Nov 19, 2020 Historic District Council

[1. CALL TO ORDER / ROLL CALL / DETERMINATION OF QUORUM]

[00:00:11]

THE HISTORIC REGULAR MEETING AND ALSO THE OLD TOWN COUNCIL MEETING WOULD MS. HARTMAN YOU

PLEASE CALL THE ROLL. >> MEMBER MORRISON, VOICE CHAIR, CHAIR SABINA.

>> PRESENT. >> KIM, YOU ARE REGULAR, NOW, RIGHT? BOARD MEMBERS STARTING COULD YOU PLEASE PARTAKES MIKE I HAVE NONE.

>> I HAVE NONE. >> I HAVE NONE. >> BENCH COME YOU DON'T HAVE ANY CONFLICTS TO YOU? CITY ATTORNEY? COUNSELOR, COULD YOU PLEASE

PRESENT THE QUAD SIDE JUDICIAL PROCEDURES? >> SURE CAN.

TONIGHT, WE HAVE SEVERAL CASES ON THE AGENDA. IN ONE VARIANCE.

WHAT THAT MEANS IS WE ARE GOING TO BE CONDUCTING ALL OF THOSE AS QUASI- JUDICIAL HEARING.

FIRST CITY STAFF WILL MAKE A PRESENTATION AND INTRODUCE EVIDENCE INTO THE RECORD AND CALL ANY WITNESSES THEY MAY HAVE. THEN THE APPLICANTS WILL COME TO THE PODIUM OR SPEAK THROUGH THEIR VIRTUAL MICROPHONE AND PRESENT EVIDENCE AND TESTIMONY INTO THE RECORD. THEY MAY ALSO CALL WITNESSES ON BOTH PARTIES, THE CITY AND THE APPLICANTS MAY CROSS-EXAMINE EACH OTHER AND EACH OTHER'S WITNESSES.

AFTER THE APPLICANT IN THE CITY PRESENT THEIR EVIDENCE OF TESTIMONY, ANY AFFECTED PARTIES MAY DO THE SAME. YOU WILL BE INTRODUCING TESTIMONY AND EVIDENCE INTO THE RECORD AND YOU MAY CALL WITNESSES AND CROSS-EXAMINED THE PARTIES AND OTHER AFFECTED PARTIES IF YOU WISH. IF THERE IS AN APPEAL TO BE TAKEN OF ANY OF THE DECISIONS TONIGHT, THAT APPEAL WILL BE FILED WITH THE CITY COMMISSION WITHIN 30 DAYS OF THE BOARDS DECISION AND WRITTEN FINDINGS OF FACT AND OCCLUSIONS OF LAW WHICH ARE USUALLY SIGNED WITHIN A FEW DAYS OF THE MEETING. TONIGHT, WE HAVE ONE VARIANCE CASE ON THE AGENDA.

THE DIFFERENCE WITH THAT CASE IS WHAT IT REQUIRES TO APPROVE A VARIANCE.

A SUPER MAJORITY, FOUR OUT OF FIVE AT A MINIMUM MUST APPROVE A MOTION TO APPROVE A VARIANCE.

IF THERE IS A MOTION TO DENY THE VARIANCE REQUEST IT ONLY REQUIRES A SIMPLE MAJORITY OF THE BOARD OR THREE OUT OF THE FIVE VOTING MEMBERS. ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS FROM

ANYBODY ONLINE OR IN THE AUDIENCE OR ANY BOARD MEMBERS? >> HEARING NONE, I WILL ASK THE SECRETARY TO ADMINISTER THE OATH TO ANYONE WHO WISHES TO SPEAK. PLEASE STAND.

>> PLEASE STAND AND RAISE YOUR RIGHT HANDS. DO YOU SWEAR OR AFFIRM THAT THE ORAL, AND/OR WRITTEN TESTIMONY YOU ARE ABOUT TO GET WILL BE THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH, NOTHING

BUT THE TRUTH? >> I DO. >> ALL RIGHT.

[2. APPROVAL OF MEETING MINUTES]

CHANGES? >> I HAVE ONE MINOR HOUSEKEEPING >> GO AHEAD AND A.

>> FOR THE RECORD, ABOUT HALFWAY THROUGH THE OCTOBER 15 MINUTES MY NAME STARTED GETTING MISSPELLED, WE DON'T HAVE TO MAKE AN AMENDMENT BY JUST GOING FORWARD GET IT RIGHT.

>> COULD SOMEONE MOVE THE MINUTES FOR APPROVAL? >> SO MOVE.

>> SECOND. >> MOVED, SECONDED AND IS THERE ANY DISCUSSION? HEARING NONE COME ALL THOSE IN FAVOR OF THE MINUTES PLEASE SIGNIFY BY SAYING, AYE.

>> AYE, ANY OPPOSE COME HEARING NONE. AND IT'S ARE APPROVED.

[3.1 HDC 2020-0022 - CITY OF FERNANDINA BEACH, AGENT FOR C. TODD KEMP, 511 ASH STREET]

>> MOVING ON, 2020-022511 ASH STREET. THIS IS AMENDMENT TO THE COA TO

WAIVE THE 90 DAY DEMOLITION DELAY. >> GOOD EVENING.

GIVE ME ONE SECOND, I WILL PULL THIS OUT. >> THIS IS CASE 2020 —-DASH 22,

[00:05:23]

STAFF WAS NOT ABLE BECAUSE OF THAT CONDITION TO LIFT THE DELAY WHEN THE APPLICANT, IN SOME CASES WERE LOOKING TO HAVE A STRUCTURE RELOCATED. IN OTHER CASES WERE LOOKING JUST FOR DOCUMENTATION. IN THIS PARTICULAR CASE WE ARE LOOKING FOR DOCUMENTATION.

SO, THE APPLICANT PROVIDED A SERIES OF PHOTOS WE ASKED FOUR OF THE STRUCTURE AND IS NOW ASKING, THE CITY IS ACTUALLY PUT IN THE PERMIT FOR APPLICATION TO ASK THAT THE BOARD CONSIDER WAIVING THE DEMOLITION DELAY BECAUSE WE HAVE PERCEIVED WHAT IT IS WE WERE LOOKING FOR.

STAFF IS RECOMMENDING APPROVAL OF THE AMENDMENTS TO WAIVE THE DEMOLITION DELAY.

>> QUESTIONS? >> WE HAVE RECEIVED EVERYTHING THAT WE HAVE REQUIRE, STANDARD PHOTOS AND THEY HAVE THE BUILDING READY TO ROLL. THEY ARE READY TO SUBMIT PLANS

TO THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT. >> IF YES, THE DEMOLITION PERMITS AND EVERYTHING WHICH ARE ON HOLD UNTIL THE DEMOLITION DELAY EXPIRES OR WE WAIVE IT. TRADITIONALLY WE WOULD HAVE THAT HOLD, WE WOULD KEEP THAT HOLD IN PLACE UNTIL WE RECEIVED WHATEVER IT WAS WE WERE LOOKING FOR.

IN THIS CASE IT'S A SERIES OF PHOTOS OF THE WAY IT IS WRITTEN STAFF HAS THE AUTHORITY TO THEN LIFT THE HOLDS. IN THIS CASE BECAUSE IT WAS A CONDITION OF THE COA STAFF

CANNOT DO THAT. >> OTHER QUESTIONS? I APOLOGIZE, I HAVE FORGOTTEN THE DETAILS OF THIS CASE. WE APPROVED THE APPLICATION TO GO FORWARD WITH A HOME.

>> CORRECT. >> THE APARTMENT AND DETACHED GARAGE OFFICE SIX STREET SUMMIT

CORRECT. >> AT LAST MONTH'S MEETING WE SAW THE DESIGN FOR THE HOME AND APPROVE THAT. AT THIS PREVIOUS MEETING YOU HEARD THE CASE FOR THE

DEMOLITION OF THE APPARENT NEWS LEADER BUILDING. >> SO, WE HAVE CHECKED ALL OF

THE BOXES. >> CORRECT. >> IS MR. , OUT THERE IN THE

VIRTUAL? >> I BELIEVE HE IS. >> HE COULD ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS

WE MIGHT HAVE. >> I AM NOT SURE THERE'S ANYTHING WE NEED FROM HIM AT THIS TIME. WE DON'T NEED ANYTHING FROM MR. CAMP AT THIS TIME.

IF IT'S ALRIGHT I'M GOING TO SEE IF THERE'S ANYBODY FROM THE PUBLIC WHO WISHES TO SPEAK OUT ON THIS CASE. I'M GOING TO OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING, IS THERE ANYBODY WHO WISHES TO SPEAK TO CASE 2020-0022? I SEE NO ONE IN THE ROOM,

DIRECTOR GIBSON,. >> I HAVE MR. -- ON THE LINE. >> HEARING NO ONE COME I'M GOING

TO CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING AND I WILL CONSIDER A MOTION. >> I'LL MAKE A MOTION.

I MOVED TO APPROVE THIS AMENDMENT TO HDC CASE 2020-0022 WITHOUT CONDITIONS AND I MOVED THAT THE HDC MAKE THE FINAL LEARNING FACTS AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW IN RECORD.

THAT THIS AMENDMENT TO HDC 2020-022 IS SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANT WITH THE DEVELOPMENT

COLD AT THIS TIME. >> I SECOND. >> MOVED IN SECOND WITH MORRISON. HEARING NONE, PLEASE CALL THE ROLE.

TWO NEW BUSINESS, 2020-0031, KAVANAUGH 715 SAN FERNANDO STREET.

[4.1 HDC 2020-0031 - BILL KAVANAUGH, AGENT FOR W. HARDEE JR. & MELINDA A. KAVANAUGH, 715 SAN FERNANDO STREET ]

>> WE ARE GOING TO RENAME THE SEALED TOWN COUNCIL. >> IS THE CASE HDC 2020-31 IS A PARTIAL IT'S A SINGLE-FAMILY RESIDENT. BUILT THE PROPERTY LISTED AT

[00:10:01]

THE SCOPE OF WORK IS ONLY GOING TO OCCUR ON LOTS TWO, THREE, FOUR, FIVE, AND THE SOUTHERN HALF OF LOT 12. THERE ARE A NUMBER OF ALTERATIONS BEING SOUGHT IN THIS APPLICATION INCLUDING REMOVING THE WEST DOUBLE FACING GALLERY SIDE PORCH THAT WAS ADDED IN 2002, ADDING A FLORIDA ROOM AS A ROOM, ADDING A DOWNSTAIRS THE MASTER BEDROOM, ADDING A SECOND STORY OVER THE EXISTING AREA, CONSTRUCTED IN INGROUND POOL AND DECK PATIO, REPLACING THE BRIDGE, REPLACING THE WINDOWS WHICH WERE REPLACEMENT WINDOWS IN 2002 WITH SIMILAR STYLE FG WINDOWS, ADDING A SHED ROOF AND DORMER WINDOWS TO THE GARAGE, RELOCATING THE GARAGE DOORS FROM THE WEST SIDE OF THE GARAGE TO THE NORTH SIDE, ADDING A WINDOW AND EXPANDING THE PORCH ON THE WEST SIDE OF THE GARAGE, REMOVING THE WOOD ROT AND REPLACING WITH HEARTY ARTISAN LAP SIDING AND TRIM, PAINTING THE HOUSE AND THE GARAGE, AND CORRECTING SETTLING ISSUES WITH THE EXISTING FOUNDATION. STAFF FINDS THAT THE PROPOSED DESIGN IS COMPATIBLE WITH THE OLD TOWN HISTORIC DISTRICT IN TERMS OF MATERIAL, SKILL, PROPORTION AND SETBACKS.

AS ALWAYS WE TAKE A LOOK AT THE ARCHAEOLOGICAL SENSITIVITY OF OLD TOWN AND ASKED THAT THEY READ BE RESPECTFUL OF THAT IF ANYTHING IS FOUND. AND WITH THAT, STAFF FINDS THAT THE REQUESTED ACTION AS PRESENTED IS CONSISTENT WITH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT COLD.

THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR STANDARDS ON THE OLD TOWN PRESENTATION GUIDELINE AND

RECOMMENDS APPROVAL OF HDC 2020-31. >> QUESTIONS FOR MR. CAMILLA?

>> THE MARVIN ELEVATE WINDOWS, NO WE HAVE HAD I SEE ONE THING QUOTES ALL TRACKS OF OTHER QUOTES ELEVATE, THEY MAY POTENTIALLY BE THE EXACT SAME THING.

>> I THINK ALL TRACKS ARE THE MATERIAL THE WINDOW IS MADE OUT OF.

IT IS THEIR PROPRIETARY FIBERGLASS ON THE EXTERIOR. THE ELEVATING I BELIEVE RESPONSE

TO WHAT USED TO BE THE INTEGRITY WINDOWS. >> ARE THOSE CURRENTLY ON OUR

LIST? >> YES. >> I WAS UP THERE THIS WEEK, I'M

SORRY, TAMMY, QUESTIONS. >> REMIND ME, WHERE IS THIS HOUSE?

SAN FERNANDO AND WHAT? >> IS THE CORNER OF SAN FERNANDO AND ESTRADA.

>> A BEAUTIFUL PROPERTY. , GREAT VIEWS FROM THE BACKSIDE OF THE RIVER.

IF WE DON'T HAVE ANY QUESTIONS OF HER -- WILL GO TO THE APPLICANT.

I'M GOING TO GUESS IS MR. KAVANAUGH. IT COME UP, IDENTIFY YOURSELF

FOR THE RECORD AND YOU ARE SWORN, RIGHT? >> YES, WE WERE.

>> EXCELLENT. >> HARDY KAVANAUGH. >> I'M LINDY CAPITAL.

>> IS THERE ANYTHING YOU'D LIKE TO ADD TO THE APPLICATION AT THIS TIME?

>> KNOW. IT WAS A PRETTY LARGE APPLICATION.

>> IT IS SUBSTANTIAL. IT PROBABLY HAS MORE ATTACHENTS THAN I HAVE SEEN FOR ANYTHING I

HAVE EVER HAD. >> IS THIS CONCEPTUAL OR FINAL? >> FINAL.

>> A QUESTIONS? >> COULD YOU HAVE DONE A FEW MORE THINGS TO THAT HOUSE WHILE

YOU ARE AT IT? >> IT IS AN OLD HOUSE. >> I THINK THE GRAY ROOF IS

PERFECTLY ACCEPTABLE BUT I WILL MISS THE RED ROOF. >> ME TOO.

>> WE ORIGINALLY HAD A CEDAR SHAKER BUT THE WEATHER AND HUMIDITY HERE THEY DON'T SEEM TO LAST. A METAL ROOF IS PROBABLY BETTER SO WE DON'T HAVE THE BUCKETS IN

THE ATTIC. >> IT'S ALWAYS EXCITING WHEN THE RAIN COMES IN.

>> I DO HAVE A QUESTION FOR YOU. THE POOL THAT YOU'RE PUTTING IN THE BACK, I KNOW THERE IS A MAP BUT I KNOW THE PROPERTY IS FLAT TENANT DOES DROP DOWN, DOES THE POOL GOES IT JUST ON THE FLAT

SPOT? >> JUST ON THE FLAT SPOT. >> SO YOU DON'T HAVE TO HAVE AN

[00:15:02]

EXCEPTIONALLY TALL FENCE AROUND THE POOL. >> ARE YOU PROPOSING THE WHITE

PICKET FENCE HAS THE POOL FENCE? >> YES. >> THAT WOULD BE WHAT IS CODE.

>> FOREFEET. >> THAT PICKET WE CARRY AROUND. >> YES.

>> THE OTHER QUESTION I HAD WAS THE NOTES ABOUT THE CHANGING OF THE WINDOWS ALREADY REPLACED.

ARE THERE ANY ORIGINAL WINDOWS LEFT ON THE STRUCTURE? >> NO, THEY ARE NOT.

WE ORIGINALLY REDID THE WINDOWS IN 2002. WE WENT WITH WOODEN WINDOWS AND THE CORNERS OF THEM ALL HAVE ROTTED OUT JUST FROM THE MOISTURE THAT WE HAVE SO, IS TIME TO GO AHEAD AND REPLACE AND GET SOME THAT ARE HURRICANE PROOF SO WE DON'T HAVE TO

CONTINUALLY BOARD UP THE WINDOWS EVERY TIME WE HAVE A HURRICANE. >> ONE MORE QUESTION.

I CANNOT FIND THE LOCATION OF THE AIR CONDITIONER COMPRESSORS. ARE THEY EXISTING?

>> THERE IS EXISTING ON THE ESTRADA SIDE. ON THE EAST SIDE OF THE HOUSE, BUT NOW THEY ARE GOING TO BE RELOCATED A LITTLE BIT FURTHER TO THE NORTH.

THERE SHOULD BE A LOCATION ON THE SIDE OF THEIR. >> IS TALK TO BACK BEHIND A

LITTLE ELSE SHAPE IS THAT WHERE THEY ARE? >> THAT'S WHERE THEY ARE NOW.

ARE YOU CHANGING THE GARAGE? I YOU GOING FROM A TWO BAY WITH A ONE-DAY WITH A PEDESTRIAN

DOOR? >> YES, WHEN WE PUT THE GARAGE AND WITH THE WAY IT IS SET UP NOW YOU WOULD HAVE TO HAVE A VERY SMALL CARD TO BE ABLE TO GET INTO WITHOUT BACKING INTO

THE HOUSE. >> EXTRAORDINARY PROPERTIES WHO MAKE IT REALLY IS.

SO, I USE TO AFFECTIONATELY AND I STILL CALL MY HOUSE THE RIVERSIDE OF THE ISLAND AND YOU'LL UNDERSTAND THAT'S A BIG JOKE. THIS IS NOW GOING TO BE THERE

WERE SIDE OF THE ISLAND. AND IT WON'T BE A JOKE. >> I HAVE NO QUESTIONS.

>> A GOOD SUBMITTAL. >> I HAVE NO QUESTION. >> I HEARD YOU.

OKAY, I THINK YOU HAVE BEEN GRACIOUS AND WE SURE APPRECIATE THE EFFORT YOU HAVE PUT INTO

THIS APPLICATION. >> WE HAVE TO THINK SALE AND ALSO KELLY FOR THEIR HELP, THEY

HELPED US WITH OUR PACKAGE TO MAKE SURE. >> YOU DID EXCELLNT YOU SELECTED IN EXCELLENT ARCHITECT. THANK YOU FOR YOUR DEDICATION WE SURE APPRECIATE IT.

IF THERE ARE NOT ANY OTHER QUESTIONS WE WILL GO AHEAD AND THINK YOU AND WE'LL MOVE ON TO THE PUBLIC HEARING. IF THERE IS ANYONE WHO WISHES TO SPEAK IN REGARDS TO CASE 2020- 0031. NO NEED TO STAND UP HERE. IS THERE ANYBODY, ANYBODY IN THE ROOM? NO. WE WILL CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING AND MOVE INTO BOARD DISCUSSION. BOARD MEMBERS, ANY ADDITIONAL COMMENTS?

>> I THINK IT'S A VERY SIGNIFICANT PROPERTY AND IT'S A SIGNIFICANT ADDITION.

I THINK IT'S VERY WELL DONE AND IT WILL BE VERY SUCCESSFUL WHEN IT IS ALL DONE.

>> I CONCUR. >> I APPRECIATE THAT PERSPECTIVE BECAUSE AS NOT A DESIGNER, I LOOK AT THIS AND I SEE THE HISTORIC PROPERTY IS BEING THOUGHTFULLY ADDED ONTO.

AT SOME POINT YOU START TO WONDER, HAVE WE GONE TOO FAR FROM THE ORIGINAL? I THINK THE FACT THAT IT WAS DONE 20 YEARS AGO WHEN WE ARE BACK HERE NOW, EVERYTHING SEEMS TO BE MUCH MORE -- NOW. WE BUILD IN 1880 AND WE HAVE VERY FEW CHANGES OVER 100 YEARS AND NOW ABOUT EVERY 20 YEARS WE SEEM TO SEE MUCH MORE SUBSTANTIVE CHANGES.

HAVING SAID THAT WITH THE QUALITY OF MATERIAL, DESIGN AND QUALITY OF THE LABOR THIS COULD

BE AROUND FOR A LONG TIME. >> WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE MAIN STRUCTURE IT STILL TAKES PRECEDENCE IT'S VERY CLEAR AND THEN THE HIGH AND BETWEEN ITS BEAUTIFULLY DONE.

IT LOOKS LIKE A HOUSE THAT COULD VERY WELL HAVE EVOLVED OVER THE LAST 150 YEARS SLOWLY INSTEAD OF

THIS INCREDIBLE UNDERTAKING. >> THE - IS CALLING OUT THE MID- LACK CORRIDOR.

>> GREAT. IF THERE IS ANYBODY WHO WOULD LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION THIS WOULD

BE THE TIME TO DO IT. >> I MOVED TO APPROVE CASE NUMBER HDC 2020 WILL-31 WITHOUT

[00:20:06]

PART OF THE RECORD. THAT HDC 2020-31 HAS PRESENTED IS SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANT WITH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT COMPANY, THE SECRETARY OF DEVELOPMENT STANDARDS IN THE OLD

PRESERVATION GUIDELINES TO MARK APPROVAL AT THIS TIME. >> SECOND.

>> ANY DISCUSSION? HEARING NINE, PLEASE CALL THE ROLE.

>> MEMBER MORRISON. >> YES. >> MEMBER KOSACK.

>> YES. >> IT. >> SPINO.

>> YES. >> GOOD LUCK. >> MOVING ON TO 2020-035

[4.2 HDC 2020-0035 - MIRANDA ARCHITECTS, AGENT FOR MIKE MYERS + CHRISTIE WALSH MYERS, 321 N. 4TH STREET ]

WITH PLEASE GO AHEAD. >> INTERESTING LOCATION. >> YOU LIVE ON IT.

>> VERY WOODED. >> THIS IS HDC 2020-35, PROPERTY LOCATED AT 321 NORTH FOURTH STREET. IT IS CURRENTLY A VACANT LOT ZONED ARE TWO MEDIUM RESIDENTIAL. THIS IS THE AREA HERE THERE IS A LOT OF ACTIVITY GOING ON IN THIS NEIGHBORHOOD, YOU WILL REMEMBER LAST YEAR THERE IS A HOUSE ON THE 25-FOOT BLACK THAT WAS BUILT ON LAST MONTH WE SAW A PROPOSED PROPERTY FOR THE 316 BEHIND IT. THIS IS THE 321 LOT.

IT IS A 50 BY 125 LOT CONSISTING OF MULTIPLE UNDERLINED LOTS AND THE APPLICANT IS SPEAKING FOR A SINGLE-FAMILY RESIDENCE ON AN EIGHT BY 12 SINGLE-FAMILY RESIDENCE STAFF DOES FIND THAT THE DISC ACTION IS CONSISTENT WITH THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, BUT LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE ON THE SECRETARY OF INTERIOR STANDARDS IN THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC GUIDELINES AND IS RECOMMENDING APPROVAL OF HDC 2020-35 WITH A COUPLE OF CONDITIONS. THE FIRST ONE BEING THAT THE DRIVEWAY HAVE A CONCRETE APRON, THE SECOND THAT IT BE ENLARGED TO REQUIRE ACCOMMODATE THE TWO VEHICLES AND THE MECHANICAL BE PRESENTED AND THE FOUNDATION HEIGHT BE RAISED SLIGHTLY

HIGHER. THANK YOU. >> QUESTIONS.

>> WAS YOUR COMMENTS ABOUT THE FOUNDATION BEING RAISED HIGHER JUST IN A STATIC THING?

>> WE REQUIRED AN ELEVATED FOUNDATION. I BELIEVE THE FOUNDATION IS

ELEVATED 12 INCHES. IS THAT WRONG? >> WILL FIX THAT.

>> THAT WAS THE THOUGHT PROCESS BEHIND IT. >> OTHER QUESTIONS.

>> YOU REQUEST THAT THEY EXPAND THE DRIVEWAY TO FIT TWO CARS, WHEN I LOOK AT THE SITE PLAN I'M WONDERING WHERE WOULD YOU FIT THOSE IN WITH MOVING A BUNCH OF TREES.

>> OF THE REQUIREMENT IS TO ON-SITE PARKING SPACES. >> WE WILL GET JOSÉ TO RESPOND TO THAT. WE CANNOT WAIVE AN LDC REQUIREMENT.

SAL, THE FOUNDATION HEIGHT, THE MECHANICALS, DRIVEWAY, TWO VEHICLES, AND APRON IS ALSO.

>> THERE IS NO REQUIREMENT FOR A PAVED DRIVEWAY BUT THERE IS A REQUIREMENT.

>> AT THE UTILITY VEHICLES THAT NEED TO BE. >> THAT IS NEW CONSTRUCTION

ONLY, RIGHT? >> CORRECTS. >> PRETTY GOOD REASONS IF YOU WANT TO PARK AN ELECTRIC TRUCK RIGHT THERE. NO OTHER QUESTIONS I'LL ASK MR. MARANDA TO JOIN US. PLEASE IDENTIFY YOURSELF FOR THE RECORD AND YOU ARE SWORN,

CORRECT? >> I AM. >> BECAUSE THEY MARANDA SUITE 206. JUST TO ADDRESS SOME OF THE COMMENTS FROM STAFF, YES, WE PROCEEDED WITH CONSTRUCTION DRAWINGS BECAUSE THIS WAS ONE OF THE APPLICATIONS THAT SLIP

[00:25:02]

YES, THE DRIVEWAY HAS BEEN MODIFIED. FIRST WHILE WE CHANGE THEM FROM GRAVEL TO PAVERS, DOES HAVE A CONCRETE APRON. WE ADDED THE DOUBLESTACK THE SECOND SPACE IS JUST GOES OFF TO THE SIDE OF THIS HOUSE BECAUSE WE DID NOT WANT TO REMOVE TREES THERE WAS A LOT OF ORDINANCES TO JUGGLE WITH. WE DID NOT WANT TO REMOVE A TREE THE MECHANICAL EQUIPMENT WILL BE ON THE SIDE OF THE HOUSE ON THE WIDE SIDE OF THE HOUSE WHICH WOULD BE SOUTH. THE CONSTRUCTION DRAWINGS SHOWS THAT INFORMATION AS WELL.

THE FOUNDATION, 24 INCHES OUT OF THE GROUND. THE REASON IT LOOKS SHALLOW IS BECAUSE WE HAVE VERTICAL BOARD AND WE WENT LONG TO EXTEND THEM BELOW.

WE HAVE FRAMED THE FRONT PORCH AND THE PORCH IN THE HOUSE ARE THE SAME LEVEL.

IT IS SEAMLESS FROM INSIDE TO OUTSIDE. WE FEEL THAT THE FOUNDATION IS 24 INCHES IS MORE THAN ADEQUATE FOR THAT CONTEXT AND NEEDS THE INTENT OF THE DESIGN GUIDELINES.

>> LET ME INTERRUPT JUST A SECOND. DID THEY PROPOSE SOLUTION OF

TWO-CAR SCENARIO WAS THAT CONSISTENT WITH THE LDC? >> IF THERE IS TWO PARKING

SPACES. >> NOT SO MUCH THE DRIVEWAY BUT TWO CARS IT WILL IT BE TO

PARKING SPACES WHEN IT'S DONE? >> YES. >> I'M ASSUMING WE CAN STACK

VERSUS INDIVIDUAL. >> QUESTIONS FOR MR. MORAN. >> YOU SET A SPUR ON THE

DRIVEWAY TO THE SOUTH SIDE? >> YES. WE ARE TRYING TO AVOID THE TREES AND HOUSE AND PROBABLY THOSE SPUR WE CAN MULCHER GRAVEL. IT'S BECOME A SECONDARY SPACE BECAUSE IT'S A SINGLE HOMEOWNER, WE DON'T EXPECT HER TO HAVE MORE THAN ONE CAR, BUT WE DO HAVE TO

ACCOMMODATE THAT EXTRA SPACE. >> QUESTIONS? A.

>> ON THE FRONT PORCH, IS THAT A TRUE PEER FOUNDATION? >> YES.

>> WITH SLOTS BEHIND IT? >> YES. YOU ARE RIGHT.

>> IT IS TRUE. >> CAN I GO AROUND THE WHOLE HOUSE?

>> IT IS ONLY YOU HAVE A LIMITED BUDGET. IT IS NOT VERY CHEAP.

>> OTHER QUESTIONS? >> TO GO WITH TAMMY'S COMMENT, TO GO WITH THE FRONT PORCH AND IS THE ENTIRE FRONT PORCH FRONT AND SIDE, THAT IS THE ELEMENT YOU'RE GOING TO SEE AS YOU APPROACH THE HOUSE SURPASSED BY IT, THAT IS WHERE YOU GET THE MOST BANG FOR YOUR BUCK AS FAR

AS THAT PURE LOOK. >> I THINK THAT'S GREAT FROM AN AESTHETIC BUT TRULY WHAT MY CONCERN WITH THESE WELLS AND I BRING IT UP TIME AND AGAIN AND IT'S NOT OUR PURVIEW, IT HAS TO BE A DIFFERENT SITUATION IS, THE TOPOGRAPHY IS THAT THESE GUYS ARE SITTING ON A HILL IN THE BIG BLUE IS SITTING ON A HILL. ALL OF THESE DUES HOMES HAVE THE CONSTRUCTION AND BIG BLUE PUTS THE PAPERS IN THE BACK AND THEY ARE DUMPING ALL OF THE WATER ONTO THE REST OF US THAT HAVE

BEEN THERE AND I GET A RIVER UNDER MY HOUSE. >> YOU CANNOT DO THAT ANYMORE THERE'S A STORM DRAIN PLAN NOW ON THE CONSTRUCTION THAT WE ARE REQUIRED TO HANDLE ALL OF THE

RUNOFF ON THE SITE. >> PEOPLE SAY THEY'RE HANDLING IT.

>> WHAT WE ARE SAYING IS SITTING OUT REVIEW SAID AND SINCE INSPECTS THAT DURING CONSTRUCTION. YOU SAW THIS HAS BEEN A PROBLEM AND THAT'S WHY THAT ORDINANCE

WAS ENACTED. >> THEY MADE THEM IN SAN AUGUSTINE, ONE OF THE REASONS THEY ARE HAVING SO MUCH FLOODING YOU HAVE TO DO PURE CONSTRUCTION AND LET THE WATER FLOW LIKE IT WAS INTENDED TO FLOW. BUT THAT'S MY CONCERN THERE. I APPRECIATE IT WE ARE GUTTERING

IN DAYLIGHT. >> I WOULD LIKE TO UNDERSTAND HOW THAT WORKS SOMETIMES.

OTHER QUESTIONS? >> ON YOUR SITE PLAN, YOU HAVE DASHED LINES AND I AM ASSUMING SOME ARE THE SETBACKS BUT THEN THERE IS A COUPLE RANDOM ONES THAT I'M NOT SURE WHAT THEY ARE.

>> YOU CAN SEE THE SMALLER DASHED LINE IS THE ACCESSORY BUILDINGS.

JUST TO SHOW THAT THAT GARDEN O. >> THAT'S WHAT IT SAYS 20-FOOT IN THE REAR THAN THE HOUSE COMES

IN A LITTLE BIT FURTHER. >> THAT'S CORRECT. >> THAT'S GREAT.

THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU MR. MARANDA. I SUGGEST THAT -- BY THE

[00:30:09]

THERE. >> THE TINY HOUSE, SHE'S IN IT RIGHT BEHIND YOU.

>> THAT FILLED IN NICELY. ANYONE? NO.

WE WILL CLOSE PUBLIC HEARING AND GO TO DISCUSSION. BOARD MEMBERS.

>> I THINK IT IS A NICELY DESIGNED HOUSE. >> I THINK THE SCALE OF IT IS GOOD. IT IS NOT OSTENTATIOUS, IF IT'S ESPECIALLY WITH A TINY ONE NEXT TO IT. THAT WORKS. I THINK THEY HAVE DONE A GREAT JOB AND THESE FOLKS DO NICE WORK. REALLY GOOD JOB.

>> WAS THE CONTRACTOR? >> THAT WOULD BE CALL CONSTRUCTION.

>> I'LL MAKE A MOTION. I MOVED TO APPROVE CASE NUMBER HDC 2020-35 WITHOUT CONDITIONS.

LET ME SAY, I FEEL LIKE THE CONDITIONS THAT WERE IN SAL'S STAFF I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE

EVERYBODY ELSE AGREES WITH THAT I FEEL OKAY WITH THAT. >> SALARIES SATISFIED WITH WHAT YOU HEARD IN TERMS OF CONDITIONS? TWO YES, WHILE WE ARE SEEING FOR FINAL HERE DOESN'T HAVE BEEN. IF THE PERMIT SET SORRY AND WE WILL JUST HAVE TO MAKE SURE THAT

THOSE ARE CONDITIONS ARE MET ON PERMITS. >> I THINK YOU'RE SATISFIED.

>> WITHOUT CONDITIONS IN A MOVE THAT HDC MAKE THE FOLLOWING FINDINGS OF FACT SO THE CONCLUSION OF LAW ON THE RECORD THAT HDC CASE HDC 2020-35 SB PRESENTED IS COMPLIANCE, THE SECRETARY OF MINSTER INTERIOR STANDARDS IN THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC GUIDELINES.

>> SECOND. >> MOVE ORSON. SECOND KOSACK, ANY DISCUSSION?

>> MEMBER MORRISON. >> YES. >> MEMBER KOSACK.

>> YES. >> VICE-CHAIR POZZETTA. >> YES.

[4.3 HDC 2020-0040 - SOLAR TREK, AGENT FOR SUSAN MORGAN, 314 S. 7TH STREET ]

>> CHAIR SPINO. >> YES. >> MOVING ON, SOLAR TREK MORGAN 314 SOUTH STREET THIS IS AN ELECTRIC PANEL SYSTEM IN MY RECALLING THAT CORRECTLY?

>> 84. >> THIS IS HD 2020-40, PROPERTY LOCATED AT SOUTH SEVENTH STREET.

IT IS THE PROPERTY BUILT IN 1884 ACCORDING TO THE MASTER FLIGHT ZONED R TO.

THE REQUESTED ACTION IS TO INSTALL ROOF MOUNTED SOLAR PANEL SYSTEM.

THIS IS THE FRONT ELEVATION OF THE PROPERTY, IT DOES HAVE AN ACCESSORY STRUCTURE OR GARAGE THE SOLAR AWAY WILL BE ON THE EAST FACING PORTION OF THE ROOF OF THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE OUR DOWNTOWN GUIDELINES TO ADDRESS UTILITIES AND ENERGY RETROFITTING STATING THAT THESE TYPE OF MECHANICAL SYSTEMS AND SOLAR PANELS SHOULD BE PUT AT THE REAR FAÇADES OR ON ROOFTOPS THAT ARE NOT READILY VISIBLE FROM THE STREET AND PAINT CONDIMENTS AND BLEND WITH THE COLOR OF THE BUILDING. THE APPLICANT HAS IN THE PROPOSAL DONE THAT AND PLACE THE PANELS TOWARDS THE REAR OF THE STRUCTURES SO THEY ARE NOT HIGHLY VISIBLE FROM THE FRONT.

TO MINIMIZE THE IMPACT IT WILL HAVE ON THE FRONT ELEVATION. SO, STAFF FINDS THAT THE REQUESTED ACTION IS PRESENTED IS CONSISTENT WITH A COMPREHENSIVE PLAN TO LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE ON THE SECRETARY OF DEVELOPMENT STANDARDS AND DISTRICT GUIDELINES AND IS RECOMMENDING

APPROVAL HDC-2020-THREE. >> A QUESTIONS FOR MR. CAMILLA? >> SAL, DO WE KNOW HOW MANY

PANELS ARE ON HERE? IS THIS A TRUE DEPICTION? >> THAT IS THE ACTUAL PLAN FOR

THE SOLAR ARRAY AND I CAN PULL THAT UP ON THE SCREEN. >> THIS IS THE LOCATION OF THE

[00:35:03]

BOTH ARE NOT VISIBLE FROM THE FRONT ELEVATION. >> IT SAL COME IS THAT A GABLE

STRUCTURE ON THE BACK? >> YES, I BELIEVE SO. >> I'VE NEVER SEEN THAT.

>> IT LOOKS LIKE YOU SHOULD BE ABLE TO SEE IT FROM EIGHTH STREET BUT I DON'T THINK YOU

CAN. >> IT'S OVER THERE. >> IT LOOKS LIKE THERE'S A

PARKING LOT. >> NEXT TO THAT ANTIQUE STORE MUST BE SOMETHING YOU CAN SEE

FROM THEIR. >> WHENEVER DOUG COMMENTED THAT DESIGNED BUILDING ON THE CORNER.

>> THE HOUSES FURTHER DOWN. AS THREE OR FOUR HOUSES DOWN. >> I CAN PULL IT UP ON GOOGLE

EARTH IF YOU LIKE TO SEE THE EIGHTH STREET SIDE. >> WE HAVE ALL DRIVEN DOWN IT IF

WE WERE GOING TO SEE WE PROBABLY WOULD'VE SEEN IT. >> THAT'S EXACTLY HOW WE WOULD SEE IT. OTHER QUESTIONS? DO WE HAVE A REPRESENTATIVE FROM SOLAR TREK ONLINE AND DO THEY HAVE ANYTHING THEY WOULD LIKE TO ADD?

THANK YOU. >> I THINK WE CAN ASK IF THERE IS ANYBODY ON LINE REPRESENTING THE CASE THEY CAN RAISE THEIR HANDS RESUME. I DON'T THINK WE KNOW.

>> ANYBODY OUT THERE RAISE YOUR HAND ON ZOOM IF YOU ARE PARTICIPATING.

IF NOT, WE'LL JUST GO AHEAD AND DENY THIS. [LAUGHTER]

NO. >> OKAY, HEARING NONE. BEFORE WE GO TO THE PUBLIC

HEARING WOULD ANYBODY HAVE ANY QUESTIONS. >> THE ONLY QUESTION I WOULD'VE HAD IS COME I CAN'T BELIEVE THE SIZE OF THIS. THEY HAVE 50 PANELS AND ACCORDING TO THE ENGINEERING PLANS IF THEY ARE 340 WATTS OF PEACE THEY HAVE 170 KILOWATTS OF POWER GOING IN THERE, THAT'S MASSIVE. I HAVE GOT 4 KILOWATTS FOR MINE.

>> THERE GOING TO BE SUBSIDIZING THE REST. >> THAT'S A MASSIVE SYSTEM.

DIRECTOR, DID YOU SEE ANYTHING OUT THERE FROM SOLAR TREK? WERE JUST QUESTIONING THE SCALE OF THE INSTALLATION SEEMS RATHER LARGE FOR THAT SIZE HOUSE. WERE GOING TO NEED A BUILDING

PERMIT ANYWAY. >> IT'S NOT LIKE IS THE KAVANAUGH HOUSE.

>> THAT'S MY UNDERSTANDING THAT BECAUSE THE RATE OF RETURN IS SO LOW THAT MOST FOLKS TRIED TO BE

UNDER THEIR FULL CAPACITY IN ORDER. >> RATE.

YOU CAN ALWAYS ADD IF YOU NEED TO. >> YOU DON'T REALLY NEED TO

BUILD MORE BECAUSE YOU'RE NOT GOING TO GET A RETURN ON THAT. >> THE THING IS, AT LEAST FROM MY PERSONAL STANDPOINT, STATICALLY I THINK IT ACTUALLY LOOKS BETTER WHEN YOU COVER THE ENTIRE ROOF THAN A FEW HAVE BITS AND PIECES OF IT ANYWAY. I DON'T SEE A NEGATIVE SIDE OF THERE BEING THIS MANY OF THEM. I THINK ONCE YOU START IT LOOKS BETTER WHEN YOU COVER THE WHOLE

THING THEN WHEN YOU SEE IT PIECEMEAL ON THE SIDE OF IT. >> ARE WE GOING TO BE OKAY APPROVING THIS IF THEY DECIDE THEY WANT TO COME IN SMALLER LATER.

>> MAYBE THAT'S WHY THEY WENT AS BIG. >> THEY HAVE BEEN PLACED WHERE

WE WOULD. >> IF THEY ASK WHERE WE WOULD HAVE A SOLAR FARM THIS IS WHERE YOU WOULD DO IT BUT IN FACT IT WILL BE INTERESTING TO SEE. IT WILL BE INTERESTING TO SEE.

>> I THINK WE ARE GOING TO SEE MORE OF THIS. IN THE NEXT COUPLE OF YEARS WERE GOING TO SEE MORE AND MORE PROJECTS LIKE THIS THAT WILL COME IN FRONT OF US THAT WE HAVEN'T SEEN A LOT TODAY BUT I THINK THIS IS AN EXAMPLE OF WHAT WE WOULD WANT PEOPLE TO COME TO US AND SHOW US. I THINK IS SETTING A GOOD PRECEDENT.

>> IT'S A LOT OF JUICE. >> IS THERE ANYBODY FROM THE PUBLIC WHO WISHES TO TESTIFY OR

BE HEARD IN REGARDS TO 2020-0040 >> I DON'T BELIEVE SO. >> SIMPLY UNMUTE YOURSELF.

>> THEY ARE VERY CONFIDENT. >> THEIR CONFIDENT WITH THEIR 341 TO COVER ALL THAT ROOF IN.

>> WHAT IS THIS GOING TO COST? >> A LOT. >> THEY ARE ON SEVENTH.

[00:40:07]

>> THEIR NOT CLOSE ENOUGH TO A DISTRIBUTION LINE. I DOUBT THAT.

YOU HAVE TO GET CLOSER TO TENTH. >> IT WILL BE OVER 100 GRAND. >> I'M SURE MORE THAN THAT.

>> OKAY, THAT IS NOT OUR CONCERN. IS IT.

WAS SOMEBODY LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION. >> I MOVED TO APPROVE CASE NUMBER HDC 2020-40 WITHOUT CONDITIONS AND I MOVE THE HDC MAKE THE FOLLOWING FINDINGS OF FACTS PART OF THE RECORD. THAT HDC CASE 2020-40 IS PRESENTED IS SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANT WITH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE WITH THE SECRETARY OF STANDARDS AND THE

HISTORIC DISTRICT. >> SECOND. >> MOVE MORRISON, SECOND KOSACK.

ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION? HEARING NONE. PLEASE CALL RON.

>> MEMBER MORRISON. >> S. >> MEMBER KOSACK.

[4.4 HDC 2020-0043 - TOMASSETTI & PRINCE, PC, AGENT FOR CMR ISLAND PROPERTIES, LLC., 116 N. 2ND STREET ]

>> AS. >> VICE-CHAIR POZZETTA. >> YES.

>> CHAIR SPINO. >> YES. >> I'M ASSUMING TREECE IS TIED UP. IT'S 116 NORTH SECOND STREET THIS IS 43.

NORTH SECOND STREET, IT IS ZONED C-3 CENTRAL BUSINESS DISTRICT AND IT IS CURRENTLY A VACANT LOT. THE REQUESTED ACTION IS A COA TO CONSTRUCT FOR THREE-STORY TOWNHOMES. THIS FALLS INTO THE COMMUNITY REDEVELOPMENT AREA, IT IS PART OF THE EASTERN FRONT STREET AREA. WE WILL SKIP OVER ALL OF THAT STUFF AND GET TO THE ANALYSIS. SO, THE TOWNHOMES ARE PERMISSIBLE HOUSING TYPE, IT IS MEETING THE LOT DENSITY AND THE MECHANICAL. IT DOES HAVE ITS APPROPRIATE SETBACKS THERE IS A BUFFER REQUIRED BETWEEN THE NONRESIDENTIAL AND MIXED-USE PROJECTS SO IT IS A TYPE C BUFFER THAT IS REQUIRED AT THE REAR OF THIS PROPERTY BECAUSE OF THE ZONING. PARKING IS REQUIRED AND WILL BE PROVIDED IN GARAGE IS THAT THE FRONT OF THE STRUCTURE. THE PARKING MATERIAL WILL BE PER SECTION 5.1 OF THOSE CRA GUIDELINES OF THE APPLICANT IS GOING TO PROVIDE DETAIL SHOWING HOW THE PAVERS WERE AND DRIVEWAYS OF THE PROPOSED SITE PLAN SHOWS THE DRIVEWAYS HAVE BEEN 16 FEET IN WIDTH WHICH IS WITHIN THE MINIMUM BETWEEN 12 AND 20. STAFF HAS NOTED CONCERNS WITH THE DRIVEWAYS BEING IN FRONT OF THE FRONT LOADED GARAGE ENCOURAGING PARKING ACROSS THE SIDEWALKS AND CREATING AN IMPEDIMENT TO THE WALKABLE CHARACTER OF THIS DESIRE THE CRA AND ALSO THE NUMBER OF CURB CUTS REQUIRED THERE WOULD BE MORE CURB CUTS NOT IN KEEPING WITH THE CHARACTER OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD PREVENTING DEVELOPMENT OF A FUTURES STREETSCAPE THAT INCLUDES ON STREET PARKING. THERE ARE SIDEWALKS BEING PROPOSED ON THE PLAN. A LOCATION FOR TRASH, TRASH DUMPSTER OR ROLLOFF IS NOT SHOWN ON THE PLAN. AND AS FAR AS THE ELEVATIONS IT IS APPROPRIATELY SCALED ACCORDING TO THE CRA GUIDELINES IT HAS APPROPRIATE MASSING IN HIGH AN APPROPRIATE STEP BACK, THE FOUNDATION IS A STEM ALL FOUNDATION THE WINDOWS ARE ANDERSON A SERIES DOUBLE HUNG WOOD WINDOWS, THE DOORS ARE ANDERSON A SERIES DOORS CONTEXT NO CONTEXT DRAWINGS WERE PROVIDED TO SHOW WITHIN THE STREETSCAPE IT HAS BEEN THROUGH THE TECHNICAL REVIEW COMMITTEE AND RECEIVED HIS FIRST ROUND OF NOTES, IT DID RECEIVE CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL PREVIOUSLY BUT THOSE ARE HAS BEEN SIGNIFICANT CHANGES TO THE DESIGN SINCE RECEIVING IT CAME BACK FOR THIS BOARD STAFF IS SEEKING COMMENT FROM THE BOARD AND RECOMMENDS CONTINUATION TO GIVE THE

APPLICANT TIME TO ADDRESS ANY COMMENTS WE HAVE TONIGHT. >> IT QUESTIONS.

>> WE CONCEPTUALLY AGREE WITH THIS. >> I THINK THIS IS A NEW CASE.

>> HERE'S THE PLAN THAT WE GOT. >> THIS WAS FROM MARCH 2019. >> WAS THE CASE NUMBER?

[00:45:04]

>> IT'S A DIFFERENT CASE MEMBERS WHO MAKE THIS IS NEW BUSINESS IT'S GOTTA BE A NEW CASE.

>> I REMEMBER SEEING THE PROPERTY SEVERAL TIMES. >> IS 2019-ZERO NINE.

>> SO, WE CONCEPTUALLY APPROVED IT IN 19 CASE NUMBER NINE WHICH HAD FOR TOWN OPS A CENTER

DRIVEWAY. >> AND WE HAD THE DISCUSSION ABOUT THE SETBACK.

>> THE SETBACKS AND IT HAD NOT BEEN THE TRC. >> SO, EFFECTIVELY SUE BANK THAT'S A QUESTION, WE HAVEN'T REALLY APPROVE THIS BECAUSE THIS IS LIKE A WHOLE NEW.

>> WHICH IS WHY IT'S NOT COMING FOR FINAL TONIGHT AND WE ARE GOING TO CONTINUE IT.

AND GIVE THE BOARD THE OPPORTUNITY TO HAVE COMMENTS ON IT TONIGHT.

>> I ASSUME IT'S -- >> THANK YOU. >> SO, QUESTIONS.

>> IS THERE A SITE PLAN? >> I BELIEVE SO. >> THANK YOU.

>> I DON'T THINK YOU DID DISAGREE. >> I SEE IT, NEVERMIND.

>> IT'S AT THE VARIANCES. >> CAN YOU PUT THAT UP FOR US? I THINK I HAVE SOME QUESTIONS

FOR YOU. I WAS UP THERE TODAY. >> ON OTHER PARTS OF NORTH SECOND STREET THERE MIGHT BE NOT BE KNOW, BUT I KNOW THE PLAN AND OTHER PARTS OF NORTH SECOND STREET AND OTHER PROJECTS THERE WILL BE PARALLEL PARKING AND STUFF LIKE THAT DEVELOPED ON THE SIDE OF THE ROAD. IS THAT THE PLAN ON THIS PART OF NORTH SECOND STREET, THAT JUST

DOESN'T SHOW UP ON THE DRAWINGS. >> THAT IS THE CITIES DESIRE, TO HAVE THAT PART OF THE CRA TO HAVE WALKABLE SIDEWALKS AND ON STREET PARKING WHERE APPROPRIATE.

>> THAT'S FOR YOUR COMMENTS IS, THE INTENT OF THE DESIGN DISTURBS THE CONCEPT OF BEING

ABLE TO HAVE PARKING AND SIDEWALKS. >> CORRECT.

>> BECAUSE OF THE DRIVEWAYS BEING ACCESSED. >> YES.

OTHER QUESTIONS? >> I DO HAVE SOME. >> YOU MENTIONED TYPE C BUFFER,

WHAT IS THAT ON THIS PROJECT? >> YOU CAN SEE IT ON THE LANDSCAPE PLAN COMMITS A 15-FOOT BUFFER, A CERTAIN NUMBER OF TREES IN A CONTINUOUS HEDGE THAT IS REQUIRED BETWEEN THIS

PROPERTY AND THE ZONING PROPERTY BEHIND IT. >> AND BECAUSE THIS IS C-3 ARE THEY IN THE IMPERVIOUS SURFACE LIMITS COME IS THAT SOMETHING THEIR COVERAGE IS ACCEPTABLE?

>> WE TALKED A LITTLE BIT ABOUT PARKING TODAY AND OUR ABILITY TO HELP THIS STREETSCAPE GET REFORMS BECAUSE AT ONE POINT IT WAS A PEDESTRIAN STREET AND COME I JUST REALLY WANT TO COMMEND YOU FOR THINKING ABOUT THAT BECAUSE I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT THAT WE TRY TO REBUILD THIS STREETSCAPE WHERE WE CAN SO PEOPLE CAN GET AROUND OUR COMMUNITY.

I AM ADDICTED TO -- SO I AM UP THERE ONCE OR TWICE A MONTH THEN WE HAVE A SIDEWALK THERE WHICH IS GREAT. IF I MOUNT IN THE STREET IS NOT VERY FRIENDLY.

I APPRECIATE WHAT THEY ARE DOING DOWN THE SECOND STREET SIDE, THE EAST SIDE BECAUSE ULTIMATELY WE WOULD LIKE TO SEE IT ALL CONNECTED. IT ALSO LOOK LIKE THE CITY HAD TAKEN ADVANTAGE OF THE MINIGOLF TO PUT IN FIVE PARKING SPACES RIGHT THERE ON THE SECOND STREET SIDE WHAT WE HAD AN CONCEPTION PREVIOUSLY WOULD ALLOW US TO PUT IN PROBABLY FOR ADDITIONAL PARALLEL PARKING SPACES IN FRONT OF THE LAST DESIGN. WE ARE TAKING THOSE OUT IF THIS

GETS APPROVED. >> YES, IT WOULD BE THE DRIVEWAYS.

>> THEM FOLKS WILL PARK THEIR CARS ACROSS THE SIDEWALK AND WE ARE GOING TO LOSE THAT

STREETSCAPE. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? >> COME UP AND PLEASE STATE YOUR

NAME AND ADDRESS FOR THE RECORD. >> YOU ARE SWORN IN. >> I AM, YES.

>> MIKE MCCLUSKEY, 26 KINGFISHER. I AM A PARTNER OF CMR.

[00:50:01]

AND STUFF LIKE THAT TO MAKE IT EASIER, SOMETIMES ARE EASIER. >> IS THERE ANYTHING DIFFERENT

IN THESE THAT YOU'RE HANDING OUT NOW? >> I THINK HE PUT SOME DETAIL ON THERE AND ALSO GOT INTO THE REASON WE DESIGNED IT LIKE WE DID TO TIE INTO THE NEIGHBORHOOD AND WHAT HIS REASONING WAS. IT HAS SOME INFORMATION ON THAT. HE TALKED ABOUT IT WENT THROUGH TRC AND TRC AND WE TALKED ABOUT THE PARKING IN THE SIDEWALKS IN THIS TYPE THING, SO DAN IS DOING THE DRAINING JUDGE FOR A SUB THAT WE MADE THIS CHANGE IS WHEN WE DID THIS BEFORE WE ARE TRYING TO TURN IN THE BACK AND COME IN THE GARAGE IN THE BACK AND IT MADE IT MORE DIFFICULT.

WITH THIS TYPE DESIGN IT MAKES THE BACK GREAT. IT GIVES US 15 FEET IN THE BACK.

IT GIVES A BIG AREA WHERE THEY CAN DO DRAINAGE AND THEY CAN ALSO HAVE FLOWERS, PLANTS AND DO THIS KIND OF THING. IT GIVES YOU A HUGE BUFFER BETWEEN THE C-3 THAT WE ARE DOING AND WHAT YOU HAVE ON THIRD STREET. IT MAKES IT MUCH MORE APPEALING FROM THAT STANDPOINT. WE SPEND A LOT OF TIME ON THESE. RICHARD IN PARTICULAR AND WE'VE HAD ENGINEERS AND ARCHITECTS LOOK AT THEM AND WE HAVE ALSO HAD A LOT OF REALTORS LOOK AT IT FROM A SALES STANDPOINT WHICH IS IMPORTANT TO US. MOST OF THE COMMENTS HAVE BEEN EXTREMELY POSITIVE WITH THIS. I WILL BE HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS YOU HAVE.

THESE ARE ALL GOING TO BE INDIVIDUALLY OWNED SO IS GOING TO BE FOR HOUSES OR FOR TOWNHOUSES. THEY ARE GOING TO BE FEESIMPLE. THEY SHOULD HAVE A LOT OF PRIDE IN WHAT THEY HAVE. BUT THE CONCEPT OF WHAT THEY HAVE DONE, YOU SETBACK THE THIRD FLOOR IT GIVES US PLENTY OF ROOM ON THE ROOF SECTION ON THE BACKSIDE TO PUT THE MECHANICAL WHICH MAKES IT IDEAL. IF I JUST WALK THROUGH THEM QUICKLY.

>> THE FIRST PAGES IT JUST SHOWS YOU THE OVERALL VIEW WHICH SHOULD BE PRETTY NEAT.

THE TOP FLOOR HAS SOME AIR-CONDITIONED AREA AND STUFF LIKE THAT AND IT HAS SOME OBSERVATION AREA IN THE FRONT. IT'S THAT SETBACK, RICHARD IS USING A COMBINATION OF METAL AWNINGS, TPO ROOFING AND THEN EITHER WOOD OR METAL ABOVE THE GARAGES.

THE GARAGES WILL BE SOMEWHAT CONCEPTUAL WHERE THEY ACTUALLY YOU CAN SEE THROUGH THE BOTTOM OF THEM. THEY SHOULD LOOK GOOD IN THE AREA.

ON THE NEXT PAGE BRUCE WILLIAMS DID THE LAYOUT. AND HE LOOKED AT WHAT HE WAS GOING TO DO. THEY ARE NOT MANY TREES LEFT ON THE LOT.

THE ONLY TREES ARE WRITER ALONG THE GOLF COURSE AREA. >> MINIATURE GOLF COURSE.

>> AND WE WILL GET WITH DAVE ON THOSE SORT SATISFACTORY TO WHAT HE IS LOOKING FOR.

ON THE THIRD PAGE, WE HAVE ABOUT 20 FEET FROM THE STREET COMING UP INTO THE GARAGES.

IF YOU LOOK AT IT WE GO ON FROM 7 FEET UP TO 9 FEET, THERE'S ABOUT A 2-FOOT UPSCALE.

DAN SAID THAT WAS FINE AND IT WOULD WORK OUT FINE AS FAR AS WHERE WE ARE TRYING TO GET HER WHAT WE ARE TRYING TO GET TO. IT SHOULD GIVE YOU A FEELING OF ALMOST THE HOMES BECAUSE YOU HAVE 5 FEET ON EACH SIDE ON BUFFERS AND THEN YOU HAVE A 10-FOOT AREA IN BETWEEN THEM.

THEN YOU CAN SEE THE RETENTION POND THAT HE IS GOD IN THE BACK WHICH IS A GRASS AREA.

WE ARE PUTTING PAVERS IN THE DRIVEWAYS AND THERE WILL BE PERVIOUS PAVERS WILL RAISE THE ACTUAL FIRST FLOOR TO 11 FEET 4 INCHES WHEN WE WERE TALKING TO TRC STEVE SAID THEY WANTED IT TO BE 4 INCHES ABOVE THE MINIMUM. 4 INCHES ABOVE THE GARAGE IS SOMEWHERE AROUND 9 FEET.

SO YOU HAVE IT GOING IN FROM THE GARAGE TO THE MAIN PROPERTY IN THE ENTRANCE IS ON THE SIDE OF

[00:55:04]

PROBABLY DON'T HAVE TOO MUCH A LITTLE STEPS AND LITTLE PORCHES ON THE BACK OF IT STEPPING DOWN TO THE GARDENS. IN THE BUFFER AREA I CAN ANSWER MOST OF THESE QUESTIONS FOR YOU

COME IF I CAN'T, RICHARD SHOULD BE ONLINE AND SO SHOULD SHIP. >> I'M GETTING THE SIGNAL THAT

RICHARD IS AVAILABLE. >> RICHARD, CHIME IN IF YOU HAVE A SOME INFORMATION YOU WOULD

LIKE TO SHARE WITH THEM. >> I HAVE CHIP. >> YOU WILL NEED TO IDENTIFY HIMSELF OR THE RECORD AND HE HAS TO BE SWORN AND NAME AND ADDRESS FOR THE RECORD.

>> WHEN WE TALK TO SALE, HE ASKED US ABOUT SOME METAL, WE HAVE METAL AWNINGS THAT COME ACROSS THERE ABOVE THE GARAGE THAT YOU CAN EASILY EITHER USE WOULD OR METAL ON THOSE.

AND ON THESE BACK PAGES HE IDENTIFIES ALL THE DIFFERENT MATERIAL THAT WE ARE USING THROUGHOUT THE UNITS. THEY'LL BE ABOUT 2500 SQUARE FEET IS WHAT THEY WILL BE.

>> QUESTIONS. >> I LIKE TO HAVE ONE MYSELF THIS A GREAT LOCATION.

>> QUESTIONS. >> WHEN A GUEST ARRIVES AT YOUR HOUSE, ARE THEY GOING TO ENTER DOWN THE SIDE YARD AND THROUGH THE GARAGE? IS THAT THE FRONT DOOR OF THE

RESIDENTS? >> YOU WILL COME DOWN THE ACTUAL GARAGE IS GOING TO BE COMMON IF YOU COME INTO THE GARAGE AND HAVE STEPS THAT COME INTO IT BUT THERE ARE ENTRANCES THAT ACTUALLY GO INTO THE DINING AREA THERE SO THEY WILL NOT COME INTO THE GARAGE WHEN THEY FIRST COME

IN. >> HE HAS TO COME THROUGH BECAUSE THAT'S THE ONLY WAY TO

GET STEPS UP INTO THE HOUSE. >> TO BRING THEM IN. MY ONLY CONCERN IN THAT REGARD IS IN THAT PARTICULAR GUARD IS IT IS REALLY MARKED AS A FRONT ENTRY THAT WOULD HAVE ANY TRADITIONAL -- BECAUSE WE ARE KIND OF LOSING THAT FEATURE THERE IS NO REAL FRONT DOOR ON

THIS THING. >> SOMETIMES IT MIXES IT WITH THE INDUSTRIAL LOOK THAT THE CRA IS GETTING IN THE RESIDENTIAL LOOKS AND A COMBINATION OF THE TWO WHICH IS NOT AN EASY THING

TO DO. >> WHEN YOU WILL MADE THE DECISION TO GO FROM A BACKLOADED GARAGE CONCEPT TO A FRONT LOADED GARAGE CONCEPT, THAT WAS A PRETTY SIGNIFICANT DECISION TO MAKE. SO, I DON'T KNOW, I KINDA WISH THAT YOU HAD COME AND GONE FOR SCRIPTURAL BEFORE YOU WENT FOR ALL YOU DID. IT'S JUST A VERY SIGNIFICANT

CHANGE. >> IS A CHANGE THAT WAS MADE NECESSARY I THINK BY THE ENGINEERS OF THE TRC. THEY CAME UP WITH THIS FROM A DRAINAGE STANDPOINT AND FROM THE STANDPOINT OF TURNING VEHICLES AND GIVING YOU MORE SPACE BETWEEN THE RESIDENTIAL AREA AND THE C-3. THIS GIVES YOU AND PICKS UP AS AN 25 OR 30 FOR THEM.

>> DID YOU DEAL WITH THAT OR HAVE UNDERGROUND FAULTS? FOR DRAINAGE?

>> I DON'T KNOW IF WE GOT THAT FAR WITH THEM AS FAR AS IT GOES. >> THIS ISN'T THE ONLY SOLUTION, SO, OF TRC IS REQUIRING WHEN THE SOLUTION IS HAVING THAT RETENTION OR DETENTION COME AS A RETENTION OR DETENTION IN THE BACK BUT YOU COULD HAVE UNDERGROUND FAULTS AND STORM

CATCH BASINS ON THEN STILL HAVE A REAR LOW GARAGE. >> YOU COULD, BUT THE PROBLEM WAS THE TURNING RADIUS IS GETTING THEM IN AND THIS BECAME A REAL ISSUE TO DO THAT.

THAT'S THE REASON THEY WORK THIS WAY. PLUS I THINK THIS GIVES YOU MORE OF THE CR KIND OF CONCEPT. I THINK THIS LOOKS MORE LIKE A CRA.

[01:00:08]

WE ARE PUTTING THIS DOWN AT THE DOCKS. >> ANYTHING ELSE?

>> I HAVE CONCERN ABOUT THE LOSS OF PARKING IN THE LOSS OF SIDE OF.

I'M CONCERNED ABOUT GARAGE DOOR SPACING OUT ONTO THE STREET. I AM NOT A FAN.

IT LOOKS LIKE A MUFFLER SHOP AT THE STREET LEVEL WITH ALL OF THOSE GARAGE DOORS.

I THINK WE WOULD GET TREMENDOUS PUSHBACK FROM THE COMMUNITY IF WE APPROVE THIS THE FOUR MASSIVE GARAGE DOORS DOWN SECOND STREET. I'M JUST ONE VOTE. AS I SAID, I HAVE WALKED US A LOT. THIS SECTION OF SOUTH SECOND STREET IS NOW CURRENTLY WALKABLE. IF WE DO THIS IT WON'T BE. YOU'LL BE PUSHED IN THE STREET BECAUSE CARS WILL BE PARKED. I WOULD HOPE THAT BASED ON THE DESIGN GUIDELINES THAT HAVE BEEN ADOPTED FOR THE CRA, REINSTALLING THAT STREETSCAPE IS SOMETHING THAT WE HAVE WANTED TO ACHIEVE. UNFORTUNATELY IF WE DO THIS, I THINK WE TAKE THIS STREETSCAPE OUT OF IT WHICH IS WHY I SO SUPPORTIVE OF THE PREVIOUS CONCEPT.

I UNDERSTAND YOU HAVE A LOT OF THINGS ARE TRYING TO BALANCE. I UNDERSTAND THAT, PARKING, NEIGHBORS, STORMWATER, I GET THAT. BUT I AM VERY CONCERNED ABOUT WHAT HAPPENS TO THE STREETSCAPE HERE. I THINK THE LONGER I AM ON THIS BOARD THE MORE I HEAR THE PEOPLE IN OUR COMMUNITY TELLING ME WHY DID YOU DO THAT? WHY DID YOU LET THEM PUT FOUR MASSIVE GARAGE DOORS ON SOUTH SECOND STREET WITH CARS ACROSS AND NOW I CAN'T WALK ON THAT STREET. I WANTED TO GO TO THAT NEW RESTAURANT UP THERE BUT I CAN'T BECAUSE IT'S NOT WALKABLE IF WE DO THIS.

AND I WANT TO SEE MORE SIDEWALKS, MORE SEX ASSESSABLE SIDEWALKS NOT PURE SIDEWALKS.

THAT'S JUST ONE OPINION. >> WE TALKED ABOUT THAT A LOT IN THE TRC AND THEY SAID THAT THEY WOULD ENFORCE THAT BECAUSE WE ARE GOING TO MOVE THE SIDEWALKS TO APPEASE THAT PART OF IT AND THEY SAID THEY COULD NOT ENFORCE THAT AND IT WOULD NOT BE AN ISSUE BECAUSE YOU HAVE 35 PARKING SPACES THAT ARE HALF A BLOCK AWAY OR LESS AND THAT NOBODY USES IN THAT ACROSS THE STREET YOU HAVE ANOTHER 25 THAT ARE SITTING RIGHT ACROSS THE STREET.

SO, THERE IS A LOT OF PARKING SPACES. THE CONCEPT WAS THAT WHEN YOU LOOK AT AND TRYING TO PUT WAREHOUSE AND CRA WHICH IS SOMETHING RELATIVELY NEW BECAUSE NOBODY HAS REALLY DONE IT COME OVER ONE OF THE FIRST PEOPLE COMING IN THERE BESIDES THE MINIATURE GOLF COURSE IN THE APARTMENTS DOWN THE STREET, BUT IT'S A CONCEPT THAT MATCHES UP WITH WHAT MOST PEOPLE DO WHEN THEY ARE TRYING TO BRIDGE THAT BETWEEN RESIDENTIAL AND FULL

COMMERCIAL. >> I HAVE A UNDERSTAND YOU HAVE A LOT TO BALANCE.

THANK YOU. WE WILL GO TO THE PUBLIC HEARING.

IS THERE ANYBODY WHO WISHES TO SPEAK WITH REGARDS IN REGARD WITH 2020-0043.

COME UP WERE RAISE YOUR HAND ON ZOOM. YOU ARE IN THIRD STREET.

I REMEMBER. ARE YOU IN THE HOUSE THAT HARVEY --

>> I AM GO AHEAD. >> WHAT HAPPENED TO MY HOUSE? >> I THOUGHT IT MIGHT BE ON

COTNER. >> I AM BOBBY CARPENTER AT 113 NORTH THIRD.

I JUST HAD SOME QUESTIONS. FIRST OF ALL, THE LANDSCAPING BUFFER, IS THAT GOING TO BE COMPLETELY, IS THE RETENTION POND GOING TO FALL INTO THE LANDSCAPING BUFFER OR THEY SEPARATE? SO THEY WON'T BE A RETENTION POND?

>> WE CAN HAVE HIM RESPOND. >> WE WILL NEED HIM ON THE MICROPHONE.

[01:05:04]

>> GO AHEAD, BOB. >> I WAS KIND OF TRYING TO UNDERSTAND THE LANDSCAPING, I'M SORRY THE RETENTION POND AND THE WAY HERE IS IT'S GOING TO BE I GUESS DIRT SOIL COVERED WITH GRASS AND I JUST WONDERED WHO MAINTAINS THAT? WHO MAINTAINS THE OPERATION AND WHO MAINTAINS THE CUTTING OF THE GRASS. YOU HAVE FOUR DIFFERENT HOMEOWNERS. AND I DON'T IMAGINE EACH ONE WILL HAVE A LAWN MORE AND PUT IT ON THEIR PART OF THE RETENTION POND TO TAKE CARE OF IT, AND I JUST WONDERED HOW THAT'S GOING

TO HAPPEN? >> ALL FOUR WILL HAVE TO INDIVIDUALLY -- THE LEADER HAVE TO DO IT THEMSELVES OR GET A GROUP TOGETHER AND PAY EACH MONTH FOR SOMEONE TO TAKE CARE

OF IT. >> I UNDERSTAND, THAT'S WHAT CONCERNS ME IS THAT EACH ONE OWNING A QUARTER OF THE RETENTION POND. I CANNOT SEE INDIVIDUALS COMING

OUT THERE AND TAKING CARE OF ONE QUARTER OF THE RETENTION. >> IT'S NOT LIKE IT'S GOING TO BE LIKE -- DAN HAS A DRAWING IS NOT GOING TO BE A HUGE DEAL AS TO HANDLE WHAT WE HAVE ON THIS

RUN OF. >> MY CONCERN MAINLY IS NOT SO MUCH NORMAL RAINFALL, BUT TROPICAL STORMS, HURRICANES AND RISING RIVER AND ALL THE WAY TO SECOND STREET INTO THE PROPERTY, HOW DOES THAT WATER GET CARRIED AWAY? HOW DOES IT KEEP FROM COMING ON

MINE? >> IS IT IS ACTUALLY NECKING TO GO TO THE STREET THE WAY THE

ENGINEERS HAVE IT. >> IT LOOKS LIKE THERE IS AN OVERFLOW BASICALLY THAT GOES FROM THE RETENTION POND TO SECOND STREET SO IF THE RETENTION POND REACHES ITS CAPACITY IT OVERFLOWS TO THE STREET IF THAT MAKES SENSE. IS THAT RIGHT?

>> AND WHEN IT SAYS LANDSCAPE RE- BUFFER, CAN YOU ELABORATE A LITTLE BURIED ON THE LANDSCAPING

THAT'S GOING TO BE THERE? >> THEY'LL HAVE THE EXACT PLANS THAT WILL SHOW ALL THE PLANS

THAT ARE USING AND THEY HAVE A COMPLETE BREAKDOWN. >> IS THAT IT? ANYTHING ELSE? THANK YOU, IS THERE ANYBODY ELSE WHO WISHES TO TESTIFY WITH REGARDS TO 116 NORTH SECOND STREET. MS. KELLY, DO YOU HAVE ANYBODY

ONLINE? COMMISSIONERS. >> CAN YOU HEAR ME.

>> HI, MIKE. >> MR. CHAIR, THIS IS -- 21 SUNRISE DRIVE.

SALE, COULD YOU BRING UP GOOGLE EARTH AND THE STREET VIEW AND CHALLENGE WE HAVE IN DESIGNING

THE BUILD ON THIS PROPERTY IN THIS COMMERCIAL AREA. >> GIVE ME ONE SECOND.

>> WE NEED YOU TO SWEAR, MS. HARTMAN. >> I DIDN'T KNOW WHEN EVERYBODY WAS SWORN IN CEMENT DID YOU SWEAR TO YOU SWEAR TO TELL THE TRUTH.

>> I SWEAR TO STAY AWAY FROM MY BROTHER AND HIS WIFE FOR TEN DAYS.

>> WE APPRECIATE YOU TAKING THE PRECAUTION. NOT EVERYBODY IS BEING AS

THOUGHTFUL AS YOU ARE. >> YES. >> YOU GOT A NEW DADDY IN THE

ROOM. AND A BUNCH OF OLD PEOPLE. >> I QUALIFY ON THE OLD PEOPLE.

>> SMACKS AL IS WORKING ON YOUR GOOGLE AND I THINK YOU'LL SEE THAT SOMATIC ON THE SIDE WALL,

THAT'S AGAINST -- I DON'T SEE THAT AS AN ISSUE. >> I AM GOING TO DISAGREE WITH YOU. BECAUSE I WALK A LOT IN DOWNTOWN.

>> YOU BUILD SOMETHING THAT YOU KNOW IS GOING TO BE VIOLATED IN THE NEW COMPLAINT BECAUSE THE CITY DOESN'T ENFORCE THE LAW. AND I THINK THAT IS A FALSE DICHOTOMY, WE ARE SETTING UP

[01:10:01]

EXPECTATIONS THAT WE CANNOT MEAN. >> WELL, CERTAINLY IF YOU WALK AND SEE SOMEBODY PARKED ON THE SIDEWALK IT'S WITHIN YOUR RIGHT TO CALL AND REPORT THEM FOR

PARKING ON THE SIDEWALK. >> I THINK YOU'RE BETTER OFF JUST NOT DESIGNING IT THAT WAY.

>> IS AN ENDANGERMENT FOR SOMEBODY AROUND THE STRUCTURAL SIDEWALK.

>> I'M JUST NOT GOING. >> WE ARE CLOSE. >> IT USED TO BE WHAT WAS THERE.

>> ABOUT A HUNDRED 80 DEGREES. >> IT LOOKS LIKE GOOGLE EARTH STILL HAS A RESIDENTIAL PROPERTY MINIGOLF IS NOT IN PLACE. SO, THAT'S YOUR SITE JUST WITH THE OLD BUILDING ON IT.

CORRECT. >> CELL, CAN YOU DO IT WAS AT 9? THAT'S OUR FRONT DOOR.

THAT BUILDING A CAN EVEN REMEMBER THE NAME, THAT'S PART OF OUR INSPIRATION.

DESCRIBE STORE DID NOT INSPIRE US TO PUT THOSE GARAGE DOORS ON THE FRONT OF OUR PROJECTS.

WE WERE ENCOURAGED TO DO THAT BECAUSE OF CONCERNS OF TURNING RADIUS AND DRIVEWAYS ON THE PREVIOUS PLAN. THERE ARE WAYS TO LESSEN THE IMPACT TO THOSE GARAGE DOORS.

BUT I LIKE TO SUMMON CHARLSTON, SAVANNAH, BOSTON, AND OTHER AREAS HISTORIC FRONT LOADED RESIDENCES AND ONE OF MY FAVORITES WAS SOME REALLY NICE WOOD LOOKING DOORS.

AND WE WILL GATHER YOUR COMMENTS AND TRY TO MEET WHAT YOU WOULD LIKE TO SEE HERE.

>> THANK YOU. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS. MS. KELLY DO HAVE ANYONE ELSE IN THE PUBLIC WHO WISHES TO TESTIFY OTHERWISE I'M GOING TO POKE CLOSE A PUBLIC HEARING AND GO INTO THE BOARD DISCUSSION. BOARD MEMBERS WHAT ARE WE THINKING?

>> I'M WITH JIM WHEN I WENT THROUGH IT I HAVE TWO MAIN COMMENTS BUT I HAVE A THIRD BECAUSE I THINK MR. CARPENTER BROUGHT UP A GOOD POINT, IF THIS WAS TO GO THROUGH AND THERE ARE FOUR HOMES WHO IS MAINTAINING THE COMMON GROUNDS? THERE'S NO HOA, SO ASSUME THAT THE HOMEOWNERS MIGHT TAKE GET TOGETHER AND CHIP IN A FEW BLOCKS, THAT'S A LOT OF MAINTENANCE AND GRASS TO CUT, WHAT WILL BECOME OF THIS? SO I REALLY HAVE TO THINK ABOUT THIS AS BUILDING AND PLANNING FOR THE FUTURE AND THAT COMES INTO MY FIRST CONCERN WHICH IS THE CROSSING OF THE SIDEWALK. AND IF WE ARE SAYING THAT THESE ARE SMALL ENOUGH AND IS PROBABLY JUST ONE CAR THAT MIGHT BE IN THERE YOU'RE NOT BUILDING FOR THE FUTURE BECAUSE THAT'S NOT SMART BUILDING WHEN PEOPLE ARE GOING TO HAVE MORE. WHEN I PEOPLE HAVE THREE CARS IN

MY DRIVEWAY. >> A VERY LONG DRIVEWAY. >> EXACTLY.

AND SO, THAT'S A BIG CONCERN BECAUSE WE ARE COMPLETELY BREAKING UP ANY WALK ABILITY THAT IS THERE AND THEN THE LAST ONE IS COME I DON'T UNDERSTAND HOW LOOKING AT IF WE GO BACK TO THE ISOMETRIC COLORED PICTURE ON THE FRONT COVER PAGE, I HAVE TRIED EVERY WHICH WAY TO FIND INDUSTRIAL WATERFRONT CRA OUT OF THAT BUT I FIND NOTHING BUT MIAMI BEACH AND SOUTH BEACH WITH THE COLORS, THE MATERIALS, THOUGH LIMITED ARTICULATION, WE DON'T EVEN HAVE THE BLACK

EUNICE. >> SO, I LOOK FOR STEEL, LOOK FOR HIGHLY ARTICULATED BRICK, DON'T LOOK FOR ARCHES, LOOK FOR IRON, STEEL, NOT ALUMINUM, NOT POLISHED CLASS.

I CAN'T FIND ANYTHING THAT'S WITHIN RCRA GUIDELINES AS FAR AS MATERIALS GO.

>> I FEEL THAT WHEN WE HAVE APPLICANTS THAT COME IN FRONT OF US THAT WE TYPICALLY TRY TO MAKE IT OUR GOAL TO GET THEM FEEDBACK THAT THEY CAN LEAD WITH AND WE CAN WORK TOGETHER TO FIND A WAY TO SORTA GET TO THE POINT WHEN WHEN WE FEEL GOOD ABOUT IT AND THEY FEEL GOOD ABOUT IT AND EVERYBODY MAKES IT WORK BUT ON HONEST I'M STRUGGLING. I THINK IT IS SUCH A FUNDAMENTALLY INCORRECT SOLUTION THAT I DON'T SEE A PATH FORWARD FOR THEM TO BE ABLE TO GET TO A POINT WHERE I WOULD FEEL GOOD ABOUT IT AND I'M GUESSING BY THE SORT OF VIBE I AM GETTING FOR THE OTHERS THAT YOU ALL FEEL THE SAME WAY, THE CONCEPT OF THIS FRONT LOADED GARAGE SOLUTION IS

[01:15:01]

THIS JUST IS NOT THE SOLUTION THAT IS GOING TO WORK. THAT'S MY FEELING.

>> I THINK THERE MIGHT BE SOME POTENTIAL WITH THE DESIRE BUT FOR ME HE WOULD NEED TO INCORPORATE POTENTIALLY SHIFTING THE ENTIRE BUILDING BACK FAR ENOUGH SO A CAR COULD PARK IN THE DRIVEWAY AND NOT BLOCK THE SIDEWALK. I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S EVEN POSSIBLE. POTENTIALLY YOU COULD CREATE A ONE CAR GARAGE SITUATION SO THE FRONT ENTRY TO THE HOUSE COULD THEN OCCUR ON THE FRONT OF THE BUILDING.

I DON'T KNOW IF ECONOMICALLY THE FEASIBILITY AS FAR AS MAKING THIS A CHANGE FROM A TWO-CAR GARAGE TO ONE CAR WOULD BE FEASIBLE BUT SOME KIND OF CREATIVE SOLUTION THAT IN MY MIND ALLOWS HER FRONT ENTRY TO ACTUALLY ADDRESS THE STREET AS OPPOSED TO BEING DOWN THE SIDE

YARD. >> WHERE THE GARAGE DOORS SECONDARY, INSTEAD OF BEING

THERE FOR PRIMARY FOCAL POINT. >> EXACTLY. AND POTENTIALLY SOME KIND OF PORCH ELEMENT AT THE GROUND TO REFLECT THE RESIDENTIAL SCALE WITH HOUSES ALONG THERE, THAT THERE MAY BE A SOLUTION, IT'S NOT AN EASY ONE, BUT CERTAINLY AS FAR AS THE WATER RETENTION AND DRAINAGE GETTING TO SOME OF THE THINGS THAT TAMMY TOUCHED ON PERHAPS YOU CAN SLIDE THIS BUILDING BACK IF YOU USE DIFFERENT TECHNIQUES FOR WATER STORAGE UNDERNEATH OR SOMETHING OF THAT NATURE. THEIR SOLUTIONS THERE, THEY'RE JUST NOT EASY ONES.

BUT I AGREE, I DON'T THINK ONE DOUBLE FRONT LOADED GARAGE IS RUNNING THE ENTIRE LENGTH OF THE

PROPERTY IS THE WAY TO GO TO ADDRESS THE PUBLIC. >> THANK YOU, VERY THOUGHTFUL, ALL OF YOU VERY THOUGHTFUL. I WANT TO GO BACK TO SOMETHING HE SAID, AND SEE IF THERE IS CONSENSUS. WE HAVE WORKED OFTEN TO STUFF THAT IS PROBLEMATIC FROM THE BEGINNING TO TRY TO GET TO A RESOLUTION. AND, SOMETIMES I THINK WE THAT MAY BE A DISSERVICE TO THE COMMUNITY AND TO THE RECENT CASES.

AND THIS IS I'M NOT SPEAKING TO THIS CASE SPECIFICALLY BUT JUST TRYING TO UNDERSTAND THE PROCESS AND TRYING TO MAKE SURE THAT WE ALL AGREE ON THE PROCESS BECAUSE WE REPRESENT THE COMMUNITY WHEN WE SIT HERE. WE REPRESENT THE VALUES OF OUR COMMUNITY AS EXPRESSED IN THESE RATHER LENGTHY AND WELL-THOUGHT-OUT -- WE REPRESENT WHAT WE HEAR FROM OUR COMMISSIONERS IN THESE DISCUSSIONS. WHAT IS THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT, WHAT IS A BUILDING DEPARTMENT, WHAT IS THE CITY COMMISSION THINK WE SHOULD BE DOING AS AN ORGANIZATION SO, WHEN WE PASS THESE ON TO BE POLITE WE'VE DONE SUCH GOOD WORK BUT IS NOT CONSISTENT WITH THE BROADER GUIDELINES AND GOALS I THINK SOMETIMES WE SHOULD JUST SHIFT THEM AND PUT THEM OUT OF THEIR MISERY AND SAY GO BACK AND START OVER AGAIN OR DON'T EVEN TRY.

BECAUSE, YOU CAN'T GET, YOU CAN'T FIT THAT SQUARE PEG INTO THAT ROUND HOLE.

IN SO, I THINK AS WE GO FORWARD ON THIS CASE AND ANY OTHERS WHERE THERE IS NOT BROUGHT CONSENSUS LIKE THERE HAS BEEN ON THE OTHER VOTES OR PROJECT COME I THINK IT IS WORTHWHILE TO WHOEVER IS LEADING COME JANUARY TO THINK ABOUT WHETHER OR NOT PERHAPS WE ARE NOT DOING THE COMMUNITY A SERVICE BY CONTINUING I'VE SPOKEN TOO MUCH, BUT THAT'S WHERE I AM.

IS THERE A CONSENSUS FOR CONTINUATION IN THE EXPECTATION THAT THESE THAT WE COULD GET IMPROVEMENTS TO GET WHERE WE WANT TO BE? OR ARE THERE THREE VOTES.

[01:20:05]

>> I'LL BE HONEST I'M STRUGGLING WITH FINDING SOMETHING THAT I THINK IS POSITIVE.

>> LIKE YOU'RE SAYING COME IN YOUR POINT, WHEN YOU'RE SAYING SOMETIMES THERE'S NOT ENOUGH THERE TO BE ABLE TO BE ABLE TO ITS WEEKS ON IT TO GET TO WHERE YOU WANT TO GO, I BRING UP THE ISSUE WITH THE GARAGE DOORS AND THE ENTRIES AND STUFF LIKE THAT WHICH I THINK EVERYBODY HAS CONSENSUS ON IT BUT TAMMY BROUGHT THIS UP, I'D BE INTERESTED TO SEE IF JIM AND YOU AGREE WITH THIS BUT I THINK THERE ARE SOME ISSUES WITH THE OVERALL STYLE OF THE ARCHITECTURE THAT PROBABLY IS NOT WHERE WE WANTED TO BE. AND SO I HAVE HEARD THE APPLICANTS COMMENTS ABOUT WORKING WITH THE ARCHITECTURE WITH A CRA IN THE INDUSTRIAL VIBE IT BUT I THINK THEY NEED TO GO BACK AND THEY NEED TO READ A LITTLE BIT MORE CLEARLY THE GUIDELINES FOR THE CRA AND LOOK AT SOME EXAMPLES OF SUCCESSFUL PROJECTS THAT ARE BEING DEVELOPED OR HAVE BEEN DEVELOPED TO GET A BETTER FEEL FOR WHAT THE A STATIC IS THAT WERE GOING

FOR BECAUSE I DON'T THINK IT'S THERE YET. >> I AGREE.

>> IF THEY CAME BACK WITH THIS SAME, IF THEY JUST FIX THE GARAGE SITUATION AND THEY FIXED THE ENTRY SITUATION BUT CAME BACK THE SAME GENERAL STATIC COME I DON'T THINK THEY WOULD BE

WHERE WE WOULD WANT THEM TO BE EITHER. >> SO,.

>> IS THERE ANY ADDITIONAL COMMENTS OR WAS SOMEBODY LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION.

>> I'LL MAKE A MOTION. >> I MOVED TO DENY EACH D.C. CASE NUMBER 2020-43 WITHOUT CONDITIONS. I MOVE THAT THEY MAKE THE FOLLOWING FINDINGS PART OF THE RECORD, THAT HDC CASE 2020-43 IS PRESENTED IS NOT SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANT WITH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE AND THE REDEVELOPMENT AREA GUIDELINES TO WARRANT CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL AT

THIS TIME. >> THIS IS NOT CONCEPTUAL PROOF. >> THAT'S WHAT WAS IN ITS MAKE

IT TO WARRANT A CERTIFICATE OF APPROVAL. >> I AM MEANT TO WARRANT

APPROVAL AT THIS TIME. >> IS THERE A SECOND? >> I'LL SECOND.

>> MOVEMENT KOSACK, SECOND MORRISON, ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION?

>> HEARING ON, PLEASE CALL THE ROLE. >> MEMBER MORRISON.

>> KOSACK. >> YES. >> VICE-CHAIR POZZETTA.

>> YES. >> MOVING ON, DO WE WANT TO START THIS CASE IS THAT A

FIVE-MINUTE BREAK? >> UP TO YOU. WHAT YOU WANT TO DO DO YOU WANT

TO START THE NEXT CASE? >> LET'S DO ONE. >> LET'S HEAR IT IN 2020-0046,

[4.6 HDC 2020-0046 - MARK L. + JENNIFER D. BAILEY, 809 SAN FERNANDO STREET ]

LOOKING FOR THAT CASE. >> I'M SURPRISED YOU GOT THAT FAR.

THAT'S AN INTERESTING HOME, TOO, GO AHEAD WITH SAN FERNANDO IT RUNS NORTH-SOUTH IT RUNS

EAST-WEST I'LL PUT IT UP ON THE SCREEN. >> I WISH MR. HARRISON COULD

HAVE JOINED US TONIGHT. >> THIS IS HDC 2020-46, PROPERTY LOCATED AT 809 SAN FERNANDO.

IT'S A VACANT PARCEL. IT IS ZONED OT ONE RESIDENTIAL AND IT'S A CONCEPTUAL CERTIFICATE OF APPROVAL TO CONSTRUCT A 2500 SQUARE-FOOT STUDENTS TWO STORY SINGLE RESIDENCE. YOU CAN SEE FROM THE AERIAL IT IS A LOT 6:00 A.M. TO TWO -- LOT THREE AND FOUR. THE APPLICANT IS SEEKING THE CONCEPTUAL CERTIFICATE OF APPROVAL FOR THIS TWO-STORY RESIDENCE. OF NOTE ON THE PARCEL ALTHOUGH IT IS A VACANT LOT OF BROOKE WELL AND A GROUP BRICK SCRIPTS STRUCTURE ON THIS LOT, IT IS UNKNOWN AS IT IS NOT PART OF THE RESEARCH THAT WAS CONDUCTED IN OLD TOWN BECAUSE THEY EXIST ON

[01:25:03]

YOU CAN SEE STAFF DID HAVE A NOTE IN THE STAFF REPORT ABOUT THE TOTAL HEIGHT.

SINCE THEN WE HAVE GONE BACK AND LOOKED AT THAT AND IT IS THE CHIMNEY AND THE CHIMNEY IS EXEMPT FROM THE HEIGHT, SO THERE IS NO ISSUE WITH THE TOTAL HEIGHT OF THE STRUCTURE AS IT IS UNDER THE 35 FEET. AS ALWAYS, WE TALKED ABOUT ARCHAEOLOGICAL SENSITIVITY.

THERE ARE SOME FEATURES ON THE SITE WHICH MAKES THE SITE UNIQUE IN THE APPLICANT HAS DONE A GOOD JOB AT ADDRESSING THOSE AND PRESERVING THOSE. WITH THAT, STAFF FINDS THAT THE REQUESTED ACTION IS PRESENTED IS SUBSTANTIALLY CONSISTENT WITH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE, THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR STANDARDS IN THE OLD TOWN PRESERVATION GUIDELINES AND IS RECOMMENDING CONCEPTUAL APPROVAL OF HDC-2020-46 WITHOUT COMMISSIONS.

THANK YOU. >> QUESTIONS FOR SAL? >> MY ONLY QUESTION IS, IN THIS

SCENARIO DOES THE CORNER PARCEL REMAINED DEVELOPABLE? >> THAT'S A GREAT QUESTION.

>> IF YOU WANTED TO DO SOMETHING, THEY ARE NOT DEVELOPING LOT FOR BECAUSE THAT IS WHERE THE WELL AND THE BRICK FEATURE WERE. AND ALSO IT HAS TREES AND THEY'RE TRYING TO MAINTAIN THE TREES ON THAT PART OF THE PARCEL.

YOU COULD DO MORE BUILDING THERE. YOU COULDN'T PUT THE GARAGE THERE PER SE THOUGH BECAUSE WE DON'T ALLOW THOSE TO BE ON THE FRONT PARTS OF ANY OF THOSE

CORNER LOTS. >> COULD YOU DEVELOP A SINGLE-FAMILY HOUSE ON THAT LOT

IF YOU WANTED TO? >> NO. IT CANNOT BE SOLD OFF BECAUSE THE ASSESSOR RESTRUCTURE, THE GARAGE IS ON LOT THREE. YOU CANNOT DIVIDE OUT LOT THREE

SEPARATELY FROM LOT FOUR. >> YOU COULD PUT A SECONDARY SMALLER STRUCTURES.

>> A GARDEN SHED. >> A POOL OR SOMETHING. >> MAYBE NOT.

>> I SEE WE HAVE OUR APPLICANTS ON ZOOM. WE CAN REFER ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS TO THEM AS WE GET THERE. OTHER QUESTIONS BEFORE WE MOVE ON? HEARING NONE. MR. AND MRS. BAILEY, WELCOME.

>> THANK YOU. >> I SEE YOU ARE IN CORAL GABLES COME IS THAT RIGHT?

>> YES. YES, CAN YOU HEAR ME? >> YES.

>> 306 CAMILLE AVENUE IN NAPLES, FLORIDA. I'M HERE WITH MY WIFE, JENNIFER.

I THOUGHT I WOULD JUST TAKE A MOMENT AND INTRODUCE OURSELVES VERY BRIEFLY.

I JUST WANTED TO LET YOU KNOW THAT INTERESTINGLY ENOUGH, MY PARENTS MOVED TO FERNANDINA BEACH IN THE 50S AND IN MY DAD WORKED RIGHT DOWN THE STREET. I WAS BORN AND RAISED ON THE ISLAND AND GRADUATED FROM FERNANDINA BEACH HIGH SCHOOL. I GUESS FOR THE LAST 30 YEARS OR SO MY WIFE, AND I ALONG WITH OUR GROWN DAUGHTERS HAVE BEEN VISITING FERN AND DINO REGULARLY -- FERNANDINA AND WE DECIDED TO RETIRE IN FERNANDINA. NOT BECAUSE I WANT TO RELIVE MY CHILDHOOD DAYS, BUT BECAUSE OF THE BEAUTY OF THE ISLAND, THE HISTORIC, THE UNIQUE HISTORIC SIGNIFICANCE OF OLD TOWN, AND THE ELEVATION OF, WE HOPE TO BUILD A HOME THAT HONORS THE HISTORIC PLATTING, THE GUIDELINES AND THAT REFERENCES THE WEST INDIES AND THE CARIBBEAN ST. AUGUSTINE STYLE ARCHITECTURE. I'M GOING TO INTRODUCE JENNIFER, I KNOW SHE WANTS TO TALK A BIT ABOUT WHAT YOU HAVE REFERENCED EARLIER IN REGARD TO THE HISTORICAL QUOTE WE DON'T QUITE KNOW THE HISTORICAL PROVIDENCE OF THE THE -- FIRE PIT BUT THERE ARE SOME OTHER INTERESTING THE CEDAR TREES ON THE ISLAND ON THE CORNER.

BUT I WOULD LIKE FOR TO INTRODUCE JENNIFER, MY WIFE AND LET HER TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT

THE SIDING AND THE PLANNING. >> HELLO. I HOPE YOU CAN HEAR ME.

[01:30:10]

CHARACTER OF THE AREA. >> WONDERFUL. QUESTIONS FOR MR. MRS. BAILEY.

>> I THINK IT IS NICE LOVELY DESIGN HOUSE. >> I DO HAVE ONE QUICK QUESTION.

I AGREE WITH BENJAMIN, THE MAIN HOUSE IS AN EXCELLENT EXAMPLE OF THAT TYPE OF ARCHITECTURE.

THEN I THINK WOULD BE A WELCOME ADDITION IN THE COMMUNITY. I HAVE JUST BEEN LOOKING AT THE GARAGE AND FEEL LIKE MAYBE THE GARAGE COULD USE SOME OF THE DETAILING OVER THAT SENSITIVITY THAT HAS BEEN BROUGHT TO THE HOUSE, JUST ONE OR TWO LITTLE ELEMENTS MAY BE VISITED FROM THE HOUSE TO THE GARAGE MIGHT HELP JOIN THAT GARAGE VISUALLY BETTER WITH THE HOUSE.

>> IT MIGHT BE A LITTLE TOO SIMPLE. >> LET ME TELL YOU ONE REASON WHY SO SIMPLE IS BECAUSE ULTIMATELY WE WANT TO PUT SOLAR ON IT SO A VERY SIMPLE ROOFLINE IS BECAUSE THAT IS WHERE WE WANT TO HIDE THE SOLAR SO THAT IT IS NOT VISIBLE FROM THE STREET.

THAT IS ONE REASON WHY SIT IN IS SO SIMPLE BECAUSE WE WANTED TO MAKE SURE NOTHING IS VISIBLE.

BUT WE CAN TAKE YOUR THOUGHTS AND EXPLORE THAT. >> IS THE -- COULD ADOPT SOME THAT YOU HAVE ON THE FRONT ELEVATION PERHAPS EVEN JUST A SIMPLE DETAIL LIKE THAT MIGHT

HELP MARY THAT GARAGE TO THE HOUSE, DETAIL WISE. >> THE PERIPATETIC OVER THE SIDE PORCH WAS TO HELP MARY THE TWO DIFFERENT ROOFLINES. THE ROOF LINE OVER THE GARAGE AND THERE IS A WALL AROUND IN THE DRAINS AROUND THE SIDE PORCH SO, THOSE WERE DESIGNED IN THOSE WILL ALSO INCLUDE IF FEASIBLE, SOLAR PANELS AS WELL AND THOSE WOULD BE OBVIOUSLY DISGUISED AND NOT VISIBLE BECAUSE OF THE PARAPET WALL. ANYWAY, THAT'S WHAT THE

THOUGHTS. >> IS A YOUR INTENTION TO DO SOLAR SOONER DURING THE

CONSTRUCTION PROCESS OR DOWN THE ROAD? >> IT DEPENDS ON WHAT IT COST.

>> IS GOING TO COST A LOT. >> THAT'S MY TECHNICAL. >> SO FAR NOTHING -- NOTHING

DOESN'T COST A LOT. >> WILL YOU ARE JOINING A NUMBER, I HAVE THREE SETS OF NEIGHBORS WHO HAVE PROPERTY IN CORAL GABLES AND PROPERTY ON FIFTH STREET JUST SO YOU KNOW YOU WILL BE JOINING A LOT OF IMMIGRANTS FROM DADE COUNTY. AND SPECIFICALLY FROM CORAL GABLES. JIM, ARE WE GOING TO NEED TO CAPTURE SOME OF THOSE DETAILS IN

THE RESOLUTION TO APPROVE THIS THING? >> I FEEL COMFORTABLE THAT THEIR

DESIGNERS FULLY CAPABLE. >> THIS IS CONCEPTUAL. >> THIS IS CONCEPTUAL.

NEVER MIND. IF WERE VOTING FINAL THEN I WOULD NEED-MAKES MICK

UNDERSTOOD. >> I'M GOING TO STOP YOU RIGHT THERE.

I THINK THERE IS CONSENSUS FOR APPROVAL OF THIS CONCEPTUAL. AND YOU HAVE HEARD OUR COMMENTS,

[01:35:02]

ARE THERE ANY OTHER COMMENTS? >> JUST TO REINFORCE WHAT JIM SAID AND SO YOU LEAVE THIS KNOWING WHAT MAY BE THE NEXT STEP IS, I WOULD GO BACK TO YOUR DESIGN PROFESSIONAL AND GIVE THEM THE FEEDBACK THAT THE PEOPLE ON THIS BOARD FELT LIKE MAYBE AS FAR AS THE GARAGE IS CONCERNED THERE COULD BE SOME OPPORTUNITIES TO LOOK AT ADDING SOME ARE ARCHITECTURAL FEATURES TO THAT TO TIE IT BACK TO THE ARCHITECTURE OF THE HOUSE AND I THINK THEY WILL UNDERSTAND THAT AND BE ABLE, BOTH IDEAS. THAT'S THE FEEDBACK I WOULD GIVE.

THAT'S REALLY THE ONLY FEEDBACK I WOULD GIVE. OTHER THAN THAT IT'S A VERY WELL

ARTICULATED NICELY DESIGNED HOUSE. >> IT IS SENSITIVE TO THE GRID WHICH IS IMPORTANT TO US WHICH IS THE GRID BE PROTECTED. WITH THAT, I'M GOING TO GO AHEAD AND OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING AND SEE IF THERE IS ANYONE WHO WISHES TO SPEAK WITH REGARDS TO

CASE 2020-0046. 809 SAN FERNANDO STREET. >> ARE WE DOWN FROM A ZOOM

PERSPECTIVE, NOBODY OUT THERE? >> THANK YOU. WE WILL CONTINUE TEST THAT QUESTION JUST TO BE FAIR AND OPEN BECAUSE WE ALWAYS WANT TO GIVE THE PUBLIC THE OPPORTUNITY TO PARTICIPATE. BUT IT'S GOOD TO KNOW WHAT IS IN THE PIPELINE.

WE WILL CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING AND GOING TO BOARD DISCUSSION AND A CONSENSUS FOR A MOTION.

>> I MOVED TO APPROVE HD CASE 2020-0046 WITHOUT CONDITIONS THAT MAKE THE FOLLOWING FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW FOR THE RECORD THAT HE/SHE SEE CASE 2020-46 AS PRESENTED IS SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANT WITH LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE, THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR'S STANDARDS, AND THE OLD TOWN PRESERVATION DEVELOPMENT GUIDELINES TO WARRANT CONCEPTUAL

APPROVAL AT THIS TIME. >> SECOND. >> MOVE MORRISON, SECOND

VICE-CHAIR POZZETTA ANY OTHER? PLEASE CALL THE ROLL. >> MIRRORS MEMBER MORRISON.

>> MEMBER KOSACK. >> YES. >> VICE-CHAIR POZZETTA.

>> YES. >> CHAIR SPINO. >> YES.

>> THANK YOU SO MUCH. >> I HAVE BEEN INSTRUCTED THAT WE ARE TO TAKE A FIVE MINUTE BREAK AT THE HOUR AND A HALF MARK SO, WE ARE GOING TO DO THAT, I'M NOT SURE WHY JUST TO GIVE EVERYBODY

[Items 4.7 & 4.8]

>> THIS IS THE HDC MOSER, KAVANAUGH, LADY STREET. COUNSELOR COME ARE YOU OUT

THERE? >> YES SIR, I AM. >> IT'S OKAY IF WE DISCUSS THESE TWO CASES TOGETHER BUT WE HAVE TO VOTE ON THEM SEPARATELY, RIGHT?

>> YES, THAT SOUNDS FINE. >> DO YOU MIND MAKING A PRESENTATION ON 087049 AT THE SAME TIME? THEN, WE WILL GO FROM THERE. AND IS THERE DIRECTOR IS MOSER

ON THE LINE? WHO IS THERE? >> KELLY.

>> LAUREN -- >> HI, LOREN. >> HI.

>> YOU ARE AN HONORARY CITIZEN HERE, NOW. GO AHEAD.

>> SO, THIS IS HD CVD 2020-ZERO EIGHT. IT IS FOR A PROPERTY LOCATED ON BLOCK 13 LOT SEVEN AND NINE ON LADY STREET IT IS A VACANT LOT THAT IS ZONED OT ONE HI RESIDENTIAL IN THE REQUEST IS FOR A VARIANCE FROM LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE SECTION 7.01.08D. THIS IS THE PARCEL HERE. IT IS ON LIGHT NOUN AND A FULL PAEONIA ON LOT SEVEN. THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING A VARIANCE FROM 701.08D WHICH INCLUDES AN AREA VISIBILITY FORMED BY THE TWO INTERSECTING RIGHTS OF WAY.

THE HORIZONTAL DIMENSIONS OF THE SITE AREA IN THE TRIANGLE FORMED BY THE INTERSECTING RIGHTS-OF-WAY LINES IN A STRAIGHT LINE JOINING THOSE LINES OF 15 FEET FROM THE POINT OF INTERSECTION. THE VERTICAL DIMENSION OF THAT SITE TRIANGLE IS THE SPACE BETWEEN THE HEIGHT OF 18 INCHES AND 10 FEET IN ELEVATION. SO, NOTHING CAN BE IN THAT SPACE

[01:40:01]

SO, NO FENCE, WALL, STRIDE SIGNS, FOLIAGE OR PLANTING SHALL BE THERE.

REDUCTION OF THIS CITYWIDE SAFETY MEASURE HAS BEEN DISCUSSED BEFORE BY THE HDC AS ONE OF THE TOPICS TO FURTHER EXPLORE IN MARCH OF 2019 WE ADDRESS THIS.

AT THE TIME, THE BOARD FELT THAT THERE WASN'T CONSENSUS TO ADOPT ALTERNATIVE STANDARDS TO OLD TOWN BUT CONTINUED TO HEAR VARIANCES ON A CASE-BY-CASE BASIS ON THIS ISSUE.

AS I SAID, THIS PLANNED OF THE LAND ABOUT MY COAT IS NOT SPECIFIC TOLD TOWN.

IT DOES APPLY THROUGHOUT THE CITY. WHEN LOOKING AT VARIANCES WE LOOK AT THE SIX CRITERIA WHICH ARE SPECIAL CONDITIONS. THAT SPECIAL CONDITIONS AND CIRCUMSTANCES EXIST WHICH ARE PECULIAR TO THE LAND, STRUCTURE, OR BUILDING INVOLVED IN WHICH ARE NOT APPLICABLE TO OTHER LAND, STRUCTURES OR BUILDINGS IN THE SAME ZONING CYST DISTRICT.

SPECIAL CIRCUMSTANCES DON'T RESULT FROM ACTIONS OF THE APPLICANT AND NOT BASED ON A DESIRE TO REDUCE DEVELOPMENT COSTS. STAFF ANALYSIS FINDS THAT THIS DOES NOT MEET THE CRITERIA. IN THIS REQUEST DOES NOT CONSTITUTE A SPECIAL CONDITION.

NUMBER TWO, SPECIAL PRIVILEGE, GRANTING THE VARIANCE DOES NOT CONFER UPON THE APPLICANT A SPECIAL PRIVILEGE DENIED BY THE APPLICANT GO TO OTHER LAND STRUCTURES OR BUILDINGS IN THE SAME ZONING DISTRICT. STAFF FINDS THAT SINCE HDC CASES ARE NOT PRECEDENT-SETTING AND ARE EVALUATED ON THEIR OWN MERITS ON A CASE-BY-CASE BASIS DOES NOT MEET CRITERIA.

NUMBER THREE, LITERAL INTERPRETATION. THE LITERAL INTERPRETATION OF THE PROVISIONS OF THE LDC WHICH DEPRIVED THE APPLICANT OF RIGHTS BY OTHERS IN THE ZONING DISTRICT COME AGAIN, STAFF FINDS IN THE ANALYSIS THAT DESIGN CHOICES SEEM TO BE DRIVING THE REQUEST FOR A VARIANCE AND THAT LITERAL INTERPRETATION WOULD NOT DEPRIVE THEM OF THE RIGHTS ENJOYED BY OTHERS IN THE ZONING DISTRICT. NUMBER FOUR, MANY OF VARIANCE. THAT THE VARIANCE REQUESTED IS THE MINIUM VARIANCE NEEDED TO MAKE POSSIBLE THE REASONABLE USE OF THE LAND, STRUCTURE OR BUILDING. STAFF FINDS THAT THE REQUEST IS NOT MEET THAT STANDARD, IT IS NOT THE MINIMUM VARIANCE REQUIRED TO MAKE REASONABLE USE OF THE PROPERTY.

NUMBER FIVE, GENERAL HARMONY. THAT GRANTING THE VARIANCE WILL BE IN GENERAL HARMONY WITH THE GENERAL INTENSIVE PURPOSE OF THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE AND COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.

STAFF DID NOT FIND THAT THE REQUEST WASN'T GENERAL HARMONY WITH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE AND COMPREHENSIVE PLAN. AND NUMBER SIX, PUBLIC INTEREST BY THAT GRANTING GRANTING THE VARIANCE IS COMPATIBLE WITH SURROUNDING PROPERTIES AND WILL NOT CAUSE INJURY TO THE AREA INVOLVED OR OTHERWISE BE DETRIMENTAL TO THE PUBLIC HEALTH, SAFETY, OR WELFARE OF THE ENVIRONMENTS. SINCE THIS IS THE VISIBILITY TRIANGLE IS A PUBLIC SAFETY ISSUE, ENCROACHMENTS INTO THE TRIANGLE DO NOT SERVE THE PUBLIC INTEREST.

THERE IS ALSO THE ADDITIONAL SIX CRITERIA, THE APPLICANT HAS SUBMITTED THOSE.

WITH THAT, SAM FINDS THAT THE REQUESTED ACTION AS PRESENTED DOES NOT MEAN ALL SIX OF THE CRITERIA THAT SUCH STAFF MUST RECOMMENDS AN ISLAND BUT RECOMMENDS DENIAL OF HD CVD

2020-ZERO EIGHT. THANK YOU. >> PLEASE MOVE ON.

>> WE WILL DISCUSS THEM TOGETHER >> THIS IS PORCH COLUMNS THAT'S IN THE WAY.

>> YES, WHAT IT WILL MAKE MORE SENSE WE TALK ABOUT THE DESIGN. SO THIS IS HDC 2020-49.

AGAIN, BLOCK 13 LOT SEVEN AND NINE LADIES STREET. OT ONE IN THIS REQUEST IS FOR THE CONSTRUCTION OF A TWO-STORY SINGLE-FAMILY RESIDENCE STAND A DETACHED GARAGE.

THE MAIN HOUSE CONSISTS OF A FULL INTERIOR PAEONIA AND A ONE MEDIA PAEONIA ON THE CORNER.

THE MAIN FORM OF THE HOUSE IS LOCATED ON LOT NINE WITH A LOW CONNECTION ACROSS A SECONDARY FORM ON THE INTERIOR PAEONIA OF LOT SEVEN. DISCONNECTION WAS DISCUSSED BY THE HDC IN SPRING OF 2020 AND THE APPLICANT WAS DIRECTED TO TREAT THAT SIDE YARD CORRIDOR AS WOULD ADMIT LOT VISIBILITY CORRIDOR. IN LOOKING AT IT, STAFF FINDS THAT THE PROPOSED DESIGN IS CONCEPTUALLY COMPATIBLE WITH THE OLD TOWN FERNANDINA HISTORIC DISTRICT GUIDELINES IN TERMS OF MATERIAL, SCALE, PORTIONS, REFORMS AND SETBACKS.

[01:45:03]

TO BETTER UNDERSTAND THAT. >> THANK YOU. >> DIRECTOR, YOU HAVE HANDLED THIS CASE I RECALL IN THE SPRING, IS THAT RIGHT? I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT WHAT WE'RE DOING HERE IS CONSISTENT WITH THE DISCUSSION WE HAD IN THE SPRING.

THANK YOU. I THINK IT IS BUT I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT SINCE YOU LEAD

THAT EFFORT THAT YOU THINK THIS IS CONSISTENT WITH THAT. >> THANK YOU.

WHAT DO WE TALK ABOUT IN THE SPRING? >> WHAT HAPPEN, THIS IS AN L-SHAPED LOTS MIKE WAS THIS WHEN I CAME AND SAID WHAT WOULD YOU DO IF WE CAME TO PASS THROUGH

VARIANCE BUT NOT ACTUALLY COMING TESTS WERE VARIANCE RIGHT NOW? >> I DON'T REMEMBER THAT BUT IT COULD BE SMART THEY SAID YES IT WAS BUT ULTIMATELY DECIDED THEY WOULD NOT ASK FOR A VARIANCE.

>> WE ENCOURAGE THEM NOT TO. THE IMPORTANT THING THERE WAS BECAUSE OF THE UNUSUAL L-SHAPED LOT WE DID NOT WANT TO LOSE YOUR STREET, WE ACCOMMODATED THAT, WE ACCOMPLISH THAT WITH THIS WHAT WOULD LOOK LIKE IN MID LOT AND WORLDLY -- IT LOOKS LIKE WE GOT THERE AND IT'S GREAT.

WE JUST HAVE THIS ONE ISSUE. >> I'M HAVING TROUBLE PULLING UP THE FILE.

>> I WISH HARRISON WAS HERE. >> HE'S NOT EVEN ON ZOOM, IS HE? >> HE CANNOT PARTICIPATE IN THE MEETING AS A MEMBER OF ZOOM BECAUSE THE GOVERNOR DECIDED WE ALL HAVE TO BE HERE.

HAVE A BUNCH OF OLD PEOPLE DECIDE THEY'RE NOT GOING TO SERVE ON BOARDS ANYMORE.

>> SO, WHAT YOU ARE LOOKING AT RIGHT HERE ON THE SCREEN IS AS WE SAID, IT'S A FULL PAEONIA WHICH IS AN INTERIOR LOT WHERE THE CURSOR IS HERE. A BLOW THAT UP BIGGER FOR YOU AND IN MEDIA PAEONIA BOTH THE FACING LADY STREET. AND, THE DISCUSSION THAT WAS HAD IN THE SPRING WAS IF YOU BUILD THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE ON THE MEDIA PAEONIA LOT NINE CAN YOU EXTEND IT OVER THE SIDE YARD VISIBILITY CORRIDOR AND CONTINUE WITH THAT DIRECTION IN THE DIRECTION THE APPLICANT WAS GIVEN WAS TO GO AHEAD AND BUILD OVER THE SIDE YARD CORRIDOR BUT TREATED AS IF IT IS A MID LOT COURT ORDER WHERE WE FOR A 10-FOOT ACKNOWLEDGMENT OF THAT CORRIDOR AND WE'VE DONE THAT HERE WITH THIS CONNECTOR ELEMENT BETWEEN THE TWO MASSES OF THE STRUCTURE. THE VARIANCE IS YOU CAN SEE THE FRONT PORCH YOU CAN SEE THE CORNER OF THE PORCH CLIPS THAT VISIBILITY TRIANGLE. SO WHAT THEY ARE ASKING FOR IN THE VARIANCE IS THAT THEY HAVE DESIGNED THE PORCH, THE PORCH, THE GROUND FLOOR THE WHOLE BOTTOM LEVEL DOESN'T ENCROACH INTO THE SETBACKS SO THEY HAVE STEPPED THAT BACK AND YOU CAN SEE THAT STAIRS TO THE RIGHT OF THE SCREEN THERE BUT OF COURSE THEY DO STILL NEED THE SUPPORT COLUMN TO HOLD UP THE SUPPORT COLUMN PORCH SO THEY ARE ASKING AS PART OF THAT VARIANCE TO ALLOW THAT SECONDS COLUMN THAT HOLDS THE SECOND STORY PORCH UP TO ENCROACH INTO THAT VISIBILITY CORRIDOR IN ORDER TO HAVE THE FRONT PORCH BE SYMMETRICAL. OTHERWISE I THINK THE OTHER SOLUTION WOULD BE THEY END UP LOSING ONE BAY OF THE PORCH WHICH WOULD THROW THE PORCH OUT

OF SYMMETRY. >> SO WHAT I AM LOOKING AT ON MY COMPUTER ACTUALLY SHOWS THE ON

BALANCED FOR BAY VERSUS FIVE BAY PORCH. >> SO, AS PART OF THE VARIANCE APPLICATION THEY HAVE INCLUDED THE DESIGN SHOWING THE COLUMN. THIS IS THE PREFERRED WHAT THEY WOULD LIKE TO DESIGN AND BUILD. IN THE ACTUAL APPLICATION YOU'LL SEE THE ALTERNATIVE PERSON IF WE DON'T GRANTED VARIANCE IT WOULD BE FOR THAT FOUR BAY FORTUNE INSTEAD OF A FIVE BAY PORCH.

[01:50:05]

>> QUESTIONS OTHERWISE WILL MOVE ON. ANYTHING YOU WOULD LIKE TO ADD

AT THIS TIME, LAUREN? YOU NEED TO UNMUTE. >> THANK YOU.

FROM OUR STANDPOINT, AND IN REPRESENTING THE FUTURE HOMEOWNERS EMILY REED AND HER HUSBAND, WE LOOKED THROUGH A NUMBER OF DESIGN OPTIONS AND PART OF THE UNIQUENESS OF THIS LOT IS THAT IT IS ONE OF ONLY TWO OR THREE CONDITIONS IN OLD TOWN SQUARE THERE WAS ONLY ONE OF THE PAEONIA IS BACK CONNECT TO THE FULL INTERIOR PAEONIA AND WHAT THAT REQUIRES FROM A DESIGN STANDPOINT AND I TOTALLY UNDERSTAND IN THE STAFF REPORT WHERE A LOT OF THESE DECISIONS ARE DESIGN BASED BUT THE DESIGN IS REALLY DRIVEN BY A LOT CONDITION IN AN EFFORT TO REALLY MEET THAT CORNER WHOLE BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO GO BACK INTO THE OTHER PAEONIA LIKE WE NORMALLY WOULD THAT SUAREZ REALLY GETTING THE FUNCTIONALITY AND PROGRAM OF THE HOUSE. SO, THAT IS WHY SOME OF THE DESIGN DECISIONS WERE MADE IN THE MAIN FORM OF THE HOUSE. AND, WE WANTED TO MAINTAIN A FIVE BAY HOUSE IN HOPES THAT THE PORCH CAN EXTEND ALL FIVE BAYS AS WELL. ALTHOUGH I THINK WE COULD DO A FOUR BAY PORCH IS PRESENTED IN JUST MAKING THE FIFTH DAY -- FIFTH BAY.

I KNOW YOU HAVE TALKED ABOUT THIS BEFORE THAT HAVING CITYWIDE STANDARDS THAT GOVERN IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT CAN BE PROBLEMATIC, AND I WOULD SAY IF YOU WANTED TO LOOK AT THIS TECHNICALLY ONE OF THE OTHER CONDITIONS OF THIS LOT AND THE MAJORITY OF THE LOTS IN OLD TOWN WHICH THE STREETS ARE NARROW AND NATURALLY PROVIDE FOR SLOWER TRAFFIC.

THAT'S A UNIQUE CONDITION WITHOUT THE DISTRICT WHICH YOU MAY MEET THE RATIONALE FOR

HAVING A VISIBILITY TRIANGLE AT THE CORNERS. >> THANK YOU.

QUESTIONS FOR MS. KELLY? THANK YOU, WILL GO AHEAD TO THE PUBLIC HEARING DOES ANYONE WISH TO SPEAK WITH REGARDS TO HD CVD 2020-ZERO EIGHT OR HDC 2020-049. ANYBODY ON THE LINE? WERE GOING TO CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING TO GO TO BOARD DISCUSSION.

WE HAVE SOMEBODY. WONDERFUL. WHO DO WE GOT?

>> ALEX? >> HE ALWAYS HAS TO SHOW UP. >> THANK YOU.

WE WILL SWEAR HIM AND JUST TO BE ON THE SAFE SIDE. I'M REALLY GLAD TO HAVE SOMEONE FROM OLD TOWN ENGAGE SINCE MR. HARRISON IS NOT HERE. I THINK IT'S NICE TO HAVE SOMEBODY GOOD SPEED ON THE GROUND UP THERE. AND HAS VESTED.

ARE YOU THERE? >> I AM, CAN YOU HEAR ME? >> HOW ARE YOU?

>> I'M DOING WELL. >> ARE YOU SWORN? >> I AM NOT.

>> MS. HARTMAN IS GOING TO SWEAR YOU IN. >> THANK YOU.

>> IF YOU RAISE YOUR RIGHT HANDS. YOU SWEAR OR AFFIRM THAT THE ORAL, AND/OR WRITTEN TESTIMONY YOU ARE ABOUT TO GIVE A WILL BE THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH AND

NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH? >> ALEX, STATE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS FOR THE RECORD PLEASE.

>> I DO. MY NAME IS ALEX 908 LADY STREET. THANK YOU.

>> WHAT CAN YOU TELL US? >> SO, I OWN THE LOT WHICH IS DIRECTLY ACROSS THE STREET, ACROSS THE CORNER LOT THAT IS DIRECTLY ACROSS JUST SO AS THE FRAME OF REFERENCE.

I ALSO OWN ANOTHER LOT ON LADY STREET WHICH IS UP IN THE MIDDLE OF THE BLOCK.

AND SO, JUST TO GIVE YOU GUYS A FRAME OF REFERENCE. THIS PROPERTY WOULD BE RIGHT ACROSS THE STREET FROM ME. AND I FEEL PERSONALLY I FEEL LIKE AIR ERIC MOSER AND COMPANY HAVE DONE A WONDERFUL JOB WITH THE DESIGN OF THE HOUSE BUT MOST IMPORTANTLY I THINK, AND SELL, NOT SURE IF I HEARD YOU RIGHT. I THINK YOU MIGHT'VE SAID YOU WERE GOING TO RECOMMEND APPROVAL

OF THE VARIANCE TO ALLOW IT. >> HE CANNOT RECOMMEND APPROVAL BECAUSE THEY DID NOT MEET ANY OF

THE SIX CRITERIA. >> OKAY. AND ISN'T IT ALSO TRUE THAT IN A VISIBILITY CORRIDOR IF THIS TOWN WANTED TO THEY COULD PUT A TELEPHONE POLE IN THE VISIBILITY

[01:55:09]

TRIANGLE. >> I DON'T KNOW. >> IN THE VISIBILITY TRIANGLE IS

ON PRIVATE PROPERTY. SO THEY COULD NOT. >> THEY COULD NOT, THE TOWN

COULD NOT PUT. >> THIS IS PRIVATE PROPERTY. THEY JUST HAVE TO MAINTAIN IT

OPEN BECAUSE IT'S ON A CORNER. >> BUT, IT WOULD NEVERTHELESS BECAUSE IT'S WITHIN THE

RIGHT-OF-WAY WITH. >> IT'S NOT IN THE RIGHT AWAY. >> I'M SORRY, IF THE TOWN WERE TO PUT A TELEPHONE POLE IN THE RIGHT-OF-WAY THAT WOULD EQUALLY ARGUE MUCH MORE GREATLY OBSTRUCT THE CORNER. AND SO, SINCE WE ARE TALKING ABOUT A PORCH COLUMN WHICH DOESN'T EVEN EQUATE TO THE SIZE OF A TELEPHONE POLE AND SENSE IT'S MUCH CLOSER TO THE HOUSE.

I WOULD THINK THAT WHILE THE STRICT INTERPRETATION OF THE VARIANCE CERTAINLY HAS BEEN PROVIDED VERY THOROUGHLY, THE REASON I THINK YOU HAVE THE DISCRETION TO BE ABLE TO APPROVE THAT. I WOULD RECOMMEND THAT FOR ALL THE OTHER REASONS THAT WE WERE SPOKEN ABOUT TONIGHT IN TERMS OF THE DESIGNS TO MAKE THANK YOU, ANYTHING ELSE?

>> THAT'S ALL. >> WE APPRECIATE YOU COMING IN. >> WE TALKED ABOUT THIS, LET ME

CLOSE THE PUBLIC. >> WE TALKED ABOUT THIS IN THE MARCH WORKSHOP ON MARCH 2019 WORKSHOP. NOT LONG THOUGH, I DON'T THINK IT DIDN'T GET THE DISCUSSION THAT SOME OF THE OTHER THINGS WE TALKED ABOUT THAT DAY BUT IN THE END, I THOUGHT ABOUT WE DECIDED WAS THAT WE REALLY WANTED TO HEAR WHAT THE STREETS PEOPLE AND POLICE DEPARTMENT AND OTHERS HAD TO SAY, EMERGENCY SERVICES AND I'M NOT SURE WE EVER DID HEAR FROM THEM FORMALLY.

>> NO. >> I WILL ADD, I THINK THE POINT MS. KELLY BROUGHT UP IS A GOOD POINT AND IT WASN'T PART OF THEIR APPLICATION AS FAR AS THE SPECIAL CONDITION BUT I DO FEEL THAT IS A UNIQUE CONDITION THAT IS SOLELY AN OLD TOWN WHERE THE SPEED LIMIT IS GOING TO BE

SLOWED A LITTLE BED BY THE FACT THAT THERE ARE SHELL ROADS. >> YES.

>> MY FEELING ON IT IS THAT AFTER GOING THROUGH THE CRITERIA THAT YOU WENT THROUGH IN EVERYTHING, WHICH LEGITIMATELY THE ONLY JUSTIFICATION FOR A VARIANCE IS THE AESTHETICS.

AND QUITE FRANKLY, I DON'T KNOW, I THINK THE APPLICANTS ALMOST DID THEMSELVES A DISSERVICE BY SHOWING US A WELL-DESIGNED HOUSE THAT DOESN'T REQUIRED THE VARIANCE BECAUSE IT LOOKS GOOD WITHOUT IT. I HAVE NO REASON, THERE IS NO REASON FOR US TO REALLY HAVE -- I SEE NO REASON TO APPROVE A VARIANCE WHEN THEY HAVE SHOWN US A SOLUTION THAT WORKS WELL

WITHOUT REQUIRING IT. >> YOU WOULD'VE LOOKED AT IT AND SAID JUST TAKE THE BAY OF.

>> WE TALKED ABOUT IT BEFORE WE'VE HEARD THE SAME THING BEFORE SOMATIC IN FACT, WE HAVE

THE SAME CONVERSATION A COUPLE OF YEARS BACK. >> I THINK IT WAS BUILT

KAVANAUGH HIS HOUSE. >> IT'S AT NEWTOWN STREET AND BEATTY STREET? NEW STREET ON LADY STREET. AND WE HAD THE EXACT SAME CONVERSATION.

THEY CAME BACK, THEY MOVE THE PORCH, THEY SOLVE THE PROBLEM AND IF YOU GO BY NOW YOU CAN'T

TELL THAT ANYTHING HAPPENED IN THAT DESIGN PROCESS. >> AND THIS LOOKS GREAT.

IT'S A GREAT DESIGN HOUSE. >> IT LOWER INCOME I THINK YOU SHOULD TAKE YES FOR AN ANSWER ON THE CONCEPTUAL AND KNOW THAT YOU'RE PROBABLY NOT GOING TO GET THE VARIANCE.

>> I CONCUR. I THINK THE HOUSE LOOKS GREAT WITH FOUR BAYS, THERE'S NO NEED

FOR A VARIANCE. >> LET'S JUST MOVE THIS THINGS TO MAKE THE ONLY COMMENT I WOULD HAVE WHEN YOU GO BACK TO THE FINAL IS THAT THERE NEEDS TO BE A NOTE ON HERE ABOUT SCREENING FOR MECHANICAL UNITS BECAUSE THERE'S NOT THAT'S JUST A SMALL THING.

>> THIS IS FUN TO MAKE A CONDITION OF APPROVAL SINCE YOU ARE MOVING.

>> THERE'S BAD NEWS AND GOOD NEWS. I ONLY CHEER FOR ONE MORE MEETING. SOMEBODY ELSE IS GOING TO HAVE TO REMEMBER ALL THESE DETAILS

COME JANUARY OR FEBRUARY. >> DO WE NEED TO MOVE THESE INDEPENDENTLY OF EACH OTHER?

>> YOU DO. WE NEED TO VOTE ON 087049. >> I NEED MOVED TO DENY HD CV 2020-49 WITHOUT CONDITION AND I THAT ACC MAKES THE FINDINGS PART OF THE LAW THAT HDC 2020-49 AS PRESENTED IS NOT COMPLIANT WITH LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE, THE SECRETARY OF THE STANDARDS AND

[02:00:03]

>> SECOND. >> MOVED MORRISON, SECOND KOSACK.

ANY DISCUSSION? HEARING ON. >> THE CASE ITSELF IS ZERO AIDS.

>> MR. MORRISON, YOU'LL HAVE TO ACCEPT AN AMENDMENT TO YOUR MOTION THAT IT IS A HD CV 2020-0008. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. WE WILL CALL THE ROLE.

>> MEMBER MORRISON. >> YES. >> MEMBER KOSACK.

>> YES. >> VICE-CHAIR POZZETTA. >> CHAIR SPINO.

>> YES. >> MOVING ON, HDC 2020-49. >> I MOVED TO APPROVE HDC 2020-49 WITH A CONDITION THAT APPROPRIATE SCREENING, AND THE EXTERIOR MECHANICAL HVAC EQUIPMENT BE APPROPRIATELY DETAILED WHEN SUBMITTED FOR FINAL BUILDING PERMITS AND I MOVE THAT THE HDC MAKE THE FOLLOWING FINDINGS OF FACTS AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW PART OF THE RECORD THAT HDC CASE HDC 2020-49 AS PRESENTED IS SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIANT WITH LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE, THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR'S STANDARDS, AND THE OLD TOWN PRESERVATION

DEVELOPMENT GUIDELINES TO AWARD FINAL APPROVAL AT THIS TIME. >> SECOND.

>> IT IS HDC 2020. THEY THE FIRST TIME YOU SAID HD CV.

>> IT IS HDC 2020-49. >> MOVED TO MORRISON, THE SECOND OF --

>> MEMBER MORRISON. >> YES. >> MEMBER KOSACK.

[4.9 HDC 2020-0050 - MOSER DESIGN GROUP, AGENT FOR KERRIE CAMPBELL, BLOCK 7 LOT 8, SAN FERNANDO STREET ]

>> VICE-CHAIR POZZETTA. >> YES. >> CHAIR SPINO.

>> YES. >> HDC 2020-50 MOORE'S SERVER MOSER CAMPBELL THIS IS TO

STRUCTURES. >> A TWO-STORY ACCESSORY DWELLING AND A ONE-STORY ACCESSORY DWELLING. AGAIN ON LADY STREET IN OLD TOWN.

NO, SAN FERNANDO STREET. I'M SORRY. THIS IS SAN FERNANDO STREET.

IN THIS THERE IS A MAIN HOME AND THEN THERE'S AN ADJACENT LINE. >> CORRECT.

>> LAUREN, DO YOU WORK ON ANYTHING BESIDES OLD TOWN? OR IS THIS ALL YOUR PRACTICE?

>> RIGHT NOW. WE LOVE IT. THAT'S GREAT.

>> THIS IS HDC 2020-50, LOCATED ON BLOCK SEVEN LOT EIGHT SAN FERNANDO STREET IN OLD TOWN.

IT'S A VACANT PARCEL. IT IS ZONED OT ONE. HIGH RESIDENTIAL.

THE REQUESTED ACTION IS A CERTIFICATE OF APPROVAL TO CONSTRUCT A TWO-STORY DWELLING AND A ONE-STORY ACCESSORY STRUCTURE. HERE IS AN AREA OF LOT EIGHT, IT IS THERE ARE TWO ACCESSORY STRUCTURES THAT THEY ARE ACCESSORY TO THE STRUCTURE THAT CURRENTLY EXIST ON LOT TEN AT 907. SO, THE GUESTHOUSE IS A 500 SQUARE-FOOT GUESTHOUSE AND THE OTHER ACCESSORY STRUCTURES OF 160 SQUARE FOOT SHOT SHED TOUR THE CORNER OF THE PROPERTY. AGAIN, THESE ARE ACCESSORY TO THAT PRIMARY STRUCTURE ON LOT TEN. STAFF FINDS THAT THE PROPOSED DESIGN IS COMPATIBLE WITH THE OLD TOWN BERNARDINO DISTRICT IN TERMS OF MATERIAL, SCALE, REFORMS AND ORIENTATION AND SETBACKS. AND STAFF IS RECOMMENDING APPROVAL OF HDC 2020-50 WITH NO

CONDITIONS. THANK YOU. >> WE TALKED A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THE SIDING OF THIS PROPERTY. YOU CAME TO THE CONCLUSION THAT BECAUSE IT WAS A SECONDARY STRUCTURE IT WAS OKAY TO BE FOR THE BACK ON THE LOT AND HE THOUGHT IT WAS APPROPRIATE.

>> CORRECT. IT IS IT APPEARS AS A LARGE STRUCTURE BECAUSE OF THE PORCHES ONLY, BUT IT IS IN KEEPING WITH THE SCALE OF ACCESSORY STRUCTURES IN OLD TOWN AND THE MAXIMUM SIZE REQUIREMENTS AND BECAUSE IT'S NOT ANOTHER PRIMARY STRUCTURE IT IS AN ACCESSORY STRUCTURE IT IS APPROPRIATE TO BE PUSHED A LITTLE BIT FURTHER BACK ON THE LOT THE WAY IT IS

CURRENTLY PROPOSED TO BE CITED. >> WELL, JUST TO CLARIFY THAT, YOU SAID IT IS CONSISTENT WITH THE SCALE OF ACCESSORY STRUCTURES IN OLD TOWN BUT I DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT I AGREE WITH IT. IT MIGHT BE CONSISTENT WITH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE REQUIREMENTS AS FAR AS THE CONDITIONS IN SQUARE FOOTAGE BUT I DON'T THINK IS CONSISTENT WITH

THE SQUARE OF. >> IT IS BIGGER TO MAKE IT'S A MASSIVE ACCESSORY STRUCTURE.

>> BUT, WHAT DRIVES THAT IS THE SQUARE FOOTAGE OF THE PORCHES THAT OLD TOWN BEING UNIQUE WE DON'T CALCULATE WE DON'T TAKE INTO ACCOUNT THE SQUARE FOOTAGE OF THE PORCHES BECAUSE WE

[02:05:05]

TO. >> IT'S A LOT OF ROOF. >> IT'S A LOT OF ROOF.

>> I AM JEALOUS. >> CELL, I UNDERSTAND THE CONCEPT OF THE PORCH NOT CONTRIBUTING OR BEING PART OF THE CALCULATION, BUT IN THIS CASE IT IS ROOFED, IT IS TWO STORIES HIGH AND IT IS SCREENED. WHICH OFFERS A LEVEL OF OPACITY THAT REALLY DRIVES THE OVERALL MASSING OF THAT ENTIRE THING TO LOOK CONSIDERABLY BIGGER THAN 500 SQUARE FEET.

500 SQUARE-FOOT PRINCE MAKE IT'S NOT TRYING TO LOOK LIKE AN ACCESSORY.

>> I DON'T DISAGREE WITH THAT BUT WITH THE WAY OUR GUIDELINES VIEW IT, WE ENCOURAGE THOSE SCREENED ENCLOSURE DOOR OPEN ENCLOSURES BUT THAT INDOOR OUTDOOR CONNECTIVITY AND THEREFORE THEY ARE NOT INCLUDED IN THE SQUARE FOOTAGE AND THEY ARE ALLOWED TO BE UNDER ROOF.

BUT, I DO AGREE THAT IT GIVES IT A MUCH LARGER BULK, ESPECIALLY. >> YOU WHEN YOU DECIDE TO WHAT

EXTENT IT'S APPROPRIATE. >> YES. IT IS ON SEPARATE IT'S A

COMPLETELY SEPARATE LOT ADJACENT TO THE EXISTING MAIN HOUSE. >> IS THERE POTENTIAL DOWN THE ROAD SOMEBODY COMING IN AND REQUESTING TO ENCLOSE ANY PORTION OF THE PORCH?

WOULD THAT BE IMMEDIATELY DENIED? >> IT WOULD NOT BE ALLOWED UNDER OUR CURRENT GUIDELINES AND THE LDC BECAUSE I BELIEVE THEY ARE AT THE MAX FOR THE SQUARE

FOOTAGE OF THE ACTUAL ENCLOSED HEATED PART OF THE BUILDING. >> WITH THAT LOT BE SOLD AND

THEN THAT BECOMES THE MAIN? >> IT'S BUILT AS AN ACCESSORY STRUCTURE SO NO.

IT'S AN ACCESSORY TO THEIR PRIMARY ON THE ADJACENT LOTS AND IT WOULD NOT BE ABLE TO SOLD OFF

LATER ON. >> WHAT IS MAKING IT AN ACCESSORY STRUCTURE BESIDES THE

FACT THAT THEY'RE CALLING IT AN ACCESSORY STRUCTURE? >> IT IS DESIGNED IN ITSELF.

YOU KNOW HOW WE TALK ABOUT THE COMBINATION OF PUTTING AN ACCESSORY STRUCTURE ON AN ADJOINING LOT CREATES THE ONE BUILDING SITE. SO, THAT'S WHAT WE TIED TOGETHER IS THAT IT'S NOT ONE BUILDING SITE WHETHER THE STRUCTURE WAS THERE AND GOT DEMOLISHED IT

WOULD NEED A VARIANCE REGARDLESS. >> I GUESS IN MY MIND I'M TRYING TO RATIONALIZE THE SCALE OF IT AND I AM RATIONALIZE THE SCALE OF IT IN MY HEAD IS SAYING THIS COULD BE DEVELOPED AS AN INDEPENDENT LOT WITH A PRIMARY STRUCTURE THAT IS ACTUALLY

LARGER THAN THIS ONE IF THEY WANTED TO. >> IT WOULD NEED TO COME TO THE BOARD FOR A VARIANCE. IT COULD BE LOOKED AT BUT THEN YOU'RE GOING TO TAKE INTO ACCOUNT THE DESIGN, AND ITS IT WOULDN'T BE CITED APPROPRIATELY FOR HER PRIMARY STRUCTURE?

>> WHY WOULD IT HAVE TO GET A VIBRANT. >> YOU'RE TALKING CROSS

PURPOSES. >> BASE SOLD THE LAW LOT OF CAN THEY BUILD OF IT?

>> THEY CANNOT SELL IT OFF SEPARATELY. >> NOW OR FOREVER?

>> IF THEY DID NOT PROPOSE, IF THEY HAD IF THIS LOT STAYED VACANT AND THEY JUST SOLD IT SOMEBODY ELSE COULD DEVELOP THAT IS A SINGLE-FAMILY RESIDENTIAL LOT ARE YOU AND END UP WITH THE

STRUCTURE BIGGER THAN THIS AS A PRIMARY STRUCTURE. >> CORRECT.

>> BUT, IT WOULD BE THE SETBACK WOULD BE DIFFERENT SOMATIC WE WOULD HAVE IT ADDRESS.

>> I THINK PART OF THE PROBLEM THAT WE ARE ALL DANCING AROUND IS WHEN YOU LOOK AT THAT FIRST COVER PAGE, THERE IS SIGNIFICANTLY DIFFERENT, SO MUCH SO THAT IN MY MIND IT DOES LOOK LIKE TWO INDEPENDENT UNITS, TWO INDEPENDENT STRUCTURE YOU HAVE A PITCH ROOF AND A GABLE ROOF, THEIR FRONT FAÇADE THAT JIM SAID THIS SCREENING DOES REALLY PULL THAT FORWARD SOMATIC THEY DON'T GO, NOT THAT ONE IS BETTER AND ONE IS LESSER, BUT THERE IS NO TYING ELEMENTS.

IT LOOKS LIKE THIS ODD HOUSE THAT IS SET BACK ON A LOT. WHY'S THAT HOUSE BACK THERE.

>> THAT SOUNDS LIKE A GOOD QUESTION. IS THAT OKAY IF WE MOVE TO LAUREN. YOU HAVE ANYTHING TO OFFER WITH REGARD TO THE COMMENTS?

>> A COUPLE OF THINGS. IN REGARDS TO THE ELEMENTS. WE ACTUALLY DID USE A SIMILAR -- IN THE MAIN HOUSE HAS THE SHED ROOF AND GABLE ROOF AND THIS HAS THAT SHAPED TRUTH.

THE ROOF AS YOU SEE IT AND PERCEIVE IT AN ELEVATION AND AS YOU GUYS KNOW, WALKING AROUND THE OLD TOWN, WHEN YOU'RE ACTUALLY STANDING ON THE STREET IT'S ALMOST IS SIMILAR TO THE

[02:10:05]

TWO STRUCTURES. SUBMIT QUESTIONS FOR MS. KELLY. >> MY COMMENTS COULD BE BACKED UP AFTER SOME OF TAMMI'S COMMENTS. IT KIND OF RELATES TO THE HIERARCHY AND SCALE OF THE ELEMENTS ON THE ACCESSORY DWELLING.

FOR EXAMPLE, RIGHT NOW THE ROOF FORM COVERS ALL OF THE PORCHES AND HE ENCLOSED HOUSE PORTION OF THE ACCESSORY. BUT WHAT IF THE HOUSE PART OF THE ACCESSORY DWELLING HAD ITS OWN ROOF FORM IN THE PORCH ROOF LIKE ON THE MAIN HOUSE THE PORCH ROOF IS SEPARATE FROM THE HOUSE ROOF. IF THE PORCH ROOF TOOK A SECONDARY ROLE TO THAT 500 SQUARE FOOT PART, I THINK MYSELF CONCEPTUALLY WOULD SEE THE SCALE OF THIS BUILDING WOULD COME DOWN I THINK IF THE ROOF FORM WAS REVISITED AND LOOKED AT SLIGHTLY DIFFERENTLY.

THAT MIGHT HELP ME GET TO A YES ON THIS. >> ONE OTHER THING, I DID NOT READ IT ADDITIONALLY WHEN I LOOKED AT ABOUT ONE THING I PICK UP AS I LOOK AT IT MORE THAT I'M TRYING TO FIGURE OUT THAT SOMETHING DOESN'T FEEL QUITE RIGHT TO ME AND ANOTHER PART IS THAT FOR A HOUSE THAT IS ALL PORCHES, THEY ARE NOT ELEVATED OFF THE GROUND AT ALL.

WHICH I THINK IT DOES NOT HELP THE FACT THAT IT DOESN'T TIE INTO THE OTHER HOUSE BECAUSE IT FEELS INCONSISTENT. HONESTLY, IT'S AGAINST THE GUIDELINES THAT WE APPLY TO ALMOST EVERY OTHER PROJECT IN OLD TOWN. SO, THAT WOULD BE SOMETHING I WOULD HAVE A COMMENT ON. I AGREE, JIM. THERE NEEDS TO BE MORE HIERARCHY AND THE REFORMS. I THINK THAT WOULD HELP BREAK UP THE MASS A BIT MORE SO THAT IT STARTS TO HAVE A LITTLE BIT LESS OF A VISIBLE KIND OF IMPACT THAT IT DOES RIGHT NOW AND TIE IT BACK TO THE ARCHITECTURE HOPEFULLY TO THE MAIN HOUSE WHICH IS WHAT TAMMI'S ORIGINAL COMMENT WAS. THERE DOES SEEM TO BE A DISCONNECT SOMATIC I WAS THINK THAT EVEN THOUGH THIS IS PART OF THE ARM HOMEOWNERS PROGRAM, I THINK THE COLUMNS SHOULD BE MATCHING THE MAIN STRUCTURE. THERE SHOULD BE SOMETHING THAT SAYS THESE WERE BUILT AT THE SAME TIME, THEY BELONG TO EACH OTHER AND I WOULD GO FURTHER AND SAY THAT THE RAILINGS AND ANY BALLASTS OR SHOULD SPEAK TO THE HOUSE AS WELL NOT JUST HAVE COMPLETELY DIFFERENT ELEMENTS

THROWN OUT THERE. >> LET ME INTERRUPT FOR A SECOND.

TO BE HAVE ANYBODY ON THE LINE WHO WILL BE WEIGHED IN ON THE PUBLIC ON THIS, SIR, ARE YOU

[02:15:04]

GOING TO WEIGH IN? >> THANK YOU. BOARD MEMBERS, WERE GOING TO NEED TO GO THROUGH A PROCESS HERE SO IF YOU DON'T MIND WERE GONNA LET MS. KELLY GO, MS. KELLY DO YOU HAVE ANYTHING ELSE AT THIS TIME? SOMATIC JUST A COUPLE OF THINGS TO THINK ABOUT. WE REALLY STUDIED THE GUIDELINES FOR THIS PROJECT AND TRIED TO KEEP WITHIN THEM. AND ONE CHALLENGE IS THAT THE GUIDELINES DON'T REALLY ADDRESS ACCESSORY STRUCTURES THAT ARE ALL RESIDENTIAL VERY WELL. SO, WHEN YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT ESPECIALLY CHANGING UP THE REFORMS WHAT I TRIED DON'T DISAGREE AND I THINK THAT COULD BE A WORKABLE SOLUTION, ELEVATING THE HOUSE OFF OF GRADE WHICH IS EIGHT OR 12 INCHES, YOU'RE FIGHTING YOURSELF AGAINST THE 24-FOOT MAXIMUM HEIGHT. IN ESSENCE, IF YOU REQUIRE IF YOU HAVE A DOUBLE STANDARD AND SAY THEY CAN BE NONCREATIVE THERE IS SOME -- OF ATTACHED TO THEM BUT IF NOT THEY HAVE TO BE ELEVATED THEN YOU ARE PRECLUDING THAT THAT TWO-STORY RESIDENTIAL FORM. JUST TO BE AWARE IS TRYING WHAT WE ARE TRYING TO DO BUT ALSO

LOOKING AT THE GUIDELINES. >> I THINK THAT WHAT YOU'RE SAYING MAKES SENSE, BUT I ALSO THINK THE REASON THAT IT FEELS LIKE YOU'RE FIGHTING IT SO MUCH IS BECAUSE I THINK YOU'RE FIGHTING IT TO SOME EXTENT. I THINK YOU'RE PUSHING IT FURTHER THAN WHAT THE INTENT OF THE GUIDELINES WERE TO BEGIN WITH. SO, I UNDERSTAND THAT YOU MEET THE REQUIREMENTS FOR THE MAXIMUM IN SQUARE FOOTAGE STANDPOINT AND THINGS LIKE THAT.

BUT, IS PUSHING IT REALLY FAR. I THINK MAY BE YOU ALL NEED TO STEP BACK A LITTLE BIT AND

REEVALUATE HOW FAR YOU REALLY WANT TO PUSH IT. >> THANK YOU, MS. KELLY.

WE ARE GOING TO CUT YOU OFF UNLESS YOU HAVE ANYTHING ELSE TO ADD.

AND GO TO THE PUBLIC HEARING. ALEX, ANYBODY ONLINE? WE WILL CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING. MY SENSE IS THAT WE ARE GOING TO CONTINUE THIS.

AND BUT I WOULD LIKE TO SEE US GIVE MS. KELLY SOME PRETTY FIRM GUIDANCE SO THAT WHEN SHE COMES BACK HERE PROBABLY IN JANUARY, IS IT THAT FAR OUT, YEAH THAT THEY WERE COMING IN FOR FUN FOR AN ACCESSORY STRUCTURE. I THINK I HEARD MS. KELLY WAS OKAY WITH A CHANGE IN THE ROOF.

BUT, WHERE WE HAD HEIGHT? >> 2311.5. YOU GO UP AND THEY'RE GOING TO LOSE, SHE MADE A PRETTY GOOD ARGUMENT THAT IF YOU LOOK AT FOR EXAMPLE WHITE STREET, THE FOLKS THAT ARE HAVING TO REDO THEIR ROUTE BECAUSE THEY BUILT IT AT 25 FEET THE NAME IS ESCAPING ME, THAT IS A MASSIVE STRUCTURE. IT IS HUGE AND YET IT'S COMPLETELY CONSISTENT WITH THE GUIDELINES SAUMICO MY TALKING ABOUT? THE FOLKS THAT HAD TO REDO THE ROOFS MAKE THE JOHNSON'S SOMATIC THAT ACCESSORY STRUCTURE IS NOWHERE NEAR THIS.

>> THIS IS 32 FEET LONG. >> THIS IS BECAUSE MOST HOUSES SAUMICO GIVE YOU THAT.

SO,. >> BACK TO YOUR POINT, I DON'T DISAGREE WITH YOU OR HER AS FAR AS THE HEIGHT THAT YOU ARE WORKING AGAINST AND MAY BE AND DOESN'T REQUIRE ELEVATING THE PORCHES TO GET WHERE THEY NEED TO GO, THAT'S UP TO THEM TO FIGURE OUT THE SOLUTION THAT LOOKS GOOD AND WORKS WITH AMASSING AND LOOK WORKS WITH THE ARCHITECTURE OF THE HOUSE, WERE JUST SAYING IT'S NOT THERE YET. AND I DON'T THINK I WOULD TELL HER, I WOULD NOT WANT TO SAY TO THEM, FOR YOU TO COME BACK YOU HAVE TO ELEVATE THAT I DON'T FEEL THAT STRONG.

>> THAT'S WHAT I WANT TO HEAR HIS GUIDANCE. LAUREN DID YOU HEAR THAT? WE ARE NOT TELLING YOU WHAT TO DO OTHER THAN THE REFORMS SHOULD REFLECT THE MAIN IN A BETTER WAY AND TO BRING DOWN THE MASSING THERE'S MASSING ISSUES AND SOME DETAILING THAT I THINK WE WOULD

LIKE TO SEE SO IT TIES THE TWO STRUCTURES TOGETHER. >> FOR EXAMPLE THE GROUND-FLOOR

[02:20:07]

>> OKAY, I THINK WE HAVE GIVEN ENOUGH GUIDANCE DON'T WANT TO BEAT IT TO DEATH.

WOULD SOMEONE MAKE A MOTION TO CONTINUE PLEASE. >> THANK YOU, VERY THOUGHTFUL WE PROBABLY WILL NOT NEED ANOTHER BREAK BUT WE DO HAVE QUITE A BIT OF WORK IN THE BOARD BUSINESS

DEMOS, GUIDELINES DEMOS WE HAVEF WORK IS MY GUESS. >> I WOULD LIKE TO MOVE TO CONTINUE HDC CASE 2020-52 THE JANUARY MEETING OF THE HDC. I DON'T KNOW IF I NEED TO SAY

ANY CONDITION. >> I THINK THAT'S SUFFICIENT. >> THE SECOND.

>> THERE'S A MOVE, NO DISCUSSION, PLEASE CALL THE ROLE SOMATIC MEMBER MEMBER MORRISON.

>> IT MEMBER KOSACK. >> VICE-CHAIR POZZETTA. >> YES.

>> CHAIR SPINO. >> YES. >> YOU CAN ALWAYS CALL FOR TECHNICAL ADVICE, THANK YOU FOR YOUR WORK. WE APPRECIATE IT.

[5.1 Staff Certificate of Approval - October 2020]

ABOUT 20 OF THEM IS THAT CORRECT? >> SOUNDS ABOUT RIGHT.

I WAS A LITTLE BIT CURIOUS DID WE DO ONLY WINDOWS BEHIND US HERE?

>> TWO OF THE UNITS HAVE APPLIED TO HAVE ALL THE DOORS AND WINDOWS REPLACED.

>> WHAT WAS THE REASON? ARE THEY FEELING? >> THEY WANTED TO UPGRADE.

>> ONE IS DOING HURRICANE IMPACT RESISTANT WINDOWS, THE OTHER WANTED A BETTER QUALITY ONE DOSE MY GOODNESS GRACIOUS. THAT IS 23 WINDOWS AND ONE STRUCTURE I WAS THINKING ABOUT THE NUMBERS WHICH WERE ASTOUNDING. OKAY, WAS THERE ANYTHING IN THE STAFF REPORT ANY WANTED TO BRING TO CELLS ATTENTION SOMATIC A LOT OF WORK WAS DONE.

THE PUBLIC COMMENT PERIOD AND FOR A BUSINESS WE FIVE APPLICATIONS FOR TWO POSITIONS

ON THE BOARD. >> I GUESS WE ARE THE PLACE EVERYONE WANTS TO BE.

>> I TOLD YOU WE ARE THE FUN BOARD. >> IT'S A PANDEMIC MIRACLE.

>> THEY'RE GOING TO REGRET THAT. >> MANY ARE JOINING US VIA ZOOM. I THINK A COUPLE OF THEM ARE ON

ZOOM. >> OKAY IS THAT SCHMITZ, MOELLER, EDSON, OR DUNCAN.

>> DUNCAN. >> SO, GENERALLY SPEAKING WE ALWAYS FORWARD WHOEVER APPLIES ONTO CITY COMMISSION WITHOUT COMMENT OR RECOMMENDATION. GENERALLY SPEAKING.

IS THERE ANY REASON TO SEE ANYTHING DIFFERENT TONIGHT? WE HAVE FIVE APPLICATIONS.

>> MY QUESTION IS, IF WE DO THAT, SHOULDN'T WE GIVE THEM SOME KIND OF THOUGHT SO THEY'RE

NOT JUST RANDOMLY PULLING OUT -- >> WE HAVE ONE APPLICANT HEREUNTO ON ZOOM INTO TOP ZOOM

TO TALK TO. >> OU WANT TO DO THAT FIRST AND THEN MAKE A DECISION ON PROCESS.

MR. O'DONNELL HAS BEEN HERE FOR A WHILE. COME ON UP MR. O'DONNELL.

>> YOU DON'T NEED TO BE SWORN IN FOR THIS PART. IT'S JUST INFORMATIONAL.

SO, TELL US WHY YOU WANT TO DO THIS. >> I AM EXCITED FOR THE OPPORTUNITY. MY WIFE AND I MOVED INTO A HOUSE OVER ON SEVENTH STREET AND I WANT TO THANK THE BOARD IN TURNING DOWN THE EXTRA THINGS WE WANTED TO DO TO THE GARAGE, WE WERE ABLE TO DIVERT SCARCE FUNDS INTO THE MAIN HOUSE. SO, I DON'T KNOW IF MY WIFE WOULD DELIVER THAT BUT WITH HER NOT HERE I'LL JUST LEAVE IT AT THAT.

>> YOU ARE BEING TELEVISED ALL JUST HORNY. >> WE MOVED TO THE PLANTATION THREE YEARS AGO BUT FELL IN LOVE WITH DOWNTOWN AND JUMPED AT THE OPPORTUNITY.

I HAVE GOT TO DEGREES IN ENGINEERING, ONE IS CIVIL AND ONE AND GEOLOGICAL.

[02:25:03]

ONE IN NEWTOWN SQUARE WAS THE RELOCATION OF THE CHEMICAL COMPANIES HEADQUARTERS ONTO A 300 ACRES STATE WITH A BIG BOARD FENCE AROUND IT, NEWTOWN SQUARE. IN CONSIDERABLE WORK WITH THE HISTORIC BOARD AND SO FORTH TO GET THAT IN A GOOD PLACE FOR THEM.

AND THEN ANOTHER ONE THAT COMES TO MIND OVER IN LONDON I DID A PROJECT OVER THERE BUILDING THE HEADQUARTERS FOR THE LONDON OFFICE AND THE TOWN OF GUILFORD, VERY HISTORIC TOWN.

ANOTHER VERY INTERESTING PROJECT THAT TURNED OUT FINE. I HAD AN OPPORTUNITY AND CORPORATE REAL ESTATE TO WORK AND ACTUALLY MANAGE THE RONALD REAGAN PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND CONSTRUCTED THAT IN CALIFORNIA. A WONDERFUL OPPORTUNITY TO WORK WITH THE PRESIDENT AND MRS. REAGAN. AS A RESULT OF THAT, THE PRESIDENT ASKED ME, THE FIRST LADY THAT SOME YEARS DOWN THE ROAD THEY WOULD BE BUILDING A -- TRAUMA ONE HOSPITAL IN LOS ANGELES AND THEY SAID WHEN WE CALL, WILL YOU COME AND DO THAT. AND SURE ENOUGH, SOME YEARS LATER THE CALL CAME. SO, A TRANSFER TO UCLA AND BUILT THAT PROJECT FOR THEM.

IT WAS ONE OF THE BEST PROJECTS I'VE EVER ENJOYED BUILDING. AND THEN, PUT IN 14 YEARS AT THE UNIVERSITY OF TEXAS SYSTEM AND COME I HAVE TO TELL YOU THE MOST SCARY THING YOU CAN DO IN THE WORLD IS DEMOLISH HALF OF THE FOOTBALL STADIUM AT THE UNIVERSITY OF TEXAS, IT WILL OPEN ON TIME. SO, WE WERE 24/7 TO GET THAT ON SETTLED.

BUT I HAVE DONE HUNDREDS OF PROJECTS WITH ARCHITECTS AND DESIGNERS AND ENGINEERS.

HOPEFULLY I CAN BRING SOMETHING HELPFUL TO THE TASK. I'M EXCITED ABOUT RETIREMENT, GOLF AND BOATING ARE WONDERFUL THINGS BUT IF I DON'T EXERCISE THE OTHER PART OF MY BRAIN

MADNESS WILL ENSUE. >> THANK YOU. ANY QUESTIONS FOR MR. O'DONNELL.

WE APPRECIATE YOUR PATIENCE MIKE THANKS FOR STICKING AROUND ALL NIGHT.

SUE MEGAN HAD ALL UNANIMOUS VOTES. >> MR. EDSON IS HERE.

[7. BOARD BUSINESS]

>> SURE, CAN YOU HEAR ME OKAY. >> YES. SPENT GOOD EVENING THANK YOU FOR YOUR CONSIDERATION. MY WIFE AND I RELOCATED TO THIS AREA FAIRLY RECENTLY.

WE BOUGHT A HOME ON TARPON WHICH WILL PROBABLY ULTIMATELY TURNED INTO A RENTAL PROPERTY BUT WE LOVE THIS AREA. WHEN IT COMES TO ARCHITECTURE, DESIGN, NAME NOT THAT'S NOT MY BACKGROUND, MY BACKGROUND IS MORE OF THE FINANCIAL SERVICES, AUDIT CONSULTING RISK MANAGEMENT WORLD. I'VE WORKED IN REAL SPACE PROFESSION FOR MY CAREER, I HAVE LIVED IN THE SAVANNAH HILTON HEAD AREA AND ATLANTA. I HAVE SEEN HOW THE CONSERVATION EFFORTS ON THE DESIGN ELEMENTS IN THE PRESERVED HILTON HEAD AND THE SAVANNAH AREA TO SOME EXTENT AND I HAVE SEEN HOW SAVANNAH SOMEWHAT JEOPARDIZED THEIR HISTORIC GOALS REGISTERED STANDING. I CERTAINLY PROBABLY HAVE A DIFFERENT CANDIDATE.

ADDITIONALLY WE MOVED HERE WE SOLD OUR HOME IN SAVANNAH WE SAW VOLUNTEERS AND SAID THIS IS NOTHING VENTURED, NOTHING GAINED. WE CAN GET BY SOMATIC WOMEN HAVE TO SCHOOL YOU ON THE ETHICS LAWS BEFORE WE CAN DO THAT. SOME SUNSHINE LIMITATIONS IS

HOPE WE CAN TALK ABOUT. QUESTIONS FOR MR. EDSON. >> HEARING NONE SOMATIC THANK

YOU, SIR. WE APPRECIATE YOUR INTEREST. >> TERESA, HI.

ON MUTE. >> HELLO. >> HELLO.

>> TREECE IS A NEIGHBOR AND A FRIEND, SHE COMES TO THE TABLE WITH -- WHY DO YOU WANT TO JOIN

[02:30:07]

US FOR? >> WELL, FIRST I HAVE A CAVEAT, NEVER FAILS ON A MINUTE ZOOM MEETING THAT AS SOON AS I UNMUTE THAT'S WHAT MY HOUSE GETS LOUD. THAT ALSO IS A BIG PART OF MY REASON WHY I WANT TO SERVE ON THIS BOARD IS THAT I AM RAISING A FAMILY.

I HAVE LIVED DOWNTOWN, AND HE OWNED A BUSINESS DOWNTOWN. AND SO, I HAVE A STAKE IN OUR HISTORICAL DISTRICT AND SOME OF YOU ON THIS BOARD ALREADY KNOW ME BECAUSE I REALLY BELIEVE THAT GOVERNMENT ONLY WORKS WHEN CITIZENS ARE INVOLVED IN SO, I TRIED TO DO THE BEST THAT I CAN TO BE AN INVOLVED CITIZEN. AND ANYBODY WHO KNOWS ME KNOWS I AM IN LOVE WITH OUR HISTORIC AREAS AND ARE DOWNTOWN AND REALLY PASSIONATE ABOUT THE PRESERVATION OF THOSE IN BEING DOWNTOWN PRIOR TO OWNING A BUSINESS DOWNTOWN I HAD AN OFFICE DOWNTOWN, JUST 13 YEARS OUTSIDE THE DISTRICT AND I SEE HOW IMPORTANT THE REGULATIONS OF THE PEOPLE WHO SERVE ON THE BOARD HAVE BEEN THROUGH THE YEARS AND PRESERVING SOMETHING VERY SPECIAL.

I WANT TO BE A PART OF THAT. I DON'T HAVE A DESIGN BACKGROUND BUT I DEFINITELY HAVE "THE RESIDENT" AND BUSINESS ABILITY TO UNDERSTAND HOW ALL THOSE PIECES HAVE TO WORK TOGETHER SO WE CAN HAVE ECONOMIC VITALITY AND PRESERVING HISTORIC STRUCTURE THAT WE DON'T END UP WITH DISNEY HISTORIC DOWNTOWN WHERE EVERYTHING IS JUST PRETENDING WITH WHAT WE HAVE.

ON PREACHING TO THE CHOIR HERE BUT WE HAVEN'T SPECIALIST DOWNTOWN IN MY OPINION SOME OF THE MOST BEAUTIFUL PLACES IN THE UNITED STATES SOMATIC THANK YOU, QUESTIONS AND COMMENTS?

>> REPORTER: WHAT HAPPENS TO PARKS AND RECREATION? >> PUBLIC RECORD, BUT PARTS AND WRECK IT WAS A CHALLENGE. THERE WERE SOME SYSTEMIC ISSUES THAT DEPARTMENT AND IN THAT WORD THAT NEEDED -- IT MADE IT DIFFICULT TO DO ANY WORK AND HAVE A FAMILY.

I FELT LIKE MY TIME COULD BE BETTER SPENT ELSEWHERE. >> YOU REALIZE SOMETIMES OUR

MEETINGS GO THREE, FOUR, AND FIVE HOURS. >> ABSOLUTELY.

>> THERE IS PREPARATION IN THE AGENDAS IN ADVANCE. TO BE HONEST, IN PERSON MEETINGS

ARE A LITTLE BIT EASIER FOR ME THEN ZOOM MEETINGS. >> THANK YOU.

WE APPRECIATE YOUR APPLICATION. I HOPE TO SEE YOU AND FRANCIS REAL SOON.

>> ABSOLUTELY. >> SHE HAS A DELIGHTFUL DAUGHTER.

WE DON'T SPEND MUCH TIME TOGETHER BECAUSE OF THE PANDEMIC BUT SHE HAS A LOVELY SON, TOO.

SO, WE HAVE HEARD FROM MR. O'DONNELL -- MR. MOELLER IS NOT AVAILABLE ONLINE RIGHT?

>> WE HEARD O'DONNELL, EDSON AND DUNCAN. >> WHAT YOU THINK.

>> I THINK WE HAVE FIVE REALLY WELL-QUALIFIED AND INTERESTING CANDIDATES THAT HAVE IT PRESENTED TWO OF US AND I THINK ULTIMATELY SOMETIMES IT'S NICE TO BE ABLE TO PASS THESE THINGS TO THE CITY COMMISSION AND LET THEM BE THE ONES TO MAKE THE DECISION.

MY ONLY CAVEAT WOULD BE I PERSONALLY FEEL LIKE THAT THREE OF THESE CANDIDATES EITHER LIVE IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT OR OWN BUSINESSES IN THE HISTORIC BUSINESS AND I WOULD GENERALLY ENCOURAGE THE COMMISSION TO TAKE THEIR APPLICATIONS MAY BE A LITTLE AT A LITTLE HIGHER VALUE THAN THE OTHER ONES BECAUSE I FEEL LIKE THEY OFFER A DIFFERENT PERSPECTIVE AND OPPORTUNITY ON

THE BOARD THAT I THINK COULD BE VERY VALUABLE. >> MR. MOELLER HAS RENOVATED HIS

AND HAS DONE AN AMAZING JOB. >> I WAS GOING TO SAY THE SAME THING.

WE HAVE SOME OTHER GOOD QUALIFICATIONS THERE BUT I THINK YOU HAVE TO LIVE IT AND

UNDERSTAND IT AND BE IN IT TO BE IN HER SHOE SOMETIMES. >> JIM, THOUGHTS.

>> STILL WITH BOARD MEMBERS, I'M JUST HAPPY WE HAD PEOPLE JOINING US.

>> REALLY. SO ARE WE RANK ORDERING. >> I THINK MAYBE WE SHOULD THIS INTO THE THREE AND THEN LET THE COMMISSION MAKE A DECISION ON PICKING TWO OF THE THREE, DOES

[02:35:01]

THAT SEEM REASONABLE? >> YOU COULD DO THAT, YOU COULD DO NOTHING AND SPEAK TO COMMISSIONERS INDEPENDENTLY AND LET THEM KNOW YOUR CONCERNS AND THE CRITERIA.

I WAS ADVISED BY MY NUMBER ONE ADVISOR AT HOME THAT I SHOULDN'T WE IN BUT YOU PROBABLY SHOULDN'T

-- IN PART BECAUSE THEY MAY BE HERE SOMEDAY. >> THEY ARE ALL QUALIFIED.

>> THAT'S A GOOD POINT. WE'LL HANG ONTO THEIR APPLICATIONS AND IT IS ALWAYS

GOOD TO HAVE THAT LIST OF PEOPLE WHO ARE INTERESTED. >> I NOTICED MORE THAN ONE INDICATED INTEREST IN OTHER BOARDS AS WELL. HOUSING AUTHORITY, PARKS AND COULD REALLY USE SOME EXTRA MANAGEMENT EXPERTISE. I GUESS MY INCLINATION.

>> LET'S DO THAT, WE WANT TO REACH OUT TO COMMISSIONERS WE CAN REACH OUT.

>> I WOULD ENCOURAGE YOU TO REACH OUT AND WE ESPECIALLY VALUE THE EXPERTISE OF PEOPLE IN THE COMMUNITY COME ON THE STREET, DOWNTOWN EVERY DAY, RENOVATING A HOME, I THINK MR. MOELLER AND MR. DUNCAN HAVE SOME EXTRAORDINARY THINGS WHICH YOU'RE GOING TO NEED.

>> YOU DO WE HAVE A MOTION TO FORWARD ON ALL FIVE NAMES IF THAT IS YOUR WISH?

>> I WOULD LIKE TO MOVE THAT WE FORWARD ALL FIVE APPLICANT NAMES TO THE CITY COMMISSION FOR THEIR

REVIEW. >> IT MOVED SECOND WITH THE KOSACK, ALL IN FAVOR SAY AYE,.

[8.1 EVENT Fernandina's Old Town Spanish Plan: Revisiting Design Guidelines ]

>> AYE. >> ALL OPPOSE. THANK YOU VERY MUCH, MOVING ON.

SAL, WE HAVE AN EVENT DECEMBER 18. >> YOU HAVE ANY EVENTS.

HE HAS COME IS GOING TO BE A MUSEUM SPONSORED EVENTS. AS YOU KNOW WE RECEIVED A GRANT FOR THE OLD TOWN GUIDELINES UPDATE AND ANALYSIS. THIS IS GOING TO BE THE KICKOFF, SO WE ARE PARTNERING WITH THE UNIVERSITY OF FLORIDA AND THE MUSEUM OF HISTORY WILL DO A PRESENTATION THERE BEFORE THE OLD TOWN SPANISH PLAN REVISITING DESIGN GUIDELINES.

WE WILL GO OVER WITH THE PROJECT IS AND WHAT WE HAVE DONE SO FAR. AT THIS POINT THERE WILL HAVE BEEN LASER SCANNING DONE OF OLD TOWN AND SO I BELIEVE WE WILL BE ABLE TO SEE SOME OF THOSE IMAGES PROCESSED AT THAT POINT. THERE IS ALSO I BELIEVE THE LINK WASN'T WORKING BUT I CAN PULL IT UP SEPARATELY FOR YOU. ON THE CITY WEBSITE WE DO HAVE A NEW LANDING PLATE PAGE FOR THE PROJECT WHICH HAS UPDATES. IT IS ALSO GOING TO HAVE THE OLD TOWN SURVEY.

WE ARE GOING TO OPEN UP A SURVEY FOR THE CITIZENS, EVERYBODY BUT MAINLY WE WANT TO HEAR WHAT THE CITIZENS HAVE TO SAY AND SAID, THAT WILL BE OPENING UP PROBABLY RIGHT BEFORE THAT MEETING AND

WILL HAVE IT OPEN FOR A WHILE. GIVE ME JUST ONE SECOND. >> ARE WE GOING TO DO MORE WORKSHOPS AS PART OF THE REDOING OF THE GUIDELINES? ARRIVED WE PROVIDED THEM BUT

WERE GOING TO PROVIDE? >> SO, THERE WILL BE A COUPLE MORE OF THESE TYPE OF THINGS ABOUT THE PACIFIC SPECIFIC PROJECT AND THEY WILL HAVE A PRESENTATION TO THE HDC BEFORE ULTIMATELY A DECISION WILL BE MADE ABOUT THE OLD TOWN GUIDELINES, WHAT IS WORKING,

WHAT IS NOT WORKING. >> WERE STILL IN THE EARLY PHASES OF THIS.

>> YES. THE GOAL AT THE END IS TO HAVE SOMETHING, THERE WILL BE A BROCHURE TYPE DOCUMENT THAT THE DOCUMENT BECOMES WHICH TALKS MORE ABOUT THE HISTORY THEN REGULATIONS THEMSELVES. WE ARE PROBABLY GOING TO LOOK AT GETTING THE REGULATIONS INTO THE

LDC AND HANDLING THAT THAT WAY. >> IS THERE A GOAL FOR THE TIME FRAME THAT IS SUPPOSED TO HAPPEN

WITHIN? >> YES. I CAN BRING UP THE PROJECT

SCHEDULE. >> I'M JUST CURIOUS. >> THE QUESTIONS.

I'M GOING TO TRY TO PULL IT APPEAR. >> DIRECTOR, THOUGHT THAT WENT

PRETTY SMOOTHLY TONIGHT. >> I AM PROUD OF YOU FOR GOING SO QUICKLY.

>> IT ON GETTING THE HANG OF THIS. >> IT'S AMAZING WHAT HAPPENS

WHEN WE AGREE. >> YES. >> I BET 95% OF THE CASES WE

HAVE OUR -- >> I WOULD THINK. >> 19 OUT OF 20 THAT'S PROBABLY

TRUE. >> I THINK IF WE TAKE THE NOTION THAT WE ARE NOT GOING TO KICK TO

[02:40:06]

BEST BEHAVIORS MEGAN WERE ALMOST DOING THEM A DISSERVICE. >> I COMPLETELY AGREE WHICH IS A GREAT SEGUE FOR ME TO SAY BY THE WAY REMEMBER YOU'RE GOING TO GET A NEW CHAIR SOON.

I FINALLY GOT THE HANG OF THIS. I GET THE HANG AND THEN YOU HAVE TO REPLACE ME.

[8.2 Old Town Analysis and Design Guidelines Project Update and Website]

>> SO, THIS IS THE HISTORIC DISTRICT PAGE ON THE CITY WEBSITE FOR THE ACCESS THAT WW.FB FL.U.S..BACKSLASH HISTORIC DISTRICTS. WE'LL BRING YOU TO THIS LANDING PAGE WHICH WE HAVE ALWAYS HAD WHICH HAS LINKS TO HER APPLICATION.

>> I'M GETTING TO THE NEW. YOU WILL SEE APPEAR IN THE SIDE COLUMN OF THE VERY FIRST THING IS OLD TOWN FOR AN EDINA ANALYSIS AND GUIDELINES UPDATE. IF YOU CLICK ON THAT THIS IS THE LAUNCH PAGE FOR THE PROJECT. YOU'LL FIND EVENT UPDATES, THE SURVEY WILL BE THERE, BRIEF PROJECT SUMMARY, AS WE GET MORE IMAGES IN DIFFERENT DOCUMENTS THEY WILL BE UPLOADED TO THIS PAGE SO EVERYBODY CAN SEE WHAT IS GOING ON AND WHAT THE NEXT STEPS ARE.

>> NEXT STEP INCLUDES THE FEBRUARY MEETING IS THE NEXT THING THAT WILL HAPPEN AND, IF I

CAN FIND. >> 6:00 AT THE MUSEUM OF HISTORY I WILL NOT BE ATTENDING.

>> SO, THEY WILL ALSO COME I DON'T REMEMBER WHAT PROGRAM THEY USE BUT THEY'RE THIRD ON THEIR

PROGRAMS ARE LIVE STREAMED. >> SO, I WILL WATCH. >> A GET THAT INFORMATION ON THE WEBSITE SO EVERYBODY CAN LINK TO IT FROM OUR WEBSITES MAKE THAT WILL BE RECORDED.

>> I BELIEVE IT IS RECORDED. >> IT SOUNDS LIKE-MAKES MAKE IT WILL BE THE SAME AS THE REGULAR

THIRD ON THURSDAY READ. >> SUPER. >> LET'S SEE IF I CAN BRING YOU

UP THE PROJECT SCHEDULE. >> WE ARE RUNNING OUT OF PEOPLE HERE.

>> I WOULD DO IT BUT I HAVE TO RECUSE MYSELF SO MUCH IS NOT PRACTICAL FOR ME TO DO IT.

>> I THINK TAMMY IS THE CHOICE. >> YOU HAVE BEEN HERE LONGER THAN ME.

>> SHOULD WE MAKE MIKE DO IT SINCE HE IS NOT HERE. >> WE COULD BOTH ADDED.

>> HE WAS A REALLY GOOD CHAIR. >> HERE'S THE PROJECT SCHEDULE. AS YOU CAN SEE WE HAVE ALREADY STARTED IN SEPTEMBER, OCTOBER AND NOVEMBER WE STARTED THE ACTUAL SURVEY AND AS WE MOVE INTO DECEMBER THEY WILL BE DOING THE ACTUAL MODELING OF THE STREETS.

THEY'RE GOING TO TAKE THE LASER SCANS AND CONVERTED INTO AUTOTEST SO THEY WILL BE USABLE FILES OF THE PROPERTIES. WE ARE ALSO DOING AN ANALYSIS AND A LASER SCANNING OF THE PLAZA WHERE WE HAVE THE EROSION ISSUES THERE SO, THEY WILL LOOK AT MODELING SEA LEVEL RISE AND COASTAL THREATS TO THAT PORTABLE TOWN. THEN MOVING INTO JANUARY AND FEBRUARY THEY ARE LOOKING AT SOME OF OUR VERY SPECIFIC THINGS WE HAVE LOOKED AT LIKE APPROACHES TO DEVELOPING THE MEDIA ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS, CONCEPTUAL DESIGN FOR THE VISITOR CENTER BETWEEN OLD TOWN IN THE CEMETERY. AND COASTAL RESILIENCE ISSUES THEN MOVING INTO MARCH WE ARE GOING TO CIRCULATE AND PRESENT DESIGNS FOR COMMENT AND THEN APRIL, FINALIZE DESIGN STRATEGIES FOR THE COASTAL RESILIENCE AND THEN MOVING INTO THIS SPRING, APRIL, MAY, AND JUNE WILL BE THE EDUCATION PUBLICATION PART WHERE WE GET WORK ON THE ILLUSTRATED HISTORY OF OLD TOWN THEY WILL PRINT THE PAMPHLET AND ALSO BE IF YOU'RE FAMILIAR WITH STORY MAPS THERE WILL BE A STORY MAP THAT WILL HAVE ON THE WEBSITE THE UNIVERSITY WILL HAVE ON THEIRS TO TALK ABOUT THE PROJECT AND REALLY VISUALLY SHOW IT TO YOU

HAVE ANY QUESTIONS ABOUT THAT? >> I HAD ONE QUESTION WHAT BENJAMIN WAS SAYING, IS THERE AT SOME POINT WHERE THERE IS ALMOST LIKE WORKSHOP ORIENTATIONS ARE THERE IS SOME FEEDBACK?

ARE THESE NEW GUIDELINES PUT FORTH? >> IT WILL COME BACK TO THE HDC.

>> WHEN IT'S DONE? >> NO. SOMEWHERE.

>> IT'S OKAY FOR US TO LOOK AT AND COMMENTS ON IF THERE'S ANY ISSUES WE'VE BEEN DEALING WITH.

>> YES. IT WILL BE PROBABLY AROUND THIS STAGE WHEN WE GET TO DESIGN

[02:45:01]

>> THE REASON I THINK IT IS IMPORTANT BECAUSE OF THE SHEER QUANTITY OF WORK THAT IS GOING ON IN OLD TOWN. THE AMOUNT OF CASES THAT WE SEE EVERY SINGLE MONTH.

I THINK WE ALL PROBABLY FEEL LIKE THERE ARE SOME THINGS THAT WE THINK ABOUT NOW THAT WE DID NOT THINK ABOUT SIX OR NINE MONTHS AGO THE LAST TIME WE DID A WORKSHOP BECAUSE THERE IS SO

MUCH GOING ON. >> THAT IS WHAT THIS PROJECT IS TO HELP VISUALIZE AND TO HAVE BE ABLE TO ANALYZE IN A REAL WAY IS TO PHYSICALLY SEE WHAT WORKS, WHAT DOESN'T WORK, ASIDE FROM THE LASER SCANNING I'VE GIVEN THEM THE FILES FOR EVERY CASE THAT WE HAVE APPROVED THAT IS AND BUILD SHIP. THEY ARE GOING TO BE MODELING THAT TO SEE WHAT IS THERE AND

WHAT WILL BE BUILT OUT THAT WE KNOW OF. >> THAT WILL BE NEEDED.

>> IT'S A STEP BACK TO LOOK AT HOW THESE GUIDELINES BEEN WORKING AND ACHIEVING WHAT WE

SAID THE INTENTION IS? >> I CAN THINK OF THREE THINGS THE CROSSING OUTLINES.

>> VERY GOOD. >> THANK YOU, SAL THAT WAS HELPFUL.

I'M GLAD -- IS ON THE JOB. I SUGGESTED WE DO WORKSHOPS NEXT YEAR AT SOME POINT FOR THE

PUBLIC WE SHOULD THINK ABOUT DOING THEM OUTSIDE. >> SAL, WE HAVE A COUPLE OF

[Items 8.3 - 8.5]

DEMOS. ACTUALLY THREE. >> I WILL RUN THROUGH THE FIRST ONE. IT'S JUST A PROPERTY THAT CAME IN FOR DEMO.

I GOT DOCUMENTATION ON AND WAVED THE DEMO. >> WHAT WAS THE VINTAGE ON THAT?

>> THIS ONE. >> 216, 1960. THERE WAS NOTHING SIGNIFICANT ABOUT IT. WE GOT ALL OF THE PHOTOS THAT WE ASK FOR A BIT.

SO, THAT WE DID APPROVE A DEMO PERMIT FOR IT AND THAT HAS BEEN WAIVED.

>> AND THEN YOU HAVE THESE TWO HISTORIC PROPERTIES ON NORTH TENTH.

>> THAT IS MORE OF A DISCUSSION. THOSE ARE TWO PROPERTIES THAT ARE OLDER IN AGE.

WOULD IF THEY WERE IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT THEY WOULD BE CONSIDERED CONTRIBUTING QUITE FRANKLY. WE DID PLACE THE 90 DAY DEMOLITION DELAY ON THOSE.

THEY ARE LOCATED AT 103 AND 107 NORTH TENTH STREET. WE DID RECEIVE THE STANDARD PHOTOS THAT WE ASKED FOR WHICH ARE EIGHT PHOTOS FOR OF EACH ELEVATION OF FOUR FROM THE CORNERS. BUT BECAUSE OF THE AGE OF THESE PROPERTIES I DID WANT TO BRING THEM TO YOU. AND GET YOUR FEEDBACK ON IT. AND IF THERE IS ANY OTHER DOCUMENTATION YOU WOULD LIKE TO DO, IN A LOT OF CASES WE LOOK AT GIVING THEM SOME TIME TO RELOCATE THE STRUCTURES, IN THIS CASE YOU WILL SEE THE DEMOLITION COMPANY HAS SUPPLIED US WITH PHYSICAL PAPER COPY I E-MAILED ONE OUT THIS AFTERNOON THE CONDITIONS REPORT OF THE STRUCTURES THEY ARE ALSO A CODE ENFORCEMENT CASE BECAUSE OF THEIR CONDITION AS THESE BUILDINGS SO, I DON'T KNOW IF MOVING THEM THERE'S NOT REALLY MUCH TO SALVAGE THESE DAYS.

SO, OF COURSE THEY WOULD LIKE THE DEMOLITION DELAY FOR US TO CONSIDER WAVING OUT IT.

BUT BEFORE WE DO THAT IS THERE ANYTHING ELSE YOU WOULD LIKE TO SEE FOR DOCUMENTATION OR WOULD

WE LIKE TO WAIVE IT NOW AND SAY THAT THE PHOTOS ARE ENOUGH? >> DID THE CODE ENFORCEMENT

PROMPTLY REQUEST FOR A DEMO? >> I AM NOT 100% CERTAIN OF THEIR STATUS.

I DON'T THINK THEY HAVE BEEN TO THE CODE ENFORCEMENT BOARD. I THINK CODE ENFORCEMENT HAS BEEN WORKING WITH THEM FOR A NUMBER OF YEARS AND HAS PROMPTED THEM TO DO SOMETHING EITHER FIX THE PROPERTY OR DEMO IT. I DO THINK THAT IS WHERE THE DEMO IS NOW COMING FROM.

>> AND A QUESTION THAT BECAUSE, WE HAVE SAID TO OTHER APPLICANTS WE'VE ALMOST MADE IT A CONDITION IS YOU CANNOT DEMO UNLESS YOU ALREADY HAVE A PERMIT WHERE YOU WANT TO DO SOMETHING ELSE SO WERE NOT STUCK WITH THE VACANT LOT. I REALIZE THERE IS SOME SIGNIFICANT DETERIORATION OF THESE BUILDINGS. I AM NOT COMFORTABLE JUST READING A REPORT THAT SAYS THERE IS INTERIOR DAMAGE, WE BELIEVE BUT WE DIDN'T GO IN.

>> YES. I BELIEVE AND I HAVEN'T BEEN IN ITS I CAN'T SPEAK DIRECTLY TO IT. BUT THE BUILDING IS IN AN UNSAFE CONDITION FOR ANYBODY TO GO INTO AT LEAST ONE OF THE BUILDINGS FROM A CODE ENFORCEMENT SAFETY STANDPOINT.

[02:50:01]

THEM. >> WHAT CAN WE DO? JUST THAT WE WANT MORE

INFORMATION. >> WE CAN CONTINUE TO HAVE A HOLD UNTIL WE GET SPECIFIC

INFORMATION. >> THIS IS A CONUNDRUM. I FEEL LIKE I'M THE ONE WHO ALWAYS HARPS ON THIS, BUT THE BUILDING GOES AND WE ERASE A PART OF OUR HISTORY.

AND IF NON- IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT PER SE BUT THIS IS THIS WAS IN AN AFRICAN-AMERICAN SECTION OF TOWN LIKE MY HOUSE IT WAS A GREAT CONTENDER TO BE DEMOLISHED.

IT WAS FALLING DOWN. IT WAS ALMOST UNSAFE TO BE IN. AND I FELT THE HOMEOWNERS -- EVEN ABOUT THIS ARTICLE AND WILL READ A QUICK THING AND THE EDITOR OF THE PRESERVATION MAGAZINE THIS MONTH SAID AND THIS IS SPOT ON, IN THE UNITED STATES THE GRASSROOTS PRESERVATION MOVEMENT STATE AND LOCAL PRESERVATION ORGANIZATIONS AND THE NATIONAL TRUST GENERALLY HAVE A LONG HISTORY OF PROTECTING AND MAINTAINING PLACES THAT REPRESENT WHITE, MALE, EUROCENTRIC HISTORY OFTEN OVERLOOKED LACES THAT REPRESENT WOMEN AND PEOPLE OF COLOR.

AND, THESE HOMES ARE SUCH AN INTEGRAL PARTS OF OUR HISTORY. THERE WAS A TIME WHEN THERE IS ALMOST A 50/50 BALANCE BETWEEN WHITES AND BLACKS. AND THAT WAS NOT VERY LONG AGO.

AND TO LOSE SOMETHING, I'M NOT SUGGESTING WE HAVE A GRASSROOTS MOVEMENT TO DETRITUS CELL AND SALVAGE THIS PLACE BUT IT NEEDS TO BE DOCUMENTED AND I THINK THE MUSEUM SHOULD BE INVOLVED, THERE SHOULD BE MEASUREMENTS OF IT. IT'S ALMOST LIKE A FRIEDMANS HOUSE.

THIS DOES LOOK AT IT THROUGH THE LENS OF SLAVERY BUT THIS LOOKS AT IT THROUGH THE LENS OF WHAT THESE PEOPLE WERE ABLE TO DO. THIS IS A CELEBRATORY MOMENT AND TO JUST SAY, WAIVE IT KNOCK IT

DOWN. >> I DO AGREE WITH YOU. I WILL REMIND EVERYBODY ON THIS BOARD THAT THIS HAS BEEN ON OUR RADAR. I PUT THIS ON THE HISTORIC RESOURCE ASSESSMENT LIST. IT HAS BEEN THERE BEFORE ME THESE PROPERTIES HAVE BEEN ON THERE WE TALKED ABOUT IT AND WE HAVE LEFT CODE ENFORCEMENT KNOW THAT FOR OUR PERSPECTIVE YES, WE

DON'T HAVE PURVIEW OVER THESE BUT THEY ARE IMPORTANT TO US. >> SO HOW DO WE CHANGE THIS GOING FORWARD? WHAT WE DO? WE ARE JUST ERASING OUR HISTORY

ONE CLAW AT A TIME. >> THERE ARE MORE THAN THESE TWO HOUSES.

AND THAT'S THE COMMUNITY UP THERE. I WILL TELL YOU I DROVE BY TODAY ON THESE ARE PROBABLY TWO OF THE WORST CONDITION HOMES I HAVE EVER SEEN.

I WOULD NOT SEND STAFF AND FOR FEAR THEY MIGHT GET INJURED. >> I WOULD GO IN THEM.

I WOULD VOLUNTEER TO GO IN THEM. YOU PUT A HARD HAT ON AND YOU GO IN AND YOU ARE SMART ABOUT IT.

>> YOU ARE LIGHTER ON YOUR FEET THAN I AM. >> I WOULD SAY THAT THE BOARD CAN DO THAT. THE BOARD KENASTON FOR PERMISSION FROM THE OWNER TO DO SOME DOCUMENTATION FOR THEM AND GET MORE INTERIOR PHOTOGRAPHS AND MEASUREMENTS AND THINGS LIKE

THAT. >> DO YOU HAVE A SURVEY? >> I DO NOT BELIEVE THERE IS A

SURVEY. >> THAT WE BE ONE THING I WOULD THINK WOULD BE A WORTH FOR WORTHWHILE THING TO ASK FOR DOCUMENTATION IF WE DON'T HAVE A LEGITIMATE SURVEY TO GIVE US A HISTORICAL DOCUMENT THAT WE WOULD HAVE THAT WOULD SHOW THAT THIS DIMENSION AND THE LOCATION OF THE HOUSE AND EVERYTHING LIKE THAT. I THINK THAT IS AN IMPORTANT

THING TO HAVE AND THAT IS THE REASONABLE THING TO ASK. >> ALL POINT TO EVEN WHEN YOU CLICK ON THE THINGS FOR 103 THEY ALL FLIP OVER TO 107. SO, UNLESS WE HAVE ANOTHER SET OF PHOTOS FOR 103 SOMEPLACE IN THAT ONE HAS THE BISHOP CHIMNEY ON IT, SOME VERY INTERESTING

ARCHITECTURAL DETAILS ON IT. >> ON A POSITIVE NOTE, THIS IS A REALLY GOOD EXAMPLE OF WHY IT WAS SUCH A GOOD IDEA THAT SAL GOT THE CHANGES MADE A YEAR OR TWO AGO TO GIVE THE AUTHORITY TO DO THIS. UNTIL HE DID THAT WE WOULD NOT EVEN HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY OR HAVE THE DISCUSSION WE ARE HAVING RIGHT NOW. I GIVE A LOT OF CREDIT TO SAL FOR HAVING THE INITIATIVE TO GET THIS STUFF DONE. AND ANYBODY ELSE IN THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT THAT WAS INVOLVED. JUST TO BE ABLE TO SIT HERE AND HAVE THIS CONVERSATION TO BE ABLE TO ASK FOR SOMETHING THAT WE NEVER HAD BEFORE. THIS IS THE EXACT TYPE OF PROPERTY THAT I THINK IS WHY YOU WANT TO BE ABLE TO DO THAT. FROM MY PERSPECTIVE TO ANSWER

[02:55:04]

I DON'T THINK, I DON'T KNOW THAT HAVING FULL DRAWINGS IS REALLY APPROPRIATE THING TO DO.

I UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE SAYING BY CONSIDERING THE SAFETY ISSUES THAT ARE DOCUMENTING NOT ONLY FROM THE APPLICANT BUT FROM THE LICENSE ENGINEER, THAT'S MULTIPLE PEOPLE THAT ARE SAYING

THE SAME THING. >> STILL, THEY ALL DEAL WITH 107.

NO MENTION OF 103. >> I APOLOGIZE, I THINK WHEN WE LINK THE PHOTOS WE DO HAVE THE PHOTOS OF 103 BUT WHEN WE CREATED THE LINK HIT WE ACCIDENTALLY PUT 107 ON BOTH OF

THEM. >> I JUST WANT TO WEIGH IN BECAUSE I FEEL FOR BOTH ARGUMENTS HERE, BUT I THINK THE PHOTOS ARE NICE TO HAVE BUT THEY ARE LIMITED.

THERE IS ONLY SO MUCH INFORMATION THAT CAN BE TRANSMITTED VIA THE PHOTO THAT YOU DON'T GET WHEN YOU ACTUALLY TAKE A TAPE MEASURE IN THEIR AND MEASURE THE PLANS AND ELEVATIONS ELEVATIONS. I COPY AT THAT BECAUSE I HAVE BEEN THE GUY WHO HAS GONE INTO A DANGEROUS HOUSE AND PUT YOUR LIFE AT RISK USING THAT TAPE MEASURE WALKING IN DANGEROUS LOCATIONS. AND I THINK THOSE DAYS FOR ME ARE LONG GONE.

BUT AND I DON'T THINK I WOULD ASK SOMEBODY ELSE TO PUT THEMSELVES IN JEOPARDY LIKE PAT ESPECIALLY IF A PROFESSIONALS OPINION IS THAT IT IS NOT SAFE TO GO INTO.

BUT WHEN IT IS POSSIBLE TO GO AND I THINK WE SHOULD REQUIRE DRAWINGS THAT DOCUMENT THE PLAN IN ELEVATIONS OF THE HOUSE BECAUSE I FEEL LIKE THAT IS AN EXTRA LEVEL OF INFORMATION FOR THE FUTURE THAT TALKS TO THE SIZE AND SCALE AND SPACES THAT PEOPLE LIVED IN DURING THIS TIME

THAT WE DON'T LIVE IN HOUSES THE SIZE ANYMORE. >> I GUESS WE COULD I GUESS JUST FOR THE SAKE OF THE CONVERSATION HERE, WE COULD REQUIRE THEM TO HAVE HOSPITAL -- JOINS AT THE EXTERIOR. THAT'S SOMETHING YOU COULD DO SAFELY I WOULD THINK IF YOU ALL FELT LIKE THAT WAS IMPORTANT TO MAKE JUST REMIND YOU WE CANNOT REQUIRE ANYTHING.

ALL WE CAN DO IS REQUEST WHATEVER DOCUMENTATION WE WANT IN RETURN FOR ONCE WE RECEIVE IT

TO WAIVE THE 90 DAY DELAY. >> EITHER WAY THEY CAN WAIVE 90 DAYS WHICH THEY ARE GOING TO DO.

REALISTICALLY. >> COULD WE REQUEST THAT THEY PEEL OFF ONE OF THE PLYWOOD

WINDOW WAS. ARE WE GOING TO LOOK INSIDE. >> WE CAN MAKE THAT REQUEST.

>> THIS ISN'T A PUNITIVE THING. I THINK THAT SHOULD BE CLEAR. THIS IS A CELEBRATORY THING.

THERE IS SOMETHING A MANTLE DETAIL, SOMETHING IN THERE THAT SHOULD BE PRESERVED FOR THEIR FAMILY HISTORY. THIS IS STILL A FAMILY THAT OWNS THIS PROPERTY.

>> WE CAN ASK OR THEY CAN JUST WAIT IT OUT. >> YES.

WE JUST HAVE THE ONE SET. THIS IS GOING TO BE LEADING INTO THE NEXT DISCUSSION ON THEM WE CAN FINALIZE THAT. IF WE KNEW THE DIMENSIONS, IF WE HAD A HISTORIC RECORD OF DIMENSIONS OF EACH OF THESE ADDITIONS TIED TO THESE PHOTOGRAPHS, THEN YOU COULD LAYER THAT OVER THE SANBORN MAPS AND FIGURE OUT HOW OLD EACH OF THOSE PIECES ARE WHICH WOULD BE USEFUL INFORMATION. SO, I THINK TO THE EXTENT THAT WE COULD ASK FOR SOME DIMENSIONS OF THE EXTERIOR INCLUDING EACH OF THE PARENTS ADDITIONS OF EACH OF THESE STRUCTURES, THIS WOULD SURE APPRECIATE HAVING THAT. AND THEN THAT INFORMATION COULD BE SENT ON FILE TO OUR FRIENDS AT THE MUSEUM. AT LEAST THEY HAVE SOMETHING IN ADDITION TO BORDER GRAPHS THAT

COULD BE PLACED THERE. TIMMY MAKES A GOOD POINT. >> I WILL JUST AROUND.

>> I THINK IS A HARDSHIP ISSUE HERE AND THAT'S WHY WITH THE CODE ENFORCEMENT THE OPTION THAT THEY HAVE CHOSEN IS DEMOLITION. I AM ALSO NOT POSITIVE THE OWNERS LIVE LOCALLY SO IF THEY

[03:00:02]

BE HELPFUL. >> IT WOULD BE NICE IF THIS IS SOMETHING WE ARE GOING TO SEE HAPPEN WHICH I THINK IT IS. I THINK IT WOULD BE NICE AND I THINK IT'S NOT THAT UNREASONABLE THAT SOME OF THESE COMPANIES LIKE DRAKE AND OTHER LOCAL COMPANIES WOULD BE WILLING TO DONATE THEIR SERVICES IN THE INTEREST OF THE COMMUNITY BENEFITS OF HAVING DOCUMENTATION FOR THE HISTORICAL RECORD. I DON'T KNOW IF THERE IS TIME TO DO THAT RIGHT NOW OR NOT BUT I THINK IT IS SOMETHING THAT'S A WORTHWHILE THING TO APPROACH THAT YOU CAN GO TO HOMEOWNERS AND SAY IT'S NOT GOING TO COST YOU ANYTHING BUT GIVE YOU PERMISSION TO DONATE A HALF A DAY OF THEIR WORK TO COME COME IN AND DOCUMENT THIS THING FOR THE CITY OF AND THERE'S NO HARM OR NO-FAULT TO DONORS AND IT DOESN'T COST THEM ANYTHING. A LOT OF THESE COMPANIES ARE

HAPPY TO DO STUFF LIKE THAT. >> I THINK THAT IS A GREAT SOLUTION.

IT DOESN'T PUT ANY HARDSHIP ON THE OWNER. I THINK MOST WOULD AGREE THAT IF

YOU CAN HELP ME WITH THAT. >> I CAN ASK, WHO GETS TO WAIVE THE DELAY?

YOU. >> SO, ON BRINGING IT TO THE BOARD.

WHAT I AM ASKING IS THAT SET WHAT WE WOULD LIKE TO SEE IF WE WANT TO WAIVE THE DELAYING KEEP

THE DELAY. >> WHO WAIVES THE DELAY, THIS BOARD ARE YOU?

>> THIS BOARD. >> IF WE WANTED TO TONIGHT CAN WE DO THAT OR DO WE NEED A

FORMAL ACTION? >> YOU COULD TAKE ACTION TODAY TO WAIVE THE DELAY IF YOU WANT TO WAIVE THE 90 DAY DELAY. I WILL ALSO SAY THAT I BELIEVE THE APPLICANTS IS THAT WAS GOING TO CALL IN. HE MAY BE ON ZOOM TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS OR TO DISCUSS.

>> I WOULD LIKE TO SEE SOME SIMPLE DRAWINGS OF WHAT IS THERE.

I WOULD BE WILLING TO WAIVE THE 90 DAYS IF WE HAD ENOUGH -- TO SEE WHAT WAS THERE AND HAD SOME DIMENSIONS TIED TO THOSE PHOTOGRAPHS WAS SOME SIMPLE LINE DRAWINGS TO SHOW US WHAT IT IS WE ARE TEARING DOWN. AGAIN, SOME GRAD STUDENT OR UNDERGRAD STUDENT COULD TAKE THAT INFORMATION, TELL THE STORY, LOOK BACK AND SAY LOOK, THIS MAN BUILT IT AND IT SHOWS UP IN A MAP IN 1909. THIS IS PRETTY COOL. THERE IS A STORY TO BE TOLD HERE AND I WOULD LIKE TO SEE THAT STORY IF ALL WE COULD GET WITH SOME SIMPLE LINE DRAWINGS OF WHAT IS THERE I WOULD BE WILLING TO WAIVE THE DEMO IF WE COULD GET THAT.

IS THERE CONSENSUS ON THAT? >> I WOULD DONATE MY TIME AND SERVICES FOR EXTERIOR DIMENSIONS ON THE HOUSES IF THAT NEEDS TO GO TO THE APPLICANT. I CAN TALK TO THEM DIRECTLY LIKE

WE DID ON THE SIX REBOUNDS AND HE LET MCGOWEN. >> SO, IF YOU WILL FIGURE OUT A WAY TO GET THAT DONE WITH THE PERMISSION OF THE OWNER THEN WE WOULD BE INCLINED IN DECEMBER TO

VOTE TO WAIVE THE 90 BAIT DAYS. >> IS SO, THE DEMOLITION DELAY IS ACTUALLY UP BEFORE THAT.

YOU WOULD HAVE TO TAKE ACTION TONIGHT, STATE WHAT IT IS YOU WANT TO RECEIVE IN ORDER TO LIFT AT THE DELAY. AND THEN WE WOULD LIFT THE DELAY ONCE RECEIVED WHATEVER THAT WAS.

>> THERE'S LOTS OF LEAD PAINT TO CHEW ON OVER HERE. >> IT'S AN INTERESTING STRUCTURE THE ORIGINALS BASE STRUCTURES ARE FASCINATING IT'S A COMPOUND THEY SUGGESTED WE LOOKED AT CONSERVATION DISTRICT IT'S BASICALLY WHAT YOU WANT TO MAKE IT TO BE.

IT'S NOT LIKE WE HAVE A GRANT FROM THAT WE CAN SAY GOSH, THIS HOUSE IS REALLY SAVING WERE

GOING TO MOVE IT TO A BIGGER LOT. >> THE EXPIRATION COME OF THE 90

EXPIRES JANUARY 2721. >> DO WE WANT TO TAKE ACTION TONIGHT, OR ASK TAMMY AND SAL TO

SEE WHAT THEY CAN DO AND JUST LEAVE IT. >> WOULD YOU LIKE TO SPEAK INTO

THE APPLICANT? >> IS HE HERE? >> YES.

[03:05:04]

FIRST OF ALL OF MY SAYING IT RIGHT? >> I BELIEVE SO.

>> ARE YOU OUT THERE? >> WE DON'T HAVE ANYBODY ON THE LINE.

>> WERE NOT ON THE SAME PAGE HERE. >> KELLY CUT THEM LOOSE.

>> I HADN'T SEEN THAT NAME ON ANY OTHER THAN THAT IT'S NOT ON THE TITLE.

>> THEY ARE NOT THE OWNER OF THE PROPERTY, THEY ARE THE DEMOLITION COMPANY.

>> HE'S THE AGENT. >> I HOPE YOU CAN ACCOMPLISH, PLEASE DO NOT GET HURT.

>> IT IS ONE OWNER FOR BOTH PROPERTIES. >> IT IS AN ARIS PROPERTY.

[8.6 Nassau County Property Appraisers Sanborn Maps Tool]

>> DON'T GET HURTS. >> SANDOR MAPS, THE COUNTY PUT THAT ON.

>> WE HAVE BEEN WORKING WITH A COUNTY WHO HAS A FULL-TIME PERSON WHO WORKS JUST ON CITY PROJECTS. IT HAS BEEN REALLY BENEFICIAL THEY ARE DOING GREAT WORK OUT

THERE AND WE HAVE MORE. >> WHO'S THAT? >> IT IS A TEAM OF THREE.

I THINK THEY ARE WORKING ON PROJECTS TOGETHER, WE PAY FOR FULL-TIME HOURS.

FORTY HOURS. [INAUDIBLE] >> IN OUR OFFICE JAKE AND I ARE WORKING WITH THEM ON SPECIFICALLY HISTORIC PRESERVATION PROJECTS.

SOME OF THEM YOU SEE ONLINE ALREADY, I'LL PULL THIS OUTCOME IT'S A COOL TOOL.

AGAIN, THESE ARE WORKS IN PROGRESS. WE DO HAVE SOME BUGS IN THEM STILL BUT WE ARE WORKING ON THEM AND I'LL SHOW YOU HOW TO GET TO THEM.

THERE ARE THINGS THAT YOU CAN ACTUALLY USE WHEN LOOKING AT THESE PROJECTS.

I THINK IT WOULD BE REALLY HELPFUL SO, THIS IS THE NASSAU COUNTY PROPERTIES PAGE WHAT WE NORMALLY USE IS THERE TAX. AND THEN THERE'S THESE DEVELOPMENTS AND IT'S IN

PROGRESS SO THIS IS CHANGING YOU KEEP ADDING THINGS TO IT. >> CORRECT SOMATIC THE HISTORIC SITES ONE IS NOT REALLY WHAT WE WANTED TO BE YET BUT WE ARE WORKING TOWARDS GETTING THAT INFORMATION. AND YOU'LL BE ABLE TO CLICK ON THAT IN DIFFERENT SITES AROUND TOWN AND WILL LINK IT TO THE MASTER SITE FILES AND PHOTOS AND THINGS LIKE THAT SO YOU CAN GET A HISTORY OF THE STRUCTURES. AT THE BOTTOM IS THE SANBORN MAPS AND WHAT IT IS, IF YOU'RE FAMILIAR WITH THE PROPERTY APPRAISERS PAGE IT'S THEIR BASE MAP WITH THE ABILITY TO TURN ON THE SANBORN LAYERS THEN WE HAVE REFERENCED THEM SO, YOU CAN CHANGE THE PATH SO YOU HAVE ALL THE SANBORN MAPS THERE. NOT I WILL NOTE THAT THE 1949 ONES ARE NOT WORKING PROPERLY UP

AT ALL THE OTHER SHOULD BE AND YOU CAN TURN DOWN THE OPACITY. >> CAN YOU CLICK ON 1897.

>> 1897? >> NOW YOU CAN LOOK AT ONE PROPERTY, TURN ON AND OFF THE

LAYERS. >> YOU CAN ALSO CHANGE THE TRANSPARENCY OF THE LAYERS, YOU

CAN TURN ON ONE LAYER, ALL THE LAYERS, SOMATIC. >> GO TO NORTH THIRD.

>> SOMATIC THAT IS JUST THE HISTORIC DISTRICT, THAT DOESN'T SHOW THE HOST CITY.

>> IS NOT EVEN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT, IT'S WHATEVER THE CITY WAS AND WHATEVER THE SANBORN

MAPS WERE AT THE TIME WHICH, WHERE WE GOING MAP. >> CEDAR.

>> HOW DID YOU GET TO SANBORN, INC. DID YOU GO TO THE TASK MAP AND THEN AN OVERLAY?

>> ON THE PORTAL FOR THAT PARTICULAR MAP, SO, YOU DON'T HAVE TO GO ON LOOK UP THE SANBORN SENEY MORE INDIVIDUALLY, YOU CAN FIND A PROPERTY ON THE SITE USING THE TAX APPRAISERS ON THEN TURN ON THE DIFFERENT LAYERS OF THE DIFFERENT SANBORN SAID.

SO, IS A RESEARCH TOOL REALLY TO HELP US; A CLICK ON SANBORN IT WENT TO THE TAX APPRAISERS MAP.

IS THERE ONE OF THESE LAYERS. >> IF YOU GO DOWN TO. >> IS THE BOTTOM.

[03:10:04]

>> IF YOU GO TO THIS PARDON. >> AND THEN YOU GO TO BASE MAPS, I'M SORRY MAP LAYERS.

IF YOU GO OVER THERE THERE'S PROBABLY IF YOU START CLICKING THROUGH.

>> IT'S NOT IN THE GENERAL TAX MAP. IF YOU GO TO, THIS IS THE MAIN

PAGE TO NORMALLY GO TO AND THEN CLICK ON GIS. >> THERE IS EXTRA PAGE AND THERE NOW THAT DIDN'T USED TO BE THERE. THIS BLACK BACKGROUND PAGE, THIS IS THE REGULAR TEXT PAGE YOU GO TO FOR INFORMATION, SCROLL FURTHER DOWN.

AND THAT'S WHERE YOU'LL SEE THE DASHBOARDS. >> THEN CLICK ON THE SANBORN

DASHBOARD. >> AND DOWN HERE, THERE'S THE SANBORN, THEN YOU CLICK ON VIEW

AND IT BRINGS UP THIS APPLICATION. >> YOU DID NOT GO TO THE RIGHT

PLACE. >> MY GOES TO THE GIS SITE. >> BUT, IT'S DEFINITELY WORTH PLAYING WITH. IT STILL HAS SOME BUGS BUT IT'S DEFINITELY I FOUND IT REALLY

HELPFUL SO FAR. >> IT'S GREAT. WE HAVE OTHER PROJECTS COMING

[8.7 National Trust for Historic Preservation Leadership Forum]

IT'S JUST A RESOURCE WE HAVE FOR YOU GUYS AND OBVIOUSLY I WAS NOT GOING TO PUT THE PASSWORD ONLINE

BUT I WILL GIVE YOU INDIVIDUAL PASSWORD IF YOU DON'T HAVE IT. >> THANK YOU.

[8.8 Discussion to remove PGT windows from the approved window list.]

WHAT ELSE WE HAVE. >> IT WE'VE TALKED ABOUT THE PGT WINDOWS.

AND, REMOVING THEM FROM THE APPROVED LIST. SO, HAD PUT THAT ON THE AGENDA

IF YOU WANT TO DISCUSS THAT TONIGHT. >> I VOTE FOR YOU REMOVE THEM.

SO MEGAN TELL ME WHY SOMATIC THEY ARE VERY FLAT. THEY DON'T HAVE A LOT OF DETAIL AND TO MENTION ON THEM. THEY LOOK LIKE A VINYL REPLACEMENT WINDOW FOR HUNDRED

$69 APIECE. >> AND IS THAT AN ACTION YOU WOULD LIKE US TO TAKE TONIGHT?

>> IF YOU WISH. IF WERE GOING TO DO IT. >> WHERE YOU ON THIS?

>> I AGREE WITH TAMMI, THAT FOR ME, THE ISSUE IS THE LACK OF DEPTH IN THE SASH ASSEMBLY.

THE CLASSES ESSENTIALLY FLUSH WITH THE OUTSIDE FACE OF THE SASH.

IT LACKS THE DEPTH AND CHARACTER OF A HISTORIC WINDOW AND FOR THAT REASON THAT'S SOMATIC NO

SHADOW LINE. IT'S VERY FLAT LOOKING. >> I DON'T GET A VOTE BUT I DEFINITELY AGREE. THEY DEFINITELY DON'T HAVE A HISTORIC IS THERE ANY POLITICAL

BLOW BLACK IF WE TAKE THIS? >> THERE IS ALWAYS THE POSSIBILITY.

>> IF WE DON'T TAKE IT TONIGHT WILL GET IT INTO WEEKS. >> I DON'T THINK WE SEE IT LIKE

THE OTHER PGT. >> WE DO. >> THAT IS WHAT THEY'RE LESS

EXPENSIVE OPTION IS. >> IT IS COME THROUGH QUITE A BIT ESPECIALLY LATELY.

AS YOU KNOW OTHER MATERIALS ARE GOING UP. >> TO ME WOULD YOU LIKE TO MAKE

A MOTION? >> I WOULD LIKE TO REMOVE THE PGT WINDOW OPTION FROM THE

APPROVED WINDOW LIST. >> SECOND. >> HEARING NO DISCUSSION, ALL

THOSE IN FAVOR SAY, AYE. >> AYE. >> OPPOSED?

>> IT'S DONE. >> THEY CAN NOISE COME BACK AND PRESENT.

>> I HAVE A COUPLE THINGS I WANT TO REMIND EVERYBODY WE HAVE BEEN REMOVED INVITED TO THAT OF FERDINAND TO PRESERVE TOMORROW AT 11:00. I'M CONCERNED THERE'S NO AGENDA IT IS JUST QUOTE A DISCUSSION. I'M GENERALLY NOT COMFORTABLE GOING TO MEETINGS WITHOUT AN

AGENDA WITHOUT KNOWING WHAT MIGHT BE DISCUSSED. >> MR. CHAIRMAN COME I WILL SAY WE HAVE BEEN TALKING ABOUT THIS KIND OF INTERNALLY OVER THE LAST COUPLE OF DAYS.

I WAS GOING TO SUGGEST TO THE BOARD THAT WE NOT ATTEND AND BE INVOLVED.

LET THE TWO PARTIES WORK THIS OUT SOMATIC WEIGHT, THERE'S PARTIES?

>> WHAT IS THE ISSUE? I THOUGHT IT WAS DONE? IT'S A DONE DEAL.

[03:15:02]

>> I GUESS IT'S NOT. >> IT'S NOTHING THAT WE HAVE BEFORE US OR THAT WE NEED TO

PHYSICALLY. >> I THINK WHAT EVERYBODY WOULD LIKE US TO LEARN MORE ABOUT THE RESERVE AND I WOULD LIKE TO EXTEND AN INVITATION TO BOTH MISS MAN AND THE CHURCH TO, AND TO A PRESENTATION FOR US JUST TO TELL US MORE ABOUT THE RESERVE IN THE HISTORY AND THAT KIND OF STUFF. I THINK THAT WOULD BE MORE PRODUCTIVE THAN THIS MEETING

TOMORROW. >> THANK YOU. >> IT LAST I HAD FOR YOU WAS

THAT WE WILL NEED A NEW CHAIR AND VICE CHAIR COME JANUARY. >> YOU'RE NOT GOING AWAY, ARE

YOU? >> AS MUCH AS I WOULD LIKE TO TRAVEL.

>> YOU WILL STILL BE ON THE BOARD. >> I WILL BE ON THE BOARD.

I WILL SERVE WHATEVER CAPACITY THE BOARD DEEMS. I JUST LEARNED TO THE JOB.

>> THAT HAPPENS. >> IS THAT IT? >> OTHER COMMENTS?

>> ONE THING I WANTED TO TELL EVERYBODY IS THERE IS A SHOW ON PBS CALLED SECRETS OF SPANISH

FLORIDA. >> I BEEN WATCHING IT. >> IT'S FASCINATING.

>> I FORGET WHICH EPIC BUT THEY ABOUT FERNANDINA. >> THEY GO THROUGH OUR SECRET HISTORY AND WHAT THE SPANISH, THAT'S ON PBS OR YOUTUBE. AND THEN, I HAVE TWO QUESTIONS.

ONE THAT LAUREN BROUGHT TONIGHT ABOUT THE ADU AND OLDTOWN, WITHOUT BUILDING THEY BUILT BECAUSE IT IS NOT A GARAGE AND IT IS ON SLAB IS THAT SOMETHING WE SHOULD DIFFERENTIATE

SOMEWHERE IN THE ORDINANCE GUIDELINE IF IT'S NOT A DRIVING. >> IT'S NOT JUST OLDTOWN, WE HAVE THE SAME ISSUE DOWNTOWN. WE DON'T DIFFERENTIATE. WHEN WE ALLOW IT TO BE A GRADUALLY ALLOW IT TO BE A SLAB BUT IF IT'S NOT A GARAGE DO WE NEEDED TO BE AN ELEVATED

FOUNDATION THE WAY THE MAIN HOUSE DOES. >> HOW WOULD THAT BE APPROACHED?

IS THAT LDC? IS IT GUIDELINE CHANGE? >> EITHER.

>> WE JUST COME UP WITH AND PUT TO A DISCUSSION? >> I GUESS IF IT'S DEEMED THERE

NEEDS TO BE A CHANGE. >> THERE IS DISCUSSION ABOUT IT. >> ON THE AGENDA FOR NEXT MONTH?

>> I THINK THAT IS GOOD. >> WE PREVAILED IN THE APPEAL OF THE PRESBYTERIAN CHURCH THE CITY COMMISSION AGREED THAT WE HAD DUE PROCESS. IN SO, ON DECEMBER, IN DECEMBER LDC CHANGES IN DECEMBER BEFORE THE COMMISSION MAY BE. I WILL DEFEND OUR POSITION THAT A BRIEF PARTY, TAMMI, YOU ARE NOT THERE ANYMORE, ARE YOU? SHE DOESN'T NEED TO BE HERE FOR THIS DISCUSSION. I HEARD HER SAY SOMETHING A LITTLE DIFFERENTLY.

IN A MEETING NOT TOO LONG AGO ABOUT WHO WOULD AGREE -- COULD BE AND I SENSE THAT SHE WAS NARROWING THE DEFINITION AS COUNSEL BECAUSE, WHEN WE FIRST TALKED ABOUT THIS MONTHS AGO I SENSED THE PARTY COULD BE ANYBODY WHO LIVED IN THE CITY AND WHEN I HEARD HER TALK ABOUT

THIS RECENTLY I HEARD HER SAY YOU HAVE TO BE A NEIGHBOR. >> I THOUGHT IT WAS JUST AN

APPLICANT. >> IT IS NOW. A CHANGE IN THE LDC WOULD MAKE ANYBODY, I DON'T LIKE THE COLOR OF YOUR HOUSE, SO I GO TO THE STAFF AND I WAIT 29 DAYS, I WAIT 29 DAYS AND GO TO THE HOUSE AND SAY I WANT TO APPEAL THE STAFF DECISION ON THE COLOR OF TAMMI'S

HOUSE. >> YOU CAN BE AFTER-THE-FACT OR ANY POINT IN TIME.

>> YOU HAVE 30 DAYS. >> WHERE DID THIS COME FROM? >> WHAT HAPPENED WAS THE CITY COMMISSIONERS ASKED FOR THIS CHANGE TO THE LDC AND GOT IN, WE DISAGREED WITH THAT, PA BE DISAGREES WITH IT AND IT'S BEEN FLOATING AROUND FOR MONTHS AND STAFF HAS BEEN TRYING TO GET THE LDC CHANGES BEFORE THE COMMISSION. I AM WILLING TO APPEAR BEFORE THE CITY COMMISSION AND SAY TWO THINGS. FIRST OF ALL, THERE IS NO STAFF THAT SHOULD EVER BE SUBJECT TO APPEAL PROCESS. IF YOU MAKE ANY CHANGE AT ALL THAT'S WRONG. AND SECONDLY IF THE AGGRIEVED STATUS IS BEING APPLIED REALLY

BROADLY THEN THAT IS SOMETHING IT JUST DOESN'T MAKE SENSE. >> IT'S WHAT WE SAID OVER AND OVER AGAIN. DIRECTOR, YOU KEEP ME INFORMED AS TO WHEN YOU GO TO THE CITY COMMISSION WITH THE CHANGES AND WHEN THEY APPEAR ON THE AGENDA I WILL CALL TAMMI AND GET A FAIRLY

[03:20:07]

EGREGIOUS THAN IF IT'S THE WHOLE CITY. >> CELL, LET US KNOW AND THOSE COMING UP. I WROTE A LETTER TO THE COMMISSIONERS LAST TIME AND I

WILL WRITE A LETTER TO THE COMMISSIONERS AGAIN. >> THAT'S ENOUGH FOR TONIGHT.

>> THANK YOU SO MUCH. >> I GOT COMPAY WHEN I WORK FOR THE CITY OF OHIO AFTER 240 HOURS

AND IRAN THAT OUT A LOT. >> THANK YOU SO MUCH, WE APPRECIATED.

>> ADJOURNED, ENJOY YOUR DAY

* This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.