> QUESTIONS MR. MILLER?

>> THE APPLICATION SAYS THAT THEY ARE GOING TO USE TGT WINDOWS WHICH WE MAY NOT MADE ACCESS WELL. THIS COULD HAVE BEEN SUBMITTED ACTUALLY BEFORE WE MADE THAT DECISION OF THE BOARD BUT I THINK WHEN IT GETS TIME TO MAKE A MOTION THEY NEED TO USE THE

WINDOW THAT IS APPROVED. >> THAT COULD DEFINITELY BE A CONDITION.

>> REPORTER: I THINK THAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN MORE THAN ONCE. >> OTHER QUESTIONS?

IF NOT. >> I HAVE A COMMENT IN THE APPLICATION YOU LISTED UNDER

ATTACHMENTS BUT -- [INAUDIBLE] >> THEY ARE THE BACKUP

ATTACHMENTS THAT ARE WITH THE STAFF REPORT. >> THEY ARE ALL INCLUDED IN THE

STAFF REPORT. >> THEY ARE, THAT'S JUST HOW WE THEM AS JPEG FILES IN THE WE

COMPILE THEM FOR YOU. >> THANK YOU. >> ANYTHING ELSE, MR. HARRISON? THANK YOU. WE WILL MOVE ON. IS THERE SOMEONE HERE FROM

CHISM? >> YES, THEY ARE ON THE LINE. >> SEE IF YOU CAN GET THEM UP

HERE. WHO IS IT? >> IT.

>> ASHTON TAYLOR. >> ASHTON IS NOW WITH US. >> AND WE SEE THIS PERSON?

>> I DON'T BELIEVE SHE HAS A CAMERA ON. >> HELLO I AM HERE.

>> THAT'S OKAY, MS. TAYLOR, YOU RAISE YOUR RIGHT HANDS AND MS. HARTMAN WILL SWEAR YOU AND.

>> DE SWEAR OR AFFIRM THAT THE ORAL AND/OR WRITTEN TESTIMONY YOU ARE ABOUT TO GIVE WILL BE

THAT YOU COME OF THE TRUTH NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH? >> YES.

>> THANK YOU. WHAT CAN YOU TELL US ABOUT THIS PROJECT ON NEW STRAIGHT?

>> BASICALLY NOTHING HAS REALLY COME FROM THE LAST TIME, I DO UNDERSTAND THAT THEY SHOULD NOT BE USED AND WE ARE LOOKING AT -- WINDOWS, COUPLE OF WEEKS AGO. I THINK THE HOMEOWNER WOULD BE

VERY HAPPY WITH SWITCHING THE WINDOWS. >> DO YOU KNOW WHICH CLASS GRADE OR DESCRIPTOR OF THOSE WINDOWS AT THIS TIME? IF YOU DON'T THAT'S OKAY WE JUST

WANT TO KNOW IF YOU DO I COULD SPECIFY. >> NO.

I HAVE BEEN OUT FOR A COUPLE OF DIFFERENT QUOTES AND I THINK EFFECT YOU ON THAT BUT I DO KNOW

THAT THEY ARE WANTING TO GO WITH PELLA. >> WHAT WILL PROBABLY HAPPEN TONIGHT IS THAT WE WILL APPROVING, IF WE APPROVE YOUR PROJECT I SHOULD SAY, IF WE APPROVE YOUR PROJECT IN WE WILL SPECIFY THAT YOU WILL GET STAFF APPROVAL ON THOSE WINDOWS.

>> SURE. >> AND SAL KNOWS WHAT IT IS THAT WE WILL APPROVE.

IT'S A BUREAUCRATIC PROCESS BUT IT GETS YOU WHERE YOU NEED TODAY WITHOUT HAVING TO COME BACK TO

US. ANY QUESTIONS MS. TAYLOR? >> NO.

>> LET'S GO WITH MR. POZZETTA FIRST MET HI, ASHTON. I LOOKED AT THE FOUNDATION PLAN AS IT REGARDS TO THE ARTICULATION ALONG THE FOUNDATION AND I SEE THAT BASICALLY YOU ARE GOING TO JUST ADD ON SOME LITTLE THREE YEAR BUMP OUTS TO SIMULATE THE PEERS.

MY CONCERN IS, WHEN THAT GETS ACTUALLY DONE IN THE FIELD IT IS VERY HARD TO TELL ON THE WALL SECTIONS THE REAL WHAT THAT IS ACTUALLY GOING TO LOOK LIKE AND HOW IT IS GOING TO BE MADE.

I'M JUST A LITTLE CONCERNED ABOUT WHAT THAT ACTUALLY IS GOING TO LOOK LIKE WHEN IT IS

COMPLETED AND INSTALLED. >> OKAY. I KNOW THAT WAYNE HAS BUILT -- IN OLD TOWN. I KNOW HE WOULD DEFINITELY BE COMFORTABLE WITH SHOWING YOU

[00:15:01]

>> MY CONCERN IS THAT THOSE FALSE PEERS ARE GOING TO PROJECT OUT BEYOND THE WALL FINISH OF THE HOUSE ABOVE IT WHICH IS CONTRARY TO THE WAY IT WOULD ACTUALLY LOOK AT THAT WAS APPEAR, AND OF GREAT PEER BUILT THAT IS KIND OF THE OPPOSITE OF WHAT IT WOULD LOOK LIKE IF IT WAS REAL. SO, I'M JUST CONCERNED THAT YOU ARE PROPOSING TO BUILD SOMETHING THAT IS NOT GOING TO LOOK UP AND TAKE. IT IS GOING TO LOOK WRONG

ACTUALLY IN THE FIELD. >> OKAY. >> WE MAY HAVE A WORKAROUND I'M A MS. TAYLOR I THINK WE CAN FIGURE THIS OUT. GO AHEAD MS. COSSACK.

>> I LIKE WHEN POZZETTA GOES FIRST BECAUSE HE ALWAYS TAKES THE FIRST THING ON MY LIST.

HI, ASHTON. I HAD FOUNDATIONAL FOUNDATION QUESTIONS ALSO.

IF THE CORRECT THAT ON THE FRONT PORCH THOSE WILL ACTUALLY BE YEARS? OR IS IT A WHOLE CMU BLOCK FOUNDATION ON THE WHOLE ENTIRE STRUCTURE?

>> THEY ARE NOT REAL PEERS. >> THEY ARE NOT REAL PEERS? >> OKAY.

>> TO FURTHER WHAT JIM WAS SAYING WITH THE OF FINE FLOW PEERS IS IF THEY ARE ONLY BUMPING OUT 3 INCHES AND YOU HAVE A NOTATION OF A COMPOSITE SKIRTING AND WHAT IS THE DEPTHS OF THE COMPOSITE, VISIT THREE QUARTERS, AN INCH, WHAT WILL BE PUT THERE? WE ARE LOSING A LOT OF THAT THAT AND ARTICULATION A SHADOW LINE IF WE ARE STARTING TO BUILD OUT.

I THINK IF THE INTENT IS REALLY GOOD A LOT OF THIS WILL DEPEND ON THE EXECUTION OF HOW THIS

TURNS OUT. >> OKAY. >> THAT WAS IT WITH THE PGT

WINDOWS. >> I AGREE WITH EVERYTHING THAT JEN AND TAMMI SAID ABOUT THE FOUNDATION. I DON'T KNOW THE PAST, CORRECT ME IF I AM WRONG BUT I THINK THAT WE HAVE PRETTY TYPICAL BE ALLOWED HOUSE IS AN OLD TOWN TO HAVE EXPRESSED FOUNDATION ON THE PORCH IN THE FRONT BUT NOT NECESSARILY ALL AROUND THE HOUSE BESIDES IN THE BACK YOUR I THINK. THAT MIGHT BE AN OPTION. IF THEY WANT TO DO THE TRUE PURE THEY CAN DO THAT ON THE FRONT PORCH AND ALL THE WAY AROUND THE REST OF THE HOUSE.

>> MR. HARRISON, THIS IS YOUR NEIGHBORHOOD MS. DUNCAN? AT THIS TIME.

>> THANK YOU, MS. TAYLOR. I THINK WE WILL TRY TO WORK OUT AND IF THERE'S GOING TO BE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE TRY TO WORK THAT OUT. I'M TRYING TO THINK ABOUT WITH

-- HOUSE WHICH IS UP THE ROAD. >> 7-ELEVEN GARDEN STREET. LITERALLY TWO BLOCKS OVER.

>> I CANNOT ENVISION WHAT WE APPROVED. >> ANY OTHER QUESTIONS TO THE PUBLIC MEETING HANG AROUND IF YOU COULD BECAUSE WE MAKE IT BACK TO I WILL CLOSE THIS SESSION IS THERE ANYONE WHO WISHES TO SPEAK WITH THE GARSIDE CASE 2020-0030.

THANK YOU. WE WILL CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING AND MOVE INTO FOR DISCUSSION.

BOARD MEMBERS, I THINK WITH REGARDS TO WINDOWS I WOULD BE COMFORTABLE SPECIFYING PELLA AND HAVING THE STAFF APPROVE THEM IF THEY'RE GOING TO BE CONSISTENT WITH THEM BEING LIT UP BEFORE.

THE FOUNDATION ISSUES WOULD YOU LIKE SOME SENSE OF WHAT YOU WOULD LIKE TO SEE HAPPEN.

>> I DON'T HAVE A GOOD SENSE AND HOW TO PUT INTO A MOTION HOW TO ENSURE THERE IS A CHECK AND

[00:20:04]

BALANCE WITHOUT THEM. >> IS THAT SOMETHING YOU WOULD LIKE TO CONTINUE I FEEL LIKE IT'S A VERY NICELY DESIGNED HOUSE AND THE OTHER REQUIREMENTS AND EVERYTHING LIKE THAT.

I JUST OPEN TO YOUR SUGGESTIONS BUT I DON'T KNOW HOW ELSE TO HANDLE THE FOUNDATION ISSUE AS

JIM SAID, IT'S JUST NOT RIGHT RIGHT NOW. >> AND THIS IS AN ISSUE THAT HAS BEEN COMING TO US AGAIN AND IT AND IT'S AFTER THE FACT THAT THIS IS AN IMPORTANT FEATURE OF THE HOUSE ESPECIALLY WERE SUPPOSED TO BE EXPRESSED AND IF IT IS DONE POORLY THAT IS A BAD

THING. >> JIM? >> I FEEL LIKE THIS HOUSE IS ON THE ORDER LIVE. SO, IT IS VIEWED FROM TWO STREETS.

A NICE FEATURE OF THE HOUSE IS THAT IT HAS A WRAPAROUND PORCH THAT ADDRESSES BOTH READ.

IN MY MIND, THE PORCH WAS EXPRESSED ON ACTUAL REAL PIERS, THAT WOULD GO A LONG WAY TOWARDS THIS HOUSE PRESENTING ITSELF WITH THE P OR FOUNDATION TECHNIQUE BUT MAY BE THE MAIN HOUSE COULD JUST REMAIN AND NOT HAVE THESE FOLKS YEARS TO PUT IT BUT THE PORCH BECAUSE IT'S A SIGNIFICANT IT'S THE FIRST THING THAT YOU VIEW. IN MY MIND THAT WOULD GO AWAY TOWARDS MITIGATING AND CERTAINLY WOULD BE PREFERABLE TO WHAT IS CURRENTLY PRESENTED.

>> I THINK THAT IS CONSISTENT WITH WHAT WE HAVE DONE WITH OTHER PROJECTS.

WE'VE HANDLED IT DIFFERENTLY WITH A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT STANDARDS IN OLD TOWN WE HAVE

BEEN FLEXIBLE. >> I WONDER IF FROM A CONSTRUCTION STANDPOINT IF HE WAS INTENDED TO HAVE COMPOSITE HE WOULD HAVE SOME WISE STANDS THERE.

WE WOULD HAVE SOME FLAP ABILITY, AND HE IS GOING HAVE TO MAYBE HAVE SOMETHING BEHIND IT AND STILL MELTED ON TOP OF IT. HE HAS A SEVEN OR 8-FOOT SPAN BETWEEN THOSE PIERS.

WE DON'T KNOW WHAT THE COMPOSITE LOOKS LIKE SO, I DON'T KNOW HOW WE PUT THAT INTO SOMETHING.

>> MS. DUNCAN, DO YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS OR CONCERNS? >> IT SOUNDS TO ME LIKE WERE HAVING A HARD TIME GETTING TO A PLACE THAT WE CAN PUT SOMETHING IN MOTION TO GET US WHERE WE NEED TO BE. AS MUCH AS WE DISLIKE CONTINUATIONS, I'M ALWAYS TRYING TO LOOK AT CONSENSUS WE DON'T WANT TO TWIST ANY ARMS SO WE GET SOMETHING WE DON'T LIKE WHICH IS ALSO NOT A GOOD IDEA BUT I, SET THE SPEC THEY WOULD LIKE TO GET IT DONE.

>> OF THE COMPOSITE BE A STEP IF THERE SO WHAT THEY'RE INTENDING. WHAT IT'S USED ARE MADE UP OF

COULD THAT BE A STAFF APPROVAL. >> AND WOULD STAFF BE COMFORTABLE?

>> I WOULD ASK FOR A DETAIL ON WHAT THAT ACTUAL ARTICULATION WOULD BE THIS IS A VERY INTERESTING PRODUCT. THEY'VE DONE A NICE JOB ON THIS THEY'VE DONE THERE'S JUST ONE DETAIL WE NEED TO GET PAST. THEY COULD BE WORKING ON THAT WHILE WE ARE GOING FORWARD AND IT WOULD NOT SLOW DOWN THEIR TIMELINE WHICH I ALWAYS THINK IS NICE.

IF WE CAN GET WHAT THEY WANT THEY CAN GET WHAT THEY WANT. >> I THINK I HAVE HEARD INSIDE OF THEIR POTENTIALLY EMOTION THAT WOULD INCLUDE SOME BETTER DRAWINGS, SOME BETTER REPRESENT REPRESENTATION OF WHAT THAT WOULD LOOK LIKE DO YOU FEEL COMFORTABLE.

>> IT MAY BE JUST LET ME POSE TO THE REST OF THE BOARD. >> I DON'T WANT TO FORCE THE DIRECTION ON THEM, MAYBE THEY WOULD HAVE SOME FEEDBACK FOR US BEFORE WE THROW MOTION OUT THERE FOR CONSIDERATION. PERHAPS ASHTON MIGHT HAVE SOME THOUGHTS ON WHAT THEY ARE WILLING TO MAKE IT HAVE YOU BEEN ABLE TO FOLLOW WHAT WE BEEN SAYING.

[00:25:01]

>> ABSOLUTELY I THINK THE HOMEOWNERS ARE OPEN TO LISTENING TO ALL IDEAS AND I ALSO THINK THEY ARE ANXIOUS TO START THE BUILDING PROCESS AND WOULD BE OPEN TO MAKING ANY CHANGES THAT WOULD MAKE YOUR PLANS TO BE MORE HISTORIC PERK OR CHANGING TO THEM BEING A REAL PEER I DON'T

THINK IT WOULD BE OF ISSUES THE CLIENT. >> IN THAT CASE WE WOULD PROBABLY BE READY FOR PIERS. WHAT I HEAR IS I CAN THAT WE CAN PROBABLY MOVE THAT.

THE WORST CASE SCENARIO YOU CAN COME BACK IF THINGS SO FLY IN YOUR PROCESS AND WE TO GET THROUGH HERE TONIGHT. MY SENSE IS THAT FOLKS GENERALLY LIKE THIS PROJECT.

WITH SOMEBODY LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION? >> YES.

>> CAN I MAKE ONE COMMENT? >> I JUST WANTED TO COMMENTS BECAUSE WE DID GET A LOT OF E-MAILS THIS WEEK REGARDING THE E-MAILS OF TREES IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT.

I JUST WANT TO MAKE A POINT ON THE RECORD THAT THIS PROJECT AT LEAST ACCORDING TO MY CALCULATIONS WILL REQUIRE THE REMOVAL OF 114 INCHES OF TREES. I JUST WANTED TO PUT THAT IN THE RECORD THERE IS A 20 IN CHO, 22-INCH SHOW, 20-INCH THEATER IN A 24-INCH THEATER ALL COMING OUT FROM THIS PROJECT THAT'S IT. WE WILL GIVE MR. POZZETTA A MOMENT TO WRITE A MOTION.

>> I WOULD JUST LIKE TO ASK THE BOARD TO BE VERY CLEAR IN YOUR MOTION EVEN IF YOU'RE GOING TO ACCEPT APPEAR FOUNDATION WHETHER THAT BE JUST THE FRONT PORCH, THE FRONT ELEVATION AND WHAT

HAPPENS ON THE SIDES AND REAR. >> YOU CAN HEAR MOTION BEFORE IT BECOMES A MOTION.

SO WHAT LANGUAGE WERE YOU THINKING OF? MY THOUGHT IS EVEN IN LOOKING AT THE ELEVATIONS THE THE TALLEST FOUNDATION ELEMENT ALSO HAPPENS TO BE THAT BECAUSE OF THE WAY THE TOPOGRAPHY GOES AT THAT PORCH IS EVEN MORE ACCENTUATED BY ACCENTUATING IN ON THE PORCH TO HAVE PURE ELEMENTS, ACTUAL PURE ELEMENTS ON IT AND IT HIDES EVEN MORE OF THE FOUNDATION AS IT GOES AROUND THE HOUSE IN THE REAR OF THE PACK. SO, IN MY MIND IT BECOMES LESS IMPORTANT THOSE AREAS BECAUSE WE ARE TALKING ABOUT MAY BE A FOOT OF EXPOSED FOUNDATION AROUND THE SIDES AND REAR BUT ON THE FRONT IT'S ALMOST 2 FEET PEER REALLY, WE ARE GETTING THE MOST VISUAL THING FOR OUR BUCK THERE AT THE FRONT TO THE FRONT CORNER. WHICH IS A PORCH.

IF THE PORCH WAS GIVEN THAT TREATMENT I THINK THAT WOULD ENHANCE THE HOUSE.

>> OKAY. I THINK THERE IS CONSENSUS. >> I CAN'T SCROLL THROUGH US HE WAS BEING PRESENTED IS THIS IS ON GRADE OR ABOVE GRADE? IT LOOKS LIKE IT'S A COUPLE FEET

ABOVE GRADE. >> IS THAT UNUSUAL LOCK. >> I AM ASKING WHAT IS THE

GROUND FLOOR, IS IT A SUSPENDED FLOOR? >> IT'S A SLAB.

>> SO, CHANGE ANYTHING? YES, DOES. >> DO YOU WANT TO ARTICULATE

THAT A LITTLE BIT? >> I GUESS THE PROBLEM THAT I HAVE IS DOWN THE LINE REQUIREMENTS IN THE OLD TOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT IS -- AND PROGRESSIVELY WERE GETTING MORE

AND MORE. >> I GOT YOU. >> I WOULD PREFER TO SEEEAL

AND GREAT TERMINOLOGY. >> WITH ENGINEERING DETAILS. >> I DON'T KNOW THAT THE CODE

[00:30:18]

ACTUALLY REQUIRES YOU TO BE OF GREAT. >> I BELIEVE HOW IT IS STATED IS

THE ELEVATED FOUNDATION. IT COULD BE A STONEWALL. >> IT DOES THE GUIDELINE HAVE ANY LANGUAGE THAT IS SPECIFICALLY TALKED ABOUT TO KIND OF ACT BOWS PIERS OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT? I THOUGHT EXHIBIT MAYBE IT DOESN'T.

MAYBE A SEAL TIME GUIDELINES. >> I BELIEVE IT DOES TALK ABOUT TRADITIONAL PEER FOUNDATION BUT IT DOES ALLOW FOR SLAB NOT SLAB ON GRADE, SLAB FOUNDATION WITH A SET WALL AS LONG AS IT IS

ELEVATED. >> DOESN'T APPEARS ON THE PORCH WRAPAROUND ON THE NEW STREETSIDE

GET US WHAT WE ARE LOOKING FOR? >> PERSONALLY I THINK THAT'S AN ACCEPTABLE COMPROMISE.

>> JIM. >> FOR CONSIDERATION OF THE BOARD MAY MOTION WITH A, LET'S ALLOW THEM TO CHANGE THE WINDOWS AND HAVE THEM REVIEW AND DETERMINE WHETHER IT IS WORTHY OF GRANTING APPROVAL AND THEN ALSO THAT THEY REVISE THE FOUNDATION DETAILING TO BETTER EXPRESS REAL PEER CONSTRUCTION ESPECIALLY AT THE FRONT PORCH. IT WOULD BE GREAT IF THEY DID IT AROUND THE ENTIRE HOUSE ACT BUT I DON'T KNOW IF IT HAS TO BE THE WHOLE HOUSE SPECIFICALLY YOU CAN

USE THE WRAPAROUND PORCH. >> YOU WANT THAT DRAWN TO INCLUDE WHAT THAT SCREEN WILL

BE? >> YOU SHOULD PROVIDE A DETAIL THAT WOULD INFORM STAFF ON WHAT THE CONSTRUCTION OF THAT SKIRT GLADYS ELEMENT IS AND HOW IT WILL BE PUT TOGETHER.

>> THAT SOUNDS GOOD. AND ARE YOU COMFORTABLE WITH THEM.

WERE NOT ASKING TO DO WHAT YOU WANT TO DO. DIRECTOR GIBSON YOU CAN ALWAYS

BRING IT BACK. >> MISREPRESENTED. >> I MOVED TO APPROVE CASE NUMBER HDC 2020-30 WITH THE FOLLOWING CONDITIONS, THAT THE WINDOWS SERVER THE PROJECT BE CHANGED FROM PGT TO WINDOW TO BE REVIEWED AND ADJUDICATED BY STAFF THAT FITS WITHIN THE OLD TOWN APPROVED WINDOW SELECTIONS, THAT THE PEER DETAILING ESPECIALLY AT THE WRAPAROUND FROM PORCH BE REVISED TO BETTER EXPRESS TRUE PIERS AND THAT IT DETAIL BE PROVIDED SHOWING THE CONSTRUCTION OF THE INFILL LETTER THAT GOES BETWEEN THE PIERS AND THAT THESE ELEMENTS BE REVIEWED BY STAFF. I MOVED THAT HDC MAKE THE FOLLOWING FINDINGS OF FACT AND THAT ALLOW PART OF THIS THAT CASE HDC 2020-30 HAS PRESENTED IS SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANCE WITH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT OF, THE SECRETARY OF INTERIOR SEE THE OLD TOWN PRESERVATION IN THE DEVELOPMENT GUIDELINES IT TO WARRANT FINAL APPROVAL AT THIS TIME.

>> SECOND. >> MOVE POZZETTA, SECOND KOSACK COMMITTEE DISCUSSION?

PLEASE CALL THE ROLL. >> COMPARISON. >> YES.

>> HARRISON. >> YES. >> POZZETTA.

>> YES. >> SPINO. >> ESTIMATE MOVING ON TO HDC

2020-34, COTNER ASSOCIATES. >> I SHOULD'VE FOLLOWED UP. SHE WILL TALK TO SAL ANYWAY.

I THINK SHE GOT APPROVED. THAT'S THE MOST IMPORTANT THING. THANK YOU.

[3.2 HDC 2020-0034 - COTNER ASSOCIATES, INC., AGENT FOR ARTISAN HOMES, LLC., LOTS 2 + 3 + 4 BLOCK 8, N. 2ND STREET]

[00:35:02]

CONCEPTUALLY. >> CORRECT. >> THIS IS THE PROPERTY IN THE BLOCK JUST NORTH OF BROOME. IT IS BETWEEN RUBEN, BROOME AND CALVIN.

I THINK OF IT AS A COUPLE OF DOORS DOWN. >> PLEASE GO AHEAD.

>> THIS IS HDC 2020-34. THE PROPERTY LOCATED IN THE 200 BLOCK OF SECOND STREET.

THE CURRENT ZONING IS C3 CENTRAL BUSINESS DISTRICT. THE APPLICANT IS SEEKING APPROVAL TO CONSTRUCT A TWO-STORY -- I'M SORRY TO BECOME A THREE-STORY SINGLE FAMILY IT IS LOCATED WITHIN THE WATERFRONT REDEVELOPMENT AREA. THE PROPOSED STRUCTURES ARE COMPLIANT WITH THE RA GUIDELINES AND STAFF FIND THE REQUESTED ACCESS PRESENTED IS SUBSTANTIALLY CONSISTENT WITH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE, THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR STANDARDS AND THE WATERFRONT COMMUNITY REDEVELOPMENT AREA. STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL OF HDC

2020-34. >> REMIND ME OF THE UNDERLYING GUIDELINES FOR THIS NEIGHBORHOOD

>> THE COMMUNITY REDEVELOPMENT GUIDELINES THE CRA GUIDELINES. >> THEY ARE IN SECTION EIGHT OF OUR MANUAL. THANK YOU. THAT DOES LEAD TO A WHOLE

DIFFERENT SET OF EXPECTATIONS I THINK. >> CORRECT AND IT IS IMPORTANT TO REMEMBER THAT QUESTIONS? HEARING NONE, WE ALL GOING TO PRETEND THAT BENJAMIN IS NOT AT THE TABLE BECAUSE WE HAVE NO OTHER PLACE TO PUT IN. MR. COTNER COTNER IS HERE.

MONTHS. >> GOOD EVENING, JOHN COTNER, SEVEN RATNER AVENUE.

THIS HAS NOT CHANGED MUCH FROM THE PRELIMINARY TWO MONTHS AGO. THERE WERE ONLY A COUPLE OF CHANGES. WHEN WE NOTIFIED SAL VIA E-MAIL BASED ON YOUR DECISION RECENTLY LAND BEFORE YOU MADE A DECISION ABOUT P GT WINDOWS WE OPTED TO GO -- AND THAT IS ON THE RECORD.

FOR THE LAST MEETING MORE SCHEMATICS HAVE SHOWN BRICK FIRST LEVEL, WE CONVERTED BACK TO STUCCO. SIMILAR TO WHAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN NEXT OR IF IT EVER GETS PERMITTED. BUT. OTHER THAN THAT, AND HIS COME THROUGH THE MILL. IT IS JUST DEVELOPMENT OF THE PLANS AND EVERYTHING STAYED CONSISTENT. THE COLOR PALETTE THAT YOU HAVE NOW IS BASICALLY GRAY CAFTAN SCHEME CONSISTENT TRIM COLOR BUT SLIGHTLY VARYING BODY COLORS. AND GILLETTE HAS DONE THE DRAINAGE PLAN WHICH IS REQUIRED BECAUSE THERE'S NO STORM DRAINAGE IN THIS AREA.

IT WILL BE CONTAINMENT BELOW THE PARKING AREA WHERE THE DRIVER BETWEEN THE TWO GARAGES.

OTHER THAN THAT, IT IS A SIMPLE DEVELOPMENT FROM THE LAST TIME WE LOOKED AT IT BUT I WILL TAKE

QUESTIONS IF YOU HAVE ANY. >> QUESTIONS? >> I DUE.

>> PULLED ON A SECOND. I FEEL LIKE WE PUT THESE GUYS ON HERE.

IF YOU KNOW MY. MISS DUNCAN ANY QUESTIONS? >> NO.

>> MR. HARRISON? >> NO. >> JOHN COME ON THE WINDOWS WILL THEY HAVE THE SAME GRID ORIENTATION AND EVERYTHING WITH TWO OVER TWO?

>> YES, SAME MUD CONFIGURATION EXPRESSED A BIG RELEASE MAKE THE ONLY THING THAT WOULD CHANGE ON THE PLANTS IS DOUBLE OF WHAT THEY ARE GOING TO A SINGLE HOME? YES.

>> AND THEN I'M CURIOUS AS TO HOW THIS COMPARES TEXTURALLY WITH THE PAGE PROJECT NEXT TO?

>> THEY ACTUALLY GAVE A CONTEXT DOCUMENT TO SAL SHOWING THE TWO OF THEM COMBINED WHEN THEY'RE BOTH AT THE 35-FOOT HEIGHT. ONE BE IN A FLAT ROOF WITH PAGE AS A FLAT ROOF IN THIS AREA IS TO THE EXTREME POINT. THEY CAN'T GO ABOVE ANYTHING. THIRTY-FIVE IS THE CAT.

SO, THE PAGES AT 22 - 24 IS A FLAT AND THIS IS AT THE TOP LEVEL SO, IT'S 35 TO THE PEAK.

UNDER 3534 AND A HALF. >> THINK I REMEMBER THE MASSING OF THE PAGE WAS SIMILAR TO THIS

[00:40:07]

FROM THE FRONT? >> THEY ALL TAKE ON A VERTICAL PROPORTION I WOULD SAY THE WAY

THEY ARE BROKEN UP. DO YOU HAVE THAT COMPOSITE? >> I'M NOT.

>> IT SEEN IT. >> WE SENT IT TO YOU WITH A LIMITED PACKAGE.

>> I CAN PULL IT UP. >> ON THE ISOMETRICS OR EVEN ON SOME OF THE PLANNED ELEVATIONS IS THE HOG BOARD IN THE BATH WITH THAT BE USED AS A RETAINING WALL OR ABOVE GRADE.

>> THAT IS ABOVE GRADE. IT IS A HOG BOARD AND THAT IS JUST CREATING A COURTYARD

PRIVACY. >> IT'S IT'S AT ANDRE, NOT HOLDING ANYTHING DOWN LIKE WHAT WE HAVE DONE THE STEPS OF THE SIDEWALK ABOUT 2 FEET TO GET AT THE PORCH LEVEL AND ANOTHER 2 FEET TO GET TO THE GARAGE LEVEL. THERE'S ABOUT A 6-FOOT FALL ON

THESE PROPERTIES FRIENDS BACK. >> AND THEN MY NEXT QUESTION OF COURSE IS GOING TO BE ON THE BACK OF THE PROPERTY THE NOTATIONS FOR THE TREES ON THE BACK OF IT HAVE THEM WITH THIS WIGGLE IS THAT BEING SAVED WHERE THEY ARE NOT IMPORTANT ON THE VERY REAR? THE ONES BEHIND THE GARAGES ARE TO BE SAVED. THERE IS ONE TO BE HIT ON THE EDGE OF THE GARAGE SO THEY ARE GONERS, BUT I THINK THERE THREE OR FOUR.

>> THERE WERE FOUR THAT WAS OUTSIDE THE BUILDING. >> IF THEY ARE THE ONES THAT ARE

DEPICTED THEN THERE IS NO ACT ON THEM. >> UNLESS WE FIND SOMETHING THAT IS UNUSUAL. BUT RIGHT NOW THE GAME PLAN IS TO.

>> THAT IS IT FOR ME. >> THERE'S YOUR COMPARISON. >> SO, WE ARE EXPANDING RESIDENTIAL IN THIS OTHER STILL A VACANT LOT IMMEDIATELY TO THE SOUTH.

>> IT WOULD BE GREAT TO SEE SOMETHING HAPPEN. >> IT SURE WE HAVE APPROVED A

LOT OF PLANS. >> NOT MUCH IS HAPPENING. >> I WOULD JUST LIKE TO COMMENT THAT I THINK SOME OF THE DETAILING IS NINE UNLIKE THE EXPOSED -- AND I JUST HOPE THOSE ARE THE TYPES OF THINGS THAT WE SEE FALL THROUGH THE LESION UNTIL GET EDITED OUT BY VALUE ENGINEERING OR SOMETHING AFTER THIS LEADS YOUR HANDS AND LEADS TO THE CONTRACTOR THAT REALLY BRINGS CHARACTER TO THIS PROJECT AND I HOPE THAT IT CONTINUES THROUGH.

>> ONE THING THAT'S DIFFERENT IS THEY HAVE ASKED US TO TAKE IT ALL THE WAY THROUGH COMPLETION AND THE FOUNDATION OF THE WHOLE 9 YARDS. AND THEY HAVE EVEN SAID SURE WE HAVE DETAILS ON THE RAFTER TALES OF THE GUARDRAILS AND THEY HAVE ASKED FOR THE DETAILS AND WERE

GOING TO GIVE THEM THE DETAILS. WHICH IS ENCOURAGING. >> YES.

>> I'M GOING TO OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING. JOHN YOU LOST YOUR CHAIR.

>> THERE'S. >>> 2020 —-DASH 0034, IS THERE ANYONE WHO WISHES TO THIS CASE?

ANYBODY ONLINE WISHES TO SPEAK TO THIS CASE? >> I DO NOT SEE ANYONE ONLINE.

>> WE ARE GOING TO SUPPORT DISCUSSION. WHAT IS YOUR PLEASURE?

>> I THINK IT SHOULD BE APPROVED. >> FOR PURPOSE OF THIS

DISCUSSION. >> ENTERTAIN A MOTION. >> I AM READY TO GO AHEAD.

>> I MOVED TO APPROVE HD CASE NUMBER 2020-34 WITHOUT CONDITIONS THAT I MOVED THAT THE HDC MAKES THE FOLLOWING FACTS AND CONCLUSION OF LAW PART OF THE RECORD.

HDC CASE 2020-34 AS PRESENTED IS SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANT WITH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE, THE SECRETARY OF INTERIOR STATED THAT THE WATERFRONT COMMUNITY REDEVELOPMENT AREA TO AWARD

FINAL APPROVAL AT THIS TIME. >> SECOND TWO ANY PER THE DISCUSSION?

>> SO MOVED, A SECOND. MS. HARTMAN PLEASE CALL THE REAL.

>> MEMBER HARRISON. >> YES. >> MEMBER BASIC.

[00:45:02]

>> ESTIMATE MEMBER DUNCAN. >> YES. >> PFISTER POZZETTA.

[3.3 HDC 2020-0036 - SETH JUDD, JUDD CONSTRUCTION LLC, AGENT FOR HEIDI CORMIER, 229 S. 8TH STREET]

>> YES. >> PFISTER SPINO. >> ESTIMATE GOING ON, HDC

2020-36, THE REPLACEMENT OF 19 WINDOWS. >> THIS IS HD 2020-36 SOUTH EIGHTH STREET IT IS THE PROPERTY ZONED C-3 IN THE CENTRAL BUSINESS DISTRICT BUILT IN 19 TEAM ZERO THREE HERE'S AN EXTERIOR SHOT IT WAS CONSISTS DRIFTED AS A PRIVATE RESIDENCE AND A TWO-STORY VERNACULAR BUILDING THAT WAS NOTED FOR ITS PAIRED WINDOWS IN FRONT FACING GABLES. ALSO OF NOTE IS A SIMILAR DESIGN TO THE ADJOINING HOME AND THE PROPERTY IS CURRENTLY IS COMMERCIALLY ON THE FIRST FLOOR AND RESIDENTIALLY OF FOUR.

THE APPLICANT IS SEEKING TO REPLACE ORIGINAL WOOD WINDOWS WITH INSIGNIA OF BRAND RESIN WINDOWS. THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT GUIDELINES STATE THAT WINDOWS ARE FUNCTIONAL AND AESTHETIC HELPING TO CONVEY ABILITIES PARTICULAR STYLE PRESERVING WINDOWS OF THEIR COMPONENTS HELP UPHOLD THE ARCHITECTURAL INTEGRITY OF THE DISTRICT AS A WHOLE. THE APPLICANT HAS PROVIDED I WINDOWS SURVEY COMPLETED BY THE AVONDALE WINDOW RESTORATION COMPANY DATED SEPTEMBER 6, THE 16TH OF THIS YEAR.

OF NOTE ARE THREE REPLACEMENT ALUMINUM SASHES, THE TWO OVER TWO OF THE ORIGINAL SASH BOXES.

ALSO NOTED ON THE REPORTS ARE SIX WOODEN DOUBLE HUNG TO OVER TWO WINDOWS THAT ARE LOCATED ON AN ENCLOSED PORCH ON THE CEDAR AND EIGHT DREAM ELEVATION AS WE OFTEN SEE WITHIN FILLED THESE WINDOWS DO NOT MATCH THE ORIGINAL QUALITY OF MATERIAL OR INSTALLATION TECHNIQUES.

THE REPORT STATES THAT THE PORCH AND FILL WINDOWS ARE CREATING AN ISSUE WITH MOISTURE DAMAGE.

STAFF FIND THAT THE SIX WHICH INFILL WINDOWS ARE PROBLEMATIC. AND REPLACEMENT SHOULD BE CONSIDERED WITH WINDOWS OF THE SAME SIZE, CONFIGURATION AND MATERIAL.

ADDITIONALLY THE THREE ALUMINUM WINDOWS ON THE PROPERTY SHOULD BE REPLACED WITH A MORE APPROPRIATE WHAT IT WINDOWS TO MATCH THE ORIGINALS. YOU MAY REMAINING ORIGINAL WINDOW SHOULD BE PROPERLY PREPARED REPAIRED AND RESTORED AS IS TRADITIONALLY DONE WITH WOOD WINDOWS. THE BREATH AND SCOPE OF MATERIAL DO NOT MEET THE SECRETARY OF INTERIOR STANDARDS NUMBER 1256 AND 913 AND AS SUCH, STAFF MUST RECOMMEND DENIAL.

STAFF FIND THAT THE REQUESTED ACTION IS PRESENTED IS NOT CONSISTENT WITH THE COMPREHENSIVE PLANS OF THE LAND DEVELOPMENT FOR THE SECRETARY OF INTERIOR STANDARDS THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT GUIDELINES AND STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL OF HDC 2020-36 QUESTIONS.

>> I'M SORRY THEY RECOMMEND DENIAL OF HDC 2020-36 QUESTIONS? >> BENJAMIN, YOU ARE -- WE DO HAVE A SAMPLE OF THE WINDOW IN THE APPLICANT HAS THE REPRESENTATIVE THAT WOULD LIKE TO REPRESENT AND TELL US ABOUT THE WINDOW. QUESTIONS?

>> THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT I WAS GOING TO ASK ABOUT I'M CURIOUS. >> NOW IS NOT THE RIGHT TIME TO

DO THAT. >> I WAS BY THE PROPERTY YESTERDAY AND THEIR 33 WINDOWS IN THIS BUILDING. RIGHT. SO, I KNOW THERE IS STEEL AND ALUMINUM AROUND THE SIDE. WHERE THE REST OF THEM? UP-AND-DOWN?

>> IT'S ALL OVER THE PLACE. IT IS GOING TO BE FRANKEN WINDOW.

OKAY. IF THEY ARE NOT IN FURTHER QUESTIONS I WILL CALL THE APPLICANT. IS THAT APPROPRIATE? IS THERE SOMEONE WHO WISHES TO SPEAK ON BEHALF OF 2020-0036. PLEASE IDENTIFY YOURSELF AND YOUR ADDRESS FOR THE RECORD.

>> 4229 SOUTHEAST EIGHTH STREET DOWNSTAIRS IS A HAIR SALON UPSTAIRS IS RESIDENTIAL.

IN 1909 THE HOUSE WAS BUILT FOR CARRIAGES AND DIRT ROADS. NOW WE HAVE HIGHWAY AND LOG TRACKS THAT ZOOM BY DAILY. AND I HAVE A BUSINESS THERE WHICH WASN'T A BUSINESS BEFORE I CAME TO THE BOARD, THREE OF THEM TO BE EXACT TO GET IT CHANGED TO THE ZONING CODE SO THAT I CAN

[00:50:03]

BECAUSE DUTY CENTRAL HEAT AND AIR THE AIR FILLS THE WALLS AND IT DOESN'T STAY IMPROPERLY AND IT DOESN'T PREVENT THE HEAT ELEMENTS NOR WHAT THE TRUCK SPRING AND THAT ARE ON THAT HIGHWAY. NOT TO MENTION THE NOISE. I ASK THAT YOU RECONSIDER THE PROPOSED REPLACEMENT I LISTEN TO THE PRESENTATION THAT MY GUYS FROM THE WINDOW COMPANY HAVE

OFFERED. >> THANK YOU FOR THAT OPPORTUNITY.

LET ME ASK YOU ONE QUESTION. I'M A LITTLE BIT CONFUSED AS YOU CAN TELL.

WHAT AN APPLICATION FOR 19 OF THE SIX ON THE PORCH OF THREE ARE THEY ON THE NORTH SIDE AND

THEN WHERE THE OTHER? >> ON THE CORNER OF EIGHTH AND CEDAR.

>> THERE ARE THREE IN THE RECEPTION AREA AND SEVEN THAT ARE NOW ENCLOSED.

IT WAS ONCE AN OPEN PORCH THERE ARE SEVEN THAT'S IN THE SALON AREA.

TWO ON THE LEFT SIDE OF THE HOUSE AND THEN BUT THANK YOU. FIRST OF ALL I THINK I LIVE DOWE STREET AS I SEE THIS PROPERTY ALL OF THE TIME. THERE IS MORE THAN 19 WINDOWS THANK YOU VERY MUCH. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? IF NOT WE ARE GOING TO GO TO

THEIR VENDOR AND CONTRACTOR. >> I HAD A QUESTION. I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT I UNDERSTAND BECAUSE IT'S A LITTLE TO ME IN THE STAFF REPORT OF THE PRESENTATION THAT ESSENTIALLY WHAT IS GOING ON HERE IS THAT YOU HAVE A COMBINATION OF ORIGINAL WINDOWS AND LIKE AFTERMARKET ALUMINUM WINDOWS AT YOUR HEART HOUSE OR BUSINESS AND YOU HAVE AVONDALE WINDOW COME OUT AND DO AN ANALYSIS LAND IS WHAT HAPPENED WITH THE AVONDALE WINDOWS WHERE YOU AFTERWARDS ARE PROPOSING TO REPLACE THE ONE THAT ARE DAMAGED BEYOND THE POINT OF REPAIR.

>> HOW DID YOU ALL CHOOSE THE 16 WINDOWS OR WHATEVER THAT ARE GETTING REPLACE.

>> THEY ARE THE ONES THAT ARE ALL DOWNSTAIRS. >> I WOULD LIKE TO HAVE THEM ALL

COHESIVELY LOOK APPROPRIATELY. >> YOU ARE PROPOSING TO JUST CHANGE ALL OF THE WINDOWS

DOWNSTAIRS. >> FOR NOW. >> AND LEAVE THE ONES UPSTAIRS.

>> CORRECT. >> THANK YOU. >> DUE TO FINANCIAL.

>> YES. NO SMALL THING. WE UNDERSTAND THAT.

>> ALL RIGHT. WE WILL GO AHEAD AND CALL A WHERE WE AT?

>> IS AN ONLINE? >> I'M NOT SURE. MR. JUDD TO MIKE LET ME PROMOTE

HIM. >> HE'S NOT USED TO LIKE HE IS VIRTUAL.

>> HELLO, CAN EVERYONE HEAR ME? SIGNIFICANT YEAR, WE ARE WAITING ON THE VISUAL.

>> SEMI THANK YOU. CAN YOU STATE YOUR NAME IN EXCESS FOR THE RECORD?

>> THAT IS JUDD 5220 SHEDD ROAD IN JACKSONVILLE, FLORIDA SMITH AND EASY TO RAISE YOUR RIGHT

HAND IN HIS HEART WAS FOR HUMAN. >> TO SWEAR OR AFFIRM THAT THE ORAL AND/OR WRITTEN TESTIMONY YOU ARE ABOUT TO IT WILL BE THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH, NOTHING TRUE?

>> I DUE. >> EXCELLENT. >> WHAT CAN YOU TELL US? THE NEXT SO, I KNOW YOU HAVE A SAMPLE THERE BUT OUR WINDOW LINE IS COMPLETE CUSTOM OPERATION.

SO, WE CAN MATCH A STATICALLY EXACTLY WHAT IS THERE DOWN TO ONE 16TH OF AN INCH.

WE CAN MAKE THE -- THE SAME SIZE AS THE EXISTING HISTORIC WINDOW. WE CAN DO THE EXTERNAL WOULD BE

[00:55:02]

IT WOULD NOT LOOK LIKE THAT EXACT SAMPLE THERE. >> QUESTIONS FOR MR. JUDD.

>> JUST THAT AND I DON'T NEED TO SPEAK FOR EVERYBODY ELSE. BUT REALISTICALLY WE ARE NOT GOING TO PROVE THE WINDOW TO BE USED WITHOUT IT BEING ABLE TO SEE TO BE ABLE TO MATCH IT THEN MAKE IT THE WAY HE DID IT IS YOUR IT'S NOT REPRESENTATIVE OF WHAT IT WILL BE THERE AND IT DOESN'T DO US ANY GOOD. I FEEL LIKE FOR US TO BE ABLE TO LOOK AT THIS SERIOUSLY WE NEED TO SEE AN EXAMPLE OF WHAT THE WINDOW WAS ACTUALLY GOOD TO LOOK LIKE AND THAT IS BEING REQUESTED TO BE INSTALLED AND NEEDS ALL OF OUR OTHER REQUIREMENTS. THAT'S MY UNDERSTANDABLE.

>> WHAT I CAN DRAW FOR MY MANUFACTURE WORK. >> FOR ME, FOR OUR BOARD WHAT WE ARE REALLY INTERESTED IN IS WHAT DOES IT LOOK LIKE FROM THE EXTERIOR.

AND WE WOULD NEED DRAWINGS PRESENTED TO THAT CAN DRIVE HOME WHAT IS IT GOING TO LOOK LIKE ON THE OUTSIDE. SO, SOMETHING THAT CAN DESCRIBE IT IS SECTION SO THAT WE CAN UNDERSTAND THE DEPTH OF THE SASH OF THE RELATIONSHIP IN THE GLASS TO THE WINDOW, WHAT IS THE PROFILE OF YOUR EXTERIOR MOUNTAINS ET CETERA APPEARED THAT WOULD BE VERY IMPORTANT FOR US IT IS GOING TO BE PRESENTED IN DRAWING FORM TO REALLY BE ABLE TO UNDERSTAND WHAT WE ARE LOOKING AT. JUST LOOKING AT THE WINDOW PRESENTED HERE TONIGHT, WHERE IT LOOKS NICE ON THE INSIDE THAT'S IRRELEVANT FOR US. WE ARE FOCUSED ON THE EXTERIOR AND WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE ON THE EXTERIOR IS THAT IT IS TO FLAT INTO SHALLOW AND DOES NOT REFLECT WHAT THE EXISTING HISTORIC WINDOW PROFILE WINDOW LOOKS LIKE.

IF YOU DO HAVE AN OPTION THAT CAN PROVIDE MORE ARTICULATION OF THAT EXTERIOR AND MORE DEPTH,

THAT WOULD BE AWESOME AND GREAT. >> IF YOU HAVE TO MEASURE AN EXISTING WINDOW AND USE IT AS A BASIS FOR WHAT THE PROPOSED ONES ARE GOING TO LOOK LIKE EVEN IF YOU PRESENT DRAWINGS OF WHAT YOU ARE ALL RECOMMENDING YOU COULD DO A SIDE-BY-SIDE. A SECTION OF THE EXISTING WINDOWS AND IF YOU ARE LOOKING TO DRIVE HEARTS US AND SELL US ON THIS THAT WOULD BE SOMETHING THAT'S WORTH TAKING HIS ITERATION. IF YOU CAN DO IT.

>> YES I CAN DO THAT. >> PLEASE GO AHEAD. >> CAN WE GET APPROVAL FOR THAT RATHER THAN WAITING QUESTION WINDS PROBABLY NOT. THAT'S PROBABLY TOO FAR BUT ALAS

THE MEMBERS. >> I ONLY ASK BECAUSE THIS IS THE SECOND.

>> WE HAD NO MATERIALS PROVIDED IN THE FIRST MEETING. SO, THAT WAS -- WE PROBABLY SHOULDN'T DAVE EVEN HEARD THE CASE THIS IS BEFORE SOMEONE HAS EVEN SEEN THE WINDOW TO KNOW WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT. SO, IF JUST TO FILL YOU IN. AS YOU PICKED A WINDOW OF THE EXISTING LIST. IT PROBABLY WOULD'VE BEEN A DIFFERENT CONVERSATION THAN WHAT WERE HAVING RIGHT NOW. SO, JUST SO YOU KNOW. YOU'RE BRINGING A WHOLE NEW

VENDOR PROCESS TABLE. >> I WOULD SAY HE WOULD BE REALLY GOOD TO GET ALL PARTIES

[01:00:01]

MOVE FORWARD. >> JIM YOU ARE OKAY WITH THAT COMPOSITE.

>> YES. I THINK THERE ARE COMPOSITE WINDOWS OUT THERE THAT WOULD

CERTAINLY MEET OUR CRITERIA. >> I FEEL LIKE WE CAN ALSO IN THE INTEREST OF GETTING THE APPLICANT AS MUCH INFORMATION AS POSSIBLE ADDRESS THAT CONCERN THAT SAL HAD AND HIS STAFF REPORT RELATING TO ONLY DOING SOME OF THE WINDOWS AND EATING THEM OUT.

WE NEED TO GIVE THE APPLICANT SOME INFORMATION. THIS IS AN INTEGRAL PART OF THIS AND I DON'T WANT THEM TO COME BACK AND THEN WE HAVE TO HAVE THAT CONVERSATION AGAIN I'M INTERESTED TO HEAR WHAT YOU THINK ABOUT THE COMMENTS THAT SAL MADE.

>> ARE WE IMPORTANT DISCUSSION THE. >> WE STILL NEED TO DO PUBLIC

HEARING. >> NOW WE NEED TO OPEN THE PUBLIC.

KNOW IF ANYBODY ONLINE OR HERE WANTS TO SPEAK TO THIS CASE IS 2020-036229 SOUTH MAIN STREET.

>> WERE GOING TO CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING. >> PLEASE SPIKE SAL THEY FORCED YOU TO DENY THE APPLICATION AND IF YOU'RE ASKING THE APPLICANT TO RESUBMIT ALL OF THOSE.

>> SOME OF THE ISSUES WERE A REPLACEMENT SHOULD BE SOUGHT AS A LAST RESORT WHEN WINDOWS CANNOT BE RESTORED OTHER THAN THIS PORTION WILL WHICH THEY ARE BEYOND REPAIR BY THAT REPORT THAT WE RECEIVED. SO, THE WOODEN REPLACEMENT WINDOWS WOULD BE SUITABLE FOR THAT. ALSO THERE ARE A COUPLE OF WINDOWS THAT ARE NOT ORIGINAL ALUMINUM WINDOWS. THOUGH REPLACEMENT WOULD BE A CHOICE FOR THOSE.

ONE OF THE LARGE ISSUES IS THAT IT GOES AGAINST THE SECRETARY OF THE STANDARD SATISFIES MATERIALS FOR REPLACEMENT WINDOWS AND MAINTAINING AND PRESERVING HISTORIC FABRIC.

>> I AM READING SECTION THREE WINDOWS. ON THE HISTORIC DISTRICT GUIDELINES DAMAGE FROM A HISTORIC WINDOW IS BEYOND REPAIR OR REPLACE IT ENTIRELY WHENEVER POSSIBLE IT WOULD BE DAMAGE TO RETAIN IF THE MAJORITY OF WINDOWS BEYOND REASONABLE REPAIR WITH WINDOWS SHOULD BE REPLACED WITH WOODEN WINDOWS TO MATCH THE ORIGINAL.

>> AND HERE WE ARE TALKING ABOUT NINE OF. >> HOW MANY WINDOWS ARE WE TALKING ABOUT THE NEXT 17 OF 30 MOMENTUM WERE 19 CAME FROM IT IS TO MAKE IT IS 17.

BUT IT IS 917 ON FIRST FLOOR. >> ONLY ON THE FIRST FLOOR. >> I GUESS MY COMMENTS WERE SORT

OF A QUESTION. >> I THINK THAT THIS PROCESS IS SET UP SO THAT INTENTIONALLY WE CAN HAVE AN EXPERT THIRD PARTY OPINION FROM A COMPANY DO THIS STUDY AND ITEMIZE EACH WINDOW WITH THEIR RECOMMENDATIONS AS WE RESPECT WHAT THEIR OPINION IS. SO, I THINK THE WAY I READ THE REPORT FROM AVONDALE WINDOWS IS THAT GIVEN TO US IS THAT THEY DON'T RECOMMEND REPLACEMENT OF THE MAJORITY OF THE WINDOWS, THEY RECOMMENDED THE EXISTING FRAMES CAN BE KEPT IN THE SESSIONS CAN BE MADE TO MATCH THE EXISTING. SO, IN ALL FAIRNESS, WE HAVE LOOKED AT SOME OF THE OTHER CASES FAIRLY RECENTLY FOR APPLICANTS WHO HAVE ASKED TO BE REPLACING HISTORIC WINDOWS AND WE HAVE NOT ALLOWED THEM TO DO THAT AND WE HAVE GOT THE PROCESS

[01:05:02]

>> CAN YOU REMIND ME OF ONE OF THOSE CUSTOMER. >> YES.

>> THAT'S WHEN MOST RECENTLY. >> AND THEY HAVE REPAIRED WOOD FOR WOOD.

>> ORIGINALLY THEY CAME IN AND APPLIED TO DO EXACTLY WHAT THIS APPLICANT IS DOING AND THEN WE SAID STOP, GOING GET A THIRD PARTY OPINION AND THE RESULT THAT IS THAT THEY DECIDED THAT THEY CAN. THE SEA SO, WE KNOW THAT THERE ARE SIX EXISTING WINDOWS IN THE PORCH WHICH IS PRETTY ROUGH AND NOT ORIGINAL. WE KNOW THEY ARE ALUMINUM.

>> REPORTER: DO WE HAVE A SENSE OF WHETHER OR NOT THE REST OF THE WINDOWS ON THE FIRST FLOOR

50 REBUILT OR DOES THE REPORT TELL US? >> I THINK THE REPORT THERE'S A COUPLE THAT HAS SIGNIFICANT ISSUES THAT I THINK THE REPORT GENERALLY ACROSS-THE-BOARD TO STATE THAT THEY BE ABLE TO BE REPAIRED AND REPLACED THERE IS FOR.

>> FOUR OUT OF 13 CAN I JUMP IN WITH SOME THINGS? >> I THINK THAT THE FIRST ISSUE THAT WE HAVE TO DEAL WITH TONIGHT IS OUT OF THE BLUE WE ARE LOOKING AT A WINDOW THAT IS SIGNING ON OUR LIST HERE SO WE ARE PUTTING THE CART BEFORE THE HORSE.

THIS WINDOW IS SOMETHING THEY WANTED TO LOOK AT IS THEY SHOULD'VE BROUGHT IT TO US TO LOOK AT TO APPROVE. YOU CAN TELL US WHAT THEY'RE MADE OUT OF AN THIS IS BACKING US INTO A POSITION OF SAYING IT GIVES THEM A SPECIAL CONDITION. THE OVERARCHING BROAD DISSENT THAT I HAVE. THE SECOND IS THAT IF YOU LOOK THE HOUSE BUSINESS THAT HAS AN INTERESTING COLOR SCHEME. THEY ARE PROPOSING PUTTING IN A SHINY VINYL WHITE WINDOW.

WHAT IS THAT MEAN? IS THE HOUSE GOING TO BE REPAINTED? NOW WILL ALL OF THE BUTTONS THE WHITE DO WE HAVE A REPAINT GOING IN? OR ARE WE GOING TO GO WITH YELLOW. ARE THEY GOING TO MATCH.

WERE PUTTING IN A PERMANENT FEATURE TO A HOUSE THAT HAS SOME THINGS THAT CAN BE CHANGED OVER TIME. AND, WE REQUIRE WINDOWS TO BE SALVAGED WHEN THEY CAN AND WE TELL PEOPLE PUT STORM WINDOWS AND TO HELP WITH THE NOISE AND INSULATION YOU HAVE JUST AS MUCH AIR INFILTRATION AROUND THE WINDOWS INTO THE PANES OF GLASS. THE BOTTOM LINE IS, REQUIRES MAINTENANCE TO KEEP THEM UP. SO, I'M HAVING A HARD TIME WITH AN INFANT INTERESTING STRUCTURE REPLACING THE BOTTOM BAND AND SHINY VINYL WINDOWS EVEN IF THEY MATCH THE CONFIGURATION TAMMI'S THOUGHTS ARE COMPELLING TO ME WHEN I THINK OF THE CAPABILITY OF WORD IS THAT YOU CONVEYED WHATEVER COLOR THE HOUSE COLOR CHANGES DOWN THE ROAD YOU CAN. YOU CAN'T REALLY DO THAT WITH VINYL. THAT LOCKS YOU INTO THAT COLOR FOREVER BASED.

>> QUIET WHITE IS A POPULAR COLOR AND IS A RESIDENT I NEVER PLAN ON SELLING.

>> THANK YOU. >> IT SEEMS TO BE MOVING PRETTY RAPIDLY.

>> I THINK YOU ARE RIGHT. AND UNFORTUNATELY I WOULD LIKE TO AGREE.

I DON'T SEE A PATH FORWARD HERE AND I DON'T SEE A PATH FORWARD HERE AND IT REALLY PAINS ME BECAUSE IT'S A BEAUTIFUL HOME AND WE HAVE A WINDOW WE HAVE NEVER APPROVED, DESIGN THAT IS PROBABLY GOING TO BE AS DISTANT FROM TOP TO BOTTOM. I ALWAYS THINK ABOUT MY NEIGHBOR WHO IS A VERY DESIGN CONSCIOUS HISTORIC RENOVATION GUY AND SHE'S GOING TO SAY WHY THE WINDOWS DOWNSTAIRS DIFFERENT THAN THE WINDOWS UPSTAIRS I CAN HEAR HER.

AND I'M STRUGGLING WITH THAT. I'M REALLY STRUGGLING WITH THAT. SO, SOMEBODY HELP ME HERE FIGURE OUT A MIDDLE GROUND. NOT JUST IN THE UA SHANK ACT BUT WHAT WE WANT TO SEE COME BACK AND CHECK MY SENSE -- SO, WE JUST WANT TO CONTINUE IT? BUT WE SLEPT GET GUIDANCE.

[01:10:08]

>> I THINK WE HAVE TO DECIDE WHETHER OR NOT PERSONAL THAT WE ARE OKAY WITH THE COMPLETE REPLACEMENT WINDOW. THAT'S A FIRST DECISION I THINK WE HAVE TO AGREED UPON GET BE BACK ON. FROM THERE THERE'S A PATH FOR CONTINUATION.

IF THE ANSWER IS NO, THAN I THINK THE ONLY PATH FORWARD IS TO REPAIR AND REPLACE WHICH NOT TO GET INTO A SITUATION WHERE SHE DOESN'T HAVE TO COME BACK TO US ANYWAY.

>> CELL. >> SO, THAT'S A DECISION WE NEED TO MAKE YOUR ARE WE OKAY WITH THE IDEA QUITE FRANKLY PUTTING THE DEPARTMENT OF INTERIOR STANDARDS OFF TO THE SIDE AND WHENEVER POSSIBLE ARE WE OKAY WHATEVER THAT ALLOWS THE REPLACEMENT AND IF SO I THINK THEY LET THAT CONTINUE AND COME BACK WITH THE WINDOW THAT REQUIREMENTS THAT THEY ARE

LOOKING FOR. >> TO WE HAVE THE VINYL WINDOW. >> THEY HAVE A REPORT BY

HAPPENED OUT WINDOWS. >> I THINK WHAT I'M HEARING IS A CONTINUATION WITH RECOMMENDATION THAT THEY REVISIT AND SEE HOW MANY OF THESE THEY CAN RENOVATE. AND WHEN THERE LOOKING EXACTLY

LIKE THE EXISTING WOOD WOODEN WINDOWS. >> JUST TO GIVE A COUPLE OPTIONS -- I SEE YOU HAVE THE ANDERSON 400 SERIES ON YOUR APPROVED LIST WHICH IS EXTERIOR VINYL WINDOW.

IF WE WERE TO GO IN WITHOUT, WOULD IT BE IMMEDIATELY APPROVED BECAUSE IT'S ALREADY ON YOUR

LIST? >> I DON'T THINK SO. I THINK WHAT I'M HEARING IS THAT THE BOARD HAS INTERESTED IN SEEING HOW MANY OF THE ORIGINAL WINDOWS COULD BE MEDITATED IF

NOT ALL OF THEM. >> I WAS JUST ASKING. >> THAT'S A GOOD QUESTION.

>> THE GUIDELINES ARE PRETTY CLEAR THAT IF IT'S POSSIBLE TO REPAIR THE WINDOW THAT'S ROUTE NUMBER ONE THAT NEEDS TO BE ADHERED TO. AND REPLACEMENT IS REALLY ONLY AN OPTION WE CAN CONSIDER WHEN THE WINDOW IS SO COMPLETELY DEGRADED THERE'S NOTHING LEFT.

>> I THINK THAT IS TRUE IN SOME CASES ESPECIALLY IN THE FRONT PORCH.

>> I'M NOT DENYING THAT CERTAINLY SOME OF THE PICTURES SHOW SOME BACK CONDITIONS.

>> ONE THING THAT HAS BEEN HELPFUL IS THAT -- DOES NOT ACTUALLY ITEMIZE WINDOW BY WINDOW OF WHAT THEY THINK SHOULD BE DONE WINDOW BY WINDOW. SO, MAYBE THAT WOULD BE SOMETHING WE WOULD WANT THEM TO COME BACK WITH TO EXPAND UPON THE DOCUMENT THEY PUT TOGETHER TO WHERE THEY ACTUALLY THEY LIST EACH WINDOW AND EACH ELEVATION BUT THEY DON'T ACTUALLY SAY WHAT THE RECOMMENDATION IS AND WHAT THE CONDITION IS. THEY JUST SUMMARIZE AT THE VERY END A GENERALIZATION OF THE RECOMMENDATION THAT THEY CAN BE REPAIRED.

>> THE OTHER THING WE HAVE TO CONSIDER IS, WE HAVE TO APPROVE COLORS.

SO, IF WE APPROVE A WHITE VINYL WINDOW ARE WE THERE FOR APPROVING A HOUSE THAT WILL HAVE WHITE VINYL WINDOWS ALTHOUGH BOTTOM IN YELLOW DOUBLE HUNG ON THE TOP?

WOULD WE APPROVE THAT? >> I GUESS I WOULD BE UP TO THE APPLICANT TO COME TO US TO

PROPOSE SEE. >> I WOULD NEED TO BE IN IT. >> I PERSONALLY DON'T HAVE A BIG ISSUE OF DOING IT IN PHASES. I THINK EVEN WHEN THE CITY ITSELF DID THE PECK CENTER IT IF THEY DO IT IN PHASES BECAUSE THEY CANNOT AFFORD TO DO IT AT ONCE.

THEY DID ONE HAVE ONE YEAR AND ONE HALF THE OTHER YEAR. THERE CERTAINLY A PRECEDENT HERE

IN TOWN THAT. >> SO, WE ARE ASKING FOR THE WINDOW BY WINDOW DETAIL FROM

AVONDALE AS PART OF THIS PROCESS. >> , ALREADY HAVE BEEN REPLACED.

OUT OF THE 17 THAT AREN'T REPAIRED OR HAVE BEEN REPAIRED THEY HAVE BEEN REPLACED.

I DON'T WANT TO REPAIR THE WOOD WHEN IT IS JUST GOING TO CREATE PROBLEMS OVER TIME.

[01:15:02]

I TAKE PRIDE IN MY HOME AND TAKE PRIDE IN THE LANDSCAPE. THERE IS ON.

I TAKE PRIDE IN THE AESTHETICS OF IT ALL. >> AND IT'S ONLY GOING TO IMPROVE THE HOME. WE UNDERSTAND. AND HONESTLY IT'S A BEAUTIFUL PROPERTY. WE APPRECIATE WHAT YOU'RE TRYING TO DO.

SHOULD BE CLEAR ABOUT THAT. THE PROBLEM IS THAT WE ARE BEING PRESENTED WITH HALF A SOLUTION AND IT WOULD CREATE SOME INCONSISTENCIES THAT FRANKLY WE DON'T THINK THE COMMUNITY WOULD WANT TO LIVE WITH PIERS MIKE I UNDERSTAND THAT. I STILL LIVE ACROSS THE STREET USED TO NOT HAVE A GROUP CLASS FRONT TO MAKE THAT HAPPEN LONG BEFORE WE HAD AN OPPORTUNITY WITH THAT. WE ARE GOING TO TRY TO FIND A WAY FORWARD BUT WE WILL TONIGHT AND WE ARE GOING TO MAKE SOME RECOMMENDATIONS I THINK TO HELP US GET THERE.

AND HOPEFULLY WE CAN GET YOU WHERE YOU NEED TO BE. WE UNDERSTAND THIS IS A

DIFFICULT SITUATION AND YOU GET STUCK CLEANING UP THE MESS. >> I ACTUALLY STARTED THE

CHEESE. >> WE APPRECIATE YOUR SITUATION. FRANKLY, SOME OF US HAVE BEEN RIGHT FOR YOU ARE WITH HISTORIC PROPERTIES. IT'S A CHALLENGE AND WE

UNDERSTAND THE COSTS ASSOCIATED WITH IT. >> YES, IT IS $5000 A WINDOW.

THANK YOU. WE APPRECIATE WHERE YOU ARE. CAN I GET A MOTION TO CONTINUE?

I THINK THAT IS WHAT I'M HEARING. >> YES.

>> I WOULD LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION TO CONTINUE HDC CASE 2020-36, IS THERE A TIME ON THE DOCKET, WHEN

IS THE NEXT TIME? >> THE FEBRUARY MEETING. >> TO THE FEBRUARY HDC.

>> SECOND MAKE ANY PER THE DISCUSSION? DO THEY HAVE GUIDANCE?

>> I THINK WE ARE GOING TO ASK THEM TO WORK WITH STYLE AND FIND MIDDLE GROUND.

>> PLEASE CALL THE ROLL.

WE UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE GOING THROUGH. SOME OF US HAVE BEEN IN THE EXACT SAME WE WILL TRY TO GET YOU THERE. CAMILLA, DO THE BEST YOU CAN.

MOVING ON. MR. JUD, THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME.

[3.4 HDC 2020-0037 - COTNER ASSOCIATES, INC., AGENT FOR TODD LORENTSON, 316 N. 3RD STREET]

WE MOVING ON. HDC 2020-0037. >> CAN I SAY SOMETHING?

>> CAN I INTRODUCE THE CASE? IS THIS ABOUT -- >> OF COURSE YOU CAN.

>> HDC 2020-0037, COTNER LAWRENSON, 316 NORTH THIRD STREET.

BENJAMIN IS OUT, MS. DUNCAN IS IN. MS. KOSACK DID YOU HAVE A

COMMENT? >> YES, I HAVE SPENT A LOT OF TIME AND ENERGY AND RESEARCH ON THIS CASE. AND RECOGNIZING THE PROXIMITY OF THE HOUSE NEXT TO MINE.

I WILL HAVE A NEIGHBOR THAT IS LITERALLY 31 INCHES FROM MY HOME AND WANTING TO WELCOME TODD, THAT NEIGHBOR AND HIS THREE BOYS INTO THE COMMUNITY AND NOT WANTING TO START WITHIN THE SERIAL RELATIONSHIP THAT, ALTHOUGH I AM NOT LEGALLY TO RECUSE MYSELF FROM THIS CASE, I WILL LET SAME VOTING ON THIS CASE DID NOT HAVE YOU TALKED TO COUNCIL ABOUT THIS?

I HAVE TALKED WITH COUNSEL ABOUT IT. >> COUNSEL ARE YOU OKAY? I AM. THERE IS A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN WHAT SHE WAS SAYING THAT THE LEGALLY. UNDER FLORIDA LAW YOU HAVE TO GO TO UNLESS YOU HAVE A VOTING CONFLICT UNDER CHAPTER 112 WHICH IS THE CODE OF ETHICS FOR PUBLIC OFFICERS AND EMPLOYEES.

WHICH MEANS BASICALLY A FINANCIAL INTEREST. EITHER GOOD OR BAD FOR YOU.

BUT, THERE IS FOR QUASIJUDICIAL HEARINGS IN THE LAW UNDER CHAPTER 286 OF THE FLORIDA STATUTE A SLIGHT EXEMPTION AND I DISCUSSED LAST NIGHT AND DID SOME TRAINING ON PAUSE I JUDICIAL HEARINGS FOR THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT, THAT ALLOWS A BOARD MEMBER QUASIJUDICIAL

[01:20:03]

>> SHE SAID SHE IS NOT VOTING CHEMISTRY CANNOT BE UNBIASED TO MAKE THIS IS DIFFERENT THAN THE CASE WHEN THE HOUSES ACROSS THE STREET FROM YOU ON CEDAR STREET. I WAS NOT THAT ENGAGED.

>> RIGHTS, EXACTLY. I WAS ALLOWED TO. LIKE HE SAID.

ANY OTHER COMMUNITY MEMBER. THIS ONE IS A LITTLE TOO CLOSE FOR COMFORT.

>> RIGHT. >> AND WE DISCUSSED THE DETAILS OF THAT.

AND YOU DO NOT HAVE TO FILE WHAT WE CALL OUR CALL 8B WHICH IS GOOD FOR MY FILE FOR CHAPTER 112 EXTENSION. YOU DO NOT HAVE TO FILE A FORM FOR THIS.

>> I NEVER GOT IN TROUBLE FOR TELLING THE TRUTH. THANK YOU.

AND THANK YOU. MOVING ON. MR. CUMELLA.

>> THIS IS A HDC 2020-37, A AT 316 NORTH THIRD STREET. CURRENTLY ZONED R2 MEDIUM DENSITY RESIDENTIAL. IT IS CURRENTLY A VACANT LOT THIS IS A PHOTO OF WHAT THAT LOT LOOKS LIKE FROM THE FRONTS. THE APPLICANT IS SEEKING TO CONSTRUCT A SINGLE-FAMILY RESIDENCE OF APPROXIMATELY 2200 SQUARE FEET PLUS A ONE AND A HALF CAR DETACHED GARAGE.

THE STRUCTURE IS PROPOSED TO BE A WOOD FRAME STRUCTURE WITH PARTIES SIGNING INTEREST, IF SAID 100 SERIES WINDOWS, AND HE SAID 100 SERIES DOORS. WITH A COMBINATION OF ROOF WITH A COMBINATION OF 5 FEET JAVELIN AND FIBERGLASS. IT HAS BEEN STYLE DRIVEWAY.

THIS CASE WAS HEARD OCTOBER 12, 2020 AND CONTINUE TO ALLOW THE APPLICANT THE OPPORTUNITY TO SEEK SOLUTIONS THAT WOULD NOT REQUIRE THE REMOVAL OF A MATURE OAK TREE.

STAFF FINDS THAT THE HOME DESIGN IS COMPATIBLE WITH THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT IN TERMS OF MATERIALS, SCALE, PROPORTIONS, REFORMS, AND ORIENTATION. THE PROPOSED SETBACK IS 12 EAGER WHICH IS NOT COMPLIANT WITH THE CITY SETBACK OF 25 FEET. BUT THE APPLICANT HAS RECEIVED A CONTEXT-SENSITIVE SETBACK DETERMINATION AS OUTLINED IN LDC 4.02.03 ARREST.

THAT CONTEXT-SENSITIVE SETBACK RAMPS THE PROPERTY A 12-FOOT FRONT YARD SETBACK.

STAFF FINDS REQUESTED ACTION AS PRESENTED IS CONSISTENT WITH THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE CHECK THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR STANDARDS OF THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT GUIDELINES. STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL OF HDC 2020-37.

THANK YOU. >> QUESTIONS? MIKE, PLEASE GO FIRST.

>> I WOULD LIKE TO RAISE A HYPOTHETICAL ISSUE. AND THAT IS THE POINT OF IT IS, IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT COUNCIL APPROVED SOMETHING WHICH WOULD CONTRADICT OR GO AGAINS THE LAND DEVELOPMENT? IF IT IS SHOWN THAT THE TREE HERE MUST GO BUT IS ALSO MUST BE PRESERVED HISTORICALLY, IS THE HDC ABLE TO GRANT APPROVAL FOR DESIGN OR SOMEBODY ELSE RESPONSIBLE FOR POLICING? I DON'T KNOW THE COURT ENFORCEMENT.

>> WE WILL ASK COUNSEL. MY SENSE IS THAT WE OFTEN BALANCE DIFFERENT ELEMENTS

COUNSEL. >> TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION IN THIS CASE, THE SHORT ANSWER TO GENERALLY SPEAKING, THE HDC CANNOT APPROVE A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS.

CERTAINLY IF IT IS INCONSISTENT WITH THE COMP PLAN. THAT'S A NO-NO.

WITH REGARD TO LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE. SAME THING.

ALL OF YOUR CERTIFICATES OF APPROPRIATENESS AND SALES ANALYSIS AND STAFF REPORTS ARE NOT ONLY PART OF AND COMPLIANT WITH THE GUIDELINES. WHATEVER THEIR PROPERTY IS UNDER WHATEVER ADVICE. BUT ALSO IN CONFORMANCE WITH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE.

AND JUST FOR THIS CASE I DON'T HAVE ALL THE DETAILS. I HAVE NOT SPENT NEARLY AS MUCH TIME AS I SHOULD HAVE LOOKING AT ALL THE E-MAILS BACK AND FORTH IN THE HISTORY.

BUT MY UNDERSTANDING GENERALLY IS THAT WITH NEW CONSTRUCTION SUCH A BEAUTIFUL TREE IS THIS

[01:25:01]

AND I TALKED ABOUT THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN LEGAL AND MORAL OBLIGATIONS.

YOUR OBLIGATIONS ARE TO APPLY THE LAW WE HAVE IN PLACE RIGHT NOW AND IT HAS BEEN GREAT TO WATCH YOU ALL HELP PROPERTY OWNERS THINK OF OTHER IDEAS AND PLACES THAT THEY CAN SHIFT A STRUCTURE IN ORDER TO ACCOMMODATE TREES. BUT IT IS NOT ILLEGAL.

WE ARE NOT DOING ANYTHING THAT VIOLATES THE LAND ABOUT THE CODE IF YOU APPROVE THIS KNOWING THAT THE TREE COULD OR WILL BE REMOVED. DOES THAT ANSWER YOUR QUESTION?

>> THE CASE IS NOW BEING RETURNED TO US, HOW DOES WHAT WE HAVE HERE COMPARED TO WHAT HAPPENED IN OTHER ASSORTED JURISDICTIONS. ARE WE CAN DO WITH WHAT WE SEEN

ELSEWHERE? >> IN OTHER JURISDICTIONS? >> YES.

WE ARE AS A COMMUNITY WITH REGARD TO TREES. WE DON'T PROTECT THEM THE MOST OF ANY COMMUNITY OF FLORIDA. WE ARE NOT EVEN IN THE MIDDLE. WERE NEAR THE MOST STRICT WITH REGARDS TO TREE REMOVAL AND MITIGATION. WE ARE NOT THE WORST AND WERE NOT IN THE MIDDLE. WE ARE UP THERE BUT WE CAN DO BETTER TO MY QUESTIONS TO MAKE WE'VE TALKED ABOUT LOOKING AT THE GUIDELINES IN THE NEAR FUTURE AND MAKING SURE THAT

TREES OR SOMETHING THAT IS BITTER. >> ABSOLUTELY.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH. >> THE SECOND QUESTION, THIS CASE WAS CONTINUED AND IS NOW CONTINUED TONIGHT SO, THE APPLICANT CAN PRESENT ALTERNATIVES WHICH WILL ALLOW --

>> DID YOU SEE SUCH RECOMMENDATIONS? >> SO, THEY DID PROVIDE US.

THE DESIGN HAS REMAINED THE SAME FROM THE PREVIOUS CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL.

THEY DID PROVIDE US SOME FURTHER INFORMATION THIS AFTERNOON WHICH WE HAVE PAPER COPIES OF IN YOUR E-MAIL THE COPY OF LATE THIS AFTERNOON ON THE ARBORIST EVALUATION OF THE TREE.

>> SO, WE ARE GOING TO HEAR MORE FROM JOHN. COME UP AND INTRODUCE YOURSELF YOUR STOMACH YES. JOHN KUTTNER. AGENT FOR TODD LAWRENCE.

AND TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION. I DID. I TOLD YOU AT THAT LAST MEETING WHAT IT WAS CONTINUED WE DID NOT GET APPROVAL BY THE WAY, IT WAS A SO THAT WAS AN INCORRECT STATEMENT. AND, LET ME MAKE A COUPLE OF CORRECTIONS.

THIS WHEN WE HAD ANDERSON 100 SERIES AND THAT HAS NOT YET BEEN APPROVED.

WE WANT TO CHANGE THAT TO ANDERSON 200 SERIES WHICH IS AN APPROVED PRODUCT.

WE DID ELEVATE THE HOUSE FOR YOUR PREVIOUS RECOMMENDATIONS. YOU WANTED TO GO A LITTLE BIT HIGHER. WE DID BUMP IT UP A LITTLE BIT. WE ARE JUST AT THE MAXIMUM WITHOUT GOING TO GUARDRAILS RIGHT NOW. AND THERE IS AN ERROR ON THE SITE PLAN. IT SHOWS THE DRIVEWAY AND THE WALKWAY GOING TO THE CENTERLINE OF THE STREET RATHER THAN THE EDGE OF THE PAVER AND I WANTED TO POINT TO THAT LITTLE ERROR.

JUST SO IT IS CORRECTIVE FOR THE RECORD. NOW.

WHAT OCCURRED AFTER THAT LAST MEETING IS THAT I WENT BACK AND LOOKED AT THE TREE.

WILL FIRST OF ALL, I DIDN'T LOOK AT THE TROOPERS, I ALREADY KNEW WHAT THE TREE WAS.

I THOUGHT IT WAS A GOOD, SOLID TREE. SO, THE ARBORIST REPORT DID NOT SUPPLY ME A BIT. IT WAS A HEALTHY MIDPOINT OF HIS LIFE BUT NO SIGNS OF DISEASE OR DETERIORATION. WE KNOW IT'S A GOOD TREE. NO ARGUMENT THERE.

BUT AFTER OUR MEETING. THE FIRSTISE WAS TO SEE HOW GEOMETRICALLY CAN THIS BE MODIFIED TO POTENTIALLY SAVE HISTORY. SO, I LOOKED AT FLIPPING THE HOUSE. COMPLETELY FLIPPING IT NORTH TO SOUTH, SHIFTING IT COMPLETELY TO

[01:30:05]

THE FLIP DID NOT WORK. WE ARE ALREADY PUSHED UP TO THE 12-FOOT CONTEXT AND THROUGH THE FRONT YARD. WHAT THAT DOES IS IT PUTS THE TREES TO FEED OFF OF THE BACK BUILDING WALL. TO FEED INTO THE BACK PORCH. I EVEN LOOKED AT TAKING 2 FEET OFF THE FRONT PORT JENNA GIVES ME 4P. TWELVE FOR THE AS EARLY STATED IN THE ARBORIST REPORT, HE IS RECOMMENDING TEMPE. THERE IS NO WAY I CAN GET 10 FEET. NO MATTER WHAT KIND OF GEOMETRY. WE HAVE ALREADY GOT A SMALL EXHIBIT TWO-STORY RELATIVE MODEST 2200 SQUARE-FOOT HOME. THERE IS JUST NO WAY TO PUSH AND PULL THIS THING AND HAVE A REASONABLE CHANCE OF SAVING THE TREE.

NOW I WILL SAY THIS. YOU MIGHT BE ABLE TO SAVE THE TREE IF YOU BUTCHERED IT.

BUT YOU LITERALLY HAVE TO CUT THREE QUARTERS OF THE TREE CANOPY OF TO KEEP IT OFF OF THE BUILDING. BECAUSE THE BUILDING I THINK THE PEAK OF THE PORCH WAS ABOUT OFF THE GROUND TO UPPER GRADE LEVEL WAS ABOUT 14 AND A HALF FEET. AND THE EVE OF THE UPSTAIRS IS AT 20 FEET. WELL, THE CANOPY OF THIS TREE IS WELL DONE INTO THAT 20-FOOT RANGE OR LOWER. SO, WHAT ALL OF THE LIMBS ARE GOING TO THE WEST AND THE SOUTH.

>> JOHN, WE HAVE THESE PICTURES TO MAKE YOU CAN SEE THESE LOW LIVES HERE.

ALL THESE GUYS OUT HERE, ALL OF THIS WOULD HAVE TO BE CUT. SO, YOU WOULD HAVE WHAT AMOUNTS TO A HAT RACK TREE AND A GOOD CHANCE OF BEING 4 FEET A GOOD CHANCE YOU'RE GOING TO LOSE IT EVENTUALLY ANYWAYS. THEN IT'S A MAJOR EXPENSE TO GET OUT OF THERE.

NOW YOU HAVE TO TAKE A PIECE. SO, TO A ROUNDABOUT WAY TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION.

WHEN I STARTED THERE IS NOTHING TO DRAW ONCE I STARTED I JUST CAN'T GET THERE.

I CAN'T GET MORE THAN 4 FEET OFF OF THIS TREE INTO DIRECTIONS. SO, ON THE SOUTH SIDE OF THE TREE AND ON THE WEST SIDE OF THE TREE. AND I WILL MAKE ANOTHER OBSERVATION. AND I DID LOOK AT OTHER APPLICATIONS HERE OF RECENT PAST. AND OF 40-INCH LOSS OF INCHES ON A 50-FOOT LOT, THAT'S RUN IN ABOUT HALF OF WHAT BOTH OF THESE SUBMISSIONS ARE SHOWING. IT'S A PRETTY GOOD NUMBER.

AT 40 INCHES. UNFORTUNATELY IT'S ONE GOOD TREE.

THE OTHER TWO THE OTHER TREES WERE CEDARS AND HACKBERRY WHICH WERE GREAT SPECIMENS ANYWAY.

BUT WHILE WE HAVE PROPOSE TO DO AND WE WENT THROUGH THIS YOUR WE HAVE PROPOSE FOR MITIGATION, MORE THAN THE MINIMUM WHICH IS A 4-INCH LIVE OAK TREE WHICH IS A BETTER QUALITY TREE IN THE LONG RUN IN THE REAR YARD INTO TREE FORM EIGHT MYRTLES ON THE STREET SIDE TO CREATE THE STREET TREES FOR CAN'T SAMMY'S, WE TALKED ABOUT -- BUT BECAUSE OF THE POWER LINES DECIDED THIS REFORM WOULD BE A BETTER WAY TO GO. SO, IT WASN'T IGNORED, I REALLY TOOK A SINCERE LOOK AND I COMPASSION FOR THE TREE OR ANY TREE. I SHARE YOUR CONCERN.

BUT. IT WAS SERIOUSLY STUDIED. IT JUST WE JUST DON'T HAVE ANY

PLACE TO GO. >> IF THE TREE WAS NOT THERE WITH THE DESIGN BE THE SAME? I'M TALKING ABOUT BOTH THE DESIGN THE FOOTPRINTS IN THE LOCATION.

>> I WOULD SAY BASED ON THE CONTENTS, WE WOULD PROBABLY BE THE SAME.

VERY SIMILAR ANYWAYS. SUBMIT QUESTIONS FOR MR. COTNER. >> I CAN SYMPATHIZE, I JUST AHEAD THOUGHT ABOUT THIS A ALEUTIANS THAT YOU HAVE EXPRESSED TONIGHT HERE THERE IS

[01:35:01]

ARE PROBABLY NOT GOING TO SAVE THE TREE. >> THANK YOU, JOHN MCKAY DID

HAVE A QUESTION. >> JOHN, ON THE ELEVATIONS FOR THE FRONT DOOR YOU SHOW IT I GRILL, I THINK A SIX LIGHT AND ON THE SPECS THAT WAS GIVEN IT JUST THE HALF-LIGHT, IS IT MORE

LIKE THAT OR IS IT THE MATERIALS THAT SHOW JUST THE HALF? >> WAS THAT A CUT SHEET CUSTOMER

THE CUT SHEET IS THE ACCURATE ONE. >> REPORTER: SO IT IS JUST ONE

OPEN STOREFRONT. >> NO. >> THEY JUST HAD A HALF-LIGHT

AND IT WAS WAS SOLID. >> I THINK IT JUST THE PARTICULAR CUT THE GLASSES AND

SAYS THE. IT IS NOT AS CLOSE TO THE FLOOR. >> OKAY.

I THOUGHT THERE WAS A SMOOTH ONE CIRCLE. SEE THAT CIRCLE RIGHT THERE.

>> AND THEN YOU ARE GOING TO THE 200 SERIES OF THE WINDOWS. DID WE HAVE A CONTEXTUAL FRONT ELEVATION OF THIS PROPERTY THAT SHOWS THE TWO HOUSES TOGETHER? AND I THINK BE PROVIDED THAT

BACK AT THE PRELIMINARY CONCEPT LEVEL. >> NOW THAT YOU HAVE RAISED IT I THINK WE ARE CLOSER IN HEIGHT. SO I AM NOT LOOKING DOWN SPINNING I KNOW THE PLANS THAT YOU HAVE LISTED IT AT 27. AND THERE IS SOME UNDULATION ON THE LOTS.

WE ARE ACTUALLY AT ABOUT 25 RIGHT NOW ACCORDING IF I LOOK THE ELEVATIONS SHOW IT AT 25.

>> 25 FROM EXISTING GRADE. >> THAT'S PRETTY CLOSE. >> THAT'S A PRETTY BIG DIP IN

FRONT OF YOUR HOUSE. >> THAT IS ALL MY QUESTIONS FOR JOHN.

>> ANYTHING ELSE? WE ARE GOING TO LET JOHN GO. AND OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING.

IF THERE IS ANYONE HERE WHO WISHES TO SEEK IN REGARDS TO 2020-0037 AT 316 NORTH THIRD STREET, THIS WOULD BE THE TIME. PLEASE, BUT IDENTIFY YOURSELF FOR THE RECORD.

WE HAVE ONE PERSON ON THE LINE. IDENTIFY YOURSELF ON NORDSON. 116.

>> WELCOME TO THE NEIGHBORHOOD. >> THANK YOU. >> FIRST, IT IS A PLEASURE TO MEET EVERYBODY. I LOOK FORWARD TO GETTING TO KNOW EVERYBODY ENJOYING THIS GREAT COMMUNITY. THINGS HAVE CHANGED A LITTLE BIT SINCE THE LAST MEETING OBVIOUSLY SO, I WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT I LET EVERYBODY KNOW I APPRECIATE YOUR TIME AND IT IS A BIG COMMITMENT TO BE ON THE ACC AND I UNDERSTAND THAT YOUR TIME IS VALUABLE.

REALLY WHAT I WANTED TO DO, I KIND OF STRUGGLED ON HOW I WANTED TO APPROACH THIS.

OBVIOUSLY THE TREE HAS BEEN A POINT OF CONVERSATION. I REALLY STRUGGLED WITH HOW TO APPROACH THIS BUT I THINK THE BEST WAY TO DO IT IS REALLY IN REGARDS TO AN E-MAIL THAT WAS SENT HER THERE WAS AN E-MAIL SENT TO AND I WAS ALERTED ON DECEMBER.

AND IN THIS E-MAIL THERE WAS A COUPLE OF CONCERNS. IN THIS E-MAIL.

I THOUGHT THE BEST WAY TO DO THIS TO LEARN ABOUT ME AND MY INTENTIONS.

WAS TO REALLY ADDRESS THE E-MAIL AND THE POINTS THAT WERE MADE. THAT IS WHAT I AM PROPOSING TO DO. BEAR WITH ME FOR JUST ONE MINUTE.

THE FIRST POINT I WANT TO MAKE IS THAT I AM FROM HERE. I GREW UP HERE.

I CONSIDER MYSELF BLESSED IN THE FACT THAT I AM ABLE TO BUY A PIECE OF PROPERTY HERE IN A PLACE THAT IS SPECIAL TO ME. BUT I AM ALSO LUCKY IN THE FACT THAT NO CHOICE OF MY EYE WAS BROUGHT HERE. I MOVED HERE THE CHOICE OF MY PARENTS IN 197.

SO, I HAVE DEEP ROOTS IN THIS COMMUNITY AND DEEP ROOTS IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT.

I SPENT COUNTLESS DAYS AND HOURS. I HAD A HIGH SCHOOL GIRLFRIEND WHO LIVED IN THE 200 BLOCK -- I HAVE MULTIPLE FRIENDS ON THE 400 BLOCK OF THIRD STREET.

I SPENT TIME IN BEAUTIFUL HOMES THAT GRACED US IN GRACE THIS AREA ON NORTH SIXTH STREET.

IS SO, I HAVE A UNIQUE UNDERSTANDING OF WHAT IT MEANS TO LIVE HERE AND I TAKE GREAT PRIDE IN THAT I ALSO TAKE GREAT PRIDE IN THE FACT THAT WHAT I AM TRYING TO DO WITH THIS IS

[01:40:08]

I THINK THE REASONABLE APPROACH HERE IS DEFINITELY -- AS MR. COTNER STATED WE HAVE PROPOSED A LIVE OAK EXAMPLE WHICH IN MY UNDERSTANDING IS MUCH MORE DURABLE THAN THE LAUREL OAK ON THE PROPERTY. AND Z HAS THE OPPORTUNITY TO LAST GENERATIONS WITHIN THE NEIGHBORHOOD AND BECOME A PIECE OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD FOR GENERATIONS TO COME.

SO, THE SECOND POINT I WANT TO ADDRESS IS A COMMENT THAT WAS MADE IN THE E-MAIL.

MANY WHO BUY IN THE AREA HAVE FOUND PROPERTY THEY LIKE. AND SORRY NO WAY MAKING AN INTENTIONAL CHOICE TO LIVE IN OUR HISTORY COMMUNITY. HONORING THOSE WHO HAVE COME BEFORE AND ADDING TO HISTORY WE SHARE AFTER PURCHASE TO FIND THE HISTORIC GUIDELINES TO FALL IN THE BUILDING RENOVATION PROCESS. REST ASSURED, I HAVE EXPERIENCED I MOVED HERE FROM THE AVONDALE AREA. I LIVED IN THE HISTORIC AREA THAT IS GOVERNED BY RIVERSIDE AVONDALE PRESERVATION. I LIVED IN A HOUSE BUILT IN THE 1920S.

I MADE RENOVATIONS TO THEN HOME. I WENT THROUGH THE PROCESS. SO IF ANYBODY HAS AN UNDERSTANDING OF WHAT IT MEANS AND WHAT IT TAKES TO LIVE AND MAINTAIN A HOME IN A HISTORIC

SOCIETY OR AREA, I FEEL STRONGLY THAT I DO. >> THANK YOU.

>> THE LAST POINT THAT I WOULD LIKE TO ADDRESS WAS THE PROPERTY OWNER AT 316 NORTH THIRD STREET IS TO COME TO UNDERSTAND THAT OF OUR SHARED HISTORY. AND OF THE GREATER GOOD.

AND SO, I THINK CLEARLY I HAVE ADDRESSED THE. WHETHER IT BE THE FACT OF MY MEMORIES OF ALL DATE MYSELF. GOING BACK TO HARBOR LIGHTS AS A CHILD TO BUY BASEBALL CARDS FOR PEOPLE WHO DON'T KNOW. THAT IS WHERE CAFÉ CARIBOO IS NOW.

WHETHER IT BE GOING TO THIS LIMP SHOP BY SKATEBOARD WHICH THANKFULLY STILL THERE AND I CAN STILL DO THAT YOUR I LOOK FORWARD TO BUYING A BIKE AS SOON AS I GET INTO THE NEIGHBORHOOD.

WHETHER WALKING FROM THE MIDDLE SCHOOL TO THE PUBLIC LIBRARY DOWNTOWN, TO STUDY OR AGAIN, DATING MYSELF BUT HOLINESS ENCYCLOPEDIA TO DO A RESEARCH PROJECT FOR SCHOOL.

THOSE ARE ALL PART OF MY MEMORIES. AND I AM LUCKY ENOUGH AND BLESSED THAT I GET TO BRING MY CHILDREN TO THIS NEIGHBORHOOD SO THAT THEY CAN GROW AND EXPERIENCE A LOT OF THE THINGS THAT MAKE THIS A GREAT. WITH THAT, I APPRECIATE EVERYONE'S TIME AND ATTENTION. I DO WANT EVERYBODY TO UNDERSTAND THAT I UNDERSTAND THE PASSION BEHIND MEMBERS OF THE BOARD AND THE COMMUNITY AND THEIR DESIRE TO SAVE THE TREES.

I AM WITH THAT. BUT UNFORTUNATELY IN THIS SITUATION THAT IS NOT FEASIBLE IN MY OPINION. I THINK THAT MITIGATION IS THE REASON WE ARE THAT'S THE ROUTE

[01:45:01]

>> ACTUALLY WERE IN THE PUBLIC HEARINGS MICK. >> PUBLIC HEARING -- I LOST TRACK. 2020-037 NORTH THIRD STREET. I KNOW THEY BEEN WAITING

PATIENTLY. COULD WE GO AHEAD? >> SHE IS ON MAKE THANK YOU.

PLEASE STATE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS FOR THE RECORD AND WE HAVE TO SWEAR YOU IN.

>> RIGHT HERE. >> IT DEBORAH ON -- NORTH THIRD STREET.

THANK YOU ESCARPMENT STEMMING WOULD YOU PLEASE RAISE YOUR RIGHT HAND.

TO SWEAR OR AFFIRMED THAT THE ORAL AND/OR WRITTEN TESTIMONY THAT YOU ARE ABOUT TO GIVE WILL

BE THE TRUE, THE TRUTH AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH? >> I DO.

>> OF FIRST, I WANT TO SAY THAT E-MAIL YOUR RESPONSE IS MINE AND I WANTED TO JUST THANK YOU FOR SHARING YOUR RESPONSES TO SOME OF THE COMMENTS THAT I HAVE MADE.

I WOULD LIKE TO BE PORTIONS OF THAT AND ENTER THEM INTO THE RECORD TONIGHT.

IT IS IMPORTANT TO ME AND OTHERS IN THE COMMUNITY. THAT WE BEGIN TO RECOGNIZE AND ADDRESS THE GROWING NEED FOR INTENTIONAL PROTECTION AND PRESERVATION OF AN IMPORTANT PIECE OF HISTORY IN THIS BELOVED HISTORIC TOWN AND TO KNOW THAT YOU ARE A PART OF THE HISTORY OF THE FERNANDINA BEACH. OUR TREES ARE PART OF THAT HISTORY.

WHILE I KNOW THAT THE CURRENT TREE ORDINANCE HAS ABSOLUTELY NO TEETH AND THAT THE HBC HAS NO JURISDICTION OVER PROTECTION OF TREES, I BELIEVE THIS CAN IN MOST CHANGE EFFORTS TO BE AN OUTGOING OR FORMER MAYOR STATES ON THE CITIES WEBSITE, THE CITY OF MAJESTIC TREES.

IT HAS BEEN MY UNDERSTANDING THAT THE VARIANCE WAS GRANTED TO YOU, TODD TO THE PROPERTY OWNERS ON 316 SHIFTING THE HOUSE FOR WHICH IT WAS IMPLIED TO ME AND INTENTION TO SAVE THE TREE THAT STANDS ON THE PROPERTY. WHILE THE PROPERTY IS VOID OF ANY HISTORICS RUPTURE OR ANY HISTORIC RELICS THAT HAVE YET TO BE FOUND, THERE IS A PIECE OF HISTORY ON THE LOT.

IT IS THIS TREE, THIS 24-INCH CALIPER LAUREL OAK. NOW, I UNDERSTAND THAT THE HOUSE IS JUST BIG ENOUGH THAT THAT WORK FOR REMOVAL. I APPRECIATE THE CONCEPT OF MITIGATION. HOWEVER, IN OUR LIFETIME NEGATION EVEN WITH THE LARGER TREE CHOICE, THE 4-INCH PACKET MITIGATION OF THE TREE WILL NOT SERVE TO REPLACE THE BEAUTY, THE CANOPY AND THE NATURAL HABITAT FOR THE HOCKS AND OTHER WILDLIFE.

IN THE HISTORY THAT SHE REPRESENTS. AND, DESPITE GRANTING A VARIANCE TO DECREASE THE FRONT SETBACK TO ORDER BETTER PLACE THE HOUSE ON THE LOT, IT IS STILL A CHOICE TO EXTEND THAT REAR DECK FAR ENOUGH INTO THE BACKYARD TO REQUIRE REMOVAL OF THE TREES.

IT IS THE ONLY PIECE -- ON THE PROPERTY. I UNDERSTAND AND I HEAR THAT CREATIVE SOLUTION TO SAVE THE TREE HAS BEEN EXPLORED. I'M JUST NOT CONVINCED.

NOW, I HEAR YOU HAVE BEEN A PART OF THIS HISTORY, BUT MY EXPERIENCE IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT OVER THE PAST YEAR HAS BEEN THAT THERE ARE MANY COMMON TO THE AREA WHO BY THEIR JUST BECAUSE THEY HAVE FOUND A PIECE OF PROPERTY THEY LIKE. THEY ARE NO WAY MAKING A CHOICE TO BE A PART OF OUR HISTORIC. TO HONOR OR TO ADD TO THE RICH HISTORY.

SUMMARY BEEN SURPRISED AS YOU NOTICED FROM MY E-MAIL, THAT THEY FIND THEIR HISTORIC GUIDELINES WE HAVE EXPERIENCED THAT WITH ADJACENT NEIGHBORS BEHIND US.

THEY HAD NO IDEA THEY SAID THAT THERE WAS ANY KIND OF HISTORIC GUIDELINES THAT THEY HAD TO FOLLOW WHEN A RESTORATION OR RENOVATION. IF OUR TREES, IF OUR HISTORY INCLUDING OUR TREES ARE TO BE PRESERVED WE HAVE GOT TO ELEVATE THE AWARENESS.

AND ITS ENTITY FEES. IF OUR HISTORY INCLUDING OUR TREES IS TO BE PRESERVED BACK THE TREE ORDINANCE HAS TO BE STRENGTHENED IN LANGUAGE AND INTENT TO PROTECT OUR MAJESTIC TREES AND SPECIFIC AND MEANINGFUL WAYS. BEFORE IT IS TOO LATE AND OTHER NATURAL PIECES OF OUR TREE ARE LOST. UNTIL THEN, IT IS UP TO US.

WE AS CITIZENS, U.S. SERVANTS MUST MAKE IT A PRIORITY TO INCREASE EDUCATION, AWARENESS

[01:50:02]

SO, I THANK YOU FOR THE OPPORTUNITY TO SPEAK. I THANK YOU FOR YOUR SERVICE ON THE HDC. IN THE WAY THAT YOU'RE ABLE AS CITIZENS AND AS SERVANTS.

I THINK YOU FOR ADDRESSING THIS ISSUE IN THE COMING WEEKS AND MONTHS IT MAY TAKE YEARS.

WITH COURAGE AND COMMITMENT ON HELPING US ALL CHOOSE TO STRENGTHEN THE PROTECTION.

THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU. WE APPRECIATE YOUR COMMENTS.

ANYBODY ELSE WISHES TO TESTIFY IN REGARDS TO 2020-37. WE WILL CLOSE THE MEETING FOR

DISCUSSION WHERE ARE WE? >> CAN JUST MAKE A COMMENT? >> I AM PARTICIPATING.

I JUST REALLY WANT TO BE VERY CLEAR HERE THAT MY VOICE TOWARDS THIS SITUATION IS NOT TO PROHIBIT THE APPLICANT FROM ENJOYING A BUILDING OF THIS PROPERTY AND THE REPLACEMENT I INITIATE THE REPLACEMENT WITH A 4-INCH CALIPER TREE THAT'S GREAT.

THIS IS A 47 BUT WITH CANOPY RIGHT NOW. AND I CAN BE DONE PROPERLY WITH SELECTIVE A PROPER PRUNING. YOU CAN BE SAFE. AND I'M NOT EVEN GET A PUSH TOWARDS THAT. YOU MADE A COMMENT THAT I THOUGHT WAS SO APROPOS.

I GREW UP IN TREES AND CLIMBING TREES .-PERIOD-PARAGRAPH LEARNING HOW TO CUT TREES AND I HELD MY DAD CUT TREES AND I CALLED WHAT IS IT WITH. I SEE BOTH ENDS OF THAT POINT.

WHAT ARE WHEN WE WERE GOING THROUGH THE NEIGHBORHOOD, WHAT A GREAT OPPORTUNITY FOR THEM TO HAVE THIS BEAUTIFUL TREE IN IF THE CLIMBER. THEY COULD CLIMB WITHIN A FEW YEARS. MY HOPE IN ALL OF THIS IS NONSENSE, IT'S TO MOVE US FROM A PUNITIVE TREE NARRATIVE WHERE THEY SAY CUT THE TREE OR WERE GOING TO HAVE GO BEFORE THE BOARD OR GET A PERMIT. MY HOPE IS THAT WE RAISE SOME CONSCIOUSNESS AND SHIFT THE NARRATIVE TO SOMETHING MORE PROGRESSIVE WHERE ALL OF US APPRECIATE THE VALUE THE ECONOMIC VALUE THE EROSION CONTROL AND I WANTED TO TEACH THE KIDS THAT AND THIS PARTICULAR PLAN CANNOT BE BUILT WITH THAT TREE THERE SO, WHAT WENT TO BE A STEWARDS WE ARE ALL STEWARDS OF OUR PROPERTY. AND WENT TO BE SAY, YOU KNOW WHAT MAYBE I SACRIFICE NP AND THAT ONE CORNER OR MAYBE I ASKED HER THE VARIANCE TO MOVE UP ONE MORE FOOT.

YOU CAN STILL WHOP A FUN AND BE EVEN WITH MY HOUSE AND THAT WOULD GIVE YOU ANOTHER FOOT IN THE BACK. THAT'S MICHAEL. NOT TO BE A COG IN THE WHEEL BUT TO INCREASE AWARENESS AND HOPEFULLY EDUCATION AND CHANGE THE CULTURE LITTLE BIT AND

THAT'S ALL I HAVE ON THIS. >> THANK YOU. VERY THOUGHTFUL.

BOARD MEMBERS, WHAT WE THINK. >> WILL COME BACK. >> MR. POZZETTA ANYTHING YOU WOULD LIKE TO OFFER? THANK I THINK IT IS REGRETTABLE THAT THE TREE HAPPENS TO YOU WERE SET. I FEEL LIKE THE HOUSE ITSELF FOR ME, THE DECISION IS BASED ON THE DESIGN OF THE HOUSE. THE HOUSE IS APPROPRIATE IN SCALE, PROPORTION, THEY HAVE DONE SO MANY THINGS RIGHT. IT TAKES ALL OF THE BOXES. THE POSITIONING OF THE HOUSE

[01:55:03]

BUT BACK I DON'T EVEN COMPLETELY REMOVING THE BACK PORCH I DON'T THINK IT'S A SET THREE.

SO, I DON'T SEE AN EASY SOLUTION OR EVEN A DIFFICULT SOLUTION THAT MAKES SENSE.

I'M FOCUSED ON THE POSITIVE ELEMENTS OF THIS HOUSE RIGHT NOW IS SOMETHING, ANYTHING?

>> TO THE POINT, THERE USED TO BE AN UGLY OLD CEDAR TREE NEXT TO MY HOUSE IN NC LOT.

AND THERE IS NOTHING IN ANY ORDINANCE SAVING IT BUT THEY ALSO ALL USED TO SAY IT WAS THE BEST TREE IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD. ALL THE KIDS IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD USED TO CLIMATE.

WE LOST OF HER DRIVEWAY AND IT WAS SO MUCH MORE OF A LAW THAN JUST THE DRIVEWAY.

BECAUSE IT WAS A GATHERING PLACE CHILDREN. I DO THINK IT'S ON FORTUNATE THAT MAYBE THIS HAS BECOME A LINCHPIN FOR A BIGGER ISSUE. ON THIS ONE TREE IS VISIBLE ON PREVIOUS PROJECTS. THERE'S OTHER PROJECTS WITH JUST AS MANY TREES.

SO, I WILL SAY THAT I THINK IT IS UNFORTUNATE THERE DOES NOT TO BE EASY SOLUTION TO SAVE THIS PARTICULAR TREE. AND I'M GLAD GLAD TO HEAR THAT MAYBE THERE'S SOME MOMENTUM FORWARD THAT WE CAN ASK PROPERTY OWNERS OR WE CAN PRESERVE THOSE. BUT THIS IS MY FIRST MEETING.

I AM JUST REALLY LOOKING AT THE RESEARCH PRIOR TO COMING AND I AM STILL UNCLEAR AS TO WHETHER AS A BOARD THAT WE HAVE ANY ABILITY TO DENY THIS BASED ON A TREE.

>> I HAD ONE RESPONSE TO THAT. THE THINGS THAT I ALWAYS DO WHEN I AM LOOKING AT EIGHT.

I RELY ON THE HISTORIC DISTRICT GUIDELINES. THE LDC AND THE OVERARCHING CONFLICT. AND, WHILE THERE IS NOTHING IN OUR HISTORIC DISTRICT GUIDELINES WHEN YOU STEP UP TO THE LDC WHAT I FOUND UNDER THE GENERAL DIVISIONS.

EIGHT.ZERO.ZERO ONE THE INTENSE SUBSECTION PARAGRAPH UNDER A IS TO ACCOMPLISH THE PROTECTION AND ENHANCEMENT PERPETUATION OF BUILDINGS, STRUCTURES, SITE OF LANDSCAPE FEATURES AND UNDER B TO SAFEGUARD THE CITY START A SEXUAL CULTURAL, ECONOMIC AND NATURAL HERITAGE.

AND UNDER THE OVERLAY SECTION OF THE LDC 801-0101 IS STANDARDS FOR NEW DEVELOPMENT .-PERIOD-PARAGRAPH D SAYS THE FOLLOWING FEATURE SHALL BE ENTERED BY THE HISTORIC DISTRICT COUNCIL. SETBACKS OR ORIENTATIONS AND SITE COVERAGE.

SO, IN MY MIND THAT TREE IS A HISTORIC FEATURE UNNATURAL HISTORIC FEATURE IN THE SETBACKS AND THE ORIENTATION OF THE SITE COVERAGE CAN BE ARGUED THAT COULD BE SOMETHING FOR DENIAL IF

WE SO BE. >> OR APPROVES MY CORE APPROVED. >> EITHER WAY.

>> SO, I THINK TAMMI IS FOR EXAMPLE. I KEEP GOING BACK TO EARLY MCCALL'S ANALYSIS AND THE BIG THING THAT STEPS UP TO ME IS WHEN HE TALKS ABOUT HOW CLOSE CAN YOU BE TO THE TREE TO GIVE THIS TREE IS A GOOD CHANCE OF SURVIVAL AND HIS NUMBER IS 10 FEET. IF YOU DRAW 10-FOOT CIRCLE AROUND THE ENTRY, THERE IS JUST NOTHING LEFT ON THAT SITE. HOW BIG OF A HOUSE CAN YOU PUT ON THERE.

IT IS NOT MUCH OF A HOUSE. SO, THAT IS WHERE THIS BECOME SO DIFFICULT TO ACCOMMODATE THE TREE WHEN REALISTICALLY IF YOU -- IT IF THIS IS AN ARBORIST WHO KNOWS HIS STUFF AND HE IS LOOKING FOR 10 FEET. AND I JUST DON'T KNOW IF WE CAN GIVE HIM 10 FEET.

>> I THINK 10 FEET IS A LITTLE GENEROUS. I MY GARAGES -- WHEN THEY RAISE THIS UP WE HAD A PURE FOUNDATION. SO, WE HAD WATER INFILTRATION AND THE ROOTS WILL GO UNDERNEATH THE HOUSE AS OPPOSED TO -- WILL COME THROUGH.

MY GARAGES A SLAB ON GRADE. I'M 14 INCHES WITH A 32-INCH -- BUILT THAT 14 INCHES AWAY.

[02:00:06]

SO AGAIN. IT'S A CHOICE. >> MR. HARRISON.

>> THANK YOU. I APPRECIATE THE TIME. MY MIND IS BEST AND THE ISSUE IS WHERE THE QUESTION IS. IF THE TREE -- BUT THE VARIANCE WAS ON MOVING THE PROPERTY FORWARD TO ALLOW ROOM FOR THE TREE. DOES THE VARIANCE STILL STAND?

>> ITS CONTEXT-SENSITIVE SETBACKS. >> IT IS NOT A VARIANCE.

THE CONTEXT-SENSITIVE REVIEW WAS DIFFERENT. IT IS TAKEN INTO CONSIDERATION THE OTHER PROPERTIES ON THE BLOCK PHASE TO WHERE THEY ARE SET HISTORICALLY THE FUNDS ARE.

>> THANK YOU. IF I MIGHT PACK I HAVE LITERALLY LOOKED AT PROPERTIES LAFAYETTE STREET IN THE PAST IS THAT I'M NOT BUYING THAT BECAUSE I DON'T KNOW THAT TREE.

BECAUSE THERE ARE TIMES WHEN YOU REALLY DON'T WANT THAT ON. IN THIS CASE.

I WOULD BE CONCERNED THAT IF WE ADJUSTED THE HOUSE TO GET THE 1T THE TREE IS SUCH A WAY THAT IS

NOT GOING TO BE WHAT WE WANTED TO BE WHEN WE WERE DONE. >> WE HAVE APPROVED TONIGHT MUCH MORE DESTRUCTION OF TREES THEN THIS ONE IN PARTICULAR. AND I JUST FEEL LIKE THIS FAMILY HAS BROUGHT THIS PROPERTY IN IT TO JOINT. VACANCIES.

WHICH IS WHY YOU WOULD NEVER WANT TO BUY A PROPERTY WITH A DIAGNOSTIC LIVE OAK IN THE MIDDLE OF IT BECAUSE ACT WE WILL STRAP SOMEBODY TO IT AND YOU WILL NEVER GET A CHANCE TO GO THERE. BUT IN THIS CASE IT'S NOT THAT KIND OF A TREE.

AND I THINK THEY GET TO USE IT. A COUPLE OF BLOCKS AWAY, SOMEONE IS BUILDING ANOTHER HOUSE THAT NEVER CAME TO THIS BODY. AND THEY ARE CUTTING DOWN MORE THAN YOUR INCHES THEN WE ARE TALKING ABOUT RIGHT HERE AND RIGHT NOW. SOMEWHERE AROUND 9 FEET I SAW THIS SO, THE ONE THING THEY TEACH YOU IN PUBLIC POLICY SCHOOL IS THAT YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO TREAT EVERYBODY THE SAME WAY. AND. PRESS TO HOLD THIS PROPERTY TO ONE SET OF STANDARDS WHILE WE ARE HOLDING OTHER PEOPLE TO KNOW STANDARDS IS REALLY PROBLEMATIC FOR ME. AND, I HAVE SPENT AN AMOUNT OF TIME LOOKING AT THIS TREE PACKETS AGREED STREET. BUT MY SENSE OF THIS IS THAT IT PROBABLY HAS TO GO SO THEY CAN

JOIN THEIR PROPERTY WITH SOMEBODY LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION? >> I WILL MAKE A MOTION.

>> I MOVED TO APPROVE CASE NUMBER HDC 2020-37 WITHOUT CONDITIONS.

I MOVE THAT HDC MAKE THE FOLLOWING FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW PART OF THE RECORD, THAT HDC CASE HDC 2020-37 IS PRESENTED IS SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANCE WITH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR STANDARDS AND THE DOWNTOWN DISTRICT DESIGN GUIDELINES TOWARD FINAL APPROVAL AT THIS TIME.

>> IS THEIR SECOND. >> YES. >> FURTHER DISCUSSION?

>> I WILL TELL YOU THIS, MS. DUNCAN SHOWS UP AND STARTS MAKING REALLY INTERESTING PUBLIC POLICY ORDINANCES IN HER FIRST MEETING. IT'S IMPRESSIVE.

I WOULD NOT BE SO BRAVE. I WOULD ARGUE THE COUNTER TO YOUR POINTS THAT WE ARE ON THE CUSP OF CHANGING. BECAUSE I WANT TO ENJOY MY PROPERTY AND SO, THERE'S GOING TO BE ATTENTION IN THE PUBLIC POLICY WITH THE COMMISSIONERS WHO ARE HERE THAT I MOVED INTO A CLEAR-CUT SUBDIVISION AND I DON'T WANT YOU WHO LIVE SOMEWHERE ELSE ON THE ISLAND TO CUT DOWN A TREE SO YOU CAN BUILD A HOUSE. I THINK THAT'S REALLY PROBLEMATIC BECAUSE WE ARE TREATING THE SAME PEOPLE DIFFERENTLY.

SO, WE NEED TO BE VERY CAREFUL WHEN WE CHANGE THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE TO ACCOMMODATE TIGHTER TREE RESTRICTIONS THAT WE DON'T DENY PEOPLES RIGHT TO DO WHAT THEY NEED TO DO.

AND I DON'T COME FROM THAT EASILY. IT WAS HARD TO GET YOU.

SO, THANK YOU VERY MUCH. ANYBODY ELSE? PLEASE CALL THE

>> MEMBER HARRISON. >> YES. >> MEMBER OF THE YES.

[02:05:03]

>> VICE CHAIR POZZETTA. >> YES. >> SHARE SPINO.

>> YES. >> MOVING ON. >> I WOULD LIKE TO ADD TO WHAT YOU SAID AND COMMENTS THAT GIVEN THAT WE WANT TO ENHANCE OUR TREE IN THE CITY, WE SHOULD MAKE CLEAR THAT WE ARE LOOKING AT NEEDING TO DO THAT ON PUBLIC PROPERTY AND NOT RELYING ON --

NECESSARILY. >> YOUR COMMISSIONERS ARE HERE LISTENING MOVING ON TO THE OPPORTUNITY FOR CITY COMMISSION TO ADDRESS THE BOARD IS ALWAYS AVAILABLE.

NOT TONIGHT. >> MR. CHAIRMAN. >> WE ARE AT TWO HOURS LAST CAN

TAKE A BREAK. >> FIVE MINUTES. >> I THINK THAT'S GOOD

[3.5 HDC 2020-0038 - RICHARD HIGGINBOTHAM, HALL INVESTMENTS INC., 231 N. FRONT STREET ]

>> WIEBE ANNOUNCED THE CASE AND WILL CONTINUE DOING EASIER ANY TESTIMONY ON IT?

>> I WOULD LIKE TO SAY A COUPLE OF THINGS PURE SO, AS YOU KNOW WE ARE WORKING ON HAVING THIS BUILDING RELOCATED AND SAVED THE APPLICATION BE FORCES -- CITY STAFF IS WORKING ON THAT RIGHT NOW AS YOU KNOW IT IS A LONG PROCESS TO GET THROUGH. WE HAVE THE APPLICANT IS BEING PATIENT WITH US AS WE WORK THROUGH THE PROCESS. HE HAS ASKED HIM I SAID I WOULD.

BEFORE THE BOARD. HE HAS ASKED IF THE BOARD WILL CONSIDER THE PARTIAL DEMO OF THE NON- HISTORIC ADDITIONS THAT HAVE BEEN ADDED ONTO THE BUILDING HERE AND WHAT I HAVE TOLD HIM IS THAT WE ARE WORKING ON GETTING THE DROIDS BUILT THAT CAN HAPPEN UNTIL AFTER WE GET THE DRAWINGS AND WE DON'T WANT TO LEAVE THE BUILDING PARTIALLY DEMOLISHED UNEXPOSED.

I TOLD THEM I WOULD PRESENT THAT TO THE BOARD BE. >> I AGREE.

THAT BRINGS UP OR WHETHER IN SOMETHING HAPPENS. >> EXCUSE ME ARE YOU TALK ABOUT

THE DEMOLITION? >> A DIFFERENT CASE. WE WILL GET THERE IN A COMMENT

ON THAT? >> I AGREE. >> I AGREE.

>> WAS SO, WE WOULD LIKE TO RECOMMEND CONTINUING THIS UNTIL FEBRUARY WHICH WILL GIVE US MORE

TIME AND WILL GIVE YOU AN UPDATE OF FEBRUARY. >> JUST TO REINFORCE THE MESSAGE. WHAT I'M HEARING FROM THE EXPERTS AT THE TABLE WAS THAT WE WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT THE HISTORIC STRUCTURES PROTECTED WHATEVER HAPPENS WITH FORWARD.

THAT MEANS WE HAVE TO DELAY THE DEMO OF THE ADULT STRUCTURES THAT WE WANT TO SEE THAT HAPPEN SO THE EXISTING STRUCTURE CAN BE PROTECTED UNTIL SMOOTH TO ITS NEW HOME.

>> CAN I GET A MOTION. MS. KOSACK IS GOOD WERE TO CONTINUE.

>> WE NEED A MOTION TO CONTINUE? >> YOU DO. >> SO, I WENT TO CONTINUE HDC CASE 2020-38 TO A DATE OF FEBRUARY 18. 2021.

>> SECOND. >> YOU HAVE THAT MS. HARTMAN? >> KOSACK AND MORRISON.

THERE WILL BE NO MORE ON DISCUSSION. CALL THE ROLL.

>> MEMBER HARRISON. >> YES. >> MEMBER MORRISON.

>> YES. >> MEMBER BASIC. >> YES VICE CHAIR POZZETTA.

[3.6 HDC 2020-0046 - MARK L. + JENNIFER D. BAILEY, 809 SAN FERNANDO STREET]

>> YES. >> SPINO. >> YES.

>> THIS IS RECONSIDERATION HDC 20200 FOR SIX OF 809 SAN FERNANDO STREET.

A CASE WE HEARD LAST MONTH. A MONTH BEFORE. THEY'VE ASKED FOR CONTINUATION

CONTINUATION ON THIS. >> 2020-46. >> THEY'VE ASKED FOR.

>> HE WAS HURT LAST MONTH. THE APPLICANT HAS CONTACTED US AND ASKED FOR CONTINUATION UNTIL NEXT MONTH. THEY'RE STILL WORKING TO THEIR JOINTS BUT BECAUSE THIS CASE PUBLICLY NOTICED BEFORE WE GOT THAT REQUEST IT HAS TO BE HEARD WHEN SO, IF ANYBODY WAS WATCHING

TO SEE WHAT HAPPENS. >> AND YOU HAVE ANY ADDITIONAL INFORMATION?

IS THAT THIS CASE? >> NO. >> I MOVE.

>> MOVED AND HARRISON AND A SECOND BY KOSACK ANY DISCUSSION? HEARING NONE PLEASE CALL THE

[02:10:04]

ROLL. >> MEMBER HARRISON. >> YES.

>> MEMBER MORRISON. >> YES. >> MEMBER KOSACK.

>> VICE CHAIR POZZETTA. >> YES. >> HERE SPINO.

[3.7 HDC 2020-0049 - MOSER DESIGN GROUP, AGENT FOR BILL KAVANAUGH, BLOCK 13 LOTS 7 + 9, LADIES STREET]

>> YES. >> 2020-0049, MOSER FOR KAVANAUGH.

THIS IS ACTUALLY THE PRE-PROJECT >> IS THIS A WARREN KELLY. IS SHE OUT THERE SOMEWHERE.

>> SHE IS. >> DO YOUR THING FIRST. SO, THIS IS A CASE THAT WAS HER LAST MONTH. THIS IS HDC 2028-49. BLOCK 13 MONTHS 79 ON BABY STREET AND A RECONSIDERATION OF THAT CASE WHICH WAS A CERTIFICATE OF APPROVAL TO DIRECT A TWO-STORY SINGLE-FAMILY RESIDENCE IN THE ATTACHED GARAGE WITH THE ZONING OF THE LETTER OT ONE WHICH IS HIGH RESIDENTIAL ON A VACANT PARCEL WHICH CONSISTS OF A FULL PAEONIA AND ONE MEDIUM PAEONIA. THIS WAS HEARD, APPROVAL WAS GRANTED NOVEMBER 19, 2020 FOR DESIGN THAT HAS A FOUR BAY DOUBLE GALLERY FROM PORCH RATHER THAN THE FIVE A THAT THE APPLICANT DESIRE. THIS WAS DUE TO THE PORCH PROBLEM BEING IN THE CORNER VISIBILITY TRIANGLE AND THE ASSOCIATED VARIANCE APPLICATION HDC V2020-ZERO ZERO EIGHT WAS DENIED. AFTER THE MEETING IT CAME TO STAFF ATTENTION THAT CALL OF ITSELF IS A PERMISSIBLE ENCROACHMENT INTO THE VISIBILITY TRIANGLE PER LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE SECTION 7.01.08E WHICH STATES THAT TREE TRUNKS, POEMS, AND SUPPORTING COLUMNS OR POSTS SHALL BE PERMITTED WITHIN THE CLEAR AREA PROVIDED THE LOCATION DOES NOT ITSELF CREATE A TRAFFIC HAZARD IN THE AREA IS FREE OF LANDS AND FOLIAGE. THE PROPOSED PORCH POSED INTO THIS LIST OF EXCEPTIONS AND WERE NOT CREATED TRAFFIC HAZARD SUCH AS A TREE OR SHRUB THAT HAS LIVED AS SUCH, THAT VARIANCE HAS BEEN DEEMED AVOIDED STAFF WOULD LIKE TO ASK FOR THE BOARD TO RECONSIDER THE ORIGINAL DESIGN OF THE HALL IN WHICH THE FRONT PORCH AGAINST THE FULL FIVE BASE RATHER THAN THE TRUNCATED FOUR BAY DESIGN THAT WAS APPROVED. THANK YOU.

>> MR. HARRISON. >> IS IT SUFFICIENT TO AVOID A VARIANCE THAT SOMEBODY DEEMS IT

SHOULD BE AVOIDED? >> WE DID NOT APPROVE. WE DENIED THE VARIANCE TO MAKE

THE VARIANCE WAS DENIED AND BECAUSE IT WASN'T REQUIRED. >> HAVE YOU DONE THAT?

>> WE DIDN'T DO THAT. WE FORCE THEM INTO THE FOUR BAY SCENARIO.

>> AND WE APPROVE THE FOUR BAY DESIGN. ALL THEY ARE DOING IS COMING BACK AND SAYING HEY, THE ONE THAT YOU SAID THAT WE THINK WE COULD DO WE WOULD RATHER DO THAT TO MAKE TO BRING THAT SYMMETRY AT THE FRONT OF THE HOUSE. THEY ARE STILL DOING THE PORCH COLUMN IS NOT ON THE GROUND FLOOR OF THE PORCH CONNECTING AT THE END OF THE HOUSE.

BUT THE SECOND FLOOR WILL CONTINUE OVER. SO THEY CANNOT EXTEND THE PORCH OUT OF THE COLUMN BECAUSE IT WOULD FIT WITHIN THE EXEMPTIONS THAT THEY PUT AND SO THEY HELP

TO BRING IT BACK TO THIS. >> IT HAS TO BE HIGHER THAN TEN PEOPLE OR COULD HAS TO BE CLEAR EXCEPT FOR THE CULPRITS AND THE THEY DON'T NEED THAT THE REQUIREMENT.

TO MAKE MOVED TO APPROVE. >> I WISH IT WAS THAT EASY. >> LAUREN, ARE YOU OUT THERE? LET ME GET HER ON. SHE DOESN'T HAVE TO SAY VERY MUCH.

>> WE WOULD TAKE, YES FOR AN ANSWER. >> I'M HERE, CAN YOU HEAR ME?

>> WE CAN HEAR YOU AND I THINK YOU HAVE CONSENSUS AS A PART OF YOUR APPLICATION.

BOARD MEMBERS YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR MS. KELLY? >> NO.

WE LIKE THIS TO BEGIN WITH. WE WERE MISLED BY STAFF WHICH HAPPENS ALL THE TIME.

IT'S JUST SO UNFORTUNATE. >> SO THIS IS A VERSION I WOULD LIKE APPROVED.

YOU CAN SEE THE SECOND FOR THE FIFTH PHASE. >> THANK YOU.

IS THERE ANYONE HERE WHO WISHES TO SPEAK ON CASES ZERO THE -- I'M SORRY 0049.

HEARING NOW. WE WILL CLOSE THE PUBLIC MEETING TO MOVE INTO MORE

[02:15:01]

>> I MOVED TO APPROVE. >> SECOND. >> MOVED TO APPROVE HDC CASE HDC

V IS WHAT IS LISTED. >> 2020-46. >> IS NOT A VARIANCE.

AT THAT IT'S A TYPO I MOVED TO APPROVE HDC 2020 —-DASH 49 WITHOUT CONDITIONS.

I MOVE THAT THE HDC MAKE THE FOLLOWING PART OF THE LAWN RECORD.

THAT HDC CASE 2020 -- 49 AS PRESENTED IS SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANT WITH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CARD, THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR STANDARDS OF THE GUIDELINES FOR FINAL APPROVAL AT

THIS TIME. >> SECOND. >> POZZETTA SECOND, KOSACK MOVES. NO FURTHER DISCUSSION, THIS ARTICLE IS HOW THE ROLE.

>> MEMBER HARRISON. >> YES THE NIGHT MEMBER MORRISON.

>> YES. >> MEMBER KOSACK. >> YES.

[4.1 HDC 2020-00047 - BYRON BROCATO, 205 AMELIA STREET]

>> MEMBER VICE-CHAIR POZZETTA. >> YES. >> MEMBER CHAIR SPINO.

>> YES. >> MOVING ON, HDC 202-0047 AMELIA STREET.

IF YOU CAN HEAR ME, THANK YOU FOR YOUR PATIENCE. >> THANK YOU.

MR. CUMELLA. >> THIS IS HDC 20 FUNNY-47. PROPERTY LOCATED ON 205 AMELIA THREE. HIGH DENSITY RESIDENTIAL. IT WAS A PROPERTY BUILT IN 1950.

THE REQUESTED ACTION IS A CERTIFICATE OF APPROVAL TO REPLACE EXISTING WINDOWS WITH THE SAME SIZE AND TYPE WINDOWS. IT IS THE PROPERTY HERE. OF CORNER LOT IT IS A STRUCTURE.

STAFF FINDS THAT THE WHOLESALE REPLACEMENT OF ORIGINAL WINDOWS IS NOT IN KEEPING WITH THE SECRETARY OF INTERIOR STANDARDS MAINTAINING, REPAIRING AND MAINTAINING FABRIC IS IMPORTANT TO MEETING THE CHARACTER OF ALL STRUCTURES. WOULD WINDOWS TEND MAINTENANCE. AND WOULD WINDOWS ARE DESIGNED TO LAST FOR GENERATIONS AND BE DISMANTLED, REPAIRED AND BE REINSTALLED AS WE HAVE DISCUSSED TONIGHT PICK THIS CITY OF FERNANDINA BEACH HAS A COMPREHENSIVE PLAN POLICY 11.03.11 RECOGNIZES THE IMPORTANCE OF STRUCTURES CONSTRUCTED IN THE LAST 50 YEARS AND ENCOURAGES EFFORTS TO PROTECT THE SIGNIFICANT EXAMPLES OF THE STRUCTURES AS ILLUSTRATIVE OF THE COMMUNITIES MORE RECENT HERITAGE. ALTHOUGH THE MAIN PORTION OF THE HOME WAS CONSTRUCTED IN 1950, THERE WERE LATER ADDITIONS TO THE HOME. AND LATER ADDITIONS ADDED TO THE NORTH IN A LATER T-TEST ASSESS RESTRUCTURE WAS INSTRUCTED LATER.

AS IS COMMONLY THE CASE A LATER ADDITIONS DO NOT APPEAR TO BE OF THE SAME QUALITY MATERIALS AND CRAFTSMANSHIP AS THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE. STAFF IS RECOMMENDING RETAINING AND REPAIRING THE SEVEN ORIGINAL SIX OVER SIX WITH DOUBLE HUNG WINDOWS ON THE ORIGINAL SECTIONS OF THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE WHICH ARE THREE OF THE SOUTH ELEVATION, TWO ON THE EAST AND ONE ON THE WEST OF ONE OF THE NORTH. AND ALLOWING FOR ALL OTHERS ON THE LATER EDITION OF THE GARAGE TO BE REPLACED WITH THE PROPOSED WINDOWS.

STAFF FINDS THAT THE REQUESTED ACTION IS PRESENTED IS SUBSTANTIALLY CONSISTENT WITH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE, THE SECRETARY OF INTERIOR STANDARDS, IN THE OLD TOWN FERNANDINA PRESERVATION GUIDELINES. STAFF RECOMMENDS A APPROVAL OF HDC 2020-47 WITH THE CONDITIONS THAT ONE, SEVEN ORIGINAL SIX OVER SIX WITH DOUBLE HUNG WINDOWS ON THE ORIGINAL SECTION OF THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE BE RETAINED AND REPAIRED AND NUMBER TWO, ALL OTHERS ON THE LATER EDITION ACCESS RESTRUCTURE BE REPLACED WITH THE PROPOSED WINDOW.

THANK YOU. >> WHAT IS PROPOSED? >> WHAT IS THE MEAN WHEN THEY SAY THEY WILL BE REPLACED WITH WINDOWS OF THE SAME SIZE AND TYPE?

>> I BELIEVE IT'S THE CONFIGURATION THEY WERE PROPOSING A SIX OVER SIX WINDOW

TO REPLACE THE -- OF THE WINDOWS. >> WHAT IS THE PRODUCT?

>> IT IS A MARVIN 6525. MAKE. >> THE PICTURES IN OUR FILE OF SIX OR SIX -- THERE'S NO CALL OUT TO WHERE THOSE ARE THEY ALL IN THE ORIGINAL STRUCTURE? SO EVERYTHING WE SEE IN THE PICTURE YOU WANT THE SIX BY SIX IS RETAINED?

>> NOT ALL OF THE SIX OVER SIX. IT IS JUST THE PARTICULAR ONES THAT ARE ORIGINAL TO THAT STRUCTURE. WHICH ARE THE THREE SOUTH ELEVATION.

TO EAST ELEVATION. ONE WEST ELEVATION. AND ONE NORTH ELEVATION ANY

[02:20:05]

OTHER QUESTIONS? >> COME ON UP AND IDENTIFY YOURSELF FOR THE RECORD.

JUST. >> 205 AMELIA STREET. THE RECOMMENDATION TO RETAIN AND

REPAIR WHAT IS THERE. >> ON THE ORIGINAL PART OF THE STRUCTURE.

AND REPLACING THE OTHERS. >> WELL. AS YOU WILL SEE IN SOME OF THESE PICTURES THAT TWO OF THE COMPLETE WINDOWS UPPER AND LOWER STASHES TWO OF THE WINDOWS THEY HAD NO LOWER STATUES. THEY ARE COMPLETELY GONE. THEY IS NOTHING THERE'S REPAIRED. I HAVE NO WAY FOR THEM. THERE'S NOTHING IN THE WINDOW.

THE WINDOWS ARE NOT OPERABLE. THEY ARE DETERIORATING. YOU CANNOT OPEN THEM.

SO, I'M NOT SURE HOW I'M GOING TO REPAIR SOMETHING THAT IS NOT THERE.

>> YES, IT IS A RE-CREATED SASH. YOU NOT REPAIRING THE BOTTOM SASH ON THOSE WINDOWS BECAUSE THERE IS NOTHING THERE BUT THAT IS THE REPAIR. YOU'RE GOING TO KEEP LIKE IN THE PICTURE BEHIND TO THE TOP SASH AND REPLACE THE BOTTOM SASH WHICH IS A NEW WOOD SASH AND ALL THE ASSOCIATED HARDWARE IS SUPPOSED TO COME -- YOU WANT ME TO SOURCE THAT SOMEWHERE THERE IS NO HARDWARE TO MAKE SO, THE WINDOWS IS, THAT THIS ASHLEY WOULD GO OR ARE BROKEN IN THE

ACTUAL WINDOW. >> THEY ARE COMPLETELY GONE. >> THEIR SPECIALTY COMPANIES.

>> THEY ARE NOT ORIGINAL TO THE HOUSE EITHER. >> ARE YOU A NEW OWNER OF THE HOUSE? MY GUESS. I'VE BEEN PUTTING A LOT OF

EFFORT INTO IT TO GET IT TO FIT IN. >> IT'S NONCONFORMING IN A LOT

OF WAYS. >> IT WHAT WE PROPOSED WITH THE MARVIN WINDOWS OF LIKE KIND, SHAPE, SIZE, YOU WILL BE TOUGH TO CEMENT PROBABLY THE BIGGEST DIFFERENCE THAT I NOTICED WHEN I WENT THROUGH THE SAME THING ON MY HOME IS WHEN I LOOK AT THE SIX OVER SIX THE YOU CAN'T DIRECTLY KATE THAT. EVEN THE NEW WINDOWS THAT ARE CHUNKIER AND BEEF YEAR.

I UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE GOING THROUGH BECAUSE. >> NOT HAVING THE LOWER STASHES

ON SOME OF THOSE WINDOWS. >> HOW MANY WINDOWS ARE WE TALKING ABOUT IN TOTAL?

THERE IS NINE ON THE ORIGINAL STRUCTURE BUT IN THE OUTBUILDING >> SOME ARE NOT EVEN WINDOWS

JUST A PIECE OF GLASS. >> HOW MANY OPENINGS? >> THERE IS A.

TWO MEDICAID OPENINGS ON THE ORIGINAL HOUSE AND THEN YOU HAVE GOT YOUR SHED.

>> AND THOSE. >> HOW MANY ARE OPERABLE? >> NONE.

SUE MCKAY WENT BY THE OTHER DAY AND FROM THE STREET YOU CAN SEE IT'S PRETTY ROUGH.

THANK YOU. WITH PAGES THAT? >> THIS IS THE SURVEY THAT IS

PAGES 308. >> THANK YOU. YOU ARE 518 AGE AGENDA.

>> I GUESS GO AHEAD. >> IS THERE FIRST OF ALL, I LOVE CM WHO IS A GOOD FRIEND OF MINE.

BUT ISN'T THERE SOME SORT OF STANDARD HERE AS FAR AS WHO DOES THESE SURVEYS AS THE A PERSON WHO ACTUALLY HAS EXPERIENCE DEALING WITH HISTORIC WINDOWS. AS MUCH AS I LOVE SAM I'M PRETTY CONFIDENT THAT HE IS NOT AN EXPERT AT THE RESTORATION OF HISTORIC WINDOWS THAT HE ACTUALLY SELLS NEW WINDOWS. SO, I'M NOT SURE AND MAYBE THAT'S PART OF THE REASON WHY, GETTING A COMPANY TO TAKE A LOOK AT A REALLY DO SPECIALIZE IN THESE TYPES OF WINDOWS WHICH THOU CAN GIVE YOU THE NAMES OF. THE ALLENDALE WINDOW OUT OF JACKSONVILLE IS WHEN WE FEEL AFTER BUT, IT IF YOU GET SOMEBODY LIKE THAT TO COME UP AND TAKE A LOOK AT IT, I THINK THEY CAN HOLD YOUR HAND TO THE PROCESS IN A WAY THAT DOESN'T SEEM SO SCARY.

>> IT'S NOT GOING TO BE A BURDEN ON YOU. >> IT'S NOT SCARY.

IS JUST THAT THE HOME, AND QUITE FRANKLY IF YOU HAVE SOMEBODY WHO COMES TO LOOK AT IT AND THEY ISSUE AND THEY SAID LOOK AT THERE'S JUST NO WAY THAT THESE THINGS MAKE SENSE TO SALVAGE THE WE WOULD PROBABLY LOOK AT IT IN A DIFFERENT LIGHT. THE WHOLE POINT OF THIS PROCESS IS TO GET BACK FROM SOMEBODY WHO IS LEGITIMATELY AN EXPERT IN THE FIELD OF RESTORATION OF HISTORIC

[02:25:01]

AND, I THINK WITHOUT HAVING THAT MAKES IT DIFFICULT TO MAKE A POINT NOSY TURBERVILLE YOU

SHOULD. >> I THINK THAT THESE WINDOWS ARE CERTAINLY PAST THEIR PRIME AND WHEN THEY FIRST BROUGHT THE PROPERTY MY FIRST EXPECTATION IS THAT THEY WERE GOING TO BULLDOZE

THE PROPERTY DOWN. >> AGREED. MAYBE YOU SHOULD APPEAR.

>> IT CERTAINLY IS NOT I CAN SHOOTING MAKE THIS IS AN OFFICIAL --

>> IT SO, WE ARE SAYING THAT THE WINDOWS ARE THE ONLY THING ON THE STRUCTURE THAT IS HISTORICAL IS THE WINDOWS? DOES THE STRUCTURE ITSELF IS AN HISTORICAL?

NONCONTRIBUTING? >> IT THEY ARE APPROPRIATE TO THE AGE OF THE HOUSE.

THAT'S THE ISSUE. THEY ARE ONE OF THE PRIMARY CHARACTER DEFINING FEATURES OF THE PROPERTY SO, TO REMOVE THEM TAKE THE HOUSE EVEN FURTHER AWAY TO MAKE IS REPLACING IT IN THE LIFETIME. I UNDERSTAND THAT MODERN WINDOWS IS TOUGH TO DUPLICATE THAT.

I UNDERSTAND THAT THERE BUT, IS THERE A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE AND A

NONCONTRIBUTING SRS THE GUIDELINES? >> THERE IS.

IN OLD TOWN THERE REALLY ARE NO CONSTRICTING STRUCTURES AND THAT THERE ARE NO SPANISH PERIOD HOMES. SO, THERE ARE A COUPLE OF VICTORIAN PERIOD HOMES.

THE SWITCHES HAPPENS TO BE FROM THE 1950S. IT DOESN'T MAKE IT ANY LESS IMPORTANT THAT THE VICTORIAN HOME. AS FAR AS KEEPING THE COHESIVENESS OF THE MATERIAL THE DESIGN AESTHETIC THAT IT WAS DESIGNED WITH.

WE RECOGNIZE YOU ARE UPGRADING THE PROPERTY. SO,.

>> THAT'S AN UNDERSTATEMENT. >> I HAVE A QUESTION FOR THE BOARD.

IF THIS IS APPROPRIATE. IN THIS SITUATION ACTIVITY DOES GET AN OPINION OF A TRUE RESTORATION FIRM AND THEY SAY YES, THEY ARE BEYOND THEIR -- IF HE SAYS YES, WE CAN FIX THEM, ARE WE GOING DOWN THAT RABBIT HOLE AGAIN WHERE WE ARE APPROVING PART OF THE STRUCTURE TO HAVE NEW WINDOWS AND THEN WE HAVE WINDOWS ON PART OF IT? WHAT IS PARAMOUNT?

WHAT IS MORE IMPORTANT? >> WHAT YOU WOULD REALLY WANT TO DO IS STRIVE TOWARDS EITHER 100%

REPLACEMENT FOR 100% -- REPLICATION. >> JUST BACKUP TO THIS CASE WHAT WE WANT TO SEE? WE WOULD LIKE TO SEE THEM REBUILD SOME WOOD WINDOWS IN THIS 1880 HOUSE. LET'S GET BACK ON TRACK THE. OTHER QUESTIONS?

>> WE WILL GET THERE, MARK. I JUST FEEL LIKE WE NEED TO GET OUR PROCESS MOVING FORWARD.

THANK YOU. I APPRECIATE YOUR NOTES. ANYTHING ELSE WOULD LIKE TO ADD?

>> THAT IS WHAT I AM TRYING TO ACHIEVE YOUR TO MAINTAIN NOT ONLY THE CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE BUT THE HOME AS WELL SO THAT IT IS ALL UNIFORM. AND IT WILL NOT JUST REPLACING AS YOU SUGGESTED THE MAIN STRUCTURE AND THEN LEAVING THE OTHER ONES THE WAY THEY ARE.

THAT DID NOT MAKE SENSE TO ME. THANK YOU. >> WE WILL GO AHEAD AND MOVE TO PUBLIC HEARING. IS THERE ANYBODY HERE WHO WISHES TO SPEAK WITH REGARDS TO 234-7025 HERE ANYBODY ONLINE? A CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING WILL BE FOR DISCUSSION.

I THINK WHAT I'M HEARING IS THERE IS A BIG DISTINCTION THE 1880 HOUSE AND A 1950 HOUSE MAC I FEEL AS WE HAVE TALKED THROUGH IT AND I THOUGHT ABOUT IT AS WE HAVE BEEN LISTENING TO THE APPLICANT SPEAK AND STUFF, I THINK THERE ARE TIMES THAT WE PUT BURDENS ON PROPERTY OWNERS THAT ARE JUSTIFIED AND REALLY CONTRIBUTE TO THE GREATER GOOD OF THE COMMUNITY AND THAT ARE IMPORTANT FOR SETTING PRECEDENTS IN THIS AND THINGS LIKE THAT. AND I'M JUST NOT SURE THIS IS ONE OF THOSE CASES THERE I'M JUST NOT SURE THAT I THINK THIS IS THE PROPERTY ONLY OWNER WAS TRYING TO IMPROVE HIS PROPERTY MAKE IT NICER IT'S YOUR POINT, WHAT IS THE END GOAL YEAR? AND, I THINK THE EVENT END GOAL OF HAVING CONSISTENCY MIGHT BE BETTER THAN HAVING I AM TENDING

TOWARDS LOOKING AT APPROVING WHAT IS REQUESTED. >> AND RESPECTFULLY A STAFF RECOMMENDATION. WHAT HE SAID IS COMPLETELY RIGHT.

YOU DON'T TAKE THIS LIGHTLY. BUT THE BUS IS COMING. >> I JUST THINK IF THEY HADN'T HAD THE SAME ARGUMENTS IN THE 1900S ABOUT THE 1890S YOU WOULD NOT HAVE THOSE HOUSES.

[02:30:05]

>> THEY DID ACTUALLY. THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT THEY DID. I THINK YOUR HOLDING UP.

>> ANYTHING ELSE? >> I AM IN THE MIDDLE GROUND HERE.

I DON'T -- IT DOESN'T BOTHER ME TO SEE SOME REFURBISHED HISTORIC WOOD WINDOWS NEXT TO A NEWER WINDOW. BECAUSE THIS ONE HERE WAS UTTERLY WALK ROTTED AWAY

COMPLETELY, BUT YOU ARE ABLE TO SAVE. >> AND IN ADDITION.

>> A HISTORIC WINDOW. SO, I DEFINITELY SEE MERIT IN THAT.

I HAVE GOT A HOUSE OF THE MIX-WINDOWS. I WISH IT WAS DIFFERENT BUT IT IS WHAT IT IS. SO, I STRUGGLE WITH THAT THOUGHT BECAUSE I DO LIKE THE IDEA OF HAVING SOME HISTORIC WINDOWS AROUND UNITY BUT WE CAN POINT TO AND SAY THIS IS THE WAY THEY

USED TO BE MADE. >> SO, WOULD WE WANT TO REQUEST ANOTHER ASSESSMENT BY

RESTORATION COMPANY. >> I'M GOING TO TELL YOU MY DRIVE-BY.

THAT IT WAS ROUGH. VERY ROUGH. I DON'T THINK YOU -- I THINK THE PHOTOGRAPHS ARE -- I DON'T THINK YOU'RE GOING TO YIELD A SUBSTANTIAL CHANGE IN

RECOMMENDATION OF THE HOMEOWNER. >> I MOVED TO APPROVE. >> PLEASE DO TO MAKE.

>> 15K. >> THANK YOU. I MOVED TO APPROVE HDC 2020-47 WITHOUT CONDITION. I MOVE THAT THEY MAKE THE FOLLOWING FINDINGS OF FACTS AND CONCLUSIONS ACCORDING TO THE RECORD. THAT HDC CASE 2020-47 IS PRESENTED IS SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANCE WITH THE DEVELOPMENT CODE, THE SECRETARY OF THE ASTUTE INTERIOR STANDARDS AND THE PRESERVATION DEVELOPMENT GUIDELINES.

>> SECOND. >> ANY DISCUSSION? NONE, PLEASE CALL ROLE.

>> HARRISON. >> YES. >> MORRISON.

>> YES. >> KOSACK. >> YES.

>> VICE-CHAIR POZZETTA. >> YES. >> CHAIR SPINO.

>> YES. >> GOOD LUCK. YOU ARE APPROVED.

[4.2 HDC 2020-0048 - MARK ROSS, AGENT FOR MARION CLARK II, 205 N. 3RD STREET]

>> 2020-0048 MRS. ROSS AND CLARK FOR 2053RD STREET. >> IT IS NEXT TO THE CORNER

HOUSE. >> I WENT UP THERE THE OTHER DAY.

I AM GETTING THERE. >> THINK OF HOW MANY TREES WE HAVE SAVED.

HOW MUCH TIME. BECAUSE I CAN PUT THROUGH THIS PRETTY FAST.

TERESA DOESN'T UNDERSTAND A SOUL PEOPLE WE REALLY LIKE PAPER. >> DID YOU GO THROUGH ALL 500

PAGES? >> YES WE WOULD HAVE STOP ALL 500 PAGES.

>> THE 1990S. >> SO, THIS IS HDC 2020-48. A PROPERTY LOCATED AT 205 NORTH THIRD STREET. IT IS CURRENTLY ZONED R TO MEDIUM DENSITY RESIDENTIAL AND IS A VACANT LOT. THIS IS THE OVERHEAD OF THE LOT THERE.

THE APPLICANT IS SEEKING APPROVAL TO CONSTRUCT A TWO-STORY SINGLE-FAMILY STRUCTURE OF APPROXIMATELY 1750 SQUARE FEET WITH AN ACCESSORY STRUCTURE, PULLBACK AND FENCING.

PROPERTY RECEIVED A CONTEXT-SENSITIVE REVIEW ADMIN 2020-0023 WHICH ALLOWS FOR A NEW FRONT SETBACK OF 13.3 FEET. STAFF FINDS THAT THE HOME DESIGN IS COMPATIBLE WITH THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT IN TERMS OF MATERIAL FACT SCALED-BACK PROPORTIONS, REFORMS AND ORIENTATION. FI THROUGH ACTION IS REQUESTED IS CONSISTENT WITH A

[02:35:02]

THANK YOU. >> QUESTIONS. >> WISE THE SETBACK 13.93 FEET

AND NOT FOR TP? >> THAT IS THE CALCULATION WHEN THEY AVERAGE OUT THE EXISTING

BUILDINGS ON THAT BLOCK. >> IT'S PURELY MATHEMATICAL. WE SHOULD PROBABLY CHANGE THAT

SO IT'S ROUNDED. >> WOULD YOU GO UP OR DOWN? >> THE ROUNDING RULE ALWAYS

APPLIES. >> SALE CACTUSES LISTED AS PGT WINDOWS THAT THEY SUBMITTED A

CHANGE FOR THAT? >> I DON'T BELIEVE SO. >> OTHER QUESTIONS.

>> HERE IS THAT THE APPLICATION FOR THAT CONTACT JUST SO YOU CAN SEE WHERE THE OTHER HOUSES ON

THE BLOCK ARE AND HOW THEY ARRIVED AT THAT NUMBER. >> THIS IS THE ONGOING -- THE TAKEOVER OF FERNANDINA BEACH. THERE WILL BE A -- SHORTAGE COME 2021.

I'M ALMOST CERTAIN OF IT IS BASED ON THE ACTIVITY WE HAVE SEEN TONIGHT.

NOW WE GO TO IS THE AGENT FOR MARY CLARK HERE? >> YES.

>> ARE THEY STILL THERE? >> HAVE A GIVEN UPPER DECIDED TO ANOTHER SOUND.

>> WHO IS THIS? >> THIS IS MARK ROSS. >> CAN YOU IDENTIFY YOURSELF THE

NAME AND ADDRESS IT THAT WE HAVE TO. >> MARK ROSS, AT 201 NORTH THIRD

STREET, FERNANDINA BEACH FLORIDA, 32034. >> SO, YOU ARE THE NEIGHBOR AND

-- >> REPORTER: I AM. ACTUALLY WE JUST SOLD THAT HOUSE DOWN ON 227 NORTH THIRD STREET. 201 NORTH THIRD IS MY BROTHERS SO THAT IS WHERE WE ARE RIGHT

NOW SO WE CONSTRUCT NEXT-DOOR. >> CAN WE GET YOU TO RAISE YOUR RIGHT HAND AS HIS HEART" WHERE

YOU WENT. >> YES, CAN YOU SEE ME? MEG NOT YET.

>> WE DON'T HAVE TO SELECT WE DON'T HAVE TO SEE YOU. WE WILL TAKE YOUR WORD FOR MAKE RAISE YOUR RIGHT HAND. GO AHEAD TO MAKE YOU SWEAR OR AFFIRM THAT THE ORAL AND/OR WRITTEN TESTIMONY YOU ARE ABOUT TO GIVE WILL BE THE TRUE, THE WHOLE TRUTH AND NOTHING BUT THE

TRUTH? >> YES. IS THERE ANYTHING YOU WOULD LIKE TO ADD TO THE REPORT THAT SAL PRESENTED? I THINK WE HAVE QUESTIONS.

>> NO. I DON'T HAVE REALLY ANYTHING TO ADD.

I THINK SAL HAS DONE A GOOD JOB. >> HI MARK, IT'S TAMMI'S TWO NECK HI THERE.

HOW ARE YOU? >> THE THING THAT WE HAVE BEEN DEALING WITH A LOT OF THESE NEW BUILDS IS THE ARTICULATION OF THE LATTICE BETWEEN THE YEARS AND I THINK I SAW CONFLICTING DRAWINGS OR PROJECT DESCRIPTIONS IS THIS A STEM WALL OR A MONOLITHIC SLAB?

WHAT IS THE FOUNDATION ON THIS? >> THAT IS ON THE FRONT. THAT WAS CHANGED.

ORIGINALLY IT WAS MONOLITHIC SLAB, THE PORCH ONLY WILL BE ON USE ON INDEPENDENTLY BUILD.

AND THEN YOU HAVE THE LATTICE WEDDING BETWEEN APPEARS? >> THAT'S GOOD.

THE OTHER QUESTION I HAVE WAS FROM THE DRIVEWAY, HOW DO GET THE FRONT DOOR? IT LOOKS LIKE THE FENCE RUNS AROUND THE PERIMETER WITH NO GATES ON THE DRIVEWAY SIDE TO THE FRONT DOOR SPINNING WE ARE STRUGGLING WITHOUT A LITTLE BIT HERE WHETHER WE ACTUALLY -- WHICH DRAWING IS THIS? IF YOU GO I DON'T KNOW HOW TO CONTROL ANYTHING.

THERE IS ACTUALLY AN ENTRANCE. ON THE SIDE. THE DRIVEWAY SIDE.

SO, IF YOU GO DOWN ONE MORE RIGHT HERE, YOUR GOOD. SO, THAT RIGHT HERE.

I CAN'T POINT. BUT RIGHT THERE IS THE ENTRANCE INTO THE HOUSE.

>> SO, WHEN YOU HAVE VISITORS. WHEN THEY BECOME AN AND THE FRIENDS OF FAMILY ENTRANCE? NOBODY WOULD COME IN THROUGH THE FRONT DOOR WITH A PARK ON THE STREET AND COME TO THE FRONT

[02:40:04]

DOOR? >> PARK ON THE STREET OF IT BECAUSE WE WOULD BE USING THE DRIVEWAY. IT'S A VERY SMALL DRIVE BY PIERS OKAY.

>> I SAY SMALL DRIVEWAY, TO D. LIKE THE LAST QUESTION IS THAT YOU HAVE EXTERIOR STAIRS ON THE BUILDING. AND THAT GOES UP TO THE ATTIC. IS NOT JUST A FUNCTION OF SPACE

BECAUSE HE COULDN'T FIT INTERIOR STAIRS TO GET UP TO THE ATTIC? >> WE REALLY ARE STRUGGLING.

IF YOU NOTICE A SLOT IS NOT A STANDARD LOT. SO, IT DOES HAVE A PUT 50-FOOT FRONTAGE. BUT WE ARE DEALING WITH 82-FOOT. SO, WE ARE DEALING WITH -- YOU CAN SEE OUR LITTLE STORAGE IT'S NOT VERY MUCH. SO, THAT IS THE BEST WAY.

THE UPSTAIRS FOR NOW WILL JUST BE STORIES SPACE AS ANYONE ELSE HAS A STORAGE UNIT ON THE BACK.

WE JUST DON'T HAVE THE ROOM TO PUT IT. >> OKAY.

THAT'S IT. >> THE ONLY THING I NOTICED WAS ON THE TWO CAR PARKING PAN, IT APPEARS ON THE SITE PLAN THAT IT GOES RIGHT TO THE PROPERTY LINE HERE I JUST PULLED WISE I AM WONDERING DO YOU HAVE TO DO IS ALLOWED TO GO RIGHT TO THE PROPERTY LINE?

>> IT IS PURE. >> IT IS. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS.

>> MR. HARRISON? MR. MORRISON? >> IT DID WE ASK ABOUT PGT

WINDOWS AND CHANGING THEM OUT? >> THAT WAS STEALING? >> MARKET FACT YOU KNOW THAT PGT

WINDOWS ARE NO LONGER APPROVED? >> I DID NOT KNOW. AS OF WHEN?

>> LAST MEETING. >> A MONTH AGO. >> NO.

WE'VE DONE TOO MUCH PLANNING BEFORE THAT. THAT SOMETHING YOU TALKED ABOUT

TO WORK WITH ALAN FROM DAY ONE. THAT WAS ONE OF OUR QUESTION. >> THERE IS A GOOD ALTERNATIVE.

>> WHEN U.S. THE QUESTION GIVE YOU THE RIGHT ANSWER. HOW DO WE RESOLVE THAT?

>> MARK, YOU CUT OUT. >> WELL, I HATE TO GO BACK TO THE DRAWING BOARD ON SOMETHING THAT WE WORKED WITH FROM DAY ONE. AND THAT WE BUILT THE HOUSE DIRECTLY ACROSS THE STREET FROM THE ONE THAT WE JUST SOLD AT 224 NORTH THIRD AT THAT IS WHAT WE USE THEIR PEER SO, WE KIND OF USE A LOT OF THE SAME MATERIALS ON PURPOSE.

AND THE PGT WINDOWS WAS ONE OF THE QUESTIONS FROM DAY ONE. WHAT ARE WE TRYING TO DO?

>> I THINK UNFORTUNATELY IN THIS SITUATION YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE TO LOOK AT SOME OF THE OTHER WINDOWS THAT ARE OF THE PREAPPROVED LIST AND TRY TO FIND SOMETHING THAT WORKS WITH YOUR BUDGET AND NEEDS YOUR REQUIREMENTS. I APOLOGIZE.

SOMETIMES THINGS CHANGE BRICKS TO MAKE MY SENSES WE COULD GET APPROVAL OF THIS IF WE COULD

LEAVE THE WINDOW DECISION TO STOP APPROVAL. >> YES.

TO MAKE YES, WE WOULD BE FINE WITH THAT I DON'T THINK WE HAVE ANYTHING ELSE FOR YOU AT THIS TIME. THEN WE ARE GOING TO AS THE PUBLIC IF THERE'S ANYBODY WHO WISHES TO SPEAK IN REGARDS TO 2020-0048. WE WILL CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING

TO MOVE INTO FOR DISCUSSION. >> I WILL MAKE A MOTION. >> DO HAVE ONE QUESTION ABOUT THIS. AND THIS MAY BE FOR DISCUSSION AFTERWARDS.

SO, WE HAVE AN ALUMINUM FENCE GOING AROUND THREE SIDES OF THE FRONT AT AND 4 FEET TALL.

IT'S ALUMINUM PICKET. AND. TECHNICALLY WE END OUR GUIDELINES WE SAY WOOD OR METAL. SO TECHNICALLY THIS IS APPROVED, -- DID THE YELLOW HOUSE ACROSS THE STREET IN IT HAS, A SIMILAR FENCE AND WHITE. SO, WE HAVE LIKE THIS

PENITENTIARY SITUATION GOING ON HERE. >> WE JUST APPROVE THIS PROJECT ON ASH STREET TO HAVE A 4-FOOT ALUMINUM FENCE JUST LAST MEETING.

>> TRADITIONALLY WE HAVE ASKED FOR IT TO BE BLACK BECAUSE THE IDEAS THAT IT'S A MODERN

INTERPRETATION OF WROUGHT-IRON. >> I BROUGHT IT UP IN THE FIRST TIME WE DID THAT CASE AND I THINK 4 FEET IS TOO HOT A PERIOD OF FENCE IN A HISTORIC BUT NOBODY ELSE AGREE THAT WE PROVE

THAT SO WE DO SOMETHING DIFFERET FOR THIS GUY. >> WE HAD THE DISCUSSION.

>> I DON'T REMEMBER EITHER. I WOULD'VE BET ON THAT. >> THE FIRST TIME THAT WE TALKED ABOUT THAT HOUSE ON ASH STREET SIDE BROUGHT UP IS THAT I DID NOT THINK IT I THOUGHT A 4-FOOT

[02:45:04]

SAYS 3 FEET. >> IS MARKED OUT THERE? >> I AM HERE.

>> I THINK WHAT WE TALKED ABOUT IT BEFORE THE FENCES ARE ULTIMATELY A STOP APPROVAL THING AND ALEX AT THE WORD DEVELOPMENT CODE IS THE BASIS OF HIS APPROVAL AND LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE LIST FOR PITAS BE IN THE MAXIMUM PROOF IN SIGHT. SO WE REALLY DID NOT HAVE ANY TEETH TO BE ABLE TO SAY AND NEEDS TO BE LOWER. NOW I THINK THAT IS WHERE WE DID

UP ON IT. TO MAKE YES. >> UNLESS WE WERE SOMEDAY THINKING IT WAS THAT IMPORTANT TO LOOK AT THE GUIDELINES TO RESTRICT IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT FENCES TO A DIFFERENT STANDARD. I JUST DON'T THINK WE HAVE THE

JURISDICTION. >> BUT WE HAVE CAN MAKE MARKET FACT WOULD YOU BE WILLING TO

ENTERTAIN THE IDEA OF DOING A 3-FOOT FENCE ACROSS THE FENCE. >> WERE FINE WITH THE

FOOTPRINTS. >> AND BLACK. >> I WORRY ABOUT MY PUPPIES A LITTLE BIT. SO IF THEY CHASE THEM DOWN THE STREET THAT THEY CAN ROUTE.

BUT WE ARE FINE. >> WE COULD ADDRESS THIS MOVING FORWARD BACK I DON'T KID ABOUT

DOGS. >> CAN I MAKE A MOTION? >> I MOVED TO APPROVE CASE NUMBER HDC 202048 WITH THE FOLLOWING CONDITIONS THAT THE APPLICANTS WORK WITH STAFF TO CHOOSE AN ALTERNATE WINDOW AND DOOR MANUFACTURER THAT IS ON THE PREAPPROVED LIST AND THAT WE LIMIT THE HEIGHT OF THE PROPOSED ALUMINUM FENCE IN THE FRONT YARD TO BE 3 FEET IN THAT THE COLOR OF THE ALUMINUM FENCE SHALL BE BLACK. I MOVE THAT THE HDC MAKE THE FOLLOWING FINDINGS OF FACTS INCLUDE SOLUTIONS PART OF THE RECORD THAT HDC CASE HDC 2048 HAS PRESENTED A SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANT LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE THE SECRETARY BEEN THROUGH

STANDARDS IN THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC GUIDELINES IT. >> SECOND.

>> MOVED TO -- ANY DISCUSSION. HEARING NONE. PLEASE FOLLOW.

>> HARRISON. >> MORRISON. >> KOSACK.

[4.3 HDC 2020-0051 - NORTH FLORIDA WASTE PRO MANAGEMENT, AGENT FOR FRONT STREET PROPERTIES, LLC., 101 N. 2ND STREET ]

>> YES. >> VICE-CHAIR POZZETTA. >> YES.

>> CHAIR SPINO. >> YES. >> IT 2020-51.

NORTH MANAGEMENT THESE ARE THE WAREHOUSE -- >> CORRECT.

>> THIS IS HDTV 2020-51. PROPERTY LOCATED AT 101 NORTH SECOND STREET KNOWN AS THE CH HOYT BUILDING. IT IS A C3 CELL PROPERTY IN SUCH A BUSINESS DISTRICT.

IT IS A VACANT COMMERCIAL STRUCTURE CONSTRUCTED IN THE TWO.

IT IS IN THE CRA NEAR THE RB DEVELOPMENT AREA. IT IS NOTED THAT IT IS ALSO ELIGIBLE FOR INCLUSION INTO THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT HAS A STRUCTURE THIS IS THE PROPERTY HERE. I WILL SHOW YOU FROM THE AERIAL AS OF NOTE, WE ARE NOT TALKING ABOUT THE HISTORIC BASE PART OF THE BUILDING, THE BUILDING DID HAVE TWO LATER WAREHOUSE ADDITIONS THAT WERE ADDED ONTO IT IN THOSE WAREHOUSES ARE WHAT WE ARE TODAY.

AGAIN, THIS IS THE PROPERTY AND WHERE IT FALLS THE EAST OF THE CRA GUIDELINES.

HERE ARE THESE ARE A LITTLE OUTDATED IN THE GOOGLE EARTH REVIEWS OF THOSE TWO ADDITIONS.

ONE OF THEM IS A MASONARY ADDITION OF THE OTHER IS A METAL WAREHOUSE EDITION.

IT IS THE METAL WAREHOUSE ADDITION WHICH IS IN MUCH WORSE SHAPE RIGHT NOW THAN THIS HISTORY SHOWING. THE WALLS HAVE BLOWN IN THE LAST TWO HURRICANES.

THERE IS A NEED TO DO SOMETHING WITH THIS SOON ERIC THIS CODE ENFORCEMENT HAS CONTACTED THE PROPERTY OWNER TO CORRECT. IF YOU WOULD GO BACK TO THE AERIAL WHERE WE HAVE GOT THE SITE. NOT THIS ONE. YOU HAVE ANOTHER ONE WITH THE

BANDANNA. >> THE CRA GUIDELINES MAKE YES. NOW, IS THAT THE PROPERTY THAT

WE ARE TALKING ABOUT? >> THAT IS THE ENTIRE BLOCK CONTACT THE BUILDING SITS IN THE

[02:50:01]

CORNER. >> THAT IS A LITTLE CONFUSING HERE.

>> YES. THE WHOLE BLOCK IS ONE PARCEL. THAT IS WHERE THE RED BOUNDARY.

IT IS PICKING UP THE ENTIRE PARCEL BUT THE BUILDING IS JUST THE CORNER OF THAT PARCEL.

>> WHAT IS THERE BETWEEN THE MAIN BUILDING AND THE DEMOLITION?

>> THERE IS THE MAIN BUILDING AND THEN THERE'S TWO WAREHOUSE ADDITIONS WHICH WERE ADDED ON AT DIFFERENT TIMES AFTER THE ORIGINAL CONSTRUCTION. WHAT YOU ARE SEEING IS A ONE-STORY WAREHOSE ADDITION AND THEN LATER ON ANOTHER METAL WAREHOUSE EDITION ADDED ON TO

MAKE WHICH IS THE ONE THEY ARE PROPOSING TO TAKE OUT? >> BOTH, BRINGING THE BUILDING

BACK TO THE ORIGINAL FOOTPRINT WHICH IS A TWO-STORY RECTANGLE. >> WERE GET TO YOU.

>> THAT'S NOT MY UNDERSTANDING. WE WILL GET YOU IN A MINUTE. >> AHEAD.

>> SO, THIS IS FOR A PARTIAL DEMOLITION, LOOKING AT OUR CRITERIA FOR DEMOLITION, STAFF FINDS THE REMOVAL OF THE ADDITION AND THE REMOVAL WILL ENHANCE THE SIDE ALLOWING FOR THE REHABILITATION OF THE PRIMARY HISTORIC STRUCTURE OF THE REMOVAL WILL NOT NEGATIVELY IMPACT HIS SITES ARE SURROUNDING NEIGHBORHOOD. THE PROPERTY CURRENTLY HAS ACTIVE CODE ENFORCEMENT CASE ON PERTAINING TO THE CONDITION OF THE METAL WAREHOUSE STRUCTURE.

STAFF IS RECOMMENDING APPROVAL OF HDC 2020-51. AND THE APPLICANTS ARE HERE.

I WOULD LIKE TO VACATIONS ON WHICH PART OF THE BUILDING IF IT IS NOT THAT.

>> TO BE JUST WANT TO MOVE ON TO THE APPLICANTS? PLEASE COME UP.

SAY YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS FOR THE RECORD. SERVE, IF YOU'RE GOING TO SPEAK YOU MIGHT AS WILL COME UP AND INTRODUCE YOURSELF AS WELL. WE WILL GET THE WHOLE ENCHILADA

HERE. IT WILL BE THAT QUICKER. >> MY NAME IS TIM WALKER AND I

AM HERE ON BEHALF OF OF -- >> OKAY. SO, WHAT IS YOUR UNDERSTANDING?

>> WELL, YOU ARE TALKING TO WAREHOUSES THE WE ARE ONLY TALKING ABOUT DOING THE DEMOLITION ON THE METAL BUILDING AT THIS POINT. THAT IS WHAT THE PERMIT IS FOUR.

IT IS NOT -- MAC THE FIRST AD ON. IT'S JUST FOR THE METAL 6000

SQUARE BUT NOT ALL. >> AND, DID YOU EVER GET QUESTIONS FROM MR. WALKER? WE MAY HAVE QUESTIONS FOR YOUR CONTRACTOR. ISON HE IS HERE.

I WOULD JUST LIKE HIM TO IF I CAN ADDRESS ONCE THE BUILDING COMES OFF, HOW IS IT BEING SEALED THAT. IS MY UNDERSTANDING THAT THERE'S A PLAN FOR USING SOME DOORS THAT ARE ALREADY THERE. THE ORIGINAL BLOCK BUILDING, THE FIRST ADD-ON HAD AN OVERHEAD DOOR THAT WENT INTO THE MILLEDGEVILLE BUILDING. IT'S PROBABLY 18 FEET WIDE.

>> SIMILAR TO WHAT IS ON THE FRONT OF THAT WAREHOUSE. >> ON THE FRONT SIDE.

>> WHEN YOU GO TO THE METAL BUILDING, THE SECOND STREET SIDE.

I DON'T THINK I HAVE A PICTURE OF THAT. >> THERE'S THE BACK.

BUT, THERE IS AN OVERHEAD DOOR OVER HERE THAT IT IS OPERATIONAL.

AND IT'S ABOUT THE SAME SIZE AS THE DOOR, THE PASSAGE COMING OUT IS THE WHERE THE EXISTING METAL BUILDING IS A WE ARE GOING TO MOVE THAT DOOR AND MOUNTAINS IN THIS THE DOOR. AND THAT IS EXCELLENT. THANK YOU.

>> SO, ARE BIG CONCERN WHEN WE FIRST SAW THE CASE, IS THAT THIS IS A VERY IMPORTANT BUILDING.

AS YOU KNOW IT'S A VERY IMPORTANT BUILDING TRUST IN THE COMMUNITY.

WE DO NOT WANT TO SEE ANYTHING GO TOWARDS ACCIDENTAL TO HAPPEN THAT MIGHT CAUSE DAMAGE TO THE BUILDING. WE JUST WANT TO UNDERSTAND THE CONTRACTOR, WHAT ARE THEY WILLING TO DO TO MAKE SURE THAT NO DAMAGES DONE? AS A RESULT OF THIS?

DID YOU COME UP IN TELECINE AND ADDRESS. >> I'M TONY.

THE METAL BUILDING IT IS NOT CONNECTED. SO IT IS COMPLETELY DIFFERENT.

SO,. >> SO THIS RIGHT HERE THAT IS COMPLETELY DIFFERENT.

WE COULD JUST PUSH IT DOWN AND COME UP TO MAKE THE TWO STRUCTURES ARE NOT TIED

[02:55:01]

WHEN YOU'RE ON SITE. >> WE ARE NOT KIDDING. >> REED SAID -- WE DID THE OTHER

BUILDING. THEY DID THAT. >> WE HAVE TALKED TO THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT OR THEY ARE AWARE OF WHAT IS COMING WILL BE THROUGH THIS.

YOU WILL BE COMING NEXT YEAR WE ARE JUST ASKING YOU TO BE CAREFUL.

WE DON'T WANT TO SEE ANY DAMAGE TO THE BUILDING. THIS BUILDING HAS TO OUTLAST ALL OF US AND WE NEED TO MAKE SURE THINK THE STATE. THANK YOU, SIR.

SO WE HAVE YOUR ASSURANCES. >> YES. >> ON THE RECORD.

>> OKAY. THANK YOU VERY MUCH MR. WALKER. >> ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OF ALL OPENS PUBLIC. IS THERE ANYBODY WHO WISHES TO SPEAK MIGHT WANT TO WAIT FOR THE

VOTE. SEEING NO ONE. >> NO ONE ON THE LINE.

>> NO ONE ON THE LIGHT. >> WE WILL POST PUBLIC HEARING AND ASKED THE BOARD WITH THEIR

PROPOSAL IS. >> I THINK THE FACT THAT IT IS COMPLETELY SEPARATE.

IT IS NOT TIED INTO A. I THINK IT IS ALREADY CAN BE SECURED.

MAKE IT IS WHEN THEY COME IN TO REDEVELOP THE SITE IS WHEN THEY COME REDEVELOP THE SITE AND THE BLACK BUILDING HAS TO COME DOWN WE ARE ALL GOING TO BE OUT THERE WITH OUR CAMERAS.

A POINT OF TEACHER, AND GIVEN THAT THE APPLICANT IS CLARIFYING THAT HE JUST WANTS TO TAKE --

>> WE NEED TO SPECIFY THAT IN A MOTION. >> IS THAT REPORT.

>> I WOULD JUST CLARIFY IT IN THE MOTION AND THAT'S HOW I WOULD IN ALL THAT.

>> I WILL MAKE A MOTION. >> I MOVED TO APPROVE HDC CASE NUMBER 2020-51 WITH THE CONDITIONS THAT JUST THE METAL BUILDING AND SLAB ARE BEING DEMOLISHED AND REMOVED AND THAT EXTRAORDINARY CARE WILL BE TAKEN TO ENSURE THERE IS NO DAMAGE TO THE ADJACENT EXISTING STRUCTURE.

I MOVED THAT THE HDC MAKE THE FOLLOWING FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS PART OF THE RECORD THAT HDC CASE 2020-51 IS PRESENTED IS SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANT WITH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE THE LAND DEVELOPMENT. GUIDELINES TO WHERE WARNS

APPROVAL AT THIS TIME. >> SO MOVE. IS THERE ANY DISCUSSION?

YOU'RE A NUN. THIS FELT THE ROLE. >> MEMBER HARRISON.

>> YES. >> MEMBER MORRISON. >> YES.

>> MEMBER KOSACK. >> YES. >> VICE-CHAIR POZZETTA.

>> YES. >> CHAIR SPINO TONIGHT YES. >> THANK YOU FOR YOUR PATIENCE.

[5. STAFF CERTIFICATE OF APPROVAL]

TAKE YES FOR AN ANSWER. STAFF CERTIFICATE OF APPROVAL SPIRIT SALVE BACK ANY HIGHLIGHT?

I HAVE NOTHING FOR YOU. >> I HAD A QUESTION. I NOTICED A LOT OF APPROVALS FOR SIGNAGE AND THAT GOES TO THAT STAFF, TODAY HAVE BEEN PRESENT? CAN I INTERRUPT? I APOLOGIZE. I KNOW COUNSEL SHALL GO. I WANT TO THANK YOU AND DIRECTOR GETZEN SAL FORGETTING THE ELECTRONIC DEVICES CHANGED. YOU MANAGE THAT FORCIBLY APPRECIATED AND HE PULLED THE FIRE ALARM LESS MATURE AND HERE WE ARE AS WINTER AND WE HAVE CHANGES AND WE APPRECIATE THAT. WHEN GOOD CELL CELLS THIS PROPERTY THEY WANT TO OPEN AN

SPORTS BAR WITH 20-FOOT SCREENS WE CAN SAY NO. >> AT LEAST TO THE SCREEN.

>> THANK YOU VERY MUCH. >> REPORTER: BUT YOU'RE STILL GOING TO BE ON THE BOARD, RIGHT,

MIKE? THANK YES, FOR A WEEK OR TWO. >> IT'S LIKE YOU ARE LEAVING

THE. >> I THINK ON YOUR WAY OUT YOU LEAVE THIS CHAIR TO SIT AT THE

LITTLE TABLE. >> THANK YOU VERY MUCH. >> IT IS NICE DOWN THERE.

ON SORRY. SO MY QUESTION ON STAFF APPROVALS FOR SIGNAGE.

DOES THE APPLICANT HAVE TO PROVIDE THAT SHE DRAWINGS, COLORS AND EVERYTHING THAT OR

[6. BOARD BUSINESS]

JUST THE WRITTEN DESCRIPTION? >> WE GET BOTH A MOCKUP OF THE SITE.

THE LOGO, COLORS EXCISE TAX LOCATION CAN FOLLOW THAT. >> THAT IS ALL I HAD ON THAT

[03:00:01]

CONFLICTED. >> I MOVE THAT MIKE HARRISON BE ENTERED AS THE NATURE.

>> MIKE, IS THAT SOMETHING YOU COULD DO? >> YES.

>> I SECONDS. >> DO WE NEED ABOUT? WHERE IS COUNSEL WHEN YOU NEED

THAT? >> MS. HARTMAN, PLEASE CALL THE ROLE.

>> MEMBER HARRISON SPINNING YES. >> MEMBER MORRISON. >> YES.

>> MEMBER KOSACK. >> YES. >> VICE-CHAIR POZZETTA -- CHAIR

SPINO TWO YES. >> NOW VICE CHAIR. JIM CAN'T DO IT.

>> I WOULD DO IT. >> I HAVE A MOTION. I NEED A SECOND.

>> SECOND. >> MS. HARTMAN PLEASE CALL THE ROLE.

>> MEMBER MEMBER HARRISON. >> YES. >> MEMBER MORRISON.

>> YES. >> VICE-CHAIR POZZETTA. >> YES.

>> CHAIR SPINO. >> YES. >> IT'S NICE TO HAVE THAT IS

TERRIBLE. THANK YOU FOR DOING THAT. >> REPORTER: LISA WILL BE TOO

MUCH OF A LEARNING CURVE. >> IT OBVIOUSLY IN A PINCH JIM OR I COULD RUN IT.

>> THE ORDER IN WHICH YOU CALL THE BOATS IS BEING CONSISTENT. IS THERE A REASON WHY YOU CALL

THE ROLE IN A CERTAIN WAY? >> I DO VICE CHAIR AND CHAIR LAST.

>> I LIKE THAT IT IS CONSISTENT. >> THAT'S A GOOD THING. >> KEEP YOU ON YOUR TOES.

[Items 7.1 & 7.2]

>> STAFF REPORT. WE HAVE 324 ELM STREET. AND 506 STATE STREET.

RANDY IS HERE. >> THE 324M STREET WAS TO LET YOU KNOW THAT WAS SOMETHING EVALUATED AND WAIVED. THE 506 STATE STREET WAS A 90 DAY DEMOLITION DELAY THAT WAS

NOT POSED BECAUSE OF THE AGE OF THE STRUCTURE. >> REMIND ME, 324 ELM, -- THERE'S NOTHING HISTORIC ABOUT THAT THAT THAT WE COULD TELL. WHEN WAS IT BUILT?

>> THE 50S TWO I EVALUATED IT AS A SENSORY STRUCTURE DID NOT HOLD UP THE.

>> IS THAT THE ONE THAT DOUGLAS COLEMAN LIVES IN? HE TOLD ME ONCE IT WAS ORIGINALLY A BOAT. THAT THEY PUT ON A SLAB. THAT'S WHAT HE TOLD ME ONCE.

>> WE WOULD HAVE TO GO TO THE PROPERTY RECORD. AND THEN 506 THIS IS THE HOUSE NEXT TO MY SECOND BODY WILL TO MAKE THE APPLICANTS HERE TO REQUEST A WAIVER OF THE

DEMOLITION BLAMING WHAT THE SITUATION IS. >> IT IS SHALL WE SAY, ROCK

CUSTOMER IT IS ROUGH. >> GRANDE, COULD COME UP AND INTRODUCE YOURSELF TO THE RECORDS WE CAN GET TO ON RECORD AND IF YOUR CLIENT IS YOU THAT IS GREAT.

>> NAME AND ADDRESS. >> RANDY -- SUITE 201H AN ARCHITECT FOR THE PROJECT.

JUST TO GIVE YOU A BRIEF HISTORY FACT WE STARTED ON THIS ABOUT TWO YEARS AGO.

WE DID A PLAN, IN ADDITION AND THE RENOVATION OF THE INSIDE AND AS I GOT OPENED UP YOU COULD SEE I THINK WE HAVE SOME PICTURES FOR YOU. IT JUST WAS NOT LIABLE.

WE ARE AT A POINT WHERE WE HAD TO COME BACK IN CHECK WE STARTED IN 2019 JUST A SLOWER PROCESS ISSUE. BUT TO DO A NEW CLIENT. WE HAVE A NEW PLAN IN FRONT OF THE CITY TO BUILD A NEW HOUSE ON THE SITE. SO, WHERE IT HAS COME TO YOU IS THAT WE HAVE TO DEMO IT OUT FIRST TO OBVIOUSLY GET THE NEW STRUCTURE CONSTRUCTED.

>> IS THERE ANYTHING HISTORIC ABOUT THESE? ABOUT THESE GABLED PROPERTY?

DO YOU KNOW WHEN IT WAS BUILT? >> 1926. >> IS THERE MUCH LEFT OF THE

ORIGINAL? >> THERE IS THE OLD FRAMING BUT NONE OF THE FRAMING IS EVEN RIGHT. THERE'S NOT CONSISTENT OR PLAYS. DECIDING IS HOLDING HOLDING THE FRAMING TOGETHER. THERE IS NOT HEATHER'S. SO SOME WINDOWS.

>> LET ME COMMEND YOU FOR YOUR REPORTING. IT IS ASTOUNDING.

>> I'M LIKE YOU AND I. AND THEY JUST DID THIS TO SMITH'S HOUSE ON THE CORNER FOR

[03:05:02]

IS BASICALLY A REBUILD WITHOUT DEMOING. >> SAL ARE YOU INCLINED TO

APPROVE THIS ON THE ROAD? THIS IS ON YOUR PLATE, RIGHT? >> YES.

WHAT WE WOULD NORMALLY ASK IS FOR DRAWINGS AND PHOTOS WHICH THEY HAVE NOW PROVIDED.

>> IS THERE AN ADMINISTRATIVE ACTION WE CAN TAKE AWAY THAT? >> THE BOARD CAN VOTE TO WAIVE

ITS NECK? >> WOULD YOU LIKE US TO DO THAT TONIGHT?

>> THERE IS NOTHING ELSE THAT I'M GOING TO ASK THEM FOR. WE HAVE GOTTEN THE DRAWINGS IN

THE PHOTOS WHICH IS ALL WE WOULD NORMALLY ASK FOR. >> JUST THE ARCHAEOLOGICAL YOU GET IN THERE BY SOMETHING THAT YOU NEED TO CALL THE UNIVERSITY OF FLORIDA DON'T BE AFRAID TO

CALL BECAUSE YOU NEVER KNOW. >> CAN I MOVE? >> I MOVED TO WAIVE THE 90 DAY

DEMOLITION DELAY ON THREE TO FOUR ELM STREET -- >> NO 506 STATE STREET.

>> 506 STATE STREET. >> CAN I GET A SECOND? >> SECOND.

>> MEMBER HARRISON. >> YES. >> MEMBER MORRISON.

>> YES. >> MEMBER KOSACK. >> YES.

>> VICE-CHAIR POZZETTA. >> YES. >> IT CHAIR SPINO IT.

>> YES. >> IT WE WILL CONTACT YOU TOMORROW AND THAT DELAY WILL BE

WEIGHT TOMORROW MORNING. >> THANK YOU FOR YOUR PATIENCE TONIGHT AND THANK YOU FOR THE WORK YOU HAVE DONE. WE APPRECIATE IT. IF ALL CASES WERE THIS WELL-DOCUMENTED THE MEETINGS WOULD BE SHORT. THANK YOU.

[Items 7.3 & 7.4]

>> THANK YOU. >> SAL A TALK YOU WANT TO TALK ABOUT OLD TOWN?

>> IT CAN WE TALK ABOUT ANYTHING ELSE? >> I AM EXCITED.

WE HAVE A LOT GOING ON IN OLD TOWN. JUST A REMINDER THAT TOMORROW IS THE PRESENTATION AND WORKSHOP UP FOR FERNANDINA OLDTOWN SPANISH PLAN REVISITING DESIGN GUIDELINES AND THE TEAM FROM UNIVERSITY OF FLORIDA WILL BE HERE IS THE THIRD ON THURSDAYS.

IT WILL BE PRESENTED LIVE AT THE MUSEUM BUT THERE IS LIMITED SEATING DUE TO COVID.

SO, IT IS ALSO AVAILABLE VIA TWITCH WHICH IS A STREAMING SERVICE THAT IS THE BILLION ISLAND MUSEUM OF HISTORY CHANNEL ON THERE. IT CAN BE ACCESS FROM OUR WEBSITE FOR THE PROJECT WHICH IS WWW..FB FL U.S. BACKSLASH OT 2021 WHERE THE MUSEUM WEBSITE.

THAT'S TOMORROW AT 6:00 P.M. WE WILL GO OVER WHAT THE PROJECT IS AND THE PRELIMINARY RESULTS

OF THE OLDTOWN SURVEY WE WILL GUIDE PART OF THAT DISCUSSION. >> I WAS WAITING FOR THE

WORKSHOP. >> THE SURVEY IS GOING TO CLOSE AND APACE TO SURVEY WILL BE OUT.

YOU MISSED PHASE ONE. >> OKAY. >> A COUPLE OF YEARS BACK TO THE MANAGERS WITH MARTIN ANNOUNCED F VU WAS LOOKING AT UNDERGROUND ELECTRIC UTILITES.

AND OLDTOWN WOULD BE AN AREA THAT WOULD BE LOOKED AT. THOSE PLANS HAD SIDELINED WHEN FB USE OLD LOCATION. I HAVE BEEN IN TOUCH WITH FPU AND THEY TELL ME THAT THE PROJECT IS BEING RECONSIDERED AND THEY ARE SCHEDULING A MEETING IN JANUARY TO REVIEW IT.

>> THAT IS GREAT. OF COURSE YOU'LL TIME GUIDELINES TO CALL FOR THE UNDERGROUND.

>> THAT WOULD BE SO GOOD UP THERE. >> ALSO.

IN PAST YEARS BOTH AS THE CITY IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT COUNCIL WRITTEN LETTERS OF SUPPORT THAT WE WOULD SUPPORT THE UNDERGROUND TRAIN OF UTILITIES. SO, WHEN THE TIME COMES THAT WE

CAN DO THAT AGAIN IF THE BOARD WISHES. >> ANYTHING ELSE?

>> I HAVE A FEW QUESTIONS BEFORE YOU PACK UP AND LEAVE. >> SO, AT THE COMMISSION MEETING THEY SAID THAT WE HAVE AN OPENING FOR AN ALTERNATE? DO WE NEED TO GO BACK TO OUR ORIGINAL APPLICANTS AND HAVE THEM CONSIDERED? OR HOW DOES THAT WORK?

>> WE HAVE A ACTUALLY GOT MORE APPLICANTS SINCE THEN. SO, I THINK WHAT WE ARE GOING TO

[03:10:03]

SAY MOVE THEM ALL TO THE COMMISSION. >> I THINK WE LIKE TO SEE WHO IS IN THE MIX. AND WE CAN INDEPENDENTLY TALK TO OUR COMMISSIONERS ABOUT WHAT WE THINK. OF COURSE MR. MORRISON MADE THE POINT LAST TIME THAT WE LIKE PEOPLE WHO LIVE IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT OR HAVE BUSINESSES OR LIVE IN OLDTOWN JAMAICA THINK

THERE ARE NUMBER OF GOOD APPLICANT. >> WE WOULD LIKE TO SEE ALL OF THEM AND I THINK AS LONG AS TERESA PROMISES TO CONTINUE TO JOIN US.

>> THROUGH DECEMBER. >> AFTER THAT. >> , BENJAMIN IS FREQUENTLY -- AND SO, WE REALLY NEED TO. WE COULD HOLD OFF WE WOULD LIKE TO CEASE MORE APPLICATION.

>> I CAN BRING THEM BACK IN JANUARY. >> MY NEXT QUESTION IS DO WE HAVE THAT HOUSE AND OLDTOWN WERE THEY CAME AFTER THE FACT APPROVAL WITH THE FOUNDATION AND WITHOUT BE APPLIED? AND I THINK IF I AM NOT MISTAKEN HOUSES FOR SALE.

>> IT HAS BEEN SOLD DOES THE NEW OWNER HAVE TO TAKE OVER? >> WE CONSTRUCTED -- AND TO SAID THAT WE NEED TO COME UP WITH A SOLUTION. AND THEY DID.

AND IT'S OKAY. IT'S NOT. >> IT STILL APPLIED BUT IT'S

MORE IN PROPORTION. >> SO THE ONUS IS ON THE NEW ORDER MAKE IT IS ALREADY DONE TO MAKE IT'S AS GOOD AS IT'S GOING TO BE MET WE TOLD KELLY THAT IF SHE WAS UNHAPPY WITH WHAT THEY WERE PROPOSING SHE'S GOING TO BRING A BACK TO YOU. SHE OBVIOUSLY GOT TO THE POINT

SHE WAS COMFORTABLE WITH THAT. >> THEY ACTUALLY MADE MOCKUPS FOR US TO LOOK BAD AND MOUNTAIN

LOOK AT THEM. >> IT'S NOT SOMETHING THAT WAS SLIPPED TO THE GIANT CRACKS.

>> THE PROCESS THAT IS DESIGNED FOR. >> THE ONLY OTHER THING IS DO WE WANT TO MOVE FORWARD AT SOME POINT IN DISCUSSING METAL ALUMINUM FENCES VERSUS OTHER

TYPES OF METAL FENCES? >> AS A REMINDER THIS YEAR WE ARE WORKING ON THE OLDTOWN GUIDELINES GETTING THOSE REDONE. STARTING NEXT YEAR. THAT PROJECT WILL BE DONE IN JULY. RIGHT AFTER THAT WE WILL START ROLLING REEVALUATED THE DOWNTIME VIOLENCE. SO, DEFINITELY BE KEEPING TRACK OF THE DIFFERENT ISSUES LIKE THAT THAT YOU WANT TO BRING UP AND TALK ABOUT IT THAT BECAUSE THAT IS THE TIME TO REALLY GET THEM TO WORKSHOPS AND DISCUSS WHAT CHANGES WE WOULD LIKE TO SEE.

>> I WANT TO THANK MIKE AND JIM AS THEIR LAST NIGHT HERE. >> NOT REALLY SPENT THEY ARE

COMING BACK. >> THANK YOU MICK WE ARE GOING TO MAKE TERESA A RULE AS WE SAID

ON ANOTHER BOARD. >> I'VE NEVER SEEN ANYBODY SO ENTHUSIASTIC ABOUT LIVING

[8. PUBLIC COMMENT]

LEAVING. >> REPORTER: IT IS HAPPY HOUR SEMI- CUBIST HAPPY HOUR SEMI- PUBLIC, READY THANK YOU MICK ON THIS IS MORE OF JUST A DETOX FROM OUR FIRST CONVERSATION.

I'M AT A LOSS NOW WHAT, IF THEY WANTED TO READDRESS THE BOARD BACK WHAT WE DO? IS THAT ARE WE DONE FOR A YEAR? MAKE YOU CAN ALWAYS MAKE A NEW APPLICATION.

>> IS THAT MEAN? I GUESS I'M TRYING TO FIGURE OUT PACK I DON'T WANT TO SPEND

ANOTHER YEAR WITH US AND YOU IN. >> IT CAN'T BE THE SAME APPLICATION.

THERE HAS TO BE SOMETHING DIFFERENT ABOUT HER BUT IT'S NOT LIKE A VARIANCE WHERE IT'S BAND

FOR A YEAR. >> HOW CLOSE ARE WE? IS THERE TO THINK THAT WOULD

CHANGE CAN BE APPROVED? >> I THINK YOU COULD GET THERE FROM A DESIGN.

THE PROBLEM I HAVE IS I CAN'T USE THIS AS MY CRITERIA. BUT YOU HAVE TO UNDERSTAND.

I WORKED WITH SOME SCHOOL SUPERINTENDENTS FOR A LONG TIME HECK THEY ARE SMART GUYS AND THEY SAID MIGHT, YOU ARE PUTTING KIDS ON AN OPEN ROOF. WHAT DID YOU THINK WAS GOING TO HAPPEN. AND MARK SAID IT WAS A 3-FOOT FENCE SEPARATING THEM FROM ADJACENT BUILDING. WE ALREADY HAVE PEOPLE AND GROUPS THAT ARE NOT SUPPOSED TO BE. YOU'RE ALWAYS GOING TO HAVE A HARD TIME GETTING ME TO VOTE YES AND ADVISED I MUCUS TO OLD OVER IT BUT YOU'RE PUTTING KIDS ON AN OPEN ROOF OR CAN YOU SEE THE NEWSPPER THE COMMUNITY GOING QUESTION WHO THOUGHT THAT WAS A GOOD IDEA TO PUT THE KIDS UP

THERE AND THAT OPEN ROOF? >> WITH THAT BEING SAID,. >>> WITH MITIGATION STRATEGIES

THAT MIGHT MITIGATE THOSE RISKS? >> SOLVE THAT PROBLEM. >> THE OTHER ISSUE WAS THE PENETRATING THE OLD BRICK IN THE ARTICULATE BRING ON THE ONE SECTION OF THE GOOD-LOOKING

[03:15:05]

>> I THINK IF YOU WENT BACK AND YOU WATCH THE VIDEOS OF THE TWO OR THREE YEAR HOWEVER MANY THERE WERE TIMES THAT YOU GUYS CAME IN HERE AND PRESENTED STUFF AND YOU LISTEN TO THE COMMENTS OF THE PEOPLE ON THE BOARD. I THINK YOU'LL FIND THEY ARE CONSISTENT.

AND IF YOU FOCUS IN AND MAKE A LIST OF THE, THAT WE HAVE BEEN TO ADDRESS THOSE.

I THINK YOU CAN GET THERE. IT'S NOT TEN THINGS. IT'S LIKE THREE OR FOUR THINGS MIKE I GUESS I JUST WOULD NOT TORTURE THAT WAY. JUST GO TALK TO SAL.

IF YOU WANT TO USE A BATH TO GET MY VOTE IS JUST ONE VOTE. YOU'RE GOING TO NEED TO MOLD MITIGATE KIDS ON THE ROOF SOMEHOW. IT'S INTERESTING THAT WITH ALL THE PROPERTY THEY HAVE THAT THEY ARE REALLY FOCUSED ON USING THIS CORNER FOR THAT USE CENTER.

I SEE THE KIDS OUT PLAYING THEY ARE OVER ON -- STREET SIDES MAKE IT 13 SUBJECT OR GETS A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT THAN THE KID CENTER SO I GUESS JUST MY OPINION.

>> WE ARE NOT THAT FAR APART MIKE IS TO THE POINT THAT YOU FIRST ASKED.

YOUR CLIENTS AND YOU GUYS SPENT A LOT OF TIME AND A LOT OF MONEY TO GET TO WHERE YOU ARE.

AND I WOULD HATE TO SEE THAT JUST COMPLETELY GO TO WASTE AND FOR YOU TO ABANDON.

I THINK THAT YOU CAN CAPITALIZE UPON THE INVESTMENT THAT THEY MADE SO FAR WITH SOME TWEAKS AND ADDRESSING SOME THINGS AND BE ABLE TO TURN IT INTO A POSITIVE SITUATION.

>> AND MAYBE CONVINCE THEM NOT TO PAINT IT WHITE. >> REPORTER: THAT WOULD BE -- IS NOT ANOTHER POTTERY BARN. IS LIKE EVERYTHING IS JUST A WHITE PAINTED.

>> THE ORIGINAL TEXTURE OF THE BRICK IS -- >> THE ORIGINAL BRICK IS

IMPORTANT THAT IT DOES NOT GET PAINTED. >> I THINK AT THE NUMBER AND SIZE OF THE PENETRATION THROUGH THE BRICK THINK IF IT WERE I CAN'T SPEAK FOR THE BOARD, BUT THE LARGE FRONT PENETRATION IN THE BRICK WAS STRUCK IT DOWN TO THE THREE SMALLER.

IN MY OPINION I THINK THAT WORKS A LOT BETTER THAN THE LARGER BUT YOU STILL HAD ON THE SIDE OF VERY LARGE PENETRATION THROUGH THE BRICK AND IT WAS ROUND WHICH I THINK I DON'T KNOW HOW THE BOARD FEELS ABOUT IT BUT SOMETHING MORE HORIZONTAL TO MATCH THE WINDOWS ON THE FRONT WOULD HAVE MADE LOSING THAT SECTION ARE BRICK A LITTLE BIT MORE BETTER.

SO, I DO THINK THERE ARE THINGS THAT CAN BE DONE TO ACHIEVE. >> IT DOESN'T TAKE CHANGING THE

WHOLE PROGRAM. >> THANK YOU FOR YOUR PATIENCE MICK.

* This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.