[1. CALL TO ORDER]
[00:00:02]
>> ALL RIGHT. SO WE WILL OFFICIALLY CALL THE MEETING TO ORDER. AND DO A ROLL CALL.
>> RICKY ROBBINS. >> HE'S HERE.
>> SUE SIMPSON IS HERE BY PHONE. NOW PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE.
I PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA AND TO THE REPUBLIC FOR WHICH IS STANDS, ONE NATION UNDER GOD, INDIVISIBLE WITH LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL.
>> SUE, CAN YOU HEAR US OR NO? >> I CAN HEAR YOU.
>> I THINK THAT'S PROBABLY GOING --
>> ALL RIGHT. >> BE THE BEST WE'VE GOT.
WELL, WE'RE SPEAKING, JUST TRY TO SPEAK UP SO SUE CAN HEAR.
[4. NEW BUSINESS]
ALL RIGHT. THAT'S IT.>> WE HAVE CHRIS REPRESENTATIVE OF INDIGO PARTNERS.
HE DOESN'T HAVE A FORMAL PRESENTATION BUT WANTED TO BE AVAILABLE FOR ANY AND ALL QUESTIONS THE BOARD HAS.
PROBABLY WOULD LIKE TO MAKE A QUICK STATEMENT I ASSUME, RIGHT
CHRIS? >> I APPRECIATE BEING HERE WITH YOU GUYS. A LOT OF THINGS GOING ON SUCH WITH THE GOLF COURSE. I AM HERE TO ANSWER THE QUESTIONS TO THE BEST OF MY ABILITY AND HELP WHERE I CAN.
>> CAN I INTERRUPT JUST A SECOND RICKY.
I'M NOT GOING TO BE ABLE TO HEAR PEOPLE.
FIRST OF ALL, CAN I AT LEAST KNOW WHO IS ON THE CALL.
I DIDN'T HEAR THE ROLL CALL. >> EVERYONE ON THE BOARD IS HERE
AND CHRIS FROM INDIGO >> OKAY.
-- COMMISSIONERS, >> ROSS AND KREGER.
SO I HOPE SOMEONE IS TAKING REALLY GOOD NOTES FOR ME SINCE I'M NOT GOING TO BE ABLE TO BE ON.
>> I'M TAKING >> I GUESS THAT'S LEE.
GO AHEAD AND I WILL TRY TO CATCH WHAT I CAN.
>> OKAY. IS MY PHONE BREAKING UP OR YOU
JUST CAN'T HEAR PEOPLE? >> YOU ARE FINE NOW.
I CAN HEAR YOU JUST FINE. I CAN'T HEAR OTHERS SPEAKING.
JUST SOME NOISE. >> ALL RIGHT.
>> I WILL TRY TO FIGURE THIS OUT BETTER IF IT HAPPENS AGAIN.
>> SOUNDS GOOD. WE'RE GOING TO GET STARTED
>> OKAY. >> HE'S A REGIONAL MANAGER.
>> REGIONAL MANAGER FOR INDIGO GOLF PARTNERS.
>> IS HE TAKING YOUR PLACE WHILE YOU'RE GONE?
>> HE WILL HAVE A ROLE. >> THE 20TH YES IS YOUR
ALL RIGHT. SO BASICALLY TODAY ALL WE'RE GOING TO DISCUSS IS OPTIONS TO GIVE TO THE COMMISSION ON WHETHER WE STICK WITH INDIGO GOLF.
HAVE A FILL GAP WHILE THE CITY FIGURES OUT WHAT TO DO NEXT VIA DO ANOTHER RFP OR AN INDIGO GOLF TYPE MANAGEMENT COMPANY OR FIGURE OUT THE BUDGETING AND HIRING TO DO IT INTERNALLY.
I THINK THE ONLY OPTION FOR THE FILL GAP IS IT GETS TURNED OVER TO PARKS AND REC AND THEY TAKE IT OVER WHILE WE FILL IT OUT.
I THINK THAT'S THE ONLY OPTION WE HAVE IF WE GO WITH ENDING THE CONTRACT WITH BILLY CASPER. AND THEN BUT WE ALSO HAVE TO DISCUSS WHETHER OR NOT WE WANT SUBMIT TO BILLY CASPER ANOTHER EXTENSION. SO.
>> I DON'T THINK, RICKY, JOHN HERE, I DON'T THINK THAT'S THE ONLY OPTION. FROM TALKING TO VARIOUS PEOPLE, THE COURSE IS PRETTY MUCH IN THE INTERIM TO PEOPLE THAT ARE STILL
THERE WOULD RUN ITSELF. >> YOU CAN'T HAVE AN ENTITY
WITHOUT A LEADERSHIP. >> BUT IN THE INTERIM, I WOULD
[00:05:05]
SUGGEST THAT THE CITY MANAGER AND IT'S NOW MAYOR LEDOVICH JOINTLY MANAGE IT. THE CITY MANAGER AS AN EMPLOYEE OF THE CITY WOULD TEMPORARILY FILL THAT ROLE.>> IF THAT'S THE OPTION WE WANT TO GIVE TO THE COMMISSION --
>> I MEAN THAT'S AN OPTION WE CAN GIVE THEM.
I JUST DON'T THINK THE COMMISSION CAN ACTUALLY DIRECTLY OVER SEE THEM. THEY HAVE TO WORK THROUGH THE
DEPARTMENT HEAD. >> THAT'S CORRECT.
IF THE CITY AND COMMISSIONER OR MAYOR COULDN'T BE A TECHNICAL
EMPLOYEE OF A PROPERTY. >> THEN IT WOULD HAVE TO BE THE CITY MANAGER TO TAKE THAT ROLE IN THE INTERIM THEN.
SO, YES, MA'AM. >> IF WE WENT TO THE REC CENTER, WE WOULD PAY EMPLOYEES FULL PRICE? THEY'RE EXPENSIVE TO HIRE. THEY HAVE THEIR SALARY PLUS THE MERIT RAISE AND VACATION TIME AND SICK TIME AND THAT'S SOMETHING TO CONSIDER IF YOU GO TO THE PARK AND RECS.
>> WHEN I SAY PARKS AND RECS FOR THE FILL GAP, THEY JUST PICK UP THE SLACK AND BASICALLY ONE OF THEIR SUPERVISORS WOULD ESSENTIALLY BECOME SCOTT AND THEN OR STEVE I'M SORRY, AND THEN THEY WOULD JUST CUT THE GRASS.
THEY WOULD ONE OF THEIR SUPERVISORS WOULD OVERSEE THE CURRENT STAFF. SO IT WOULDN'T BE HIRING A NEW PERSON RIGHT AWAY BECAUSE I DON'T THINK, I DON'T THINK IT'S AN OPTION FOR US TO FILL THOSE POSITIONS IN 30 DAYS WITHOUT GOING TO THE CITY BUDGETING AND THERE'S A WHOLE LIST OF THINGS IF WE GO THE INDIRECT ROUTE WHERE WE HIRE A NEW DIRECTOR OF GOLF, A NEW SUPERINTENDENT. LIKE THOSE SALARIES CAN'T BE FIGURED OUT IN 30 DAYS. IT NEEDS A LOT MORE VETTING THAN THAT. I DON'T THINK YOU'RE GOING TO FIND A QUALIFIED CANDIDATE IN 30 DAYS, FIGURE OUT THE BUDGET IN 30 DAYS AND SIGN THE CONTRACT IN 30 DAYS.
SO, AND ALL I'M DOING IS LAYING OUT THE OPTIONS I THINK ARE THERE TO DISCUSS. I'M NOT SAYING THIS IS THE WAY OR IF YOU HAVE ANYTHING, KICK IN.
SO IT'S HAVING PARTS AND REC TAKE IT OVER WHILE THE CITY FIGURES OUT THE PLAN. ASKING INDIGO GOLF TO EXTEND FOR ANOTHER SIX MONTHS WHILE THE CITY DECIDES OR TAKING THIS MEETING AND SAYING INDIGO GOLF IS THE BENEFIT OPTION AND WE NEED TO ADJUST THE CONTRACT, YOU GET YOUR CONTRACT FEE AND MONEY WISE NOTHING ELSE IS DONE BASED ON ROUNDS PLAYED OR CONDITIONS OR THE COURSE OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT.
CORRECT? >> NO, WE ACTUALLY HAVE IT BUILT INTO THE CONTRACT IF WE HIT ESCALATORS IN OUR FINANCIAL PERFORMANCE. WE ALSO HAVE, WE NEVER WANT TO BE PUT IN A POSITION WHERE WE'RE NOT --
>> CAN YOU ASK HIM TO SPEAK UP A LITTLE BIT PLEASE.
>> CAN YOU HEAR ME NOW? >> YOU'RE BREAKING UP A LITTLE BIT. FR SOME REASON IT'S NOT PROJECTING THROUGH THE SPEAKERS. GIVE IT A SHOT AGAIN.
>> YEAH, WE ACTUALLY HAVE INCENTIVES BUILT INTO THE CONTRACT BASED ON FINANCIAL PERFORMANCE.
WE DO HAVE INCENTIVES IN OUR CONTRACT TO HIT CERTAIN
FINANCIAL THRESHOLDS. >> SO IF YOU DIDN'T HEAR THAT, THERE ARE FINANCIAL PERFORMANCE CLAUSES IN THE CONTRACT.
BUT IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING THAT THOSE NEVER HAVE BEEN MET.
>> THOSE HAVE NEVER BEEN MET IN 10 YEARS NOW.
>> CAN YOU HEAR ME STEVE? >> YEAH, I GOT YOU NOW.
>> WE GOT YOU. DID YOU HEAR ME?
[00:10:03]
>> YEAH I BASICALLY RELAYED EVERYTHING OUT.
FOR AND REASON IT'S NOT GOING THROUGH THE OVER HEAD SPEAKERS.
>> SO IF THOSE PERFORMANCE CLAUSES HAVE NEVER BEEN MET, HAVE WE ADJUSTED THEIR CONTRACT IN ANY WAY?
WE HAVE NOT, HAVE WE? >> NO WE HAVEN'T.
I BELIEVE THAT'S WHAT RICKY IS TALKING ABOUT RIGHT NOW.
THE PERFORMANCE CLAUSES ARE $1.55 MILLION AND THOSE NUMBERS HAVEN'T BEEN SEEN AT THE GOLF COURSE SINCE THE EARLY 2000S.
>> SO, WITH THE, WITH THE INDIGO GOLF CONTRACT, YOU LOOK AT KEEPING THEM ON, READJUSTING THE INCENTIVES, LOWERING THEIR MANAGEMENT FEE, BASICALLY THAT'S IT.
EVERYTHING STAYS THE SAME. THERE'S ACTUALLY MAYBE YOU DON'T GET A BIG OF SAVINGS GETTING RID OF INDIGO BUT READJUST THEIR INCENTIVE GOALS WHERE THEY MIGHT ACTUALLY HIT THEM AND THAT MIGHT INCENTIVIZE THEM TO DO THE JOB BETTER.
SO THOSE ARE KIND -- >> WE'RE TALKING LONG-TERM.
>> NO, MA'AM, NOT AS JUST A FILL GAP.
IF IT'S A FILL GAP, IT JUST STAYS THE SAME.
I'M TALKING IF THE OPTION TO GIVE TO THE COMMISSION IS STICK WITH INDIGO BUT THESE CHANGES HAVE BEEN TO BE AGREED TO.
>> STEVE, HAS INDIGO GOLF BEEN GIVEN A LIST OF GRIEVANCES THEY FEEL THE SHORT COMINGS HAVE BEEN.
>> NOT THAT I KNOW. CHRIS, HAVE YOU SEEN ANYTHING
FROM THE CITY PROPER? >> NO WE HAVE NOT.
A MONTH AND A HALF AGO, IT WAS BASED ON FINANCIAL PERFORMANCE OR THE SAVINGS WAS THE DRIVING FACTOR OF THE CONTRACT NOT BEING
RENEWED. >> EVERYTHING THAT WAS GIVEN TO INDIGO WAS, IT WASN'T A PERFORMANCE OR ANYTHING THEY WERE NOT DOING, IT WAS AT COST SAVING.
>> WHAT DOES INDIGO COST? >> A LITTLE NORTH OF $90,000 A
>> YES. >> $90,000 IS NOT A LOT OF MONEY. IF WE'RE TALKING ABOUT AND
MASSIVE CHANGE. >> I MEAN THERE'S OTHER THINGS
TOO, >> THAT'S JUST THEIR MANAGEMENT
FEE. >> THAT'S OVER AND ABOVE WHAT
THEY PAY -- SURE. >> THERE'S OTHER INCIDENTAL EXPENSES THAT BRING UP THAT. TO YOUR POINT, IT'S NOT AN INSURMOUNTABLE AMOUNT TO YOUR POINT.
>> IT'S BASICALLY SEVEN THOUSAND, $8,000 A MONTH TO MANAGE THE GOLF COURSE. AND INDIGO'S STANCE IS THEY GOT RID OF INDIGO, IT WILL COST THE CITY MORE.
THERE WOULDN'T BE SAVINGS IN INDIGO'S EYES BY BRINGING IT
BACK TO THE CITY >> AND THE CITY COMES BACK AND SAYS, MY $50,000 SAVINGS AFTER PENSIONS AND ALL THAT.
>> JUST AS A POINT OF DISCUSSION OUT THERE ALSO, THERE WAS TWO BALLOT MEASURES IN NOVEMBER THAT ACTUALLY CHANGED THIS DISCUSSION IN MY OPINION. ONE IS THE LEASE AND OR PURCHASE OF ANY PARK AND REC LAND OR OPEN SPACE LAND THE CITY OWNS, WHICH IS VIRTUALLY IMPOSSIBLE IN THE CITY, AND THE SECOND IS THE BALLOT MEASURE FOR THE $15 AN HOUR.
BECAUSE IF YOU EXTRAPOLATE ANY SAVINGS YOU MAKE, YOU NEED TO FIGURE OUT WHERE YOU'RE GOING TO BE FIVE YEARS FROM NOW AND THE MINIMUM WAGE IS $15. WHAT ARE THE SAVINGS GOING TO BE AT THAT POINT? THOSE TWO POINTS ENTERED INTO THIS DISCUSSION WITHOUT ENTERING INTO THE DISCUSSION.
>> WHAT IS THE FIRST ONE? >> A BALLOT MEASURE PASSED BY THE CITY OF FERNANDINA. IT WAS VOTED 70% OF THE PEOPLE IN THE CITY VOTED TO MAKE IT NEARLY IMPOSSIBLE,
[00:15:05]
COMMISSIONERS, CORRECT ME IF I AM WRONG, YOU NEED A VOTE TO -- ANY CONVERSATION LAND THE CITY OWNS.>> SO IF THE CITY WANTED TO DO A LEASE FOR THE GOLF COURSE, THE
MAXIMUM WOULD BE 40 YEARS. >> UNDER 40 YEARS.
>> WHY DO YOU THINK THAT'S, I MEAN IT'S A FACTOR.
>> BECAUSE -- >> YOU DON'T NORMALLY GET A BIG LAND LEASE LIKE THAT FOR LESS THAN 99 YEARS.
BUSINESSES WON'T GO AFTER IT KNOWING I'M IN THE GOING TO HAVE
THE SPCE FOR A LONG TIME. >> I REMEMBER FOR AMILIA LEASES, ABOUT THE 70 YEARS. WHO KNOWS WHAT WILL HAPPEN IN 70
YEARS? >> I'M NOT DISAGREEING.
>> I'M BRING IT UP BECAUSE THERE HAVE BEEN A LOT OF RUMORS THROUGHOUT THE CITY TO SELL THE GOLF COURSE OR DO THIS.
THIS REFERENDUM BY THE VOTERS HAS PRETTY MUCH MIXED THAT.
>> GOT YOU. >> DOES ANYBODY IN THE AUDIENCE OR HERE HAVE ANY FIGURES OR WHAT AVERAGE, WHAT DO YOU CALL IT CONTRACT COST IS FOR A GOLF MANAGEMENT COMPANY?
>> I MEAN I CAN JUST, JUST OFF OF ASKING AROUND TO THE FEW GOLF PROS AROUND HERE AND STUFF, WITH THE CITY COURSES RIGHT NOW, IT'S THE CRAPIEST COURSE AROUND. THE WAY THE GREENS ARE, THE STAFF IS GREAT, BUT THE COURSE ITSELF IS NOT IN THE BEST SHAPE.
YOU'RE LOOKING JUST FOR, JUST TO FILL HIS POSITION, IS 60 TO $80,000 BASED ON EXPERIENCE, YOU KNOW VOLUME, REVENUE, MAYBE YOU GET LUCKY AND FIND A GO GETTER THAT'S TRYING TO BREAK INTO THE INDUSTRY AND WILL TAKE $45,000 OR $50,000 BUT PROBABLY NOT.
I'M LOOKING TO JUST TO FILL THE DIRECTOR OF GOLF OR GM, $60,000 TO $80,000 AND THAT'S JUST SALARIFUL THAT'S NOT 60 TO 80 PLUS COMPS. YOU HAVE A SUPER THAT'S ROUGHLY
50TH. >> IT WILL COST THE SAME AS THE
GM. >> ANOTHER 60 TO 80 FOR THE GM AND THEIR BENEFITS AND YOUR HOURLY STAFF.
>> WHAT ARE YOU PAYING NOW ANNUALLY IN HOURLYISH ROUGHLY?
>> THE TOTAL PAYROLL FOR FISCAL YEAR WAS $625,000 ENDING
SEPTEMBER. >> HOW MUCH WAS THAT
>> AND HOW EXACTLY IS THAT, THAT'S PAID THROUGH
>> I CALL IT REVENUE GENERATED BECAUSE YOU STILL HAVE FOOD
RIGHT. SO I MEAN YOU'RE JUST OFF THE TWO SALARIES. WE WILL GO LOW END AND SAY WE GET LUCKY, $120,000 TO FILL THE TWO KEY POSITIONS OUT THERE AND THAT DOESN'T EVEN INCLUDE YOUR F & B MANAGER.
>> ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT THE STATE TAKING IT OVER?
>> HE WAS JUST ASKING HOW MUCH IT COST.
>> THE ONLY REASON I'M ASKING THAT.
I USED TO WORK IN THE ADMINISTRATION OFFICE FOR 16 YEARS, THE DIRECTOR WASN'T MAKING $60,000 A YEAR.
THEY WERE MAKING HALF THAT. ALL THEIR MONEY CAME FROM THE REVENUE OF THE PERCENTAGE FROM THE FOOD AND BEVERAGE AND THE
PRO SHOP AND THE DRIVING RANGE. >> YOU'RE SAYING THEY WERE
INCENTIVIZED -- >> THEY WEREN'T MAKING $60,000
TO $80,000 BY THE CITY. >> THOSE CONTRACTS AREN'T AROUND
ANYMORE. >> I'M TALKING ABOUT WHEN INDIGO TOOK OVER IN 2010. PRIOR TO THAT, THE DIRECTOR WASN'T MAKING $60,000. I KNOW BECAUSE I USED TO DO THE
PAPERWORK. >> I ASKED ABOUT THAT TOO.
IS IT LIKE DO YOU PAY SOMEONE LESS AND THEN INCENTIVIZE THEM
[00:20:04]
TO GIVE PEOPLE ON THE RANGE AND BUYING STUFF IN THE PRO SHOP AND GIVE THEM A PERCENTAGE OF THAT? BECAUSE I USED TO HAVE A FRIEND THAT WORKED AT THE RICH GOLF COURSE AND THAT'S WHAT IT WAS.HE MADE LIKE $23,000 A YEAR BUT HE ACTUALLY ENDED UP MAKING LIKE 50 BECAUSE HE WAS SELLING BAGS OF BALLS.
BUT THEY ACTUALLY WHETHER HE WAS STILL OUT THERE AND THAT WAS IN 2015, THEY SAID, YOU JUST GET A FLAT SALARY.
HERE'S YOUR 45 K. 120, 140, JUST IN SALARIES FOR THE THREE DEPARTMENT HEADS OUT THERE YOU'RE AT $160,000.
>> THIS IS SPEAKING TOWARD WHAT? >> IF WE MAKE A CHANGE?
>> YEAH, YOU ASKED HOW MUCH IT COST TO RUN IT AND THINGS LIKE THAT. I'M JUST GIVING YOU THE SALARIES
OF THE THREE. >> IT'S PRETTY MUCH SIX FULL TIME EMPLOYEES AND 38 PART-TIME EMPLOYEES AND THE BUDGET AND THE RECORDS ARE ALL THERE WHAT IT COST.
AND THAT'S GOING TO BE THERE NO MATTER WHAT.
THAT'S WHAT IT TAKES TO RUN A GOLF COURSE.
>> WHAT HAS BEEN THE NET LOSS OF THE GOLF COURSE OVER THE PAST
THREE YEARS EXCLUDING THIS ONE. >> I CAN TELL YOU OVER THE LAST
10 YEARS. >> JUST TO ME, APPROXIMATE.
>> APPROXIMATELY OVER THE LAST 10 YEARS ON THE EVEN LINE, THE PROFIT LOSS LINE IT'S LOST $500,000 AND IN THAT, YOU HAVE TWO-AND-A-HALF HURRICANES AND CO COVID. THE BIGGEST YEAR LOSS WAS THIS PAST YEAR. THE AVERAGE LOSS IS LESS THAN
>> WE'RE IN SEARCH OF A PROBLEM WHEN THERE ISN'T ONE REALLY AT THIS POINT. I KNOW GOLF MANAGEMENT, GOLF COURSES ALL ACROSS THE COUNTRY ARE ENCOURAGED.
I HAD AN INVESTMENT ONCE AND IT WAS A REIT.
I THOUGHT IT WAS GOING TO BE A BIG MONEY MAKER.
NEXT THING YOU KNOW, THEY'RE DISPOSING OF THE GOLF COURSE.
IT'S BEEN ON A DOWN TREND FOR A LONG TIME AND PERHAPS IT'S
BOTTOMING OUT. >> IT'S COME BACK THROUGH THE PANDEMIC. THE LAST SIX MONTHS.
>> THERE'S NOTHING ELSE TO DO. >> AGAIN.
THE WHOLE REASON THIS IS BROUGHT UP IS BECAUSE OF COST SAVINGS.
ON YOUR EBITA LINE, YES YOU'RE LOSING $50,000 AND THERE'S CAPITAL EXPENSES WHICH ALL THREE COMMISSIONERS WILL GLADLY TALK TO AND THAT'S ADDING TO THE DEBT OF THE GOLF COURSE.
>> IS THE GOLF COURSE STILL PAYING BACK ON LOANS FROM OTHER ENTERPRISE FUNDS OR OTHER CITY ENTITIES?
>> NO. THE GOLF COURSE IS PAYING BACK LOANS ON THE CLUBHOUSE AND IRRIGATION SYSTEM AND THAT WILL SAVE AT THE END OF THIS FISCAL YEAR.
>> HOW MUCH ARE THEY PAYING? >> $18,000 A MONTH.
>> I WAS TOLD IT WAS ENDING THIS DECEMBER.
>> THE NOTE WAS REFINANCED. >> $18,000 A MONTH.
>> WELL, STEVE, LET ME ASK YOU THIS -- I'M SORRY.
>> THERE'S ONE OTHER LITTLE BUCKET OF MONEY.
WHAT IS IT? >> THE $2 MILLION OWED --
>> THE ONE FROM ARE LIKE 10 YEARS AGO.
>> THE CUMULATIVE LOSSES AND CAPITAL IMPROVEMENTS.
THE DEBT ON THE GOLF COURSE IS ROUGHLY $2 MILLION.
ONE IS A LOAN FROM THE BANK, THE OTHER IS A LOAN FROM ANOTHER
WHEN ARE THESE DUE TO BE PAID OFF?
>> THE ONE FOR CLUBHOUSE IS SEPTEMBER OF 2021.
AND THEN THE $2 MILLION IS THAT EVEN BEING PAID ON?
>> NO. THE $2 MILLION IS A DEBT JUST SITTING THERE BEING PAID ON. SO, WE'RE PAYING ABOUT $20,000 A YEAR FOR THE CLUBHOUSE WHICH WE WILL GET THAT BACK NEXT YEAR IN
>> I'M SORRY. $200,000 A YEAR.
OR $18,000. >> THE IRRIGATION AND CLUBHOUSE.
>> SO I MEAN IF WE JUST SET $200,000, WE SIT THERE AND
[00:25:07]
THERE'S OTHER REPAIRS THAT NEED TO BE DONE, I THINK YOU'RE RIGHT. IT WAS A SNAP THING THAT NO ONE REALLY HAD TIME TO LOOK INTO. IN THE NEXT YEAR WE'RE GETTING $200,000 IN REVENUE AND I THINK THE CITY WIPES THE $2 MILLION THAT'S OWED BECAUSE OF THE PREVIOUS MONEY THAT WAS BORROWED FROM THE GOLF COURSE, YOU CAN CALL IT A WASH.AND YOU JUST EXTEND TO INDIGO. I THINK THAT'S --
>> YEAH, BUT THE WHOLE PROBLEM IS INDIGO, THE WAY THE COURSE LOOKS. WHAT HAS HAPPENED? HAS INDIGO NOT DONE WHAT THEY ARE SUPPOSED TO DO TO MAKE OUR FAIRWAYS PLAYABLE. WE NEED TO HOLD INDIGO TO THE FIRE IF THEY'RE NOT GOING TO PERFORM THEN WE'RE NOT GOING TO
WHEN I SAY WE JUST EXTEND THEM, WE DON'T JUST EXTEND THEM AS IS.
IT'S A RENEGOTIATION WHERE THEIR PERFORMANCE ENHANCERS AND INCENTIVES ARE BROUGHT TO A MORE REASONABLE OPTION TO GIVE THEM THE INCENTIVE TO ACTUALLY GO OUT AND FIGURE OUT HOW TO MAKE THE FAIRWAYS BETTER AND THINGS LIKE THAT BECAUSE $1.5 MILLION IN
REVENUE, STEVE, IS THERE MORE? >> RIGHT NOW IT'S A LITTLE OVER $1.5 MILLION. I THINK THAT'S A LITTLE HIGH.
WE GIVE THEM SOMETHING THEY ACTUALLY THINK THEY CAN REACH AND AND WE ADD IN SEMI ANNUAL OR ANNUAL REVIEWS, YOU KNOW WE DO ANOTHER LET'S JUST, THIS IS ALL HYPOTHETICAL, WE GIVE THEM ANOTHER 10 YEAR CONTRACT FOR THE FIRST THREE YEARS YOU GET A SEMIANNUAL REVIEW OF WHERE YOU'RE AT AND IF YOU'RE NOT MEETING CERTAIN EXPECTATIONS, YOU'RE DONE AND WE WILL, THEN THERE'S 120 DAY NOTICE OF MOVING ON FROM YOU AND YOU HAVE TO FINISH IT OUT. SO YOU JUST CREATE A CONTRACT THAT I THINK PUTS THE CITY IN MORE CLEAR CONTROL OF THE MANAGEMENT COMPANY AND IT ALSO SAYS DO THESE THINGS OR YOU WON'T BE HERE ANYMORE AND THERE'S NO DISCUSSION ABOUT DOING THESE THINGS OR NOT DOING THESE THINGS.
YES, SIR. >> I UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE SAYING. I THINK THE CITY COMMISSIONER'S TASKED DALE MARTIN AT YOUR LAST MEETING TO TALK TO INDIGO AND START RE-NEGOTIATIONS, THAT'S WHAT IS TAKING PLACE DURING THIS 60 DAY PERIOD. I THINK I LIKE SOME OF YOUR IDEAS. AND I'M VERY WORRIED THAT INDIGO WILL SEND IN A 30-YEAR OLD WITH NO EXPERIENCE.
I HAVE BEEN THROUGH GENERAL MANAGERS FROM INDIGO.
AND THAT'S WHY I'M SO HIGH ON STEVE MURPHY BECAUSE HE CAME IN WITH EXPERIENCE. THEY COULD VERY EASILY SEND SOMEONE IN THAT'S 30 YEARS OLD THAT DOESN'T KNOW THEIR [BLEEP] THAN ANYTHING. I WOULD REQUIRE THAT TO BE PART OF WHATEVER DALE IS DOING. DON'T LET THEM JUST PUT ANYBODY IN HERE. PUT SOMEONE IN HERE THAT HAS 25
YEARS EXPERIENCE. >> ANYONE WE BRING IN IS VERIFIED BY THE CITY COMMISSION. WE DON'T MAKE THAT DECISION
BASED ON OUR DESIRES. >> THAT'S IN WRITING?
>> I WAS GOING TO SAY THE SAME PROCESS.
I EVEN TALKED TO THE GOLF COURSE GREENS COMMITTEE AT THE TIME.
>> AND HAD TO GO THROUGH THAT PROCESS.
>> IF I CAN SAY ONE THING IN DEFENSE OF THE STAFF AND INDIGO AND I KNOW EVERYBODY WANTS, EVERYBODY IN THE WORLD WANTS BETTER CONDITIONS. TO SAY WE'RE THE WORSE GOLF COURSE OUT THERE, I BEG TO DIFFER BECAUSE I PLAYED NORTH HAMPTON IN THE PAST SEVEN DAYS AND QUITE FRANKLY I'M GOING TO TAKE OUR GOLF COURSE. EVERYBODY HAS THEIRON PERCEPTION. MY QUESTION IS, WHAT IS YOUR EXPECTATION RELATIVE TO THE DOLLARS SPENT? I KNOW SUE AND JANE WANTS TO SEE GOOD QUESTIONS.
JOHN PLAYS OUT THERE THREE TIMES A WEEK AND EVERYBODY OUT THERE WANT DIFFERENT CONDITIONS. IF YOU HAVE A BUILDING OF
[00:30:05]
$200,000, YOU HAVE TO WEIGH YOUR EXPECTATIONS.IT'S A MUNICIPAL COURSE AMENITY TO THE CITY.
IT'S NOT THE RITZ-CARLTON WHERE YOU HAVE PRIVATE MEMBERS PLAY.
IT'S A MUNICIPAL COURSE. YOU TRULY HAVE TO WEIGH YOUR EXPECTATIONS IF FOR YOUR DOLLARS SPENT.
SURE WE COULD PAY $800,000 AND MAKE THE GRASS GREENER.
LET'S JUST -- >> STEVE, THE CONDITIONS HAVE DECLINED DRASTICALLY IN THE LAST FEW YEARS AND MANY, MANY REQUESTS HAVE BEEN MADE FOR EXAMPLE REPAIR TEE BOXES AND THEY WERE SAYING OKAY IT'S GOING TO BE DONE, IT'S GOING TO BE DONE AND IT WAS NEVER DONE. I THINK THEY'RE WORKING ON THEM NOW ON SOUTH ANYWAY. BUT --
>> AND SUE TO YOUR POINT, YOU'RE ABSOLUTELY --
>> TO YOUR POINT, SUE, YOU'RE ABSOLUTELY CORRECT.
IN THE PLAN AND BUDGET THESE THINGS WERE MEANT TO BE DONE.
BUT WHEN YOU RUN OUT OF MONEY BECAUSE OF A HURRICANE OR BECAUSE OF COVID, I CAN'T JUST GO OUT THERE AND SPEND MONEY.
I'VE GOT TO ANSWER TO THE CITY AND INDIGO AS TO WHY WE LOST THAT KIND OF MONEY. IF YOU RAN YOUR OWN BUSINESS, I'M SURE YOU WOULDN'T GO INTO DEBT BECAUSE OF AN ANCILLARY
AFFECT ON THE CITY. >> WHEN YOU WENT TO THE CITY WHEN YOU SAID I NEED MORE MONEY. WHAT DID THE CITY SAY?
LAUGH YOU OFF? >> THAT'S OPERATIONAL MONEY SPENT NOT CAP X. SO THEREFORE THE MONEY I BRING IN THAT I'M ALLOWED TO SPEND. NOT THE MONEY THAT I'M GOING TO ASK THE CITY FOR MORE BECAUSE WE HAD COVID-19, BECAUSE THAT'S NOT
PART OF THE BUDGETED MONEY. >> STEVE, ARE YOU DONE
>> I KNOWLEDGE THE CONDITION THINK -- I THINK THE COURSE CONDITION, I TALKED TO SEVERAL PEOPLE WALKING BY AND LIKE THE AFFORDABILITY OF THE GOLF COURSE MOSTLY.
THEY'RE NOT, THERE'S AIL OF VALUE GOLFERS OUT THERE AND THEY'RE NOT WILLING TO SPEND DOUBLE TO HAVE GRASS ON THEIR, TO HAVE MORE GRASS. SO, YOU'RE THE SQUEAKY WHEEL, YOU'RE IN THESE GROUPS THAT PLAY THEIR LITTLE TOURNAMENTS TWO OR THREE TIMES A WEEK. YOU'RE NOT THE MAJORITY.
THE MAJORITY WANTS GOLF. GOLF IN ANY CONDITION.
I PLAYED THAT COURSE. DOESN'T DETER ME ONE BIT EXCEPT WHEN IT'S FLOODD AND THAT'S A TEMPORARY CONDITION.
IT REALLY DOES COME DOWN TO A HIGHER MAINTENANCE BUDGET.
I DON'T KNOW HOW THEY CAN KEEP THE GRASS MORE FERTILIZER OR BRINGING IN MORE TOPSOIL, THAT'S BEYOND MY KNOWLEDGE RIGHT NOW.
PROBABLY CAN BE DONE BUT WE MAY NOT BE ABLE TO HANDLE THE COST.
AGAIN NOT TO BE PICKING ON YOU, I THINK THE CONDITION PEOPLE IF IT WAS SO BAD YOU WOULD HAVE LEFT.
YOU ARE STILL HERE PLAYING GOLF. >> A LOT PEOPLE ARE LEAVING.
>> SUE IS RIGHT. I DON'T PLAY THE CITY ANYMORE AND HERE'S WHY. BECAUSE I CAN GO ON GOLF NOW AND PAY $5 MORE AND PLAY ACROSS THE STREET.
>> THE CITY COURSE -- >> RIGHT ON GOLF NOW.
>> THERE ARE QUITE A FEW PEOPLE IN THE WOMEN'S LEAGUE THAT ARE LEAVING AND JOINING OTHER CLUBS. IS THAT CORRECT,
>> BECAUSE WHILE THEY'RE LEAVING.
>> I KNOW COVID HAPPENED. I'M JUST TRYING TO FIGURE OUT HOW WE CAN GET BACK TO A DESCENT GOLF COURSE WHERE PEOPLE WANT TO
PLAY. >> I MEAN I THINK ON THE CONDITIONS THING, WE'RE GETTING OFF TOPIC, BECAUSE WE NEED TO FIGURE OUT WHAT WE WANT TO GIVE TO THE CITY.
THE CONDITIONS ARE ROUGHLY, IT WOULD BE ABOUT $800,000 TO GET THE SOUTH BACK TO GREEN. ROUGHLY.
>> I CAN'T GIVE YOU THAT. >> RIGHT NOW THE SOUTH IS NOT OVER SEEDED THIS YEAR. THAT WAS DONE INTENTIONALLY TO GET THE BERMUDA GRASS TO GROW. NOBODY WANTS TO TALK ABOUT.
WHEN SPRINGTIME HITS, YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE GRASS ON ALMOST EVERY FAIRWAY. ALL YOU WANT TO DO IS COMPLAIN
[00:35:02]
ABOUT THE CONDITION TODAY. YOU HAVE TO DO THE PROGRESSES TO GET TO THAT. THAT'S NOT OVERSEEDING THE SOUTH BECAUSE IT ALLOWS THE BERMUDA TO TAKE UP ALL THE WATER TO CONTINUE TO GROW THROUGH THE WINTER MONTHS.>> AS THAT BEEN PUT OUT TO THE GENERAL PUBLIC VIA INDIGO
WEBSITE? >> IT WAS PUT OUT IN AN E-MAIL
LAST SEPTEMBER, YES. >> I GUESS BRING IT FULL CIRCLE IS HAS ANYBODY REALLY SAID TO INDIGO LIKE WHAT IS YOUR PLAN FOR, WHY IS IT IN THIS SHAPE AND WHAT IS YOUR PLAN FOR IT NOT TO
NOBODY HAS -- >> BASICALLY IS INDIGO KNOWS OF NO PROBLEM WITH THE CITY COURSE. NO MAJOR PROBLEMS WITH THE CITY COURSE OF ANY ISSUES? IT'S ALL SOMEWHERE FROM PLAYER TO INDIGO THE MESSAGE ISN'T GETTING RELAYED.
>> YES BUT IT'S A LARGER SCALE THAN THAT.
I THINK WE'RE DOING A LOT OF THINGS ON THE GOLF COURSE THAT ARE MEANT TO IMPROVE THE PROPERTY GOING FORWARD.
AND THERE'S CERTAIN INDIVIDUALS THAT, I THINK IT'S STANDARD IN EVERY GOLF COURSE, THEY MAKE THEIR OWN ASSUMPTIONS WHY CONDITIONS ARE THAT WAY INSTEAD OF ASKING FOR FEEDBACK OF WHY WE'RE IN THAT POSITION. WHAT ARE WE DOING TO IMPROVE IT.
STEVE HIGHLIGHTED NOT OVER SEEDING THE SOUTH.
WE DID THAT STRATEGICALLY. KNOWING THAT OUR PLAN WAS TO RUN 18 ON THE RENOVATED NORTH GREENS AND THE WEST.
WE'RE A LITTLE BEHIND ON THE NORTH GREENS BECAUSE WE HAD A LATE START TO THE RENOVATION PROCESS.
THERE'S, THERE WAS IN PLACE TO PUT THE SOUTH IN A BETTER POSITION GOING FORWARD. STEVE ALSO MENTIONED, IT'S EASY TO GO SPEND HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS TO IMPROVE CONDITIONS. WE CAN DO THAT BUT WE WORK WITHIN THE BUDGET WE HAVE THAT'S BEEN APPROVED BY THE CITY.
WE'RE 100% WILLING AND ABLE TO SIT DOWN AND TALK THROUGH -- ANY CONTRACTUAL ISSUES WE HAVE. I THINK OVER THE LAST 10 YEARS, WE HAVE SHOWN OUR WILLINGNESS THAT WE WANT TO BE THERE.
WE WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT FERNANDINA GOLF COURSE IS SUCCESSFUL. WE HAVE DONE IN THE PAST WHERE WE PAID FOR A RENOVATION OF 1 AND 9 GREENS.
THAT'S A CONVERSATION WE ARE WILLING TO HAVE AND GOING THROUGH THAT PROCESS WITH THE CITY MANAGER.
WE WANT TO BE INVOLVED IN THE CONVERSATIONS AND BE ABLE TO EXPLAIN THE THINGS THAT WE'RE DOING AND HOW WE PLAN ON GETTING TO WHERE WE WANT TO BE. I THINK THAT'S A BIG, IMPROVING OUR COMMUNICATION IS A HUGE PART OF OUR SUCCESS MOVING FORWARD
THAT WE NEED TO DO. >> CAN I SAY SOMETHING ABOUT WHAT RIVER IS TALKING ABOUT, THE COVID.
IN PAST, THINGS HAVE ALWAYS HAPPENED TOO.
WE HAD HURRICANES. WE HAD A LOT OF WATER.
WE HAD TO CLOSE DOWN THE WEST FOR TWO OR THREE WEEKS BUT WE SEEM TO KEEP THE COURSE UP. AND WHY ISN'T THAT KEEPING UP NOW. WOULD THE MEMBERSHIP LIKE US TO OVER SEED THE SOUTH? IT'S NOT TOO LATE.
>> THE CONDITIONS YOU HAD THE LAST 10 YEARS.
>> I'M SAYING, WE HAVE BEEN THROUGH THESE THINGS MANY TIMES.
I HAVE BEEN PLAYING SINCE '95 AND NEVER SEEN THE SOUTH THIS BAD SINCE I HAVE BEEN PLAYING THERE SINCE '95.
>> CHRIS AS SOMETHING TO SAY. >> YOU NEED TO TAKE INTO CONSIDERATION OVER THE LAST FIVE YEARS WHAT THE PLAN WAS WE WORKED WITH THE CITY ON. IMPROVING CAPITAL IMPROVEMENTS.
WE RENOVATED ALL 18 HOLES. GREENS, WE HAVE INVESTED A LOT OF MONEY IN THIS PAST FISCAL YEAR WITH THE NORTH GREENS.
INTRODUCE TOP TRACER TO HELP GENERATE REVENUE.
EVERYONE WANTS US TO BE THERE RIGHT NOW AND YOU KNOW, UNFORTUNATELY, WE HAVE TO DO CERTAIN THINGS IT'S A 50, 60 YEAR OLD GOLF COURSE THROUGHOUT AND WE'RE DOING THAT IN PARTNERSHIP WITH THE CITY TO GET TO WHERE WE WANT TO BE.
[00:40:03]
IF YOU LOOK AT OUR BUDGET WE PRESENTED FOR FISCAL YEAR '21, THAT IS MOVING FORWARD REVENUE WISE AND OPERATIONAL WISE AND IN FISCAL YEAR '22 THAT WILL BE GREATER AS WE HAVE TOP TRACER ESTABLISHED. WE ARE MOVING IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION AND WE PUT PIECES OUT THERE TO HELP US GET THERE IN TERMS OF CAPITAL IMPROVEMENTS, ESPECIALLY IN THE LAST FIVEWELL, CAN I MAKE A COMMENT? >> IF ANYBODY HOW I FEEL OR IN THE PREPARED REMARKS, I THINK IT'S A GEM.
THERE'S GOT TO BE INCENTIVES OBVIOUSLY.
I HAVE WATCHED THE MANAGEMENT AND THEY KNOW WHAT THEY'RE DOING. I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM.
I THINK WE NEED TO GO IN THERE, TALK TO THEM, GIVE THEM ANOTHER FIVE YEARS. BETTER CONTRACT.
MAYBE A LITTLE BIT MORE SPECIFIC.
STEVE MIGHT HAVE RECOMMENDATIONS.
SO HE'S BEEN HERE FIVE YEARS AND KNOWS WHAT WORKS AND DOESN'T WORK. I HATE TO LOSE HIM.
IF THERE'S SOMETHING THAT CAN PROBABLY TELL US WHAT TO DO IT'S HIM. WHEN HE'S NOT LONGER AN EMPLOYEE OF CASPER. I'M NOT SURE HE CAN DO IT RIGHT NOW. DOWN THE ROAD.
THE CITY COMMISSIONERS, I THINK YOU KNOW, I DON'T KNOW WHY DALE DID THIS AND WHY HE DIDN'T START NINE MONTHS AGO OR A YEAR AGO.
IT'S NOT SOMETHING YOU JUST TREAT LIGHTLY.
YOU NEED TO GET YOUR DATA. MIKE MEADOWS ASKED ME A QUESTION AND I'M NOT SURE ANYONE KNOWS THE ANSWER.
HOW MANY EMPLOYEES DID WE HAVE BEFORE CASPER TOOK OVER?
>> NINE FULL TIME AND SEVERAL PART TIME.
>> STEVE HAS SIX FULL TIME AND 38 PART TIME.
>> THIS IS MAINTENANCE. >> THAT'S NOT WHAT WE HAVE RIGHT NOW. WE'RE UNDER STAFFED DUE TO COVID AND I KNOW SOMETHING YOU HAVE TOLD ME AND I LEARNED BEFORE THAT WHAT HE HAS WITH STAFF IS IT NOT A PROJECT TEAM.
THEY CAN'T TAKE ON PROJECTS. ALL THEY CAN DO IS MAINTAIN THAT GOLF COURSE. NOTHING IS GOING TO GET DONE.
NOW WE DID A LITTLE BALL CADDYING AND MADE $180,000 THE YEAR THEY GOT RID OF THE DIRT. THAT WAS THE BEST YEAR THEY EVER HAD. IT WAS A GREAT YEAR.
TOO BAD WE CAN'T DO THAT EVERY YEAR.
FROM MY POINT, I THINK INDIGO KNOWS WHAT THEY'RE DOING, THEY
HAVE 120 GOLF COURSES THEY >> 160.
>> 160. I'M NOT DISDIS-- DISINFAVOR OF PUTTING OUT OTHER PROPOSALS. THAT MAKES WISE SENSE.
SOME COMPANY THAT'S HUNGRY AND WANTS TO GROW.
INDIGO MIGHT BE A LITTLE TOP HEAVY.
I DON'T KNOW. WE DON'T KNOW THAT STUFF.
I THINK WHAT PEOPLE SAY IS LET'S GET THE DATA AND INFORMATION.
BUT IN SHORT TERM, I WOULD SUGGEST DALE MARTIN WORK WITH INDIGO, GET INCENTIVES TO PULL TOGETHER.
THAT'S WHAT YOU DO. >> WHAT SORT OF CONTRACT? IF WE GO DOWN THIS ROAD, I WOULD NEVER WANT TO GO WITH A
>> IT'S A FIVE YEAR CONTRACT. IF THEY WOULD POSSIBLY THINK
ABOUT THREE, WE COULD SEE -- >> OUR EXPECTATIONS THAT
>> ALL RIGHT. SO I WANT TO OPEN IT UP FOR A REAL QUICK 10 MINUTES OF PUBLIC COMMENT.
>> CAN I SAY SOMETHING FIRST BEFORE THE COMMENTS? WE HAD OUR QUARTERLY MEETING, OUR LADY'S GOLF COURSE.
I GAVE THEM ALL THE ACTIONS WHAT WE DISCUSS TODAY.
AND ONE THING THEY SAID THERE WASN'T ENOUGH DATA TO MAKE A REAL GOOD DECISION. WE HAVE 30, 60 DAYS AND CAN'T GET ALL THE DATA IN THAT TIME. THE CONSENSUS TO KEEP WHERE WE ARE FOR NOW. WITH THE CHANGES IN THE CONTRACT. THAT'S THE CONSENSUS OF OUR
LADIES YESTERDAY. >> SO I'M GOING TO OPEN UP TO PUBLIC COMMENT. WE ARE GOING TO KEEP THE PUBLIC COMMENT TO THREE MINUTES PER. SO, IF ANYBODY HAS ANY PUBLIC COMMENT, GO AHEAD SIR AND THEN YOU SIR.
>> GOOD MORNING. JOHN BURKE, 8606 FERNANDINA.
[00:45:09]
FORMER PAST PRESIDENT. YOU COVERED SOME OF THIS.WHERE IS THE BUDGET FOR FIXING THINGS ON THE GOLF COURSE? IS IT X AMOUNT OF MONEY THE CITY ALLOCATES TO THE GOLF COURSE EVERY YEAR OR DOES IT COME OUT OF THE MANAGEMENT FEE BECAUSE TO ME THE PROBLEM IS THERE'S NOT ENOUGH MONEY.
SO, YOU HAVE TO DO THE BEST YOU CAN WITH THE SMALL AMOUNT OF MONEY, SO I'M NOT CLEAR IN MY MIND EXACTLY WHERE THAT MONEY IS. IS IT THE CITY THAT SAYS, THIS YEAR WE'RE GIVING YOU X AMOUNT OF MONEY? DOES ANY OF THAT COME FROM THE MANAGEMENT FEE?
OR HOW DOES THAT GO? >> ALL CITY FUNDS.
NONE COMES OUT OF THE MANAGEMENT FEE.
ALL PUT IN A CAP X PLAN. >> BASICALLY, BASED ON REVENUE GENERATED AND CORRECT ME IF I AM WRONG, REVENUE GENERATED FROM THE PRIOR YEAR, THE CITY CREATES THE NEW BUDGET AND SAYS, YOU NEED THIS MUCH FOR PAYROLL, THIS MUCH FOR CLUBHOUSE MAINTENANCE.
THIS MUCH FOR FEE GREENS MAINTENANCE, THIS MUCH FOR A PROJECT AND IT'S NOT A BIG PROJECT BECAUSE THE STAFF ISN'T EQUIPPED TO BE A BIG PROJECT STAFF AND THEN IT COMES TO THE CITY COMMISSION AND THEY CHECK IT OFF.
CORRECT? AND THAT'S USUALLY DONE WITH YOU
AND DALE AND -- >> THE BUDGET IS PUT THROUGH ME AND INDIGO GOLF PARTNERS WILL TWEAK IT AND WILL GO TO DALE AND THE COMPTROLLER AND PRESENTED TO THE CITY COMMISSION.
>> IN MAY OF EVERY YEAR WE START THE BUDGET PROCESS.
IT'S BASED OFF REVENUE PROJECTIONS.
>> NEXT YEAR IS PROBABLY GOING TO BE LESS.
>> TO ME THAT'S A PROBLEM. WE'RE LOOKING FOR, I DON'T THINK, I PLAY TWO TO THREE TIMES A WEEK.
I HAVE BEEN HERE A NUMBER OF YEARS.
PLAYING ALWAYS AT THE CITY COURSE ALTHOUGH I HAVE PLAYED ALL THE OTHER COURSES. YOU'RE NOT, ONE OF THE THINGS, EVERYBODY THAT I HAVE TALKED TO GOING BACK YEARS THE GOLF COURSE USED TO MAKE A LOT OF MONEY AND THE COMMISSIONERS AT THAT TIME TOOK THE MONEY AND PUT IT INTO THE GENERAL FUND.
SEE THAT MONEY IS GONE. I DON'T LIKE WHAT GOES ON HERE.
YOU'RE GOING TO DISTRIBUTION BECAUSE THE CLUBHOUSE AND IRRIGATION LOANS AND YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE EXTRA MONEY.
I HOPE SOMEWHERE THE COMMISSIONERS OR THE CITY MANAGER DECIDE TO USE PART OF THAT MONEY TO FIX THE GOLF COURSE. THAT'S ANOTHER WHOLE YEAR AWAY.
I UNDERSTAND THAT. THAT'S SOMETHING YOU NEED TO BE THINKING ABOUT NOW. AND THE MONEY THAT YOU HAVE USED FROM THE WATER AND SEWER DEPARTMENT OR IF THAT'S THE EXACT TERM. THOSE LOANS YEAH.
IF THIS IS A CITY ASSET. THE BIGGEST OPEN AREA IN THE CITY WITH 3000 TREES IS WHAT I BELIEVE THERE'S ON THERE.
SO, YOU KNOW YOU GUYS I APPRECIATE EVERYTHING THAT EVERYBODY DOES HERE. I PROBABLY WENT OVER MY THREE MINUTES. YOU GUYS TALKED IN
YES, SIR. >> MY NAME IS MIKE MEADOWS.
LIVE AT 2601 VILLA DELRAY. MY QUESTION I THINK YOU SHOULD BE ASKING. MIKE ASKED YOU TO BE A FORCEFUL COMMITTEE AND MAKE COMMENTS TO THEM.
MY QUESTION TO THE CITY IS WHY ARE WE IN THIS MESS YOU'RE SITTING HERE IN AN EMERGENCY OR SPECIAL MEETING WHATEVER YOU WANT TO CALL IT? WHY WERE WE GIVEN 30 DAYS TO MAKE A DECISION LIKE THIS IN THIS CITY? THAT'S PART OF YOUR PROBLEM. I HAVE A QUESTION GOING TO ANOTHER, I HAVE A QUESTION FOR INDIGO GOLF AND I, MAYBE THEY HAVE ALREADY EXPLAINED THIS BUT I'M NOT CLEAR ON IT.
WILL THEY DO POINT BLANK QUESTION WILL YOU DO A SIX OR EIGHT MONTH EXTENSION? WHILE WE FIGURE THIS OUT? YOU DON'T HAVE ENOUGH INFORMATION TO MAKE THESE DECISIONS. I WOULD LIKE TO ASK CHRIS IF HE WOULD DO THAT. AND THE OTHER THING IS, I HAVE A LOT OF PEOPLE IN THIS CITY ASKING THIS, YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT THE $1.5 MILLION THEY TOOK.
NEVER GAVE IT BACK. WHAT ABOUT THE SIX AND A HALF
[00:50:02]
ACRES ON SEVEN THEY TOOK AND BY THE WAY, I'M A SUPPORTER OF THE PARK, BECAUSE I HAVE A BROTHER THAT HAS DISABILITIES AND I KNOW HOW IMPORTANT IT IS AND A LOT OF PEOPLE DIDN'T LIKE IT.BUT I WANT TO LET YOU KNOW I WAS A SUPPORTER FOR THAT.
BUT THEY TOOK IT AND THEY USED THE SIX AND A HALF ACRES THAT WAS OWNED BY THE GOLF COURSE. WHY AREN'T THEY INCLUDING THAT? IT'S JUST A CASH SITUATION. IT'S A PAPER BUT WHY ARE THEY REIMBURSING US FOR THAT. I WOULD REALLY LIKE TO KNOW FROM INDIGO IF WE DON'T ALREADY KNOW THAT, WILL THEY DO A SIX
>> YOO YEAH. WE PREFER NOT TO.
JUST BECAUSE IT PUTS THE GOLF COURSE IN A BAD POSITION AS IT IS CURRENTLY DOING RIGHT NOW. WHENEVER YOU HAVE DOUBT AND IT'S CASTING A SHADOW OVER WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO ACCOMPLISH THERE.
WE ARE, HAVE ALWAYS STATED THAT WE'RE WILLING TO WORK WITH THE CITY MANAGER AND COME UP WITH A BEST SITUATION OR BEST TERM FOR A NEW CONTRACT GOING FORWARD. WE'RE WILLING TO HAVE A CONVERSATION AND WE HOPE WE CAN FIGURE SOMETHING OUT.
>> WHAT DID HE SAY? >> NO TO THE SIX TO EIGHT MONTHS. WILLING TO WORK ON A CONTRACT
EXTENSION. >> BUT THE ANSWER TO THAT IS NO
HE WILL NOT DO. >> BECAUSE IT PUTS EVERYBODY IN A LIMBO STATE AND ESPECIALLY THE EMPLOYEES.
>> AND IT'S JUST NOT A GOOD BUSINESS PRACTICE TO DO THAT SHORT TERM OF A CONTRACT. BUT WHAT WE CAN SUGGEST TO THE COMMISSION IS, CHRIS, WHAT IS THE SHORTEST YOU'LL GO ON A
CONTRACT? >> YOU KNOW, IDEALLY, WE HAVE SEVERAL DIFFERENT CONTRACTS THROUGHOUT THE COUNTRY.
WE HAVE CONTRACTS THAT ARE 10 YEARS, WE HAVE CONTRACTS THAT ARE FIVE. WE HAVE CONTRACTS THAT ARE FIVE YEARS WITH PERFORMANCE CLAUSES THAT GET YOU OUT EARLIER IF WE DON'T HIT OUR CERTAIN PERFORMANCE STANDARDS.
WERE WILLING TO HAVE A CONVERSATION --
>> FIVE YEARS WITH PERFORMANCE. IF THEY DON'T HIT IT, IT CAN BE
SHORTER. >> THOSE ARE THE INCENTIVES IN
THE PERFORMANCES. >> I THINK THAT'S GOT TO BE A QUESTION FOR HIM. THE SHORTEST HE WOULD DO IS FIVE
YEARS. >> WITH PERFORMANCE AND BASICALLY IF THEY DON'T HIT CERTAIN THRESHOLDS, WE ARE OUT OF THE CONTRACT. THE CITY HAS AN OUT.
>> AND PUTS IT, LET ME, I FEEL RIGHT NOW THE CITY HAS NOT A LOT OF INPUT HOW TO GET OUT OF THE CONTRACT.
IT'S A ONE-SIDED CONTRACT FOR INDIGO.
THE CONTRACT IF WE SUGGEST TO STAY WITH INDIGO, WE HAVE TO MAKE IT MORE EVEN MORE SO ONE SIDED OUR WAY BECAUSE WE ARE THE CLIENT. IT SHOULD BENEFIT US MORE THAN
THE PROVIDER. >> BUT THERE IS --
>> THINGS WE CAN PUT IN THERE. YEAH.
>> I STILL WAY WE NEED TO KNOW WHY WE'RE PUT IN THIS SITUATION
WITH THE 30 DAYS. >> I DON'T DISAGREE WITH YOU
ASK WHY ARE WE IN THIS POSITION? AND BASICALLY EVERYBODY ALL THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT IS THE SOUTH WHICH YOU EXPLAINED.
>> HIS QUESTION IS WHY ARE WE HAVING TO MAKE THIS DECISION?
>> AT LAST GOLF COURSE ADVISORY MEETING, IT CAME DOWN TO MILLAGE. I DON'T KNOW IF HE HAD BEEN THINKING ABOUT IT. MIKE YOU MIGHT KNOW MORE THAN ME. HAVE Y'ALL BEEN THINKING ABOUT
THIS FOR A LONG TIME. >> THE REASON WE'RE IN THIS SITUATION IS THE GOLF COURSE CONTRACT WAS NOT ON THE TOP OF ANYBODY'S PRIORITY LIST BECAUSE IT WASN'T IN THE PUBLIC EYE OR ANY OTHER CITY ISSUES AND POPS UP LIKE WE HAVE TO MAKE A DECISION AND THAT'S WHY WE'RE HERE.
THAT'S A QUESTION FOR SOMEBODY ABOVE THIS BOARD.
BECAUSE IT'S NOT ON US TO TELL THE CITY TO DO THEIR JOB.
IT'S ON US TO GIVE THE CITY COMMISSION RECOMMENDATIONS ON HOW TO OPERATE THE GOLF COURSE. AND THAT'S ALL THAT'S IN OUR
[00:55:01]
SPECTRUM. IF YOU GO OUTSIDE OF THAT, THEN WE'RE OVER STEPPING THE LINE. I THINK WE NEED TO HAVE A CONSENSUS ON WHAT WE WANT TO PUSH UP TO THE CITY COMMISSION.WHAT I AM HEARING AND CORRECT ME IF I AM WRONG IS GO BACK TO INDIGO AND SAY, WE WANT TO EXTEND YOUR CONTRACT FOR THE SHORTEST POSSIBLE LENGTH WITH PERFORMANCE MEASUREMENTS THAT IF YOU DON'T MEET XYZ AND WE HAVE TO NEGOTIATE WHAT X Y Z IS, WE HAVE AN OUT WITH AN X AMOUNT OF DAYS WINDOW OF HOW LONG TO GET IT OFFICIALLY, 120 DAYS, IF YOU DON'T MEET AT SIX MONTHS WE'RE GOING TO REVIEW YOUR PERFORMANCE, IF YOU'RE NOT MEETING THIS CRITERIA, WE HAVE 120 DAYS TO REPLACE YOU AND YOU WILL BE REPLACED AT 120 DAYS. SO THAT GIVES THEM TIME TO WELL, NO, THAT'S NOT HOW IT WORKS. AT YOUR REVIEW THEY GET ANOTHER 120 DAYS TO FIX THE PROBLEM AND THIS THEY DON'T FIX THE PROBLEM IN 120 DAYS, THEN THEY'RE OUT. IN THAT 120 DAYS, THE CITY IS LOOKING FOR THEIR REPLACEMENT. IT'S A WINDOW FOR BOTH SIDES TO BE PREPARED TO NOT HAVE THIS DISCUSSION QUICK SNAP LIKE THIS AGAIN. AND --
>> AND IF THEY COME BACK AND SAY NO?
>> IF THEY COME BACK AND SAY NO, WE, ARE YOU SAYING WHAT IS PLAN
BECAUSE I QUICKLY WILL JUST WANT TO MENTION IS THERE ANY KIND OF SENTIMENT AT ALL FOR THE GOLF COURSE TO GO BACK UNDER PARKS AND REC? DOES ANYBODY OUT THERE FEEL THAT
WAY? >> WE ONLY TALKED ABOUT INDIGO.
>> I HAVE TWO HEADS SHAKING NO. >> IS IT TOO MUCH MONEY?
>> NO YOU WANT PROFESSIONAL GOLF MANAGEMENT.
>> I'M LOOKING FOR YOUR HEAD TO GO ONE WAY OR ANOTHER.
>> I'M SAYING, I REALLY DIDN'T UNDERSTAND WHAT SHE'S SAYING BECAUSE I COULDN'T HEAR HER. SHE ASKED IS THERE ANY SENTIMENT OF MANAGEMENT GOING BACK TO THE PARKS AND REC OR IS IT A CONSENSUS OF LET'S GIVE INDIGO THE SHOT WITH THIS NEW CONTRACT WITH IT'S A LITTLE, NOT A LOT BIT, A LOT STRICTER ON THEIR PERFORMANCE GUIDELINES AND MAKES IT MORE SAY USER FRIENDLY FOR THE CITY TO BE ABLE TO MANAGE WHAT HAPPENS.
I AGREE WITH YOU AND I WOULD LIKE TO YOU GO AND TALK TO DALE MARTIN AND EXPLAIN OUR FEELINGS SO HE KNOWS AND I DON'T KNOW HOW MUCH DALE DOES KNOW. I KNOW HE WORKS WITH THE CITY CLOSELY. I DON'T KNOW.
>> I'M TOTALLY ON BOARD WITH LEE AND YOU.
IF YOU WANT SOME OTHER LONG-TERM SOLUTION, THAT'S IN A MUCH LONGER TIME FRAME TO WORK OUT AND PLAN LIKE A COMPREHENSIVE PLAN ALMOST. THIS IS AN IMMEDIATE PROBLEM AND PROBABLY THE WORST THING, MAYBE IT WILL FALL APART WITH INDIGO.
AT THIS POINT, I THINK IT'S BEST TO STICK WITH IT WITHOUT MAKING
SOME DRASTIC CHANGE. >> TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION, SUE, IT SEEMS LIKE THE ADVISORY BOARD'S CONSENSUS IS TO STICK WITH INDIGO UNDER NEW CONTRACTS AND IF NEGOTIATIONS FALL APART AND THEY DON'T AGREE TO WHAT WE'RE ASK, WE WILL HAVE TO
FIGURE THAT OUT THEN. >> OKAY.
AND WHO IN THE CITY IS RESPONSIBLE FOR KEEPING TRACK OF THE NEGOTIATIONS? WHETHER THEY HAVE MET THEIR EXPECTATIONS? WOULD THAT BE THE CITY
COMMISSION? >> THAT WOULD BE US AND THE CITY
COMMISSION I BELIEVE AND DALE >> OKAY.
I AGREE WITH WHAT YOU'RE SAYING. >> OKAY.
AND KEEPING THEIR CONTRACT WITH THE CONDITIONS THAT YOU'RE SAYING TOO. BUT WE SHOULD THINK ABOUT PARK
AND RECREATION IN THE BACK. >> AND GET SOME --
>> START WORKING THAT. I'M GETTING WHILE THEY'RE DOING THAT AND DALE IS STILL HERE, GET THE DATA FROM OTHER SOURCES LIKE PARK AND RECREATION SO WE CAN FIGURE THESE OTHER OPTIONS IN
THE BACK OF OUR MIND. >> AND HAVING PLAN B'S AND
I WILL JUST LET YOU KNOW I HAVE BEEN TALKING ABOUT BRUCE MULLER AT JACK'S BEACH TALKING TO THEM HOW THEY TURNED THEIR COURSE AROUND. SO THAT INFORMATION MAYBE HELPFUL LATER DOWN THE ROAD DEPENDING ON WHAT HAPPENS WITH
INDIGO. >> WE CAN DEFINITELY PUT THAT ON THE NEXT REGULAR MEETING AGENDA TO WORK ON PLAN B AND C IF THINGS BREAK DOWN WITH INDIGO WITH IN NEGOTIATION OR THEIR
[01:00:06]
FIRST REVIEW PERIOD. WE WILL HAVE TO FIGURE OUT IN THE NEGOTIATIONS WITH INDIGO. I SAW A HAND GO UP.COME ON UP PLEASE. >> MY NAME IS NATHAN POWELL.
I LIVE IN THE AREA. I AM A MEMBER AT THE GOLF COURSE MGA. I JUST WAS WONDERING IF THERE'S BEEN A THOUGHT OF HIRING A PRIVATE COMPANY TO TAKE OVER
EVERYTHING? >> THAT'S WHAT INDIGO DOES? THEY ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR THE EQUIPMENT AND INSURANCE?
>> OKAY. SO INDIGO TAKES ON ALL EXPENSES?
>> IT'S CITY OWND AND THEY MANAGE IT OUT.
>> THEY'RE A MANAGEMENT COMPANY. I'M TALKING ABOUT TAKING IT ALL
OVER? >> LIKE YOU MEAN SELLING IT?
>> IT CAN'T BE. >> THAT WOULD BE A LEASE DEAL?
>> IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE GETTING OUT? HAVING SOMETHING LIKE AMELIA RIVER?
>> TAKING OVER THE WHOLE OPERATION.
OKAY. THE INCENTIVE IS FOR THE COMPANY TO MAKE MONEY TO PAY THE BILLS, WHATEVER THE CITY BILLS ARE OR WHATEVER THE COURSE BILLS ARE. IF THEY MAKE MONEY THEY MAKE MONEY. IF THEY LOSE MONEY, THEY LOSE MONEY. IT DOESN'T COST YOU.
YOU HAVE AN AMENITY TO THE CITY AND YOUR OPEN SPACE.
I'M SURE THERE'S -- >> THAT'S BASICALLY WHAT WE HAVE NOW. THEY --
>> NO WHAT HE'S REFERRING TO AND STEVE, CORRECT ME IF I AM WRONG BECAUSE THERE'S A DISCREPANCY. THE COURSE OPERATOR IS PAYING THE CITY $1 AND YOU SAID THAT HE WAS PAYING $250,000.
I HAVE BEEN TOLD BY BILL SONTAG. >>
>> I DON'T BELIEVE I MADE ANY COMMENT OUTSIDE OF MR. WEED.
>> I THOUGHT YOU SAID THEY WERE PAYING THE CITY $250,000.
>> MY UNDERSTANDING IS THEY ARE PAYING A DOLLAR AND THIS GUY, A REAL GO GETTER BOBBY WAS INVOLVED EARLY.
IT'S JUST WHAT I HEAR. THERE ARE DIFFERENT
>> THAT'S WHAT WE WANT TO LOOK AT IS THE OPTIONS AS WE GO FORWARD. RICKY YOU HAVE BEEN ON TARGET.
>> THE OTHER QUESTION IS ARE YOU CONSIDERING PUTTING OUT AN RFP?
I WOULD SAY A MANAGEMENT COMPANY.
>> THAT'S NOT THE CONSENSUS RIGHT NOW.
>> THAT IS NOT THE CONSENSUS OF ANYBODY RIGHT NOW.
MOSTLY BECAUSE OF THE TIMELINE. >> RIGHT.
>> AND THAT'S WHY WE'RE TAKING WHAT WE HAVE AND IMPROVING WHAT WE HAVE AND NOT DOING, SUGGESTING THAT WE TAKE WHAT WE HAVE AND IMPROVE WHAT WE HAVE AND GIVE OURSELVES OUT TO WHERE, THAT'S WHAT THAT 120 DAY WINDOWS.
IN THE PERFORMANCE REVIEW TO DO OUR RFP.
IF WE STICK WITH INDIGO AND INDIGO ISN'T WORKING OUT, THEN IN THAT 120 DAYS WE CAN DO OUR RFPS AND DO -- SORRY.
THAT'S -- GO AWAY. THAT'S WHAT THAT 120 DAYS IS AND BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE THE TIME TO DO AN RFP BECAUSE PEOPLE ABOVE US DIDN'T MAKE THIS A PRIORITY UNTIL IT WAS A PRIORITY. WHICH WASN'T ENOUGH TIME IF THAT
MAKES SENSE. >> IF I HAVE THE NUMBERS RIGHT AND CORRECT ME. SO, $1.1 MILLION REVENUE.
WE SPEND $625,000 IN SALARY. WE PUT $200,000 TO A DEBT WE OWE. LEAVES YOU $200,000 FOR
MAINTENANCE OF 330 ACRES. >> OTHER OPERATIONAL EXPENSES.
>> PLUS GIVE OR TAKE SOME THOUSANDS IN THERE FOR
DAY-TO-DAY. >> YOU'RE ROUGHLY SPENDING MORE AND THAT'S WHY YOU'RE IN A DEFICIT
>> YEAH, IT IS. IT'S, IF WE DIDN'T HAVE A DEBT WE WOULD BE MAKING MONEY AND THERE PROBABLY WOULD BE NO
DISCUSSION AT ALL. >> INDIGO WOULD HAVE THEIR
CONTRACT RENEWED. >> YOU SAID THAT'S NOT REALLY GOING TO DO IT. WE'RE LOSING MORE THAN THAT.
YOU NEED TO LOOK AT CAPITAL EXPENDITURES.
>> >> IN FACT, THE QUESTION --
[01:05:02]
>> I GUESS GETTING BACK TO THIS RFP, IF YOU PUT RFP OUT, YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE COMPANIES COME TO YOU WITH THEIR BUDGET WHAT THEY THINK IT WILL TAKE TO OPERATE HIRE AND YOU WILL HAVE A BETTER
SELECTION. >> AND YOU WILL HAVE A CHOICE.
>> RIGHT. I DON'T DISAGREE WITH YOU ON THAT. YOU WANT MORE OPTIONS.
THE PROBLEM IS, WE DON'T HAVE TIME TO DO IT THIS TIME AND UNFORTUNATELY, THAT'S WHAT WE WERE GIVEN.
AND I THINK EVERYBODY UP HERE IF WE HAD THE TIME, WOULD GO OUT
AND INTERVIEW -- >> PUT THE RFP OUT.
>> HOW MANY MANAGEMENT COMPANIES THERE ARE IN AMERICA.
>> 10 YEARS AGO THERE WAS 13 COMPANIES THAT SIGNED UP TO BID
BOBBY WEED WAS ONE THAT DIDN'T MAKE IT.
THEY WERE 30 MINUTES LATE AND COULDN'T MAKE A PROPOSAL.
OF THE 13, JOHN WAS ON THE COMMITTEE.
BILLY CASPER WAS OUTSTANDING AND IT WAS A CLEAR CUT CASE THAT WAS THE BEST CASE TO RUN THE GOLF COURSE.
DID THEY DO EVERYTHING THEY SAID THEY WOULD DO? NO. BUT THEY'RE STILL A GOOD
COMPANY. >> TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION, WE WOULD LIKE TO DO AN RFP, WE JUST DON'T -- AND WE'RE GOING TO GO TO THE COMMISSION AS A RECOMMENDATION.
THE COMMISSION CAN SAY NOPE, THE PUBLIC HAS SPOKEN.
BILLY CASPER IS OUT. WE WILL FIGURE OUT HOW TO MANAGE THE COURSE FOR THE NEXT 60 TO 90 DAYS.
OUR RECOMMENDATION IS TO CONTINUE TO TALK TO INDIGO BECAUSE WE WOULD LIKE A PROCESS OF OTHER OPTIONS.
>> TO GET THE RFP'S DONE. >> UNDERSTAND.
OKAY. SO, WHAT WE WILL BECAUSE WE'RE WAY OVER. WE WILL PUSH UP TO THE COMMISSION IS TO STAY WITH INDIGO WITH A RENEGOTIATED CONTRACT AT FIVE YEARS WITH FIRST TWO YEARS SEMIANNUAL REVIEWS AFTER THE FIRST TWO YEARS WE WILL GO TO ANNUAL REVIEWS. WE WILL RENEGOTIATE OUR PERFORMANCE GUIDELINES THAT THEY NEED TO MEET IF THEY DON'T MEET X GUIDELINES, WE HAVE -- THEY HAVE 120 DAYS TO FIX IT.
IF NOT, THEY'RE OUT IN THE 120 DAYS AND WE WILL ALSO WORK ON REPLACEMENTS FOR THEM. WE WILL LOOK AT THEIR INCENTIVES AND SEE IF BRINGING THEIR INCENTIVES DOWN TO A MORE ATTAINABLE GOAL IS SOMETHING THAT CAN BE DONE AND CAN INCENTIVIZE THEM ENOUGH TO ACTUALLY FOCUS ON REPAIRS AND MAINTENANCE AND THAT'S ALL THAT NEEDS TO GO UP.
I THINK WHEN WE TALK ABOUT THE INDIGO CONTRACT ITSELF, THE BUDGET FOR THE GOLF COURSE IS A WHOLE ANOTHER MEETING.
THE BUDGET NEXT YEAR WILL BE MISERABLE.
JUST PUTTING THAT OUT THERE. SO I DON'T WANT TO GET INTO THAT YET. ARE WE IN AGREEMENT THAT THOSE ARE THE TERMS THAT WE SUGGEST TO THE COMMISSION TO WORK
>> ALL RIGHT. NOW YOU HAVE TO ADJOURN THE MEETING AND WRITE A LETTER TO DALE MARTIN AND THE CITY
COMMISSIONERS. >> WHAT DID THEY ASK, STEVE?
>> WHAT DID WHO ASK? >> I HEARD STEVE ANSWER.
I JUST SAID WHAT DO I DO NOW? >> I THOUGHT SOMEBODY ASKED STEVE TO RE-SEND HIS LETTER OF RESIGNATION.
>> THAT WOULD BE A NICE QUESTION TO ASK, BUT THAT'S NOT GOING
SO, MOTION TO ADJOURN. >> MOTION TO ADJOURN.
>> AYE. MEETING IS ADJOURNED.
* This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.